Montenegro vs Ireland

darkman2 · 07-09-2008 3:40pm #1

Two injury worries at least - Given and Doyle - Hunt aswell.

Would like to see Reid in for Hunt as he is a better user of the ball. Stephen Hunt seems to be showing the same headless chicken stuff up the wing that Kilbane use to. Other then that I hope for no changes.

Im going for a score draw and we will have to play well to get that IMHO. I have a feeling the whole 90 mins will be squeaky bum time:( Still as long as we get something and just get of there I will be happy.

Wonder why Given would be injured - he did not exactly have alot to do yesterday!

Xavi6 · 07-09-2008 3:43pm

darkman2 wrote: »

Would like to see Reid in for Hunt as he is a better user of the ball. Stephen Hunt seems to be showing the same headless chicken stuff up the wing that Kilbane use to. Other then that I hope for no changes.

Terrible idea tbh.

Firstly Reid is wasted on the left and is only effective in the middle.

Secondly Hunt played quite well last night. His direct running is a nightmare for defenders and he drew a number of fouls in advanced positions. Very hard to play against him.

suckslikeafox · 07-09-2008 3:50pm

Hunt gives away the ball too much though, against a better quality team we can't afford to do that as much

SantryRed · 07-09-2008 3:55pm

I'd take a draw out of this game to be honest.

whatawaster · 07-09-2008 3:56pm

Hunt is much better coming on as an impact sub. I'd bring in Andy Reid as well. As long as McGeady gives us width on the opposite side, Reid's tendancy to come inside won't be that damaging. It will also give Kilbane room to bomb on down the left.

leninbenjamin · 07-09-2008 3:56pm

i'd prefer to see Reid in for Doyle tbh, if the fitness concerns aren't resolved. i think Hunt and McGeady were very effective defensively, far more so than Reid would be, and considering our two full backs are the wrong side of thirty i'd be reluctant to be so adventurous away from home.

darkman2 · 07-09-2008 3:58pm

suckslikeafox wrote: »

Hunt gives away the ball too much though, against a better quality team we can't afford to do that as much

+1

Xavi6 - Hunt did not pass as much as he should have last night. He was also very lucky to get away with not getting a card with some of his challenges. He is a grafter though and always gives 100% but id much prefer Reid as a calming influence able to keep the ball and play some nice passes. Hunt = impact sub tbh. I dont think we need two lightning fast wingers away from home - we should be more patient and defensively minded so we stop conceding so late.

Xavi6 · 07-09-2008 3:59pm

whatawaster wrote: »

Hunt is much better coming on as an impact sub. I'd bring in Andy Reid as well. As long as McGeady gives us width on the opposite side, Reid's tendancy to come inside won't be that damaging. It will also give Kilbane room to bomb on down the left.

A pet hate of mine is an unbalanced team and that's exactly what will happen if Reid plays on the left.

gixerfixer · 07-09-2008 4:03pm

Are Montenegro ranked higher than us in the Fifa rankings?

Mr.Nice Guy · 07-09-2008 4:06pm

I hope the injury concerns aren't too bad.

My heart says we'll nick a win. My head says it will be a draw. I just hope and pray it's not a defeat.

newballsplease · 07-09-2008 4:07pm

gixerfixer wrote: »

Are Montenegro ranked higher than us in the Fifa rankings?

not at all, there far lower in the rankings(136 in rankings), but thats only because there only recently formed as an international football team.
it used to be sebia&montenegro.

something about montenegro is, they rarely keep clean sheets, but there also well able to score goals.
if our defence play well, shay given been the brick wall that he can be, if we close up there attacking, and get them on the counter, id be happy to take a 1-0 win.
tbh any sort of win, will be a good achievement for us on wednesday. its early days but it would certainly give us an advantage over bulgaria and montenegro. i dont think cyprus or georgia will battle for 1st or 2nd place.
trapp im sure will have his homework done...here wer his experience will count for something.
1-0 to ireland

PHB · 07-09-2008 4:22pm

We need balance. However I'd be happy to see Reid and Reid in the middle, I think against Montenegro it would work. However I suspect since its an away game he'll go with Whelen and Reid in the middle, Hunt and McGeady on the wings, and if Doyle is out, Murphy up front with Keane, which to be honest I prefer.

newballsplease · 07-09-2008 4:26pm

PHB wrote: »

We need balance. However I'd be happy to see Reid and Reid in the middle, I think against Montenegro it would work. However I suspect since its an away game he'll go with Whelen and Reid in the middle, Hunt and McGeady on the wings, and if Doyle is out, Murphy up front with Keane, which to be honest I prefer.

if doyle was injured id like to see a.reid come in for him, and play him off r.keane, to me that would work brilliantly. have keane in the box, with reid supplying the defence splitting passes.

wowy · 07-09-2008 5:00pm

newballsplease wrote: »

if doyle was injured id like to see a.reid come in for him, and play him off r.keane, to me that would work brilliantly. have keane in the box, with reid supplying the defence splitting passes.

And what are the chances of Keane actually staying in the box though, and not go wandering around the halfway line looking for the ball?

Myxomatosis · 07-09-2008 5:08pm

SantryRed wrote: »

I'd take a draw out of this game to be honest.

I'd take nothing less than a win.

suckslikeafox · 07-09-2008 5:14pm

We need a win to have any chance of finishing second, its too early to be having to rely on other teams slipping up for us to go through

noodler · 07-09-2008 5:19pm

Assuming all three are injured:

Murphy for Hunt
Andy Reid for Doyle

Kiely in goal. More confidence in him than our keeper backup this time last year.

The Chessplayer · 07-09-2008 5:20pm

Get Whelan out of there and put Andy Reid back in there pronto.

newballsplease · 07-09-2008 5:30pm

wowy wrote: »

And what are the chances of Keane actually staying in the box though, and not go wandering around the halfway line looking for the ball?

thats what management is about.... getting the players to do as you want.

what i cant understand is... whelan who cant get on the stoke team is starting. lawererce who starts with stoke, isnt in the squad.
reid who has played all 3 games with sunderland this season cant get on the team, and miller who has only came on for 4 mins in one match for sunderland is ahead of reid in the pecking order......

Attractive Nun · 07-09-2008 5:47pm

To be honest, I can't really see why we wouldn't be looking to beat Montenegro fairly comfortably, even away from home.

I know, we're Ireland and we can put in some incredibly shoddy performances. And, granted I have never seen Montenegro play, so I am obviously not qualified to make that sort of statement, but still.

Aside from Vucinic, who will be the best player on the pitch probably, who have these guys got? They've a winger from Sporting Lisbon who came on as a sub the other day. They've a lad playing for a midtable Bundesliga team, and some lad from Red Star who's meant to be pretty good, but also didn't start against Bulgaria. Aside from that they're all playing for mid-table Russian teams, reasonably successful teams in various eastern European leagues, a 3rd division German team, a midtable Turkish team...

I mean, obviously there are better ways to get to know a team than on wikipedia, but even their results to date are hardly fantastic. They've beaten Hungary, Estonia, Norway and Kazakhstan, drawn with Slovenia, Hungary and Bulgaria, and lost to Japan, Colombia, Sweden and Romania. Not an awful record, but these guys have been pretty hyped up by some people, and I really don't see why we shouldn't be able to beat them.

Vokes · 07-09-2008 5:52pm

Assuming all the injuries clear up, id like to see the same eleven again.

newballsplease · 07-09-2008 5:59pm

Attractive Nun wrote: »

To be honest, I can't really see why we wouldn't be looking to beat Montenegro fairly comfortably, even away from home.

I know, we're Ireland and we can put in some incredibly shoddy performances. And, granted I have never seen Montenegro play, so I am obviously not qualified to make that sort of statement, but still.

Aside from Vucinic, who will be the best player on the pitch probably, who have these guys got? They've a winger from Sporting Lisbon who came on as a sub the other day. They've a lad playing for a midtable Bundesliga team, and some lad from Red Star who's meant to be pretty good, but also didn't start against Bulgaria. Aside from that they're all playing for mid-table Russian teams, reasonably successful teams in various eastern European leagues, a 3rd division German team, a midtable Turkish team...

I mean, obviously there are better ways to get to know a team than on wikipedia, but even their results to date are hardly fantastic. They've beaten Hungary, Estonia, Norway and Kazakhstan, drawn with Slovenia, Hungary and Bulgaria, and lost to Japan, Colombia, Sweden and Romania. Not an awful record, but these guys have been pretty hyped up by some people, and I really don't see why we shouldn't be able to beat them.

one answer for you: have you not seen Irelands away record?!:eek:

maybe your right tho. we should be looking to get a good result against them, but they will be tough i feel. you could never see Ireland hammering any team away from home. il take 1-0 to ireland.

gixerfixer · 07-09-2008 6:35pm

Just done a bit of homework on these guys and if we would be "happy" with a draw againest them we dont deserve to be at the next World cup. They are shocking. Anything but a win IMO will be a disaster

newballsplease · 07-09-2008 6:53pm

gixerfixer wrote: »

Just done a bit of homework on these guys and if we would be "happy" with a draw againest them we dont deserve to be at the next World cup. They are shocking. Anything but a win IMO will be a disaster

what homework???? they should have beat bulgaria? recently beat norway? there playing at home? we have never played them before? theyre ranking is a joke? they have a top class striker?

shane86 · 07-09-2008 7:13pm

While watching last night I tried to tell myself that a world class record breaking manager must have seen something special on the training pitch to bring on McShane and Miller but on paper these were poor, unecessary subbings. Whelan played OK, but tbh his goal was lucky and MOTM was clearly Kilbane.

We could do with Morrison right now given the possible injuries, really should be in the squad.

Seriously though, I cant recall Given in any serious clash. Which, in a way, is more worrying, as it could indicate he has pulled something re his stomach problems. Which we know from the past requires alot more attention/time off than a knock to the ankle.

flyswatter · 07-09-2008 7:45pm

Myxomatosis wrote: »

I'd take nothing less than a win.

+1

Pigman II · 07-09-2008 8:29pm

Myxomatosis wrote: »

I'd take nothing less than a win.

Agreed, and I'm confident after what I saw on Saturday that we will get it too.

joe123 · 07-09-2008 9:10pm

As bill o h said after the match its kind of depressing to see andy reid so far down the pecking order.I know you could say mcshane was a completely different position but the other two subs could of easily been for a reid to come on. He is a quality passer but would definitley unbalance the team if he was stuck out on the wing.

Either drop Glen in the center mid and play reid and reid or the formation would have to change where hunt is dropped and play 3 center mids in the two reids and glen whelan then have robbie and mcgeady as forward wingers and doyle the top striker....

OPENROAD · 07-09-2008 9:29pm

Myxomatosis wrote: »

I'd take nothing less than a win.

My worry for Ireland is that they won't take there chances, go 1 up and then let in a late goal or two, but Ireland should win this.

gosplan · 07-09-2008 9:32pm

Apparently they've a very good attacking midfield and little else so there'll probably be goals in the game.

Think Sweden are the only team to beat Montenegro at home since they started but that's only like 5 games - Bulgaria were behind till the very end though.

If we want to qualify, then we need to be going for a win. Cyprus and Georgia are the next two games and I'd love to see us on 12 points when they're done (plus we probably need to be).

Call Me Jimmy · 07-09-2008 9:35pm

The only place Andy Reid should come in is the centre, where he has all the options and can play the kind of passes nobody else in the irish team can.

LuckyLloyd · 08-09-2008 12:09am

Some of you guys crack me up. Last campaign:

2 - 5 vs Cyprus
2 - 1 vs San Marino
0 - 2 vs Czech Republic
2 - 2 vs Slovakia

Yet we should expect to beat this lot fairly handily?

Some facts:

- Montenegro's current FIFA ranking is ridiculous. It has everything to do with their recent independence and nothing to do with their relative quality;

- For new countries, cultural and sporting events tend to provide a focal point for people to come together and make a show of their nationalistic fervor. Expect the atmosphere to be EXTREMELY intimidating;

- Yeah, they were unlucky to not take all three points against Bulgaria on Saturday;

I'll be delighted with a draw.

The Volt · 08-09-2008 12:19am

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Some of you guys crack me up. Last campaign:

2 - 5 vs Cyprus
2 - 1 vs San Marino
0 - 2 vs Czech Republic
2 - 2 vs Slovakia

Yet we should expect to beat this lot fairly handily?

Some facts:

- Montenegro's current FIFA ranking is ridiculous. It has everything to do with their recent independence and nothing to do with their relative quality;

- For new countries, cultural and sporting events tend to provide a focal point for people to come together and make a show of their nationalistic fervor. Expect the atmosphere to be EXTREMELY intimidating;

- Yeah, they were unlucky to not take all three points against Bulgaria on Saturday;

I'll be delighted with a draw.

I dare say that S(a)tan couldn't have masterminded an away win against Georgia, I'm optimistic

shane86 · 08-09-2008 7:05am

Any more word on the 3 injured? None of the irish sites seem to be reporting it.

Dolph Starbeam · 08-09-2008 7:57am

Take out Hunt, move Kilbane forward instead and play Delaney at left back, Hunt must have ran into 4 or 5 players just because he had his head down so much. Fingers crossed McGeady will get in a few more crosses.

2-0 win for Ireland:pac:

Vokes · 08-09-2008 8:22am

Doyle, Hunt and Given should be fit for the game.

Republic boss wary of Montenegro

Republic of Ireland boss Giovanni Trapattoni says Saturday's opening results in his team's World Cup group show the challenges that lie ahead.

The Republic claimed an impressive 2-1 win over Georgia in the away game played at the neutral venue of Mainz.

However, Montenegro - who the Republic face on Wednesday - were unlucky to only draw 2-2 against Bulgaria while Italy sneaked a 2-1 win in Cyprus.

"I have told the players, every game is very, very dangerous," said Trapattoni.

Asked if he was surprised by the draw in Podgorica, he said: "No, because Montenegro are a good team and they have good players.

"If you look across Europe, Italy scored in the last seconds and France lost against Austria."

Zoran Filipovic's Montenegro side were only denied victory over 10-man Bulgaria at the death when substitute Blagoy Georgiev hit a late goal to snatch a 2-2 draw.

Antonio Di Natale scored Italy's late winner in the 2-1 win in Larnaca.

The Republic squad remained in Germany after Saturday's win and will head to Podgorica on Monday afternoon ahead of Wednesday's second Group Eight qualifier.

While talking up the Montenegro team, Trapattoni also praised his side's qualities.

"We should not underestimate ourselves. We shouldn't be arrogant, but we should believe in ourselves.

"We have to have heart and we have to have the right willingness and the right mentality, but we have good technique.

"We are not Brazilian, we are not Portuguese, we will stick to our style."

Trapattoni could have been forgiven for having mixed feelings over his native country's victory with the World champions the overwhelming favourites to top the group.

However, he insisted he was happy to see them win - for now, at least.

He said: "I have worked in Portugal and Austria and Germany and now I am happy working in Ireland - but I am Italian.

"It is important because I am Italian. I will be happy if they lose against us, okay, but now, no."

Asked if his side could win the group, Trapattoni urged caution.

He said: "You cannot look too far ahead. You could have injuries, red cards - there are many situations. But I think, why not? Never say never."

Shay Given, Stephen Hunt and Kevin Doyle sat out training at the Halberg Stadium in Taunusstein-Wehen on Sunday morning because of minor knocks but all three look certain to be fit for Wednesday's game.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/internationals/7603145.stm

noodler · 08-09-2008 9:47am

I wouldn't move Kilbane for an inexperienced Delaney.

This going to be tough, we have to pull it out. I only hope that, considering Andy Reid won't start, we don't NEED to bring him on for the last 20.

The Chessplayer · 08-09-2008 12:07pm

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

I'll be delighted with a draw.

Montanegro are absolutely shocking. Cobh Ramblers would probably beat them.

Anyone know if McShane claimed that o.g against Georgia? Only fair that it should be given to McShane

LuckyLloyd · 08-09-2008 12:22pm

The Chessplayer wrote: »

Montanegro are absolutely shocking. Cobh Ramblers would probably beat them.

Not your cleverest post:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mirko_Vucinic
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stevan_Joveti%C4%87
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Savo_Pavi%C4%87evi%C4%87
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simon_Vuk%C4%8Devi%C4%87

Would Cobh Ramblers be unlucky just to draw if they played the Bulgarian national team at home also? Are you stupid or just plain misinformed?

String · 08-09-2008 12:24pm

Tough game i would say and prob another 2-1 or a 1-0 win to Ireland! I hope

noodler · 08-09-2008 12:30pm

The Chessplayer wrote: »

Montanegro are absolutely shocking. Cobh Ramblers would probably beat them.

Anyone know if McShane claimed that o.g against Georgia? Only fair that it should be given to McShane

Please, oh please tell me how you came to that conclusion?

mru · 08-09-2008 12:31pm

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Not your cleverest post:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mirko_Vucinic
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stevan_Joveti%C4%87
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Savo_Pavi%C4%87evi%C4%87
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simon_Vuk%C4%8Devi%C4%87

Would Cobh Ramblers be unlucky just to draw if they played the Bulgarian national team at home also? Are you stupid or just plain misinformed?

+1

Their world ranking is a joke, they'll be handy going forward, but I'd expect us to score.

Now I may be shot down for this but here goes....I think we've got a very decent international standard defence (Dunne, Given, Finnan, Kilbane, JOS) - btw I though Kilbane looks v solid, and positionally I couldn't fault him the other night (granted it was only Georgia but you can only beat what you're up against). Whelan and Reid also played well the other night, so I think we could well shut them out. If we do, I fully expect us to create a chance or two and who knows. A draw at the very least for me. We could sneak a win though, and to be fair Tapp looks to have the lads v organised - there's a visible puspose and drive to the team (well, at least there was on Sat), so I'm optimistic. Famous last words... :rolleyes:

newballsplease · 08-09-2008 12:38pm

mru wrote: »

+1

Their world ranking is a joke, they'll be handy going forward, but I'd expect us to score.

Now I may be shot down for this but here goes....I think we've got a very decent international standard defence (Dunne, Given, Finnan, Kilbane, JOS) - btw I though Kilbane looks v solid, and positionally I couldn't fault him the other night (granted it was only Georgia but you can only beat what you're up against). Whelan and Reid also played well the other night, so I think we could well shut them out. If we do, I fully expect us to create a chance or two and who knows. A draw at the very least for me. We could sneak a win though, and to be fair Tapp looks to have the lads v organised - there's a visible puspose and drive to the team (well, at least there was on Sat), so I'm optimistic. Famous last words... :rolleyes:

why would you be shot down for that?!:)
thats fair enough to say, montenegro can score, but they can also concede quite a few.
one thing im wary about is...... they will feel they should have had a result against bulgaria the other night, there gonna be going into this game with alot more confidence plus, Montenegros next 2 games after us are against Italy, so they will be doing their dam hardest to get something against us, simply becuase they will be in fear of getting nothing against the italians.
it will be tight but i hope/pray we will beat them.
1-0 ireland.

noodler · 08-09-2008 12:38pm

Now while I agree Whelan and Reid may be our best chance of shutting them out I do not think we are a very clinical team. What I mean is I feel we need about 3 chances to score.

We didn't create 'many' chances against the Georgians but I feel we will probably need to be a little more creative to crack this lot open.

Again Ill say it, I think Andy Reid can do as much for our defence as offence by keeping the ball and keeping the opposition defence turned.

The Chessplayer · 08-09-2008 12:42pm

noodler wrote: »

Please, oh please tell me how you came to that conclusion?

McShane has worked tirelessly - he deserves that o.g. It's not fair that they credited it to the Georgian.

Lads, to be worried about Montanegro is to have the mentality of Steve Staunton. 3 points is for the taking. Don't talk to me about Bulgaria...what's so great about them?

mru · 08-09-2008 12:44pm

newballsplease wrote: »

why would you be shot down for that?!:)

just figured I might be hammered for saying Zinedine Kilbane and JOS were alright players. Dodged a bullet there...

newballsplease · 08-09-2008 12:45pm

The Chessplayer wrote: »

McShane has worked tirelessly - he deserves that o.g. It's not fair that they credited it to the Georgian.

Lads, to be worried about Montanegro is to have the mentality of Steve Staunton. 3 points is for the taking. Don't talk to me about Bulgaria...what's so great about them?

NO NO...... to be thinking Montenegro are there for the taking would be the menality of staunton.

FOR THE LAST TIME: montenegro are not as bad as everyone thinks.
do you not know Irelands away record?

mru · 08-09-2008 12:47pm

The Chessplayer wrote: »

Don't talk to me about Bulgaria...what's so great about them?

i think they're ranked joint 16th in the world rankings...we're mid 30's. we should be worried

newballsplease · 08-09-2008 12:48pm

mru wrote: »

just figured I might be hammered for saying Zinedine Kilbane and JOS were alright players. Dodged a bullet there...

ive nothing but respect for kilbane, whats he on now 49 consectutive games for his country, playing with a dodgey chin or whatever. the man is a true Ireland legend.
and i think hes finally settling into that left back role!! (hope he doesnt screw up no coz i said that)
as for JOS, hes won more medals then any other player on the team so.............

Nalz · 08-09-2008 12:51pm

If we win this game, beat Cyprus and Bulgaria at home we'll qualify imo

noodler · 08-09-2008 12:52pm

Essentially because he is happy to play in insignifcant games or insignificant periods (last 10 mins when game is already in bag) of other games.

Looked less of a Fairy than usual on Saturday tho.

Montenegro vs Ireland

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