Bail out those greedy people

Darragh29

Cormic wrote: »

I am actualy shocked at EH. How can he defend this woman and her predicament.

'Cos he's a fu*kin clown who represents the worst of the last ten years. While we had people who knew what they were taking about, like David Mc Williams, telling us regularly that we were setting ourselves up for a huge fall, we had Eddie Hobbs turning every second twit with a bit of spare cash, into an "investor".

ven0m wrote: »

EH can defend cos he's just like her with his own 'dodgy' property investment schemes. The sooner people see thru EH & his own brand of perfumed b.s. the better. EH couldn't give a monkeys about 'economic fairness & prosperity' - only what he can line his own pockets with. His whole spiel the last few years
has earned him a pretty nice wad of cash, which people forget. Sure - tell people what they wanna hear, & make a buttload of cash from it. it's the oldest racket in the book.

I was at a wedding in a hotel in Naas over a year ago and the day after the wedding, I was having lunch in the hotel lobby and I hear this recognisable accent, the tone of which I can only say was smug, authorative and laden down with the speakers air of self importance. I discreetly turned around to see some complete loo-laa hanging onto the every word of Eddie Hobbs! I listened to the conversation and I can tell you that you would get less patronising and better financial advice from reading a Sunday paper!

ven0m

brianthebard wrote: »

So they are doing better than us? Result imo.

Health Service yes - major WIN for them. But, still doesn't detract from the lifestyle your average Cuban has, which is not third world standard, but it'd be nice to have some fast interwebs so you can access stuff like boards.ie

20goto10

Darragh29 wrote: »

'Cos he's a fu*kin clown who represents the worst of the last ten years. While we had people who knew what they were taking about, like David Mc Williams, telling us regularly that we were setting ourselves up for a huge fall, we had Eddie Hobbs turning every second twit with a bit of spare cash, into an "investor".

David McWilliams is a fooking clown. As is Eddie Hobbs. The worst thing to come out of the Celtic Tiger is the celebrity economist. They're all clowns and they all have their own hidden agenda, to make money out of dopes who listen to their drivel.

meditraitor

ven0m wrote: »

Solves nothing. Ask Che Guevarra.

http://www.sfgate.com/c/pictures/2007/10/09/mn_guevara.jpg

Darragh29

20goto10 wrote: »

David McWilliams is a fooking clown. As is Eddie Hobbs. The worst thing to come out of the Celtic Tiger is the celebrity economist. They're all clowns and they all have their own hidden agenda, to make money out of dopes who listen to their drivel.

From what I've been seeing, David Mc Williams was about the only person telling us the truth over the last number of years, which was this housing boom crap was going to end in tears, and now it has.

BigEejit

There was a program on the telly here in the UK and it showed a woman who was sniffling and looking for sympathy when she was out of pocket because she bought 7 flats off the books in an area she had never seen in her life in a part of Manchester with hundreds of unrented flats after attending one of those free investor conferences.....

She will most likely lose her own house, I do feel a little sympathy there, but it was her own greed that got here into the state she is in now...

Now some people (if not all) will say its an investment for their future (pension/putting kids through college etc) ... but they looked at a inflating market and greed, pure and simple greed took over their minds and they joined the other sheeple in further inflating the market ....

In disgust I changed to another channel and there was a guy who used to be one of londons biggest landlords .... 'used to be' because he flogged £700 million worth of houses over the last 12 - 18 months because he and just about anyone could see it was a bubble on the verge of bursting....nothing to do with sub prime mortgages and crap, it was just a property bubble and was going to pop sooner rather than later, he cited lots of reasons but the biggest one he said was that houses had become unaffordable and there were no longer first time buyers coming in at he bottom, just investors looking for 2 bed flats in city centres.
Another thing that was mentioned in that program or another (I cant remember) was that 2 bed flats are not family homes, and family homes were rediculously overpriced.... he said he is just holding his money and waiting to buy back a lot of those properties he sold at a greatly reduced price from when he sold them.
In London the average price for all residential property (including flats etc) is £336k, houses in any kind of a decent area start at £400k ...

20goto10

Darragh29 wrote: »

From what I've been seeing, David Mc Williams was about the only person telling us the truth over the last number of years, which was this housing boom crap was going to end in tears, and now it has.

Its going to rain one day....eventually I'm going to right and I can say I told you so (or more accurately I sohuld say it's going to be cracking day one day ).

The factors which he based his prediction on were not entirely correct, although I'm sure he's claiming full credit, I haven't heard him in a while now so I don't know. He must be off spending his millions which he made from the boom.

Loose Lips

ven0m wrote: »

No, short selling was a TINY part of the problem. The real problem was unregulated/unmonitored trading in futures markets & in subprime markets, where loses were not being tracked or questioned, as earlier trading in these areas was so bloody lucrative it turned into 'ask no questions, tell no lies', which then became institutionalised within the traders modus operandi, as their bosses were too busy back slapping over how much more money they were able to ake & their ridiculously large bonuses. It eventually became considered a 'cash cow' & any real reporting/monitoring stopped as cigars, expensive brandy & back slapping continued amongst the top tiered fat cats.

Ven0m: You are right. Speculation was at the root of this issue, but your understanding of the futures market (and other financial markets) is not very good.

Good luck!

BroomBurner

Can't believe the cheek of that woman being sad.

Have to say though, while watching the catch up programme "Secret Millionnaire Changed my Life", we were wondering how many of those then-newly-minted "property investor millionaires" are now living in the estates they went to help a couple of years ago...

lets not get all teary eyed about who was buying all the property

gurramok

BigEejit wrote: »

In London the average price for all residential property (including flats etc) is £336k, houses in any kind of a decent area start at £400k ...

Sssssshhhh!!

They're not flats at all , they're apartments as the owners would say

aidan24326

nice1franko wrote: »

I think it's more to do with the fact that she took the gamble, lost and now wants her money back.

She should try that one in Paddy Power's some day and see how she gets on.

ven0m wrote: »

Wait & see. This is a bubble that is just waiting to burst & then you'll see how exposed the top 5 banks/mortgage lenders in this state are.

Nobody will shed any tears for the banks that's for sure, the banks in this country have been taking the p1ss for years. Regardless of the current situation the top management execs in our banks will continue to cream off big fat salaries and massive bonuses, so what do they care? They're not exposed like the ordinary joe they've lured into buying a 105% mortgage to pay for a grossly over-priced house.

Our politicians won't have to worry about having their house reposessed either that's for sure, but we'll get the usual oscar-winning performances of feigned concern just the same. We now have a group of politicians in this country who are as arrogant and as detached from the man on the street as any other country in the world.

hopalong85

seems to be a lot of anger here guys! sure people like this woman shouldn't be bailed out by anyone. took the chance, it didn't work out and all that. but saying things along the lines of "serves her right" seems a bit petty imo. at the end of the day she had money to invest and did so. this is hardly a crime ffs! i just think it's pretty childish to take pleasure in someone elses misfortune.

SimpleSam06

hopalong85 wrote: »

seems to be a lot of anger here guys! sure people like this woman shouldn't be bailed out by anyone. took the chance, it didn't work out and all that.

The anger comes from the way the idiots in government are trying to bail people like her out, on the back of the taxpayers.

Darragh29

hopalong85 wrote: »

seems to be a lot of anger here guys! sure people like this woman shouldn't be bailed out by anyone. took the chance, it didn't work out and all that. but saying things along the lines of "serves her right" seems a bit petty imo. at the end of the day she had money to invest and did so. this is hardly a crime ffs! i just think it's pretty childish to take pleasure in someone elses misfortune.

Me b*llox. We have all been affected by this. I want to get married and start a family, I don't want to be extremely wealthy or make money off the backs of others, like the property parasites have been doing recently.

I just want to be able to live in a house with my future family and have time to spend with them. The greed of recent years has put these kind of humble ambitions beyond the hope of a lot of people... You don't seem to be seeing the whole picture here, a whole generation of young people are going to have problems with buying a family home for years to come over this...

aidan24326

SimpleSam06 wrote: »

The anger comes from the way the idiots in government are trying to bail people like her out, on the back of the taxpayers.

Are they though? I haven't heard of anyone being bailed out by the government.

The real sh1t will hit the fan when one of our major banks gets into trouble, and the government bail them out with taxpayers money while the greedy people who created the whole mess flee with their millions.

Dudess

No, there's nothing wrong whatsoever with what that woman did.

There is however something wrong with her writing a whingey, woe-is-me sob story letter to Eddie Hobbs and being so deluded and un-self aware as to think it would elicit anything other than revulsion.

SimpleSam06

aidan24326 wrote: »

Are they though? I haven't heard of anyone being bailed out by the government.

There was a protest on it yesterday outside the Dail.

Darragh29

Dudess wrote: »

No, there's nothing wrong whatsoever with what that woman did.

There is however something wrong with her writing a whingey, woe-is-me sob story letter to Eddie Hobbs and being so deluded and un-self aware as to think it would elicit anything other than revulsion.

Well she's not thinking right so you couldn't really blame her, but Eddie Hobbs certainly read the current climate catastrophically wrong to think that he was going to connect with a sympathic audience, which he clearly did seem to think.

pickarooney

SimpleSam06 wrote: »

Heh, so by your reckoning, France must have the highest homeless population on earth, since you can't buy or rent? I think you may be somewhat confused, there.

Can't buy or rent? No, I said it was unaffordable to the vast majority to buy and stupidly complicated for anyone to rent.

Where are you getting your information from, because it sounds like you are making it up.

I get my information from the newspapers, colleagues, friends, real estate agents and the hundred-odd letting agencies who refused to entertain the thought of showing me a flat without my parents there to sign a letter and six months' payslips showing I earned 3-4 times the monthly rent. Where do you get yours?

I don't see how there's any more pressure to buy in Ireland apart from keeping up with the Joneses.

SimpleSam06

pickarooney wrote: »

Can't buy or rent? No, I said it was unaffordable to the vast majority to buy and stupidly complicated for anyone to rent.

Odd, I thought around 65% of French people were homeowners. Doesn't sound like the vast majority to me. At that rate, it can't be that complicated to rent, or 20% of the population would be sitting by the roadside, never mind that renting is encouraged by the government there.

pickarooney wrote: »

Where do you get yours?

Sorry, didn't you read the link I supplied? As for the anecdotes, they'll be given due regard.

pickarooney wrote: »

I don't see how there's any more pressure to buy in Ireland apart from keeping up with the Joneses.

I already explained this as well. Tenant protection in Ireland is appalling. If you want to raise a family, you need better than that.

dixiefly

monkey24 wrote: »

I was just watching prime time where Eddie Hobbs read out a tear jerking letter from a women who is having a really hard time because she has five residential properties and is now finding things hard. He then went on to say the government have to do something.

Seriously, is this what it has f*cking come to. I am sorry for that women but we are now being asked to bail out greedy f*cking people. This makes me sick. So people are free to rake in money in the free markets but when it goes wrong its other people who pick up the tab.

That women should pay for her mistakes, that is how free markets work. Bailing out banks to keep the world afloat is one thing, bailing out greedy people who speculated on property is quite another.

Everyday I read about this country it usually turns my stomach ...

/rant

I have to fully agree with you there man. I thought it was a bit of a joke at first. She has FIVE RENTAL PROPERTIES ffs!!!! The chances are that at least some of them have gained in value. She can sell two or even three of them at current prices and still be way ahead of most of the country.

She was also saying she had no will to live! Christ it was unbelievable and worse of Eddie Hobbs to be making a big deal out of it.

There are many people such as those poor soles in Tyco yesterday that have a 1 mortgage over the house they are living in and the one or both people facing redundancy.

That woman expected to buy those houses and automatically make a fortune out of it.

Loose Lips

Dudess wrote: »

No, there's nothing wrong whatsoever with what that woman did.

There is however something wrong with her writing a whingey, woe-is-me sob story letter to Eddie Hobbs and being so deluded and un-self aware as to think it would elicit anything other than revulsion.

Dudess: It is a common misconception that people somehow 'deserve' anything in the economic sphere. Market forces are all that are at work.

Just as this woman is not deserving of any sympathy, neither is the struggling young couple who can't afford their first house. Nobody has an automatic right to property or prosperity.

God bless.

Caoimhín

Jaysus,

Now if someone was paralyzed in a car crash, had cancer or lost their family in a fire, i would have some sympathy.

But whinging because an investment gamble didnt pay off, fook off.

If i borrowed money from the bank and gambled on the stock market or even the horses, would i look for a bail out if i lost?

No.

Sell the assets and accept what ever you get, make a deal with the banks or maybe declare bankruptcy. Owning houses or BMW's are not as important as your family or health.

pickarooney

SimpleSam06 wrote: »

Odd, I thought around 65% of French people were homeowners. Doesn't sound like the vast majority to me.

56%, compared to the 74% EU average. That's 56% of all adults, who buy their first home at, on average 37. Young people buying houses are the exception rather than the norm.

http://lefenneccgt.unblog.fr/renseignements-economiques-sur-la-france-et-les-francais/

At that rate, it can't be that complicated to rent, or 20% of the population would be sitting by the roadside, never mind that renting is encouraged by the government there.

As long as you're not an orphan.

Sorry, didn't you read the link I supplied? As for the anecdotes, they'll be given due regard.

I did, but didn't see anything remotely pertinent.

I already explained this as well. Tenant protection in Ireland is appalling. If you want to raise a family, you need better than that.

Seems to me buying a house is the best way to end up penniless and on the street in Ireland.

Darragh29

Loose Lips wrote: »

Dudess: It is a common misconception that people somehow 'deserve' anything in the economic sphere. Market forces are all that are at work.

Just as this woman is not deserving of any sympathy, neither is the struggling young couple who can't afford their first house. Nobody has an automatic right to property or prosperity.

God bless.

People might not have an "automatic" right as you suggest to buy their first property or their fifth property, nobody is asking for an "automatic right" to a house. What people expect is that if they want to work hard and have a family, that they are not asking too much when they ask for an economy where they can buy a house to rear that family in.

Your argument if followed to where it will ultimately end, states that if the market ends up dictating that we are all living in cardboard boxes in shanty towns, then that is the way it is and that is the way it will remain because the market is in charge. We have been, but should not have been, had proper legislation been enacted, at the absolute mercy of the free market.

Just like the banks charge investors higher interest rates for investment properties, (and the banks are the mother and source of all capitalist interests), the government should have used a substantially higher rate of stamp duty for investors to keep these parasites out of the market or at least to limit their ability to fu*k up the economy.

SimpleSam06

pickarooney wrote: »

56%, compared to the 74% EU average. That's 56% of all adults, who buy their first home at, on average 37.

Thats 10% below the European average, and still means that a minority of French people are not homeowners, as opposed to your "vast majority" comment above. And of course prices are falling in France as well.

pickarooney wrote: »

Young people buying houses are the exception rather than the norm.

And this differs from most other countries how, exactly?

pickarooney wrote: »

I did, but didn't see anything remotely pertinent.

Well, you may give it the same regard I gave your anecdotes, so.

pickarooney wrote: »

Seems to me buying a house is the best way to end up penniless and on the street in Ireland.

For the next few years, yes. I'm not sure what if any bearing that has on the discussion however.

pickarooney

SimpleSam06 wrote: »

Thats 10% below the European average,

Interesting - the European average dropped by 10% in 4 years.

And of course prices are falling in France as well.

I wish!

And this differs from most other countries how, exactly?

It differs from Ireland, where all the crazy kiddies are getting houses, no?

Loose Lips

Darragh29 wrote: »

What people expect is that if they want to work hard and have a family, that they are not asking too much when they ask for an economy where they can buy a house to rear that family in.

Darragh29: An economy where they can buy a house is an economy with an open housing market. If they are asking for this, then they have it already. It is up to the family in question to earn sufficient money to buy a house. The economy can't make money for them, or stop to wait for them to catch up with it.

A society where prices are controlled so that everyone can afford to "buy" a house is not an open or free economy. It is the type of economy you find in North Korea. But that is a separate discussion.

God bless

pickarooney

pickarooney wrote: »

56%, compared to the 74% EU average. That's 56% of all adults, who buy their first home at, on average 37. Young people buying houses are the exception rather than the norm.

http://lefenneccgt.unblog.fr/renseignements-economiques-sur-la-france-et-les-francais/

so they arent gettin out 40 year mortgages then?
or 35?
or 30?
25? less?