Libraries Open on Sundays

PurpleFistMixer

From an SU email this morning:

Following discussions with college; the Libraries will re-open their doors on Sundays from this Sunday (November 16th) for the rest of the academic year. This will initially come into effect for the Berkeley, Lecky, Ussher complex and after Christmas, for the Hamilton. This is a great service for all and I encourage everyone to come in and use the service when you can so college knows that it is something that we need. The libraries will be open 11am until 5pm.

What has Peslo been up to? : p

Jonathan

Total waste of money.
24 hour study space instead?

If tcdsu do insist on making a library open on sunday, would it not make more sense to have the hamilton library open?

Hamilton is a smaller library, it wont be filled anyway with the small numbers that use the library on sunday.
Using the hamilton cuts down on security costs too. It makes sense to open the library in a building that security men are already manning anyway..

d93c2inhxfok4y

PurpleFistMixer wrote: »

From an SU email this morning:

Following discussions with college; the Libraries will re-open their doors on Sundays from this Sunday (November 16th) for the rest of the academic year. This will initially come into effect for the Berkeley, Lecky, Ussher complex and after Christmas, for the Hamilton. This is a great service for all and I encourage everyone to come in and use the service when you can so college knows that it is something that we need. The libraries will be open 11am until 5pm.

What has Peslo been up to? : p

Who's Peslo?

ilovemybrick

jmccrohan wrote: »

Total waste of money.
24 hour study space instead?

If tcdsu do insist on making a library open on sunday, would it not make more sense to have the hamilton library open?

Hamilton is a smaller library, it wont be filled anyway with the small numbers that use the library on sunday.
Using the hamilton cuts down on security costs too. It makes sense to open the library in a building that security men are already manning anyway..

On a cost efficiency scale the BLU complex makes far more sense to open simply because it can offer 1600 study spaces. While the uptake is not going to be 1600 it is the potential that the decision was made upon. Hamilton will be open after Christmas on sunday as well.

And I hate the phrase you use ("if tcdsu insist") because it is all done at the behest of the Union which is, in essence, you. If you feel so strongly about the wrong decision being made don't just say so on a website but get involved and change the decision.

Jonathan

ilovemybrick wrote: »

And I hate the phrase you use ("if tcdsu insist") because it is all done at the behest of the Union which is, in essence, you. If you feel so strongly about the wrong decision being made don't just say so on a website but get involved and change the decision.

I am involved in the su actually. I haven't got a chance to say anything to the su as this was only sent last night at around 11.

Peslo

Coulda went to the campaigns meetin last week, Or how about bringing it up at council? You have all the Sabbatical officers Email address dont you? Were you not at the Faculty meeting?

No chances, eh? Chance doesn't often wait for people, so if you're involved, then get involved man!

Crash

First year idealism makes me feel old. :S

Ron DMC

Going Forward wrote: »

First year idealism makes me feel old. :S

Being old makes me feel old.

Mark200

jmccrohan wrote: »

Total waste of money.
24 hour study space instead?

If tcdsu do insist on making a library open on sunday, would it not make more sense to have the hamilton library open?

Hamilton is a smaller library, it wont be filled anyway with the small numbers that use the library on sunday.
Using the hamilton cuts down on security costs too. It makes sense to open the library in a building that security men are already manning anyway..

Yeah, I think it might have been an idea to open the Hamilton on Sundays, and then the BLU after Christmas. You aren't going to get a rush of students going in this Sunday, it'll be gradual.

And I agree that, if possible, 24 hour study space would be more beneficial and cheaper to run than the libraries....but either way I'm happy to hear that this has happened.

AlexD

Sunday openings are a waste of time, there's plenty of hours in the week to spend in the library. The SU should spend their time having the rules enforced. What's the point going to the library on a Sunday when it's noiser than College Park and all the books have been vandalised?

Colli_Flower86

jmccrohan wrote: »

I am involved in the su actually. I haven't got a chance to say anything to the su as this was only sent last night at around 11.

It's not like it's a new issue.. You're a senior freshman - you definately should've heard about it before...especially if you're "involved" in the SU... We brought Sunday openings up MANY times before and it's something the council fought hard for.

As a final year student busy during the day with my thesis, I know the importance of late (and weekend) opening in the libraries, especially for project research as not all journals are available online and a lot of the foundation of our course is in the libraries. As you progress through college your resource base gets wider and it's just not financially sane to buy all the books/subscriptions required for your course.

Maybe you should wait until you have some actual work to do (i.e. in the Sophister years) before you start criticising something that has ALREADY been approved by majority SU ruling? From what I've observed of your posts, you do seem to throw a lot of uneducated opinions around...maybe do some research and then maybe they'll have more weight...

Crash

The majority of the SU also seem to believe that flying the irish flag should be a major issue, and voted for a wands and sceptres committee once. I wouldn't take that as a major endorsement :P

godtabh

Colli_Flower86 wrote: »

Maybe you should wait until you have some actual work to do (i.e. in the Sophister years) before you start criticising something that has ALREADY been approved by majority SU ruling? From what I've observed of your posts, you do seem to throw a lot of uneducated opinions around...maybe do some research and then maybe they'll have more weight...

I've done the undergrad. You dont need Sunday openings through out the year. 24 study space maybe. If you cant do the works required in the existing time frames you have a time management problem.

I was easily able to put in 10-12 hour days when required back in the day. I'm doing a masters now and still manage to find ample time to study and research when it is required (plus fitting it in with a full time job).

Just because its already approved doesn’t mean its above criticism.

Colli_Flower86

Going Forward wrote: »

The majority of the SU also seem to believe that flying the irish flag should be a major issue, and voted for a wands and sceptres committee once. I wouldn't take that as a major endorsement :P

Ha ha, nice! You've a good point there! Ah but having access to the libraries is different.

Yeah, kearnsr makes a good point too. All I know is that we have until Jan 30th to write up our theses and for weeks now I've found myself in the lab from 8am until 8pm running experiments, including at weekends. Science isn't so easy to "time manage" especially when working with biological systems...sometimes they just don't work, through no fault of the student, the technician or the supply company. On top of the thesis we have regular presentations, tutorials and paper discussion sessions which we usually do need access to the library for... I'm not saying we couldn't live without weekend openings, but they sure are dang helpful, especially from New Years on...

Jonathan

Colli_Flower86 wrote: »

Yeah, kearnsr makes a good point too. All I know is that we have until Jan 30th to write up our theses and for weeks now I've found myself in the lab from 8am until 8pm running experiments, including at weekends. Science isn't so easy to "time manage" especially when working with biological systems...sometimes they just don't work, through no fault of the student, the technician or the supply company. On top of the thesis we have regular presentations, tutorials and paper discussion sessions which we usually do need access to the library for... I'm not saying we couldn't live without weekend openings, but they sure are dang helpful, especially from New Years on...

I'm not saying that it is not a good idea.. But is it cost effective? At the moment is not.

Given the fact that the economy is fucked, and we are facing a 15% drop in funding next year, should we not save our money for a rainy day?

godtabh

Colli_Flower86 wrote: »

All I know is that we have until Jan 30th to write up our theses and for weeks now I've found myself in the lab from 8am until 8pm running experiments, including at weekends. Science isn't so easy to "time manage" especially when working with biological systems...sometimes they just don't work, through no fault of the student, the technician or the supply company. On top of the thesis we have regular presentations, tutorials and paper discussion sessions which we usually do need access to the library for... I'm not saying we couldn't live without weekend openings, but they sure are dang helpful, especially from New Years on...

This is the case for many technical subjects. Not sure about the deadlines engineers had the same deal (more or less)

jmccrohan

jmccrohan wrote: »

I'm not saying that it is not a good idea.. But is it cost effective? At the moment is not.

Given the fact that the economy is fucked, and we are facing a 15% drop in funding next year, should we not save our money for a rainy day?

Post up the cost of running the library on the Sunday, and I mean the cost not just some figure that you pulled out of your arse.

Then post up the cost for running it during the week.

Should be straightforward then to do a CBA.

Jonathan

Deleted User wrote: »

Post up the cost of running the library on the Sunday, and I mean the cost not just some figure that you pulled out of your arse.

€23,000 to open the libraries on sundays during hillary term last year.

I didnt ask about the rest of the week.

manicmonoliths

jmccrohan wrote: »

I'm not saying that it is not a good idea.. But is it cost effective? At the moment is not.

Given the fact that the economy is fucked, and we are facing a 15% drop in funding next year, should we not save our money for a rainy day?

Well the money that's being used to fund the Sunday opening hours is coming from the Library's own budget which is pretty much separate from the rest of the college as far as I know. If they didn't use the money for Sunday opening hours it would go to something else Library related, more than likely more books. So it's not money that could be used for saving the college from financial meltdowns.

Surely Sunday opening hours could be replaced by having a room where people could go to study on Sundays. I've heard something about the room above Front Arch (can't remember what it's called now:o) being used for this.
Or the long promised 24 hour study space. As opposed to having a huge building like the BLU open. I'd agree with jmccrohan, while it is a good thing to have more access to the library, for the amount of people using it on a Sunday it doesn't seem worth it.

godtabh

manicmonoliths wrote: »

Well the money that's being used to fund the Sunday opening hours is coming from the Library's own budget which is pretty much separate from the rest of the college as far as I know. If they didn't use the money for Sunday opening hours it would go to something else Library related, more than likely more books.

Having the most update catalogue of books I would have thought would be fairly important in an academic library

godtabh

jmccrohan wrote: »

€23,000 to open the library on sundays during hillary term last year.

I didnt ask about the rest of the week.

one library? Which one?

Jonathan

kearnsr wrote: »

one library? Which one?

Sorry. Both the BLU and hamilton afaik.

edited post above.

Jonathan

Colli_Flower86 wrote: »

Maybe you should wait until you have some actual work to do (i.e. in the Sophister years) before you start criticising something that has ALREADY been approved by majority SU ruling? From what I've observed of your posts, you do seem to throw a lot of uneducated opinions around...maybe do some research and then maybe they'll have more weight...

I based my opinion on the the figure that the su president quoted me for the cost of opening the libraries, and this post from a tcd librarian.


seem pretty researched to me..

Boston

Colli_Flower86 wrote: »

Maybe you should wait until you have some actual work to do (i.e. in the Sophister years) before you start criticising something that has ALREADY been approved by majority SU ruling? From what I've observed of your posts, you do seem to throw a lot of uneducated opinions around...maybe do some research and then maybe they'll have more weight...

The majority of the SU think I give a **** about the coke ban. The majority of SU Sabbaths sell drugs to under-aged prostitutes. The majority of the SU have a collective IQ equivalent to a half frozen bag of peas.

Crash

manicmonoliths wrote: »

Surely Sunday opening hours could be replaced by having a room where people could go to study on Sundays. I've heard something about the room above Front Arch (can't remember what it's called now:o) being used for this.

Regents Arch. Funny thing, remember another thread where Myth pointed it out that its not accessible at all? Interesting thing would be, if college offered this, technically the SU cannot support it, thanks to long standing policy on disability schtuff. Interesting that.

Oh and Coli_Flower86, believe me if you gave me a couple of hours i could come up with somewhere in the region of 30 or so academic related motions that were voted for, but were essentially the worst thought out motions ever, and only supported because no one had a proper understanding of the background. Council is run off ignorance and charisma, essentially how it works most of the time.

Colli_Flower86

Jonathan, I'm very supportive of your research, well done, I hope you got a gold star...

Neil, points already taken, I believe you, and already conceded that student politics are just that and often quite stupid.

I do however, believe that we, like many other colleges, should have access to resources essential to our college work. I already have 24 hour study space available to me, as do a lot of the science dept.s, however the resources I require are often not available there due to being stacks/reserve/periodical/open access books. The only reason I think we need the library open is access to these resources, however I see it less likely that the library will start allowing us to take out whatever books we need than opening at weekends...admittedly I could be wrong though.

Jonathan

Colli_Flower86 wrote: »

I do however, believe that we, like many other colleges, should have access to resources essential to our college work. I already have 24 hour study space available to me, as do a lot of the science dept.s, however the resources I require are often not available there due to being stacks/reserve/periodical/open access books. The only reason I think we need the library open is access to these resources, however I see it less likely that the library will start allowing us to take out whatever books we need than opening at weekends...admittedly I could be wrong though.

Shouldn't you be campaigning for more time management books?

Colli_Flower86

Well see now that WOULD have been a good burn IF you'd, and I'm sorry I have to repeat this, DONE YOUR RESEARCH and read the previous posts in this thread...

But hey, I'll be nice, give you this one as an almost successful burn and reiterate - Sometimes biological systems just don't work, and in order to get the research done you have to keep redoing the experiment until you get some results. Some of us have to work under animal cruelty laws with protesters breathing down our necks...

Degsy

Colli_Flower86 wrote: »

Jonathan, I'm very supportive of your research, well done, I hope you got a gold star...

Neil, points already taken, I believe you, and already conceded that student politics are just that and often quite stupid.

I do however, believe that we, like many other colleges, should have access to resources essential to our college work. I already have 24 hour study space available to me, as do a lot of the science dept.s, however the resources I require are often not available there due to being stacks/reserve/periodical/open access books. The only reason I think we need the library open is access to these resources, however I see it less likely that the library will start allowing us to take out whatever books we need than opening at weekends...admittedly I could be wrong though.

The library is open from 9.30 am to 9.45 pm five days a week.We're open at the weekends,from 9.30.There are two santry deliviries per day and stacks operate till 7pm.
What the hell more do you want??

Colli_Flower86

Colli_Flower86 wrote: »

however the resources I require are often not available there due to being stacks/reserve/periodical/open access books. The only reason I think we need the library open is access to these resources, however I see it less likely that the library will start allowing us to take out whatever books we need than opening at weekends...admittedly I could be wrong though.

Contact your subject librarian, give them details of the books you need for your course (and whose course it is). They're incredibly helpful most of the time so if there are books in open access or stacks or wherever that aren't available to UGs they may indeed move them to S-LEN or whatever.

Boston

jmccrohan wrote: »

Shouldn't you be campaigning for more time management books?

Bravo, nicely burnt old chap.

Brian

jmccrohan wrote: »

Shouldn't you be campaigning for more time management books?

Shouldn't you be paying attention to Dr V-D? :P

Awayindahils

Degsy wrote: »

The library is open from 9.30 am to 9.45 pm five days a week.We're open at the weekends,from 9.30.There are two santry deliviries per day and stacks operate till 7pm.
What the hell more do you want??

For the heating to work as well in the rest of the library as it appears to at the issue desk in the BLU complex.

And maybe a way of making all the annoying people leave the library for ever.

Tricity Bendix

Colli_Flower86 wrote: »

Sometimes biological systems just don't work, and in order to get the research done you have to keep redoing the experiment until you get some results.

You wouldn't be able to do experiments in the library, so i'm not sure what your particular gripe is.

Alls I ever wanted was a 24 hour study space. If I hadn't have had the physoc room in third year and my own room on campus for final year, I'm not sure what I would have done.

Crash

Aye i'm of the same opinion - thankfully CS provide 24 hour labs, but without that I could've cared less about books, simply wanted a space that was open 24 hours.

rc28

Does anyone know what the library (BLU) timetable is for the christmas period? When does it close and open again (somebody said it's closed from the 5th december but surely this can't be true).

Jonathan

rc28 wrote: »

Does anyone know what the library (BLU) timetable is for the christmas period? When does it close and open again (somebody said it's closed from the 5th december but surely this can't be true).

All on their website.