Stalling, what now?

corribdude

Ive gotten alot of great advice on this forum the last while so thanks for that guys, anyway here's my latest problem. After a period of increasing weights pretty fast over the last while when I started a 5x5 program, my last 5rm set is starting to feel extremely heavy during my last two sessions for squats and bench, 90 and 65 respectively. I had been increasing by 5kg and 2.5kg for these exercises but I cant see myself being able to increase the weight by even 1kg on these exercises for todays session so I imagine this is what stalling feels like. Overall, Im feeling a bit burnt out after the last couple of weeks and I imagine this also is a sign that I need to change something. The 5x5 program I'm doing is one where you ramp the weights, for example the squat session is as follows 50x5, 60x5, 70x5, 80x5, 90x5.

So what do I do now to overcome the stalling? Do I do drop the sets down to 3 and keep trying to increase the weight? Should I keep with 5x5 and drop the weight by 10-20%? Should I take a week off, will I come back stronger and refreshed? As you can see I really dont know what the procedure is for stalling so any advice is appreciated. Cheers.

BossArky

corribdude wrote: »

The 5x5 program I'm doing is one where you ramp the weights, for example the squat session is as follows 50x5, 60x5, 70x5, 80x5, 90x5.

Are those example squat weights or your real progression? It looks like you are making way too big leaps week on week.

Take a week off. Eat lots the night before and a few hours before your next 5x5 attempt.

COH

BossArky wrote: »

Take a week off. Eat lots the night before and a few hours before your next 5x5 attempt.

+1 ... if your feeling burnt out you may just be overtraining.

corribdude

BossArky wrote: »

Are those example squat weights or your real progression? It looks like you are making way too big leaps week on week.

I think you might've misinterpreted me. This was my squat session on last friday -
50x5
60x5
70x5
80x5
90x5

This was what it was the previous friday -
45x5
55x5
65x5
75x5
85x5


Could only manage 60kg on the bench today and that was after dropping two sets so I was doing a 3x5 instead of a 5x5.

Hanley

COH wrote: »

+1 ... if your feeling burnt out you may just be overtraining.

Why does everyone equate lack of progress to overtraining?

COH

Only equated the possibility of over-training to the fact that the OP said "Overall, Im feeling a bit burnt out after the last couple of weeks", thats all!

kevpants

It's definitely not overtraining. That's not to say a break ever few (10 -12 maybe) weeks isn't helpful.

Getting strong is hard. You've been experiencing noob gains where you just have to turn up and do the routine with more weight every week. Now it gets more difficult. You'll need to be a bit more inventive to get stronger.

It's not necessarily a new program, maybe work on the muscles that help your squat & bench. Train your upper back for the bench, your posterior chain for the squat.

But basically it gets tougher as you progress.

brianthebard

Maybe try dropping the weight on the squats back to 70kg and do all 25 reps at that weight (do a few warm up sets before that obviously) Try increasing the weight from there slightly every day or second day you train.

BossArky

Isn't a "true" 5x5 using the same weight for 5 sets of 5 reps in a particular session, then increasing it by maybe 2.5kg or 5kg next week?

e.g.

week 1: 5 sets of 5 reps at 70kg
week 2: 5 sets of 5 reps at 72.5kg
week 3: 5 sets of 5 reps at 75kg
etc...

Hanley

BossArky wrote: »

Isn't a "true" 5x5 using the same weight for 5 sets of 5 reps in a particular session, then increasing it by maybe 2.5kg or 5kg next week?

e.g.

week 1: 5 sets of 5 reps at 70kg
week 2: 5 sets of 5 reps at 72.5kg
week 3: 5 sets of 5 reps at 75kg
etc...

Yup. That's what I woulda said. What the OP is doing is just a top set of 5. When you're near your limits of strength it's a good way to go, but when you're in the middle of a cycle trying to build strength, sets of 5 (3 or 5) are probably better.

daveywavey08

I've started doing a new routine which ramps your squat/bench (1x5) on particular days but changes to 5x5 on the other days. I don't know how effective this will be but you can read about it at:
http://www.geocities.com/elitemadcow1/5x5_Program/Periodized_5x5.htm

You start the program at lifts about 80% of your current 5 RM's and progress weekly from there. Maybe you need a bit of diversity other than just 1x5 every workout.

Transform

you have got to be joking!!! 5 reps and sets at every weight!!!

5 by 5 is done at the same weight for all 5 sets and anything below that is just done as a warm up. Hate to think how long your workout is.

This is what i did yesterday and whats the point in putting down the warm up if its just a prelim to the weight i want to lift (i did about 3-4 pregressively heavier weights on the first 2 exercises then after that no warm ups were necessary AS WAS SWEATING LIKE CRAZY)

++ Deadlift 167.5kg 5sets for 4-5reps paired with dips 37.5kg 4sets for 8 reps and one set at 40kg for 8reps

++ Kneeling leg curls 10reps 5 sets paired with chins 15kg 5 reps for 5 sets

++ dumbbell Biceps curls (incline) 17kg 10reps - press ups 15-20 - barbell axe chops 20kg 8reps all done one after the other for 5 sets

Total workout time about 45mins including warm up. Add no more than 0.5kg for upper body and no more than 1kg for lower body when it starts getting tough

The above session is done once a week and i do squats, bench press, one arm rows etc on other day about 3-4 days after this workout.

You do not have to do 5 reps and 5 sets on all exercises as seen above. I have seen absolutely zero stalling in over 2 years progressive lifting in all my big lifts (apart from minor injury times).

Gotta think long term

brianthebard

Do you carry your own mini weights or something transform? Just wondering cause the smallest plates I've ever seen are 1.25kg, so 2.5 is the minimum you can increase by.

Hanley

brianthebard wrote: »

Do you carry your own mini weights or something transform? Just wondering cause the smallest plates I've ever seen are 1.25kg, so 2.5 is the minimum you can increase by.

You can get fractional plates on liftinglarge.com but they've very expensive what what they are.

brianthebard

I'd sooner just increase the weight every second session...

Malteaser!

brianthebard wrote: »

I'd sooner just increase the weight every second session...

Or get creative and make your own....

brianthebard

From what? Sounds like a make and do project!

Malteaser!

brianthebard wrote: »

From what? Sounds like a make and do project!

Oh god I dunno, rubadub would be the man to tell you!!

I'm sure you could weigh out something that'd stick like play-dough or blue-tac and just press it onto the weight before you start.

daveywavey08

I bought 2 sets (0.25 and 0.5kg) of microplates about 6 years ago and still carry them to gym when I need them. They were fairly pricey alright but they're handy to have and they're an investment for life!

I also bought plates mates and found they to be fairly crap cos the magnet went weak after a year or so so I had to start taping them to the dumbbells. They were handy for using on 30kg dumbbells though to bring weight up to 32.5kg, etc or on a 40kg to bring it to 42.5kg. Most gyms only have 30, 35, 40, 45s.

DM-BM

I just use non olympic 0.5kg discs, anad attach them to the bar with velcro straps, i suppose you could also use cable ties, just set them to a lenght that keeps them snug but allows you to slide them on and off the bar.

For 0.25kg i found two sockets from an old AF socket set and again use velcro straps, I find them very handy.

I think you can get the velcro straps in Woodies.

Hanley

Standard plates w/ cable ties sounds like the best idea so far...

We're lucky in Hercs, as well as 1.25kg plates, we have .5kg and 1kg plates.

TF has their dumbbells in 2.5kg increments too so I tend to train there when I wanna work with 'bells.

Transform

Have used platemates and microdiscs for ages now and really vital for upper body and arm work.

Its an investment that is more important than the weights belts i see some people use for doing their biceps curls or is that just to hold in their gut?

celestial

Transform wrote: »

Its an investment that is more important than the weights belts i see some people use for doing their biceps curls or is that just to hold in their gut?

I think it's cos they want to look 'serious'.

Transform

Yes seriously fat - very very rarely do i ever see anyone need a belt for the lifting that they do i.e. biceps curls and 100kg squats/deadlifts.

Suppose it helps pull in the gut just like the equivalent of a push up bra for a woman - "my how slim/muscular you are" - cut to the bedroom - "dam you that belt was just a big charade!!"

Reyman

Transform wrote: »

you have got to be joking!!! 5 reps and sets at every weight!!!

5 by 5 is done at the same weight for all 5 sets and anything below that is just done as a warm up. Hate to think how long your workout is.

This is what i did yesterday and whats the point in putting down the warm up if its just a prelim to the weight i want to lift (i did about 3-4 pregressively heavier weights on the first 2 exercises then after that no warm ups were necessary AS WAS SWEATING LIKE CRAZY)

++ Deadlift 167.5kg 5sets for 4-5reps paired with dips 37.5kg 4sets for 8 reps and one set at 40kg for 8reps

++ Kneeling leg curls 10reps 5 sets paired with chins 15kg 5 reps for 5 sets

++ dumbbell Biceps curls (incline) 17kg 10reps - press ups 15-20 - barbell axe chops 20kg 8reps all done one after the other for 5 sets

Total workout time about 45mins including warm up. Add no more than 0.5kg for upper body and no more than 1kg for lower body when it starts getting tough

The above session is done once a week and i do squats, bench press, one arm rows etc on other day about 3-4 days after this workout.

You do not have to do 5 reps and 5 sets on all exercises as seen above. I have seen absolutely zero stalling in over 2 years progressive lifting in all my big lifts (apart from minor injury times).

Gotta think long term

Transform: That's a lot of work in 45 mins (30sets). Particularly when I'd have thought a 5x5 was a strength building programme requiring longer breaks ideally ? eg 3-5 mins

What kind of rest periods are you taking between pairings/sets?

Transform

No rest between pairings i.e. do deadlift then within 30secs do the next exercise. Rest a minute or 2 then repeat for required number of sets. I always take no break between pairings and sometimes no break at all for small muscle group exercises like the last pairings.

Its all really about your conditioning - if you have crap fitness then you need more break whereas i feel ready to go with little recovery.

I do not see a certain rep range as strength, mass, tone building etc i just lift to get stronger on two days then easy days on others.

today was a light session with even less recovery (i.e. moved from exercise to exercise as fast as i could set it up but lifted with good form) -

+ Lunges onto a step 10kg 10reps on each leg + Press ups on dumbbells with feet elevated 15reps for 5 sets

+ Lat pull down (210lbs) 10reps + Leg curls (160lbs) 10reps for 4 sets

+ Single arm clean and press (14kg) + Plank position (one leg off the ground) 40secs 4sets

+ Biceps curls (barbell 30kg) 12reps + reverse curls (10lbs added to ankles) 20reps 4sets

+ Russian twists (10kg) 10reps + Band pulls to chest 10reps 4 sets

All done in 45mins again then stretching and rolling.

Its a light easy session really for me but gets up a good sweat and hits all the right areas.

rest is fine when lifting heavier but most people piss about the gym and get shag all covered in each session which is why they mostly use split programs i would guess.

this i what works for me and all my clients train exactly the same as i do

celestial

Transform wrote: »

Suppose it helps pull in the gut just like the equivalent of a push up bra for a woman - "my how slim/muscular you are" - cut to the bedroom - "dam you that belt was just a big charade!!"

Hahaha. Classic!