Rotterdam, not anywhere

Rusty Cogs 08

OK, so it's probably one of the worst titles and it mighten be a much better log but with 13 (touch wood) uninterrupted weeks to go to the sub 3 attempt at the Rotterdam marathon I might as well join the BAC Loggers.

I'm conscious of the fact that my training for the Reykjavik mara last year started around 13 weeks out so I'll be comparing my runs between the two to see how far (if any) I've progressed.

I'm following the P & D 18 week 55 mile schedule for those familiar with it.

All distances/pace will be quoted in miles unless otherwise noted

Yesterday called for 17m. P&D recommend the earlier long runs are done at mara pace +20% which means circa 8'15''. I'm concious of sticking to 'the plan' but I'd find 8'15'' too slow so set the Garmin at 7'30'' pace. I'm also not sure when P&D expect you to move your long runs from +20% to +10% but as the weeks advance I hope to bring mine in to +5% or so (but no faster).

The run ended up being 7'25'' average but there were large variances between miles & HR (I'll get around to motion based uploads soon). Some of this I put down to conditions (wind) but also I had to push it a bit on the return as I saw my times slipping. I had a carb gel at m10 and it seemed to kick in around m13. I'd say on the day I'll take a gel at m10 & m18 to get the benefits around m13 & m21.

I won't go into the terrain too much as I live in the city centre and thus my runs go either up the coast (Clontarf) or down (Sandymount) and are pretty samey as a result.

One good thing is today my legs don't feel like elephants slept on them overnight so I'm confident that 13 weeks out I'm in better shape that pre-Reykjavik.

Today is a rest day too so will hopefully be in good shape for a tougher run tomorrow night. Again for those unfamiliar with P&D you usually get rest days Monday & Friday, pace or lactic threshold days Tuesday & Thursday, recovery runs Wednesday & Saturday and a long run on a Sunday. There's also mesocycles which I'll comment on again.

Hey ! No sleeping at the back !!!

Woddle

Best of luck Rusty with your goal, I'm following the same schedule but I'll change days to suit myself, I think our marathons are on the same day. I'm doing Paris, so I'll keep a keen eye on yours so all the best and welcome.

SUNGOD

hi rusty best of luck with your training and log

inforfun

Good luck with running in my city of birth!

donothoponpop

Best of luck with your log Rusty. Might bump into you at the finish line;)

Slogger Jogger

Good luck RC. Imagine us all sitting back enjoying a cold beer after all sub 3ing.. Here's hoping.

Abhainn

Best of luck Rusty Cogs in your quest. I will be reading your log with good interest

What are your race experiences to date? i.e. times for half marathon, marathons to date. Have you been running long?

All the best

--amadeus--

Nice to see your log going up and it sounds like you are in cracking form for it already. Be good to compare your times & distances to my own.

Best of luck and I'll see you at the end - remember 1st over the line gets the beers in!

Rusty Cogs 08

Well these logs are getting busy, almost fell off the page after a day.

06/01/08 - 8m - Lactic Threshold + 8x100m(ish) strides - 53'46" - 6'43"pm - AHR 160

The schedule had me down to run 8m 'aerobically' with 8*100m strides. P&D aerobically would equate to a relaxed steady (getting in the miles) pace. However, as my Sunday run went well enough and I had Monday off I had a feeling I'd be pushing it, more like a lactic threshold run (as fast a pace as you can hold without lactic build-up slowing you down).

Some days you go out and running feels like the most unnatural thing you could ask your legs to do, like hopscotch or something. Last night it felt like I had the upper half of my body attached to the legs of a shorter but much fitter person. ie. I was powering along but with what felt like a shorter stride. My upper body was a little rigid with not much arm movement which could have been a reaction to the cold but increased the feeling that my legs were doing all the work. I wondered if this was just a more economical stride, a reaction to the cold or just nervous energy as I knew it was a fast (for me) pace.

The 100m strides themselves where a chance to stretch out the legs (I'm 6'2") rather than speed up much as my 405 upload will testify (getting closer to figuring out Motionbased).

In conclusion, I was happy with the run, it was good to go around at a pace faster than my (necessary) mara pace without the wheels coming off. I am meant to be in a recovery week so there'll be no fireworks for the rest of it.

--amadeus--

8 miles at 6:43 pace is tidy running with the guts of 3 months left to go, good session

Rusty Cogs 08

07/01/09 - 5m - Recovery - 38'40'' - 7'44''pm - AHR 141

Well a much more relaxed jaunt compared to last night, a minute slower per mile and 20 bpm lower too. This runs are nice as they are more contemplative. Your not so focused and thus can rearrange your thoughts. They say dreaming is a way for your brain to sort out thoughts and I kind of see running as serving a similar purpose. Although you can think sitting on your arse at home I think the endorphines (or whatever it is that makes running feel good) help you to organise your thoughts in a good frame of mind. You may not come home 100% zen but usually in a better frame of mind than when you went out.

Abhainn asked about pb's, off the top of my head (and I'll update if I can find my results)

5k - 19'20'' - Jingle Bells '08
5m - 32 ish ?
10m - 64'01" - Adidas race series '08
HM - 91'30" - Adidas race series '03
Mara - 3' 16' 57" - Reykjavik '08

So nothing spectacular there, as I've only ever trained for marathons. Would like to think pb's are achievable across the board in '09.

Rusty Cogs 08

08/01/09 - 8m - Aerobic - 54'38 - 6'49'' - AHR 157

Again a bit too fast paced, more anaerobic than aerobic but it's bloody cold out there and I had to run though crowds of kids going to the O2 (The Point) so I wasn't hanging around for complements on my tights. The first mile was 6'49 which turned out to be my average pace. The miles varied from 6'45 to 6'55. The benefit of no hills. In fairness though, my four slowest miles were my last four which were also my four highest HR (barring the 1st where it goes nuts because it thinks it's been chased by a rhino) so it shows that I went out too fast. I have to concentrate on trying to train evenly or even with reverse splits. I don't want to reach half way in the marathon and then expect to wilt in the 2nd half. Anyway, I knew tomorrow is a rest day with only 4 recovery miles on Saturday so I was happy to push it a little. Still though, that was predicted marathon pace so it gives me additional respect for sub 3 pace.

Rusty Cogs 08

Well it's been a busy few days in every respect. I have to give thanks to this site to keeping me motivated to stick to the schedule when I otherwise may have not bothered.

Saturday turned into a very hungover 6 mile curved route to my bike locked to the railings outside the pub. Won't be on the cover of 'Duathlon Monthly' for that one.

Sunday went tits up, was meant to run 12 but got distracted and never made it out (the fact the weather got progressively worse didn't help).

Monday I was absolutely cream crackered and felt like I was in some self imposed boot camp when I swaped my rest day for that 12 miles. Took 91'22 or 7'36'' pm to get around. The fact that my first mile was at an average heart rate of 85bpm :eek: will show you how zonked I was. Average HR of 138 over all.

With some sleep under my belt tonights run was a bit livelier. Ment to run 10m 5m at lactic threshold & 5 & HM pace. I'll have to go back to my P&D because I couldn't remember the distinct difference between the two, I figured there can't be much in it so I decided to give the whole thing a go and if 5 miles were faster than the other 5 then you can take your pick as to which was which (made sense at the time)

Ran as follows
6'39"
6'31"
6'33"
6'30"
6'30"
6'36"
6'35"
6'46"
6'48"
6'40"

Avg 6'37", Av HR 157bpm

So I won't say it was easy but I was pretty happy with that. My HR never got over 159 (bar the start) which showed I wasn't dying out there either.

I have to say, looking at SJ's milage and Dp's hill fiestas I'm a bit nervous at my shorter, flatter schedule. But I made a decision on this one and I'm sticking to it. If SJ & Dp get their sub 3's and I don't one could surmise that a higher milage schedule may be the way to go. But I'd like to prove it can be done with a shorter av mpw schedule. You'll see by the log though that I try to compensate by pushing my midweek runs tempo wise. Time will tell if many roads lead to the sub 3 goal.

Slogger Jogger

It'll be interesting to compare alright... Are you following a schedule Rusty? I'm using the HH advanced II, but somewhat loosely. I'm still doing a reasonable amount of pace / tempo runs aswell as the hill stuff.

Rusty Cogs 08

Yarp, doing P&D's 18w 55mpw. I know Dp is on the 70mpw version and I considered jumping up to it but it just looked like too many long runs (compared to what I'm used to). The 55mpw seemed like a more progressive plan for me atm.

donothoponpop

Rusty Cogs 08 wrote: »

Yarp, doing P&D's 18w 55mpw. I know Dp is on the 70mpw version and I considered jumping up to it but it just looked like too many long runs (compared to what I'm used to). The 55mpw seemed like a more progressive plan for me atm.

I'm on the 18w<70, but I'll probably not hit all the required mileage tbh. Likewise, I think you'll find yourself doing a little bit more mileage than that required on the 18w<55.

And I look at your pace times (ok they're on the flat but thats what R'dam will be) with envy:)

Rusty Cogs 08

Well last night's recovery 4m was utterly forgettable, took a new route which I won't bother with again. Had a bit of cramp most of the way around which made things no easier

Tonight called for 11m (pace unspecified). Ran the first in 7'24" and then fell into a rhythm which felt a little faster but nothing too aggressive. I had new(old) music on the MP3 and as Leftfield changed to Kraftwerk I felt strong similar to a good bike ride where the miles keep clocking off without too much struggle.

The last couple of miles were tougher but I think part of that is psychosomatic as you yearn for home.

7'24"
7'07"
7'10"
6'55"
6'48"
7'01"
7'06"
7'00"
7'01"
7'06"
6'46"

Avg 7'02" Avg HR 152

Lot of girls out running tonight, two's, three's & more, very few guys, was there a football game I should have been watching ?

Rusty Cogs 08

78 days to Rotterdam

(apologies in advance for the long spiel)

Well after a rest yesterday, today was meant to be 8 miles of something or other with 18m tomorrow but as I'm doing the IMRA Howth tomorrow I figured I'd push the 18m to today. Add the fact that there was a storm due in the 'arvo I had to carb up after the cinema last night and get to bed. Set off this morning at 10am (that's early for me, really don't like morning runs). Set the Garmin to 7'30" (PMP +10%) and headed out. The first couple of miles didn't feel great, aches in my thighs possibly from two tough midweek runs. By mile 3 & 4 things were going a bit more smoothly but I was conscious of my tail wind and the impending dark clouds. My fear was getting caught 9 miles out in the rain. I turned at 8m as I was now running up the hill of Howth and I figured I'd have enough fun with that tomorrow. En route back the wind was pretty strong and I had this extra 2 miles to fit in somewhere too. For those familiar with Clontarf strand you can run out the north Bull Wall which I'd never done but it looked about a mile so out I went and into a serious headwind. I couldn't really hear my music and it was one of those dig deep and keep digging moments. When I turned (at about 14m now) I felt the hard work was over and the wind either helped or didn't hinder too much for the return home. Rain just began to spit as I made it home and I was pretty pleased to have gotten through it all with no major (or minor really) problems. The pace was also 10secs pm faster than my last marathon so I'm beginning to believe I'm on a stronger curve than coming into the last mara. Howth tomorrow should be great craic :pac:

18m Av pace 7'20" Av HR 152

donothoponpop

Rusty Cogs 08 wrote: »

18m Av pace 7'20" Av HR 152

Nice one Rusty, that's a great pace for an 18 miler at this stage. You're flying.

Slogger Jogger

Great work RC.

--amadeus--

Blinding run, great speed for this far out

TheRoadRunner

Great running Rusty. Where do you do your long runs. Are you around Dublin at all. Send me a PM if you ever want to meet for a long run.
Cheers

Rusty Cogs 08

77 Days out

IMRA Howth Head run - 4.4m - 38'59 - Av HR 171

This was my 2nd IMRA run after the Sugar Loaf dash after Xmas. Billed as 7.5k I was wary of dashing off at the start. Actually with yesterdays 18.2m + last nights vino victoria it's a surprise I made it to the start. I actually woke up early and had to get up in the end. These runs get my blood pumping a bit because they are just so different to training runs. Your not only racing but there's the whole technical side of things too. I wore my new fell shoes and boy did I need them. I'd hate to think what it would have been like in 'runners'.

The course wound it's way up and down and around the hill of howth, all virgin territory to me so I was just making sure I followd the guy in front. The terrain was easier than the Sugar Loaf and a few more chances to pass individuals on offer. By about 2/3rds the way through I'd no idea how far into the race I was but was pretty sure I wanted it to end. I let out a holler when I saw Donothoponpop which actually caused my stomach to turn so I figured it was all about getting home at that stage. As Slogger wrote, a great race to look back on, not unlike mountain biking. You don't have time to think of much out there but fun in retrospect.

Organisation was great, hopefully the ankle will be ready for the next one.

Almost forgot, unless I was picking up someone elses, I've found my max HR, 237 !!! : O

Slogger Jogger

Well done RC. I've corrected my time to 37:05. I registered for this year under Boards too.

Rusty Cogs 08

:mad::(:mad::(:mad::(:confused:

So I twisted my ankle on the Howth run and hopped (hoped ?) it would wear off. I had a rest day Monday so went out Tuesday for a ginger 6 miles. I noticed before the run that the thing had actually swelled up so it looked quite Frodo Baggins-esq. Stuck to around 7'30" pace on a very flat course so as not to exacerbate the ankle. Came in and it didn't feel any worse than when I set out. Wednesday I was due for a 12mile PMP + 10/20%. The ankle still hurt a bit and I knew I shouldn't really be running on it at all. The swelling hadn't gone down but off I went . Again, stuck to a flat course but after about 5 miles out it began to get more sore. TCALSS I ran the 12 @ 7'20" but wasn't far of limping by the end. Diagnosis ? I'm a fcuking eijit for running on it. Yesterday was another rest day and today is meant to be tempo work but I'm not doing a thing. It's actually improving since Wednesday night (I'm no longer limping) but I'm not running a step until all traces of pain and swelling are gone. I figure 10+ weeks out I'm able to take a week of if necessary but if I keep running on it and totally bollix it up then I'll end up being off for a month and that will be curtains on my sub 3. So until next time, this is Rusty putting his feet up.

donothoponpop

That's too bad Rusty, unfortunately can happen all too frequently after your first hill run. Obviously your dainty city ankles are no match for our hardened mucksavage ligaments:)

The good news is a few days rest should see you right, and as you note yourself, you have oodles of time at this early stage. The ankle, by the way, will come back stronger for Ticknock.

--amadeus--

That sucks. I know it doesn't make it any easier but you and we know that you're doing the right thing. A lot of runners run PBs off a week or so's enforced rest. You'll be back and stronger.

Slogger Jogger

Tough luck RC. As you say a break at this stage isn't such a bad thing. Better now than later. Best of luck with the recovery.

shels4ever

Rusty Cogs 08 wrote: »

:mad::(:mad::(:mad::(:confused:

So I twisted my ankle on the Howth run and hopped (hoped ?) it would wear off. I had a rest day Monday so went out Tuesday for a ginger 6 miles. I noticed before the run that the thing had actually swelled up so it looked quite Frodo Baggins-esq. Stuck to around 7'30" pace on a very flat course so as not to exacerbate the ankle. Came in and it didn't feel any worse than when I set out. Wednesday I was due for a 12mile PMP + 10/20%. The ankle still hurt a bit and I knew I shouldn't really be running on it at all. The swelling hadn't gone down but off I went . Again, stuck to a flat course but after about 5 miles out it began to get more sore. TCALSS I ran the 12 @ 7'20" but wasn't far of limping by the end. Diagnosis ? I'm a fcuking eijit for running on it. Yesterday was another rest day and today is meant to be tempo work but I'm not doing a thing. It's actually improving since Wednesday night (I'm no longer limping) but I'm not running a step until all traces of pain and swelling are gone. I figure 10+ weeks out I'm able to take a week of if necessary but if I keep running on it and totally bollix it up then I'll end up being off for a month and that will be curtains on my sub 3. So until next time, this is Rusty putting his feet up.

I feel your pain there but better now then the week before the marathon.. You'll be back in no time.

Rusty Cogs 08

Well it actually wasn't too hard a decision. My first run after my twisted ankle was Thursday last, 3 weeks and a day break in my Rotterdam schedule and I just decided than rather missing three weeks and spending two / three weeks getting back into it I'm just going to let Rotterdam go. I want to do the IMRA Wicklow Way Ultra and two marathons in 6 days was always going to be a big ask. But if I had of done Rotterdam I'd say both could have been mediocre. I didn't want to miss my sub 3 in Rotterdam and then come home and blow up completely in Wicklow. So I'm looking at a May marathon and I'll slip the Wicklow Ultra into my training.

Anyway, thems the breaks, just happy to be back running. I'll start a new log soon with my plans laid out.

I'll just take the opportunity to wish good luck to Dp, Slogger, Amadeus and any other Rotterdam hopefuls. Looking at the logs you guys should do yourselves (and BAC) proud on the day. Just a pity I can't be there to share it.

Paddyontherun

Sorry to hear that Rusty. Thanks for the posts it helped the momentum going. Are you going to travel to Rotterdam in any case? I am hoping to break 4hrs but have had interruptions recently with a heavy cold and last weeks weather. Its beginning to come together now though.