A new political party for the people of Ireland

gally74

Hello all,

I beileve the time is right to launch a new political party.

I believe the current partys are really missing the ball for a large proportion of people,

I have supported FF for most of my life but have always stuggled with some of their concepts.

I want to establish a new party that will aim for 20 seats in the next election.

some will say these policys are radical but i dont believe they are not and that their is an appetite out there for them.

Some of the core fundementals of the party are as follows,

the party will be based on whats best for Ireland and the people within it.

Civil service, complete change needed, radical overhall, bring in private ways of doing buisness, managers, performance apprisal and lets be real lots of jobs cutec,

Education, rightly or wrongly performance apprisal with "job for life" to be gone, secondly new subjects for 1 and 2nd level including, basic economics and personal financial manegement, secondly strong emphasis on Socail involvment and responsibility.

Senad, complete closure.

Energy, Vision for ireland to become energy independant and eventually energy exporter to ireland, we have the engineers we can do it,
ESB complete overhaul of the 70K a year job basic officer pay.
Tax rebates for companys that improve Green score. inculding the public comapnies,

Health,

no more hand outs to people that come to this country to sponge, no problem helping somebody getting established, but no free car, house etc.
pharmacies, monolopy of license's to be eridicated, cheaper helath for all,
open discussion with the unions (doctors nurses etc.) on where health is going, again, management will be recuited from the private industry.

economics,

here's the big chance, huge road, infrastructure, social and "what ireland needs building effort, were talking a 10-20 year plan here, motorway up the spine of ireland from Cork right up through the country, and a west Cost freeway from Letterkenny to the N11 in wexford.
Deflation from the public services to give something back

break up fo the monopolies, transport, dublin bus, pubs, lawers ESB etc.

i could go on and on but lets see what people think,

I believe irleand stands in a dangerous place and their has to be less thinking whats in it for me and more whats the best for the country.

this is not a little steps etc change were im being honest here we really need to make a change,

who's on for it?



P G

muckety

Have you considered a name? How about 'Progressive Democrats' (I think it might not be in use....) !!!

irish_bob

gally74 wrote: »

Hello all,

I beileve the time is right to launch a new political party.

I believe the current partys are really missing the ball for a large proportion of people,

I have supported FF for most of my life but have always stuggled with some of their concepts.

I want to establish a new party that will aim for 20 seats in the next election.

some will say these policys are radical but i dont believe they are not and that their is an appetite out there for them.

Some of the core fundementals of the party are as follows,

the party will be based on whats best for Ireland and the people within it.

Civil service, complete change needed, radical overhall, bring in private ways of doing buisness, managers, performance apprisal and lets be real lots of jobs cutec,

Education, rightly or wrongly performance apprisal with "job for life" to be gone, secondly new subjects for 1 and 2nd level including, basic economics and personal financial manegement, secondly strong emphasis on Socail involvment and responsibility.

Senad, complete closure.

Energy, Vision for ireland to become energy independant and eventually energy exporter to ireland, we have the engineers we can do it,
ESB complete overhaul of the 70K a year job basic officer pay.
Tax rebates for companys that improve Green score. inculding the public comapnies,

Health,

no more hand outs to people that come to this country to sponge, no problem helping somebody getting established, but no free car, house etc.
pharmacies, monolopy of license's to be eridicated, cheaper helath for all,
open discussion with the unions (doctors nurses etc.) on where health is going, again, management will be recuited from the private industry.

economics,

here's the big chance, huge road, infrastructure, social and "what ireland needs building effort, were talking a 10-20 year plan here, motorway up the spine of ireland from Cork right up through the country, and a west Cost freeway from Letterkenny to the N11 in wexford.
Deflation from the public services to give something back

break up fo the monopolies, transport, dublin bus, pubs, lawers ESB etc.

i could go on and on but lets see what people think,

I believe irleand stands in a dangerous place and their has to be less thinking whats in it for me and more whats the best for the country.

this is not a little steps etc change were im being honest here we really need to make a change,

who's on for it?



P G

as ive said a million times before , the majority of people in this country vote based on who thier people vote for , right back to the 1920,s

djpbarry

gally74 wrote: »

the party will be based on whats best for Ireland and the people within it.

Boo, hiss!

billy the squid

gally74 wrote: »

Hello all,the party will be based on whats best for Ireland and the people within it.

All the parties say that

Civil service, complete change needed, radical overhall, bring in private ways of doing buisness, managers, performance apprisal and lets be real lots of jobs cutec,

A bit idealistic, do do that in one foul sweep would piss off the unions, and the redundancy payments would be astronomical, We are talking about people who request disturbance money if the lavatory is moved 100 metres in any direction.

Education, rightly or wrongly performance apprisal with "job for life" to be gone, secondly new subjects for 1 and 2nd level including, basic economics and personal financial manegement, secondly strong emphasis on Socail involvment and responsibility.

Isnt economics already part of Second level, and doesnt CSPE teach social responsibility?

Senad, complete closure.

Ane who would act as oversight to the government?

Health,

no more hand outs to people that come to this country to sponge, no problem helping somebody getting established, but no free car, house etc.
pharmacies, monolopy of license's to be eridicated, cheaper helath for all,
open discussion with the unions (doctors nurses etc.) on where health is going, again, management will be recuited from the private industry.

Despite what you have read on many extreme right-wing websites, the HSE does not provide the "blacks" with cars.

here's the big chance, huge road, infrastructure, social and "what ireland needs building effort, were talking a 10-20 year plan here, motorway up the spine of ireland from Cork right up through the country, and a west Cost freeway from Letterkenny to the N11 in wexford.
Deflation from the public services to give something back

We could call it Transport 21.

break up fo the monopolies, transport, dublin bus, pubs, lawers ESB etc.

i could go on and on but lets see what people think,

I believe irleand stands in a dangerous place and their has to be less thinking whats in it for me and more whats the best for the country.

this is not a little steps etc change were im being honest here we really need to make a change,

who's on for it?

Will the tax savings pay for the missing letters on your keyboard?

skelliser

Senad, complete closure.

are you serious?!

Grow up, kids

gally74 wrote: »

Hello all,

I beileve the time is right to launch a new political party.

I believe the current partys are really missing the ball for a large proportion of people,

I have supported FF for most of my life but have always stuggled with some of their concepts.

I want to establish a new party that will aim for 20 seats in the next election.

some will say these policys are radical but i dont believe they are not and that their is an appetite out there for them.

Some of the core fundementals of the party are as follows,

the party will be based on whats best for Ireland and the people within it.

Civil service, complete change needed, radical overhall, bring in private ways of doing buisness, managers, performance apprisal and lets be real lots of jobs cutec,

Education, rightly or wrongly performance apprisal with "job for life" to be gone, secondly new subjects for 1 and 2nd level including, basic economics and personal financial manegement, secondly strong emphasis on Socail involvment and responsibility.

Senad, complete closure.

Energy, Vision for ireland to become energy independant and eventually energy exporter to ireland, we have the engineers we can do it,
ESB complete overhaul of the 70K a year job basic officer pay.
Tax rebates for companys that improve Green score. inculding the public comapnies,

Health,

no more hand outs to people that come to this country to sponge, no problem helping somebody getting established, but no free car, house etc.
pharmacies, monolopy of license's to be eridicated, cheaper helath for all,
open discussion with the unions (doctors nurses etc.) on where health is going, again, management will be recuited from the private industry.

economics,

here's the big chance, huge road, infrastructure, social and "what ireland needs building effort, were talking a 10-20 year plan here, motorway up the spine of ireland from Cork right up through the country, and a west Cost freeway from Letterkenny to the N11 in wexford.
Deflation from the public services to give something back

break up fo the monopolies, transport, dublin bus, pubs, lawers ESB etc.

i could go on and on but lets see what people think,

I believe irleand stands in a dangerous place and their has to be less thinking whats in it for me and more whats the best for the country.

this is not a little steps etc change were im being honest here we really need to make a change,

who's on for it?



P G

This is the funniest post in the history of boards.ie. BRAVO! Pints for that man.

luckat

gally74 wrote: »

Civil service, complete change needed, radical overhall, bring in private ways of doing buisness, managers, performance apprisal and lets be real lots of jobs cutec,

These would be the private ways of doing business that caused the current crash, yes?

Education, rightly or wrongly performance apprisal with "job for life" to be gone, secondly new subjects for 1 and 2nd level including, basic economics and personal financial manegement, secondly strong emphasis on Socail involvment and responsibility.

So this will stop the flood of teachers leaving the job?

Senad, complete closure.

Maybe learn to spell it first? More seriously, the Seanad is a valuable stopper for crazy legislation brought in by an over-enthusiastic Dáil. I don't have a vote for it, but still value it for this.

Energy, Vision for ireland to become energy independant and eventually energy exporter to ireland, we have the engineers we can do it,
ESB complete overhaul of the 70K a year job basic officer pay.

Umm, how are we going to become energy-independent and export energy? Do we have some secret resources they haven't told us about?

pharmacies, monolopy of license's to be eridicated,

Free spelling and grammar lessons too?

here's the big chance, huge road, infrastructure, social and "what ireland needs building effort, were talking a 10-20 year plan here, motorway up the spine of ireland from Cork right up through the country, and a west Cost freeway from Letterkenny to the N11 in wexford.

Yup, deffo.

Deflation from the public services to give something back

Say what?

break up fo the monopolies, transport, dublin bus, pubs, lawers ESB etc.

Er, not all these are monopolies. I'd agree that there should be competition - for instance in the buses.

Unfortunately, a certain amount of the plans of the new party sound a little, well, Falangist.

Fratton Fred

I think the parties we have at the moment is fine, it's the severe lack of a decent leader that is causing problems.

I've said it before many times, this country needs a Thatcher type leader who can take a grip of the country and shake it up.

The_Minister

muckety wrote: »

Have you considered a name? How about 'Progressive Democrats' (I think it might not be in use....) !!!

That was my thought exactly.

DublinWriter

muckety wrote: »

Have you considered a name? How about 'Progressive Democrats' (I think it might not be in use....) !!!

The Progressive Democrats Lite

or

I Can't Believe it's not The Progressive Democrats (now with 40% less Hubris)

jaycen

I like the sound of it (in places) but how would you get something like that off the ground, as already said a huge amount of voters vote for the same crowd regardless.

Donnaghm

DublinWriter wrote: »

The Progressive Democrats Lite

or

I Can't Believe it's not The Progressive Democrats (now with 40% less Hubris)

Ha thats hilarious. The outcome of the creation of such a party would have the following effects: It would steal a huge chunk of FG voters who agree with that ideaology. Your ten seats would be sufficient for proping up a FF governemt and that government will keep getting re-elected for over a decade. Your party will by out flanked by FF on most issues and FF steals your clothes on other issues causing your party to completely loose it's identity and purpose. They will put your party's ministers in nightmarish portfollios and blame your TDs when things don't go right. In twenty years time, your party will be run by a mindless senator and an obese health minister and will have an unedifying demise. Is perpetuating FF governments worth this?

Get Back

It’s a pity that Teflon Bertie didn’t have a coat of many colours instead, 7 years of prosperity and 7 years of famine…anyway who would have supported a government that raised taxes in the good times, held out on public spending, borrowed when money was cheap and squirreled away for the rainy days? and what government would actually do this, I mean build up the coffers for the opposition to spend as they would get in on election, cause the Irish people could not / would not see the wood through the trees, double edge sword me thinks!

We need a government with balls, one that would approach the good times as though they where the bad, and bad times as though there the good, it might be all too late as Ireland’s problem is a worldwide one now and it gonna take a lot of strength and foresight to prevail. Until there is some “solid, joined up radical thinking” we’ll just have to put up with the same auld same auld and you government policies listed above are just that.

jhegarty

muckety wrote: »

Have you considered a name? How about 'Progressive Democrats' (I think it might not be in use....) !!!

It is , but I think it will be available again very soon...

The_Minister

Donnaghm wrote: »

Ha thats hilarious. The outcome of the creation of such a party would have the following effects: It would steal a huge chunk of FG voters who agree with that ideaology. Your ten seats would be sufficient for proping up a FF governemt and that government will keep getting re-elected for over a decade. Your party will by out flanked by FF on most issues and FF steals your clothes on other issues causing your party to completely loose it's identity and purpose. They will put your party's ministers in nightmarish portfollios and blame your TDs when things don't go right. In twenty years time, your party will be run by a mindless senator and an obese health minister and will have an unedifying demise. Is perpetuating FF governments worth this?

You forgot the indignity of all those political clothes being hurled out the window in a single budget, before you are even cold.

mickos

muckety wrote: »

Have you considered a name? How about 'Progressive Democrats' (I think it might not be in use....) !!!

How about 'The peoples front of hibernia' as opposed to 'The hibernian peoples front' chancers the lot of em.

gally74

can people honestly not expect a new party to come to the fore over the next few months / years,

if times get real tough here, people will look for a new voice and radical may be come the norm, to be honest its not really that radicall.

public service watch out

and abolishing the senad would be within the first 10 mins of power!

IRISH RAIL

I would support a new political party
but I would want to see a manifesto first. there is a lot of change needed in this country a viable business would not throw money away on useless ideas and working groups, these need to be reigned in just like friviolus spending on pr and make up, sweets for government jets, projects that are far unrealistic to cope with future demand, a justice system that has mandatory sentnces and uses them effectivly, a health care system that works for the people not one where they try and stop you going( like a community welfare officer only availabe for 3 hours a week) while there are managers galore, a transport system that gets trucks off the road and onto rail 1 train = 40 trucks.
a tax system thats fair and housing for those who really need it. a tougher immigration system for non eu people, a nationalised bank that could give loans and use the profit to boost the states coffers, and a reduction in ministers pay to the average industrial wage ( they should be in it for the people not the money if were expected to survive on it why cant they.)
oh and not algined to a terrorist orginisation helps too

irish_bob

Kline wrote: »

Not so fast mister. Have you never heard of the saying "It only takes one man to start a revolution". Ganges Khan did it, and he was a farmers son. Plenty of people done the same since.

Saying that, you would need a seriously charismatic leader to effect change in this country in the way that this man is proposing. It would never happen through the usual channels of politics and political marketing.

People would have to be out on the streets protesting and shouting every second day of the week for this kind of character to emerge. Until that point, and until people are hungry enough, in all senses of the word, I don't think it will happen.

Give it six months to a year when the recession has kicked in good and proper, like it is going to, then we might start seeing new faces appearing.

The last few days have been interesting I have to say.

what your suggesting could only happen in a country who,s people are idealogical , us irish are not in the slightest an idealogical people , hence the popularity of fianna fail down the years and more recently the immense popularity of bertie aherne
the two most idealogical td,s in the dail lost thier seats at the last election

cabinteelytom

Such faint-hearted ideas!
I too am smelling the blood in the air, of that wounded beast, the once mighty FF party, assailed from all sides, slinking off to find a den where it can die in peace. Once it's backbenchers knew exactly what the plain people of Ireland thought; they were the plain people of Ireland. Now they look to statisticians and psychologists to explain away and trivialise the choices the electorate make. The role of the modern politician is now to frustrate the will of the people.
I have thought [heresy] that a generation of placemen and women, holding practically hereditary seats in the Dail, there to please mummy and daddy, with few political ideas or interest, so little to contribute to our national debates, could be nearing redundancy. If they are celebrating in 2016 it will be a travesty.
I can't be the only person thinking there is a disconnect between our political elite, and the ordinary voter, which will not continue indefinitely.

turgon

billy the squid wrote: »

Ane who would act as oversight to the government?

The same people who currently do. ie, no one

gally74 wrote: »

I beileve the time is right to launch a new political party.

Ok, we need to have a front for legalizing abortion too, and immediately starting a nuclear energy program.

The checks and balances to be reformed. Removing the senate is good, but reforming it and giving it power is better.

Kline

irish_bob wrote: »

what your suggesting could only happen in a country who,s people are idealogical , us irish are not in the slightest an idealogical people , hence the popularity of fianna fail down the years and more recently the immense popularity of bertie aherne
the two most idealogical td,s in the dail lost thier seats at the last election

Interesting, but my point was and I think we have all seen it in the last few days. Its a big turn-around. My dad was born in 1922 and voted FF all his life and so did his dad. The last few years he hasn't had any time for them, not one bit. People are becoming wise to them. What I was saying was that when things get very bad, if they do, that in itself will bring about change as new leaders will emerge.

I decided though to delete my post here as I don't agree with the original posters comments on the spongers. Its got slightly racist connotations. Therefore, I'm out of this post. I'd be glad to continue somewhere else.

podge79

look at how long it took the greens and pd's to get not even 20 seats between them.. unfortunately in this country we're stuck in the "civil war" mindset. as a previous poster mentioned the manifesto of what they would do is all important... it has to be meaningful and have something in it that will entice voters... blandly saying we'll cut the public service and impose private sector practices on the public service wont work... just because it works in the private sector doesnt mean it'll work in public sector and vice versa... private sector is there to make a profit.... public sector is there to provide services

and as for abolishing the seanad - it'd take more than 10 mins to do that...as its in the constitution prob need a referendum(damn that word again lol) to get rid of it ...

ninty9er

There's no need for new parties. There's just a need for FG and FF to adapt their core left-right positions and for Labour to face up to the fact that doing nothing but criticising the government will solve nothing.

Did you notice how reluctant any leader has been to point to somewhere where €2bn could be saved this year. Eamon Gilmore has given great ploys for saving €2bn over 7 years, but that's no good to us.

What we need is a political system whereby governments are stable, and that means FF, FG or Lab with an overall majority or any mix of 2 of the three. That way decisions can be taken in the public interest rather than in the interest of keeping the govt. from going off the rails.

We got a public interest budget, but the public weren't having it, because according to the over 70s and the opposistion, and Joe Behan and Finnian McGrath, everyone over 70 is more important that you, me or anyone that isn't 70.

What happens when the retirement age is 75 (a prospect that faces me as I enter the world of a full time career over the next 18 months to 2 years), do you make the medical card apply at 70.

Does your party have the balls to raise taxes.
Does your party have the balls to make everyone pay them, even the minimum wage workers paying €175 a year (God help us....cut back on some discretionary income the same as everyone else)
Does your party have the balls to say, sorry, we ****ed up.
Does your party have the balls to say, the rich should pay for their education.

If not, just join another party and try to affect change from within. If you shout loud enough and get enough people on side, that's the way to go.

I'm seriously pissed off with the lack of backbone in my own party at the moment, and have relayed such to my local TDs assistant in a 15 minute meeting today, and will do it again in person when I see him.

The government should be able to stand by its decisions and fall on them for better or worse, because rowing back on them is just not what I signed up for. I didn't sign up for any particular decisions, and I may not like some of them, but when a party makes a policy decision, I expect that party to stand by its policy. This is something that no Irish party has done or can do while coalition is the bedrock of governance.


The Seanad is a core part of the State institutions and you could not abolish it without a referendum. Reforming it may be well and good, but aboloshing it is an unworkable loony idea.


:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:

Sorry for the rant, but I'm sick to the stomach after listening to some of the self righteous sh1te being spouted on Joe Duffy today, all in the callers' own interest in THEIR medical card, disregarding the needs of the rest of the nation.

turgon

ninty9er wrote: »

The Seanad is a core part of the State institutions and you could not abolish it without a referendum. Reforming it may be well and good, but aboloshing it is an unworkable loony idea.

You wana hear a loony idea?? How but this fast one that was pulled a few years ago -

Lets think of refreshing the state institutions. Ok, we have our two houses of parliament, and the president.

Now the party I lead have the majority in the lower house. So tinker tinker, the lower house elects head of government - Im head of government!!

Eek, didnt count on opposition from the upper house. Tinker tinker, the upper house is now useless, with me appointing 13 people there, safeguarding control. Good times.

What a president?? Forget it. Twiddle here, the presidents a figure head with no power.

So what we left with??? One powerful house of parliament under the control of the executive. No checks in the balances!!

Who am I???

Eamon DeValera of course!!

beggars_bush

you cannot run a government based on how the private sector is run. you'd never get elected

you definitely cannot run a civil service like a private enterprise. its been tried in other countries and failed. the best way is to abolish the system of advancement through seniority and make jobs available to do those most capable

and you definitely cannot run the education system like a business. its job is not to produce robots who do x, y and z. Yes, we are all individuals

jmayo

ninty9er wrote: »

There's no need for new parties. There's just a need for FG and FF to adapt their core left-right positions and for Labour to face up to the fact that doing nothing but criticising the government will solve nothing.

...
What we need is a political system whereby governments are stable, and that means FF, FG or Lab with an overall majority or any mix of 2 of the three. That way decisions can be taken in the public interest rather than in the interest of keeping the govt. from going off the rails.

We got a public interest budget, but the public weren't having it, because according to the over 70s and the opposistion, and Joe Behan and Finnian McGrath, everyone over 70 is more important that you, me or anyone that isn't 70.

...
Does your party have the balls to make everyone pay them, even the minimum wage workers paying €175 a year (God help us....cut back on some discretionary income the same as everyone else)
Does your party have the balls to say, sorry, we ****ed up.
Does your party have the balls to say, the rich should pay for their education.

...
I'm seriously pissed off with the lack of backbone in my own party at the moment, and have relayed such to my local TDs assistant in a 15 minute meeting today, and will do it again in person when I see him.

The government should be able to stand by its decisions and fall on them for better or worse, because rowing back on them is just not what I signed up for. I didn't sign up for any particular decisions, and I may not like some of them, but when a party makes a policy decision, I expect that party to stand by its policy. This is something that no Irish party has done or can do while coalition is the bedrock of governance.

FFS nintyer how long have you been supporting FF, you are in college right ?

Public interest me ar**
FF have always tried to adopt policies that would guarantee they would not get slaughtered at elections.
When was the last time they did anything in the public interest rather than the interest of some lobby group that would help them stay in power :rolleyes:

Over the last 6 years they did a hell of a lot in the builders/developers interest and now they refuse to admit their mistakes and you are always on here apologising for them and their policies.

It was in the public interest to tackle the mess that is the public sector's wage bill, but that was put on the long finger awaiting some report or other that just costs more money.
It was in the puiblic interest that you didn't start trying to become a subprime lender by offering mortgages to people that were refused by financial institutions.
It was also in the publics interest that you didn't try and help your developer friends offload all the unsold newly built property with this scheme.
If you had the interest of FTBs in mind, you would firstly not try to get people into negative equity and long term debt and secondly you would allow the scheme be used with second hand properties.

Does YOUR party, FF, have the balls to say they fu**ed up ?
NO they effing don't.
They are still, inclusing yourself, trotting out how the whole economic f***up and fact we are one of the first countries in recession, is due to outside influences.
The fact that we became so dependent on construction and created huge ghost estates in small rural villages has SFA to do with them.
The fact that nobody in power ever thought about what would happen when the bubble would burst and the fact that the FF/PD adventure blow more money than problably all the other previous governments of the state.


FF only ever do something unpopular when they are really pushed and over a barrell.
Charlie the chancer finally did something in 1987, when he got the backing of Dukes's Tallaght Strategy affectively finishing his own career, and what did Charlie do not long after, but go for an election hoping to get an overall majority.

The reason we have coalitions is FG was never as popular as FF for above reasons and people do not trust FF ever since the last time they had a full majority.
I do remember Lynch/FFand the crazy sh** they pulled in 1977. They abolished road tax and rates and of course now you know once you give something to Irish people you can't get it back. This why we have the problem that we have never had a full property tax since 1977.

I was just beginning to respect some of your posts and you disappoint me yet again questioning other parties, even fictitious ones, about their credentials when your own has some of the worst records in putting the interests of the country and it's citizens first.

gally74

who says you cant run it like a company, its ireland inc wether we like it or not, and folks the writing is on the wall,

is it fair that a bad teacher can keep his job

is it fair that civil servants think the country is their for them

there needs to be less of whats in it for me and more of a vision for ireland,

who here would be up for starting a party, the time is coming and the people do need a change,

i dont agree with the PD points put forward by some people, the pd's only came into existenance because of Charlie Haughey,

They did not come about by the need for change,

The time is coming,

by the way the paty will be called,

The Peoples Patriotic Party.

and patriot in the sense of whats right for ireland not thr tri colour waving brigade!

ninty9er

jmayo wrote: »

FFS nintyer how long have you been supporting FF, you are in college right ?

Public interest me ar**
FF have always tried to adopt policies that would guarantee they would not get slaughtered at elections.
When was the last time they did anything in the public interest rather than the interest of some lobby group that would help them stay in power :rolleyes:

Over the last 6 years they did a hell of a lot in the builders/developers interest and now they refuse to admit their mistakes and you are always on here apologising for them and their policies.

It was in the public interest to tackle the mess that is the public sector's wage bill, but that was put on the long finger awaiting some report or other that just costs more money.
It was in the puiblic interest that you didn't start trying to become a subprime lender by offering mortgages to people that were refused by financial institutions.
It was also in the publics interest that you didn't try and help your developer friends offload all the unsold newly built property with this scheme.
If you had the interest of FTBs in mind, you would firstly not try to get people into negative equity and long term debt and secondly you would allow the scheme be used with second hand properties.

Does YOUR party, FF, have the balls to say they fu**ed up ?
NO they effing don't.
They are still, inclusing yourself, trotting out how the whole economic f***up and fact we are one of the first countries in recession, is due to outside influences.
The fact that we became so dependent on construction and created huge ghost estates in small rural villages has SFA to do with them.
The fact that nobody in power ever thought about what would happen when the bubble would burst and the fact that the FF/PD adventure blow more money than problably all the other previous governments of the state.


FF only ever do something unpopular when they are really pushed and over a barrell.
Charlie the chancer finally did something in 1987, when he got the backing of Dukes's Tallaght Strategy affectively finishing his own career, and what did Charlie do not long after, but go for an election hoping to get an overall majority.

The reason we have coalitions is FG was never as popular as FF for above reasons and people do not trust FF ever since the last time they had a full majority.
I do remember Lynch/FFand the crazy sh** they pulled in 1977. They abolished road tax and rates and of course now you know once you give something to Irish people you can't get it back. This why we have the problem that we have never had a full property tax since 1977.

I was just beginning to respect some of your posts and you disappoint me yet again questioning other parties, even fictitious ones, about their credentials when your own has some of the worst records in putting the interests of the country and it's citizens first.

Hey.

Wake up....people don't join political parties because everything is hunky dory. They join them to effect change. That's why I joined a political party.

I joined FF because it's the party that has seen me right for the best part of 18 years, with FG and Labour seeing me right for 3.

However universal free 3rd level education is not something I agree with, so that was a major sticking point and probably why I didn't join Labour instead, as well as its massive upper middle class target audience.

I didn't join FG, mainly because my grandparents are members and couldn't sell it to me.

I joined FF on the basis, that the individual member, ***if he or she gets involved enough***, has more chance of effecting change than a member of any other political party. I have run for election to the Ardchomhairle, it's more than most of the public does, and it's me trying to adopt Ghandi's mantra of "be the change you wish to see in the world"

I have made my choice. I may not always agree with my party, but the way decisions are made is the way they are made and I will RESPECT them. I may moan about them, but in doing that I will also do my best to ensure the leadership knows that there is a little pain in the hole in Limerick that's severely dissatisfied/ liking recent steps.

Quite frankly, I take on board a lot of what I read here. I may not agree with it, but I do appreciate people are entitled to their point of view. In politics there aren't always rights and wrongs, just degrees of disagreement.

In the end of the day, it speaks more about a person attacking me for my political affiliations, than it does about me if I can come away not giving two hoots what people think of me.

I never said FF was perfect, but nobody and nothing is.

ninty9er

jmayo wrote: »

you disappoint me yet again questioning other parties, even fictitious ones, about their credentials when your own has some of the worst records in putting the interests of the country and it's citizens first.

I question my own party quite enough thank you very much:mad:

turgon

ninty9er wrote: »

I never said FF was perfect, but nobody and nothing is.

Thats not the problem, the problem is the gigantic lengths to which FF remains so imperfect. Just because perfection cant be reached doesnt mean slacking off can be tolerated.

PS delighted when your junior minister for health got shouted down at the old peoples parliament.Pity it wasnt Cowen.

ninty9er

turgon wrote: »

PS delighted when your junior minister for health got shouted down at the old peoples parliament.Pity it wasnt Cowen.

Great.....let's all promote indignance and intolerance.

If I were John Moloney, I wouldn't have left that microphone until I'd been listened to. God knows he's probably been listening to enough over 70s over the last week.

podge79

ninty9er wrote: »

Great.....let's all promote indignance and intolerance.

If I were John Moloney, I wouldn't have left that microphone until I'd been listened to. God knows he's probably been listening to enough over 70s over the last week.

its voicing disapproval... and by his actions John Moloney showed how little backbone this governemnt indeed all politicians in Ireland have. more concerned about getting re-elected and keeping people happy then taking tough decisions and standing by them

Fratton Fred

I'm surprised no one has mentioned the electoral system.

If you put a key FFer or PDer in a constituency, they are almost certain to retain their seat, no matter what. you can get the situation (Like with the greens) where a TD has very very few first preference votes and yet manages to become a minister.

If people really hate, for example, Mary Harney they won't vote for her they will vote for someone else, but over the course of the count she will pick up enough votes to make it into third place and bingo, another four years as health minister.

There is no real pressure on TDs to perform, which is why, in the main, they don't.

turgon

ninty9er wrote: »

Great.....let's all promote indignance and intolerance.

Are you saying he deserved to be treated better?

ninty9er

turgon wrote: »

Are you saying he deserved to be treated better?

Yes....are you completely socially inept?

The_Minister

Fratton Fred wrote: »

If you put a key FFer or PDer in a constituency.

You are kind of right about FF, but the PDs never had any really safe seats (even McDowell lost his seat half the time).

And there is huge pressure on TDs to perform - just not in the Dail.

Offy

I think its a great idea and the time is right. We are in a recession and most people in Ireland are feeling the pinch. If the young voters in this country actually went out and voted then you have a chance. Look to the people that started Boards.ie, they are intelligent, committed, hard working, successful (Boards popularity is proof enough or that) and popular. What is the average age of Boards.ie members? How many friends do they have that would support them? Lots. So stop talking and start recruiting. Start planning. Hit the colleges HARD. Im from Athlone, the AIT has over six thousand students, thats a lot of votes. Add up all the colleges and Uni's in Ireland and your sure to get some seats. Focus on the young voters, something thats not being done to date I think. Try a different approach and I feel you have a good chance of getting a few seats but be consistent. Keep the party young. I would be happy to commit time and effort to such a venture. Start planning now and with the right minds anything is possible, don’t listen to the fools that say it cant be done because fools they are and defeatists are of no benefit. It really is a good idea and the timing could not be better for a new, energetic, non corrupt party to launch.

The_Minister

Boards.ie is not a homogenous mass.

I could never me in a party with the likes of *insert random Ah'er*

DublinWriter

The_Minister wrote: »

Boards.ie is not a homogenous mass.

I could never be in a party with the likes of *insert random Ah'er*

...or one whose representatives retort with "...and YORE MA!" when fielded a particularly tricky topic on Questions and Answers.

billy the squid

gally74 wrote: »

who says you cant run it like a company, its ireland inc wether we like it or not, and folks the writing is on the wall,

You cannot run a country like a private company. Many of the services a country provides operate at a loss, these being public transport to rural areas, schools, etc. Were you to run it like a company you would have to scrap rural bus services as they were uneconomical. The same goes for schools, the only way you would be able to make schools turn a profit would be to introduce fees, leaving the educated rich and the uneducated people who can't afford to go to school. The only other alternative would be to continue the patronage of schools by the church.

is it fair that a bad teacher can keep his job

If he is a good teacher he should be allowed to keep his job. If he is a bad teacher then the parents have the option to take a complaint to the board of management of that school.

is it fair that civil servants think the country is their for them

You will have to clarify this. The country should be there for anyone who needs it.

there needs to be less of whats in it for me and more of a vision for ireland,

Mighty words, but when it comes down to it, people the world over will only agree to something if it does not impinge on their life. The only time people will make sacrifices is when they feel they are in danger of disaster/terrorism or at war.

who here would be up for starting a party, the time is coming and the people do need a change,

What time? which people. Setting up a party is a big commitment. in order to do so you need 300 signatories or one sitting TD.

i dont agree with the PD points put forward by some people, the pd's only came into existenance because of Charlie Haughey,

The PDs of yore are a far cry from the PDs of today.

They did not come about by the need for change,

Actually they did. The PDs were formed by members of existing parties who felt there should be change in relation to the likes of divorce and contreception laws. There were members of Fine Gael in the PDs founders too you know.

The time is coming,

by the way the paty will be called,

The Peoples Patriotic Party.

and patriot in the sense of whats right for ireland not thr tri colour waving brigade!

dsmythy

Offy wrote: »

What is the average age of Boards.ie members? How many friends do they have that would support them? Lots. So stop talking and start recruiting. Start planning. Hit the colleges HARD. Im from Athlone, the AIT has over six thousand students, thats a lot of votes. Add up all the colleges and Uni's in Ireland and your sure to get some seats. Focus on the young voters, something thats not being done to date I think. Try a different approach and I feel you have a good chance of getting a few seats but be consistent. Keep the party young.

Young people and students are lost to socialism until they graduate so unless you're setting up yet another socialist party, best wait for them to start earning.

irish_bob

dsmythy wrote: »

Young people and students are lost to socialism until they graduate so unless you're setting up yet another socialist party, best wait for them to start earning.

aint that the truth , just before the election last year , i was listening to that inane station spin 1038 , they had an election poll where listeners could text in which party they wished to vote for , the greens and sinn fein were 1st and 2nd unsurprisingly

Fratton Fred

The_Minister wrote: »

And there is huge pressure on TDs to perform - just not in the Dail.

from who?

How can there be pressure to perform when all you need is a FF badge and the right surname?

Darragh29

gally74 wrote: »

Some of the core fundementals of the party are as follows,

gally74 wrote: »

Senad, complete closure.

gally74 wrote: »

Health,

cheaper helath for all,

Going by the spelling mistakes in your proposed manifesto, I'm surprised you aren't pushing for more spending in education. If you want my vote, you'll need to be able to spell the word "health", before you give me a lecture on what you are going to do to that department.

Yes we need change, but none of the nonsense that you suggested...

Offy

So what do you siggest Darragh29?

Liam Byrne

ninty9er wrote: »

Great.....let's all promote indignance and intolerance.

Another policy Brian Cowen seems to have adopted.

You left out "incompetence", though......

jmayo

Liam Byrne wrote: »

Another policy Brian Cowen seems to have adopted.

You left out "incompetence", though......

I seem to remember bertie being intolerant especially of those who questioned the economic marvel he created :rolleyes:
Didn't he ask the doubters and the doomsayers to go off and committ suicide or the like ?
So much for tolerance.
Maybe the pensionsers have led the way and have shown the rest of the population how to actually get off their ars** and do something.

If FF and PDs were in France or even Britain, does our FF cheerleaders think they would still be tolerated in power after the amount of cockups and wastage of taxpayers money that they have been responsible for or rather not responsible for depending on the department ala Health ?
If anything the voters have been too bloody tolerant and now people that have meekly put up with the sh** for so long are finally getting fed up, becuase there isn't the "great" economy there any longer to mask all the faults.

md23040

gally74 wrote: »

Hello all...

What the hell let's give it a go!! Your manifesto has as many inconsistencies as any other party. Don't mind the spelling mistakes. There are independent politicians in the Kerry with only rudimentary English skills. And are about as understandable as Borat crossed with Eeyore.

But if you can unedrstnad this snetnece tehn it’s oaky not to splel properly – dno’t gvie up. Dissenters the lot of them – edcutaed snbos.

Frankie Lee

The fact of the matter is there is no alternative to Fianna Fail, unless Alan Dukes wins a by-election and regains the leadership of FG.