David Holwell returns to Leinster!

Crash

http://leinsterrugby.ie/newsroom/3012.php

Leinster Rugby has announced that out-half David Holwell has rejoined as cover for the next few weeks...
Holwell, 33, made 22 appearances for the province during the 2004/05 season and amassed 282 points (5 tries, 55 conversions, 49 penalties) in all competitions.

Leinster Coach Michael Cheika commented: “I am delighted that David was so keen to return to Leinster to provide cover over the next few weeks. David has outstanding experience as an international class operator and I know how highly he is regarded by those who played with him during his last spell with Leinster, which makes me very confident in him playing an important role for us at this important stage of the season. "The fact that the he has already worn the blue jersey and understands our culture is a real bonus.

“With Felipe Contepomi and Isa Nacewa due to return to action over the next few weeks, it is important that we maintain our momentum and David will provide the extra cover we need in the out-half position behind Jonathan Sexton.”

Holwell’s representative honours include selection for North Island Under-16 (1991), New Zealand Under-17 (1992), New Zealand Colts (1996), Rugby Academy (1998), and New Zealand A (1998 and 2000). He also won the NPC title with the Wellington Lions in 2000.

Since moving home to New Zealand, he has featured for Northland in the Air New Zealand Cup (1995-98 and since 2005) and the Hurricanes in the Super 14 where he has also played for the Auckland Blues. He was called back into the Hurricanes squad in 2006, where his experience helped the side into their first Super 14 final and has scored 676 points in 76 appearances.

Holwell is the holder of two Leinster records from his season with the province; the most individual points scored in a Celtic League game (26 against Llanelli) and the most individual points in a Heineken Cup game (29 against Bourgoin).

Coming in for a few weeks until Nacewa and Contepomi are back as outhalf cover. Interesting one, any idea what his play has been like since he left us?

bamboozle

great signing!

Amz

I looooooooooove him!

Yay! Hopefully he's as useful as I remember him

cmcsoft

I agree, excellent signing fro Leinster, I know he played Super 14 last year with the Blues but I haven't heard anything of him since.

Amazotheamazing

Shocking lack of faith in Sexton, imo. Nacewa and Contepomi will be fit pretty soon, and Kearney is a handy goal kicker if Sexton gets the yips.

TarfHead

Hmmm.

I wasn't too impressed with how his stated reason for returning home, worked out against what he did when he returned home.

And while he was a great player for Leinster, that was a few years ago and he was past his peak then.

And the description of Contepomi's injury intrigues me. How can a hand infection rule him out of play for so long ?

Clean the wound - antibiotic - job done - get your boots on ?

Serenity Now!

Thats the spirit :rolleyes:
Bring in an overseas, non-Irish qualified player at a key position (especially with national team in mind) to stand-in for two other overseas non-Irish qualified players while the Irish qualified player gets dumped to bench or worse.
Holwell is a good player (saw him during the Air New Zealand Cup games this year) but for f**k's sake, Irish provinces.

Graham Henry and Sean Fitzpatrick were right when they pinpointed the gulf between Tri Nations and 6N teams.

Crash

Amazo: I think the purpose is the Castres game on the 6th of December - We need a backup outhalf for that game otherwise we're potentially screwed.

edit: oh and I will point out, Cheika quite clearly states he's there as cover "behind Jonathan Sexton".

I really don't see this as a big deal, or a lack of faith in Sexton, but more the fact that after Sexton there's a fairly large gulf til our next number 10, and not one i'd like to see exploited for the HC game.

cmcsoft

I wouldn't say it's a lack of faith in Sexton, he's just coming in as backup. Can't see him being dropped for Holwell. Leinster have a few important HC games coming up, you need an experienced head on the bench if Sexton get's injured

Amazotheamazing

Going Forward wrote: »

Amazo: I think the purpose is the Castres game on the 6th of December - We need a backup outhalf for that game otherwise we're potentially screwed.

edit: oh and I will point out, Cheika quite clearly states he's there as cover "behind Jonathan Sexton".

I really don't see this as a big deal, or a lack of faith in Sexton, but more the fact that after Sexton there's a fairly large gulf til our next number 10, and not one i'd like to see exploited for the HC game.

If Holwell is a better player than Sexton, then he has to play imo, you can't limit your team in a big game. If Cheika thought Sexton was up to it, he wouldn't have rushed a player over from the far side of the world. Either that or Nacewa's and Contepomi's injuries are more serious than they're letting on.

cmcsoft

You can't go into a game like this with only one recognised outhalf. It's fine to say give Irish players a chance but Sexton will start, Holwell will be cover.

Serenity Now!

cmcsoft wrote: »

I wouldn't say it's a lack of faith in Sexton, he's just coming in as backup. Can't see him being dropped for Holwell. Leinster have a few important HC games coming up, you need an experienced head on the bench if Sexton get's injured

You show great faith in this. Good luck on that.

If you're a coach desperate to win a game, you pick your best team possible. No two ways about it. A coach is not going to be dictated in anyway on selection by anyone outside their staff. Sexton might start the first game but there's no way if Holwell plays better when he comes on that Sexton will be chosen ahead in the next crucial fixture.

The four Irish provinces here are going to have even more bloody overseas players playing for them than even Wales, France or England at this rate.

Amazotheamazing

cmcsoft wrote: »

You can't go into a game like this with only one recognised outhalf. It's fine to say give Irish players a chance but Sexton will start, Holwell will be cover.

Why would you play the weaker outhalf in a big game?

Crash

Tbh i'm not sure what Holwells current form is like, or even where he'ss been playing lately? Assuming airNZ cup. Sexton will start the Castres game - i'd guess Holwell is there to take over 1)if sexton gets injured or 2)if he starts playing utter ****e.

edit: Erk. He's been playing for Northland, //ignore that. was looking at the wrong year.

cmcsoft

I think we're losing the point here. Who says Holwell is better than Sexton? I think Sexton is a very good player and would expect him to keep his place. If Holwell comes on and plays better so be it. Our boys need to step up to the plate and start proving that they are good enough to keep their places.

If our young guys can't cut it against guys coming to the end of their careers from the tri nations than we have a bigger problem than I though. I think this will push Sexton to perform at his best

crisco10

Going Forward wrote: »

Amazo: I think the purpose is the Castres game on the 6th of December - We need a backup outhalf for that game otherwise we're potentially screwed.

edit: oh and I will point out, Cheika quite clearly states he's there as cover "behind Jonathan Sexton".

I really don't see this as a big deal, or a lack of faith in Sexton, but more the fact that after Sexton there's a fairly large gulf til our next number 10, and not one i'd like to see exploited for the HC game.

I would have assumed that Holwell wouldnt be registerd for the HC no? or can he be registered after the cut off these days?

Serenity Now!

cmcsoft wrote: »

Who says Holwell is better than Sexton?

I would.
Wholly experienced and a 'compleat' footballer who was in sublime form for his NZ union side this year. A proven playmaker who has all facets of the game in the bag.

Amazotheamazing

crisco10 wrote: »

I would have assumed that Holwell wouldnt be registerd for the HC no? or can he be registered after the cut off these days?

Yep, Leinster can still register to extra players.

cmcsoft

Serenity Now! wrote: »

I would.
Wholly experienced and a 'compleat' footballer who was in sublime form for his NZ union side this year. A proven playmaker who has all facets of the game in the bag.

I will agree he has all the components of a great player but Sexton is young and dynamic. I think it is shrewd move by Cheika. He has the best of both Worlds

sm.org

If Sexton is anything less then excellent in his next game then he will be dropped and Holwell will start for the remainder of his contract.

Sexton seems to be a confidence player and clearly needs a run of games whether or not he's playing well or not. Thats clearly not going to happen now.

Rugby is a professional game and the pressure on Cheika to do well in the HC this year is huge, I can completely understand his thinking.

Amazotheamazing

cmcsoft wrote: »

I will agree he has all the components of a great player but Sexton is young and dynamic. I think it is shrewd move by Cheika. He has the best of both Worlds

But you can only play one of them.

cmcsoft

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

But you can only play one of them.

But look at the options he has, whereas without another outhalf if Sexton got hurt, has an off day or can't cope with the occasion he has no other option.

If you were Cheika you would do the exact same thing given the situation

Amazotheamazing

cmcsoft wrote: »

But look at the options he has, whereas without another outhalf if Sexton got hurt, has an off day or can't cope with the occasion he has no other option.

If you were Cheika you would do the exact same thing given the situation

If I was Cheika, having signed Holwell I'd start him.

cmcsoft

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

If I was Cheika, having signed Holwell I'd start him.

I can't see it, can he play Saturday?

Goodluck2me

cmcsoft wrote: »

I will agree he has all the components of a great player but Sexton is young and dynamic. I think it is shrewd move by Cheika. He has the best of both Worlds

Sexton can learn from the infinitely more experienced Holwell too, and it should push him.

If it turns out Sexton isn't good enough, I don't care where he's from he shouldn't be playing.

Serenity Now!

sm.org wrote: »

Rugby is a professional game and the pressure on Cheika to do well in the HC this year is huge, I can completely understand his thinking.

His thinking and those who think like him is already evident in being detriment to Irish, English, Welsh and French rugby on the international stage.

Pity really.

Zzippy

cmcsoft wrote: »

I will agree he has all the components of a great player but Sexton is young and dynamic. I think it is shrewd move by Cheika. He has the best of both Worlds

Well, he's young alright, but dynamic??? I haven't seen too much to be impressed by yet, the hype is a lot more than the substance to date.

BTW, did Contempomi nearly lose a finger or something? Didn't think a small infection would keep him out that long...

Podge_irl

We have no idea how well Holwell is going to be able to play. He was signed as cover because Leinster have had to play games without a recognised outhalf in the HC in the past and it wasn't pretty. Sexton will start this game and the Castres game I imagine. If, as some are so ridiculously quick to suggest, Holwell is still so much better then Sexton at this stage that he demands inclusion in the starting team for Castres then it hardly matters that foreign talent was brought in because Sexton will have been shown to be not good enough anyway. I don't happen to expect to see that happen.

Holwell did very well for Leinster when he last played for them and I think its great that he is so eager to come back and help out for a few weeks.

Podge_irl

Serenity Now! wrote: »

His thinking and those who think like him is already evident in being detriment to Irish, English, Welsh and French rugby on the international stage.

Pity really.

What complete and utter nonsense. In case anyone missed it Healy, Toner, O'Brien and McFadden are starting the game against the Dragons. Cheika plays young Irish players when he thinks they are good enough. He had no trouble throwing Kearney, Fitz and Heaslip straight into the first team.

Amazotheamazing

Podge_irl wrote: »

What complete and utter nonsense. In case anyone missed it Healy, Toner, O'Brien and McFadden are starting the game against the Dragons.

Nothing to do with injuries?

Podge_irl

Yes, of course it does. Though Healy, Toner and O'Brien would be in the squad/starting anyway. My point is that there is a large number of young Irish players regularly involved with Leinster and that Cheika's thinking is merely that playing ones that aren't good enough and who he thinks never will be is pointless.

wixfjord

Good signing imo. I was a big fan of this guy. Cant see him playing too much tho and itd be very harsh on sexton if he did

Stev_o

I forse Sextons contract not being renewed. I heard this rumor on the MF forums yesterday didnt want to post as it seems a big no no

RugbyFanatic

I find it quite ridiculous how this early in the season, with only a handful of games under his belt, following on from an excellent season in which he showed up even ROG that people are so eager to throw Sexton to the lions.

Cheika has said he has signed Holwell for backup behind Sexton until Phil or Nacewa are back to fitness. This isn't a distinct lack of faith in Sexton it is merely a shrewd move. Lets say Sexton got injured who would you suggest start for crucial HC and ML game?

I honestly don't see why there is such a campaign against Sexton judge him at the end of the season not at the start ffs he earned that right last season.

It's funny, Sexton was far, far superior to Keatley last season and never received even half the praise Keatley has so far this season. Keatley is overhyped to a laughable degree and whether you like it or not Sexton is the better option. By the way this isn't just my opinion the messiah to many posters that is Declan Kidney seems to agree as well

anonymous_joe

I do hope to see Sexton getting the starts, but could be handy for the last 20 minutes of games.

Crash

But guys, more importantly, does this mean that after 3 full years, we can start calling stringer a scumbag again over the fake knee to the face incident in holwells final match? I THINK SO!

RugbyFanatic

Zzippy wrote: »

Well, he's young alright, but dynamic??? I haven't seen too much to be impressed by yet, the hype is a lot more than the substance to date.

Watch last season? In fairness to Sexton hes only had two bad games this season and its far too early to be able to judge.

BTW, did Contempomi nearly lose a finger or something? Didn't think a small infection would keep him out that long...

Depends I had a friend who got a very bad infection his hand swelled up and wasn't able to use it for a month

Stev_o

RugbyFanatic wrote: »

I find it quite ridiculous how this early in the season, with only a handful of games under his belt, following on from an excellent season in which he showed up even ROG that people are so eager to throw Sexton to the lions.

Cheika has said he has signed Holwell for backup behind Sexton until Phil or Nacewa are back to fitness. This isn't a distinct lack of faith in Sexton it is merely a shrewd move. Lets say Sexton got injured who would you suggest start for crucial HC and ML game?

I honestly don't see why there is such a campaign against Sexton judge him at the end of the season not at the start ffs he earned that right last season.

It's funny, Sexton was far, far superior to Keatley last season and never received even half the praise Keatley has so far this season. Keatley is overhyped to a laughable degree and whether you like it or not Sexton is the better option. By the way this isn't just my opinion the messiah to many posters that is Declan Kidney seems to agree as well

You mean following on from a summer tour in the USA with Ireland A where he was a embarrassment with his state of kicking, where the substitute Fly Half Keatley who mostly only got 10 minutes or even less, impressed everyone far more then Sexton.

If Kidney had faith in Sexton he would of been in the 22 for Canada so dont start that nonsense the guy is inconsistent and unless by a miracle he learns to kick he wont get very far.

And btw who was the OH who was playing for Connacht when they beat Leinster? And who was OH for Leinster? Also i remember a certain tackle by the so called over hyped player you refer on the worlds best 6 who was in for a try.

Crash

Just on a note of Sextons kicking, apparently he's had a decent game or two converting penalties for Leinster A. Going on match reports btw, having not seen the games, but still a good sign.

RugbyFanatic

Stev_o wrote: »

You mean following on from a summer tour in the USA with Ireland A where he was a embarrassment with his state of kicking, where the substitute Fly Half Keatley who mostly only got 10 minutes or even less, impressed everyone far more then Sexton.

I am sorry but this tour has been blown completely out of proportion. Sexton had a good tour OTHER than his kicking. I feel this needs to be addressed because its been getting out of hand. Keatley played well when he came on but one must remember by the time Keatley came on the opposition would make a rake of changes and he was essentially playing players at a far weaker standard.

If Kidney had faith in Sexton he would of been in the 22 for Canada so dont start that nonsense the guy is inconsistent and unless by a miracle he learns to kick he wont get very far.

More faith in Sexton than he had in Keatley.

And btw who was the OH who was playing for Connacht when they beat Leinster? And who was OH for Leinster? Also i remember a certain tackle by the so called over hyped player you refer on the worlds best 6 who was in for a try.

I have to say I love the notion in this forum that whatever team wins instantly means that the winning teams player is better than his opposite number.

Ireland beat Italy in the six nations therefore Heaslip is a far superior player to Parisse under your logic, well done

Stev_o

RugbyFanatic wrote: »

Ireland beat Italy in the six nations therefore Heaslip is a far superior player to Parisse under your logic, well done

Nope your not understanding the logic in this.

Your a better player when you OUTPLAY YOUR OPPOSITE NUMBER not too hard to understand is it? .Keatley outplayed Sexton that match completely and he guided Connacht to victory why didnt Sexton guide Leinster to victory?

And Healsip has never outplayed his opposite number in a Irish jersey to date

Nukem

Damn Damn Damn

Regards
Munster Fan:pac:

Always thought this guy should have never left Leinster, he left cause of family commitments i remember. On the flip side what a kick in the teeth of Sexton:mad:

RugbyFanatic

Stev_o wrote: »

Nope your not understanding the logic in this.

Your a better player when you OUTPLAY YOUR OPPOSITE NUMBER not too hard to understand is it? .Keatley outplayed Sexton that match completely and he guided Connacht to victory why didnt Sexton guide Leinster to victory?

And Healsip has never outplayed his opposite number in a Irish jersey to date

Sexton outplayed ROG last season is he a better player?

Because surely if a player outplays his opposite number in a single game that means he is a better player?

Lets ignore form over an entire season in which Sexton was far better than Keatley is!

[Jackass]

As a die hard Leinster fan I would just like to confirm what a lot of you have been saying for quite some time.

Leinster are a joke.

A sham of a club, run by incompitent twats.





Also, send us a postcard Ian, keep in touch mate.

Stev_o

[Jackass] wrote: »

As a die hard Leinster fan I would just like to confirm what a lot of you have been saying for quite some time.

Leinster are a joke.

A sham of a club, run by incompitent twats.





Also, send us a postcard Ian, keep in touch mate.

Jesus Jackass a post of yours which is under 100 words about Leinster im disappointed i was expecting at least a 1000 words dealing with Leinsters new crutch of importing players :P

[Jackass]

haha, well since you mention it....

Zzippy

RugbyFanatic wrote: »

I find it quite ridiculous how this early in the season, with only a handful of games under his belt, following on from an excellent season in which he showed up even ROG that people are so eager to throw Sexton to the lions.

Cheika has said he has signed Holwell for backup behind Sexton until Phil or Nacewa are back to fitness. This isn't a distinct lack of faith in Sexton it is merely a shrewd move. Lets say Sexton got injured who would you suggest start for crucial HC and ML game?

I honestly don't see why there is such a campaign against Sexton judge him at the end of the season not at the start ffs he earned that right last season.

It's funny, Sexton was far, far superior to Keatley last season and never received even half the praise Keatley has so far this season. Keatley is overhyped to a laughable degree and whether you like it or not Sexton is the better option. By the way this isn't just my opinion the messiah to many posters that is Declan Kidney seems to agree as well

34 posts in and you're the first poster to mention Keatley. The thread had discussed the merits of Sexton and Holwell, and the lack of cover at OH for Leinster, but no one had mentioned Keatley.
But since you did - Sexton has had one season of playing for Leinster, semi-regularly. Still can't get his game when the big games come along. He is 23, 2 years older than Keatley. Keatley is already playing regularly in the ML at 21, and has so far this season been better than Sexton. Doesn't mean he is a better player, you're right, judge it over the season, but I believe that Keatley at his age has far more potential than Sexton did at the same age.

Crash

Nukem wrote: »

Damn Damn Damn

Regards
Munster Fan:pac:

Always thought this guy should have never left Leinster, he left cause of family commitments i remember. On the flip side what a kick in the teeth of Sexton:mad:

Hmm for some reason I thought he couldnt get his contract renewed? or am I talking daft?

Podge_irl

I think the reason given was that he wanted to return home, but there were mumurings that the PAG simply wouldn't sanction a new contract for him.

RugbyFanatic

Zzippy wrote: »

34 posts in and you're the first poster to mention Keatley. The thread had discussed the merits of Sexton and Holwell, and the lack of cover at OH for Leinster, but no one had mentioned Keatley.
But since you did - Sexton has had one season of playing for Leinster, semi-regularly. Still can't get his game when the big games come along. He is 23, 2 years older than Keatley. Keatley is already playing regularly in the ML at 21, and has so far this season been better than Sexton. Doesn't mean he is a better player, you're right, judge it over the season, but I believe that Keatley at his age has far more potential than Sexton did at the same age.

If Keatley was better than Sexton at the same age then Leinster wouldn't have let him go and last time I checked Connacht dont have any Contepomis to challenge Keatley for his position.

by the way did you watch Keatley last night?

Crash

RugbyFanatic: quit derailing this thread. If you do it again you'll be banned.