Why buy in Ireland?

smash

I'm pricing up the lenses I'm going to get and here's how it's working out

16-35
ebay: €950
conns: €1,719

24-105
ebay: €690
conns: €999

100-400
ebay: €1,000
conns: €1,729

now there's a total difference here of €1,807 - that's crazy money... you can get another 2 lenses for that!

So why actually buy in Ireland, how are Irish shops staying in business? Are people supporting Irish shops because they're Irish or are people too lazy to look around or do they just have too much money and not enough sense?

BanzaiBk

If there's not too much of a difference (less than 200) I'll buy in a shop for peace of mind purposes, i.e. returns can be messy on the internet. I've been to places like Conns, Berminghams etc but I can honestly say I've never bought anything from them. I'd say peace of mind is one factor.

Paulw

I think there are a few reasons people buy in Ireland.

1) They don't know any better.
2) They have a fear of buying online.
3) They want to put a person to their purchase - comfort factor.
4) They want to be able to walk back in to a shop if there is a fault.
5) Sales people con them in to thinking they are getting a great deal.

Just my view.

helios

I agree with Paul, especially on point #2. Buying online, you can't physically go back to the shop if there's a problem. At least when you buy in the shops, you can bring it back, have someone look over it and give you some feedback. You also won't have to deal with return shipping, waiting...waiting...waiting... shipping back.

As for prices... I bought a 580ex II in March for €300 on eBay. €550 in the shops. Now, I'm no millionaire, but if I could afford to buy locally, I may as well just buy 2 on the internet...

Biro

The funny thing is, with some L lenses, it's cheaper to fly to the US, stay over night, buy the lens in a store, fly home than it is to buy here.

smash

I do know people who are affraid to buy online and no matter how much I say it's ok - they don't believe me... the same way I know people who could save 5k on a car by going to the uk but they don't trust it, doesn't make sense to me!

as to returning a product.... if you bring a lens back, the shop will take it, send it off, wait about 5 weeks and then tell you they've found evidence that it was dropped or something, even when it hasn't been. That's why I put all my equipment on my house insurance, with an accidental damage clause too.

Shiny

I might buy some small basic stuff in the Irish shops but I mainly shop
online. Got all my gear originally from the "Hong kong Supplies" ebay shop.

Total value was around 1900 and I got him to declare it as being worth
400. Only paid 100 duty on it then. Probably saved nearly 1000€ on what
it would have cost in Dublin easily.

Although I bought my camera bag and Tripod in that friendly shop
across from whelans, cant remember the name even though it is mentioned
nearly every day here!!! Damn memory.

smash

When you get something from a Hong Kong supplier, get them to mark the package as a repair return

I also bought my bag and tripod in a shop in Dublin... impulse purchases

Shiny

I was totally parnoid that I would get caught so I said I would rather pay that
than end up paying something silly like 4/500 in charges.

rahtkennades

You need to be sure that the ebay prices are all inclusive (this includes duty and vat!)
To be fair, there is generally an 'irish' markup on most goods these days that can't be fully explained (but usually is) by currency conversions, vat rates, cost of premises, etc.
But don't forget that a major ebay retailer could have all the kit in his garage somewhere in rural china, whereas somebody like Conns has a full unit just off one of the most expensive shopping streets in the world. That adds a lot.
Also for 'grey market' goods, the importer will source them from the cheapest supplier worldwide, whereas an Irish business has to buy through the agent or wholesaler in order to get proper warranty coverage on goods.

BTW I thought there was a ban on discussions of any way to avoid paying the full and proper duty and vat?!

FX Meister

there's a can on it? I'm vat registered and usually buy outside ireland to remove vat at source. I cant talk about that?

Shiny

rahtkennades wrote: »

BTW I thought there was a ban on discussions of any way to avoid paying the full and proper duty and vat?!

Probably. :rolleyes:

Dodgykeeper

Shiny wrote: »

Total value was around 1900 and I got him to declare it as being worth
400. Only paid 100 duty on it then. Probably saved nearly 1000€ on what
it would have cost in Dublin easily.

This is fraud plain and simple and if you were caught then it would be a lot more than the duty you would have to worry about, the double standards on this forum astound me ppl up in arms about competitions taking the right to pictures and then ppl boasting about tax evasion and downloading wink wink the latest version of lightroom! :eek:

helios

Dodgykeeper wrote: »

This is fraud plain and simple and if you were caught then it would be a lot more than the duty you would have to worry about, the double standards on this forum astound me ppl up in arms about competitions taking the right to pictures and then ppl boasting about tax evasion and downloading wink wink the latest version of lightroom! :eek:

Perhaps if the prices for all these things were resonable, people wouldn't resort to these tactics. Look at the recent post about Lightroom 2 where the US price was LESS than the Irish price! With the exchange rate these days, nothing coming from the States should be expensive.

I recently bought some new gear and the customs price was marked down from what the actual cost is. I didn't request it to be done, but that's just the way it happens. I don't have €1100 to spend on something in the shops I can get for €700 on the internet. I don't think tax evasion of any sort is good, but in principle, it's easy to see why people are getting their shipments devalued on the customs forms, indirectly or not.

Edit: I was recently in Lithuania, and I found that the prices for Canon gear, while not at eBay prices, were much more resonable than Irish prices. Reasonable enough that I would consider buying in the shops. If it can be done in the Baltics, it can be done here...

Paulw

I have paid tax on all photographs I have sold.

My version of Lightroom is fully bought and licensed. I have downloaded and installed the trial version of Lightroom 2, which I can use legally for 30 days. At that time, I hope that either Adobe revise their price scheme, or I will buy the software when I travel to the US.

I have bought camera equipment overseas and have never made any effort to import the good improperly.

Companies, especially shops in Ireland, need to be more aware of consumer power, and the fact that they can buy over seas, and save a lot of money. I have raised this issue with Adobe (logged a customer complaint case), and with Canon at a recent CPS event.

I do complain about competition rules, and I don't give away stuff for free, but I expect fair treatment when I go to buy, rather than being ripped off in Ireland.

Shiny

Dodgykeeper wrote: »

Shiny wrote: »

Total value was around 1900 and I got him to declare it as being worth
400. Only paid 100 duty on it then. Probably saved nearly 1000€ on what
it would have cost in Dublin easily.

This is fraud plain and simple and if you were caught then it would be a lot more than the duty you would have to worry about, the double standards on this forum astound me ppl up in arms about competitions taking the right to pictures and then ppl boasting about tax evasion and downloading wink wink the latest version of lightroom! :eek:

As long was everything (cameras and software) continues to be much more
expensive in Ireland I will look else where.

I would love to keep my business in Ireland but it is quite silly to pay
those prices even if it isn't the shop's fault(due to high wholesale prices).

smash

Dodgykeeper wrote: »

This is fraud plain and simple and if you were caught then it would be a lot more than the duty you would have to worry about, the double standards on this forum astound me ppl up in arms about competitions taking the right to pictures and then ppl boasting about tax evasion and downloading wink wink the latest version of lightroom! :eek:

ok well put it like this - if you're into photography and you pay Irish prices for Lightroom, CS3, 5D, CF card, 28-135, 16-35, 24-105, 100-400

how long do you think it's going to take you to make that money back by selling the pics you take when it's not a full time job for you, or even if it is a full time job?

I firmly believe that photographers, web designers, graphic designers and artists really get the short end of the stick - they're expensive industries to get into but people expect the work and results for next to nothing!

example 1:
"I'll give you €500 for a website"
"It'll take me about 70hours, I'd make more money in burger king"
"Ok I'll go elsewhere"

example 2:
"I'll give you €50 for that photo, then I'll publish it and sell 15,000 copies"
"I was up early, I was hanging around for 4 hours, it was cold and this lens cost me €150 to rent"
"take it or leave it...."

jackdaw

Biro wrote: »

The funny thing is, with some L lenses, it's cheaper to fly to the US, stay over night, buy the lens in a store, fly home than it is to buy here.

yeah .. 70-200 L f2.8 IS is €2000 in ireland..
I think i paid €1,200 on Kea ..

mehfesto2

I bought my d80, 70-300mm and 17-55mm lens', sb-600 and tripod on eBay. I paid under e950 for the lot, brand new too. At the time there was a body only d80 for sale for the same price in my local camera shop.

It's mental. At the time I was making lovely money, but I knew I wasn't going to stay in the job long, so I spent my money wisely.

Would recommend doing your homework before buying on ebay though!

challengemaster

You'd really only buy in Ireland if you were completely stupid.

After much thought on the subject, that's the only conclusion I've come up with. Goes for much more than photography gear too.

FX Meister

steve06 wrote: »

example 1:
"I'll give you €500 for a website"
"It'll take me about 70hours, I'd make more money in burger king"
"Ok I'll go elsewhere"

Mate of mine is a graphic designer and does websites in his own time. Recently he told me he was maxed out working on three at the same time. I was amazed when he said he get's €70 an hour doing them, not per website. I wouldn't call him the fastest worker but that's sweet money. The mac he uses to do them was last year christmas bonus.

hey im loking at a camera on ebay for 275 including shippingIm inexperienced with cameras and just want compact with a good zoom and some good features

so Im thinkin Olympus SP 570UZ

I can get it in Dubln city center for 550

why should i buy in Ireland? Ive been all over the city lookin! Would genuinely like to keep the business here but why should i be ripped off?

challengemaster

Deleted User wrote: »

why should i buy in Ireland? Ive been all over the city lookin! Would genuinely like to keep the business here but why should i be ripped off?

You shouldn't. When everyone in the country eventually cops on and starts out-sourcing their stuff, the Irish companies will suffer for their rip off prices. That's when they'll either have to cut their prices to something reasonable and stop making 100% profit on their goods, or go out of business and do us all a favour.

Everyone complains about the prices of things here, and does nothing about it. Just whine AFTER you pay it. This is the way to stop it. If they get no money, they can't afford to stay open. So they could be making some drastic price changes, or waving slán.

Shiny

challengemaster wrote: »

You shouldn't. When everyone in the country eventually cops on and starts out-sourcing their stuff, the Irish companies will suffer for their rip off prices. That's when they'll either have to cut their prices to something reasonable and stop making 100% profit on their goods, or go out of business and do us all a favour.

Everyone complains about the prices of things here, and does nothing about it. Just whine AFTER you pay it. This is the way to stop it. If they get no money, they can't afford to stay open. So they could be making some drastic price changes, or waving slán.

Prime example.....Jessops.
Now gone, anybody miss them?

Owen

Wasn't there a thread in here, where an open letter to Canon specifically highlighted the enormous price difference between Ireland, and Europe, for no apparent reason other than Canon upping the prices they were charging as a wholesaler to the stores?

Screw buying in Ireland. Everything's grossly inflated. I was in Poland recently, and the price of a new 40d body over there was around 1k, and there was 200 Euro cashback. The same body only in 2 shops in Cork was around the 1500 mark. Battery grip? 250 in Cork, 90 in Poland.

I empathise with Bricks and Mortar stores in Ireland charging more, but the blame lies firmly with them, and Canon/Nikon Ireland for charging more for the product here. If the body was only a hundred or two more than Europe, I'd have bought locally for backup (Backup consisting of the shop shrugging their shoulders and posting your gear back to the manufacturer), but extortion is extortion.

Arciphel

Some recent first hand experience of mine, outside of the internet this time.

Sigma 24-70mm f2.8 EX DG lens

Conns - €599
Jessops in Newry - €305

Can someone explain that one to me?

RoryW

so when you lose your job because your employer is not selling enough goods in Ireland and as a result of this and difficulties faced by other employers you are unable to get a new job and as a result have to sell your house before it is repossessed and then emigrate abroad to work, will you be thankful that you saved the few hundred euro on your camera and lens and the knock on effect that it has ?

Or maybe things wont be THAT bad, but you wont get the pay rise you FEEL you deserve as the employer cant afford as he isnt selling as much anymore.

The knock on effect is called the multiplier and simply means that for every 100 euro you spent this might be worth say 700 euro to the economy as the person you buy from buys smething to sell to you and then with his profits he pays staff and they buy things and so on and so on

If people dont pay their share of taxes that are due then they have no right to complain about the state of services in the country. If they dont like the taxes for example vote for someone else. If you dont vote then you also lose your right to complain.

And as mentioned before by others marking a new camera or lens being imported from outside the EU as a repair to obtain a reduced duty and vat liability is fraud and theft and puts you in the same category as shop lifters, bank robbers and other socially undesirables !

rant over

nilhg

Deleted User wrote: »

hey im loking at a camera on ebay for 275 including shippingIm inexperienced with cameras and just want compact with a good zoom and some good features

so Im thinkin Olympus SP 570UZ

I can get it in Dubln city center for 550

why should i buy in Ireland? Ive been all over the city lookin! Would genuinely like to keep the business here but why should i be ripped off?

To be fair if you buy it in Dublin city centre you are paying for convenience, service and a certain feel good factor that if something goes wrong you have a person to look after you. If these things are not of any value to you then are you not lucky you have another option?

Arciphel wrote: »

Some recent first hand experience of mine, outside of the internet this time.

Sigma 24-70mm f2.8 EX DG lens

Conns - €599
Jessops in Newry - €305

Can someone explain that one to me?

Dublin city centre V Newry explains a lot of the cost, Irish VAT some more.

Arciphel

I think greed explains a lot more.

RoryW

RoryW wrote: »

so when you lose your job because your employer is not selling enough goods in Ireland and as a result of this and difficulties faced by other employers you are unable to get a new job and as a result have to sell your house before it is repossessed and then emigrate abroad to work, will you be thankful that you saved the few hundred euro on your camera and lens and the knock on effect that it has ?

No more likely to lose your job because your company cant compete because of wage inflation here DRIVEN by high prices (including high mortgage costs

nilhg

nilhg wrote: »

To be fair if you buy it in Dublin city centre you are paying for convenience, service and a certain feel good factor that if something goes wrong you have a person to look after you. If these things are not of any value to you then are you not lucky you have another option?

I was in a shop on the Champs Elysee or however its spelt in Paris and (VAT is less) it was still signicantly cheaper not for the Olympus for but a Fuji S5600 I think was the model. (115€ in Paris, cheapest I cant find even outside of Dublin city center is 170€)