Trouble With Compound lifts.

Theresalwaysone

Hi all,

Ive been reading here fairly regularly and have seen many times the importance of compound lifts, and so, have been phasing out my iso lifts and bringing in squats/deadlifts/bench.

I am havnig trouble keeping a routine with them unfortunately. Every time I do a set of Squats afterwards I am ok but an hour/few hours later my legs are in bad shape, shaking/wobbly etc and the next day, they are all tight and stiff and squatting again/deadlifting is not doable.

Anyone else encounter this? Is it my form? Is it the weight? I do light stretches before and after my sets? Should I stretch a bit "heavier"?

I dont have particularly strong legs, I've started squatting 30kg until I see how that goes and then add more weight progressively. Same with deadlift.

Hanley

How many reps are you doing? How often are you squatting/deadlifting?

Theresalwaysone

3 sets of 8 reps.

Im trying to be doing it as often as possible i.e. as long as Im not sore/stiff from the previous squats/deadlifts.

The problem is, I am always stiff for a few days after. So I only get to do it maybe max twice a week, Im not sure what is optimal in terms of amount of times to be doing these lifts.

I also realise the weight Im doing is quite light, given Im 20 and 5'10''. But Ive been trying to get myself in shape for months now and have made good progress so would like to keep it up and get the most from what I do do and compounds lifts has been touted as a good habit to get into.

Colm_OReilly

What else are you doing? Can you post your complete workout?

Also, how often is as often as possible? Everyday?

Theresalwaysone

Yeah I'll post a workout I did yesterday. Gimme a sec and Ill whip it off google docs.

brianthebard

When did you make this change to bench, deads and squat?

Theresalwaysone

Push ups to start 30/20/10
then:
Bench 52.5kg 3x8
Shoulder Press 30kg 3x8
Bicep Curl 30kg 3x8
Bent Over Row 30kg 3x8
Reverse Flies 15kg 3x8
Hammer Curls 15kg 3x8
Tricep Kicks 15kg 3x8
Front Squat 30kg 3x8

Rest for 60 seconds between sets.

I try alternate my lower body compound lifts every time I do them. i.e. not squat and deadlift on the same day (I have no reason for this other than I think my legs would give in if I did them, Ive never tried it).

Opinions please? Is it ok?

Theresalwaysone

Also, its usually every second day I do that. I dont know if doing it every day would be counter productive?

My goal is weight loss if that makes a difference.

edit: I should clarify this, my primary goal is weightloss but I would also like to tone up and generally become more fit. I also, realise that diet is probably the most important thing in achieving my primary goal. I asked about my compounds because I would obvioulsy like to be stronger/bigger muscles to speed up my metabolism in order to aid with weight loss.

Theresalwaysone

brianthebard wrote: »

When did you make this change to bench, deads and squat?

I had been dabbling with them every once in a while for the last month, I guess it would be 3 weeks since I tried to incorporate them properly.

Should also add, I do cardio on the days I dont do the weights. Run for 30mins usually.

I wanted to put all that extra info in the OP but it would have been way too long and people would have lost interest.

brianthebard

It just sounds like DOMS to me, which will diminish as you get better at the lifts and do them more regularly (imo of course).

Theresalwaysone

One other quick question,

Is the workout I posted ok? What should I be aiming for in my lifts? Whats generally good numbers for a person of my height and age?

BobbyOLeary

Hey OP,

After 3 weeks you're still feeling the pain in your legs? Is it just your legs? Or do the other parts of you feel it too?

Plus I'll bet money that you're not eating or sleeping enough. Thats how it was with me anyway. I was doing big compound lifts every second day but I wasn't eating very much nor was I sleeping (about 5 hours a night on average) enough.

These days I lift heavier but I sleep a good bit more (8+ hours per night unless I go out) plus I eat more than I used to. Sorry I don't have that many figures to throw at you but I never wrote it down. Post up a typical days intake (be honest, it'll make it easier) and it'll be easier to help you.

Don't get bogged down in what numbers you should be lifting, at your stage it doesn't matter. Really at any stage the figure itself doesn't matter as long as you're progressing and seeing the results you want.

Theresalwaysone

BobbyOLeary wrote: »

Hey OP,

After 3 weeks you're still feeling the pain in your legs? Is it just your legs? Or do the other parts of you feel it too?

Plus I'll bet money that you're not eating or sleeping enough. Thats how it was with me anyway. I was doing big compound lifts every second day but I wasn't eating very much nor was I sleeping (about 5 hours a night on average) enough.

These days I lift heavier but I sleep a good bit more (8+ hours per night unless I go out) plus I eat more than I used to. Sorry I don't have that many figures to throw at you but I never wrote it down. Post up a typical days intake (be honest, it'll make it easier) and it'll be easier to help you.

Don't get bogged down in what numbers you should be lifting, at your stage it doesn't matter. Really at any stage the figure itself doesn't matter as long as you're progressing and seeing the results you want.

Sorry, I probably wasnt clear in what I meant.

Im not still sore after 3 weeks, Im sore for a few days after lifting, which stops me from lifting more regularly, which is what Id like to be doing. I can still do upper body work but it stops me doing anything on my lower body. If it is DOMS then it'll sort itself out, I thought maybe it was my form/diet/stretches etc.

A typical days intake is: Times might be off as in its not that regular but it gives a good idea.

10am Porridge or Poached eggs on toast.

12pm rice cake w/peanut butter, tuna, some sort of snack maybe boiled egg.

1:30 Roll of some sort, usually with some meat, and then peppers, lettuce, tomatoes.(Im trying to cut down on the bread, tough though given the lack of options in UCD)

5 or 6pm Dinner, Usually something Past/Rice based w/Chicken.

8pm snack, same as before, something small, not sugary, fruit, ricecakes etc etc

edit: If Im at home for lunch I will usually stick two chicken fillets on the grill and eat them with some peppers or w/e

BobbyOLeary

Im not still sore after 3 weeks, Im sore for a few days after lifting

I know what you meant, sorry I came across wrong. What I meant was that after 3 weeks of training you still get tough DOMS after a session? For me at least, the first two or three sessions back after a break have me walking like a cowboy for a week but after that I'm only uncomfortable for a day or so. Sometimes not at all.

Foodwise, I'd say its too little. People blame UCD for providing poor food choices, I blame students (I'm one too) for being too lazy and fond of chips. I'm in UCD and I eat fine. Go to the grind in the Student Centre and get a wrap, its 3.50 and you get a heap of meat and veg. I'd eat two or three of those a day. If you want to be anal about carbs you could just eat the filling.

Looking at your diet your vegetable intake is also quite low, you say you eat none at dinner? Try replacing some of the rice with boiled brocolli or carrots, incredibly easy to cook and the boiling makes them very easy to eat too.

Whats your weight at the moment? Your age and height don't determine your calorific intake for the day, your activity level and weight do*.

*Gross oversimplification I know but its close enough.

brianthebard

If you are concerned about your form, post up a video (borrow a camera if necessary) and people will tell you how it looks.

Theresalwaysone

BobbyOLeary wrote: »

I know what you meant, sorry I came across wrong. What I meant was that after 3 weeks of training you still get tough DOMS after a session? For me at least, the first two or three sessions back after a break have me walking like a cowboy for a week but after that I'm only uncomfortable for a day or so. Sometimes not at all.

Foodwise, I'd say its too little. People blame UCD for providing poor food choices, I blame students (I'm one too) for being too lazy and fond of chips. I'm in UCD and I eat fine. Go to the grind in the Student Centre and get a wrap, its 3.50 and you get a heap of meat and veg. I'd eat two or three of those a day. If you want to be anal about carbs you could just eat the filling.

Looking at your diet your vegetable intake is also quite low, you say you eat none at dinner? Try replacing some of the rice with boiled brocolli or carrots, incredibly easy to cook and the boiling makes them very easy to eat too.

Whats your weight at the moment? Your age and height don't determine your calorific intake for the day, your activity level and weight do*.

*Gross oversimplification I know but its close enough.

Firstly, cheers for the help. Appreciate it. And all replies in this thread.

Well, yeah, Your understanding of it is correct, saying that, Id say Ive done 4 sessions since I started phasing them in properly(3 weeks ago), because of the stiffness and soreness.

You are very correct when you say that I dont eat enough vegetables. I'll have to eat more.
You are also correct when you say Im being lazy in UCD. I generally just settle for a roll from centra.

Im 13stone at the moment. I'd be fairly active at the moment, given I do some sort of excercise every day. If its not weights, its a run, or neither of those then it is playing football.

Theresalwaysone

brianthebard wrote: »

If you are concerned about your form, post up a video (borrow a camera if necessary) and people will tell you how it looks.

I'll try get this sorted during the week.

BobbyOLeary

Firstly, cheers for the help. Appreciate it. And all replies in this thread.

Well, yeah, Your understanding of it is correct, saying that, Id say Ive done 4 sessions since I started phasing them in properly(3 weeks ago), because of the stiffness and soreness.

You are very correct when you say that I dont eat enough vegetables. I'll have to eat more.
You are also correct when you say Im being lazy in UCD. I generally just settle for a roll from centra.

Im 13stone at the moment. I'd be fairly active at the moment, given I do some sort of excercise every day. If its not weights, its a run, or neither of those then it is playing football.

No problem, glad I can help.

Ah don't be too worried bout being lazy, nearly everyone is. Just don't go to Centra the next time. I take it from using Centra you're based up the Fosters Avenue end of college? Up near Quinn? The student centre is a trek but I'm pretty sure 911 do wraps too and they're probably similar in price.

Hmmm, stab in the dark here but doing all that extra exercise which seems to be leg-dependant could be half the reason your DOMS are so bad. But sort the diet and sleep first and see how it goes.

On a side note, where did you get that program you were doing?

Theresalwaysone

BobbyOLeary wrote: »

No problem, glad I can help.

Ah don't be too worried bout being lazy, nearly everyone is. Just don't go to Centra the next time. I take it from using Centra you're based up the Fosters Avenue end of college? Up near Quinn? The student centre is a trek but I'm pretty sure 911 do wraps too and they're probably similar in price.

Hmmm, stab in the dark here but doing all that extra exercise which seems to be leg-dependant could be half the reason your DOMS are so bad. But sort the diet and sleep first and see how it goes.

On a side note, where did you get that program you were doing?

I am based in Quinn yes, unfortunately.

The program is less of a program more of a "something I threw together myself to start me off".

Im not sure how effective it is, but Ive been getting good results so far.

brianthebard

Maybe you should consider a program so? 5x5 is a good solid one imo and gets you introduced to all the big lifts. We've all put programs together but usually the best results (especially when starting out) are from tried and tested routines, where everything is given to you.

Theresalwaysone

brianthebard wrote: »

Maybe you should consider a program so? 5x5 is a good solid one imo and gets you introduced to all the big lifts. We've all put programs together but usually the best results (especially when starting out) are from tried and tested routines, where everything is given to you.

Yeah, that would be a good idea I think.

Could you give me one? Or tell me where to find one?

BobbyOLeary

Check out Starting Strength for a very good tried and tested beginner routine.

Look at this wiki for more information

http://startingstrength.wikia.com/wiki/Starting_Strength_Wiki

Or best off buy the book and look at the wiki, the book is available from either amazon.com or the aasgaard company website

http://www.aasguardco.com

I followed that program for a while and got reasonably strong from it in a short space of time. Plus Crunch in UCD is pretty well set up for it as nearly noone actually Squats or Deadlifts in the place.