Taxi's and Port Tunnel

MrDylan

Does anyone know why some Taxi drivers aren't happy about using the Port tunnel when doing fares from the Airport to Town?

Have heard of 3 cases of this in the last two weeks. I thought you couldn't refuse a fare within reason. Using the tunnel doesn't sound unreasonable. I know at certain times it can mean a cheaper fare for the passenger but then the driver is freed up to do more work.

Wishbone Ash

MrDylan wrote: »

Does anyone know why some Taxi drivers are happy about using the Port tunnel when doing fares from the Airport to Town?

Have heard of 3 cases of this in the last two weeks. I thought you couldn't refuse a fare within reason. Using the tunnel doesn't sound unreasonable. I know at certain times it can mean a cheaper fare for the passenger but then the driver is freed up to do more work.

Presumably you meant 'unhappy'!

The customer has to fund the toll so I can't see why they don't want to go there (unless they have a phobia about tunnels).

Badabing

I have used it alot recently and find it great, i don't mind at all using it.

Victor

If there is congestion in town, the meter goes over to time, not distance.

bazzer

Strange indeed. When it comes to other road users, the majority of those wa.... emmmm, taxi drivers ironically have 'tunnel vision'. :cool:

Stark

Maybe they're worried about the return trip (where the customer wouldn't be paying the toll).

Nothingcompares

what is the fare going from airport to city centre (let's say trinity college) from airport at 9am via port tunnel? i'd say it be less than 20 on the meter not using tunnel. the tunnel toll is 15 at that time?

Wishbone Ash

Nothingcompares wrote: »

what is the fare going from airport to city centre (let's say trinity college) from airport at 9am via port tunnel? i'd say it be less than 20 on the meter not using tunnel

It would be way more than that. It can be almost €10 before leaving the airport vicinity!

Nothingcompares wrote:

the tunnel toll is 15 at that time?

€12

1huge1

Do taxi's and buses have to pay the full rate for the tunnel, would be handy if they got a discount (though im sure double decker buses wouldnt fit in the tunnel, sorry havent much experience with the tunnel...)

Bluetonic

1huge1 wrote: »

Do taxi's and buses have to pay the full rate for the tunnel, would be handy if they got a discount (though im sure double decker buses wouldnt fit in the tunnel, sorry havent much experience with the tunnel...)

Why would it be 'handy' if taxis got a discount?

Wishbone Ash

1huge1 wrote: »

Do taxi's and buses have to pay the full rate for the tunnel, would be handy if they got a discount (though im sure double decker buses wouldnt fit in the tunnel, sorry havent much experience with the tunnel...)

Buses with more than 24(?) passengers are exempt from paying the toll.

Double deckers do fit - and many trucks are taller than double deck buses.

A bus operator on a scheduled route may only use the DPT if they are licenced for that route.

RuggieBear

i'd like it if taxis were exempt from the toll when transporting passengers...it is a public service.

Takes me 15mins from Ballsbridge to Airport using the tunnel.

1huge1

RuggieBear wrote: »

i'd like it if taxis were exempt from the toll when transporting passengers...it is a public service.

Takes me 15mins from Ballsbridge to Airport using the tunnel.

Yes that was my point, thanks for the info guys.

wayne2107

Takes me 15mins from Ballsbridge to Airport using the tunnel

What time of the day would this be, and what route would you take from Ballsbridge? I work for Fedex I use the tunnell/east link coming out of the airport every morning and returning again in the evening, 30 mins sounds more realistic from Ballsbridge. Ive been doing it since the tunnell opened and Ive never achieved 15 mins from Ballsbridge to airport..

RuggieBear

last time was 6.30am on a friday.

Up bath ave....over toll bridge.... into tunnel.

monument

RuggieBear wrote: »

i'd like it if taxis were exempt from the toll when transporting passengers...it is a public service...

Why exactly should a taxi with one or more people be exempt when cars carrying the same have to pay?

And I'm still unsure why they are allowed to use bus lanes.

Victor

monument wrote: »

Why exactly should a taxi with one or more people be exempt when cars carrying the same have to pay?

Agreed.

And I'm still unsure why they are allowed to use bus lanes.

Because the government decided to let them. This might have been fine when there was 3,000 taxis, but I saw a taxi number in excess of 40,000 recently.

RuggieBear

i see it as public transport...with a very high fare.

I can live without owning a car as i can get buses/trains for most of my journeys and get the occasional taxi for those that i can't.

By giving taxi some of these privileges it encourages me not to add to the gridlock by getting my own car and using it for pointless little trips which public transport can accommodate.

That's just how i see it.

Victor

Stark wrote: »

Maybe they're worried about the return trip (where the customer wouldn't be paying the toll).

they don't have to take the tunnel back.

1huge1 wrote: »

Do taxi's and buses have to pay the full rate for the tunnel, would be handy if they got a discount (though im sure double decker buses wouldnt fit in the tunnel, sorry havent much experience with the tunnel...)

Tunnel nominal height 4.95m
Tunnel operational height 4.65m
Typical double decker bus 4.45m

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

Buses with more than 24(?) passengers are exempt from paying the toll.

They just need to have that many seats fitted, no minimum number of passengers

Terrontress

Could you imagine the number of people would register their private cars as taxis if they could use the bus lane and the port tunnel for free?

On another matter above, at least if taxis can use the bus lane, it keeps the fare down for passengers. Some times in traffic taxis need to be encouraged to use them!

Wishbone Ash

Victor wrote: »

hey just need to have that many seats fitted, no minimum number of passengers

I wondered about that Victor. Somehow I just couldn't see the girl at the booth straining her neck to see how many passengers were on board!

John R

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

I wondered about that Victor. Somehow I just couldn't see the girl at the booth straining her neck to see how many passengers were on board!

Can't see her straining to count seats either, mind. I guess that anything that looks like a bus rather than a van with seats would be ok.

delly

Victor wrote: »

Because the government decided to let them. This might have been fine when there was 3,000 taxis, but I saw a taxi number in excess of 40,000 recently.

Is that not country wide tho', as opposed to the county only?

Ham'nd'egger

delly wrote: »

Is that not country wide tho', as opposed to the county only?

They are numbered nationally now, lowest number is 10001. Taxi's in the 40,000s means that we have at least circa 30,000 on the roads. Almost all taxis are concentrated in areas that had taxis pre 2006 as the local markets didn't allow drivers to licence a taxi; those that used hackneys have stuck with same.

pvt.joker

bazzer wrote: »

Strange indeed. When it comes to other road users, the majority of those ****.... emmmm, taxi drivers ironically have 'tunnel vision'. :cool:

well said bazzer

Fighting Irish

RuggieBear wrote: »

i'd like it if taxis were exempt from the toll when transporting passengers...it is a public service.

Takes me 15mins from Ballsbridge to Airport using the tunnel.

i agree but you still have to consider the return journey, or would taxis with no passengers be exempt as well?

Ham'nd'egger

Fighting Irish wrote: »

i agree but you still have to consider the return journey, or would taxis with no passengers be exempt as well?

Speaking as a taxi driver, if I was returning from a drop off via the Port Tunnel, I'd not want to travel back via it as there is no potential passengers to pick up en route regardless of the toll. I only use it if a passenger asks for it due to it's price which a passenger has to pay for (As indeed I would for the East and West Link) and I can't say I know of any guys who would use it for the sake of it, especially at their own expense.

Spook_ie

RuggieBear wrote: »

i see it as public transport...with a very high fare.

I can live without owning a car as i can get buses/trains for most of my journeys and get the occasional taxi for those that i can't.

By giving taxi some of these privileges it encourages me not to add to the gridlock by getting my own car and using it for pointless little trips which public transport can accommodate.

That's just how i see it.

Public transport is exactly what it is, wether you consider the fare too high or not is another question, but this Public Transport does have a better record for being on time ( at least my customers think so:) ) and does do door to door, wonder what Dublin Bus would charge for a similar service?

Fratton Fred

considering the relatively light amount of traffic that goes through the tunnel, I think it would be an excellent idea to let taxis use it free of charge, providing they have a fare on board, or even the minimum €3 charge at all times rather than just weekends and after 10pm.

Terrontress

I'd definitely stump up for a taxi license then for my missus and I travelling to work in Donnybrook from Donabate each day. She could be the passenger. Use bus lanes and tunnel the whole way. Hopefully they would make the East Link free too. Weekly train ticket is €25, times 2 is €50. €2.5k per year. Free road tax on a taxi as well as free tunnel. It would pay off the costs in no time and you'd have a quick journey into town. And if you're skint, go out and work a few taxi hours.

Wishbone Ash

John R wrote: »

Can't see her straining to count seats either, mind. I guess that anything that looks like a bus rather than a van with seats would be ok.

Are the number of seats not written on the driver's door/window?

Terrontress wrote:

Free road tax on a taxi as well

Taxis are obliged to pay the commercial motor tax rate. If the vehicle is also used privately, then the normal motor tax rate is applicable.

monument

RuggieBear wrote: »

i see it as public transport...with a very high fare.

I can live without owning a car as i can get buses/trains for most of my journeys and get the occasional taxi for those that i can't.

By giving taxi some of these privileges it encourages me not to add to the gridlock by getting my own car and using it for pointless little trips which public transport can accommodate.

That's just how i see it.

The thing is, when you or others want or have to do such you should be treated like car users who want to have to do such.

The idea behind buses getting to go for free in the tunnel (and having bus lanes etc) is giving concessions to bulk carrying* public transport, not just public transport.

(* as said above this is done by seat numbers, not the amount of people on board)

Ham'nd'egger

Terrontress wrote: »

I'd definitely stump up for a taxi license then for my missus and I travelling to work in Donnybrook from Donabate each day. She could be the passenger. Use bus lanes and tunnel the whole way. Hopefully they would make the East Link free too. Weekly train ticket is €25, times 2 is €50. €2.5k per year. Free road tax on a taxi as well as free tunnel. It would pay off the costs in no time and you'd have a quick journey into town. And if you're skint, go out and work a few taxi hours.

Have you a PSV licence to allow you to drive a taxi were you to do this?:)

Capri

Took my cousin from Donnybrook to the Airport via EastLink and PortTunnel, 14.30 on a Friday. Drove back via Drumcondra / Matt Talbot bridge / Leeson St. 4mins and .75km in the difference! Not worth paying €6 -€12 extra on taxi fare for ?

Terrontress

Hamndegger wrote: »

Have you a PSV licence to allow you to drive a taxi were you to do this?:)

No, I don't although I understand, from reading here, that it is remarkably easy to get one. You can buy the answers for the test in the Herald, pay someone else to sit it for you or else pretend to be from a minority and get a lowered pass rate.

Then all I need is a banger, a meter and a roof sign and I am good to go.

As for the road tax issue, I'm sure that not all taxi drivers use their car for taxi work alone. There must be loads of people who ferry their family around and don't inform the authorities. And if I have my missus in the passenger seat, I am taxiing. Meter will show the maximum fare. I will offer a 100% discount to my number one customer.

It's an idea that can't fail. The only drawback I can think of is the increased insurance. But I'll get rid of my current car, just use the banger.

That and the fact that taxis won't get free port tunnel.

Ham'nd'egger

To give a flat fare, you would need your wife to sign a waiver every time she travels with you or you can sue her for non payment if the meter is running Oh, and you won't be able to speak to her as she has the right to a "quiet journey"

Terrontress wrote: »

No, I don't although I understand, from reading here, that it is remarkably easy to get one. You can buy the answers for the test in the Herald, pay someone else to sit it for you or else pretend to be from a minority and get a lowered pass rate.

Then all I need is a banger, a meter and a roof sign and I am good to go.

As for the road tax issue, I'm sure that not all taxi drivers use their car for taxi work alone. There must be loads of people who ferry their family around and don't inform the authorities. And if I have my missus in the passenger seat, I am taxiing. Meter will show the maximum fare. I will offer a 100% discount to my number one customer.

It's an idea that can't fail. The only drawback I can think of is the increased insurance. But I'll get rid of my current car, just use the banger.

That and the fact that taxis won't get free port tunnel.

Terrontress

I'd say she'd love an enforced quiet journey and she could fill in the waiver on the way in to work.

If you get to the end of a journey, it's 10.50 and the taxi driver says "make it a tenner" does that require a waiver?

Ham'nd'egger

Terrontress wrote: »

I'd say she'd love an enforced quiet journey and she could fill in the waiver on the way in to work.

If you get to the end of a journey, it's 10.50 and the taxi driver says "make it a tenner" does that require a waiver?

No but it does requires a discount to be written onto the receipt as indeed does a tip. Equally, if the meter says €10.10 and €10 is charged and the 10 cent omitted, the receipt must show same or a driver risks a fixed fine. The waiver covers your absolving the legal obligation of a taxi driver to charge you as per the meter but it then puts into place the obligation to agree to a fixed fare prior to commencement of a trip.

Victor

Hamndegger wrote: »

Oh, and you won't be able to speak to her as she has the right to a "quiet journey"

Have her drive.

loyatemu

going back to the issue of the tolls - they still haven't got the pricing right...

I went to the airport yesterday, €3 each way via the tunnel (+ 2 eastlink tolls). It was virtually empty - a handful of cars and literally no lorries. Meanwhile Drumcondra and the City centre were probably quite busy.

There's no point spending ~€1billion on a tunnel and then having it lying virtually idle. It should be €1 on bank holidays and in the middle of the night, if not free.

Oh - and our good friends the Gardai had the speed gun out at the southern entrance - good work there guys, I'm sure thats a real accident blackspot (not too mention the fact that the tunnel has it's own cameras).

Ham'nd'egger

loyatemu wrote: »

going back to the issue of the tolls - they still haven't got the pricing right...

I went to the airport yesterday, €3 each way via the tunnel (+ 2 eastlink tolls). It was virtually empty - a handful of cars and literally no lorries. Meanwhile Drumcondra and the City centre were probably quite busy.

There's no point spending ~€1billion on a tunnel and then having it lying virtually idle. It should be €1 on bank holidays and in the middle of the night, if not free.

Oh - and our good friends the Gardai had the speed gun out at the southern entrance - good work there guys, I'm sure thats a real accident blackspot (not too mention the fact that the tunnel has it's own cameras).

But here is the thing; the tunnel is intended for trucks and large vehicles to access the port quickly and is deliberately tolled high to help keep cars and small vans out of it. Lower the tolls and you fill it with cars and the trucks can't exit the port quickly. The tunnel is discounted at night and weekends but the truth is that the tunnel isn't much use unless you are traveling to the Port or IFSC or towards the east suburbs so discounting further it doesn't do a lot.

As for the speed cameras, I can tell you that I have used the tunnel and have been passed out by trucks many a time when I have been doing over 100 (It's an 80 zone) so don't say the guns aren't needed.

Victor

loyatemu wrote: »

There's no point spending ~€1billion on a tunnel and then having it lying virtually idle. It should be €1 on bank holidays and in the middle of the night, if not free.

Whatever about midnight on a bank holiday, there is a huge advantage to truckers and others that they know the tunnel will be uncongested.

Also, if it was full, people would be saying it needs to be widened.

Oh - and our good friends the Gardai had the speed gun out at the southern entrance - good work there guys, I'm sure thats a real accident blackspot (not too mention the fact that the tunnel has it's own cameras).

The tunnel cameras can't be used for issuing fines.

loyatemu

the tunnel will be uncongested in the middle of the night even if it is free, it would then save people time and petrol and make the streets of Dublin safer. there has to be a point between full and congested at which we are making use of the tunnel that we have spent a billion euros on. The current toll structure suggests they haven't found that point.

as for the speed check - can anyone seriously suggest that the run-in to the tunnel is a accident blackspot. Apart from the fact that hardly anyone uses it, theres no pedestrians or cyclists and its fully segregated. The reason they were there is because its a big road with a 50km/h limit on it and therefore easy pickings.

markpb

Victor wrote: »

Whatever about midnight on a bank holiday, there is a huge advantage to truckers and others that they know the tunnel will be uncongested.

I think the main reason they're so careful to limit the numbers of vehicles in the tunnel is to do with the HVAC system. If memory serves the operating limit for the HVAC is lower than the operating limit for the tunnel. I could be horribly wrong though, heard that ages ago from a guy who claimed to work for the company that installed the system.

Victor wrote: »

The tunnel cameras can't be used for issuing fines.

Apparently they have been measuring the speed through the tunnel (end to end rather than at any one point) and so many vehicles were over the limit that they're examining the possibility of using them to issue fines.

Victor

loyatemu wrote: »

as for the speed check - can anyone seriously suggest that the run-in to the tunnel is a accident blackspot. Apart from the fact that hardly anyone uses it, theres no pedestrians or cyclists and its fully segregated. The reason they were there is because its a big road with a 50km/h limit on it and therefore easy pickings.

The problem is the severity of an accident in a tunnel is much greater than one on an ordinary road, so I think your "easy pickings" is akin to a cheaters charter.

Fratton Fred

If the toll charges fitted in with ferry arrivals and departures then i could understand it, but they just seem to be there to maximise revenue.

There's no point having it free at night though, its never bloody open when I try and use it and if it is, drivers need an e-toll because the booths are unmanned half the time.

I know its for lorries and buses, but it is criminally under utilised which is why i think allowing taxis to use it foc would be a good idea. get them off the main routes and save their passengers a couple of quid on fares or tolls.

I also think that anyone driving to or from a ferry should get a vastly reduced rate as well. maybe this could be ordered at the time of booking or given out on the ferry.

RuggieBear

Fratton Fred wrote: »

If the toll charges fitted in with ferry arrivals and departures then i could understand it, but they just seem to be there to maximise revenue.

There's no point having it free at night though, its never bloody open when I try and use it and if it is, drivers need an e-toll because the booths are unmanned half the time.

I know its for lorries and buses, but it is criminally under utilised which is why i think allowing taxis to use it foc would be a good idea. get them off the main routes and save their passengers a couple of quid on fares or tolls.

I also think that anyone driving to or from a ferry should get a vastly reduced rate as well. maybe this could be ordered at the time of booking or given out on the ferry.

i heard a rumour that it was closed at weekend nights due to joy riding....that could be complete BS by the way.