Class Rep Weekend in Wexford

Shantih

I was just wondering if anyone had heard anything about the shenanigans that went on at last weekend's SU class rep training in Wexford?

Was anybody there?

Red Alert

I'm sure there has to be a class rep resident on boards.ie.... surely they can enlighten us as to exactly what 'training' took place. :rolleyes:

Stabshauptmann

I was at one 2 years ago, dont worry lads, they're pretty tame, and you dont have to be a class rep to go :pac:

That being said, and I wouldnt be the unions greatest supporter, but I think the class rep training is essential to the effective running of the union.

random_banter

Ive called into one before.. didnt stay.. they throw huge drinking fests in the houses they rent.. then do "training" for a few hours on the sat afternoon and sunday... complete waste of union funds imo.

Would be far better off getting the Astra hall for a full day and providing food, drinks, and lunches and perhaps a drinks reception in the evening afterward with a party in the forum bar.

Stabshauptmann

I dont think the union pays for the booze.

They rent the houses take care of transport and pay for one meal a day.

Train from early morning 9 or 10 afaik untill 3 or 4, Saturday and Sunday. My memory would be quite fuzzy and thats all subject to change.

People do socialise at night, no big ****ing surprise there, but its at their own expense iirc. yes its the main attraction of the weekend, but its absolutly essential. 99% of the work that gets done in life is done on an informal basis.

the first week in many companies for example is pointless training and nights out so that you get to know your team mates.

TBh being secluded with the other reps for a weekend and sharing houses etc does work really well for getting to know each other. Auditor training, which is a one day event in the astro hall doesnt work as well.

Het-Field

The Weekend is the only way council will keep quorate. Kaptain Redeye has hit the nail right on the head.

However, if you ever needed the definition of the word Junket, the Oxford English Dictionary may define it as "UCDSU Class Rep Training". It has a huge booze culture to it, you have usually scored one of you fellow Class Reps by the end of it, and most people know little more about the Union, then they did when they jumped on the bus behind the Student Centre. As such im not sure I fully agree with the validity of its existence. I must becoming more of a lefty in my old age !

That said, Class Rep Training October 2005, Lake 2 April 2005, and PD National Conference February 2007 are three of my favourite memories from college.

AngelofFire

Kaptain Redeye is right, there was no free booze, i was there.

gubbie

Kaptain Redeye wrote: »

TBh being secluded with the other reps for a weekend and sharing houses etc does work really well for getting to know each other. Auditor training, which is a one day event in the astro hall doesnt work as well.

After doing both, I concur 100%

AngelofFire wrote: »

Kaptain Redeye is right, there was no free booze, i was there.

I've heard otherwise.
Granted I wasn't at this years class rep training but last year there was also free can's given out.

panda100

How much did it cost to hire the hotel,the accomodation etc ?? Well into 10 grand I've heared. Couldnt they have better uses to spend that money on??
My two years of being a class rep ,I never went on this junket on a point of principal beacuse its just a complete waste of students money.

passive

http://outpost81.com/Number_One_Homer_the_Great_Get_Drunk_and_Play_Ping_Pong.wmv

AngelofFire

Just to clarify that Class rep training is not entirely a drinking session, we have to be up for 9am sharp on both saturday and sunday morning for day long training seminars which are quite intense.

anyone with any queries about the weekend should drop SU president Aodhan O'Dea an email aodhan@ucdsu.ie

clickerfingers

i know someone that went on it who boasted that it was a complete piss up, and noone paid for a drink at all, and he even went as far to say he felt bad that all of us poor students paid for their piss up.

and training or no training those reps are ridiculous , i have yet to hear a good story about them actually doing what they are supposed to do

Karma_Police

clickerfingers wrote: »

i know someone that went on it who boasted that it was a complete piss up, and noone paid for a drink at all, and he even went as far to say he felt bad that all of us poor students paid for their piss up.

Well unfortunately for you, that person is a lying tool.

I too was on the class rep trip, as a class rep. It was completely necessary, and was not a drinking w/end. Obviously there was beer had at night, but every1 was up by 9 and in the hotel for training till 5 or 6. As Kaptain said earlier it is extremely necessary, its a way of meeting those people you are to be working with for the year, and getting some basic guidelines to the approaches you can and can't take..

Obviously there are going to be stories of people getting everything for free, but those are just stories... no truth behind them. The accomodation and transport with 1 meal in the hotel was provided.. The drink and food at night, was bought at your own expense

scop

As long as they do the training it dosen't really matter what they get up to as, you know, students like me and you...who, can you believe it, drink and listen to music and god knows what else. I for one support our overlords in their drinking binge as long as they know whats what the next day.

Stabshauptmann

panda100 wrote: »

How much did it cost to hire the hotel,the accomodation etc ?? Well into 10 grand I've heared. Couldnt they have better uses to spend that money on??
My two years of being a class rep ,I never went on this junket on a point of principal beacuse its just a complete waste of students money.

How many years have you been a rep? It should be easy to verify something like that, either A)Ask a sabbat or B)Look at last years accounts

edit: It appears the report of last years training and last years budget were included in the presidents report Oct 22nd 2007. Unfortunately, due to someones oversight, these sections of the report are not available on the union website. Anyone want to source these?

DaveyGem

Didn't someone piss on an electricity box and that f*cked up the power for the cottages they were staying in?

Also Starring LeVar Burton

DaveyGem wrote: »

Didn't someone piss on an electricity box and that f*cked up the power for the cottages they were staying in?

That's a mere rumour. Electricity was working fine when we left and as far as I know, no one pissed on an electricity box.

As many people have already said, we spend all day Saturday and the better part of Sunday in Seminars that are very helpful to class reps and believe it or not, despite how much some people would like to deny it the class reps do a lot of work during the year - trust me, if there were no class reps, you'd definitely notice. Just because you don't always see what they are doing, doesn't mean they aren't getting things done.

As for free booze - it's a complete myth - everyone bought there own drink and as far as these alleged "charges" go, the Union haven't paid any extra bills, than the ones set out in the original budget.

gubbie

Karma_Police wrote: »

Well unfortunately for you, that person is a lying tool.

I too was on the class rep trip, as a class rep. It was completely necessary, and was not a drinking w/end. Obviously there was beer had at night, but every1 was up by 9 and in the hotel for training till 5 or 6. As Kaptain said earlier it is extremely necessary, its a way of meeting those people you are to be working with for the year, and getting some basic guidelines to the approaches you can and can't take..

Obviously there are going to be stories of people getting everything for free, but those are just stories... no truth behind them. The accomodation and transport with 1 meal in the hotel was provided.. The drink and food at night, was bought at your own expense

You may have gone down there to learn to be a class rep (and good on ya) but look around you at next council, and at councils to come and they will drop like flies. Many of them that you saw at class rep training you will never see again. But I don't think you would get the same comradeship at just a day in the student bar.

CaptainNegative wrote: »

As many people have already said, we spend all day Saturday and the better part of Sunday in Seminars that are very helpful to class reps and believe it or not, despite how much some people would like to deny it the class reps do a lot of work during the year - trust me, if there were no class reps, you'd definitely notice. Just because you don't always see what they are doing, doesn't mean they aren't getting things done.

Many class reps are getting lazy. Most of them don't do their job. That's just how it is

Thomas_S_Hunterson

Seems to be a bit of an info blackout...nobody's saying nothing. Have the SU closed ranks? It certainly sounds like it.

CaptainNegative wrote:

That's a mere rumour. Electricity was working fine when we left and as far as I know, no one pissed on an electricity box.

As many people have already said, we spend all day Saturday and the better part of Sunday in Seminars that are very helpful to class reps and believe it or not, despite how much some people would like to deny it the class reps do a lot of work during the year - trust me, if there were no class reps, you'd definitely notice. Just because you don't always see what they are doing, doesn't mean they aren't getting things done.

As for free booze - it's a complete myth - everyone bought there own drink and as far as these alleged "charges" go, the Union haven't paid any extra bills, than the ones set out in the original budget.

Case in point. You've carefully managed to say very very little.

passive

Sean_K wrote: »

Seems to be a bit of an info blackout...nobody's saying nothing. Have the SU closed ranks? It certainly sounds like it.

I'M A MASSIVE DOUCHE!!!11!!ELEVEN!!

Case in point. You've carefully managed to say very very little.

hm... I see how this works. good technique.

Stabshauptmann

Sean_K wrote: »

Seems to be a bit of an info blackout...nobody's saying nothing. Have the SU closed ranks? It certainly sounds like it.

Listen. This isnt an SU website, this isnt an SU board. You're looking for gossip - theres plenty of it out there. But this isnt the place. many of the posters on here know each other in real life, but this board isnt for
> "hey man, Saturday was deadly buzz"
> Bleedin Rapid

We've IM for that crap.

This board is for discussing things about UCD, for example, is Class Rep training needed / well run / abused.

But its not a place for who scored who

Case in point. You've carefully managed to say very very little.

The first point was that electricity was working fine afahk. Whats wrong with that/ should I have my tinfoil hat to the ready?

Does the Union pay a premium for anticipated damage / plan to lose its deposit every year?
Interesting question. I'd bear in mind though, if these things caused a lot of destruction of property, I dont think they'd be allowed back year after year...

No offence to any of the reps, and Ive heard some pretty good war stories, but for the most part, the one I went to was very tame.

Thomas_S_Hunterson

From the mystery tour thread:

DaveyGem wrote:

I wouldn't bet on it going ahead, particularly if word spreads about that training weekend, the bus crowd could pull out.

People can make up their own minds, but if the SU is going for a piss-up at the expense of events for the rest of the student body, then there's something wrong.

Stabshauptmann

If you also read the rest of that thread the SU ents officer says its definitly going ahead...

Thomas_S_Hunterson

Kaptain Redeye wrote: »

If you also read the rest of that thread the SU ents officer says its definitly going ahead...

That's all well and good but unless that poster was mistaken, something must have happened for them to form that opinion.

Stabshauptmann

Sean_K wrote: »

That's all well and good but unless that poster was mistaken, something must have happened for them to form that opinion.

You said "if the SU is going for a piss-up at the expense of events for the rest of the student body, then there's something wrong". I havent seen any events cancelled as a result of this.

There was an event in another university a few years ago that had a big knock on effect for studnets nation wide, but thats another story for anther day.

How much weight am I to give that opinion?

The poster hasn't said why they hold that opinion, so its completely worthless to me.

Thomas_S_Hunterson

Kaptain Redeye wrote: »

You said "if the SU is going for a piss-up at the expense of events for the rest of the student body, then there's something wrong". I havent seen any events cancelled as a result of this.

The SU profess to be a representative body for students in the university. As such, they have a responsibility to the students to be beyond reproach when it comes to their actions.

Stabshauptmann

No they dont. That is ridiculous.

They dont even have a fiduciary responsibility (though arguably they should).

They have a responsibility to be bound by the rules of the SU, nothing more.
The SU has its flaws, plenty of them, and Im not a fan of the organisation and have my problems with most of its members, but Im not going to give much weight to idle speculation, rumour mills or witch hunts.

The facts I am aware of: when I went on this training there was no free booze. The ppl on this board who have said there were none this year I know and trust.

The waste of student funds is unacceptable, but I dont think this is an example of it.

Thomas_S_Hunterson

I was speaking from an ethical perspective as opposed to a legal one.

gubbie

There was free booze last year. I remember it was bought in Tescos. Not on our first trip to Tescos, but our second.

Ah everyone's gotta have seen the front page of the tribune. Now class rep training isn't a waste of €10,000 but the couple of extra grand on that that they'll lose... not thats a waste

Red Alert

gubbie wrote: »

There was free booze last year. I remember it was bought in Tescos. Not on our first trip to Tescos, but our second.

Ah everyone's gotta have seen the front page of the tribune. Now class rep training isn't a waste of €10,000 but the couple of extra grand on that that they'll lose... not thats a waste

I'd like to see class reps behave a bit better than your average scumbag.

Stepherunie

Seeing as the Tribune can't even get the numbers who attended right I fail to believe that they can have got much of what they said right....

There was max 120 there.

Also Starring LeVar Burton

gubbie wrote: »

There was free booze last year. I remember it was bought in Tescos. Not on our first trip to Tescos, but our second.

Ah everyone's gotta have seen the front page of the tribune. Now class rep training isn't a waste of €10,000 but the couple of extra grand on that that they'll lose... not thats a waste

There was no free booze from the student union fund last year. Barry Colfer was kind enough to pay for a couple of cans out of his own pocket - how that is a bad thing, I fail to see. Not enough people give kind gestures these days.

What couple of extra grand??? Don't believe everything you read. The union haven't paid anything extra than the set price.

So far, there has been mere speculation and hearsay. There has yet to be any credible proof that "terrible" damage was caused. Even I can write that somebody who has something to do with something said "the student's union won't get their deposit back." Doesn't make it true.

Thomas_S_Hunterson

CaptainNegative wrote: »

There was no free booze from the student union fund last year. Barry Colfer was kind enough to pay for a couple of cans out of his own pocket - how that is a bad thing, I fail to see. Not enough people give kind gestures these days.

What couple of extra grand??? Don't believe everything you read. The union haven't paid anything extra than the set price.

So far, there has been mere speculation and hearsay. There has yet to be any credible proof that "terrible" damage was caused. Even I can write that somebody who has something to do with something said "the student's union won't get their deposit back." Doesn't make it true.

Just saw the article in the tribune. Can I take it you're saying that you feel it is completely untrue and that either they made up the quotes from the owners/managers of the properties, or else that the owners/managers were telling outright lies?

Stabshauptmann

Red Alert wrote: »

I'd like to see class reps behave a bit better than your average scumbag.

I think in the interest of fairness and accountability candidates shouldnt be returned automatically in the case of no opposition.

ie in a one seat constituency, if only one person puts themselves forward for election, that one person should still have to defeat RON.

Some might says thats harsh. If no one else wants the job then whats the harm in them doing it?

Well, simply put, if these people are claiming to represent you, you should have the right to say they dont.

I'd expect some hacks to come out with "theres nothing stopping you from running against them". There is; time, resources and interest. Just because you dont want to be represented by someone doesnt mean you want to represent others.


Also, the way I see it many people view the SU as irrelevant/unrepresentative to them, if they had to fight harder for their seats reps might do a better job.

Het-Field

Kaptain Redeye wrote: »

I think in the interest of fairness and accountability candidates shouldnt be returned automatically in the case of no opposition.

ie in a one seat constituency, if only one person puts themselves forward for election, that one person should still have to defeat RON.

Some might says thats harsh. If no one else wants the job then whats the harm in them doing it?

Well, simply put, if these people are claiming to represent you, you should have the right to say they dont.

I'd expect some hacks to come out with "theres nothing stopping you from running against them". There is; time, resources and interest. Just because you dont want to be represented by someone doesnt mean you want to represent others.


Also, the way I see it many people view the SU as irrelevant/unrepresentative to them, if they had to fight harder for their seats reps might do a better job.

You would guarantee to cut council in half if there was a RON option. People do exercise the option, and when somebody only needs to win a seat by 3 votes, the chances of the RON option being exercised are increased.

Some people do very well in Class Rep elections, and never turn up for council. In my years with UCDSU I know plenty of reps who were victorous in an uncontested race. Many of these were some of the best reps on council.

It would be a very lame attempt at creating fairness and accountability to offer the RON option.

Stabshauptmann

Im sorry but that makes no sense, how could they be doing a good job if you believe their constituents would prefer they not be their rep?

Het-Field

Kaptain Redeye wrote: »

Im sorry but that makes no sense, how could they be doing a good job if you believe their constituents would prefer they not be their rep?

Do you actually think that constituents actually care that much ? The vast majority of the UCD population could hardly name the five sabbatical officers, and I doubt could name any exec officers.

Stabshauptmann

What has that got to do with it. Your doing a song and dance here but evading the issue.

If you have an election, with just the one candidate and RON, the people who dont care wont vote. You'd be elected anyway.

Having the election though would raise the profile of the union, and of the rep themselves. And if they are a complete twat that their class doesnt want to represent them then they have the option of RON'ing them

DaveyGem

Sean_K wrote: »

Just saw the article in the tribune. Can I take it you're saying that you feel it is completely untrue and that either they made up the quotes from the owners/managers of the properties, or else that the owners/managers were telling outright lies?

A very good point indeed, I don't imagine they have much reason to lie, the SU on the other hand...

Also Starring LeVar Burton

Sean_K wrote: »

Just saw the article in the tribune. Can I take it you're saying that you feel it is completely untrue and that either they made up the quotes from the owners/managers of the properties, or else that the owners/managers were telling outright lies?

To be perfectly honest, as both a section editor of the Tribune and a Student's Union Class Rep who attended the training, I was unaware of these goings on at the time and as far as I know neither the Hotel nor the place we were staying were not at liberty to disclose any sort of information and they've since been contacted by the University and they've denied disclosing any such information, so in the words of Shakespeare "Something is rotten in the State of Denmark"!
I'm not saying that the class reps were sober little angels last weekend, but I'm skeptical about this so called damage - if it was really that bad, surely the majority of the people in attendance would have noticed, but no one I've spoken to was there heard anything about it at the time nor did they notice anything out of place.
Having said that, it would surprise me if anyone writing for the Tribune would make up quotes for a news story, but I'm going to need to see actual evidence of anything the union are being accused of before I believe it - so far I haven't, all I can go on is the fact that I was there, and being involved with both the Tribune and the Union am equally biased, so we'll just have to see how it plays out, but lets remember that it's "innocent until proven guilty" not the other way around.

DaveyGem

CaptainNegative wrote: »

To be perfectly honest, as both a section editor of the Tribune and a Student's Union Class Rep who attended the training, I was unaware of these goings on at the time and as far as I know neither the Hotel nor the place we were staying were not at liberty to disclose any sort of information and they've since been contacted by the University and they've denied disclosing any such information, so in the words of Shakespeare "Something is rotten in the State of Denmark"!
I'm not saying that the class reps were sober little angels last weekend, but I'm skeptical about this so called damage - if it was really that bad, surely the majority of the people in attendance would have noticed, but no one I've spoken to was there heard anything about it at the time nor did they notice anything out of place.
Having said that, it would surprise me if anyone writing for the Tribune would make up quotes for a news story, but I'm going to need to see actual evidence of anything the union are being accused of before I believe it - so far I haven't, all I can go on is the fact that I was there, and being involved with both the Tribune and the Union am equally biased, so we'll just have to see how it plays out, but lets remember that it's "innocent until proven guilty" not the other way around.

Surely as an editor, you could check where the quotes from the hotel/accom came from and also even lesten to the recording of that conversation....

As raggy as both the tribune and the observer can be, i doubt they would make up quotes, breaching what i imagine is one of the fundamental rules of journalism....

Stepherunie

Look I was there and 99% of people acted perfectly.

Sure they got drunk on the nights but so did most and the vast majority of alcohol was purchased by the students, not by the SU.

The vast majority of students had nothing to do with any of the damage that may or may not have occurred. In fact I'd say most students are at most guilty of bringing some mud into a house because of the really bad weather the second night.

Most people are smart enough to respect the fact they've been taken away for a weekend and dont' act the maggot. As with any large group of people there are always one or two bad apples who give everyone else a bad name.

I'm offended by what was written in that article because it casts all in a bad light rather than the truth which was a small minority who acted up in any way.