irish defence force dpm

irishintrested

does any one kno where i can buy and irish dpm/bdu uniform ive been looking for the past three days contstantly but have only found british and others

Captain Chaos

Its against the law for civilians to own or wear current Irish Defence Forces DPM. You can buy and wear the old style DPMs however.

irishintrested

what about for us citizens and also is there somewhere i could buy the curent dpm or the old one

cushtac

You might get some on eBay.

Witcher

irishintrested wrote: »

what about for us citizens and also is there somewhere i could buy the curent dpm or the old one

you've just been told its illegal

doesnt matter what nationality you are its illegal to wear here, unless you on

official duty

minidazzler

cushtac wrote: »

You might get some on eBay.

I don;t recommend it,
A) Because its Illegal,
B)Because it would cost about €400 for the hole uniform.

If you don;t Mind me asking OP Why do you wnat it?

the GALL

Captain Chaos wrote: »

Its against the law for civilians to own or wear current Irish Defence Forces DPM. You can buy and wear the old style DPMs however.

what's the old style dpm look like?

minidazzler

the GALL wrote: »

what's the old style dpm look like?

It wasn't DPM. More of a BDU. I cant remember exactly but if you Google FCA you will probably find some (nearly) Modern pics as they only went out of service in the RDF in 2003.

Donny5

the GALL wrote: »

what's the old style dpm look like?

I think he means the OGs.

the GALL

It was a drab oliven/green, the defence forces kept it that way so the IRA wouldn't have a problem with target recogniton.
ogs, what's og's?

Donny5

the GALL wrote: »

It was a drab oliven/green, the defence forces kept it that way so the IRA wouldn't have a problem with target recogniton.
ogs, what's og's?

OGs is Olive Green, as you said. Here's a picture of fellas from the 20th in the OGs:

arybvtcw0eolkf

The old OD working dress was the best working dress uniform we'd had.

For most, the current DPM uniform is ill fitting, heavy and uncomfortable.

Donny5

Mairt wrote: »

The old OD working dress was the best working dress uniform we'd had.

Except when wet.

the GALL

not at all the dpm uniform is cut for women

kermit_ie

cushtac wrote: »

You might get some on eBay.

US Citizens are also civilians...

cushtac

kermit_ie wrote: »

US Citizens are also civilians...

Civilians who live outside the jurisdiction.

Tribunius

Look you can get a hold of it but it won't be easy therefore it won't be cheap. (And no before anyone gets any ideas I'm not offering)

It is rare because as has been mentioned the Irish DF does not sell surplus equipment. So any you do come across is stolen.

And just to correct a previous poster the DPM uniform was introduced into the then FCA in 2001.

the GALL

there's a shirt on E-BAY at the moment

cp251

Now I know it's illegal to wear current issue DPM uniform items. But is it illegal to wear a garment that merely copies the pattern. For the sake of example; a T-shirt? Or even a jacket cut in a similar way to the current issue with a very similar but not quite the same camouflage pattern?

I doubt it somehow!

minidazzler

AFAIK, the pattern is Copyrighted. So while not illegal to weat per se, it would be illegal to produce.

You can get the Smocks In different Cammo patterns I think, Is the Brit Smock the same as out one????

Local-womanizer

I thought it was only illegal if it has the tri-colour on the arm?

kermit_ie

Local-womanizer wrote: »

I thought it was only illegal if it has the tri-colour on the arm?

untrue.

ex_infantry man

lads its like goin out in a garda uniform this act is illegal as you would be inpersonating a garda same with irish dpm impersonating a soldier of the irish df would come under this also

Oilrig

Donny 5,

I'm really curious as to when/where that pic was taken... it looks like IRL reserve with the French Famas rifle?

Oilrig

"For most, the current DPM uniform is ill fitting, heavy and uncomfortable"

Similar to the old issue system, get issued, get adjusted and wear - quit moaning.

Motto: whatever it takes. When you signed up, you signed up, now get the job done.

arybvtcw0eolkf

Oilrig wrote: »

"For most, the current DPM uniform is ill fitting, heavy and uncomfortable"

Similar to the old issue system, get issued, get adjusted and wear - quit moaning.

Motto: whatever it takes. When you signed up, you signed up, now get the job done.

If by "get it adjusted" you mean 'have it tailored' well then you should be made aware that its unlawful to have the DPM uniform tailored.

Its made as it is (ill fitting for the most part) for a reason. As its intended as a layered system if you have the pants tailored you won't be able to wear the issued terminal underwear with them, likewise the shirts, tailor those and you won't get the 'norgie' to fit etc.

Irish_Army01

Oilrig wrote: »

Donny 5,

I'm really curious as to when/where that pic was taken... it looks like IRL reserve with the French Famas rifle?

Yup, taken many yrs ago.. In France around 89.

trellheim

that's half my recruit section in that picture. Couldn't go on the long march to Paris as I had to work. Jaysus that's 19 years ago now.

Nam_Man

Donny5 wrote: »

OGs is Olive Green, as you said. Here's a picture of fellas from the 20th in the OGs:

Classic pic ... Them where the days ...

A lots of Irish DPM gear on ebay lately ... Some bloke in the UK even sold a whole uniform!!

And Irish desert shirts went for €255+

Crazy ...

bq300466

Hi there, can anyone tell me if I can get a set of enamel ribbons made up for my uniform? Thanks...Brian!

tac foley

I'm beginning to get a little concerned about the IDF wannabes on this thread. Surely someone who has IDF-issued medals would know where to get medal ribbons?

tac

Praetorian Saighdiuir

bq300466 wrote: »

Hi there, can anyone tell me if I can get a set of enamel ribbons made up for my uniform? Thanks...Brian!

Im looking to get these done myself, if you have any luck giz a PM.

tac foley wrote: »

I'm beginning to get a little concerned about the IDF wannabes on this thread. Surely someone who has IDF-issued medals would know where to get medal ribbons?

tac

I know where to get ribbons alright

Just dont know where to get the ribbons in emamel form! They are not too common.

SIRREX

benwavner wrote: »

Just dont know where to get the ribbons in emamel form! They are not too common.

The only time I've seen Irish ribbons in enamel form, they were done on overseas missions. The Mingi Men can get you anything made, for a price!

goldie fish

Why would you want them?

Mr. Tezza

why would you want a medal for something you didn't do? makes no sense to me, your only misleading yourself and others around you, similarly why wold you want to set of irish defence forces DPMs? Its a copyrighted colour/pattern and is only accessible to members of the defence forces through their respective CQ afaik. To those of you buying/selling the uniform on ebay to the best of my knowledge its ILLEGAL on two counts.

1) it is a copyrighted pattern and cannot be redistributed without authorisation.
2) it is Illegal to impersonate a member of the Irish defence forces.


I'd be glad if anyone on here could correct me if anything I have said is incorrect...

Praetorian Saighdiuir

Mr. Tezza wrote: »

why would you want a medal for something you didn't do? makes no sense to me, your only misleading yourself and others around you, similarly why wold you want to set of irish defence forces DPMs? Its a copyrighted colour/pattern and is only accessible to members of the defence forces through their respective CQ afaik. To those of you buying/selling the uniform on ebay to the best of my knowledge its ILLEGAL on two counts.

1) it is a copyrighted pattern and cannot be redistributed without authorisation.
2) it is Illegal to impersonate a member of the Irish defence forces.


I'd be glad if anyone on here could correct me if anything I have said is incorrect...

I think you are right

se conman

It goes a bit deeper than that , on my last reading , it is illegal to wear ANY military uniform of ANY country in Ireland without permission. That would mean it is illegal to wear any surplus. I will have a look for the link.

Mr. Tezza

se conman wrote: »

It goes a bit deeper than that , on my last reading , it is illegal to wear ANY military uniform of ANY country in Ireland without permission. That would mean it is illegal to wear any surplus. I will have a look for the link.

Thats interesting, so all the people going around in their airsoft "loadouts" mimicing other military countries are actually doing so illegally? never heard of that but I do know about the whole Irish Defence Force DPM being copyright so that can't be worn, never thought of it being extended to other military uniforms because they are available to the civilian market.

se conman

http://www.irishstatuebook.ie/1954/en/act/pub/0018/print.html#sec157
Go to sections 264 & 317.
There may be an up-dated version but I couldn't find one.

Tabnabs

Link fails to work.

264.—(1) If any person (not being a member of the Defence Forces) wears, without permission granted by or on behalf of the Minister, any uniform of the Defence Forces or any colourable imitation thereof, such person shall be guilty of an offence under this section and shall be liable on summary conviction thereof to a fine not exceeding ten pounds or, at the discretion of the court, to imprisonment for any term not exceeding three months.


(2) Subsection (1) of this section shall not apply in respect of the wearing of any uniform of the Defence Forces or any colourable imitation thereof in the course of a stage play or other dramatic representation or performance.


(3) In this section the word “uniform” includes any distinctive part of a uniform.

317.—(1) No person shall, save with the consent in writing of a Minister of State, enter or land in the State while wearing any foreign uniform.


(2) No person shall, save with the consent in writing of a Minister of State, go into any public place in the State while wearing any foreign uniform.


(3) A Minister of State may from time to time direct that subsections (1) and (2) of this section shall not during a specified period apply in respect of any particular class (defined in such manner as he thinks fit) of persons, and in that case the said subsections shall not apply during that period in respect of that class of persons.


(4) Every person who contravenes (by act or omission) any provision in subsections (1) or (2) of this section shall be guilty of an offence under this section and shall be liable on summary conviction thereof to a fine not exceeding twenty-five pounds or, at the discretion of the court, to imprisonment for a term not exceeding six months.


(5) Nothing in this section shall restrict, or apply in respect of, the wearing of any uniform by the head of any diplomatic mission duly accredited to the State or by any member of the diplomatic staff of such mission whose appointment as such has been officially notified to the Minister for External Affairs or who is otherwise entitled to diplomatic immunities.


(6) Nothing in this section shall restrict, or apply in respect of, the wearing of any foreign uniform in the course of a stage play or other dramatic representation or performance.


(7) In this section—


the expression “foreign uniform” means the uniform of any armed force of any other State whether operating by land, sea or air, and includes any distinctive part of any such uniform;


the expression “public place” includes any street, road, park or other similar place, and also any place or building to which the public have access on payment of a charge for admission.

Captain Chaos

So essentially mil sim airsoft is illegal in this country unless you wear SWAT gear.
It's been going on for 5 years and there are many, many shops here selling surplus gear. How come they are not closed down. There must be a massive grey area in this law.

Donny5

Captain Chaos wrote: »

So essentially mil sim airsoft is illegal in this country unless you wear SWAT gear.
It's been going on for 5 years and there are many, many shops here selling surplus gear. How come they are not closed down. There must be a massive grey area in this law.

The law is ambiguous at best. More importantly, no-ones cares in the slightest. The DPP would laugh at the Gardaí if they sent in a file because a guy dressed like a WW2 stormtrooper running around with a guy dressed like a U.S. Marine from Ramadi.

se conman

That is it exactly , a law from a different era not being policed. It is outdated but not worth the hassle of updating.

Dogwatch

I think this is the important bit of this leglislation

"any uniform of the Defence Forces or any colourable imitation thereof, "

se conman

The problem is the date , 1954 , that covers OD also. Are we off topic or is this relevant ?

se conman

I am not PDF or RDF and from my reading it is equally as illegal to wear any dpm as it is to wear Irish dpm , so the question I ask is , do we just choose which laws to up-hold ?

Local-womanizer

se conman wrote: »

I am not PDF or RDF and from my reading it is equally as illegal to wear any dpm as it is to wear Irish dpm , so the question I ask is , do we just choose which laws to up-hold ?

Well yes and no, why would the guards look to waste their time chasing a prosecution of an air softer running around a field wearing us marine uniform?

Now if a person put on said uniform and conducted a vehicle checkpoint or try to gain entry to a government building then they would be in bother.

I'm sure the state will use its discretion in the application of the law.

Donny5

se conman wrote: »

I am not PDF or RDF and from my reading it is equally as illegal to wear any dpm as it is to wear Irish dpm , so the question I ask is , do we just choose which laws to up-hold ?

That's is your reading, but not mine. DPM does not a uniform make.

goldie fish

(6) Nothing in this section shall restrict, or apply in respect of, the wearing of any foreign uniform in the course of a stage play or other dramatic representation or performance.

You could say airsoft is a dramatic representation or performance of sorts.
I mean nobody believes they are for real.

Morpheus

Quality GF

Sure theyre only "playing" at soldiers! no harm there

OzCam

Morphéus wrote: »

Sure theyre only "playing" at soldiers! no harm there

Don't worry. We're quite aware of that. Most of us, anyway.

There are three separate issues:
1. DF uniforms remain the property of the Minister of Defence. Therefore any uniform in the possession of anyone not legally entitled to have it is technically stolen property.
2. Under DF regs, the uniform is only to be worn on duty, when travelling to or from duty, and only in it's entirety.
3. Uniforms of a "foreign power" may only be worn in public with the permission in writing (including date, time and place) of the Minister for Foreign affairs.

Two minor points: there doesn't seem to be a definition of "uniform". I don't know whether it's been established in court whether a shirt/smock & trousers without any insignia qualifies as a uniform. However, the Guards still have the discretion to intervene if something that looks like a uniform might cause a problem in public, under the Public Order laws. It used to be called "Conduct likely to cause a breach of the peace", I don't know what it's called these days.

Most responsible airsoft sites discourage players from turning up in utilities, and all sites that I know of prohibit wearing of Irish DPM.

This issue has been discussed in detail several times in the Airsoft forum. Check there if you need citations for the relevant laws and regulations.