Teenager: Out of Control

LegacyUser

I’m at my wits end here. I just don’t want to do with him anymore.

In the last year I’m physically and mentally worn down with him. He think he knows everything, he wont accept advice or help from anybody. I wish I could call him a street angel and a house devil but I cant even do that. He is the devil.

On the Streets:
He has been instructed not to hang around street corners and has already recently been removed from one particular ‘associate’ of his who was bad news. He does what he wants and his father is terrified of him so will talk and give out to him until he’s blue in the face and it doesn’t make a blink bit of difference. He has never had a hand raised to him and to be honest I think this is the problem. Some days as a mother I wish he was beaten to within an inch of his life as it might do him the world of good. Maybe he might learn something for a change.
Keeping in mind that he is 13 we had one occasion in the last six months where he went off in a huff took food and alcohol from the fridge and went off for hours of end without an explanation. My son (22) found him eventually ,drunk, and tried to take him home. He demanded cigarettes and my son had no choice to drive him to the local garage as he said he would not get into the car unless he had ‘smokes’. The garage wouldn’t serve him and when he was brought home he ran away again as he didn’t get what he wanted only to be caught by my husband.
He hangs around with a group of unsavoury characters and was grounded because of one of his antromartins for two weeks before christmas. He was leaving the house in the middle of the night unknowns to anybody to go drinking in a derolict house with these characters and was caught.

In School:
He is pretty cute in school only getting a few notes since he started in September.
He got an average report passed most things but when we received the report we realized he had an NG in two subjects. Upon investigation he informed us that he had gone on the hop for two days during the exams ice skating and to a shopping centre.
He is that devious that he told me when I was driving him to school on the day he went on the hop ‘I’m starting a new leaf today mam gonna walk the rest of the way’ and then went on the hop.

In the Home:
He is a very aggressive person and if he doesn’t get his way he lashes out. I have never ever heard my older son tell me to ‘**** off’ in all my life but this toe-rag verbally abuses me like theres no tomorrow. My husband as I said is afraid of him and wont dicipline him at all other than talking to him which goes in one ear and out the other. Phrases like ‘he didn’t do much wrong outside of here’, ‘he hates to be caught out’,‘I cant put him in a cage’ and ‘ he has a awful temper’ are about as far as I get with him when were talking about a remidy.
He lives in filth in his room and no matter what we do he wont clean it. The worst thing is I like to have the house clean and I end up cleaning it in the end one way or another because it annoys me and not him.

Its not only him in the home. My husband does enjoy a few drinks and when he was younger he wouldn’t know when to stop. This resulted in arguments the child clearly remembers from being younger. This could be part of the problem with drink. He is not controllable and a rebel. He cant keep his mouth shut and it gets him into nothing but trouble.

My older son:
22 studying in college. He is no problem and never has been. I think because he is so ‘good’ the other one feels like he has to be bad as my husband constantly compares him to him.

Tonight he put his foot in it again. A certain article was stolen from a chap in his school and he found out who did it. He told the chap where he could find this article. When the parents found the item it was destroyed. The parent found out where we lived and came here to get the details of who had taken it.

When they left we tried to tell him as noble as his thoughts were trying to help the other child when is hes going to learn how to get a bit of sence and keep his mouth shut and stop bringing trouble on this house. My son is in the middle of exams and its upsetting him.

Violence:
Some months ago he managed to wresle his 16 stone father to the ground with me watching in terror. Tonight the 13 year old got violent and faced up to my 22 year old and hit him. My other son wouldn’t have any of this and restrained him. The 13 year old would raise the saints and I’m worried that my 22 year old, while very level headed, will lose it one day and just bloody kill him. The 13 year old thinks he knows the law and threatnes us that if we ever touch him he will call the police and have us arrested and also frequently threatnes us with ‘ I’ll get my mates to kick the ****e out of you if you ever touch me’.

He states that the only place that he is happy is out with his friends. And is currently missing after another ordeal tonight. Told my husband he was going on a walk to clear his head and hasn’t come back. My son is still upset after what happened and is trying to study upstairs but I’m guessing wont be in the mindset for any exam tomorrow.

Solutions:
Grounding, took his mobile for two weeks. Talk until were blue in the face with him and nothing works. We have sent him to a councellor in the school to talk about anger issues but I don’t think he is making any progress.

Worried:
I’m worried when I’m in the house on my own with him. My husband works a lot of hours and my son is in college full time. He has held my by the neck up against a wall once and is always verbally abusing me. I don’t know what I will do when my son eventually moves out.

I’m in Distress, Please Help.

Aard

If your son is being violent towards you (grabbing you by the neck) then you need to call the guards. I know it's easy for me to say, and difficult for you to do, but you need to sort this out now. A quick wake up call like this could prevent him from even more "bad behaviour" in the future.

LegacyUser

Aard wrote: »

If your son is being violent towards you (grabbing you by the neck) then you need to call the guards. I know it's easy for me to say, and difficult for you to do, but you need to sort this out now. A quick wake up call like this could prevent him from even more "bad behaviour" in the future.

He did that on one occasion. And he's not the least bit scared of the guards he would just laugh at them as he knows nothing can be done to him without our permission and he knows we would never have him 'dealt with' that way.
Funny thing is he says he want's to be one. We told him he won't get in with a criminal record.

MagicMarker

I honestly can't tell you what to do, because I really don't know.

Part of me thinks he needs some tough love. As in, if he gets out of line, then you put him back in line, by ANY MEANS NECESSARY. If he gets violent, then show him he's not as tough as he thinks he is. I don't have kids and if I did I wouldn't be the type to punish with a slap, but it really sounds like this kid literally needs a kick up the arse and A LOT more.

Then again, part of me thinks you should just toss him out onto the streets for a few weeks.

dolliemix

A lot of what you describe is normal teenage behaviour - messy room, rebelling, argumentative and in fairness the 'manipulative' aspect is normal too. Teenagers lie full stop. Also teenagers are experimenting at a very young age now - thus the alcohol is probably (while shocking) quite normal too. What I would be very worried about is the violence. Your son is really angry for some reason and both you, your husband and he himself have to get to the bottom of this. Did he just start secondary school - maybe he's finding it hard?
I would suggest you make an appointment with the school and let them know whats happening so that they keep you up to date, if he takes the day off again etc. More importantly you need to find a councillor outside of school. Sometimes school councillors, while great, are just qualified careers guidance teachers. However if they are not aware of the anger and violence he is showing at home they are probably basing it on the what your son is saying.

Also I would talk to your older son, he should not be involved in this. Your husband should make sure of this

LegacyUser

MagicMarker wrote: »

I honestly can't tell you what to do, because I really don't know.

Part of me thinks he needs some tough love. As in, if he gets out of line, then you put him back in line, by ANY MEANS NECESSARY. If he gets violent, then show him he's not as tough as he thinks he is. I don't have kids and if I did I wouldn't be the type to punish with a slap, but it really sounds like this kid literally needs a kick up the arse and A LOT more.

Then again, part of me thinks you should just toss him out onto the streets for a few weeks.

I think your right about the tough love part. Well he's currently on the streets and i don't know if he will come home tonight or where he is.

What would be the legal implifications if i was to say. Listen if you cant behave yourself here you have to go and he does. I know he will come crawling back but what if something happens to him when he's gone.

RedXIV

Hmmmmm i reckon your son is in dire need of tough love. God know's as a kid I got my fair share of whacks and if seen these days, no doubt there would be cry of excessive discipline, but i truly believe that it was worth it. My father taught me to respect others and him and i will, to the day i die, i'll respect no man more. And as a 21yr old, if i had a 13yr old brother causing that much hassle, i'd DEF be giving tough love.

Your son appears to be your strongest ally. So use him. And at 13, your son no doubt requires aid from you in some shape or form. so deny it until he gives you respect. If you want to get the guards involved, then do. Let him know he can't get away with it. Trust, me this is a lesson he needs to learn soon because if he doesn't, he'll only end up getting in far more trouble later in life

Show_me_Safety

im 20 with 2 younger brothers. i moved out the week i turned 18. i was a terror (altho not that bad) im now working in a good job and putting myself thru college.
if my younger brothers were to do that i'd hit them around the head no problem.

you say you took his mobile away for two weeks- you need to smash it in fromt of him.
get locks on his bedroom door and windows and lock him in it if needs be, especially if he is violent towards you. it seems to have gone beyond the stage of talking with him. you need to cut off all contacts with his friends and even have him change school if needs be.

if he were any older i'd recommend you kick him out. your right to say that he needs a good hiding and have him learn a lesson.

speak with social services if you have to, he's out of control.
dont be afraid of being heavy handed with him, he will appreciate in the future.

if he is on bebo, have his account deleted by emailing the administrators of have your older son do it.

take away all priviledges. do not give him any money. keep your money away from him. lock away your drink in the house. password protect your computer so he cant get internet access.

have you thought that he may have ADHD? i know my friends younger brother has it and it can cause him to lash out.

i really feel for you and the situation you're in. when i think back on how i was i feel so ashamed. i hope you can sort him out.

LegacyUser

dolliemix wrote: »

Also I would talk to your older son, he should not be involved in this. Your husband should make sure of this

Taken that all on board.

But i have to say. My older son is the voice of reason in all of this. He is the only one he will even contemplate listening to. I agree he shouldn't be involved but he's a person who cant just sit there while theres murder going on. Even with exams tomorrow he was down trying to be the peacemaker before he got a punch. And continued even after he helped me sort out the issue of the stolen article.

If my older son isn't doing what he does in a conflict situation then the teen can run wild as he's no respect for anybody but himself and his father doesn't believe in raising a hand to him.

LegacyUser

Show_me_Safety wrote: »

you say you took his mobile away for two weeks- you need to smash it in fromt of him.
get locks on his bedroom door and windows and lock him in it if needs be, especially if he is violent towards you. it seems to have gone beyond the stage of talking with him. you need to cut off all contacts with his friends and even have him change school if needs be.

if he were any older i'd recommend you kick him out. your right to say that he needs a good hiding and have him learn a lesson.

speak with social services if you have to, he's out of control.
dont be afraid of being heavy handed with him, he will appreciate in the future.

if he is on bebo, have his account deleted by emailing the administrators of have your older son do it.

take away all priviledges. do not give him any money. keep your money away from him. lock away your drink in the house. password protect your computer so he cant get internet access.

have you thought that he may have ADHD? i know my friends younger brother has it and it can cause him to lash out.

i really feel for you and the situation you're in. when i think back on how i was i feel so ashamed. i hope you can sort him out.

My husband wont hit him. And my older son is very level headed so won't unless he is pushed 2 miles over the edge. And if he was hit he would have the police on the doorstep and what to i tell them. My 22 year old son gets a criminal record for assaulting a minor, no thanks.

Smashing his phone is a bit extreme and if it was smashed. He would end up getting another one before the weeks out and it would cost me.

What can social services do in a case like this?

We have tried to take away all privalages before but it really doesn't work. He got his own laptop for christmas so no point in password protecting that as only he has the passwork for it.

The worst thing is its worse when he's grounded as hes following me around the house with nothing to do. Its almost better and i have a bit of peace when he's out.

Thanks for the suggestions keep them coming.

banshee_bones

OP it sounds like you really are at the end of your rope

As with the other posters , at that age he is dependent on you so cut off all priveleges.

get the guards involved if he so much as lays a finger on you. You do not need to be abused like that by one of your own kids. Nor do you deserved to be treated like that.

I woudl take away all computer consoles and games,dvds,cds,ipods, internet access,phones,house phone, pocket money. Anything he values, or enjoys. Take it all off him and maybe keep it at a relatives house.

I really do not know whatelse to advise but please take care of yourself.

nomorebadtown

jesus thats rough.

its not nice to say it but your son sounds like an evil little bastard and appears to be, as you say, completely out of control.

it also sounds like you've reached the end of your rope.

why are you afraid of him? is he a huge powerful 13 year old? you have a 16 stone husband and a 22 year old son in the house...how do they allow themselves be intimmidated by the 13 year old? due to forum rules i will just say that if he ever threatens violence again call the police immediately, its gone way too far at this stage.

what is his access to money like?Its clear that he has zero respect for his parents (maybe because he never received the "gift of discipline"?) and so you have to get him the only way he will respond to - Criminal Assets Bureau style - stop all pocket money. freeze his account. stop paying for phone credit. dont buy any but the most basic necessities for him. if he wants funding, make him earn it.

it pains me to pander to the psycho babble end of things but have you considered the possibility that he may be suffering from some psychological disorder? its probably something to look into.

dolliemix

Sorry but I really don't think using violence is going to help this situation. He is only a child and if he sees adults responding to his behaviour with violence i.e

he needs a good hiding

you say you took his mobile away for two weeks- you need to smash it in fromt of him.
_ quote nomorebadtown

then how is he supposed to learn that violent behaviour is wrong


By all means - tough love but through negotiation (bringing in an outsider if necessary i.e councillor, principal, guard as a last resort) not violence and agression ....

flibbertyjibbet

I think you were onto something when you talked about how he might feel in relation to his brother.

From your post, the older brother is described as somewhat of a golden child: doing well, in college, never any trouble, always been great. Perhaps your younger son is a little jealous and threatned by his elder brother and this is manifesting itself as anger, especially if your husband regularly compares him to his older brother.

Tbh, I don't think this is helpful and you should ask your husband to stop. Your sons are different people, and if the younger isn't particularly academic he might feel unable to "live up" to his brother and might feel helpless and caught in a hopeless situation, so he just thinks "f*** it, I'll never achieve that so I'll just do what I like."

What are the younger boy's talents? Is he particularly good at art, or sport, or building/ creating things? Maybe if you see him doing these things you should praise his work. Maybe also praise him when he does do something positive. Even little things like "Thanks for cleaning the dishes, I apreciate it."

While I don't think that will in any way solve all the problems, I do think it may ease the aggression somewhat. Best of luck

LegacyUser

nomorebadtown wrote: »

jesus thats rough.

its not nice to say it but your son sounds like an evil little bastard and appears to be, as you say, completely out of control.

it also sounds like you've reached the end of your rope.

why are you afraid of him? is he a huge powerful 13 year old? you have a 16 stone husband and a 22 year old son in the house...how do they allow themselves be intimmidated by the 13 year old? due to forum rules i will just say that if he ever threatens violence again call the police immediately, its gone way too far at this stage.

what is his access to money like?Its clear that he has zero respect for his parents (maybe because he never received the "gift of discipline"?) and so you have to get him the only way he will respond to - Criminal Assets Bureau style - stop all pocket money. freeze his account. stop paying for phone credit. dont buy any but the most basic necessities for him. if he wants funding, make him earn it.

it pains me to pander to the psycho babble end of things but have you considered the possibility that he may be suffering from some psychological disorder? its probably something to look into.

Were afraid of him because he's about 14.5 stone and 5ft 6" he's bigger than my 22 year old. He's going to the gym too and appears to be getting muscle. I love to see him getting a bit of exercise though. I'm sure my older son is even beginning to feel intimidated by him.

We took his money before and thought it was working. We then found out that he had secretly been accessing his credit union account and had taken almost €200 out of it to look after himself. When confronted about it he said 'its my money' i'll do what i want with it!

Theres no controlling him and he's still not home.

nomorebadtown

dolliemix wrote: »

he needs a good hiding

you say you took his mobile away for two weeks- you need to smash it in fromt of him.
_ quote nomorebadtown

you're misquoting me there love

ogriofa

RedXIV wrote: »

Your son appears to be your strongest ally. So use him.

I'm NO expert, I don't have kids, but I was "strong" young man of your sons age once.

I'd get your older son to talk to him. A real man to man, with the possible threat of violence (providing your 22 year old can & would)

I know you dont want to wreck your other sons head (particularly now with the exams) but if your eldest sorted it out, the house would be a lot calmer for his studying?

Hope you get this sorted out!!

RedXIV

dolliemix wrote: »

Sorry but I really don't think using violence is going to help this situation. He is only a child and if he sees adults responding to his behaviour with violence i.e

he needs a good hiding

you say you took his mobile away for two weeks- you need to smash it in fromt of him.
_ quote nomorebadtown

then how is he supposed to learn that violent behaviour is wrong


By all means - tough love but through negotiation (bringing in an outsider if necessary i.e councillor, principal, guard as a last resort) not violence and agression ....

*shrug*, i've watched alot of councillors and good hearted people get nowhere because they believe problems can be sourced and solved by talking. I may appear a bit of a pessimistic but if you want to fix this situation, he needs to find someone he respects. And respect for a young lad like that is not going to be easily earned. And i'd highly doubt talking is the way to do it....

LegacyUser

flibbertyjibbet wrote: »

What are the younger boy's talents? Is he particularly good at art, or sport, or building/ creating things? Maybe if you see him doing these things you should praise his work. Maybe also praise him when he does do something positive. Even little things like "Thanks for cleaning the dishes, I apreciate it."

While I don't think that will in any way solve all the problems, I do think it may ease the aggression somewhat. Best of luck

Keeping in mind its almost impossible to say this about your own son but he has no interest in anything except going out with friends. We tried him at the piano but he has no concentration level and just left it. He likes shows and did some variety group work but i don't know if he's lost interest in that.

As for "thanks for cleaning the dishes" goes. YE RIGHT he never lifts a finger unless he is physically put to a task. Like walked to the clean dishes in the dishwasher and handed them to be put away.

LegacyUser

ogriofa wrote: »

I'm NO expert, I don't have kids, but I was "strong" young man of your sons age once.

I'd get your older son to talk to him. A real man to man, with the possible threat of violence (providing your 22 year old can & would)

I know you dont want to wreck your other sons head (particularly now with the exams) but if your eldest sorted it out, the house would be a lot calmer for his studying?

Hope you get this sorted out!!

This has been done by my older son before. The 13yr old is not afraid of anyone and when violence was mentioned he stood up to him looking for a fight. Doesn't work

Show_me_Safety

well then drop the phone in water, cut the sim in half all he understands for now, are actions, and that will send the message that the OP has enough of the BS from him when he begins to cop he will learn why it was done and thats when the op can sit him down and talk and not have to resort to drastic measures.

also, read his messages too. see what he is up to. maybe he is even talking to friends about problems he feels he cant talk to you about.

at this age the boy feels like he doesnt need his family when he has his friends. isolate him from them.

biko

Would it be possible for you to send him away to a summer camp to learn sailing or similar? This way he gets away from his mates and also learn that there is more to life than hanging on street corners.

Does he have any good interests? Boxing clubs and similar usually set kids straight and know how to deal with/defuse angry teens.

LegacyUser

Show_me_Safety wrote: »

at this age the boy feels like he doesnt need his family when he has his friends. isolate him from them.

Very good points there, but. I cant isolate him from his friends. If i try to stop him going out he will push me out of the way. He CANT BE CONTROLLED

RedXIV

biko wrote: »

Does he have any good interests? Boxing clubs and similar usually set kids straight and know how to deal with/defuse angry teens.

Actually, this is a really good idea if you can get him to do it. Alot of people don't realise that any of the contact sports like boxing or martial arts are very heavy on discipline. Instructors are also going to be completely fearless in dealing with him. The trick is getting him to go now....

banshee_bones

just out of interest.... how tall is he , how much does he weigh? i mean hes 13! at that age surely he cant have that much strength!?? :eek:

banshee_bones

RedXIV wrote: »

Actually, this is a really good idea if you can get him to do it. Alot of people don't realise that any of the contact sports like boxing or martial arts are very heavy on discipline. Instructors are also going to be completely fearless in dealing with him. The trick is getting him to go now....

yesss very good idea.... guess the trick would be making him feel like it was his idea

LegacyUser

biko wrote: »

Would it be possible for you to send him away to a summer camp to learn sailing or similar? This way he gets away from his mates and also learn that there is more to life than hanging on street corners.

Does he have any good interests? Boxing clubs and similar usually set kids straight and know how to deal with/defuse angry teens.

We talked about sending him boxing at one stage but thats really adding fuel to the fire. If he becomes a proficient boxer the rest of us are ****ed. What little upper hand we may have on him now would soon be lost.

He may be going to the gaeltacht this summer we haven't decided yet but the layabouts he calles friends will be going too, i'd imagine.

Biko, If your a gard would you mind anwsering this one. Is there any form of Juvenile liason officer that would talk to him (if we aggreed to it at home) if he hasn't already committed a crime as such yet?

RedXIV

banshee_bones wrote: »

yesss very good idea.... guess the trick would be making him feel like it was his idea

thats the only way i can see it working.

Also OP, i noticed you said he has a laptop thats his? simple, take the battery out. leave the laptop. Also, the guards aren't rigidly by the book. If there's a domestic where your sons have a scrap, the guards will prefer to settle it without legal ramifications. And you need to realise that you're trying to bluff your son. and that won't work, he already knows your limits so suprise him. He thinks you won't call the cops on him? then do it.

LegacyUser

banshee_bones wrote: »

just out of interest.... how tall is he , how much does he weigh? i mean hes 13! at that age surely he cant have that much strength!?? :eek:

He's about 14.5 stone and 5ft 6" id say

Nevyn

PLEASE go to socail services.
Currently your child is at risk on the streets.
Yes child so that means you can report him missing to the garda and have him on the look out for him.

You and your family are in crises and you need as much help as possible as soon as possible to turn this around.

Yes it will take tough love, even having him put in foster care or a childern's home until he see's how good he has it at home.

Yes you will have to come down on him like a tonne of bricks and make hard and unpleasant choices but they are for his own good.

This doesn't just happen over night, it sounds like he think he is an adult due to living in a house of adults and he is not and this needs to be hammered home.

My two kids know damn well I rule this house, he is dependent on you and his father for everything and it's time to make at abundantly clear by stripping him of all privileges if needs be.

I won't kid you it will be hell but better that then things getting worse and the running away from home is the ultimate emotional blackmail and he is using it to detestating effect.

Again please get in touch with socail services and get support from counseling for you all, to family mediation, medical assessment if there is something which has been over looked, parenting plans, other adults to tell him and re enforce to him that his behaviour is not acceptable.

The help is there you just need to access it before it is any later and your husband needs to start getting invovled and not washing his hands tbh.

LegacyUser

RedXIV wrote: »

thats the only way i can see it working.

Also OP, i noticed you said he has a laptop thats his? simple, take the battery out. leave the laptop. Also, the guards aren't rigidly by the book. If there's a domestic where your sons have a scrap, the guards will prefer to settle it without legal ramifications. And you need to realise that you're trying to bluff your son. and that won't work, he already knows your limits so suprise him. He thinks you won't call the cops on him? then do it.

I wouldn't like to have the police at the house. They have enough on their mind than dealing with our problems aswell.

Nevyn

terrifiedmum wrote: »

I wouldn't like to have the police at the house. They have enough on their mind than dealing with our problems aswell.

Every station as a junior lilasion office and community garda who will for the most part be happy to help keep a youngster from becoming a bigger problem.

Also safety orders can be issued against minors, being in court and being told that such behavior is not acceptable and that he would be at risk of going into care might be a good shock.

LegacyUser

Thaedydal wrote: »

The help is there you just need to access it before it is any later.

Thanks i'll see what i can do. He has just arrived home so i have to go and try to deal with him.

He is soalking and was in the playground apparently.

LegacyUser

RedXIV wrote: »

*shrug*, i've watched alot of councillors and good hearted people get nowhere because they believe problems can be sourced and solved by talking. I may appear a bit of a pessimistic but if you want to fix this situation, he needs to find someone he respects. And respect for a young lad like that is not going to be easily earned. And i'd highly doubt talking is the way to do it....

I agree... If i stepped out of line as a child i got the wooden spoon. Im 20 now and everyone of my age grew up getting the odd slap if we did something terrible. My sister is a child psychologist and she refuses to slap her children and uses the "silly stool" the children were genuinely scared of it, but now they see its nothing and are starting to answer back. (they are under 6) where as i would have been in fear of my dad or mam if i stepped out of line. I think all this "dont slap your children" stuff is crap and has lead to alot of the problems with kids being unruley these days.

OP as was stated i think your eldest son is your key. I mean regardless a younger brother always looks up to his older brother, esp as there is a bigger age gap. If he attempts to get abusive to him, tell your son dont be afraid to put him in his place physically.

I also agree that you should cut off all his money and computer access. Take his phone if you bought it for him. other than that leave him the phone, when he runs out of credit, let him earn the money for it.

Get him into doing a sport or something, it seems as if he is lacking direction. Your elder son is off doing this and that with his life and your younger son prob feels left out.

LegacyUser

Thaedydal wrote: »

Every station as a junior lilasion office and community garda who will for the most part be happy to help keep a youngster from becoming a bigger problem.

Also safety orders can be issued against minors, being in court and being told that such behavior is not acceptable and that he would be at risk of going into care might be a good shock.

He wants to be a gard. and although he doesn't have the right temprement for it at all i wouldn't like to hurt his chances. Maybe when he grows up he could be a good gard.

I want to keep him out of trouble alltogether and without a criminal record.

Nevyn

Lack of slapping does not equal lack of discipline.

A lot of parents have given up corporal punishment but have not learned other ways
of disciplining their children and there is a horrid of rise of the idea that being harsh but fair to a child and upsetting them is child abuse, it's not.

ukgalwaymcguire

13... i have a 15 year old and i have step children age from 24 too 17,

i dont understand why at 13 he is allowed out at any time he feels..

but now thats done, i truly feel for you i really do, my suggestion would be too get professional help, speak too the school in the first instance, they should be informed of the complete picture anyway, but they may be able too point you in the right direction.

we moved too galway from london in august, and the way things are in london i thank god your story isnt based in london the guns and knifes are terrible, but ireland always has been known too follow, and regardless of that theres so many things that could happen, i would act now as in FIRST thing in the morning, and get some help asap

you and your family are in my thoughts and prayers and i pray you sort this out!!
xx

Toots

Thaedydal wrote: »

Every station as a junior lilasion office and community garda who will for the most part be happy to help keep a youngster from becoming a bigger problem.

Also safety orders can be issued against minors, being in court and being told that such behavior is not acceptable and that he would be at risk of going into care might be a good shock.

Good advice here, I'd give your local station a buzz or maybe even drop down and talk to them, see what they can do and what advice they give. You mentioned your son wants to be a Garda, maybe having one of them talk to him would get him to cop on.

Alternatively, about a year ago I know a friend of my mother's was having similar problems to you and she got the Gardaí to bring her 15 yr old son down to the station (he'd just punched her, she was at the end of her rope) and he was put in a cell for a few hours. Then he was given a good talking to and told he could end up in St Pat's if he didn't cop on. Apparently it did do him good, it wasn't overnight, initially he was really angry at his mum about it, but after a week or so he started calming down and wasn't violent, and then started behaving himself better. Apparently he's much better now, although he wouldn't be called an angel, it's a vast improvement to what he was.

Hope you manage to get something sorted out OP.

RedXIV

terrifiedmum wrote: »

We talked about sending him boxing at one stage but thats really adding fuel to the fire. If he becomes a proficient boxer the rest of us are ****ed. What little upper hand we may have on him now would soon be lost.

TRUST ME. His attitude has obviously entered every aspect of his life and if he tries anything in a boxing club or dojo, he'll learn very fast he's not in charge, I've done martial arts for years and while the instructor is one of the nicest poeple i've ever met, He's got no problem putting unrulely students in their place.

I'm really sorry OP but every post i'm reading of yours is oozing the "softly softly" approach. The guards are servents of the law. don't think you're problems are too small to be dealt with by the guards. And by the sounds of it, you'll never get him to come see a councillor

Show_me_Safety

ukgalwaymcguire wrote: »

you and your family are in my thoughts and prayers and i pray you sort this out!!
xx

thats a lovely sentiment, i will be think about the op too this evening.

Nevyn

terrifiedmum wrote: »

He wants to be a gard. and although he doesn't have the right temprement for it at all i wouldn't like to hurt his chances. Maybe when he grows up he could be a good gard.

I want to keep him out of trouble alltogether and without a criminal record.

All records of a minor are sealed when they turn 18 and become responsible for themselves.
Getting a talking to by a garda will not go on any record.

nomorebadtown

terrifiedmum wrote: »

He may be going to the gaeltacht this summer we haven't decided yet but the layabouts he calles friends will be going too, i'd imagine.

ehh what?

your son behaives in a completely inappropriate manner, treats you and the rest of the family like crap, bullies, lies and intimidates.....and yet your looking at paying for him to go off on holiday with his dodgy mates for a few weeks?? No wonder the kid is a dangerous brat. He acts the ignorant scumbag and his parents are considering rewarding him with a holiday.

From what you are posting, you are way out of your depth at the moment and you have very little idea of how to discipline your child. You need social services. You need to make the tough decisions now while he is young. He will thank you for it later when he is not in prison.

Raskolnikov

You are showing this kid far too much fear!

The kid has a laptop, gym membership, money and pretty much has free rein over all of you. Sounds like a spoilt little brat! First thing you need to do is to take all his money off of him. If he wants any money, he needs to do something to earn it. Cancel his gym membership and confiscate his laptop. These things aren't a right, they're a privilege!

Nevyn

Can we please keep posts helpful and supportive.

LegacyUser

RedXIV wrote: »

I'm really sorry OP but every post i'm reading of yours is oozing the "softly softly" approach. The guards are servents of the law. don't think you're problems are too small to be dealt with by the guards. And by the sounds of it, you'll never get him to come see a councillor

I have to agree with this comment, OP you are not doing enough and you seem a little dismissive of some of the suggestions here. You say you dont want your son growing up causing problems and having a record, well its up to you to stop it then.

Take the kids laptop, what the hell does a 13 year old need a laptop for? Take it, its gone. Take the phone, take his ipod if he has one, or whatever else he may have, keep taking til he begins to realise he's not getting away with anything.

There must be an adult named on his credit union a/c no? Can they stop him withdrawing money. Give him none yourself. That means theres no new phone etc.

Do as suggested and get the community guard down to see him. You shouldnt care about not wanting a Guard calling at the door you should care about helping your son, whatever it takes.

This can be solved but it requires a certain amount of strength by you. Teenagers are smart, this kid clearly knows he can do what he likes and get away with anything. So stop him. at 13 he is still totally dependent on you so let it show!!!!

And in no way should you be considering paying for a 3 week holiday to the Gaeltacht for him with his mates if he's acting like this.

Stay strong, I hope I didnt sound too harsh, my heart goes out to you it really does. But you have to be proactive here and get your ass in gear over this. No one else will care enough for this kid to help him more than his mother.

RedXIV

OP i really want you to get out of this problem so i'll leave on this note. Thaedyal said it best that people are confusing upseting their kids with child abuse. You sound like a saint of a mother, you really do, you've obviously given this boy everything that he wants but you need to understand that discipline IS the best gift to give. One of the greatest quotes of all times from a movie "These are the years that a man grows into the man he'll be for the rest of his life" and you don't want him to be like this when he's an adult.

Don't be afraid to take stuff off your son. I looked at your earlier posts and you said you wouldn't get rid of his phone because it'd only cost you when he wants another one. He has to EARN these things. If he wants money to go out, make him earn it, if he wants a computer game, make him earn it, if he wants anything he doesn't need, he needs to EARN it. It's going to be an awful change but it needs to be done. Just keep telling yourself, it's for him, he won't get the guards if he doesn't change, remember that. if he wants to be happy, you have to make it happen

Best of luck OP

dolliemix

I agree with REd xIV and nomorebadtown, with regards to the softly softly approach you and your husband may be taking. I work with teenagers and they will push boundries and test threats. You should say to him tonight 'you do X again' and we're taking your computer and you're grounded for X amount of days'......and follow it through. Kids appreciate boundries in the long run. Black and White makes more sense to them. I know it is hard having him around the house when he's grounded but he should tire eventually if he realises you mean business. I still would not advocate agressive behaviour or violence. It's a long and frustrating journey and it will take time and patience but it's the only way forward. I would still recommend seeing a private councillor.....his behaviour is hurtful, but it comes from an anger within him that needs to be addressed. He, himself, doesn't understand why he is angry, he's only 13, but a professional will be able to draw this out hopefully over time. I also think getting a juvenille liason officer to talk to him is a good idea. Some of the kids I work with have been in contact with them and they've been great.

For now

1. I would make a list of sanctions. Tell him that each occassion he refuses to co-operate A will come into action , the B, C etc. So the choice is his

(However I would say, that lying, defensiveness and messy rooms are part of the teenage course and most mums and dads go through that ....its his aggressive behaviour and going out for hours that I would be worried about right now)

2. Call the school tomorrow and let them know

3. Research councillors in your area

4. Call the gardai and ask them about a JLO

Good Luck

BroomBurner

Thaedydal wrote: »

Can we please keep posts helpful and supportive.

Sorry, but if you meant the last two posts there, I thought they sounded very helpful. The OP clearly is having trouble with controlling her child, she asked for help.

OP, good luck with your son, I can only second everything others have said about taking away his privelages. He has clearly done nothing to deserve these things, so why have you given in to him? Children will push and push and push, you need to set boundaries.

Also, why is everyone suggesting that the eldest son is the one to help with the discipline? That will only make a bad situation worse, especially if the elder son is meant to be some "golden boy". Your eldest is his brother, not his father. Your husband is the one that needs to start accepting responsibility for his children.

LegacyUser

nomorebadtown wrote: »

ehh what?

your son behaives in a completely inappropriate manner, treats you and the rest of the family like crap, bullies, lies and intimidates.....and yet your looking at paying for him to go off on holiday with his dodgy mates for a few weeks?? No wonder the kid is a dangerous brat. He acts the ignorant scumbag and his parents are considering rewarding him with a holiday.

From what you are posting, you are way out of your depth at the moment and you have very little idea of how to discipline your child. You need social services. You need to make the tough decisions now while he is young. He will thank you for it later when he is not in prison.

He wont be going to the gaeltacht. Took his stuff off him.

Asked him if he has anything to say over disrupting the whole house and he told us to **** off.

Going to seek professional help in the morning. He said he wont go to it unless he's kicking and screaming.

Thanks for the prayers guys they really do help. I'll be sayin a few myself

LegacyUser

Unregistered wrote: »

I have to agree with this comment, OP you are not doing enough and you seem a little dismissive of some of the suggestions here. You say you dont want your son growing up causing problems and having a record, well its up to you to stop it then.

Take the kids laptop, what the hell does a 13 year old need a laptop for? Take it, its gone. Take the phone, take his ipod if he has one, or whatever else he may have, keep taking til he begins to realise he's not getting away with anything.

There must be an adult named on his credit union a/c no? Can they stop him withdrawing money. Give him none yourself. That means theres no new phone etc.

Do as suggested and get the community guard down to see him. You shouldnt care about not wanting a Guard calling at the door you should care about helping your son, whatever it takes.

This can be solved but it requires a certain amount of strength by you. Teenagers are smart, this kid clearly knows he can do what he likes and get away with anything. So stop him. at 13 he is still totally dependent on you so let it show!!!!

And in no way should you be considering paying for a 3 week holiday to the Gaeltacht for him with his mates if he's acting like this.

Stay strong, I hope I didnt sound too harsh, my heart goes out to you it really does. But you have to be proactive here and get your ass in gear over this. No one else will care enough for this kid to help him more than his mother.

I can guarantee you all the posts have been read and are not falling on deaf ears. Thanks a million to anybody who suggested something. We have talked to him since he came home. Usual in one ear out the other but were going to get hime help for his anger issues.

Still wouldn't apologise and is cursing like nobodys business. Taken everything we can from him. Money laptop battery, phone. Gym membership is a problem id say i don't know where his card is

LegacyUser

BroomBurner wrote: »

Sorry, but if you meant the last two posts there, I thought they sounded very helpful. The OP clearly is having trouble with controlling her child, she asked for help.

OP, good luck with your son, I can only second everything others have said about taking away his privelages. He has clearly done nothing to deserve these things, so why have you given in to him? Children will push and push and push, you need to set boundaries.

Also, why is everyone suggesting that the eldest son is the one to help with the discipline? That will only make a bad situation worse, especially if the elder son is meant to be some "golden boy". Your eldest is his brother, not his father. Your husband is the one that needs to start accepting responsibility for his children.

I cant get out of it now. I mean this is what the situation is like. When his goods were to be taken he told mam 'where are you going with my ****ing phone?' at which point he squared up to her. I don't know about you but i'm not letting my mother be treated like that by this bastard of a brother of mine. Not happening while i'm still in this house. Nobody in their right mind would let this go on.