Are you an indie snob?

jill_valentine

Safe to say indie fans tend to like their music, but would you consider yourself a stereotypical indie snob?

Do you own everything on Vinyl? Do you choose what to wear ironically? Do you hate Timbaland on a profound and personal level? Do you instinctively know what every single member of Broken Social Scene is doing at any given moment? Do you live for the day one of your friends asks you to recommend an album? Do you find yourself using the phrase "Oh, Pitchfork's standards have just plummetted..." a lot lately?

...

'cause lately I find myself slipping into those habits, and I'm desperately afraid of turning into an Eyebrowy character.

Dudess

Nah, not much of one anyway. My favourite type of music by a long shot is indie - and specifically that from the 80s/early 90s, it's what I always go back to (probably because it's from the time I first started getting into good bands). But there are plenty of Timbaland tunes I find damn catchy and I hate this crap of turning against an indie band just because they've become popular. I think, for example, The Killers and Kaiser Chiefs have some cracking tunes.
However I'd be selective about whose music I'd buy - despite all of the above, I wouldn't buy anything by Timbaland, The Killers or The Kaiser Chiefs. I'd copy it though.

I've very little vinyl, and choosing what I wear ironically? Ew...

KnifeWRENCH

jill_valentine wrote: »

Do you own everything on Vinyl?

No

jill_valentine wrote:

Do you choose what to wear ironically?

No, I choose what to wear by wearing clothes that I like.

jill_valentine wrote:

Do you hate Timbaland on a profound and personal level?

No, he's worked with Bjork!! Therefore, he's a legend!!

jill_valentine wrote:

Do you instinctively know what every single member of Broken Social Scene is doing at any given moment?

Nope, don't listen to them.

jill_valentine wrote:

Do you live for the day one of your friends asks you to recommend an album?

I would like that actually!

jill_valentine wrote:

Do you find yourself using the phrase "Oh, Pitchfork's standards have just plummetted..." a lot lately?

If I ever say that, I'll smack myself. And would deserve it.

So I guess the answer is: non. Je ne suis pas un typical indie snob.

jill_valentine

Man, you were going so well until you answered in French...


Thing is, I don't like to think of myself as an indie snob, but... then again, I do find myself hating Coldplay for being so ferociously bland and mainstream, when I should be hating them just for being so ferociously bland. Or even better, not caring about Coldplay. But if I'm honest, I suspect I'm a wee bit bitter about their success (VLV sold incredibly quickly) when other, smaller, better bands won't ever make it. That, surely, is the mindset of an indie snob?

Personally, I don't dress ironically. But I was at a show a while back, and as far as the eye could see, it was all ironic check shirts and post-nerd glasses. It was curious at first, then funny, but after the first few dozen, it got... well.... unsettling.


Has anybody used the dread phrase... "I prefer the early stuff?"

Or even anything related? (eg. "First album was better", "They were good, but gawsh, I saw them a few years ago, in a smaller venue, the band played right in the crowd, it was amazing. Then Régine Chassagne bought me a pint afterwards, and the whole band came around to mine to play in my sitting room. And you just don't get that kind of dialogue with a bigger crowd, yah?")

JC 2K3

No.

I'm above conventional Indie.

If someone asked me to recommend an album, I'd probably be indifferent and tell them one with the caveat of "you probably wouldn't like it, it's an acquired taste".

It's a fact that many bands get worse as they progress and concurrently get famous, so I've no qualms with saying I prefer a band's older stuff.

I dress however the fúck I want.

Indie snobs are stupid because the music they're so snobbish about usually isn't very good.

jill_valentine

Touché.

TestTransmission

What is even considered Indie nowadays?
Surely not the Killers,kaiser chiefs?I know a few people who had no interest in "music" until a year r two ago and nowadays they ask me if i ever heard of the bloc party and tell me to go buy their album,lol

Xavi6

I'm not an Indie snob, I'm a music snob. And I've no problem admitting it. I like what I like and if someone asks me an opinion on a particular band I'll give it, whether positive or negative.

For example, my cousin asked me the other day had I heard of the Ting Tings. My first reaction was a snigger, then I proceeded to rant about how shit they were and then when he said "Ah but they're catchy though" I gave another speech about how they are what's wrong with music nowadays. That's just the way I roll when it comes to music. At least I'm not in denial about it!

jill_valentine

See, I wouldn't quite consider The Killers indie, but they're definitely considered indie by many. I consider them pop, just pop of above-average goodness. But then, isn't it a big part of being an indie snob to endlessly trying to define what does, and what doesn't, qualify?

JC 2K3

Killers sound the same as any other indie band to me.

I mean that's what "indie" in the modern sense means, right? A load of bland shíte that all sounds the same.

jill_valentine

So where does that leave acts like Final Fantasy? I mean, absolutely the only thing I can think of to call Final Fantasy would be indie. I still think the word has value. I think it's a shame it's applied to bands like, Saints preserve us, Razorlight, but there's enough weird little indie acts out there that we can't retire the term altogether...

JC 2K3

Heh.

It's the most bastardised term in modern music.

KnifeWRENCH

jill_valentine wrote: »

Thing is, I don't like to think of myself as an indie snob, but... then again, I do find myself hating Coldplay for being so ferociously bland and mainstream, when I should be hating them just for being so ferociously bland. Or even better, not caring about Coldplay. But if I'm honest, I suspect I'm a wee bit bitter about their success (VLV sold incredibly quickly) when other, smaller, better bands won't ever make it. That, surely, is the mindset of an indie snob?

I don't hate Coldplay's success because they're mainstream.
I hate it because Chris Martin is an irritating little shit who can't fcuking sing, writes insipid drivel that somehow masquerades as music and acts like he has a halo so he can lecture us on ending poverty.

I do wish other, much more talented had their mainstream success. I don't think that makes me a snob though.

I don't think all indie bands are vapid shite, although it depends how one defines "Indie" it's such a vague term. These days, "Indie" apparently is any music that has guitars.

Of course, I (occassionally) read NME and I like The Ting Tings. So clearly I know nothing about music!!!

jill_valentine wrote:

Has anybody used the dread phrase... "I prefer the early stuff?"

That wouldn't bother me if the person was being genuine. If it was someone just trying to sound cool, I'd walk away and talk to someone less retarded.

jill_valentine wrote:

Or even anything related? (eg. "First album was better", "They were good, but gawsh, I saw them a few years ago, in a smaller venue, the band played right in the crowd, it was amazing. Then Régine Chassagne bought me a pint afterwards, and the whole band came around to mine to play in my sitting room. And you just don't get that kind of dialogue with a bigger crowd, yah?")

LOL, Nicely written :pac:

jill_valentine

Ironically enough, I've just remembered an interview where Owen Pallett referred to his own music as "Pop". Oh, my fragile hold on reality is slipping even further from my grasp.

Like I say, I wouldn't consider myself an indie snob... really... I don't think. But I have been accused of that by enough independant parties to start worrying.

Would I be right in saying that "indie" has still sort of retained it's original meaning outside of Britain and Ireland? 'Cause in the US, people still seem to think of indie as what I would consider, indie - ie. Canadian music*. (:D) If that's the case, then I think NME is probably the biggest culprit when it comes to eroding the definition. They're supposed to be an indie magazine, but seeking out actual alternative and indie bands is too much like hard work for them anymore, and now they just present whoever's available for an interview as THE NEW INDIE SENSATION! Hence the Ting Tings, who I sort of like, I just don't think they're indie. I do like Blood Red Shoes a lot though, and I can't help wondering if I'd stop considering them as indie and respectable if they sold a few more albums...



*Nickelback excepted. I'll find you Kroeger, I swear to God, I'll find you and make you pay.

TestTransmission

lol

jill_valentine

jackncoke wrote: »

lol

Rage. There's only rage. Oh God, I have so much rage.

I remember seeing a video of a discussion panel witha few notable Canadian music figures giving a talk about independant radio. They wandered off down a brilliant Nickelback hating tangent.

Truly, I've never seen a more profound glimpse of despair than Win Butler throwing up his hands and crying out to know "WHAT IS THE POINT OF NICKELBACK?!?" with sincere and tragic bewilderment.

Torquil Campbell shook his head sadly and said "The continuing success of that band is testament to the amount of bad coke in the world..."

Gawd bless you sirs.

Sinfonia

God bless Cyanide and Happiness :pac:

I'd pretty much echo the sentiments of JC 2K3's first post and Xavi.

I've got two music degrees as well, which gives me some more high horse ammo :pac:(Pretty much the only thing they're gonna bring me...*sigh*)

Blackhorse Slim

I used to be an indie snob, but I'm better now

This was when the Smiths were just starting to take off, The Wedding Present were the biggest unsigned band in the world and Half Man Half Biscuit were the best band that no-one has ever heard of (and still are).

The fact that bands like Slint were ignored by the record buying public is enough to make you lose faith in rock'n'roll.

These days I don't listen to new indie music much at all, I mostly listen to blues, both old and modern. Maybe I'm just old

Dudess

Blackhorse Slim wrote: »

This was when the Smiths were just starting to take off, The Wedding Present were the biggest unsigned band in the world and Half Man Half Biscuit were the best band that no-one has ever heard of (and still are).

Oh, now THAT was a time when being into music would have been a heavenly experience indeed!

Yes, the term "indie" has come to encompass all bands with a particular guitar sound/look. I wouldn't get too bothered by it, it lost its actual meaning many, many years ago. The Killers and Kaiser Chiefs sound commercial now but their sound would have been quite alternative 15 years ago, so it's possibly harking back to that. "Indie" originally referred to those acts signed to an independent record label. At one point, Kylie Minogue was on an independent record label (PWL) and sat in the Indie Chart top 5 alongside Lard, Alien Sex Fiend and Ozric Tentacles. So it's quite the ambiguous term.

I must admit I am guilty of "I prefer their earlier stuff"-ism, but that's simply because... I do. I've always looked to the past anyway for music - as I said, I'm stuck in a bit of an 80s/early 90s timewarp. Sometimes I think I should have been born 10+ years earlier and a contemporary of old Blackhorse above...

Kid V

Am i an indie snob???

No! Well not anymore, i used to listen exclusively to indie music but i've changed. I still prefer indie above any other genre but now i listen to more hip hop, dance, pop, experimental acts etc. I dont like to be pigeonholed and its now very important to me to have a varied taste.

Having said that i think Interpol are at least 1 million times better than timbaland:p

lordgoat

That boy's a Hoxton hero,
skinny fit jeans all dressed in pink.
How he dresses i care zero, as long as he don't spill my drink.

That girls an indie cindy lego hair cut and a polka dot dress.
I've no idea how she thinks she's indie.
How she's different is anyones guess.

I listen to music i like, i'm trying to stop giving out about all the shi-te music out there at the moment. Indie is just a loose term these days and it's original meaning can not be applied anymore in my opinion.

The only term more annoying would be Alternative. Alternative to what? Silence?

Earthhorse

Funny, I don't fall into any of the categories outlined in the OP yet I'll bet a few people who know me would say I'm an indie snob. Well, not an indie snob but an alternative snob.

This stems from my undying devotion to bands that emerged almost entirely during the early 90s, and mostly from America, and my unabashed evangelism of them during that decade. It's also a result of my unreserved criticism of bands, or indeed anything, that doesn't deserve the praise it's getting and my interest in understanding what people see in things I regard mostly as mediocre.

If I go to the cinema with certain friends there'll be that inevitable moment in the aftermath discussion where they'll turn to me and go "Well, what did you think?". They're somehow afraid that my pointing out the uninspired script, the workmanlike performances and the cack-handed direction it will ruin a movie that, only moments ago, they had enjoyed.

Some people just can't take criticism so they label you a snob; but a snob is someone who doesn't like something of a particular class, category or genre, as a rule, rather than for good reasons.

In short: EVERYBODY'S WRONG EXCEPT ME!

Bubs101

I think by the time you start relying on Pitchfork for reviews you are an indy snob

kmick

The Killers and Kaiser Chiefs are Indie? The Killers are rock and roll with a keyboard and the Kaiser Chiefs describe themselves as new wave/alternative/pop punk on their myspace.

Indie music was tied in with the whole Cool Britannia thing which is long dead Lets leave it in the annals of time.

Kold

Classing yourself as an indie snob means you limit your listening to Indie music which means you have nothing to be snobbish about. I do hate pop music though, it really grates me this overproduced drivel but one worse than that is someone who thinks the Killers are above that.

sprinkles

I find it hillarious that some indie snobs find a new bands music (for instance the Killers first album) to be amazing and genre defying and once they enter the mainstream - ie 98FM/MTV etc they become sellouts and their music, same freakin songs, are now outdated and not worth listening to - actually witnessed a mate from college saluting the Killers Mr Brightside in Whelans with a raised middle finger and a defiant "I'm not dancing to this crap" stance. Idiots!

Anyway, I'll listent o most stuff, really like some of the new bands emerging recently in the past 18 months or so (cut copy/Oppenheimer/Fleet Foxes). Love getting on the band wagon early but equally enjoy the band garnering massive success as it proves my early estimations correct

ps: I like the ting tings!

DerekD Goldfish

I hated the killers before they were popular
remember being shocked to agree with Germaine Greer when they were discussing it on its original uk release as she was the only one saying What is this crap? while the other reviews were saying how excellent it was.
I remember wondering in shock and amasment at "festival 04" when many people I was talking to went to see them on the new band stage as "They were the new Cure" The killers were a terribly bland band before and after their undeserved success.
Some would call me a music snob which I supose is deserved most of the time.

Blackhorse Slim

Around 2000, I was listening to the radio at work when I heard a guitar intro that made me prick up my ears. "Wow," I thought, "I haven't heard a cool indie guitar sound like that on radio for a looong time." I listened out for the band's name, I hadn't heard of them before, and when their album came out I bought it.
It was different to the single, more mellow and acoustic, not amazing but I liked it.


The band was Coldplay.

I had a similar experience with Oasis - I liked Supersonic (the first thing I heard by them) and the first album was decent, but, like Coldplay, they went rapidly downhill.

Sometimes the early stuff really is better.

jill_valentine

Yes, God bless Cyanide and Happiness.

Bubs101 wrote: »

I think by the time you start relying on Pitchfork for reviews you are an indy snob

Ah, this is outdated thinking. Pitchfork itself has lost it's cool. To give one's opinion worth, an indie snob must now preface their statements with "Well, quite aside :rolleyes: from whatever Pitchfork is saying these days, I think Man Man are still pushing the boundaries of etc, etc, etc..."

Miguel_Sanchez

jill_valentine wrote: »

Do you own everything on Vinyl?

Nope. But I think CDs are pretty swanky!

Do you choose what to wear ironically?

Good Jesus no.

Do you hate Timbaland on a profound and personal level?

I don't actually know any Timbaland songs. For ages I thought it was a new nickname for Justin Timberlake when I saw Timbaland mentioned anywhere. Also - isn't Timbaland a type of boot worn by construction workers?

Do you find yourself using the phrase "Oh, Pitchfork's standards have just plummetted..." a lot lately?

Never read Pitchfork really.

My girlfriend thinks I'm an indie snob and I only like things that 'nobody else likes'. But that's only because she thinks ****e like the Kaiser Chiefs can be good.

I have been guilty of using the 'I liked their early stuff' phrase once or twice but only when I honestly do. I'm not half as bad as an ex of mine who dismissively threw out the 'oh I don't listen to them anymore' comment when I told her I'd just been to see the Sigur Ros film. (Although she has have damn fine taste in music)

I listed off all the bands I saw at Explosions ATP to people at work recently and got blank stares back for every name. I have to admit I felt a little bit of smug indie kid cool creeping in, then I realised that I am definitely not cool - I'm just a grumpy **** who likes good music.

Kid V

Early stuff is usually better when it comes to some of the really big bands like U2, Coldplay, oasis, the rolling stones, even REM although the new album is pretty cool. Its because their sound was fresh but after time and no more original ideas they became diluted versions of their former selves.

Nothing wrong with the saying "i prefer the early stuff".
Unless you're someone who hates arcade fire for the bruce springstein-ness of neon bible because its not as cool as funeral. Grow up!

wittyusername

I used to be. But now I'm losing my edge. To better-looking people. With better ideas. And more talent. And they're actually... really, really nice.

Kid V

You too!!!???
I'm losing my edge too

Its those goddam kids from france and london with their borrowed nostalgia from the unremembered 80s. They weren't "there" though.

But i was there, i was there in 1968, i was there at the first Can show in cologne.

sprinkles

DerekD Goldfish wrote: »

I hated the killers before they were popular
remember being shocked to agree with Germaine Greer when they were discussing it on its original uk release as she was the only one saying What is this crap? while the other reviews were saying how excellent it was.
I remember wondering in shock and amasment at "festival 04" when many people I was talking to went to see them on the new band stage as "They were the new Cure" The killers were a terribly bland band before and after their undeserved success.
Some would call me a music snob which I supose is deserved most of the time.

That's not really snobber - you never liked them and that's your opinion. Snobbery is looking down on people who do like them from your lofty all-mighty pedestal with the view that anyone who has a different opinion to you is clearly wrong

I for one thought the Killers first album was a breadth of fresh air in a very stale indie/pop scene and kicked off the Bloc Party Razorlight Artic Monkeys revolution. Not saying all these bands are great but the choice is very welcome.

jill_valentine

Unless you're someone who hates arcade fire for the bruce springstein-ness of neon bible because its not as cool as funeral. Grow up!

Sacrilege!

Although I have to admit, I wanted to cry when I heard somebody say they thought Neon Bible was inferior "because it's not as happy."

Blackhorse Slim

Kid V wrote: »

But i was there, i was there in 1968, i was there at the first Can show in cologne.

My hat is off to you.







(unless you're lying )

Kid V

Eh ye i was there :rolleyes:

Anywho LCD Soundsystem aside being an indie snob is regrettable but completely understandable. Everyone has quality control its just how we deal with it that makes us snobs or eh nonsnobs

jill_valentine

Do you hate hearing a song you like on in the background of Skins...?

Kid V

Hell yeah

MGMT's Time to Pretend
The good the bad & the queen by TGTBATQ

Oh and they used nude by radiohead in some add.

Why dont they stick to using crystal castles, klaxons and foals:mad:

PetShoe

I liked the killers when they first came out... Bought hot fuss. Wasnt a big fan of sams town! i dont know... i just didnt really feel anything from it!!

Karl Hungus

You could certainly call me a snob, yes... But not for any of the reasons outlined above.

jill_valentine wrote: »

Safe to say indie fans tend to like their music

I would think the oppossite. Many of Indie fans I've known and come across over the years have been ignorant of music in the extreme, and the music itself is just pop music for people who like to feel they're not listening to pop.

Maybe I'm just pining for days of old, but I used to frequent the local indie club with great regularity simply because great music was played, everything from The Cure, The Smashing Pumpkins, David Bowie to Bjork, Type O Negative, Nine Inch Nails, Siouxsie & the Banshees, Joy Division, Garbage with maybe some Guns and Roses thrown in for good measure, and just about anything else inbetween.

These days, I can't stand 99% of the music played in such establishments, because it's all the same dry, bland, inspid pop music designed for people who like to think they're not listening to pop music. There was a distinct move away from interesting and original music, and the wholesale rejection of the Pumpkin's Adore (It was a terrific album, but everyone hated it because it wasn't the same old same old!) marked something of a shift for me, it seemed that I couldn't relate to a lot of people in the scene any more. I remember randomly chatting to people all the time about so many different bands, and Indie fans then really knew their music. These days, everyone seems to love the Ting Tings, but if I asked if they liked David Sylvian, blank stares.

It probably sounds like I'm just being an old fart, pining for the days gone past, but good god, Indie just isn't the same any more. It's more a fashion now than a style of music.

I'd love to go somewhere they still played good indie music, but I think the days we'd see the likes of this stuff is over:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y55305sxK50

As for "prefering the early stuff", it's true with a lot of bands, but that's usually just because those bands are simply rehashing what went before. There's plenty of bands I can think of that got better as they went on. Not an indie band, but Death just got way better as they went on, the first couple of albums I didn't think were that great, but mainman Chuck Schuldiner matured as a songwriter greatly, the music kept on progressing, became more complex and daring, from Human to Individual Thought Patterns, they just exploded with creativity...

That's just one example, but there are plenty of bands who managed to become more creative as their careers went on. Pity so many of them just don't bother.

Dudess

Kid V wrote: »

Eh ye i was there :rolleyes:

Wo... what's the need for the sarcastic roll-eyes symbol in response to what was a good-natured comment? If you were at that gig, it makes you in the region of 60 years of age, and considering Boards seems to be frequented mostly by people who think 25 is "old", it's rather - nay, extremely - unusual.
I'm not saying I definitely don't believe you and I'm also not saying it's impossible for a 60-year-old to use Boards - hell, bring it on! - but you can't blame someone for suspecting you of telling a porky about Can.
Wow, you're around my dad's age! Someone my dad's age being into Can? Now that is pretty ****ing cool!

By the way, I much prefer Neon Bible to Funeral.

As for The Killers and Kaiser Chiefs being labelled indie - commercial success or no, they do have an indie sound. A generic one maybe, but nonetheless it's a fairly accurate description. It's not pop, it's not rock. And 15 years ago, they probably wouldn't have reached anything higher in the mainstream charts than number 25.

I, like someone else on this thread, also blame Britpop for the blandening (if that's a word) of indie. In my humble opinion, 1991 was the year when indie attained perfection. Sadly, three/four years later, it was to be replaced by shyte.

Karl Hungus wrote: »

Many of Indie fans I've known and come across over the years have been ignorant of music in the extreme, and the music itself is just pop music for people who like to feel they're not listening to pop.

Perfectly put. However it depends on the type of indie too - I think that's maybe why there's such debate over the term "indie". It has been bandied about for well over 20 years at this stage and various sub-genres have obviously emerged. In fact, I don't think it's a genre, it's simply an umbrella term used to refer to lots of music - some great, some shyte. Like "pop" - some pop is great, some is shyte. And that's fine by me. I would consider myself an indie fan, yet I utterly abhor so much of the current bland crop - however there's also some fantastic stuff out there at the moment.

These days, I can't stand 99% of the music played in such establishments, because it's all the same dry, bland, inspid pop music designed for people who like to think they're not listening to pop music.

Again, perfectly put.

There was a distinct move away from interesting and original music, and the wholesale rejection of the Pumpkin's Adore (It was a terrific album, but everyone hated it because it wasn't the same old same old!) marked something of a shift for me, it seemed that I couldn't relate to a lot of people in the scene any more.

I know! I love that album! I couldn't understand the utter disdain even die-hard Pumpkins fans expressed for it!

These days, everyone seems to love the Ting Tings, but if I asked if they liked David Sylvian, blank stares.

You can't blame them either though, to be fair. Green Day are apparently "punk" ffs! This is what they're being fed...

I agree though, it seems to be more about an image right now. You've got the likes of presenter Fearne Cotton being referred to as an "indie queen" and people like Kelli Osbourne and Peaches Geldof viewed in a similar vein. Call it snobbery, but I rejoiced as a teenager when Ride were on Top of the Pops, however the above commercialisation I have no time for.
There was some guy on the Fashion & Appearance forum being slated for using a hair straightener and he insisted it's the "indie" look now, and went on to list the various acts whose male members embrace the art of hair straightening. Nothing wrong with being groomed, but still, saying that's an "indie" look is a strange one to me.

Then you've got the current crop all gushing about how much they love Joy Division - it seems fake or something. I've a feeling the surviving members of Joy Division would be having a laugh at them... But maybe I'm being too cynical.

jill_valentine

Anybody still confused about Kid V -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ON1eRJtoOrg

Also, you're spot on about the Joy Division homaging. Creeps me out, desperate to authentic, IMHO.

Karl Hungus wrote: »

These days, everyone seems to love the Ting Tings, but if I asked if they liked David Sylvian, blank stares.

It probably sounds like I'm just being an old fart, pining for the days gone past, but good god, Indie just isn't the same any more. It's more a fashion now than a style of music.

With respect, I completely imagine this bit in the voice of Mark from Peep Show. I did also, I have to confess, have to go and google David Sylvain.

Adore is a brilliant album, yes

I think there's a tendency to see the 90's through grunge coloured glasses, and it's important to bear in mind that bands like The Smashing Pumpkins etc. co-existed with a tremendous amount of sh*te. And when we were all listening to that stuff, exactly how aware were we of what was considered cool and alt by the generation before?

Fair enough, "indie" and "alternative" is being sold to teenagers now, but grunge was too, back in the day. Kids will always seek out something different, whether that's indie or rave or grunge or whatever. Remember the herds of kids with the blue-eyed Cobain t-shirts? All that's changed now is that they have more disposable income, so selling to them is more important.

There are still terrific indie acts out there, properly independant and unique. The aforementioned Final Fantasy is not an act I can imagine existing in the 90's or any time before that. Nor Beirut or Arcade Fire or Gogol Bordello or LCD Soundsystem (not even in the 80's...), or any number of weird little bands that are indietacular in their indieness. With a few notable exceptions, it's maybe harder for those acts to sell squintymillion singles and completely gatecrash the mainstream, so they don't get the same kind of exposure the Pumpkins enjoyed. But like I say, plenty of good bands of the Pumpkins' generation deserved to make it and didn't.

Sure the fringes of indie are ill-defined, but there's still plenty of bands worth getting worked up about, and there's still a real appetite for it, right here in Ireland. We're the only country other than Canada to give Neon Bible a no.1 spot.

KnifeWRENCH

Karl Hungus wrote: »

Maybe I'm just pining for days of old, but I used to frequent the local indie club with great regularity simply because great music was played, everything from The Cure, The Smashing Pumpkins, David Bowie to Bjork, Type O Negative, Nine Inch Nails, Siouxsie & the Banshees, Joy Division, Garbage with maybe some Guns and Roses thrown in for good measure, and just about anything else inbetween.

I've heard of there being those kinds of clubs in the early/mid '90's. They sound really good. Unfortunately I was in National school in the '90's so I'm a bit too young to remember

Karl Hungus wrote:

There was a distinct move away from interesting and original music, and the wholesale rejection of the Pumpkin's Adore (It was a terrific album, but everyone hated it because it wasn't the same old same old!) marked something of a shift for me, it seemed that I couldn't relate to a lot of people in the scene any more.

Pumpkins are my favourite band and Adore is my favourite album. I absolutely love it, and I can't believe so many people back then reacted so negatively to it.

Karl Hungus wrote:

I remember randomly chatting to people all the time about so many different bands, and Indie fans then really knew their music. These days, everyone seems to love the Ting Tings, but if I asked if they liked David Sylvian, blank stares.

I think it's clear from the Ting Tings thread that quite a lot of people don't like them! I do like them though!
I must admit I've never heard of David Sylvain.

KnifeWRENCH

Now I have a question for ye all, because ye seem to know an awful lot about indie music!

Which of the following bands, if any, would you describe as "Indie"?

CSS
¡Forward, Russia!
Hard-Fi
Klaxons
Pixies
The Breeders
The Go! Team
The Long Blondes
The Subways
The Sugarcubes

I ask because these bands are all listed under "Indie" on my mp3 player (Some I manually entered under Indie, some the player automatically entered) But how many would ye actually consider to be Indie?

jill_valentine

I think maybe we should start a sorting thread.

CSS - Yes. I think.
¡Forward, Russia! - Yes.
Hard-Fi - Eh... I'd say more Britpop?
Klaxons - Nu Rave. Thankyou NME.
Pixies - Yes.
The Breeders - Yes.
The Go! Team - ... Yes. Purely because I cannot think of any other category for 'em. If in doubt, indie?
The Long Blondes - I'm tempted to say Britpop again. Nah, indie I think?
The Subways - Yes.
The Sugarcubes - Yes.

JC 2K3

jill_valentine wrote: »

Kids will always seek out something different, whether that's indie or rave or grunge or whatever.

Disagree. Kids just buy what's marketed at them.

KnifeWRENCH

I thought Britpop was a dead genre. I thought it only referred to stuff like Oasis and Blur, didn't think it was still used.

jill_valentine wrote:

Klaxons - Nu Rave. Thankyou NME.

lol considered putting that in, but decided I'd leave it alone.

Karl Hungus

Glad to see the love for Adore.

jill_valentine wrote: »

I did also, I have to confess, have to go and google David Sylvain.

square_igloo wrote: »

I must admit I've never heard of David Sylvain.

Listen. Run out and buy yourself the album "Dead Bees On A Cake". Trust me on this one.

The video I posted earlier was Tweaker (which is Chris Vrenna from Nine Inch Nails) featuring David Sylvian.

jill_valentine

JC 2K3 wrote: »

Disagree. Kids just buy what's marketed at them.

Alright then, kids will always seek out what they think is indie and alternative.

Earthhorse

jill_valentine wrote: »

Do you hate hearing a song you like on in the background of Skins...?

Yes. Because it would mean I was watching Skins.

jill_valentine wrote: »

Fair enough, "indie" and "alternative" is being sold to teenagers now, but grunge was too, back in the day. Kids will always seek out something different, whether that's indie or rave or grunge or whatever.

Grunge was good, though. Great even. Sometimes I do wonder whether we're in a position to judge the movements that came after the ones we ourselves got caught up in. I hated Britpop, yet my contemporaries fawned on it all through college. Never understood that. Whilst I have a great deal more time for the current indie scene I still have yet to hear much that lights my fires. Maybe I was just a sucker for grunge the way some people were for britpop, some for nu metal and some for the skinny indie rock bands that dominate the airwaves today.

On second thought...no. It's the children who are wrong.