So........... did you drive to work today?

chris11

Any provisional drivers out there who have ignored the ban?has anyone been pulled?I got stopped at a checkpoint about a week ago and was told I shouldn't be driving on my own,my name was taken but the garda didn't seem to bothered and was asking me how much my insurance was by the end of it.I'm hearing alot of different things from gards,instructors and people in general.

Holsten

Saw a few cars with L plates up and only the driver.

Doubt much if anything will actually be done.

Hairdo

What do ye make of this?

I'm a l-plate driver (hopefully I won't be any longer after this Friday's test!) but I also hear a lot of different stories from people.

My driving instructor showed me this article yesterday:

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/learner-drivers-to-be-spared-new-rules-crackdown-1422902.html

Hanley

There's already a thread about this in learning to drive... I went all the way across the city and back between 8.30am and 11 today, also went from drumcondra to glasnevin and ballymun in the last hour or two. Didn't see any check points along the way.

I didn't see many L plates on hte road. But I did see ALOT of people who looked like they should have them up.

Danbo!

There's been a lot of these threads setup in commuting and transport, and learning to drive forums.

There hasn't been many posts about people being stopped and/or fined. They've all just descended into arguments between learner permit holders and full license holders and people bitching about the new laws.

S.I.R

check points on either end of my road and for once there was no traffic, must of caught about 100 plus either end...


Silly law imho

chris11

I was talking to a random bloke about it the other day in work and he said his cousin was a garda in the traffic division and their department was told to come down on drivers "like a load bricks".

Hanley

chris11 wrote: »

I was talking to a random bloke about it the other day in work and he said his cousin was a garda in the traffic division and their department was told to come down on drivers "like a load bricks".

:eek: sketch!! :eek:

chris11

Hanley wrote: »

:eek: sketch!! :eek:

haha,i'm just sayin what i've heard,i was also told by a gard the other day that prob wouldn't get fined and you deffo wont get fined a grand.

SQ2

A friend of mine is fairly high ranking, he says to plough on with driving, thay haven't been told what to do, and they've enough things to be worried about, so they're not going to bother.
But then again if you act the d*** on the road it's another thing to fling at you..

Hanley

chris11 wrote: »

haha,i'm just sayin what i've heard,i was also told by a gard the other day that prob wouldn't get fined and you deffo wont get fined a grand.

Well in another thread in the learning to drive forum someone said there was a lad in Charleville who was fined €1,000 yesterday. But in the indo article it was expressly stated that there would be NO on the spot fines.

Also in that article there was a mention of how the Gardai weren't planning on impounding cars but apparently there has been a few seizures this morning. That being said, I don't know WHY they were being taken. They coulda been non VRT'd or way out of tax and insurance too....

So tbh, I'm not too sure.

Hanley

How much adiminstration work is involved for a member of the force who decides to appply the letter of the law and bring you to court...?

If there's ALOT of writing to be done I can't see them going mad at every Tom, Dick and Harry....

smash

I know of someone who's been issued with the €1,000.... this was in Wicklow at 8:30am on July 1st!!!

sk8board

Hanley wrote: »

Well in another thread in the learning to drive forum someone said there was a lad in Charleville who was fined €1,000 yesterday. But in the indo article it was expressly stated that there would be NO on the spot fines.

it won't matter a damn; no judge will uphold a €1000 fine on some 19yo girl driving to work in her '95 Micra (you get the picture).
That Cork Hurler got a €750 fine on appeal for Drink Driving and obstructing justice, not giving a urine/blood sample. Irish law is all based on comparison and precedence.

They really should drop the €1000 for €80 and 2 penalty points. After getting stopped a few times the message will sink in.

Hanley wrote: »

Also in that article there was a mention of how the Gardai weren't planning on impounding cars but apparently there has been a few seizures this morning. That being said, I don't know WHY they were being taken. They coulda been non VRT'd or way out of tax and insurance too....

So tbh, I'm not too sure.

all those car's are impounded for VRT. Its been going on close-by me here for a few weeks now. A few Guard's pulling every non-irish reg, and one day they even had a Car transporter.

String

From listening to radio talk shows etc it seems people are getting fined! I don't want to risk getting fined 1000e which is like a months work for me :O

Got to hold out and hope I pass my test next month

Hanley

sk8board wrote: »

it won't matter a damn; no judge will uphold a €1000 fine on some 19yo girl driving to work in her '95 Micra (you get the picture).
That Cork Hurler got a €750 fine on appeal for Drink Driving and obstructing justice, not giving a urine/blood sample. Irish law is all based on comparison and precedence.

I'd say Irish more is law based on your standing in the community, who your parents are and who you know

Tbh, I would hope for sensible enforcement. I can see judges quickly becoming tired of hearing these cases.

They really should drop the €1000 for €80 and 2 penalty points. After getting stopped a few times the message will sink in.

You know, I was actually thinking something like the above would be more likely to discourage me than a €1,000 fine!! It would certainly be more realistic when it comes to applying it across the board.



all those car's are impounded for VRT. Its been going on close-by me here for a few weeks now. A few Guard's pulling every non-irish reg, and one day they even had a Car transporter.[/QUOTE]

DrMorphine wrote: »

From listening to radio talk shows etc it seems people are getting fined! I don't want to risk getting fined 1000e which is like a months work for me :O

Got to hold out and hope I pass my test next month

It's my understanding that no-one has been fined yet tho?? From reading the article in the indo it appears it can only be done on the back of a court appearance. Can anyone confirm this?

I get the feeling there's alot of people crying wolf.

Anan1

I was listening to the radio today - some guy rang in to say he had seen Gardai loading cars driven by unaccompanied L drivers onto a transporter.

alo1587

I think its the greatest load of rubbish ever.Imagine if every provisional driver who had to drive to work unaccompanied in the morning obeyed this law, couldn't drive to work so they had to give up their job and draw the dole?! I'm sure the government wouldn't be long doing a u turn..

Anan1

alo1587 wrote: »

I think its the greatest load of rubbish ever.Imagine if every provisional driver who had to drive to work unaccompanied in the morning obeyed this law, couldn't drive to work so they had to give up their job and draw the dole?! I'm sure the government wouldn't be long doing a u turn..

I don't much care how they do or don't get to work, I just don't want to share the road with unaccompanied, unlicensed drivers.:)

Hanley

alo1587 wrote: »

I think its the greatest load of rubbish ever.Imagine if every provisional driver who had to drive to work unaccompanied in the morning obeyed this law, couldn't drive to work so they had to give up their job and draw the dole?! I'm sure the government wouldn't be long doing a u turn..

Never mind that, imagine how much tax revenue the government would lose from people not putting fuel in their cars!

alo1587

Anan1 wrote: »

I don't much care how they do or don't get to work, I just don't want to share the road with unaccompanied, unlicensed drivers.:)

We all drove unaccompanied in the past, Anan, i dont see how its different now!

Anan1

alo1587 wrote: »

We all drove unaccompanied in the past, Anan, i dont see how its different now!

Drink-driving was once commonplace too, as was having unrestrained babies in the car. Do you see how that's different now?

Hanley

Anan1 wrote: »

Drink-driving was once commonplace too, as was having unrestrained babies in the car. Do you see how that's different now?

Both of which pose a SERIOUS threat to innocent parties. A responsible driver with a bit of experience, even if they have a green piece of paper in the glovebox is certainly not equivalent to a drunk loon lashing down a country road!

Marcus.Aurelius

alo1587 wrote: »

We all drove unaccompanied in the past, Anan, i dont see how its different now!

Very true, but, just because it was accepted doesn't make it right. I don't like high-horse "I've got a full license" posts, but the test is very basic, no skill required, I don't see why people skip along and refuse to do it.

To those who are on waiting lists and find it hard to get to work etc., because of the availability of a licensed driver to accompany you, I really do feel sorry for you. It's unfair that it was tolerated in the past, but it had to happen sometime I suppose.

If the driver test was reconfigured to teach people how to drive in 21st century Ireland with better manners (i.e. keep left unless overtaking on motorway and pull in for other cars) I would welcome the new system.

In its current guise, it's unfair to both provisional and full license holders.

Anan1

Hanley wrote: »

Both of which pose a SERIOUS threat to innocent parties. A responsible driver with a bit of experience, even if they have a green piece of paper in the glovebox is certainly not equivalent to a drunk loon lashing down a country road!

Thing is, unaccompanied learner drivers have very little experience and have not yet proved themselves either responsible or competent to be in control of a car.

Hanley

One thing I don't understand is why emergency manouvers aren't thought or examined as part of the testing process. Surely emergency stops and the likes are a MUCH more important skill to have on the roads than being able to reverse around a corner....

Anan1

Hanley wrote: »

One thing I don't understand is why emergency manouvers aren't thought or examined as part of the testing process. Surely emergency stops and the likes are a MUCH more important skill to have on the roads than being able to reverse around a corner....

True, the test as it stands is pretty basic. It would also be a good idea to retest everybody every 5 or so years, IMO. (Just so Marcus.Aurelius doesn't think i'm only on my high horse because I hold a full license.;))

green-blood

well you wouldn't need to do so many emergency stops if people knew when to safely and how to reverse around a corner.

Irelnad in the 21st century - about time

Hanley

Anan1 wrote: »

Thing is, unaccompanied learner drivers have very little experience and have not yet proved themselves either responsible or competent to be in control of a car.

I can only speak from my own experience and that of people that I personally know, but I'm on my first provisional and have spent at least 20 hours doing lessons in the past year and I've been in 3 hairy situations in the last 12 months or so, the avoidance measures I had to take had absolutely nothing to do with what is being thought or tested currently.**

Therefore I fail to see how the test makes you a "safe" driver. I suppose it does insofar as having passed it one would assume you're at least compotent enough not to do anything stupid, but when someone else pulls a bonehead manuveour even those with a test are only barely (if any) better qualified than someone who is on their second provisional.


**and before anyone says it, I know you should be anticipating dangerous situations and avoiding them before they happen, but that is not always possible.

Marcus.Aurelius

Anan1 wrote: »

True, the test as it stands is pretty basic. It would also be a good idea to retest everybody every 5 or so years, IMO. (Just so Marcus.Aurelius doesn't think i'm only on my high horse because I hold a full license.;))

Not a full test, it would only add another burden to the provisional drivers on waiting lists.

All it needs is some inspectors from DoT to sit in for 20 minutes with the driver and ask them to drive a particular route (good mix of driving) and decide on their own, without all the ridiculous box ticking nonsense. If they're totally inept, suspend the license and require a full re-test, on a new testing system which teaches proper advanced defensive-driving technique

Anan1

Hanley wrote: »

I can only speak from my own experience and that of people that I personally know, but I'm on my first provisional and have spent at least 20 hours doing lessons in the past year and I've been in 3 hairy situations in the last 12 months or so, the avoidance measures I had to take had absolutely nothing to do with what is being thought or tested currently.**

Therefore I fail to see how the test makes you a "safe" driver. I suppose it does insofar as having passed it one would assume you're at least compotent enough not to do anything stupid, but when someone else pulls a bonehead manuveour even those with a test are only barely (if any) better qualified than someone who is on their second provisional.


**and before anyone says it, I know you should be anticipating dangerous situations and avoiding them before they happen, but that is not always possible.

Don't take this as an insult, but 20 hours of instruction and a year behind the wheel makes you at best a competent beginner.

Marcus.Aurelius wrote: »

Not a full test, it would only add another burden to the provisional drivers on waiting lists.

All it needs is some inspectors from DoT to sit in for 20 minutes with the driver and ask them to drive a particular route (good mix of driving) and decide on their own, without all the ridiculous box ticking nonsense. If they're totally inept, suspend the license and require a full re-test, on a new testing system which teaches proper advanced defensive-driving technique

That'd work.

furtzy

Just heard from my folks of a young girl they know having her car taken off her after being stopped. Apparently she said she would phone her Dad to come and be the qualified driver and could they not wait until he arrived. Guards said they didn't believe she wouldn't drive home by herself. She was also told to expect something in the post.

It wasn't a checkpoint but just a random stop so maybe she was driving in a a dangerous manner I don't know

Fizman

sk8board wrote: »

They really should drop the €1000 for €80 and 2 penalty points. After getting stopped a few times the message will sink in.

.

I agree with this, and I am on a provisional and currently driving around for work! The 1k fine idea is ridiculous!

Increment the penalty over time then. Maybe in 12 months time introduce the inflated fine as by that stage everyone will know exactly what the story is! Introducing it from day 1 is just dumb!

green-blood

wooo, you'r on your 1st provisional. I hope al these hairy moments were accompanied... the law change does not affect you, it was always the case

you have a licence to learn not to drive

Anan1

Fizman wrote: »

I agree with this, and I am on a provisional and currently driving around for work! The 1k fine idea is ridiculous!

Increment the penalty over time then. Maybe in 12 months time introduce the inflated fine as by that stage everyone will know exactly what the story is! Introducing it from day 1 is just dumb!

Of course you agree - you want to be able to continue driving unaccompanied without passing your test. The idea here is to prevent learner drivers from driving unaccompanied, and a €1,000 fine will do this much better than an €80 one.

green-blood

July 1 was 8 months after day 1 !!!

sk8board

Anan1 wrote: »

Of course you agree - you want to be able to continue driving unaccompanied without passing your test. The idea here is to prevent learner drivers from driving unaccompanied, and a €1,000 fine will do this much better than an €80 one.

not really, because the point is that the €1000 fine is pretty much unenforcable. Its over 10 times the nearest traffic fine. 100% of all the €1000 traffic fines will be appealed to the courts (wouldn't you??). No judge will stand for it, and they'll send it for review. It'll be added to the penalty points list, and then the Gardai can enforce it easier; they stop you, you get the points.

angelfire9

furtzy wrote: »

Just heard from my folks of a young girl they know having her car taken off her after being stopped. Apparently she said she would phone her Dad to come and be the qualified driver and could they not wait until he arrived. Guards said they didn't believe she wouldn't drive home by herself. She was also told to expect something in the post.

It wasn't a checkpoint but just a random stop so maybe she was driving in a a dangerous manner I don't know

I took my father's car into work today as my own was booked in for a service, and i got pulled on the dual carriageway as the car has L plates displayed but i was driving on my own
(the L Plates are for my sister who is just learning how to drive so the father leaves the plates up all the time) twas funny when i pulled up and the Garda saw a pink licence rather than the green learner's permit one!
And of course having pulled me I had to explain who owned the car, whether or not i had the owner's permission to drive, and prove that i was insured, all in all took me 20 minutes and made me late for work!

Still though, proves that the law is being enforced doesn't it!

DonJose

alo1587 wrote: »

We all drove unaccompanied in the past, Anan, i dont see how its different now!

I never drove unaccompanied, I didn't even own a car when I was taking driving lessons, I took the driving test in a driving school car.

DonJose

Anan1 wrote: »

True, the test as it stands is pretty basic.

And yet the 50% of those who fail the test still believe they are entitled to drive on our roads!!!

sk8board

angelfire9 wrote: »

Still though, proves that the law is being enforced doesn't it!

yep, its great to see; taking the cars off people is a much better use of resources than trying to fine them €1000. Its also a much more visable form of law enforcement and will get the column inches if it happens regularily.

It'd certainly scare the pants off me if I was a provo licence holder.

DonJose

sk8board wrote: »

yep, its great to see; taking the cars off people is a much better use of resources than trying to fine them €1000.

I'm pretty sure the €1000 fine will follow in the post.

sk8board

DonJose wrote: »

I'm pretty sure the €1000 fine will follow in the post.

it will, and everyone will appeal it. Thats the point.

craichoe

Thats the thing, there TONS of cars going around with L drivers and people driving them with full licenses.

Fathers and Mothers with Sons and Daughters learning to drive etc.

Fizman

Anan1 wrote: »

Of course you agree - you want to be able to continue driving unaccompanied without passing your test. The idea here is to prevent learner drivers from driving unaccompanied, and a €1,000 fine will do this much better than an €80 one.

Well first of all I don't want to continue driving WITHOUT passing my test. I have it at the end of this month. Have had to cancel a previous test date as a sports injury had me in hospital for a week so when I reapplied (on March 31st) it took almost 3 months before I heard back from them!! And that was after sending off 2 letters from my employer asking for a test soon! So my test date is almost 4 months later.

My point on the whole fine topic is that if it was 80 quid and 2 PP's, I could see it been much more widely issued from day 1 instead of hearing about random 1k fines dotted all over the country. When you hear stories of somebody receiving this fine, followed by another story of somebody getting off completely, what are L drivers supposed to think? Is it being enforced? Is it not being enforced?

Regarding the Gardai....if Officer X has not received clear intructions on how to deal with offenders (which many are claiming), I reckon he would be much more inclined to hand out the penalty if it was the e80 plus 2 PP as opposed to slapping a 1k fine on every one he came across!

Anan1

Fizman wrote: »

Regarding the Gardai....if Officer X has not received clear intructions on how to deal with offenders (which many are claiming), I reckon he would be much more inclined to hand out the penalty if it was the e80 plus 2 PP as opposed to slapping a 1k fine on every one he came across!

How about 4 points and a €500 fine?;)

John Mason

I stopped driving weeks ago. Got fed up with the police in Finglas pulling me over wanting to see my licence, and wanting to know why i didnt have a full licenced driver in the car with me.

I am sure people who live in quiet towns and villages will be fine but unfortunately for me, the police presence in finglas is huge.

at least three nights a week there is a check point right outside my house from 9pm - 10.03pm


on Friday night, there a huge check point just up the road from me at 2.30am, my taxi dropped me off, he done U turn on my road and head off the way he came with my friend. the police car came flying up the road after them, blue flashies and everything and started shouting at the taxi man for trying to avoid the check point. they took my friends details and wanted my address which the big drunk eeject didnt know and she had to phone me to get the address.

anyway, i was looking out the window at all this going on and the police done a drive by on my house, slowing down to check there is was someone in or something.

see i dont think the police have anything else to do in finglas except set up check points. they certainly arent interested in robberies, drugs, travellers or anything else tbh

KamiKazi

Nope, but I did drive to my driving test and passed

Kotek Besar

KamiKazi wrote: »

Nope, but I did drive to my driving test and passed

Congrats!

peelaaa

They should fine the lot of learner drivers who are driving solo, 1000 euros. That would sort it, I am tired of their slow erratic driving and crappy nissan micras. Scum

Placebo

my da usually casts a magic spell and i drive better when hes sitting beside me, its kinda like magic, we hold the steering wheel together, bita bondin time, wha?