Women and weightlifting

metrovelvet

Nuravictus wrote: »

Woman are by nature weaker than men but men cant have kids. So whats the issue ?Yes its nature really.

It depends on how you define strength.

metrovelvet

There are probably many men I am stronger physically than at this point and many that I am not. I am far from alone in this position.

Im sure if you took the strongest man, [and by this I assume you mean in capacity to lift things? throw things? speed? endurance? not sure exactly what you mean] and compared against the strongest woman [by same definition] the man would exceed her, but there are far too many variables in considering which gender as a whole is stronger.

And no men cant have babies. But labour takes an enormous amount of strength, maybe the kind of strength a man doesn't have?

Nuravictus

metrovelvet wrote: »

There are probably many men I am stronger physically than at this point and many that I am not. I am far from alone in this position.

Lets have a fight :P I hope you are not 6.4 & a tank.

metrovelvet wrote: »

Im sure if you took the strongest man, [and by this I assume you mean in capacity to lift things? throw things? speed? endurance? not sure exactly what you mean] and compared against the strongest woman [by same definition] the man would exceed her, but there are far too many variables in considering which gender as a whole is stronger.

Yes basically but that woman would had her breasts get smaller & would stop having a period. Basically be very manly.

metrovelvet wrote: »

And no men cant have babies. But labour takes an enormous amount of strength, maybe the kind of strength a man doesn't have?

Its more of a blood flow issue if I remember correctly. A mans heart will just stop under the stress & trauma. I’m not 100% sure.

metrovelvet

Nuravictus wrote: »

Lets have a fight :P I hope you are not 6.4 & a tank.

I am 5'4 and 120 lbs. But I carry around a 30lb baby a lot of the time, lugging around carseats, assembling cribs, and do so while doing laundry, carrying shopping and am rarely off my feet before 9pm. Motherhood has given me, forced me to develop to formidable upper body strength. I can lift things my brothers struggle with.

I am sure I am not alone in this, I am sure this is the case with most women who have had children, and I would bet they would be stronger than a young geek who sits at a computer all day.

Nuravictus wrote: »

Its more of a blood flow issue if I remember correctly. A mans heart will just stop under the stress & trauma. I’m not 100% sure.

Nuravictus wrote: »

Wrong again. It is endurance, force, elasticity, and power.

But honestly, I don't really think this is germane to the issues, do you?

Nuravictus

metrovelvet wrote: »

I am 5'4 and 120 lbs. But I carry around a 30lb baby a lot of the time, lugging around carseats, assembling cribs, and do so while doing laundry, carrying shopping and am rarely off my feet before 9pm. Motherhood has given me, forced me to develop to formidable upper body strength. I can lift things my brothers struggle with.

Super Mom

g'em

Nuravictus wrote: »

Lets have a fight :P I hope you are not 6.4 & a tank.

Would you only be prepared to fight her if she was smaller/ weaker than you? How delightfully 'manly'.

Nuravictus wrote:

Yes basically but that woman would had her breasts get smaller & would stop having a period. Basically be very manly.

orly? So strong women essentially look like men? As a current holder of three world strength records I'd really love for you to meet me sometime and see just how innacurate (and frankly stereotypical, insulting and close-minded) comments like that really are.

Dragan

Nuravictus wrote: »

Yes basically but that woman would had her breasts get smaller & would stop having a period. Basically be very manly.

Eh, whut?

Its more of a blood flow issue if I remember correctly. A mans heart will just stop under the stress & trauma. I’m not 100% sure.

Links?

Is this going to be another thread where you pour out poorly thought out opinion? Also, if you really think the way your posts indicate you do then i seriously hope you stop posting "no man" , "men think" etc as if you even come close to representing the general opinion of males.

Because last time i checked, there was no "general opinon".

nomorebadtown

g'em wrote: »

orly? So strong women essentially look like men? As a current holder of three world strength records I'd really love for you to meet me sometime and see just how innacurate (and frankly stereotypical, insulting and close-minded) comments like that really are.

lol, doing nothing for your argument there love:p he is obviously trying to get a rise out of yee and its worked a treat. you have descended to his level by giving any kind of importance to physical strength. you can do it all, strength and beauty, ye must be the catch of the day.

g'em

nomorebadtown wrote: »

you have descended to his level by giving any kind of importance to physical strength. you can do it all, strength and beauty, ye must be the catch of the day.

I hold physical strength as greatly important for me personally actually, so I'm not descending to any level by discussing it. I never said I was beautiful nor did I say I was any kind of catch. If you go back and read my post I'm merely refuting his claim that strong women will look manly, which I definitely don't.

nomorebadtown

right you are ma'am

no offence meant, please dont hurt me >_<

Nuravictus

g'em wrote: »

Would you only be prepared to fight her if she was smaller/ weaker than you? How delightfully 'manly'.

Jesus I was joking . I wouldnt fight a woman unless she was trying to kill me or something.

g'em wrote: »

orly? So strong women essentially look like men? As a current holder of three world strength records I'd really love for you to meet me sometime and see just how innacurate (and frankly stereotypical, insulting and close-minded) comments like that really are.

Im talking about the MAX here & yes woman who do weight lifting sports do tend to have that happen.

I said in my first post men are not equal to woman. That was a mistake or rather a bad choice of words. I like personnal love very smart woman and I always encourage my female friends to get a third level education. Having someone who is well informed is great .

sam34 wrote: »

what biology book are you reading??? the reason men cant give birth is that they do not possess the internal organs necessary to conceive and nurture a foetus to full term. without the foetus, there aint going to be any giving birth!

likewise, im not sure where you're getting the idea that prolonged strenuous activity and pain would just "stop a mans heart"?

It was a simple comparsion between a male & a female ablities in nature.

Dragan

Nuravictus wrote: »

Im talking about the MAX here & yes woman who do weight lifting sports do tend to have that happen.

Links? Again?

And i mean some kind of proof that a woman who begins weightlifting will look more like a dude, not pictures of women who weight lift and are big etc.

Also, the issue for a woman and her period will normally hinge around bodyfat levels, as opposed to lean body mass.

Also, what is the MAX, out of interest?

Nuravictus

Dragan wrote: »

Links? Again?

And i mean some kind of proof that a woman who begins weightlifting will look more like a dude, not pictures of women who weight lift and are big etc.

Also, the issue for a woman and her period will normally hinge around bodyfat levels, as opposed to lean body mass.

Also, what is the MAX, out of interest?

I am talking about power lifters here. The people who paint themselfs in suntan. Its to do with the levels of testosterone the woman gets from doing it last time I checked. I watched on program on it on tv.

EDIT: Just google "testosterone stops Menstruation" if you don't believe me.

brianthebard

Nuravictus wrote: »

I am talking about power lifters here. The people who paint themselfs in suntan. Its to do with the levels of testosterone the woman gets from doing it last time I checked. I watched on program on it on tv.

You're talking out your arse tbh, power lifting has nothing to do with sun tan. If you can't even get basic terms or references right how do you expect anyone to take your "argument" seriously?

Nuravictus

brianthebard wrote: »

You're talking out your arse tbh, power lifting has nothing to do with sun tan. If you can't even get basic terms or references right how do you expect anyone to take your "argument" seriously?

Just google "testosterone stops Menstruation" if you don't believe me.

Go Google it & tell me i am talking out of my arse.

Gauge

No, YOU are the one making these ridiculous arguments. You need to back them up with sources, and 'google this' or 'I saw it on tv' is not a source. You're proposing (from what I can see) that a high muscle mass in women causes an increased level of testosterone. Now back it up.

wasabi

Nuravictus wrote: »

I am talking about power lifters here. The people who paint themselfs in suntan. Its to do with the levels of testosterone the woman gets from doing it last time I checked. I watched on program on it on tv.

OK, you need to go educate yourself on the difference between powerlifting and bodybuilding for starters. Powerlifters compete in squat, deadlift and benchpress. Bodybuilders (the ones with the fake tan) compete on the basis of having the best physique. Two very different events.

Some female powerlifters and bodybuilders may use substances that might make them appear more masculine (if they take shedloads), but it is a consequence of taking drugs rather than lifting weights per se.

A woman who lifts, however heavy, and does not take steroids/hormones will not end up looking masculine. It's just impossible.

Dragan

Nuravictus wrote: »

I am talking about power lifters here. The people who paint themselfs in suntan. Its to do with the levels of testosterone the woman gets from doing it last time I checked. I watched on program on it on tv.

EDIT: Just google "testosterone stops Menstruation" if you don't believe me.

1) For sun tan read bodybuilding, not power lifting.

2) Of course Testerosterone stops menstraution, do you know why? Testosterone is the MALE sex hormone, present in both males and females. Oestrogen is the FEMALE sex hormone, present in both males and females. The difference between the two will be the levels present in both sexs.

However, the amount of Ostrogen that males can produce will be limited and the amount of Testosterone that a female can produce is limited.

What you are implying is that the simple fact of adding lean mass will increase the levels of Testosterone she can produce by a large degree. This is not the case.

Edit : Since you asked, you're talking out your ****ing ass.

Nuravictus

Gauge wrote: »

No, YOU are the one making these ridiculous arguments. You need to back them up with sources, and 'google this' or 'I saw it on tv' is not a source. You're proposing (from what I can see) that a high muscle mass in women causes an increased level of testosterone. Now back it up.

High Muscle Mass in the sense of bodybuilding & not overall body defination. What I am saying is a normal woman who is 5.6 & has low body fat won't have this happen but a woman who does powerlifting and looks like this.



From the first link on Google.

Pelvic and chest/breast exams:

Many people who have a uterus, ovaries or other "female bits" prefer to not have routine pelvic exams with PAP smears. While taking testosterone can and usually does
stop menstruation, it does not stop the need for regular
gynecologic (GYN) exams.

Dragan

Nuravictus wrote: »

High Muscle Mass in the sense of bodybuilding & not overall body defination. What I am saying is a normal woman who is 5.6 & has low body fat won't have this happen but a woman who does powerlifting and looks like this.

The woman in the picture you posted takes anabolic steroids.

The article piece you quoted is aimed directly at woman who inject testosterone.

I have to be honest, the only thing that amazes me about you is that you figured out how to type.

Macha

Yeah, I'd have to agree. You can really over-analyse everything to death. Now if the only TVs shows available that had female protagonists were all like Sex and the City, then there would be a stronger argument. But just looking at one show in isolation...I don't think it really does much.

You could also argue, isn't it imitating life? There are a lot of women out there who are just like those women. Isn't that one of the reasons it became so popular?

Edit: Strong women ftw!

Nuravictus

Dragan wrote: »

The woman in the picture you posted takes anabolic steroids.

The article piece you quoted is aimed directly at woman who inject testosterone.

I have to be honest, the only thing that amazes me about you is that you figured out how to type.

We were talking about the MAX that a man & woman can become. I stated that the woman would have her period stop. I proved my point.

Dragan

Nuravictus wrote: »

We were talking about the MAX that a man & woman can become. I stated that the woman would have her period & breats get smaller. I proved my point.

You didn't.

You showed that if a woman INJECTS large amounts of a male sex hormone then she will become more muscular etc, have period issues, a loss of bodyfat etc.

Please tell me how this point pertains to a normal woman, training in a strength sport, who is NOT injecting testosterone?

Nuravictus

Dragan wrote: »

You didn't.

You showed that if a woman INJECTS large amounts of a male sex hormone then she will become more muscular etc, have period issues, a loss of bodyfat etc.

Please tell me how this point pertains to a normal woman, training in a strength sport, who is NOT injecting testosterone?

I was replying to someone post on the matter earlier. It was the MAX they could get and this would be in my opinion the max a woman could get. Maybe my statement was too general which with hindsight it was.

Dragan

Nuravictus wrote: »

I was replying to someone post on the matter earlier. It was the MAX they could get and this would be in my opinion the max a woman could get. Maybe my statement was too general which with hidesight it was.

No, your mistake was in thinking you can draw any comparison between a natural and an artificially affected organism.

Would you compare the abilities and characteristics of a male on steroids to a male not on them without pointing out that one is on steroids and the other not?

Your statement wasn't too general, it's just that very little that you posted was accurate, backed up or made any sense.

If you would like to partake in a debate then at least come informed.

Macha

Nuravictus wrote: »

I was replying to someone post on the matter earlier. It was the MAX they could get and this would be in my opinion the max a woman could get. Maybe my statement was too general which with hindsight it was.

Nuravictus, as a woman who has been weight training for the last 4 years, I can tell you that it is absolutely impossible for a woman to naturally get herself into the type of body that you posted. My body just does not produce the levels of testosterone necessary. Which is exactly why those women, who want to look like that, have to use artificial means. I mean, I can lift reasonably heavy weights and yes, I'll get stronger but I just can't bulk up like that. AND I happen to have a more muscular body-type already more suited to sprinting than long-distance, for example.

If it's any consolation, I used to think like that and I'd say 90% of the female population still think like that. Unfortunately, it puts a lot of them off lifting weights and getting nice and strong.

Ahh sorry off-topic.

Wibbs

If it was that easy to build muscle I wouldn't be a scrawny bugger. QED

g'em

The threads have been split.

Nuravictus, you're grossly misinterpreting and misrepresenting the information to hand.

Those women look manly because of injected testosterone, nothing else.

A woman can never naturally look like that, it is biologically, hormonally impossible. So before you go making sweeping statements along the lines of "srong women look like men" get your facts in order, otherwise you sound ridiculous and ignorant and it's really quite insulting to those of us who bust our proverbial, non-existant, couldn't-produce-any-testosterone-if-we-tried balls getting strong by purely natural means.

metrovelvet

Nuravictus wrote: »

Just google "testosterone stops Menstruation" if you don't believe me.

Go Google it & tell me i am talking out of my arse.

So does pregnancy, anorexia, and menopause. What is your point?

Running Bing

Eh the human male is stronger physically than the human female. Im afraid thats a fact not a sexist comment.

It amazes me that anybody would get offended by that and try to argue it.

Its the equivalent of a man being upset when somebody tells them they cannot give birth:rolleyes: Seriously people need to relax about this.

Gauge

Babybing wrote: »

Eh the human male is stronger physically than the human female. Im afraid thats a fact not a sexist comment.

It amazes me that anybody would get offended by that and try to argue it.

Its the equivalent of a man being upset when somebody tells them they cannot give birth:rolleyes: Seriously people need to relax about this.

Did you read the thread?

wasabi

In fact, women who lift weights will not only NOT turn into men, but will reap many benefits, ranging from looking nicely toned to less risk of osteoporosis in later life. Not to mention the fact that if you ever need to lift heavy things in your day to day life that becomes much easier.

Dragan

Babybing wrote: »

Eh the human male is stronger physically than the human female. Im afraid thats a fact not a sexist comment.

It amazes me that anybody would get offended by that and try to argue it.

Its the equivalent of a man being upset when somebody tells them they cannot give birth:rolleyes: Seriously people need to relax about this.

Did you actually read the thread?
Or the main issues people had with Nuravictus's posts?

Vegeta

g'em wrote: »

A woman can never naturally look like that, it is biologically, hormonally impossible.

Except maybe Rosie

Anyway yeah, here are my views on the several themes running through this thread.

Is it ok for women to lift heavy weights? hell yeah, health benefits aside, they're usually super hot as a result.

Will women turn into she-hulks if they lift weights? Nope, unless they start doin something drastic with their hormone levels.

Are men stronger than women generally? Yes, speaking in generalities, I would think so.

Are there women stronger than your average man? Definitely.

Wibbs

wasabi wrote: »

In fact, women who lift weights will not only NOT turn into men, but will reap many benefits, ranging from looking nicely toned to less risk of osteoporosis in later life. Not to mention the fact that if you ever need to lift heavy things in your day to day life that becomes much easier.

I agree. If I can be pervy/chauvinistic/blokish for a moment, the best women's bodies I've ever been with have all included weights in their fitness regime. Not those poncy little pink "weights" either. IMHO if you're a woman and want a bum to die for, squats, squats and more squats.* The handy thing is they didn't have to starve themselves either. Muscle burns calories like a bugger even when relaxed. So they could have their cake and eat it, so to speak. Result all around I would have thought.







*allied with good diet and cardio so as I don't get into trouble with the fitness forum mods.:)

justsomebloke

pah, this is the 36th reply and still no pics of some natural female lifters!!!!

Booooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

Oh and some of the sexiest women I have seen and known lift weights, and they are by no means manly. Also in relation to women who train to the max becoming manly, you only need to meet g'em and wasabi to know that argument goes out the window

Vegeta

Joe the Plumber wrote: »

pah, this is the 36th reply and still no pics of some natural female lifters!!!!

Booooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

I was afraid of the ban stick or accusations of being a chauvinistic pig.

EamonnKeane

Nuravictus wrote: »

Its more of a blood flow issue if I remember correctly. A mans heart will just stop under the stress & trauma. I’m not 100% sure.

??? A man's heart is much larger than a woman's and pumps (on average) twice the volume of blood. And there is rarely trauma (in the medical sense) in childbirth.

Also, re. periods, if a women did a lot of heavy exercise, couldn't her body fat go too low to menstruate?

Nevyn

Rarely trauma ?
ROFL

g'em

EamonnKeane wrote: »

Also, re. periods, if a women did a lot of heavy exercise, couldn't her body fat go too low to menstruate?

Yes, that can certainly happen, it happened to me when I dieted down to very low bodyfat. Amenhorrea (the absence of menstruation) is somewhat common in high end athletes but it's down to low bodyfat levels and stress and not increased testosterone as has been suggested on the thread.

As for the photos, I have no problem with them as long as they promote the idea of women lifting.

In other words, no Jamie Eason shots please.

Zaph

g'em wrote: »

As for the photos, I have no problem with them as long as they promote the idea of women lifting.

In other words, no Jamie Eason shots please.

/Googles Jamie Eason and approves

LightningBolt

g'em wrote: »

In other words, no Jamie Eason shots please.

I'd opened this thread expecting to see a picture of her!