Starting Strength Questions

Arctic89

Started the Starting Strength programme about 4 weeks ago. I just have a number of questions hat I hope some people can give me feedback on.

Just for a bit of background, I play a lot of Senior Level GAA so cardio-wise I'd consider myself very fit. I've also cleaned up the diet, eating clean 70-80% of the time now and did so all throughout the summer aswell, had a bit of a black spot from September to October with starting back to college. I also cycle to and from college, 4 days a week, about 10-15 minutes each way. I've put on about 3-4 lbs since the summer, I'd atrribute maybe a pound or two to SS. Though this will annoy many posters here, I take whey protein, one scoop in the morning and one after any weights, cardio, training or matches. I'm 19, 5'10'' and 11 stone.

Anyway my first question. Just recently, I've noticed that when I squat, I get a sharp burning sensation to the right of my pelvis (feels like its at the end of my abs) when pushing up from a squat. I can squat around 50kg, 3X5 (after warm ups). It only happens when I squat higher than 50kg. Thing is, I dont feel like 50kg is a challenge to any other part of my body, I've squatted as much as 70kg before but this I get this burning feeling again and feel like I should stop in case I hurt myself. Just wondering what I should do here?

Second question, I do 3 days cardio along with the starting strength programme. Usually 2 long distance runs and one sprint session /HIIT. I know this eats into my gains and isnt recommended but I cant afford to leave it out. I have competitive games starting again in January and I need my fitness level and sprints to be able to last a full game then, so I really cant afford to leave it out. Is there any way I can make up for what I'm losing out on by doing cardio. Maybe a certain type of food I should be eating straight after running, add more sets to my weights?

Third question, for the first few weeks on the programme, I noticed I was literally shaking leaving the gym, and had DOMS the next day. Lately though, I've noticed that I dont feel a whole lot worse after leaving the gym than when I went in, sometimes I feel fresher more than anything. The DOMS have also gotten less and less sore, even as the weight I'm lifting goes up. Being honest, in most workouts, I couldnt squeeze out another set at the weight I'm lifting, so I'm guessing my body has just adapted to the stress and thats why it doesnt hurt so much anymore. Is there anything extra I should be doing in my workout? Chins, pull ups etc?

Last question,I've found it really hard to increase my gains in the press and bench press. Literally been stuck between 25-35kg since I started. Tried 40kg on the bench last week and couldnt even get one rep. Anything I could do to increase this quicker. For the squat, deadlift and pwer clean the amount I can lift has been shooting up.I'd like to make strength and size gains as quickly as possible.

Anyway, sorry for the really long post. Thought I better get it all out in one thread and hopefully some of the questions are a bit more interesting than the usual supplement ones that come up here. Big thanks to all the regular posters here by the way, learned loads as long as I've been reading this.:)

quirkster

is ur form perfect when you squat??


and sorry but cardio is a weightgainers nightmare, the only thing i can think of is to have a very high protein diet, to maintain muscle

when i leave the gym, i have to sit down for half an hour, i cannot move.it means u killed yourself in the gym, its a good thing!switch the exercises your doing ever 3/4 weeks to keep shocking your muscle into new growth

dont expect rapid gains, if your go up 5kg every 2/3/4 weeks thats alot....most people wouldnt get that good gains.try using dumbells instead of a barbell. each pec will be worked individually this way, and your body learns to balance itself more and your get a better range of motion with dumbells.

hope that helps somewhat

BobbyOLeary

Firstly I'll say I've no idea whats wrong with your pelvis and I won't even try to address that.

Now for some more helpful stuff.

1. The cardio, you say you can't go without it. Cool, keep it then. Just expect less gains with Starting Strength thats all. When I did pure SS I was wrestling on my off days and I found it slowed my gains down somewhat. Just keep eating a lot and you'll be grand.

2. DOMS. I don't get them personally. Me getting DOMS is a sign of a number of things; bad sleep, not enough food, I'm unwell, etc. When everything is good for me I just don't get any. I still make gains on my lifts so it can't be a bad thing. Don't worry about adding things to your program until you've totally exhausted its potential.

3. Ah the presses. What weight are you trying to move up with each time? Normally a gym's smallest plate will be 1.25kg or thereabouts. Adding one on either end of a bar will make the jump 2.5kg. A hell of a lot to make each time you lift. Especially on the smaller lifts like the presses. Make your own partial weights (I made a set out of a plastic bag of gravel and some string). Your progress in these lifts will be horrendously slow when compared with the squat and deadlift so don't worry. It does sound a bit low to be stalling though, I'd wager you probably aren't resting up and/or eating enough.

Keep with Starting Strength, in Rip's words, "We need you strong"!

Edwardius

Arctic89 wrote: »

Anyway my first question. Just recently, I've noticed that when I squat, I get a sharp burning sensation to the right of my pelvis (feels like its at the end of my abs) when pushing up from a squat. I can squat around 50kg, 3X5 (after warm ups). It only happens when I squat higher than 50kg. Thing is, I dont feel like 50kg is a challenge to any other part of my body, I've squatted as much as 70kg before but this I get this burning feeling again and feel like I should stop in case I hurt myself. Just wondering what I should do here?

Are your knees slipping forward and ahead of your toes in the hole of the squat? That'll murder the hip flexors. I know someone who had this. It hurt like hell.

davyjose

Dead Ed wrote: »

Are your knees slipping forward and ahead of your toes in the hole of the squat? That'll murder the hip flexors. I know someone who had this. It hurt like hell.

Aye, sounds like your hips. I get this now and again myself. Stretches FTW.

Arctic89

Thanks for all the help there lads.

Hitting up the gym tonight after 1 light enough weights day and one rest day. I'll see if I can get someone to watch my form on the squat, but I'd wager most of ye are right in that its my hips causing the problem.

Never been able to eat as much protein as I'd like, I'm in college most of my waking day during the week so all I can get is ready-made food or bad deli food, which I try and eat as little as possible of. If I have a big-meal, its generally just an hour or two before I sleep, so I'm not sure how much of it would be actually used by my body and not just converted straight to fat.

qt9ukbg60ivjrn

is the pain in the muscley part or a boney part or where?

i've never had a hernia and never got my appendix out but they can happen fairly far south, maybe ask some who you know has had one of them and see if its a similar pain

BobbyOLeary

Where are you in college if you don't mind me asking?

kevpants

Arctic89 wrote: »

I've noticed that when I squat, I get a sharp burning sensation to the right of my pelvis (feels like its at the end of my abs) when pushing up from a squat.

Many underestimate the importance of strong abs in the squat. While I'm not ruling out a hernia or something, as I'm no doctor so won't try an diagnose you, if this is a muscular cramping up kind of pain in your abs you'd benefit from some proper core work. Leg raises, ab pulldowns, the plank etc. You don't need to do 1000, in fact if you can do more than 12-15 reps at your abs exercise you're not doing yourself any good. Try it and see if it helps. If it doesn't get it checked out. IF you're doing Starting Strength I'll presume you're informed on good form in the squat so this shouldn't be the issue.

Arctic89 wrote: »

Is there any way I can make up for what I'm losing out on by doing cardio. Maybe a certain type of food I should be eating straight after running, add more sets to my weights?

I wouldn't worry about it. This idea of cardio ruining your weight gains is passed on by people who heard their favourite bodybuilder say it. In the real world your sport dictates the cardio is required and worrying about burning muscle is overthinking.

Arctic89 wrote: »

Third question, for the first few weeks on the programme, I noticed I was literally shaking leaving the gym, and had DOMS the next day. Lately though, I've noticed that I dont feel a whole lot worse after leaving the gym than when I went in, sometimes I feel fresher more than anything. The DOMS have also gotten less and less sore, even as the weight I'm lifting goes up. Is there anything extra I should be doing in my workout? Chins, pull ups etc?

DOMS don't necessarily equate to progress, just as DA PUMP doesn't mean you're building muscle. I rarely get DOMS anymore but am making gains. I might do 4 days on the trot and feel physically drained but not have DOMS. It's most common when you introduce your body to something radically new like a first time squatter or something.

Arctic89 wrote: »

Last question,I've found it really hard to increase my gains in the press and bench press.

The bench goes up for beginner just due to sheer practice, then it gets tough. For one most people don't know how to bench properly, people flare their elbows, don't squueze their shoulder blades together, lift feet off the ground. And most people's form breaks down like this on the heavy lifts, just when it's needed. Refining your technique and really studying good benching will add kgs I assure you. Secondly I'd recommend training your back and your triceps. Most people neglect these. For your back do some rows in the 8-12 rep range and for your tri's I'm currently Marketing Manager for the JM Press around here. This is a pressing movement rather than an isolation one which should provide good carryover to the bench.

Please note this advice is to get your bench numbers up rather than build x amount of muscle or whatever. It's just about getting stronger in that lift which is what I think you asked

Arctic89

BobbyOLeary wrote: »

Where are you in college if you don't mind me asking?

UCD.I'm guessing from your sig that you are too! :cool:

BobbyOLeary

Yep. Forgot about my sig, ha. UCD isn't bad for food if you know where to look. I go (I should say I used to, exams dictate my gym timetable now) to "the grind" in the student centre. €3.50 for a wrap with a heap of chicken in it, eat two of those a day along with some milk (the staple of SS), a decent breakfast and dinner and I guarantee you'll make gains on it.

If you want me to take a look at your squat the next time you're in the gym give me a shout. I'm usually there about 3 days a week (Monday, Wednesday, Friday)

Arctic89

Thanks Bobby,

Was supposed to be going there tonight but found out today I've county trials on Saturday,which will mess up my schedule a bit, so I'll be heading along tomorrow night instead. I'll PM you next week when I know what day I'll be in UCD gym, should be a Wednesday (Usually get 2 sessions done in my gym in Drogheda at the weekend and just the one up in UCD during the week.)

Thanks for the advice, I'll give the Grind a go tomorrow at lunch.

BobbyOLeary

Watch the grind at lunchtime (1pm). It is packed, properly packed. Go an hour either side however and you should be fine.

Cool, I should be in on Monday and Wednesday next week, sure shoot me a PM and we can sort it out.

figs86

due to the ''repeated bout effect'' you shouldn't be experiencing DOMS after about 6 weeks of training

basically after 6 weeks of eccentric loading (lifting weights), your muscle and connective tissue have adapted to several rounds of weight lifting and no longer become as damaged or have as much trouble recovering from training

so in short, don't be disappointed that you're not in pain to make you feel you've accomplished something!

though you do need to improve your absolute strength if you cant bench 40kg, strength will definitely move down your list of priorities as your speed, cardio and skills would probably affect your game much more

strength in GAA should mainly focus on injury prevention

don't be disheartened that you aren't getting stronger very quickly this is mainly down to your training - doing long runs to maintain your cardio and other aerobic training is training your body to have slow twitch muscle which is not the muscle recruited for weight lifting - in order for you to make rapid increases in strength you would have to focus more on your weights and would probably lose your overall aerobic fitness, probably put on some weight (muscle) and slow down on the pitch as a result

as i said, strength is not top of your list of performance determining factors

CoachBoone

As long as you eat properly and sufficiently, the cardio you do shouldnt really affect the gains you make. Its only on the extreme end of the scale that it should affect your gains.

I doubt your doing enough cardio partnered with enough undereating/nutritionless eating for it to make "that" much of a difference. I wouldn't worry too much about the cardio.

Colm_OReilly

Hey,

You're out of season, right? If so, focus on the strength gains. The "cardio" benefit of long distance runs is easily regained. Keep the hiit sessions and maybe throw in another short metcon (5-10 minutes) if you are still seeing gains.

Now, on the squat. Pester Bobby enough to bring you out to Tallaght some day and we'll sort that bugger out.

Colm

DM-BM

It's funny how every one seems to think that the cardio won't affect the OP's strenght gains, but the man who wrote the book, with 30 years of experience coaching people thinks the opposite.

OP, if you have to do the cardio, then you will have to compromise, you can get stronger than you are now, but your gains won't be as good as they could be without the cardio. How much food are you eating?
Doing SS and 3 days of cardio, means your going to need tons of food.
You say your eating clean, but are you eating enough?


How much are you trying to increase the press and bench press by, each time you lift?

Arctic89

Thanks again to everyone who has replied. It's all much appreciated.:)

Colm, yes I'm out of season at the moment but I've been doing a number of trials for my county team,and playing one or two college games, which are both fairly fast paced, so I've still been getting a considerable amount of game time even though its the official close season. Is there any chance you could post a link to the metcons you mentioned, I've never heard of them before but would be interested on working them into my programme.

In response to the previous poster: By eating clean, I mean not eating much junk food and sticking to healthy foods (as detailed in the stickies). You might be right in that I'm not eating enough, I'll try and up my cals over the next few weeks. Would I be right in saying its mostly protein sources I'd want to increase for muscle gains. I'm generally trying to add 2.5kg to the bar each time i press or bench press.

Figs, the reason I want to improve my stength is I've always felt fairly light in games. I played midfield all last year for my club and in nearly every match I was a stone or two lighter than the person I was marking. This can be a real problem in certain situations where you can be thrown off the ball easily and within the rules. I just think a bit of extra muscle and some "explosive strength" could really benefit me for next year, especially for taking the ball past opponents, groundwork and catching the ball in the air

DM-BM

Artic89, if you are trying to gain "a stone or two", then over all calories not just protein are what you are going to need to really increase, but it will be very difficult to put on that much weight with all that cardio.
Try lots of milk and peanut butter.

I only started growing when i decided to stop worrying about body fat and just kept eating, now i don't do any cardio and yeah i put on a little more fat than i am really comfortable with, but the chances of that happening to you are very slim with all the cardio you are doing.

Roper

DM-BM wrote: »

It's funny how every one seems to think that the cardio won't affect the OP's strenght gains, but the man who wrote the book, with 30 years of experience coaching people thinks the opposite.

Depends on your definition of cardio. If by cardio you mean you ability to lap the pitch time after time then yes, your cardio will be affected by a strength programme.

For a sport like football though the positives of lifting to get stronger outweigh the negative effects on steady state cardio.

DM-BM

Roper, the OP stated that he is doing 2 long distance running sessions a week and 1 HIIT session a week and asked why he was not making gains on Starting Strenght. I'm saying all that cardio combined is going to slow down his progress on that programme.