Is the UK is going down the toilet?. Hand held thumb scanners to be issued to cops

Run_to_da_hills

My weekly "Big Brother" thread has coming early this week

UK cops are to carry portable hand held electronic finger print scanners. They reckon it will save hours on identifying culprits and avoid bringing them into custody.

There is a civil liberties issue with this but the authorities state that any information received by these devices will be destroyed within hours. :rolleyes:

Will finger printing soon be a manditory requirement for entering the UK for as it is for entering the US?.

You can always swab your thumb in battery acid before you take a print.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/7692677.stm

4zn76tysfajdxp

I give this plan a hearty thumbs up.

faceman

don't have an issue with it if the prints they scan are of convicted criminals.

Sharpshooter

Cora Sparse Tribe wrote: »

I give this plan a hearty thumbs up.

I give it the Finger " Don't blame me the OP mentioned Finger first".:o

Ruu_Old

What are you trying to hide, Run_to_da_hills? O_o

faceman

Ruu wrote: »

What are you trying to hide, Run_to_da_hills? O_o

His thumbs?

Fighting Irish

Thats grand as long as they can only store convicted crims fingerprints

Agamemnon

Shove your thumb up your hole first and they might decide not to scan you.

4zn76tysfajdxp

sharpshooterH wrote: »

I give it the Finger " Don't blame me the OP mentioned Finger first".:o

No need for any punnery here, this is a serious thread. Not that I'm pointing any fingers at anyone...

Biggins

If - a big if - it was done on the right way, I'd support it.

Darragh29

Cora Sparse Tribe wrote: »

I give this plan a hearty thumbs up.

This is an absolute load of me boll*x, I give it the two fingers.

Run_to_da_hills

Biggins wrote: »

If - a big if - it was done on the right way, I'd support it.

UK Authorities :rolleyes:

Darragh29

Are you afraid you'd get NAILED for something you didn't do OP?!?!?!

:D:D

Biggins

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

UK Authorities :rolleyes:

Yea, thats the worrying part.

Run_to_da_hills

Darragh29 wrote: »

Are you afraid you'd get NAILED for something you didn't do OP?!?!?!

:D:D

Their track record is not exactly impressive. IE Birmingham 6, Guilford 4. least we forget.

Fratton Fred

if it helps prevent iceland from running off with our savings, I'm all for even more big brother laws

Ann22

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

You can always swab your thumb in battery acid before you take a print.

I read about a murderer who burned the skin off the tops of his fingers to disguise his fingerprints. The skin grew back exactly the same and he was caught.

Darragh29

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

Their track record is not exactly impressive. IE Birmingham 6, Guilford 4. least we forget.

I used to worry when I was in the army, that I'd end up in Strangeways because I'd be handling plastic explosives regularly and the C4 residue apparently stayed on your hands for months afterwards...

Darragh29

Ann22 wrote: »

I read about a murderer who burned the skin off the tops of his fingers to disguise his fingerprints. The skin grew back exactly the same and he was caught.

Caught red handed! :D:D

Biggins

Ann22 wrote: »

I read about a murderer who burned the skin off the tops of his fingers to disguise his fingerprints. The skin grew back exactly the same and he was caught.

As mad as it sounds, apparently toes can also be used I'm told, for the same prints!
Not applicable in court but allowable for justifying an arrest warrant thus jail time (with applied for extension) for the finger skin to grow back!

BaconZombie

Well if it is anything like the US fingerprint or DNA system they will record EVERYONE'S details for a infinite amount of time. The UK and US {also Ireland} have treaties set-up so that they can "share" with information with each other and 3rd party's

"If refusing to co-operate can get you arrested, then you would have not just fingerprints but DNA on a criminal database for the rest of your life."

Fighting Irish wrote: »

Thats grand as long as they can only store convicted crims fingerprints

Guy:Incognito

I give this my "I DONT CARE" stamp of the week.

IMO everyones fingerprints should be on file. Every crime where prints are left would be much easier to solve. Especially when they invovled first timers whose prints wouldnt otherwise be on file.

Phototoxin

It will go the same way their NDNA database is now - once you're in you can't get out (with rare exceptions!) It usd to be that they could but say you were attacked and then by having your dna for elimination they figure that your a serial rapist and they try to convict you on it- it could be thrown out as it wasn't properly obtained in investigating you. So now they keep all dna they take..

There is a civil liberties issue with this but the authorities state that any information received by these devices will be destroyed within hours.

LIES

Sharpshooter

Stekelly wrote: »

I give this my "I DONT CARE" stamp of the week.

IMO everyones fingerprints should be on file. Every crime where prints are left would be much easier to solve. Especially when they invovled first timers whose prints wouldnt otherwise be on file.

We have to glove it to him.............

Darragh29

sharpshooterH wrote: »

We have to glove it to him.............

Any c*nt caught breaking the law should be HANDED over to the appropriate authorities, then we'd have no use for fingerprint databases! :D:D:D:D:D:D

Ann22

I think everyone's dna should be on file really but you'd have to be sure there'd be no fixing computer records to pin crimes on people. It's brilliant the way people are caught now for crimes from years ago and likewise others cleared. Colin Stagg was the suspect for the Rachel Nickell murder in Wimbledon Common years ago but the case fell through because an undercover policewoman befriended him and tried to coerce him into confessing to it on tape by saying it turned her on. Seems it was entrapment. All these years everyone who knew anything about the case believed this man was guilty. Turns out some fella in jail turned out to be the real killer, lucky his dna was taken or Stagg would have that hanging over him for the rest of his life.

Sharpshooter

Darragh29 wrote: »

Any c*nt caught breaking the law should be HANDED over to the appropriate authorities, then we'd have no use for fingerprint databases! :D:D:D:D:D:D

So you are suggesting that we handle them carefully?

4zn76tysfajdxp

sharpshooterH wrote: »

So you are suggesting that we handle them carefully?

Oh! The gloves are off now!

towel401

the UK has been in the toilet for many years now. a ****hole of a country and this sort of stuff isn't helping. hopefully the recession will put them back in the 3rd world where they belong

Biggins

Its clear the cops are taking a progressive approach to crime fighting and are being more hands-on.

Sharpshooter

Cora Sparse Tribe wrote: »

Oh! The gloves are off now!

Now that in itself is a sticky..............

4zn76tysfajdxp

sharpshooterH wrote: »

Now that in itself is a sticky..............

That wasn't worth printing tbh.

MagicMarker

What if you don't have thumbs?

I don't think they thought this through.

Sharpshooter

Somethumbs they don't...............

Run_to_da_hills

Biggins wrote: »

Its clear the cops are taking a progressive approach to crime fighting and are being more hands-on.

More like using a sledge hammer to crack an egg. The UK was under a far greater threat during the troubles in the North than it has ever been.

Recently they wanted electronic border control between the UK and Ireland, they have CCTV almost every 400 yards down any motorway, ANPR on almost every street corner in London to catch "congestion charge dodgers" More CCTV surveillance than any state in the world, They have full access to transit smartcard records, last week the authorities wanted to register all mobile phones. (Mobile phones can be used as bug device even when switched off)

We are now hearing of new police measures being introduced into the UK by the week. Their country is slowly turning itself into one hell of a fu**ing police state.

MagicMarker

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

More like using a sledge hammer to crack an egg. The UK was under a far greater threat during the troubles in the North than it has ever been.

Recently they wanted border control between the UK and Ireland, they have CCTV every 400 yards down any motorway, ANPR on every street corner in London to catch "congestion charge dodgers" More CCTV surveillance than any state in the world, They have full access to transit smartcard records,
last week the authorities wanted to register all mobile phones. (Mobile phones can be used as bug even when switched off)

The UK is turning itself into one hell of a fu**ing police state.

Good thing you don't live there then eh?

4zn76tysfajdxp

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

More like using a sledge hammer to crack an egg.

Great simile, I think you've cracked it!

Dave!

Thumb!

4zn76tysfajdxp

Dave! wrote: »

Thumb!

Thumbthing wrong Dave?

faceman

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

More like using a sledge hammer to crack an egg. The UK was under a far greater threat during the troubles in the North than it has ever been.

Recently they wanted electronic border control between the UK and Ireland, they have CCTV every 400 yards down any motorway, ANPR on every street corner in London to catch "congestion charge dodgers" More CCTV surveillance than any state in the world, They have full access to transit smartcard records, last week the authorities wanted to register all mobile phones. (Mobile phones can be used as bug even when switched off)

We are now hearing of new police measures being introduced into the UK by the week. Their country is turning itself into one hell of a police state.

Are those CCTV cameras in the uk used to incriminate innocent people??

The border control the Uk apparantely wanted was actually prompted by Ireland first as I recall when we signed up to some new EU border control thingie this year. Last time I flew to stansted from Dublin (last week) there was no security checks for passengers disembarking flights from Ireland or domestic UK. It's been like that for years. Same can't be said when you fly from stansted to Dublin. Irish security now checks all travellers.

As for the mobile phone thing, remember that punter in court few months back in Ireland who was convicted of killing his wife based on mobile phone data?? So if we the state didn't permit such use of that data, a guilty man would have walked free. How would you justify that?

Phototoxin

Quote:
Originally Posted by sharpshooterH
Now that in itself is a sticky..............

That wasn't worth printing tbh.

this kinda craic is why we need a crime/criminology forum!

4zn76tysfajdxp

Phototoxin wrote: »

this kinda craic is why we need a crime/criminology forum!

You really have your thumb on the pulse of the amatuer criminologists needs there, Photy.

Run_to_da_hills

Phototoxin wrote: »

this kinda craic is why we need a crime/criminology forum!

We badly need a big brother alert forum.

Guy:Incognito

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

last week the authorities wanted to register all mobile phones. (Mobile phones can be used as bug device even when switched off)
.

and unregistered ready to go phones can be used as great tools to plan, organise and carry out all sorts of crimes while remaining untraceable.

Sharpshooter

Phototoxin wrote: »

this kinda craic is why we need a crime/criminology forum!

/ off to find Columbo..............

Sharpshooter

Phototoxin wrote: »

this kinda craic is why we need a crime/criminology forum!

I am told you are really "ToxicWaste "..........

Good old Columbo.;)

BaconZombie

I second this motion.

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

We badly need a big brother allert forum.

4zn76tysfajdxp

Big Brother forum

Just use that when the show is off the air.

Run_to_da_hills

faceman wrote: »

Are those CCTV cameras in the uk used to incriminate innocent people???

No they are placed to help the UK in this "fight on Global Terrorism" thats what they say, :rolleyes:

faceman wrote: »

The border control the Uk apparently wanted was actually prompted by Ireland first as I recall when we signed up to some new EU border control thingie this year. Last time I flew to stansted from Dublin (last week) there was no security checks for passengers disembarking flights from Ireland or domestic UK. It's been like that for years. Same can't be said when you fly from stansted to Dublin. Irish security now checks all travelers.

Depends on the timing, I have often walked through both sides without checks, other times I have been held up for ages. The UK has been pushing for RFID based ID cards long before it was even thought of by the Irish authorities, It was even suggested that the registered Oyster card be extended to all national railways as a preliminary security measure.

faceman wrote: »

As for the mobile phone thing, remember that punter in court few months back in Ireland who was convicted of killing his wife based on mobile phone data?? So if we the state didn't permit such use of that data, a guilty man would have walked free. How would you justify that?

I am not sure how this case would have gone in the UK. cell site analysis" which tracks mobile phone users as they move from one signaling area to the next would be very new to the legal system here in a court of law.

Sharpshooter

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

We badly need a big brother allert forum.

AGAIN.................:rolleyes::p

towel401

faceman wrote: »

As for the mobile phone thing, remember that punter in court few months back in Ireland who was convicted of killing his wife based on mobile phone data?? So if we the state didn't permit such use of that data, a guilty man would have walked free. How would you justify that?

that was a pretty vague case anyway. I'd even go so far as to say its outcome was swayed by the meeja and the general feel-good buzz of a suspected wife-killer being locked up. if it was the wife that killed him instead they wouldn't convict so easily on that sort of vague evidence

real criminals use satellite phones and 2-way radio anyway both are slightly harder [but not impossible] to trace..