Buying a new PC, thoughts?

Karl Hungus

Right, I've been in fairly dire need of a new PC for some time now. I've decided that I'll be going for a prebuilt, and I was looking at overclockers.co.uk, where this one caught my eye.

Now, I wanted to run it by you guys to see if you think there's something that might suit my needs better, or if there's any alternatives. I'll lay it out as best I can, so you can get a good idea of my needs in a PC.

This is going to be gaming/multimedia PC, as best I can describe it, I'll want to play Diablo III, Farcry 2, and other new and upcoming games at tip-top performance, so a powerful graphics card and lots of RAM would be an absolute requirement, and a fast hard drive like a raptor would be a big plus. So, fast and powerful would be the thing to take away here.
I'll also need plenty of storage space, I have a large music collection as well as a lot of backed up DVDs, so a second drive with a 1TB capacity would be what I'm looking for. This wouldn't have to be a fast drive like the Raptor, as I wouldn't be running any programs off it.
I'd like something with a BluRay player, and a DVD/CD burner if possible.
Good sound card is also something I'd like, as I run a surround sound setup.

Right, I hope that covers it all, so thanks in advance for any help.

AlmightyCushion

What's your budget? What size monitor will you be using? Do you already have the monitor or need/want a new one.

You could do a lot better by buying from hardwareversand. German site and very good value for money. You could get a much better spec (especially seeing as you don't want a raptor drive and the oc pc has one wasting a couple of hundred quid) on there for the price of that pc on overclockers.

Karl Hungus

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

What's your budget? What size monitor will you be using? Do you already have the monitor or need/want a new one.

Lets say a budget of €2000, and yes I already have the monitor I want, it's a 21" LCD.

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

You could do a lot better by buying from hardwareversand. German site and very good value for money. You could get a much better spec (especially seeing as you don't want a raptor drive and the oc pc has one wasting a couple of hundred quid) on there for the price of that pc on overclockers.

I do want a raptor drive, I'm just saying that the second drive that I'll have for storage doesn't have to be anything fast, I'll want size rather than performance for that one.

AlmightyCushion

€2000? I wish I had that money to blow on a pc. You could get a horse of a pc on hardwareversand for that money. I'll spec something up now. With that money I'd upgrade to a 24" monitor, if I was you.

I kinda realised that raptor bit after I posted, I just read your post wrong.

Karl Hungus

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

€2000? I wish I had that money to blow on a pc. You could get a horse of a pc on hardwareversand for that money. I'll spec something up now. With that money I'd upgrade to a 24" monitor, if I was you.

I kinda realised that raptor bit after I posted, I just read your post wrong.

Well, the €2000 figure is just something I came up with off the top of my head, if I can get something that'll suit my needs for a lot less, then grand.

A new monitor could definitely be on the cards at some stage, I had thought about getting a widescreen one before, but that's not a big need right now and I want to get the PC sorted before I think about anything else.

AlmightyCushion

If you've got the money to burn then I'd ditch the velociraptor drive and get an ssd drive for your windows/applications. That will speed up things a lot e.g. boot times/load time in games/application opening time etc.

Edit: Hardwareversand don't have the ocz drives or the mtron mobis. They are both meant to be great ssd drives. Of course you could always buy it elsewhere and install it yourself. It wouldn't be that much hassle.

Karl Hungus

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

If you've got the money to burn then I'd ditch the velociraptor drive and get an ssd drive for your windows/applications. That will speed up things a lot e.g. boot times/load time in games/application opening time etc.

I wouldn't say money to burn exactly, I just gave that figure as a maximum. Can you link me to a good SSD drive so?

I'm browsing the hardwareversand.de site, and I don't see any prebuilts, so am I missing it, or is it simply a case of picking out the components in the PC configurator section? In which case, I'm not entirely sure what components I should be going for, so would you have any recommendations are regards to Graphics, CPU, Mainboard, RAM and that?

Thanks for your feedback so far, I hope it's not too much bother.

AlmightyCushion

Karl Hungus wrote: »

I wouldn't say money to burn exactly, I just gave that figure as a maximum. Can you link me to a good SSD drive so?

There's a thread in building and upgrading about the ocz drive. I'll try and find it.

Edit: OCZ thread: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055323805

Karl Hungus wrote: »

I'm browsing the hardwareversand.de site, and I don't see any prebuilts, so am I missing it, or is it simply a case of picking out the components in the PC configurator section? In which case, I'm not entirely sure what components I should be going for, so would you have any recommendations are regards to Graphics, CPU, Mainboard, RAM and that?

Thanks for your feedback so far, I hope it's not too much bother.

Yup you select the components then towards the end you tick a box that says "PC Assembly" and they will build it for you. If you buy the ssd somewhere else you'll have to install windows on it. If you haven't done it before then it's not that hard and I really wouldn't let that put you off.

The image I have attached is a horse. You could even save money but going with a q6600 for the processor and a 4850 as the graphics card (pick the cheapest one on there). The 4870 would be overkill at 21" monitor but I put it in, in case you do decide to upgrade your monitor.

You don't really need to bother with a sound card. The on board sound has gotten excellent in recent years. You'll need to buy a keyboard somewhere else as hwv only have german keyboards.

And it's no bother doing this. The worst part about it is not hitting the checkout button.

Moved from Comp and Tech.

Karl Hungus

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

Yup you select the components then towards the end you tick a box that says "PC Assembly" and they will build it for you. If you buy the ssd somewhere else you'll have to install windows on it. If you haven't done it before then it's not that hard and I really wouldn't let that put you off.

I've built quite a few PCs from scratch myself, so it's no bother at all, but I think I'll just go for the 300GB Raptor. It should be good.

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

The image I have attached is a horse. You could even save money but going with a q6600 for the processor and a 4850 as the graphics card (pick the cheapest one on there). The 4870 would be overkill at 21" monitor but I put it in, in case you do decide to upgrade your monitor.

Thanks man!

The graphics card is one area I do not want to skimp on, even if it's not something I'm going to get full use of right away. So, out of curiosity, how would you rate the GeForce GTX in comparison to the ATI Radeon you've selected?

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

You don't really need to bother with a sound card. The on board sound has gotten excellent in recent years. You'll need to buy a keyboard somewhere else as hwv only have german keyboards.

Hmm, are you absolutely sure about that? I guess I would feel a lot more comfortable with a dedicated soundcard, especially considering my surround setup.

Got a good keyboard already with no plans to replace it, so no biggie there.

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

And it's no bother doing this. The worst part about it is not hitting the checkout button.

Moved from Comp and Tech.

kk, thanks for all your efforts.

AlmightyCushion

Karl Hungus wrote: »

I've built quite a few PCs from scratch myself, so it's no bother at all, but I think I'll just go for the 300GB Raptor. It should be good.

Ah you're sorted so.

Karl Hungus wrote: »

The graphics card is one area I do not want to skimp on, even if it's not something I'm going to get full use of right away. So, out of curiosity, how would you rate the GeForce GTX in comparison to the ATI Radeon you've selected?

The new nvidia cards are pretty poor value for money compared to the ati cards. The 260gtx and the 4870 are similar performance wise despite the 260gtx being a lot more expensive.

Karl Hungus wrote: »

Hmm, are you absolutely sure about that? I guess I would feel a lot more comfortable with a dedicated soundcard, especially considering my surround setup.

Yeah but if you do want to go with a sound card don't get a creative. They still haven't sorted out vista drivers so you won't get the full functionality of the card. Get an asus zonar if you must they are meant to be good, personally I wouldn't bother though (I don't think hwv have that either).

One thing about the build I specced up is that I don't really know what's a good cpu cooler, I just picked that one because it looked impressive and was relatively expensive, it could be rubbish. There are more knowledgeable people here who will easily tell you the best cooler to get, so I'd wait till they get make a recommendation before buying.

Karl Hungus

I won't be buying just yet, so there's no rush.

Anti

Oh thank god you have decided not to buy from overclockers. Everytime i order from them they mess something up or cause hassle. Ignorant customer service reps, giving a refund into the wrong account. Showing stock which actually isnt. Refusing RMA's and telling you to go direct to the manufacturer. Poorly packaged..erm packages to list just a few. Oh and there there is the stupid shipping fees and how they calculate tax wrongly untill you hit the last page and realise your 380€ item is now 460€ !

[/rant]

HArdwareversand have some amazing prices because of their tax difference. Only daunting part of buying from them is that you have to use a direct bank transfer !

Karl Hungus

Yeah, the prices on overclockers does seem a wee bit steep, and thanks for the heads up on those issues Anti, I had used them in the past and found them to be good, but this was a good few years ago. If I can get better bang for my buck with hardwareversand and you guys recommend it, then I'll go that route.

Karl Hungus

Ok, little bit of a hitch here now, I'm trying to configure a build with the components AC suggested, and including a WD Velociraptor 300GB, but it doesn't seem available to me in the selection. If it's incompatible with the mainboard, then can you advise an alternative?

Otherwise, would it be worth going for an SSD drive? I would ideally like a decent sized fast hard drive to run a number of games from, so I'd probably be looking at a 128gb SSD if that's the case. Worth it?

Anti

Yeah its by far the best option at the moment.

Anti

Karl Hungus wrote: »

Ok, little bit of a hitch here now, I'm trying to configure a build with the components AC suggested, and including a WD Velociraptor 300GB, but it doesn't seem available to me in the selection. If it's incompatible with the mainboard, then can you advise an alternative?

Otherwise, would it be worth going for an SSD drive? I would ideally like a decent sized fast hard drive to run a number of games from, so I'd probably be looking at a 128gb SSD if that's the case. Worth it?

No not really, id go with a few 500gb Spinpoints, or even 1tb drives. The 300gb VR is quick alright, same with the SSD's but from reading around they dont seem to be living upto expectations, needing firmware flashes and the likes.

Karl Hungus

Looking at this thread at the moment, and watching the video of the OCZ performance against 2 Velociraptors, it does seem like it's definitely the one to go for performance wise.

Looking at the 128gb one on dabs, would there be a better recommendation price wise?

Anti

Really depends how much of your budget you want to blow just to be able to load a game a few seconds faster, or transfer files from one pc to another. But then you will run in to hard drive caching speed problems are your wireless will not be able to sustain the datarate unless you have a N router.

Karl Hungus

So perhaps just go for a velociraptor 300GB now? If so, what compatability issues are there with the build that AC has outlined?

Anti

None that i can see, its all compatible.

Karl Hungus

Hmm, so why isn't it coming up in the PC Configurator?

Anti

Not sure to be honest. Could just buy it seperate.

AlmightyCushion

Oddly enough their monitors don't show up on the configamajic either. Must be a glitch with it or something.

PogMoThoin

2x Samsung f1 Sata's in raid is faster and cheaper than a velociraptor. They're the ones with the 32MB cache available in 750GB and 1TB. Raid 1 will give you mirroring but will read in stripe therefore giving you the same read speed as raid 0. Here and here, €109 for 1TB, thats 11cents per GB, now thats value for money.

Karl Hungus

Ok, still pondering some of the finer details, got a couple more questions.

Is it wise to get them to assemble the PC, does it increase the risk of being damaged during shipping, or am I being paranoid?

Could someone recommend a good graphics card?

uglyjohn

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

Yeah but if you do want to go with a sound card don't get a creative. They still haven't sorted out vista drivers so you won't get the full functionality of the card. Get an asus zonar if you must they are meant to be good, personally I wouldn't bother though (I don't think hwv have that either).

correct me if im wrong, but dont the 4850 and 4870 have onbord 7.1 sound?
if so there there would be no point in getting another sound card.

Rsaeire

uglyjohn wrote: »

correct me if im wrong, but dont the 4850 and 4870 have onbord 7.1 sound?
if so there there would be no point in getting another sound card.

As far as I am aware the 7.1 sound can only be output over HDMI which may, or may not, be an issue for the OP depending on what they are hooking it up to.

Cuddlesworth

I thought they were limited to 5.1 over HDMI.

Rsaeire

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

I thought they were limited to 5.1 over HDMI.

The 48xx series can do 7.1 and the 3xxx series can do 5.1.

(look toward the bottom of both pages for the information).

Karl Hungus

Hmm, I've been looking at the AuzenTech X-FI Prelude 7.1, and from the reviews I've read, it seems to be very good. Any thoughts on this one?

As far as what I'm connecting to, at the moment it's a 5.1 system, but I could upgrade that at a later date.

AlmightyCushion

That shares a lot og components with the creative sound cards. Creative still haven't released vista drivers for their current range of cards meaning that you can't use a lot of features under vista. I'd say you'll have the same problem with the auzentech.

Karl Hungus

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

That shares a lot og components with the creative sound cards. Creative still haven't released vista drivers for their current range of cards meaning that you can't use a lot of features under vista. I'd say you'll have the same problem with the auzentech.

Yeah, it seems they do use the same drivers alright. Damnit.

This is tricky, I've had problems with Creative's drivers before when using XP, so that's something I definitely want to avoid on this PC, and there doesn't seem to be much choice on hardwareversand either.

AlmightyCushion

There's the asus xonar range but last I checked hardwareversand don't have them.

Karl Hungus

Would you have any reviews of the Asus Xonar cards you could link me to? I don't mind ordering the components seperately.

Rsaeire

Karl Hungus wrote: »

Would you have any reviews of the Asus Xonar cards you could link me to? I don't mind ordering the components seperately.

Here are reviews for both the Asus Xonar DX and Asus Xonar D2X.

Karl Hungus

Thanks Rsaeire, reading those now.

I'm still wondering if it's advisible to have hardwareversand assemble the components for me?

AlmightyCushion

Save yourself the €20. You've built pcs before so there's no real point.

Karl Hungus

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

Save yourself the €20. You've built pcs before so there's no real point.

Well for the sake of €20 I wouldn't mind the convenience, but would there be any concerns of shipping a fully build PC over well packaged components?

Oh, and I think I've made my mind up about the Sound Card, I'll go ahead and order the PC without one, and then get one at a later stage if I feel the onboard sound isn't up to scratch. After all, it's not exactly an essential component.

Anyway, thanks for your help AC, it's really appreciated.

While I'm at it, what's your opinion on this monitor?

AlmightyCushion

Karl Hungus wrote: »

Well for the sake of €20 I wouldn't mind the convenience, but would there be any concerns of shipping a fully build PC over well packaged components?

I can't imagine there is seeing as the likes of dell ship about 80 billion pcs a day.

Karl Hungus wrote: »

Anyway, thanks for your help AC, it's really appreciated.

No problem, man. Just glad I can help.

Karl Hungus wrote: »

While I'm at it, what's your opinion on this monitor?

Looks quite nice. The built in camera and microphone would come in handy if you use the likes of skype a lot (or if you're one of those cam sluts). The usb hub is handy as well because you can never have to many usb ports. Everything else about it looks good.

Karl Hungus

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

I can't imagine there is seeing as the likes of dell ship about 80 billion pcs a day.

Fair enough.

The usb hub is handy as well because you can never have to many usb ports.

Don't I know it! I was thinking of converting my current machine to one giant USB hub. :pac: