(Un)employment prospects in consulting engineers - your experience?

aquascrotum

I'm a civil engineer working in a Dublin civil/environmental consultancy....this week we took a compulsory 10% paycut and there were 8 redundancies.

We're hearing chinese whispers of many other consultancies in the same boat or worse. What are your experiences? Chat is also that none of our jobs are guaranteed past Christmas. Its altogether sounding a bit ominous.

As said in another thread, a week or two ago 13 or so people were let go, and we're on a pay freeze for 2009. Not sure what else is planned.

godtabh

We've let one person go (I think). The company is doing a review of staff and expect to let 1% go but this was meant to be announced this month but nothing yet.

There will be little or now pay increases (expect possible for promotions).

lg123

the consultancy i worked for has had two culls this year todate, first was ~40 nationwide, second was ~30. structures, M&E, and roads hit the hardest.

Eoin D

Surprised roads got hit, it seems to be the only engineering I can think of at the moment thats actually doing well.

I graduated this year and applied for a ridiculous amount of jobs in structural consultancies and couldn't get one, ended up in the council (yeah I know but it's better than nothing) but I haven't signed a contract and can see myself being let go very soon. Things are not good....

Irjudge1

Eoin D wrote: »

ended up in the council (yeah I know but it's better than nothing) but I haven't signed a contract and can see myself being let go very soon. Things are not good....

Lucky you. Nothing is going to be the alternative. Bad an all as the second half of this year has been next year is likely to be a lot worse. A lot of firms are working through current workload but new work is very scarce. We have let go about 15% of staff and I would expect a 10% paycut in the new year.

The fact that I have time to drink a cup of tea and take 10mins on boards at this time of the day says an awful lot.

Eoin D

Irjudge1 wrote: »

Lucky you. Nothing is going to be the alternative. Bad an all as the second half of this year has been next year is likely to be a lot worse. A lot of firms are working through current workload but new work is very scarce. We have let go about 15% of staff and I would expect a 10% paycut in the new year.

The fact that I have time to drink a cup of tea and take 10mins on boards at this time of the day says an awful lot.

Aye, I have been lucky, I know graduated engineers on the dole. The real killer is that it's global so it's not like we can all pack up and go to a different country

lg123

have you looked at canada? heard some good stories from there.

aquascrotum

Eoin D wrote: »

Surprised roads got hit, it seems to be the only engineering I can think of at the moment thats actually doing well.QUOTE]

Roads imo is seeing / will see the biggest hit. It's going from colossal investment and growth to no new non-essential schemes in the matter of a year.

A few lads I know on roads sites are cacking themselves. 6 or 12 months ago contractors were pushing to complete on jobs as quickly as possible to move onto the next one. Now they're delaying on everything because they've nowhere else to go.

godtabh

aquascrotum wrote: »

Roads imo is seeing / will see the biggest hit. It's going from colossal investment and growth to no new non-essential schemes in the matter of a year.

Thats simply not the case. Structures has taken the biggest hit.

I work in an office where the is about 5 structures lads and 30 roads people. Roads will be one of the last effected (in terms of road design, traffic manamgent, traffic modeling etc).

lg123

you are correct about structures getting hit the hardest but roads are going to get hit very hard too imo. i am no expert but i think there was serious cutbacks for the NDP in the last budget which will have a huge impact to roads.

aquascrotum

kearnsr wrote: »

Thats simply not the case. Structures has taken the biggest hit.

I work in an office where the is about 5 structures lads and 30 roads people. Roads will be one of the last effected (in terms of road design, traffic manamgent, traffic modeling etc).

I spose I was thinking more in terms of heavy civils. Structures is closely tied to architects and the building boom - architects have been decimated for a while whereas (in my experience) engineering is only starting to catch up now.

Before the start of the bust I thought water / environmental would have been reasonably safe as the govt needs to invest millions to comply with European led legislation in terms of water quality, waste management etc. At the mo that doesnt seem to be happening though and it is drying up (excuse the slight pun) as quickly as the roads work.

von Neumann

Yeah, it's rough as a badger's behind, Can't think of any M&E consultancies who haven't let people go .

Cheese whispers around the office, 10% staff cut after Xmas, feeling the crosshairs on the back of my head. The not knowing is sh*t.

Not sure if it's a good thing or a bad thing, at this stage, the guys left behind will be under seerriooous pressure.

Zero crack left in this business .

We were told earlier that they'll try to relocate some of us to other countries/offices if it gets bad which is something I suppose. But in a different part of this company more redundancies are on the cards so I hear.

Eoin D

yeah, don't get me wrong, roads will be hit soon enough I'd say thanks to governement cuts. As I said I'm in the council and it looks like our local roads and water budget has been halved.

I would happily move to Canada for work if there's any going but I think my first step is going to take a holiday out of this crappy country! Just for a year or two...

sickle

same story here, i think every department has been hit apart from roads so far. I wouldn't be surprised if more of us were let go after xmas too.

DJDC

I feel sorry for you guys. Was working as a grad in a well known engineering consultancy in Dublin and decided the career path wasnt for me and decided to get into the finance industry in London. This area is in trouble too but I have a feeling it will recover a lot faster than the engineering consultancy industry in Ireland. Dont mean to be pessimistic but the industry could be in serious decline,at least for the next 1-5 years.The fallout from redundacies and company liquidations could be devasting.

If you are young enough, look at other options. Engineers can move into lots of different areas.Teaching,finance,accountancy,research,public service,medicine! etc.

Keep the chins up!

learntheHardWay

I really think roads is going to be the next big nuclear time bomb. by 2010 all the main inter urban route will be finished. Even before the recssion i had grave reservations about the future in 10 -15 years


One of the reasons road design hasnt been hit so much is that compared to other engineering projects roads take a huge amount of time to get to get from constriants study to CPO.

The preliminary design of roads literally cost peanuts compared to consturction costs. So the government havent pulled the plug on many projects at prelim design to my limited knowledge.

so in the next year there will be a big drop off in road design.

Anyone got any ideas of where to go now??!! Wastewater any good with the EU laws forcing work!?

Theres still huge quantites of student in the educarion system that will be flung into the dead market in the next 2 year as well!

motherfunker

How is the Building Services end of things looking? I'm graduating with an ordinary degree next year, thinking about doing Fire Safety Engineering honours degree (1 year) part time(2 years), cant afford to stay in full time education, I know it would be a good time to stay in college but the bills are piling up and need to be paid.

lg123

stay in college and get the hons degree.

shakeydude

DJDC wrote: »

.......Was working as a grad in a well known engineering consultancy in Dublin and decided the career path wasnt for me and decided to get into the finance industry in London.........

If you are young enough, look at other options. Engineers can move into lots of different areas.Teaching,finance,accountancy,research,public service,medicine! etc.

Keep the chins up!

DJDC what further education did you need to get to get a job in the finance industry????

smooth operater

Well im studying p/t and am working as a mechanical services engineer, its tough out there at the minute. There was a serious wave of redundancies a coupla months back. Alot of management, its hitting the engineers these days. Structural, roads, water and a couple of us M&E. Still see a few jobs advertised, but it'd be near impossible i'd say to land yourself a job in the industry these days.

godtabh

I got a promotion in work today but that maybe going against the norm

Irjudge1

smooth operater wrote: »

There was a serious wave of redundancies a coupla months back. Alot of management

kearnsr wrote: »

I got a promotion in work today but that maybe going against the norm

I'd be worried Kearnsr they could be going to push you from the top.

Congratulations though.

godtabh

Irjudge1 wrote: »

I'd be worried Kearnsr they could be going to push you from the top.

Congratulations though.

I'm middle management at best

aquascrotum

News coming through today of another big Dublin water/roads consultancy letting 17 go and a 10% salary cut.

Buckle up lads

Ah, congrats kearnsr. Especially in this climate that's good going.

What consultancy was that aquascrotum (if it's out in the ether)?

aquascrotum

Myth wrote: »

Ah, congrats kearnsr. Especially in this climate that's good going.

What consultancy was that aquascrotum (if it's out in the ether)?

Chat is it's Atkins.

RJC

Consultancies are service providers and when services are not needed they must contract to survive. You should have been here in the 1980's....we didn't even have consultancies then - to speak of. we had 5 people with jobs on the day we collected our degrees - only 1 in Ireland.

Buffman

Anyone got any updates on this?

Not looking great in building services anyway, couple of lads I know were let go, others having to take a 10% paycut this year. Consultants & contractors alike. I feel sorry for those who just graduated or who will finish this year.

Nothing new where I am.

aquascrotum

Thought I'd ressurrect this.

I became a statistic yesterday - the company laid off 8 and announced a statutory consultation period which will ultimately probably cut about 30-40% of the workforce.

Sitting today and I have no idea what to do. People are coming home from Australia after 1 /2 months saying all there is is shop work. The UK is flooded. Half my (former) company is apparently heading to the Canadian embassy at the weekend to start applying for Visas there.

I knew this was coming but the figures that were floating about when we were told were incredible.

RJC

What's the consultancy?.....initials will do. Given the record spend on water this year I am puzzled at the reduction in work.

lg123

WYG?

aquascrotum

WYG are reputedly starting proceedings and took a fairly hefty paycut (12%), thats not who I worked for though.

Company I was in had a fairly peripheral water section, definitely wouldnt have been a core activity - prefer not to name names until it comes out (which it probably will).

murfie

Sorry to hear you are been let go. I have been hearing that OZ is no good unless you are already settled. Canada, Vancouver area, is where I heard engineering jobs from certain companies in Houston were moving to alright. BP sent many positions there.
I am in a consulting firm also, we are feeling the chapter 11 restructuring of Lyondell a big blow. We have been reassured our jobs are safe for now with the hope of projects for other companies picking up in the summer! Scary times everywhere, not just at home in Ireland!

Fake Tales

im a graduate civil going to vancouver. Doesn't seem too positive to be honest...

dan_d

Noticed a couple of small consultancies looking for engineers with 2-3 years experience.Problem is, will they go bust too in 10 months time? It's a tough one. I know one large environmental consultancy whose staff are taking 5% paycut and who let go 20 people in the last 2 weeks.
All we can do is keep our chins up. Economies are rebuilt with jobs such as engineering etc. The Irish gov just haven't copped that yet.

Kareir

10 months is better than doing nothing, surely?

If you were just graduated, say been working for 2 years, then got laid off as you were pretty junior, surely a (hopefully) year of working would get you paid a bit, and even if you didn't actually do much, it would still be a year of "experience", so even if the company implodes, you still get that extra year and some cash, which means you might be in the position for a better job later on.

just my 2c, feel free to correct me

_Kar.

Irjudge1

Kareir wrote: »

10 months is better than doing nothing, surely?

If you were just graduated, say been working for 2 years, then got laid off as you were pretty junior, surely a (hopefully) year of working would get you paid a bit, and even if you didn't actually do much, it would still be a year of "experience", so even if the company implodes, you still get that extra year and some cash, which means you might be in the position for a better job later on.

just my 2c, feel free to correct me

_Kar.

Agree. A degree is one thing. Some experience is essential if you want to get ready for a period of recovery.

lg123

yeah, i would jump at 10 months if it was offered.

ibh

I had just accrued 2 years experience in January when i was made redundant. Since then I have picked up some work doing pressure testing on ductwork.
I have now the opportunity to go back into an engineering position in Northern Ireland. The problem is, I can make as much cash doing 2 days a week as I am at present than i can working fulltime in this job in NI.

I don't know what to do here because the Northern company is not a consultant so it's not exactly where i want to be, but at the same time it would be nice to have fulltime work again.

I am being told by some people that you should be thankful to have any job in a recession, but should you stick to this even if it means you are being paid like a fcuking placement student.

I would be interested to hear from other people with similar experience as to what you would do.

Cheers

aquascrotum

ibh wrote: »

I had just accrued 2 years experience in January when i was made redundant. Since then I have picked up some work doing pressure testing on ductwork.
I have now the opportunity to go back into an engineering position in Northern Ireland. The problem is, I can make as much cash doing 2 days a week as I am at present than i can working fulltime in this job in NI.

I don't know what to do here because the Northern company is not a consultant so it's not exactly where i want to be, but at the same time it would be nice to have fulltime work again.

I am being told by some people that you should be thankful to have any job in a recession, but should you stick to this even if it means you are being paid like a fcuking placement student.

I would be interested to hear from other people with similar experience as to what you would do.

Cheers

Be careful when comparing UK and Irish salaries - a lot will depend on whether you're intending to live in NI while working for the NI company?

An NI salary (from experience) of £26k when living in NI offers a comparable standard of living to around about E37-40k when living in Dublin and commuter region.

Those figures are changing though, given the falling wages in construction and rapidly falling rents etc in RoI.

I wouldn't even countenance living in RoI and working in NI - do it the other way round though and yer quids in!

lg123

imo, take the job. if something turns up in the south you can always leave.

here are two sites worth doing a few sums on, income tax is very high in the north compared to south for low to middle incomes. they will probably be a lot closer after the april budget though.

http://listentotaxman.com/ for "uk" tax calculations and http://taxcalc.eu/ for irish calcs. the irish one isnt working for me atm, maybe its my computer as i am having some java wonkies the last while.

ibh

I have always worked in NI while living in Dundalk. There are numerous personal reasons for this and it used to be good when exchange rate was favourable.
Atm the exchange rate is insanely bad but a job is a job, so it looks like i will have to take it. Thankfully i should have a visa to canada this year so after Sept or so i won't have to give a fcuk about bad things are here.

Needing experience is a pain in the hole, cause most employers don't want to be the one to give it to you.

motherfunker

ibh wrote: »

Thankfully i should have a visa to canada this year so after Sept or so i won't have to give a fcuk about bad things are here.

I wouldent put all my eggs in the Canadian basket, my wifes cousin is in Canada now and finding it very hard to get a job, the canadians are onto the rest of the world moving there to escape the recession and they are only giving jobs to Canadians. I'm sure this is not the case 100% of the time but I'd say it is only going to become more the norm.

ibh

motherfunker wrote: »

I wouldent put all my eggs in the Canadian basket, my wifes cousin is in Canada now and finding it very hard to get a job, the canadians are onto the rest of the world moving there to escape the recession and they are only giving jobs to Canadians. I'm sure this is not the case 100% of the time but I'd say it is only going to become more the norm.

Unfortunately this is indeed true. But it is generally only the case in unskilled jobs. They have a shortage of Engineers in a few parts of the country and it is about the most stable economy in the world so probably better opportunities than in Ireland. I have previously worked there a few years ago.

I am not guaranteed to get into Building Services out there but there are a few other areas of Engineering that i'll be looking to when i get over there.

motherfunker

The wife's cousin is a solicitor so maybe it is starting to filter its way up the ladder, how many people have you heard in the last few months saying they are going to Canada. I'm even one of them.

godtabh

I'm going to Canada for a holiday. Does that count?