Joint Problems in Husky

Lenni

Hi,

We got a Sibe husky 4 weeks ago. When we got him we noticed he had a slight limp, very very slight. We checked his leg and all seemed fine, it wasnt bothering him. On sat friends of ours called over with their dog and the 2 pups were running around playing for ages. The more tired he got the worse the limp got. With that we noticed that the joint in the left leg (the one that is limping) was sticking out more that the right leg. Brought him to the vet last nite and he said that the join in one leg is bigger than the other let. He has to go under anistethic on Friday and get xrays done. And they will c from there what the issue is and how to fix it. Has anyone experienced anything like this with their dogs. Really worried about it!

Thanks
Lenni

Discostuy

Hi Lenni...sorry to hear about your dilemma..

I haven't had any problems like this with my own dogs ever, but i know a local chap who got a bull mastiff pup. Turned out both his back hips were dodgy and he had to have them both replaced when she was about 7-8 months old.
This hopefully wont be the case with your dog.
But what i would say is, make sure you have your dog insured, because if its a worst case scenario and he needs surgery, its very very expensive.

I hope its not so serious...but after seeing what this other fella went through, i would recommend everyone get their pets insured...especially pure breds.

Lenni

Hi Discostuy,

My heart is broken over it. Its as stressful as if it was your child. Im so worried bout the after effect. If he has to have surgery he will need a lot of care and we both work, cant afford to be out of work u no but I will need to care for him. We only have him 4 weeks, he is 12 weeks old now. I noticed it the day we took him home so the breader has to have spotted this but never said anything to us, that has me sooo annoyed. Im actually looking into insurance now. Not too up on it all though. Allianz say they cover for Veterinary fees for injury and illness of 4000 per year. Does this mean that if i spent say 1000 in one year in the vets that I would get it all back as it is under 4000 or does it mean that I would have to spend over 4000 before I can claim.

I googled it and it came up that hip displacia is common in husky's but the vet said that it looks like one joint is bigger than the other. Poor thing.

Thanks,
Lennie

Glowing

God damn breeders, some of them just don't give a sh1t. Of course the breeder didn't say anything to you, why would he? And risk loosing a sale? I'm afraid it's up to you to ensure the parents, and ultimately the pup is healthy.

I don't know how it works for insurance, but I wouldn't mention the issues you're having now, you could be denied insurance for a pre-existing condition ..... edit - the policy probably covers costs up to 4000 euro ....

Sorry Lenni, I hope the news isn't too bad for the poor pup.

Edit again: Why not give the breeders a call? Any reputable breeders would be happy to discuss this with you ....

Lenni

I wont mention anything about the condition. Thanks for the reply. My BF is gonna ring the breader now and have a chat, prob go through him!!!

Glowing

Well if the breeders are anything but helpful, make sure to Name & Shame so nobody else makes the same mistake.

Discostuy

Hi

I use allianz at the moment. The cover means they will cover all costs upto €4000 in one year. But you pay the first 60€ i think it is.

So if your bill is €1000, they will cover it all bar the first €60 or so euro. Its well worth it i think.

I had to claim after one of mine had to have an emergency spaying after a suspected case of Pyo. Luckily it was only a mild internal infection. But the bills for the blood tests, xrays and spaying were way more than the cost of the insurance, so its already paid itself off.

I would get onto allianz asap and get insurance. But i dont know what the position will be knowing your dog is out of sorts, they might not give you cover. I would read the small print.

You should contact the breeder and discuss this with him. I hate to be so cold but if its a case this dog will costs 100's or maybe 1000's in vet bills maybe the breeder should take him back. It depends how responsible he is i suppose. If i was the breeder i would take the little fella back and be the one to take the resposibility until he was given the all clear to be rehomed again.
Easier said then done though

Lenni

I no, thats wat a few people hav said to me that he should take him back. I need to think about this long and hard as I need to do what is best for my pup. If this man new he had an illness then is he the best person that the pup should b with u no... We can give him all the love but would litterally loose our jobs if we were to stay home and look after him. I will have to wait till Friday and c what the outcome is of the xrays.

When contacting the insurance company I wont mention anything bout his leg.

peasant

This is probably not what you want to hear, but here goes ...

In case this turns out to be something serious that will cause problems for years to come, you might want to consider giving the pup back to the breeder.

Yes ...I know that sounds cruel, and you'd never do hat ...but hear me out ...

First of all, you paid 700 euro for that pup. In the cold light of day it's "merchandise" like any other goods that you buy and thus has to be of a certain standard. If your dog has a birth defect, you have every right to give it back.(And that way malso maybe make the "breeder" think again about breeding defective dogs)

Secondly, you said yourself that you don't have time to care for it should it need operations and aftercare. Emotional attachment or not ...if you don't have the time to care for this dog the way it needs, you may be making it worse rather than better in the long run. A dog in a plaster cast for example can't be left unsupervised or it would damage itself further.

And lastly, I think you're beginning to realise that you may be in a bit over your head with a young pup in your circumstances and that you may not be able to provide it with the care and attention that it needs, regardless of what its joints are like. This may be an opportunity to reconsider the whole affair.


EDIT: post overtaken by events, as usual ...

Discostuy

Have you family or friends close by that could drop by and watch him for a few hours? Just even watch tv with him there make sure he is ok?.
Its a terrible position to be in. Ring the breeder, see what he says, go from there i guess.

Lenni

To be honest I dont think I am in over my head at all, this is just a major unforeseen circumstance. If he has an operation I hav no intension of leaving him at home on his own, I couldnt do that to him, way too unfair. My sister could knock in now and then but I wouldnt leave a sick pup on his own. A friend of mine actually said that if the breeder takes no head of us today that we should go to consumer affairs. As you said this is a purchase.

Glowing

Sorry to be harsh - but I don't think consumer affairs would give a hoot. Realistically you should have had a vet's check before agreeing to purchase the dog, especially because of all the genetic issues that they're prone too.

Discostuy

peasant wrote: »

Yes ...I know that sounds cruel, and you'd never do hat ...but hear me out ...

First of all, you paid 700 euro for that pup. In the cold light of day it's "merchandise" like any other goods that you buy and thus has to be of a certain standard. If your dog has a birth defect, you have every right to give it back.(And that way malso maybe make the "breeder" think again about breeding defective dogs)

.

Good honest point, i would be inclined to agree. I dont think what your saying is cruel, i think its just when it comes to pets, especially pups the heart rules over the head.

whitser

if it was me i'd take the pup back. something very similar happened to me last year with a harrier/beagle pup, 350 i paid. he was about 9 months old. within a day of getting him i realised he had hip-dis. i rang the fella and told him i wanted my money back and he can have the dog back. in fairness he was ok about it, said he hadnt noticed(?). i got my cash back. sure im keeping dogs years and i didnt notice the pups legs werent right til the next day.

it was your first dog by the sound of it so im sure you hadnt a clue to check out these things first, you like alot of people take these back yard puppy peddlers at their word, they cant be trusted. i know you might have bonded with the dog but you expected a healthy pup when you handed over your money and didnt get one, you were robbed imo. if erveryone took their sick pups back to these money hungry puppy peddlers they might be more carefull about the stock they breed.

Lenni

hi whitser,

yep, first dog. We did a lot of research before we got him but as you said, we didnt no certain things you were to check, which im sure a lot of people wouldnt. It is so hard when you have bonded, the thoughts of giving him back kills me. I would be affraid that if the breeder couldnt sell him on that he would put him down. I have a 2 year old daughter and she just loves him to bits. But as I said when friday comes and we no the outcome I will do wat is best for the put. I wont be thinking of myself.

Thanks for the support,
Lenni

~Thalia~

This is very unfortunate. Is there anyway the pup could have just injured himself while playing with the other puppy and disjointed his leg? I suppose only the x-rays will tell that.

It makes a lot of sense to question the health of your pup before buying froma breeder but I suppose that's not much good now. If I had a pup for 4 weeks there is no way I could return him. I appreciate what Peasant had said in that practically he was a 'purchase' but I just wouldn;t be able to do that.

Lenni

Hi Thalia,

That is how i feel, everytime I think of giving him back my eyes well up. I totally understand the practicality of the situation its just hard. He had the limp when we got him but it was so slight, sometimes if we had someone in the house I would mention it to them and they would think i was mad cause u could barely notice it. He is only aloud out for walks next week, so hasnt had much excercise yet, therefore when he was playing with the other dog he was just tired and the more tired he got the worse the limp was. That is how we new there was something going on. The fact that the vet said he thinks the joint in the left leg is bigger than in the right, I just dont no how they would treat that.

Beth

Thats heartbreaking.

if you got the pup from a reputable breeder, the breeder will take him back. Some of them will offer you a partial refund/full refund AND another pup, or some might just offer a replacement pup or a refund.
Some of the time, when a family have bonded, keepin the pup if they can care for joint disease right throughout the dogs life is ok - but if the breeder is reputable then the breeder will want to know that you CAN care for this joint disease every day of the dogs life. A reputable breeder will want the best for their pups no matter what is or isnt wrong with them.

If its not a reputable breeder, well, I'm afraid you'll be out of luck probably. Some pups are bred for money not for temperament, form and from health tested parents.

Lenni wrote:

When contacting the insurance company I wont mention anything bout his leg.

You will have to declare it as an existing condition - just like human insurance.
Your vet will also have to physically check the pup over, and then have to sign the form before it goes off to Allianz/Pet Insure stating that the form is correct and there are no preexisting conditions.

Lenni

But do you think the breeder would look after him himself or try and sell him on.

~Thalia~

Lenni wrote: »

But do you think the breeder would look after him himself or try and sell him on.

Just wait until the vet has done the x-rays and given their opinion and take it from there. How the pup fares if brought back to the breeder depends on how reptable the breeder is. Did you see the breeders premises? The pups parents etc?

Discostuy

God this just gets sadder the more ya read
I suppose Lenni, talk to the breeder and see what kind of impression you get from him. If you feel like he doesnt really care, maybe dont bother with him. If he shows any kind of care and compassion, work from there.

I think Beth makes a fair point that if this is a serious genetic disease, you may face a life of caring for the pup and enduring a lot of extra cost. Its a serious undertaking for anyone.

I would hate to be in the position of having to give the pup up, but thinking for the future, it might be the wisest choice.

Again i think you need to sit down with your partner and think this through with your head, not your heart...

I hope it works out for you and the little dog

Beth

Lenni wrote: »

But do you think the breeder would look after him himself or try and sell him on.

Unfortunately, all that depends on whether the breeder was reputable or not.


From what you said earlier in the thread

Lenni wrote:

I noticed it the day we took him home so the breader has to have spotted this but never said anything to us, that has me sooo annoyed

the breeder might not be a good one if she/he would let a pup with joint damage go without warning anyone of the pitfalls and costs. It could be that she/he didnt notice, yes but unusual if the breeder is reputable.

Did you see the parents? Or the mother even? the rest of the litter?
Where they were raised? (kitchen/utility/shed?) Was it clean? Were they well looked after?

Did you get advice on puppy care for when you got the puppy home? A puppy pack? Few days food?

Did you see the health certs of the parent dog and bitch?

is the pup registered? Registered pups are not necessarily garanteed genetically sound, but you could contact the Kennel Club if the pup is registered and let them know one of their breeders is selling pups with X wrong with them. Again, until after the xrays, you cant be sure of what is exactly wrong.

Do you still have the breeders details? Can you speak to their vet? Most reputable breeders will not mind you speaking to the vet, as it shows the breeder you are doing your research and want the best pup for your family situation. Is the breeder easily traceable? Reputable breeders are actually traceable through the Kennel Club and Breed Clubs... its the dodgy or back yard breeders that are hard to find usually.

It really is a case of "wait and see" though til after the x-rays. Its possible the pup was playing too roughly and something happened, its possible there was a strange birth etc.... some of these things are manageable and sometimes fixable. You really wont know for sure until after the x-rays.

As Discostuy says though, it is an issue where head will need to rule over heart. You might not want to give the pup back/up/rehome it to someone who can care for it around the clock if its needed, but you might not be able for the costs involved, let alone the care involved if you both have to work all day. In an ideal world, no one would have to work but its not an ideal world. Dealing with a dog that needs constant care around the clock isnt an ideal situtation to be in if you both need to work. Extra costs like having a dog walker come in or having the dog in doggie day care if they will take a dog that needs a lot of care, can all add up as well as vets bills, certain foods and supplements etc

Lenni

I am not in a position to look after a very sick dog at the moment. Maybe in a few years but that is no good, therefore, I just couldnt keep him. What is killing me is all this worry when hopefully there is nothing to worry about, I keep tellin myself to wait till Friday but I cant stop thinking about it. I just no it is not gonna be something simple.

As for this question "Did you see the breeders premises? The pups parents etc? " Im affraid to answer cause you will all give out to me again. No i didnt see the premises or the parents, we just saw the rest of the litter. When we got him all the litter where there.

Beth

How did you see the rest of the litter if you didnt see the premises?

Lenni

The breeder is from Galway and we met him in Athlone, we are from Dublin. He had them all with him in a puppy cage. We got puppy advise and care off him, few days food and that. He is registered and chipped. Would I just ring the kennel club. My concern is, if we didnt want to send him back to the breeder, would someone take on a puppy who needs care. For now there is not a bother on him, not once has he had a reaction when we have touched his leg and he is always running out the back and playing away.

Lenni

You hav all been really supportive and I really appreciate it!!!

whitser

Lenni wrote: »

Hi Thalia,

That is how i feel, everytime I think of giving him back my eyes well up. I totally understand the practicality of the situation its just hard. He had the limp when we got him but it was so slight, sometimes if we had someone in the house I would mention it to them and they would think i was mad cause u could barely notice it. He is only aloud out for walks next week, so hasnt had much excercise yet, therefore when he was playing with the other dog he was just tired and the more tired he got the worse the limp was. That is how we new there was something going on. The fact that the vet said he thinks the joint in the left leg is bigger than in the right, I just dont no how they would treat that.

it all depends on the vets diagnosis. dont do anything til you find out what is wrong for sure and if its fixable. but if he's chronic hip-dis or something similar bring him back to the breeder and get your money back. the breeder has created this mess let him clean it up.
having said that it might be something that the pup will grow out of or is easily sorted.
but a life of crippling pain is no life for a dog.

whitser

Lenni wrote: »

The breeder is from Galway and we met him in Athlone, we are from Dublin. He had them all with him in a puppy cage. We got puppy advise and care off him, few days food and that. He is registered and chipped. Would I just ring the kennel club. My concern is, if we didnt want to send him back to the breeder, would someone take on a puppy who needs care. For now there is not a bother on him, not once has he had a reaction when we have touched his leg and he is always running out the back and playing away.

meeting you at the side of the road will a cage full of pups...sounds like a puppy peddler to me.

~Thalia~

Lenni wrote: »

The breeder is from Galway and we met him in Athlone, we are from Dublin. He had them all with him in a puppy cage. We got puppy advise and care off him, few days food and that. He is registered and chipped. Would I just ring the kennel club. My concern is, if we didnt want to send him back to the breeder, would someone take on a puppy who needs care. For now there is not a bother on him, not once has he had a reaction when we have touched his leg and he is always running out the back and playing away.

I'm sure you probably know this doesn't sound very good but that's neither here nor there now....

Just hang on in there till Friday and see what the vet says and I really do wish you the best of luck

Lenni

It was our first time doing this and we didnt really no that this sort of thing goes on. Whatever happens here, I will never get a dog again. I have just learned so many bad things from this. I love my pup and pls god he is ok and we get to keep him in our family but if not, he will be the last pup I get. Just feel sorry for my child too, she will b so upset.

Beth

Lenni wrote: »

The breeder is from Galway and we met him in Athlone, we are from Dublin. He had them all with him in a puppy cage.

I would agree with Whitser, sounds too dodgy to be reputable.

Lenni wrote: »

We got puppy advise and care off him, few days food and that.

But this contradicts it!

Lenni wrote: »

He is registered and chipped.

All dogs registered with the KC need to be chipped now.
but like I said earlier, registered doesnt = best bred.

Lenni wrote: »

Would I just ring the kennel club.

You can do - after the results of the xrays are in, after ringing the breeder first. You can also contact the breed club. But really, after the results are in, you should contact the breeder first and see what they have to say.

Lenni wrote: »

My concern is, if we didnt want to send him back to the breeder, would someone take on a puppy who needs care. For now there is not a bother on him, not once has he had a reaction when we have touched his leg and he is always running out the back and playing away.

Some people will, some people wont. Its the luck of the draw and knowing how to choose a good home for him.

Its good that he's not reacting or sore or in pain. It could be something minor. but if it isnt, he could get worse the older he gets. Remember, the joints wont have much weight on them while he's a puppy and they're growing for up to a year/2 years. When he's fully grown, he might be in pain because he will have so much more weight to carry on those joints if they are damaged.

Friday must seem like its next year for you. All you can do is wait. In the meantime, you could scour the internet for peoples experiences of caring for dogs with joint problems and note them, then discuss it with the family, taking into consideration all of your circumstances - financial and otherwise.

Good luck

Beth

Lenni wrote: »

It was our first time doing this and we didnt really no that this sort of thing goes on. Whatever happens here, I will never get a dog again. I have just learned so many bad things from this. I love my pup and pls god he is ok and we get to keep him in our family but if not, he will be the last pup I get. Just feel sorry for my child too, she will b so upset.

If you are in the position to get a pup again, please don't let this put you off. There are things you can do to prevent being caught by someone that isnt reputable. I've recently wrote an article about buying a puppy because its so widespread people being caught out. You are not the only one, you're not the first and you wont be the last, but dogs are fantastic companions and a great addition to the family so taking some necessary steps at the start can bring a wonderful friend to your life. Yes, you know better now so think of it as a lesson learned.

You wouldnt have to buy a puppy again, you could also go to a shelter, rescue etc and find a dog there. The rescues will do all they can to find the right dog for you - much like what a reputable breeder will do to try find the right pup in the litter for you.

Please don't let it put you off ever having a dog again, whether this puppy stays with your or goes to live elsewhere.

carwash_2006

How heartbreaking!

You might want to discuss the insurance with your vet and make sure that they will be comfortable with not mentioning that they saw this before now. If you don't disclose this and the vet sends it through on their notes - which now have to be extrememly in-depth - you could find that they won't cover you on other stuff if you try to claim even though you have been paying premiums.

Keeping fingers crossed that this is something else wrong with the pup.

carwash_2006

Actually, one other thought.

Whatever this turns out to be, it would be great if you could make a point of advertising your experiences as much as possible wherever you can. The more people that get the message that buying a dog is a serious endeavor that needs time invested in research etc. This is the sort of thing that could damage the puppy farmers pockets.

greystoke

i have a 3 year old husky, and from what i have read it doesnt look like it could be a joint problem as the puppy is so young.
We got our fella from a breader in kilkenny, saw the parents and it was the breeder that kinda interviewed us to make sure we knew what we were getting into before she would sell.

i hope everything goes well.

Lenni

Well see that is the thing, the breeder kept ringing us before hand and asking questions like, what is your house like, how many children in the house, have u a back garden, what size is it... But then a lot of things he told us ended up being cr*p...

Lenni

[IMG]file:///C:/Documents%20and%20Settings/lg08658/Temporary%20Internet%20Files/OLKD9/03092008844.jpg[/IMG]

Beth

Greystone thats the proper way to do it alright! fair play to your dogs breeder!

Lenni, sounds like the breeder did try to do a lot of things right. Was there a lot of other things the breeder told ye that wasnt correct? Like what?

it could be an inexperienced breeder trying to do things right too, but just not knowing.

Deffo ring the breeder and see what they have to say about the xrays later on when you have the results. For the cost of a phone call, it might be a valuable lesson to them as well because they might be still learning.

Yes, I always try to see the postive side.....

but trust your judgement in the end.

[Edit:] Oh my god that pup is just a complete heartbreaker!!! gorgeous

Lenni

He told us that he got the pup wormed and ears checked and also his 1st injections. I said well we wont b bringing him out till he has all injections, he then said ah no dont mind that, the 1st one is the most important. We waited anyway, but we went to the vet and they said all he had given was a temp injection, then last nite we took him to a different vets for his last set of injections and the vet said that the injections the breeder gave him were useless, a waste of time... That to me was a major error, the breeder tellin us we could bring him out when infact the injections he got were useless...

Discostuy

Ah what a beaut of a dog...no wonder you'd find it hard to give him back.

I would echo what Beth said...try not let this put you off dogs in the future.
Not everyone is aware just how bad the puppy issue is in this country. I certainly didnt realise how bad it was when i got my two. Its only since, that from spending time on here and other dog forums you realise these things.
Luckily the breeder i got mine off interviewed me and im still in contact with him, as he is interested in seeing how they are getting on. He is one of the few good ones.

The widespread image in this country is that Ireland is an animal loving country...but its far from that.

Roll on Friday...hopefully all ends well.

~Thalia~

Lenni wrote: »

[IMG]file:///C:/Documents%20and%20Settings/lg08658/Temporary%20Internet%20Files/OLKD9/03092008844.jpg[/IMG]

WOW - He's beautiful, I hope he gets on ok with the vet on Friday, please keep us updated on how he gets on.

What made you choose a husky? Although beautiful, they are very high maintenance exercise wise as adults, I hope you have a good pair of walking boots! :D

Beth

Thats a shame about the injections.
Did you get his vaccination card off the breeder? That should list what vaccination it got (the label comes off the bottle and is stuck to the card), when and most of the time, it will have noted on it when the next one is due.

greystoke

Beth

Gorgeous! I'd love one, but i've enough on my hands!!

lostinnappies

was it his hip that was bigger or was it the knee (hind leg). Sorry just jumping in here. He may have damaged his cruciate ligament in his knee.

If not, there are treatments for hip-disp. from medication if its not too sever to hip replacement ... yes they do these now, although you may have to go to the Vet college to do this. Its done in the UK.

Lenni

It is the joint in his hip. It doesn't sound like hip dis as he said it is bigger that the joint in his other leg. We'll hopefully see tomorrow. We got the vacination card off him with the stickers on it, the name of them was correct its just that they were only temp.

My BF rang the breeder 5 times yesterday and got no answer. I then text him but still no reply. My bf is gonna ring again this morn, if no ans then he will text him and say who it is, then if no contact he is ringing the KC.

andreac

Can i ask where did you find the breeder from?

whitser

Lenni wrote: »

It is the joint in his hip. It doesn't sound like hip dis as he said it is bigger that the joint in his other leg. We'll hopefully see tomorrow. We got the vacination card off him with the stickers on it, the name of them was correct its just that they were only temp.

My BF rang the breeder 5 times yesterday and got no answer. I then text him but still no reply. My bf is gonna ring again this morn, if no ans then he will text him and say who it is, then if no contact he is ringing the KC.

i dont think you'll get much joy out of that breeder,all you have is a mobile number,it'd be cheaper to get a new number then take that pup back and give you your 700 quid back. its not your fault that this has happened. i blame the breeder entirley. im sure when you met him he gave you a load of waffle about well bred,ikc reg, good parents etc.......unfortunately all he was really after was your euros. these people only interest is money, its why they breed the pups in the first place. hopefully your pup will be fine but if not dont beat yourself up over it. people get conned by these scumbags every week. i hear of people all the time handing over big money only to get a pup thats riddled with health problems.
kc wont be much help either im afraid.

~Thalia~

Lenni wrote: »

It is the joint in his hip. It doesn't sound like hip dis as he said it is bigger that the joint in his other leg. We'll hopefully see tomorrow. We got the vacination card off him with the stickers on it, the name of them was correct its just that they were only temp.

My BF rang the breeder 5 times yesterday and got no answer. I then text him but still no reply. My bf is gonna ring again this morn, if no ans then he will text him and say who it is, then if no contact he is ringing the KC.

Do you have an address for the breeder? Is he/ she listed as a breeder on the IKC website?
I'm afaird if all you have is a mobile number I'd say you are out of luck somehow.

How is the little fella today?

Lenni

Thanks Whitestar.

he is grand, there is never a bother on him, he is always in gr8 form and no bother with the leg/hip. The breeder is still not answering. How do you check the reg breeders on the IKC site. I have a few numbers to try, there is another breeder in galway i am gonna ring. Then I have a number for a lady in Kilkenny, she owns The All Ireland Siberian Husky club. I will get him even if i have to drive down to Galway and hunt for him!!! He is really p1ssin me off now.

andreac

Unless the breeder is registered with the IKC they wont have any details of him, do you have a full name and address for him?
I think Josie Foley is the contact for the Hsuky Club in Kilkenny.