CIE set for Pay & display

Little-Devil

I'm not suire if this is the right place so please move.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2008/0717/rail.html

Personally i think this is a disgrace and just another plan from CIE to get more money :mad:

goldfish

Typical Iarnrod Eireann - yet again not offering value for money. On top of having to be herded into a train carraige like sardines each morning with no air conditioning, they now expect payment for 1) Something that's been free up to now (to encourage commuters to use public transport) and 2) Full up by 07:30 each morning (Coolmine station on Maynooth/Longford Line). If IE were adding value (additional carriages/perhaps a seat the odd time) I would not have a major issue. The biggest losers here are going to be the housing estates surrounding the train stations, where people will just park for free.

Ham'nd'egger

goldfish wrote: »

Typical Iarnrod Eireann - yet again not offering value for money.

I defy you to find paid parking in the city centre for €2 a day.

Tipsy Mac

Hamndegger wrote: »

I defy you to find paid parking in the city centre for €2 a day.

I defy you to find city centre parking at any train station

The only CIE parking in the city centre is the free parking offered to CIE employees who ironically all have free travel on CIE buses and trains.

fitzyshea

This has been on the cards for a long time. I commute from Carlow and the carpark there is shocking bad, massive pot holes in it. I hope they intend on doing up the carpark before they start charging!

Run_to_da_hills

Little-Devil wrote: »

I'm not suire if this is the right place so please move.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2008/0717/rail.html

Personally i think this is a disgrace and just another plan from CIE to get more money :mad:

I think this is a good thing because it will keep the locals from using it as a daytime overflow carpark.

markpb

Tipsy Mac wrote: »

I defy you to find city centre parking at any train station

Heuston and Connolly both have public car parking :P

I think some serious questions need to be asked. Why are Irish Rail charging for car parking? Is it because they'll be providing secured, managed car parks and accept liability? Is it to increase revenue for their transport operations? Is is because someone at the top hates passengers and want to discourage them from using the train?

If it's to raise money for operations, people need to start asking their local FF TDs why Irish Rail are short of money. What are the government doing to increase subvention?

If it's to provide proper car parking, people need to ask their FF TDs why the ROC has to pay for what should arguably be a local authority issue. People are going to park somewhere and either the LA provides a proper car park at the train station or they'll park on the side of the road.

Ham'nd'egger

markpb wrote: »

Heuston and Connolly both have public car parking :P

I think some serious questions need to be asked. Why are Irish Rail charging for car parking? Is it because they'll be providing secured, managed car parks and accept liability? Is it to increase revenue for their transport operations? Is is because someone at the top hates passengers and want to discourage them from using the train?

If it's to raise money for operations, people need to start asking their local FF TDs why Irish Rail are short of money. What are the government doing to increase subvention?

If it's to provide proper car parking, people need to ask their FF TDs why the ROC has to pay for what should arguably be a local authority issue. People are going to park somewhere and either the LA provides a proper car park at the train station or they'll park on the side of the road.

There was a precedence set when LUAS were allowed to charge for parking at stops; I'd imagine that has much to do with it.

keefg

Seems like another reason for people not to use public transport and use their cars.


OK, as one poster has pointed out 2 euro a day is cheap compared to city centre parking......but.......how long do you think it will stay at this price?

With a private parking management firm raking in two thirds of the revenue from this nice little earner it wont be long before the parking rates increase.


Also, a little bit off topic but seeing as someone mentioned the Luas in an earlier post.......For the price it costs to park at the Red Cow stop and the return ticket price to and from the city centre....I can drive into Dublin, park up and go about my business and drive home in comfort and still have enough money left over for a sandwich & drink.

On the occasions where I have to spend the entire day in town it may cost me 5-6 more euro than it would getting the Luas but I would rather pay that than sit in a hot, cramped, overcrowded glass tube.

This government needs to do a hell of a lot more to improve the public transport system in this country (not just Dublin) before it will pursuade a lot of drivers to give up their cars.

Introducing additional parking cost might just drive (sorry about the pun) more commuters to use their cars.

daheff

Tipsy Mac wrote: »

I defy you to find city centre parking at any train station

The only CIE parking in the city centre is the free parking offered to CIE employees who ironically all have free travel on CIE buses and trains.

My girlfriend and I get the train in. With the extra parking charge it is almost as cheap to drive to heuston and park there every day (€7 for the day) and walk to the city centre. At least that way we would always get a seat!!!

A lot of people that drive to train stations have no choice (due to stations being outside of towns / unpredicatability of trains meaning people miss feeder buses for these stations). This is just another way of increasing the fare.

Barry Kenny says that charging for car parking won't significantly reduce the amount of people using commuter transport...true...but only because people dont have any choices.

government need to decide if they want people to use commuter transport or not. If they do then stop trying to make it as expensive as they possibly can (through whatever hidden stealth charges they can find).

Ham'nd'egger

keefg wrote: »

Seems like another reason for people not to use public transport and use their cars.


OK, as one poster has pointed out 2 euro a day is cheap compared to city centre parking......but.......how long do you think it will stay at this price?

With a private parking management firm raking in two thirds of the revenue from this nice little earner it wont be long before the parking rates increase.


Also, a little bit off topic but seeing as someone mentioned the Luas in an earlier post.......For the price it costs to park at the Red Cow stop and the return ticket price to and from the city centre....I can drive into Dublin, park up and go about my business and drive home in comfort and still have enough money left over for a sandwich & drink.

On the occasions where I have to spend the entire day in town it may cost me 5-6 more euro than it would getting the Luas but I would rather pay that than sit in a hot, cramped, overcrowded glass tube.

This government needs to do a hell of a lot more to improve the public transport system in this country (not just Dublin) before it will pursuade a lot of drivers to give up their cars.

Introducing additional parking cost might just drive (sorry about the pun) more commuters to use their cars.

LUAS from Sandyford/Tallaght to town is €4.10 return. A day's parking at a LUAS stop is €4; that means the most you pay is €8.10 for a day, including travel on the LUAS. City centre on street parking is circa €2.70 per hour; pay for 3 hours (Most paid parking areas allow 3 hours max and you have paid exactly €8.10 on parking alone. Some off street parking costs over €3 per hour.

I'd love to know where you buy your sandwiches;)

HonalD

keefg wrote: »

Seems like another reason for people not to use public transport and use their cars.


OK, as one poster has pointed out 2 euro a day is cheap compared to city centre parking......but.......how long do you think it will stay at this price?

With a private parking management firm raking in two thirds of the revenue from this nice little earner it wont be long before the parking rates increase.


Also, a little bit off topic but seeing as someone mentioned the Luas in an earlier post.......For the price it costs to park at the Red Cow stop and the return ticket price to and from the city centre....I can drive into Dublin, park up and go about my business and drive home in comfort and still have enough money left over for a sandwich & drink.

On the occasions where I have to spend the entire day in town it may cost me 5-6 more euro than it would getting the Luas but I would rather pay that than sit in a hot, cramped, overcrowded glass tube.

This government needs to do a hell of a lot more to improve the public transport system in this country (not just Dublin) before it will pursuade a lot of drivers to give up their cars.

Introducing additional parking cost might just drive (sorry about the pun) more commuters to use their cars.

Something tells me that you are gone beyond wanting to be "pursuaded" - If the Park and Ride was free and the ticket free........would you re-consider sitting in a "hot, cramped, overcrowded glass tube."................maybe, maybe not, but I'm sure there would be complaint that every dog in the street uses it so why should I?

The whole public transport debate is about Choice, you have a choice (as you pointed out) and you've made your choice SO i don't think the Government (or the Romans) can do much more for those who have chosen.................:)

daheff

markpb wrote: »

Heuston and Connolly both have public car parking :P

I think some serious questions need to be asked. Why are Irish Rail charging for car parking? Is it because they'll be providing secured, managed car parks and accept liability?

Irish rail (or the company running the parking) wont accept any responsibility/liability.

Ham'nd'egger

daheff wrote: »

My girlfriend and I get the train in. With the extra parking charge it is almost as cheap to drive to heuston and park there every day (€7 for the day) and walk to the city centre. At least that way we would always get a seat!!!

Worth looking at this lil beauty if you use it daily

http://www.parkmagic.net/

goldfish

fitzyshea wrote: »

This has been on the cards for a long time. I commute from Carlow and the carpark there is shocking bad, massive pot holes in it. I hope they intend on doing up the carpark before they start charging!

Quite from RTE "CIÉ says that the revenue it collects from commuters will be reinvested in parking spaces". The question is: how long do we end up paying for something that we're apparently going to receive at somepoint in the future. Smacks of another Semi-state, the DAA and T2

Fratton Fred

All the roads near Dun Laoghaire Rathdown Dart stations have been pay and display now for months (Maybe over a year). I'm not sure how the people who live on those roads get on, I presume they get a permit. What it means is the best parking spots are now not right outside the station, they are 500 metres away where parking is free.

keefg

Hamndegger wrote: »

LUAS from Sandyford/Tallaght to town is €4.10 return. A day's parking at a LUAS stop is €4; that means the most you pay is €8.10 for a day, including travel on the LUAS. City centre on street parking is circa €2.70 per hour; pay for 3 hours (Most paid parking areas allow 3 hours max and you have paid exactly €8.10 on parking alone. Some off street parking costs over €3 per hour.

I'd love to know where you buy your sandwiches;)

OK, maybe I was being optamistic with the sandwich comment (at Dublin prices anyway)

However, I was in town (Golden Lane) on Tuesday from 9am until 4pm and it cost me 10 euro for the days parking.

I was able to park at the location instead of trudging accross from Abbey St. with my laptop bag and camera equipment. Much more comfortable and less stressfull than public transport as it is at the moment.

So, like I said, I would rather pay the extra few euro and drive until there is a cheap alternative that will actually get me where I want to go.

godtabh

markpb wrote: »

Why are Irish Rail charging for car parking? Is it because they'll be providing secured, managed car parks and accept liability? Is it to increase revenue for their transport operations? Is is because someone at the top hates passengers and want to discourage them from using the train?

I think you would be hard pressed to find any car park in Ireland that will accept liability.

Its a serviced contract were the operator runs the car park for IR and charge the customers a few for the pleasure. IR get €1m year year out of the deal till 2011.

I dont see how 8 euros a week would discourage passengers using the rail. If the aleternative to the rail is driving the increase in costs is going to be a lot more.

markpb wrote: »

If it's to raise money for operations, people need to start asking their local FF TDs why Irish Rail are short of money. What are the government doing to increase subvention?

What's the problem with raising money for operations? If it provides a better surevice then why not? IR will never be on the top of the list for goverment handouts and if alternative revenue streams present themselfs they should go for it.

markpb wrote: »

If it's to provide proper car parking, people need to ask their FF TDs why the ROC has to pay for what should arguably be a local authority issue. People are going to park somewhere and either the LA provides a proper car park at the train station or they'll park on the side of the road.

Why should the local authority provide parking for some thing that has nothing to do with them? You wouldnt expect the LA to provide parking for a housing development would you?

If they park on the side of the road thats a Garda issue and upto them to inforce it.

I've used the car park at Louisa Bridge to get the train to work for awhile.

I then moved to Louisa Bridge so I've expericned both paying for parking and people not paying for parking. I think its something that should be done.

keefg

HonalD wrote: »

Something tells me that you are gone beyond wanting to be "pursuaded" - If the Park and Ride was free and the ticket free........would you re-consider sitting in a "hot, cramped, overcrowded glass tube."................maybe, maybe not, but I'm sure there would be complaint that every dog in the street uses it so why should I?

The whole public transport debate is about Choice, you have a choice (as you pointed out) and you've made your choice SO i don't think the Government (or the Romans) can do much more for those who have chosen.................:)

I disagree. It is exactly the governments fault for the poor public transport situation across the entire country.

These are the "people" who collect 100 of millions in taxes from us and we entrust them to spend it as efficiently as possible on our behalf.

Who else should we blame for our poor transport network? The farmers? Drug dealers?


As for my comments about the Luas.....you are right, I have made my choice to drive instead of use it because it (IMO ) is a sham.

It created years of misery for motorists whilst it was being built.
It is overpriced.
It us uncomfortable and seriously overcrowded at peak times.
It doesn't even meet up at the terminals so you can change lines!!

I have no problem using public transport as long as it is cheap and efficient. I worked in Holland and Germany for years and I would always use the train/tram/bus when I was there because it was more efficient than driving. Same goes when I visit London or New York.

Why can't we get it right here? I dunno....you would have to ask the government.

Back on topic, my point was that any regular commuter who are on the fence about what is the best option for them (Car or PT) might be pushed into switching to driving their car as this the added cost of parking (which will increase) rules out PT as a viable option.

astrofool

Blackrock dart car park has been pay and display for a good while now also. (€5 for the day)

Ham'nd'egger

keefg wrote: »

OK, maybe I was being optamistic with the sandwich comment (at Dublin prices anyway)

However, I was in town (Golden Lane) on Tuesday from 9am until 4pm and it cost me 10 euro for the days parking.

I was able to park at the location instead of trudging accross from Abbey St. with my laptop bag and camera equipment. Much more comfortable and less stressfull than public transport as it is at the moment.

So, like I said, I would rather pay the extra few euro and drive until there is a cheap alternative that will actually get me where I want to go.

Question; is there a bus handy for you? Given that you are on the Tallaght run, most of the Tallaght buses serve Patrick Street, run up Bull Alley and there you are at Golden Lane. I understand if you have a load to carry that buses/LUAS don't do it for you BTW

godtabh

keefg wrote: »

It created years of misery for motorists whilst it was being built.

Thats one of the more stupid reasons I've heard for not using public trasnport

serfboard

Pedantically he quoted ...

From the item

CIÉ says it will net around €1m from new pay and display parking charges at 37 stations on the greater Dublin rail network.

It then goes on to say:

The stations affected are on lines from Athlone and Longford including the stations on the Portlaoise and Coolmine Arrow routes, the Dundalk line, the Dart routes, the Arklow and Gorey lines.

I'm sure it's news to people in Athlone that they live in greater Dublin

godtabh

serfboard wrote: »

I'm sure it's news to people in Athlone that they live in greater Dublin

It says the lines go to Athlone he didnt say the car parks were in Athlone did he?

Bluetonic

I'm surprise more people aren't printing up their own pay and display tickets these days, they are quite easy to do - after all the tickets are only checked visibly, there's no barcode to check the data information displayed.

I'm obviously not condoning this, it's illegal and very bold.

keefg

kearnsr wrote: »

Thats one of the more stupid reasons I've heard for not using public trasnport

Stupid it may be but it isn't a reason not to use public transport at all, putting up with disruption for any sort of infrastructure development is always worth it in the long run if the finished project is well designed, good quality and works well (and cheap to use in the case of a PT project).

My point with that comment is that despite years of disruption during the Luas project we ended up with a poor transport system (compared to other systems in Europe).

dodgyme

well if you take the average joe soap coming in from commuter town. He knows he will be passing a railway/dart/luas station at some point.

The chances of him parking up if he has to pay for parking, plus the ticket plus the overcrowding, waiting etc is alot less when the parking charges are there. I really think parking at stations should be free to incentivise people to use public transport.

Ham'nd'egger

dodgyme wrote: »

well if you take the average joe soap coming in from commuter town. He knows he will be passing a railway/dart/luas station at some point.

The chances of him parking up if he has to pay for parking, plus the ticket plus the overcrowding, waiting etc is alot less when the parking charges are there. I really think parking at stations should be free to incentivise people to use public transport.

And CIE have to pay to put/lay/manage a car park to be there in the first place, which these days is usually full so the outlay to provide more spaces has to come from somewhere; a vicious circle if ever there was one. Given that there is demand for car park spaces coupled with the cost of providing same, I can understand Irish Rail wishing to recoup/cash in/rip off/invest in bigger sites for same. For some sites, it requires little more than moving into the next site or flat space; for others it may mean multi storey parking facilities which will require investment.

I do agree that it would be beneficial to have parking provided free; however it is accepted to pay for parking elsewhere (Airports, LUAS and on street parking) so there is a precedence.

keefg

Hamndegger wrote: »

Question; is there a bus handy for you? Given that you are on the Tallaght run, most of the Tallaght buses serve Patrick Street, run up Bull Alley and there you are at Golden Lane. I understand if you have a load to carry that buses/LUAS don't do it for you BTW

I don't live in Dublin so I am lucky that I don't have to endure the trip into the city centre on a daily basis.

With regards to the bus option, you are correct, with the gear I had to carry with me on Tues the bus wasn't really an option.

I would use the bus quite regularly when going into town for meals in the evening or for nights out (where I would park my car at the in-laws house in West Dublin) and I think the Nightlink service is fantastic......apart from some of the undesirables you can get on there at 2-3am.

I would only use the bus network for casual or social occasions and not when I have to be somewhere on time when it relates to business because unfortunately the timetables are just too unreliable. Or you have the overcrowding issue to put up with as well, I have been at a bus stop on many occasions and had to wait until the 2nd or 3rd came along before there was room to get on.

keefg

Hamndegger wrote: »

I do agree that it would be beneficial to have parking provided free; however it is accepted to pay for parking elsewhere (Airports, LUAS and on street parking) so there is a precedence.

I am sure most people wouldn't have a problem paying for parking at train stations if all the money was going back into the system to improve the parking situation (multi-story maybe?)

In this case, two thirds of the revenue is going to a private management firm and lining someone's pockets rather than being reinvested into a much needed resource.

HonalD

keefg wrote: »

I have no problem using public transport as long as it is cheap and efficient. I worked in Holland and Germany for years and I would always use the train/tram/bus when I was there because it was more efficient than driving. Same goes when I visit London or New York.

Why can't we get it right here? I dunno....you would have to ask the government.

Back on topic, my point was that any regular commuter who are on the fence about what is the best option for them (Car or PT) might be pushed into switching to driving their car as this the added cost of parking (which will increase) rules out PT as a viable option.

Don't agree that P.T. in London is "cheap" - better service/coverage than here no doubt but not "cheap".

I'm sure that a lot of visitors to Dublin use P.T. because they feel "it was more efficient than driving".

With regard to the "regular commuter" let's add sustainability into the mix as well as the €2 cost of parking, as I said, it is all about choice, one can choose not to travel at all.....................................................