Whateverford

djScarey

I passed through Waterford and stayed overnight near the Quay. The place seemed dead with only random tourists and a chav or two knocking about. A Scottish pipe band and dance troupe were performing on the Quay to a handful of people (and a dog). Granted it was a week-night (Monday), but I have stayed years ago in Waterford on Monday nights and felt it was more bustling and thriving. The traffic was mostly passing through to other locations, without stopping. (Sadly?) I missed the presence of the Freewheeler bikes and the local mod scooters flying up and down or parked on the Quay-at least that gave some indication one was in Waterford. There also were far more locals about back then. A barman told me that parking restrictions was keeping everyone out of the centre. Comments????

KingLoser

"Wasterford" is another nice way of putting it...

Trotter

KingLoser wrote: »

"Wasterford" is another nice way of putting it...

I most certainly have noticed an increase in skobie wasters wandering the town in the last year. I mean if you stroll around the city centre now, its a horrible place to be.

Sad.. because I have so many good memories about Waterford city centre. I avoid it like the plague now. Bring on the shopping centres well away from the city centre. That or the council should have an immediate rejuvenation mission kick off for the centre.

2nd option won't happen so roll on the Dundrum of Waterford.

Skobies Skobies Skobies... Out Out Out!! Boy.

:D:p

merlante

Trotter wrote: »

I most certainly have noticed an increase in skobie wasters wandering the town in the last year. I mean if you stroll around the city centre now, its a horrible place to be.

Sad.. because I have so many good memories about Waterford city centre. I avoid it like the plague now. Bring on the shopping centres well away from the city centre. That or the council should have an immediate rejuvenation mission kick off for the centre.

2nd option won't happen so roll on the Dundrum of Waterford.

Skobies Skobies Skobies... Out Out Out!! Boy.

:D:p

I wouldn't agree with that. I live in the city centre and walk around at night from time to time. More foreigners than anything else, which makes the place a lot safer than it would otherwise be.

BBM77

Trotter wrote: »

Bring on the shopping centres well away from the city centre. That or the council should have an immediate rejuvenation mission kick off for the centre.

2nd option won't happen so roll on the Dundrum of Waterford.

Skobies Skobies Skobies... Out Out Out!! Boy.

:D:p

Intelligent assessment Trotter, that will really solve everything :mad:

Nolanger

Trotter wrote: »

2nd option won't happen so roll on the Dundrum of Waterford.

You mean a shopping centre consisting almost exclusively of expensive clothing and jewellery shops that has a train to bring shoppers to the centre so that they can avoid the surrounding run-down area?

magick

well ive always found the center on a week night fairly safe and quiet but i dont think the city center was ready for the the pedestration of the city.

Many other cites that have walk ways usually have more cafes, bars etc But im sure the local businness's are feeling the pinch now.

Trotter

Ballybrickenman wrote: »

Intelligent assessment Trotter, that will really solve everything :mad:

I wasn't really intending to provide a fully intelligent assessment. It was light hearted.

Har Har Har.

So if you want serious, here goes. The city centre no longer holds any appeal for me and my preference, which is as valid as anyone's, is to spend my money in an out of city centre retail centre.

Sin é.

Not The Real Scarecrow

I used to live in the centre a few years ago and from the way I see the town now , I'm glad I don't anymore.Nothing against the people in the town or anything, I just think it has slipped a bit over the last 5 years or so.I used to feel safe going for walks oon the quay or anywhere in the town a few yearsback, but not so much now.I don't even enjoy going in to do the occasional shopping spree.To me the town I knew is gone.I hope someday it comes back, because Waterford has great potential and the majority of people living here are nice and genuine, unlike other towns I have lived in.

mike65

I enter the cente of town once in a blue moon or when I need to get film processed, there is always some 'vagrant' sat on the concrete bench outside Sam McCauleys. The Barronstrand looks Soviet to my eyes, the shop fronts are scruffy which allied to the grey vista makes the whole area look like a place worth avoiding.

It needs to say "welcome" but it doesn't.

Mike.

Trotter

Nolanger wrote: »

You mean a shopping centre consisting almost exclusively of expensive clothing and jewellery shops that has a train to bring shoppers to the centre so that they can avoid the surrounding run-down area?

Thats quite a socialist way of looking at it I don't think the motivation for building the centre and the luas stop there was to help the elite avoid the poor man.

Its an area where there was a huge market for a shopping centre. I certainly wouldn't describe the surrounding area as run-down. The Dundrum, Rathfarnham, Stillorgan areas are as far from run-down as you get really.

mike65 wrote: »

there is always some 'vagrant' sat on the concrete bench outside Sam McCauleys.

Just beside the "information centre".. the million euro metal bus stop. Except that bus stops have information on them.

Sully

Trotter wrote: »

Just beside the "information centre".. the million euro metal bus stop. Except that bus stops have information on them.

What a waste of;
- Money
- Space
- Time
- Metal
- Technology
- etc.

At least the Spire in Dublin is good to look at.. kinda.

mike65

Some joker has made this thread of the day.

Mike.

Bubble19

Im from Waterford and theres alot more to see beyond the Quay in the city... So id recommend looking outside the city if you wnat to have a bita craic!

dazftw

Was walking past that big bus stop yoke awhile ago and me and my firends were talking about how its some waste and it looks terrible, an old man stopped us and started giving out saying its about time Waterford was given this sort of thing to rival New York City and Paris. I said were not rivaling anything just making ourselves look stupid.

Red Square in my eyes is fine im use to it but god to other people it must be terrible. Beggers, Scangers, Spanish People(play bloody rubgy in the middle of the place) Drunken People its crazy. There Tarmacing all off o connell st now btw. Thats one street that need to be fixed.

stick-dan

Sully wrote: »

At least the Spire in Dublin is good to look at.. kinda.

It's amazing how some people can miss that thing :P

Cabaal

dazftw wrote: »

Was walking past that big bus stop yoke awhile ago and me and my firends were talking about how its some waste and it looks terrible, an old man stopped us and started giving out saying its about time Waterford was given this sort of thing to rival New York City and Paris. I said were not rivaling anything just making ourselves look stupid.
.

dazftw stop stealing my posts
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55818449&postcount=3

Posted 01-05-2008

That "thing" certainly does, or as the person who I presume designed it so rudely put it to me and the gf as we passed it when they were building it...."Waterford deserves this, its not just Paris & New York that should have structures like this"

echosound

Bubble19 wrote: »

Im from Waterford and theres alot more to see beyond the Quay in the city... So id recommend looking outside the city if you wnat to have a bita craic!

But therein lies the problem - people tend to stick to the outer reaches of the city and avoid the city centre. I've lived slap bang in the city centre for a number of years, and have moved out to the burbs.

While I was living in the centre, I'd have no qualms about walking home from a late shift at 2am, and enjoyed the atmosphere in the centre, day or night. Now, I tend to avoid the city centre proper if at all possible, as it's gone very grim and depressing, with little to offer in the way of shopping, eating out, shockingly awful nightlife etc (this is IMO BTW, just think there was more happening years ago, and more of a variety too).
Of course this is a vicious circle as the less people willing to go into the centre, the less incentive there is for businesses to locate there instead of further out, where more people will go due to ease of parking etc.

I wouldn't consider going into the centre after about 9pm, as anytime I have, I've seen nothing but scumbags having fights and barfing outside pubs. There has been a total change in the type of people you find hanging around in the city centre too. It's a far less friendly place.

It's a huge pity, as when I was living away from Waterford for a number of years, I looked forward to visiting as often as possible, and had a big grin on my face when I'd be coming across the bridge and see the familiar vista of the quay, and thought there wasn't a nicer town or city in Ireland, both in terms of aesthetics and the people here. I decided to move back as I missed it so much, and I'm sorry to see it going the way it is now. It's losing the identity that I loved. Nowadays, most of my time is spent in the outer reaches of the city, be that shopping or working or whatever, and it's rare that I'd have cause to be in the city centre, which is a huge pity, as until a few years ago, even if I didn't have cause, I'd still go in as often as possible, just to enjoy the atmosphere there.

magick

well , as for the city center, its always been dead at weeknights because of the services/shops around the area are closed so no one has a incentive to go there in the first place.

Also that black marble water fountain thingy its just horrible, im sorry but somewhere ,somehow ,someone has got to put a stop to all this "Modern" art that littering the county, it looks like something from 2001 Space Odyssey (which back up my theory about scumbags being attracted to it).

Ok so if u need to go into the center of town u need an incentive, ie buying something, but most of the shops have the same old stock for months, and i can find what im looking for online and probably cheaper too!

Cabaal

magick wrote: »

well , as for the city center, its always been dead at weeknights because of the services/shops around the area are closed so no one has a incentive to go there in the first place.

Thing is Kilkenny has pubs and alot of the same shops but it doesn't die a death every weekday evening at 5.30/6.00 like Waterford center does...to be honest its very concerning.

Also that black marble water fountain thingy its just horrible, im sorry but somewhere ,somehow ,someone has got to put a stop to all this "Modern" art that littering the county, it looks like something from 2001 Space Odyssey (which back up my theory about scumbags being attracted to it).

hmm that actually makes sense :pac::pac:

Ok so if u need to go into the center of town u need an incentive, ie buying something, but most of the shops have the same old stock for months, and i can find what im looking for online and probably cheaper too!

I think its just waterford is made up of more students etc so alot of trhe events in waterford in the evenings appear to revolve around drink and drinking,

I've always believed waterford needs some late night cafes but for these to work alot of the "drink culture" has to go as people falling around the place and cafes don't go together very well.

In relation to the city center, well I've lived in various places around Waterford over the years and I've never found the far end of town up near the bridge (O'Connell street etc)very safe...or atleast its felt that way

Otherwise its been fine but then again I'll walk most places without worrying too much

Trotter

Think of what JR Square would be like with loads of cafes and seating in the square with a normal looking fountain in the middle. It'd be lovely! Thats what you have in Brussels, Krakow, Ypres, (3 that come to mind) and its so chilled out and relaxed. Theres a fantastic atmosphere.

Instead we have the council here building a metal goalpost, a willy lookalike, and seating thats skobie friendly.

Roll on the local elections because I'm going to give the councillors a roasting at my door.

paddy1mac

A trip to Cardiff to see the Cardiff Bay development would be recommended to anyone who wants to see what our Quay should look like - it fantastic there

have a look at this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CwNWf7oTJjk

BBM77

Trotter wrote: »

I wasn't really intending to provide a fully intelligent assessment. It was light hearted.

Har Har Har.

So if you want serious, here goes. The city centre no longer holds any appeal for me and my preference, which is as valid as anyone's, is to spend my money in an out of city centre retail centre.

Sin é.

You are certainly entitled to your opinion. But do you not expect that allowing a shopping centre such as the one on the Airport Road will multiply the problems that the city centre is experiencing by 20 times. You will not hear me auguring with anybody that the city centre is not up to scratch, though I don’t think it is as bad as some people make out. As you say the “appeal” of the city centre has declined over the pasted decade. It drives me mad that a city the size of Waterford has such a town like offering of shops in its city centre. For example, I would love a big HMV to root around in for an hour looking for an old album I am looking for.

Personally I think the city council has a lot to answer for. I tell you there is going to be strong words when these councillors come to my door next year.

But back to the point. In a matter such as retail the greater good has to override all other points of view. It will be far more beneficial to Waterford city as a whole for comparison retail to be kept in the city centre. It has been shown all over the world that out of town shopping centres cause huge problem in a short space of time.

I am not pointing my finger at you Trotter, I do not know you so I cannot comment on your lifestyle. But let’s face it, when you really think about it the supporters of out of town shopping are just lazy. They do not want to walk the length of a few streets shopping in the city centre. That is no grounds to plan a city on.

Marcus.Aurelius

I was in Waterford for years, but I can't stand the place now. THe traffic is so bad, I end up being late for meetings in Ballybricken, even though I leave with 45 minutes to spare on top of an hour allowed for Wexford to Waterford.

The city has an attitude attached to it, sort of a "empathetic meh" feeling. Waterford has ridiculous aspirations, or no aspirations. There's no middle ground of plain civic pride and a desire to fix what's already there, rather than creating more problems.

Sully

Traffic is only bad if you dont know how to get around it

Marcus.Aurelius

Sully wrote: »

Traffic is only bad if you dont know how to get around it

I know what you mean, but when you're coming in from Ferrybank or Sallypark, you're usually screwed.

Coming from the cork road back to the bridge can be fine if you take an alternative route.

Sully

Avoid coming from Ferrybank and just take a right at the traffic lights, up by the golf club, back down to the Dublin road and in the opposite way. Saves time when traffic is heavy!

alpha2zulu

when you really think about it the supporters of out of town shopping are just lazy. They do not want to walk the length of a few streets shopping in the city centre.

Not true I would say. Perhaps its the case that people do not want to pay hefty parking charges for the preivelege of spending money, and being threatened with a 40 euro fine for being a few minutes late back to the car.
Last week for instance having parked up and then finding i had no change on me for the meter, I just headed out to the Superquinn centre instead for lunch.

Personally I think the city council has a lot to answer for. I tell you there is going to be strong words when these councillors come to my door next year

ballybrickenman, i agree with you completely there, the whole council seems like a bit of a jolly boys club, same guys in there for the last umpteen years, making sure everybody gets a go of the Mayoral chains at least once:mad: Unfortuently I'm outside the Waterford electoral area (up the cats!!) so can't vent my anger at the canvassers:D

dazftw

Cabaal wrote: »

dazftw stop stealing my posts
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55818449&postcount=3

Posted 01-05-2008

haha weird an old man actually said that to me and my firends :eek:

magick

dazftw wrote: »

haha weird an old man actually said that to me and my firends :eek:

well just goes to show his pride !

imagine on every travel channel in the world...."vist the world great cities...Rome..Paris...Tokyo....Waterford(yes boiiii) "

Trotter

Ballybrickenman wrote: »

But let’s face it, when you really think about it the supporters of out of town shopping are just lazy. They do not want to walk the length of a few streets shopping in the city centre. That is no grounds to plan a city on.

And I was just about to say I saw a lot of merit in your opinion.

Call the person with 3 kids who needs to buy something lazy just because its not supportive to the city centre retail?
To generalise and call everyone who lives outside the city lazy for not wanting to drive into the city to buy something???

I'm not from the city, neither do I want to be in the city, or to spend time in the city as it is.. because its full of the kind of people I wouldn't want my kids near, derelict buildings, and bad smells.

Therefore.. I'd like a retail centre near where I live. Id like it to be clean, vibrant, with lots of parking, places to eat, a good atmosphere and easily accessible. I won't ask you to be lazy and use the facility that suits me personally, and I won't use the city centre as it suits you. I won't even brand you and anyone that agrees you in a derogatory manner.

I have respect for people's opinions, until they call a vast population lazy. (Which I find personally to be a little offensive).

djScarey

Some very good contributions on here. Perhaps the City Fathers have rezoned the Town Centre as a suburb, without telling anyone???

BBM77

Trotter wrote: »

And I was just about to say I saw a lot of merit in your opinion.

Call the person with 3 kids who needs to buy something lazy just because its not supportive to the city centre retail?
To generalise and call everyone who lives outside the city lazy for not wanting to drive into the city to buy something???

I did not call everybody who lives outside the city centre lazy. I said “the supporters of out of town shopping are just lazy”. I’m sorry but wanting shopping centres on the outskirts which is based on the fact that you drive to them and minimize the walking you do even though all the experience of other cities is that they are destructive is selfish and lazy.

I'm not from the city, neither do I want to be in the city, or to spend time in the city as it is.. because its full of the kind of people I wouldn't want my kids near, derelict buildings, and bad smells.

As I said I am not in disagreement with you about the condition of the city centre. But like with anything in life you try and fix the problem. You do not do something that will make the problem worse and create more problems down the line, especially when you know what to expect from that course of action.

Therefore.. I'd like a retail centre near where I live. Id like it to be clean, vibrant, with lots of parking, places to eat, a good atmosphere and easily accessible. I won't ask you to be lazy and use the facility that suits me personally, and I won't use the city centre as it suits you. I won't even brand you and anyone that agrees you in a derogatory manner.

See this is exactly the kind of thing I am talking about when I criticize people who support out of town shopping centres. There is no problem with parking in the city centre. Railway sq, The Glen and New St are never full. The problem in these people’s eyes is that you cannot drive around and park outside every shop, you have to walk and again I’m sorry but that is lazy and not reason to allow a shopping centre on the outskirts of the city.

I have respect for people's opinions, until they call a vast population lazy. (Which I find personally to be a little offensive).

You are exaggerating the mood of what I said; I am not trying to insult anybody. But it is fact that people are living more sedentary lifestyles and cars with car based developments is a major cause of this. It is hardly an attempt to insult by quoting a proven fact.

RxQueen

Sully wrote: »

Avoid coming from Ferrybank and just take a right at the traffic lights, up by the golf club, back down to the Dublin road and in the opposite way. Saves time when traffic is heavy!

doesnt really tbh , not when the schools are back in Spetember! and the traffic coming in the Sally Park way at six in the the evenings is terrible. Sucks having to come over the bridge:rolleyes:

Trotter

Ballybrickenman wrote: »

You're quoting your own opinion as fact. What gives you the right to call me lazy when you assume my motivation is to walk less when I shop?

You're wrong on that. You wish the city to be a vibrant place.. fine. I still don't understand why you think I should go into the city centre to shop, when I don't live near it.

I utterly disagree with your points, and I think they're based on you curtailing the choices of people whose rights are just as valid as yours.

Cabaal

emo!! wrote: »

doesnt really tbh , not when the schools are back in Spetember! and the traffic coming in the Sally Park way at six in the the evenings is terrible. Sucks having to come over the bridge:rolleyes:

Indeed it does, I've stopped coming over it and now go via Fiddown Bridge...much faster imho

ec18

Out of town shopping has a lot of advantages compared with having to go into town to go shopping. There's usually FREE parking provided and the range of shops is usually better and they are better maintained because they are all indoors and there is a noticeable effort to maintain that appearance.

Indoor shopping centres are much better suited to the changeable Irish weather. As there's no chance of you getting wet bar having to run to the car. There is never anyone around there drinking cans and no possibility of fights. And the place is a lot cleaner then the city centre will ever be.

Now the city centre shopping, for a start there is a horrible selection of shops, especially for means clothing. The place is generally dirty and the selection of places to go for food isn't great. I personally travel to the Dundrum centre or cork whenever I'm looking for clothes or just a look around shops. It only takes 5 Minutes to visit the shops I'm interested in Waterford. Maybe if the NewGate Centre gets the go ahead and shops actually occupy the spaces some people might stay in the city for shopping. But atm there's no incentive to do that. Or in my case I'm struggling to find reasons to stay in Waterford at all!!

damo

I grew up right in the heart of waterford city and my family still lives there. I gotta say i hate the place. For a start the social scene/nightlife is complete garbage, with geoffs being just about the only place you dont get at least a few knackers. The city centre by day and by night, is full of scumbags and alcoholics. My family home is a 2 minute walk from city square shopping centre, and some genius opened up a homeless centre right beside it. The result? Alcoholics begging/drinking/fighting outside city square every single day. Great planning went into that one.

90% of my friends left waterford after school never to return (like me). Its just a dead end town.

P.S

The only good looking girls in waterford are the foreign ones.

BBM77

Trotter wrote: »

You're quoting your own opinion as fact. What gives you the right to call me lazy when you assume my motivation is to walk less when I shop?

You're wrong on that. You wish the city to be a vibrant place.. fine. I still don't understand why you think I should go into the city centre to shop, when I don't live near it.

I utterly disagree with your points, and I think they're based on you curtailing the choices of people whose rights are just as valid as yours.

No I am quoting fact to back up my opinion.

Why would I want to curtail peoples choice, I live in Waterford to.

My opinion on retail has been proven to be sustainable yours has been proven to be destructive. Out of town shopping centres are banned or severely restricted in many countries in Europe. The same European countries with cities Waterford people visit and suggest Waterford should aspire to. This is the reason they are so nice to visit. You are ignoring the experience of cities that have gone through what Waterford is going through now and have seen the damage that allowing out of town shopping centres do to a city. I find that a very selfish attitude.

Trotter

Ballybrickenman wrote: »

I find that a very selfish attitude.

I'm lazy and selfish.. Mother in Law, is that you???

robtri

Waterford is starting to go through a phase that a lot of cities worldwide go through, it is the doughnut effect.....
basically as a city builds up over time around the centre, the centre is the vibrant place to be, but as land prices and rents rise and don't forget planning with this, people start to move out slightly as they cannot afford to have places in the centre so a ring of retail starts to form around the centre, over a period of time the centre becomes quiet and the ring around it is where all the traffic and people are now at...... so hope fully people will take note and waterford city council will help to re-develop and promote the city centre and keep it a vibrant lively place...
Thats my 2 cents worth