What language were you thought in college?

ChRoMe

Hey,

Just want to do a quick informal poll to get an idea of what languages are currently being used in Irish university's to teach programming.

I'm currently doing a even degree in DIT, and have been quite surprised (and disapointed) to learn that the progression seems to be from C to C++ with very little Java and no .net

Personally, I think learning C straight off the bat is a bad idea, I also question the marketability of someone doing C++ versus Java or .NET?

Your views/experiences please!

ChRoMe

helimachoptor

ChRoMe wrote: »

thought

What language do they use for spell checkers

ChRoMe

lol fingers moving faster than mind!

kayos

I look at it like this there is learning to program and then learning the syntax of a language.

In primary school I was happily writing BASIC on the C64, in college I did C/C++ and some form of assembly don’t ask me which it was. I used C++ a little in my first job but since then it’s been other languages. I’ve never had any problems changing from one language to another.

C/C++ both provide a good introduction into programming and how to program. C to learn how to code, C++ to cover OO and after that you just need to learn the syntax of the different languages. The design patterns are the same for them all only the implementation might be slightly different. If you read over some of the topics on VB.NET Vs C# you will notice that one of the plus’s mentioned for C# is you can get a C++/Java dev in and he will be up and running pretty quickly. So what you should take from that is being good at C++ should allow you to very easily pick up C#. Another plus to C++ would be it is used across so many platforms; learning .NET would tie you closer to Windows.

A college would never be able to keep all students happy you want .NET, the person next to you wants C and the next guy wants JAVA, and some weirdo wants to learn Assembly. Giving the students a firm base in programming is the best they can do to cover all the bases. If you want to learn .NET go out and buy a book, grab VS express and learn it in parallel to your college work. If you have an assignment to do something in C/C++ do it and then do it in .NET. Once you get a project choice go down your .NET path if they let you and I’m pretty sure they will. This will give you some .NET work to show at the end of it and show employers that you can switch from one language to another.

AARRRGH

Pascal -> Fortran -> Cobol -> C -> C++ -> Java

Tom Dunne

Pascal, C, assembly language. Um, that was it.

I think if you get a solid foundation in programming, you should be able to switch to any language. Except maybe LISP or Prologue.

fasty

Java, C++, Assembly.

Now write mostly in C++ and a little in C#

oeb

I did not go to college.

But it is far far more important to learn how to learn a programming language than it is to learn any specific language.

You should be in a position where you can start writing some kind of useful code in a language after a couple of days, TOPS.

Q_Ball

I did my degrees in DIT, graduated in 2006. I said degrees because I started on the ordinary degree in computing (3 years) then did the final year of the comp science degree. My progression was Pascal > C > Java for the ordinary degree, then had to learn C++ on my own for the honours degree because some of the classes I took assumed you coud use it already (the honours degree students had learned it in 2nd year, their progression was C > C++ > Java).

There's no .Net taught in DIT afaik. I believe the reason for this is that Java is more prevalent in the industry and that companies need a comercial licence for VS, which puts most off when they could use Eclipse and Java for free.

It is odd that Java isn't being taught though. Doing C straight off the bat isn't a bad thing imo. It gives you a good basis in the fundamentals of programming first without having to worry about OOP as well.

Creamy Goodness

First year: C and haskell

Second year: C++ and SQL and Assembly HTML XML, PHP

Third year: java and PL/SQL

Fourth year: perl and all of the above except C++

Ginger

C++, COBOL, Asm, Win C++, VB, VBS

Program in whatever .NET language I am required to. Changed languages and technologies so many times at this stage, its a case of learning the particular syntax rather than programming

Webmonkey

First Year:
C++
MC68000 Assembly.

Second Year:
C - Learning Data structures, Queues, Stacks, Semaphores, IPC. I think learning C is very important. Especially if you want to go into real time systems/embedded systems area where critical timing is involved.
x86 Assembly including FPU

Third Year:
Java

Fourth year
Back to C for real time systems.
Ada - Important for real time systems.
C/C++ for OpenGL programming.


I'm very happy with my course content.

AARRRGH

I love C.

For my masters thesis a lot of my code was based around bit manipulation (elliptic curve cryptography - you have to use polynomial maths instead of integer maths - this means every calculation involves bit manipulation) and C made this a piece of cake. Well, sort of, but the way it gives you access to low level operations while keeping things fairly high level is just lovely.

Everyone in college should learn C.

And anyway, .NET is for pussies!!

Calina

It's a while ago now, but did some Java, assembler and VB while I was in college.

FWIW I use assembler on a daily basis.

run_Forrest_run

C, COBOL, Prolog, VB, Perl, Java

I work with Java 100% now but C was a very good introduction to programming I feel.

Also, OP, don't feel too disappointed with learning C++ over Java in College, seriously, if you can master C++ then you will pick up Java very quickly. C++ teaches you to take responsibility for your coding, it forces you to think about how you manage memory and resources in your code, since Java does a lot of this behind the scenes for you it makes the developer go a bit lazy (I'll admit it!!).

I believe no language is a waste of time, learning various different types gives you a greater insight into programming in general, even if you do end up coding mainly in an OO language in your job.

run_Forrest_run

Q_Ball wrote: »

Doing C straight off the bat isn't a bad thing imo. It gives you a good basis in the fundamentals of programming first without having to worry about OOP as well.

exactly, good point.

stevenmu

Java, C, C++, Assembly, Lisp, Prolog, VBA, SQL (if we're counting that as a language), and my FYP was in VBScript (my choice). It wasn't a progression from one to the other though, different subjects used whichever tool was most appropriate, as it should be.

As others have said, the actual language you learn isn't particularly important, it's learning the theory and practices, and learning how to learn, that's important.

Saint_Mel

Way back in the day I went from:
COBOL -> VB3 -> VC++ -> Assembly -> Java

cmcsoft

Cobol
RPG
Java
.Net

Páid

Smalltalk, SQL & Java

hobochris

First year: java(j2se) + vb6/.net

Second year: java(j2ee)

Third year: c++,jsp,

Fourth year: c#/asp,processing(java based)

Also did CCNA.

stevenmu wrote: »

As others have said, the actual language you learn isn't particularly important, it's learning the theory and practices, and learning how to learn, that's important.

+1.

An OO programmer can quickly pick up practically any language very quickly.

pwd

c, sql c++, java, in that order. Graduated 2002. Any OO language is good in college like others have said. In work I've used VBA & sql, VB.NET & sql, C# & sql, in that order. The transition between languages isn't hard and I agree that you learn more about programming in general by using different languages. This mightn't always be the view of recruiters is the only thing
Learning different frameworks is another matter though. Depending on what you're doing you might be more concerned with the framework than with the language. I think the more generic the application you are developing, the more you will be configuring framework elements, and the less programming you will be doing from the ground up. This isn't a necessarily a bad thing. Generic applications are generic because they are used a lot. You will have more results more quickly the more framework elements you are leveraging and the less you need to do from the ground up. On the other hand it can get a bit repetitive and you might feel your skills plateau fairly early. Developing more specific and novel applications will teach you more, and be more interesting I think - but it will take longer too.

ChRoMe

I suppose I should put my point of view into context. I've been working in IT since I was 17 years old (telephone technical support for Ireland On line), I'm 25 now. I moved up different desk side support jobs until getting to Desktop Support Coordinator.

It was when I totally moved away from the phones, that I got my first professional experience of writing code by at first hacking together shell scripts and writing some simple PHP/MySql stuff, until I got the chance in a new job to do some linux/tomcat support along with some junior developer Java projects. Everything I know is self taught through reading API docs and a lot of mistakes!

I started doing the course in the evenings before getting the support/junior java developer role. Im in a great environment to learn java on the job and my employer is happy to pay for some professional training.

I feel very torn at the moment as learning java for 8 hours a day in work, and then walking into DIT to do 3 hours of C (which i know I have no interest in learning) is really pissing me off.

I dont have any interest in writing Linux device drivers or that lower level work. I have a clear idea that I want to concentrate on J2EE and some J2ME, so I'm trying to figure out if I should now leave the evening DIT course so I can do the sun certs.

oeb

ChRoMe wrote: »

I suppose I should put my point of view into context. I've been working in IT since I was 17 years old (telephone technical support for Ireland On line), I'm 25 now. I moved up different desk side support jobs until getting to Desktop Support Coordinator.

It was when I totally moved away from the phones, that I got my first professional experience of writing code by at first hacking together shell scripts and writing some simple PHP/MySql stuff, until I got the chance in a new job to do some linux/tomcat support along with some junior developer Java projects. Everything I know is self taught through reading API docs and a lot of mistakes!

I started doing the course in the evenings before getting the support/junior java developer role. Im in a great environment to learn java on the job and my employer is happy to pay for some professional training.

I feel very torn at the moment as learning java for 8 hours a day in work, and then walking into DIT to do 3 hours of C (which i know I have no interest in learning) is really pissing me off.

I dont have any interest in writing Linux device drivers or that lower level work. I have a clear idea that I want to concentrate on J2EE and some J2ME, so I'm trying to figure out if I should now leave the evening DIT course so I can do the sun certs.

What do you want to do?

Elfman

1st year : C++, QBasic (The programming laguage Jesus used), VB6(little)
2nd year : C++, Prolog, VB6, PL/SQL,
3rd year : Java, VB6
4th year : Java, Lejos, Assembley,

And i walked into my first job working with .net.

There's really only a weekend crash course
standing between you and a working knowleadge of
another language as long as your basics are good

- Elfman

padraig_f

I'd highly recommend sticking with the C course. It's important that you learn about things like memory management, which if you only learn Java, it's very easy to miss out on.

If I was hiring someone, I'd have no worries about hiring a C/C++ programmer with no knowledge of Java for a Java role. But I'd have real concerns about hiring someone who only learned Java for a C/C++ role. And there are still a lot of C/C++ roles outside of device drivers.

have a listen to this podcast episode:
http://blog.stackoverflow.com/2008/04/podcast-2/
http://blog.stackoverflow.com/audio/stackoverflow-podcast-002.mp3

skip to 37 mins in where they answer a listener's question 'Should I learn C++?'.


[that's a great programming podcast in general btw]

Ass

ChRoMe wrote: »

I suppose I should put my point of view into context. I've been working in IT since I was 17 years old (telephone technical support for Ireland On line), I'm 25 now. I moved up different desk side support jobs until getting to Desktop Support Coordinator.

It was when I totally moved away from the phones, that I got my first professional experience of writing code by at first hacking together shell scripts and writing some simple PHP/MySql stuff, until I got the chance in a new job to do some linux/tomcat support along with some junior developer Java projects. Everything I know is self taught through reading API docs and a lot of mistakes!

I started doing the course in the evenings before getting the support/junior java developer role. Im in a great environment to learn java on the job and my employer is happy to pay for some professional training.

I feel very torn at the moment as learning java for 8 hours a day in work, and then walking into DIT to do 3 hours of C (which i know I have no interest in learning) is really pissing me off.

I don't have any interest in writing Linux device drivers or that lower level work. I have a clear idea that I want to concentrate on J2EE and some J2ME, so I'm trying to figure out if I should now leave the evening DIT course so I can do the sun certs.

I'm a third year in your course. You will not regret learning C or C++. Having done C and C++ in first and second year, I was able to pick up most of the basics of Java and C# in about three days.

You will be expected to do so as well. They throw you in at the deep end for both when you get in to third year.

ChRoMe

I understand and appreciate the points being made regarding the benefits of having to wade through stuff like memory management in C. But at the same time I know I want to stick with J2EE/J2ME stuff as its a area i am particularly interested in as I have worked in the mobile communications industry for a couple of years.

I'm aware there are a lot of other uses for C/C++ stuff then device drivers (such as stuff like games development etc) but none of these fields interest me at all. And considering I'm already in a position where I have the development job that I want, learning C/C++ holds little interest. Along with the fact that as a marketable skill they are no where near Java/.NET in regards opportunities.

I need to pick a path, and the one where I'm already working on commercial projects getting real world experience, just seems to make the theory college course not as important to me.

Atomic Pineapple

Currently in college

Java
.NET
Prolog
Lisp

rmacm

Scheme
C++
Java
PHP (this was more self learning, used it in a project where we could pick our own language)
Assembly

Anima

1st year: Html / Javascript
2nd year: C
3rd year: More C
4th year: Java, Assembly, embedded C, Matlab code
5th year: More Java, C++, bits of SQL, learning PHP for my FYP

techguy

Im in second year at Griffith College..

In first year we did Java but the emphasis was on technique and program design.."it just so happened that we were doing Java" was the way my lecturer put it..

First semester this year its still Java through studying algorithms etc..I think we will be doing VB.net after xmas..

Red Alert

In EE we learned C and a smattering of C++. What I like about C is that it's accessible from an initial teaching point-of-view and needs little boilerplate code to do "Hello world", compared to say Java. Then it does make you think about memory management, which is going to lead to good overall programming practices in the long run. Then you can use the other higher level languages knowing what they're doing behind the scenes. Same way I always try learning a new language using the basic command-line tools rather than XCode or VS.

One other thing is that if you haven't learned a scripting/interpreted language of some sort - Python, Perl or others, it might be good to start. One of my biggest handicaps was learning MATLAB because I'm inclined to use it as a scripting language rather than learning another one.

Sweeno

In first year doing Java.. sickener

techguy

Sweeno wrote: »

In first year doing Java.. sickener

Sickener?? I'm curious..why is that??

I kinda like java...have you experience with any other languages??

Donald-Duck

techguy wrote: »

Sickener?? I'm curious..why is that??

I kinda like java...have you experience with any other languages??

He might be one of those cool "old skool" kids who programs in assembly.

IRLConor

1st Year: Java, 68k Assembly
2nd Year: C++, Eiffel, 68k Assembly
3rd Year: Prolog, C++, Handel-C, Level 5 Object
4th Year: Java, Vivio

Not all of those were explicitly taught, for example Java in 4th year was merely the language I used for my Final Year Project and Prolog was more the medium of instruction for a course than a course in itself. I used copious amounts of Perl and LaTeX throughout the degree but since they were strictly optional I didn't include them above. I also used some sort of HDL in 2nd year but I can't remember the name of it.

Civilian_Target

1st yr. Mostly Java, some VB
2nd yr. Java and Cobol
Final yr. Java, Prolog and Fortran

dazberry

Modula 2, C, C++ (Tutorials only - it was pretty new then so wasn't on the course otherwise), 6800, VAX Assembly and Cobol.

D.

Epic Tissue

IRLConor wrote: »

1st Year: Java, 68k Assembly
2nd Year: C++, Eiffel, 68k Assembly
3rd Year: Prolog, C++, Handel-C, Level 5 Object
4th Year: Java, Vivio

Not all of those were explicitly taught, for example Java in 4th year was merely the language I used for my Final Year Project and Prolog was more the medium of instruction for a course than a course in itself. I used copious amounts of Perl and LaTeX throughout the degree but since they were strictly optional I didn't include them above. I also used some sort of HDL in 2nd year but I can't remember the name of it.

Was that in TCD?

IRLConor

Epic Tissue wrote: »

Was that in TCD?

Yes.

OwenM

Does any college in the country teach python? Just wondering.

I'm in third year and so far:

Java/RPG
Java/RPG
Java/RPG


I think we are doing prolog in 4th year. I was thinking of taking up python or PHP just to have scripting experience. Anyone favour PHP over python or vice versa ?

ethernet

OwenM wrote: »

Does any college in the country teach python? Just wondering.

First year IT (only through Arts though) in NUIG, or at least this was the case last year.

Studying IT directly. C in first year with a slight smattering of bash scripting in another module apart from programming itself.

Java second year as well as touching off assembly and a mixture of C/bash in another module when I get back. More Java next year.

Glad C was taught first. Makes you get a better understanding of what's going on under the hood, especially with regard to memory, IMHO.

Sweeno

techguy wrote: »

Sickener?? I'm curious..why is that??

I kinda like java...have you experience with any other languages??

just said sickener because of a previous posts sayin it was better to learn C first, javas alright its the only language i know anything about so i cant really complain