School has not one Irish pupil enrolling this year

darkman2

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/changing-times-as-school-finds-no-irishborn-pupils-enrolling-1397401.html


But we will just continue on regardless. How many years has it been said now that our whole immigration system is a joke? That we dont actually have one? It would be too politically incorrect to point out the problems this sort of thing will bring in the future. So now we have a Public school in the most populated area in the country with not one Irish pupil enrolling. You know if we actually planned this artificial apparthied we probrably could not do it! Then there is the all African school in Balbriggan. Keep up the good work!

Article:

CHANGES in the population were brought into focus yesterday when a Dublin school revealed there isn't a single Irish-born pupil among those enrolled in its infant classes for next year.

The school is in the north inner city, where already nearly half the pupils are minority ethnic and language students, and that percentage is rising.

Figures from eight local schools in the Dublin 7 area show that there are 1,839 pupils enrolled this year -- of whom nearly half, or 855, are minority ethnic and language students.

In one of the schools, 63pc of pupils are from an ethnic minority. Another school with only 292 pupils has 26 minority languages students, while a third with 378 pupils has 25 languages spoken, according to a report launched yesterday.

The report does not identify the school where no Irish have applied for places in September, but says that may change as demand for places increases.

Schools in the report indicated a rise in the number of languages presenting in addition to the increase in overall numbers.

Variety

Increasing variety in the ethnic and national groups applying for education for their children -- and the languages they speak -- is expected to present an ongoing challenge to schools and local communities.

Dublin 7 is identified as an area of educational disadvantage by the report, which took account of literacy, early school leaving, access to education, academic under-achievement and underdevelopment of interpersonal and social skills.

"For minority language students, these are more likely to become significant factors in their educational experience. They have the added disadvantage of potentially poor communication and connectivity between school and home. Such connectivity has been clearly established as a key factor in supporting children to achieve in the school ," according to the evaluation report for a School Cultural Mediation Project.

It adds that the north inner city has a significantly higher than average number of ethnic minority residents, standing at 34pc of the population -- or three times the national average, according to the 2006 Census.

In response to this level of need, an innovative schools project was started by the Dublin Inner City Partnership in conjunction with the North West Inner City Network (with a range of other agencies advising).

This pilot project provided translation and interpretation services to minority language parents in ten schools in the North West Inner City during the past school year.

The evaluation report found that the project "has succeeded in opening channels of communication".

Over the past school year, the project was responsible for translating 75 school policy documents and 250 other documents into languages spoken by parents with a poor command of English. It provided interpretation services at 20 group meetings and at 350 one-to-one parent-teacher meetings.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Were you asleep when the last three multi-page immigraion threads went by over the last week?

kjt

Get over it!

darkman2

kjt wrote: »

Get over it!

Ive got a better idea - how about we actually deal with it? Accept that mistakes have been made and try and make sure that schools are diverse and multi ethnic etc etc but actually have Irish children in them as opposed to no Irish children at all.

RATM

Bloody foreigners coming over here taking over our schools:eek:

Id imagine the root of this problem lies somewhat with the parents who are enrolling kids in the first place. I remember seeing a piece on RTE about a month ago that revealed that parents are avoiding schools where the majority of kids are non-national like the plague. Conversely some schools must be avoiding enrolling non-national kids like the plague too for this situation to arise.

I think Hanafin said at the time that they DOE might have to legislate on it in the future....

Catari Jaguar

You know you'd want to get your facts straight. I work in that school.
This article is based on a report put forward by a Cultural Mediation group. But of course a conservative, sensationalist paper like the Indo has made a sham of the whole story..

There are actually at least 2 Irish born (of Irish parents) enrolling and most of the other children ARE born in this country (to immigrants parents).

The school is tiny and just over half of children don't have English as a first language but it is flourishing, very inclusive, standards are up, grades are way up, home involvement is improving and school violence/ vandalism is down. These are not "problems", these are improvements brought by these families. It's a privilege working with and meeting these children and their parents.

The area that the children are from just happens to have immigrants in the flats as the government have moved the majority of Irish out and into council houses. Obviously the children will go to the local school. It's the Irish parents that don't want their own to mix with children of different nationalities...

So what if they are foreign? They're kids like any other. Get a grip. Mo náire thú. :mad:

mike65

Fair play to you Lil Kitten, it good to get some first hand comment on an issue like this.

Mike.

Dudess

darkman2 wrote: »

artificial apparthied

What the fuk? Who stopped the Irish parents from sending their kids there?

Photi

Great post Lil Kitten. Thank you.

spurious

The irony is, that in many inner-city areas, it is the immigrant children who want to get on and want to succeed at education, so in terms of educational success, the best place to be is in a class of motivated 'foreigners' than a class of home-grown non-achievers looking to blame someone else for their lack of success.

darkman2

Lil Kitten wrote: »

You know you'd want to get your facts straight. I work in that school.
This article is based on a report put forward by a Cultural Mediation group. But of course a conservative, sensationalist paper like the Indo has made a sham of the whole story..

There are actually at least 2 Irish born (of Irish parents) enrolling and most of the other children ARE born in this country (to immigrants parents).

The school is tiny and just over half of children don't have English as a first language but it is flourishing, very inclusive, standards are up, grades are way up, home involvement is improving and school violence/ vandalism is down. These are not "problems", these are improvements brought by these families. It's a privilege working with and meeting these children and their parents.

The area that the children are from just happens to have immigrants in the flats as the government have moved the majority of Irish out and into council houses. Obviously the children will go to the local school. It's the Irish parents that don't want their own to mix with children of different nationalities...

So what if they are foreign? They're kids like any other. Get a grip. Mo náire thú. :mad:

I dont think anyone was criticising your school in fairness. I accept your point about all the good things every school is doing. However saying that 2 Irish pupils enrolling makes it satisfactory - thats not satisfactory. Maybe the Indo was sensationalist and factually incorrect but this is not the only school that this is happening in/has happened in and it wont be the last. Even if the Indo is wrong surely its not inconcievable that there will be no Irish children enrolling next year? I also take the point about parents from another poster. I do think they are intentionally avoiding sending their children to these schools. They have a right to do so of course but in terms of integration there are problems here.

Dudess

I really don't see the problem. Immigrants come here, they send their children to school. I know you're saying it's reflective of the lack of control on immigration this country has, but it's hardly a negative consequence.

mike65

spurious wrote: »

The irony is, that in many inner-city areas, it is the immigrant children who want to get on and want to succeed at education, so in terms of educational success, the best place to be is in a class of motivated 'foreigners' than a class of home-grown non-achievers looking to blame someone else for their lack of success.

This is an important issue, the shower of Ne'erdowells who are white and witless will turn on "immigrants" as they get left behind by the first generation of Irish children born to immigants. The government/state needs to concentrate them and thier needs/failings as well as in "new Irish"

Mike.

Sherifu

A darkman2 thread is a fine way to start the day. Good post Lil Kitten.

darkman2

Dudess wrote: »

I really don't see the problem. Immigrants come here, they send their children to school. I know you're saying it's reflective of the lack of control on immigration this country has, but it's hardly a negative consequence.

I agree this particular school is probrably not a particular problem. Its probrably well mixed aswell. Its schools like the one in Balbriggan no one wants to see in this country. Id be worried other schools might be going the same direction but if thier not thats fine. No problem with that. I just think there should be Irish pupils in every school.

Catari Jaguar

darkman2 wrote: »

I dont think anyone was criticising your school in fairness. I accept your point about all the good things every school is doing. However saying that 2 Irish pupils enrolling makes it satisfactory - thats not satisfactory. Maybe the Indo was sensationalist and factually incorrect but this is not the only school that this is happening in/has happened in and it wont be the last. Even if the Indo is wrong surely its not inconcievable that there will be no Irish children enrolling next year? I also take the point about parents from another poster. I do think they are intentionally avoiding sending their children to these schools. They have a right to do so of course but in terms of integration there are problems here.

No offence taken. It doesn't matter if no Irish children enroll next year. Tbh, the Irish kids are much more difficult to teach with the amount of social problem, academic problems and couldn't give a sh*t attitude of the parents. if anything a lot of the Irish children corrupt and are a bad influence on the foreign children that are actually trying to make something of themselves. But that's just my opinion.

The foreign children all mix well with each other and with the Irish children in the school, flats and local area. There's a lot less rivalry and issues than some of the Irish families have with each other....

ejmaztec

At least half of the kids that I went to school with in the UK, had got off the boat at Holyhead. I don't recall one instance of anyone complaining about their arrival.

briantwin

Lil Kitten wrote: »

No offence taken. It doesn't matter if no Irish children enroll next year. Tbh, the Irish kids are much more difficult to teach with the amount of social problem, academic problems and couldn't give a sh*t attitude of the parents. if anything a lot of the Irish children corrupt and are a bad influence on the foreign children that are actually trying to make something of themselves. But that's just my opinion.

Bit of a nasty opinion to hold especially in your position. If you actually do think that, i'm sure that contempt comes through when you're dealing with the irish kids ,no?
I'm really happy to see more diversity in Ireland tbh. There are loads and loads of foreign kids in our local gael scoil. Its mad, they have much better Irish than many of us.
Darkman2 i think you might be getting a bit possessive,its not like they are invading. Its just the way the cookie crumbles. Immigrants come to Ireland, if the are on the dole/social welfare and in council housing they'll probably be all lumped together in flats etc.

What would you prefer, just dont educate immigrant children?? Come on be realistic.

Reku

Lil Kitten wrote: »

most of the other children ARE born in this country (to immigrants parents).

Was thinking that'd probably be the case, stupid paper warping things to make a more sensational story.:mad:
If they're born here they're Irish, regardless of where their parents were from.

gixerfixer

RATM wrote: »

Bloody foreigners coming over here taking over our schools:eek:

Id imagine the root of this problem lies somewhat with the parents who are enrolling kids in the first place. I remember seeing a piece on RTE about a month ago that revealed that parents are avoiding schools where the majority of kids are non-national like the plague. Conversely some schools must be avoiding enrolling non-national kids like the plague too for this situation to arise.

I think Hanafin said at the time that they DOE might have to legislate on it in the future....

Cant blame the parents really.I doubt if id send my girls to a school with that many Non-nationals.

all the stars

Lil Kitten wrote: »

You know you'd want to get your facts straight. I work in that school.
This article is based on a report put forward by a Cultural Mediation group. But of course a conservative, sensationalist paper like the Indo has made a sham of the whole story..

There are actually at least 2 Irish born (of Irish parents) enrolling and most of the other children ARE born in this country (to immigrants parents).

The school is tiny and just over half of children don't have English as a first language but it is flourishing, very inclusive, standards are up, grades are way up, home involvement is improving and school violence/ vandalism is down. These are not "problems", these are improvements brought by these families. It's a privilege working with and meeting these children and their parents.

The area that the children are from just happens to have immigrants in the flats as the government have moved the majority of Irish out and into council houses. Obviously the children will go to the local school. It's the Irish parents that don't want their own to mix with children of different nationalities...

So what if they are foreign? They're kids like any other. Get a grip. Mo náire thú. :mad:

well said! +1

all the stars

gixerfixer wrote: »

Cant blame the parents really.I doubt if id send my girls to a school with that many Non-nationals.

why do you say that?

The Bollox

THEY TOOK 'ER JOBS!

sorry, had to do it.

back on topic: I don't really mind the fact that non-nationals are going to the schools, what I do mind is when non-nationals try to exclude Irish people from schools (like was said about the school in Balbriggan) and also, in Balbriggan, there was a hair salon which had a sign on the door "no whites". imagine if an Irish salon tried that with a sign saying "no blacks" the salon would be shut down before you could say "not fair!"

luckat

How are we defining 'Irish' here? Bheadh ciall againn...

Dudess

all the stars wrote: »

why do you say that?

Duh... isn't it obvious? They might catch "foreign" off them...

Mena

gixerfixer wrote: »

Cant blame the parents really.I doubt if id send my girls to a school with that many Non-nationals.

I can't blame you, seeing how you Irish raise your kids I'm finding it harder and harder to justify sending my daughter to a school with so many Irish. :pac:

Steve_o

Sherifu wrote: »

A darkman2 thread is a fine way to start the day. Good post Lil Kitten.

QFT! Great post Lil Kitten....

Saruman

As little kitten said, most of the kids ARE Irish! They were born here, grew up here so they are Irish. The fact their parents might be from another country do not alter the fact they are Irish.

rovert

Good old white flight.

AnonoBoy

The Bollox wrote: »

in Balbriggan, there was a hair salon which had a sign on the door "no whites". imagine if an Irish salon tried that with a sign saying "no blacks" the salon would be shut down before you could say "not fair!"

Was there really? Seriously? Where in Balbriggan? Anyone got photos of it?

Dave!

I'm glad. I hope we get more immigrants, and the government gives them houses close to where darkman2 lives.

Mena

DaveMcG wrote: »

I'm glad. I hope we get more immigrants, and the government gives them houses close to where darkman2 lives.

Well I live in a very comfortable 5 bed detached somewhere in Kildare currently, but I'll happily take one of the council flats next to his place if it serves the purpose!

Rb

RATM wrote: »

I remember seeing a piece on RTE about a month ago that revealed that parents are avoiding schools where the majority of kids are non-national like the plague.

Yep this is true. Don't have figures handy but there's been a massive rise in interest in gaelscoils. Middle class people in particular are chosing gaelscoils over others so that they won't have their kids going to school with foreign children.

Fair enough I guess, free world and all that.

Dudess

Rb wrote: »

Middle class people in particular are chosing gaelscoils over others so that they won't have their kids going to school with foreign children.

Ah... the "liberal" middle class. Liberal when it suits. I say that as a middle-class person.

ojewriej

I think the reason is that allegedly a lot of foreign children don't have good enough english, therefore teachers have to spend more time with them, and because of that they have less time for other kids.

I don't really how true it is, or how common, just remember reading about it somewhere.

chopperbyrne

ojewriej wrote: »

I think the reason is that allegedly a lot of foreign children don't have good enough english, therefore teachers have to spend more time with them, and because of that they have less time for other kids.

I don't really how true it is, or how common, just remember reading about it somewhere.

One of the main problems with foreign children in this country is that their parents don't speak to them predominantly in English, which doesn't help their first few years in primary school.

Was delighted to see a Chinese woman talking to both her young children in English last week.

Plenty of time to teach them another language a year or two after they've started school and have a good grasp of English.

Unshelved

I don't really mind the fact that non-nationals are going to the schools, what I do mind is when non-nationals try to exclude Irish people from schools (like was said about the school in Balbriggan) and also, in Balbriggan, there was a hair salon which had a sign on the door "no whites". imagine if an Irish salon tried that with a sign saying "no blacks" the salon would be shut down before you could say "not fair!"

There's a lot of misinformation going on about the Balbriggan situation. There are many immigrants living in the area, and a lot of them have moved from the centre in Mosney. Nobody told them that they had to put their kids' names down for national school, so they just turned up on the first day of term with child in tow expecting a place and there just wasn't the room in the national schools. Cue panic about what to do and so an additional school was quickly established in the Sunshine Home holiday centre.

It certainly was not a case of people being excluded because they were the wrong colour/race /ethnicity and it is completely unfair to blame the school authorities in Balbriggan for a problem that was not of their making, and which was totally unforseen until the first day of term when dozens of extra pupils turned up. Furthermore the new school is an Educate Together school and does not bar ANYONE from enrolling regardless of race, colour or creed.

As for the "no whites" sign - I've seen this crop up a number of times and when asked for proof of its existence it's always been "my brother / neighbour / friend of a friend saw it". I don't believe that it ever existed - it's an urban myth.

Got any more poisonous rumours that you'd like to spread around?

The Bollox

I saw the sign.

I opened up my eyes, I saw the sign :pac:

but seriously I did see it up

gixerfixer

Mena wrote: »

I can't blame you, seeing how you Irish raise your kids I'm finding it harder and harder to justify sending my daughter to a school with so many Irish. :pac:

Dont really get that? Was that an attempt at comedy.It's a free country,i can send my kids where i want.Like i said id rather they went to a school with mostly Irish kids.Dont know why you have to go and insult Irish people in general....Whats wrong with how we raise our kids.

Dudess

What's wrong with your kids mixing with foreign kids?

humanji

gixerfixer wrote: »

Dont really get that? Was that an attempt at comedy.It's a free country,i can send my kids where i want.Like i said id rather they went to a school with mostly Irish kids.Dont know why you have to go and insult Irish people in general....Whats wrong with how we raise our kids.

What's wrong with how foreign kids are raised?

Miguel_Sanchez

The Bollox wrote: »

I saw the sign.

I opened up my eyes, I saw the sign :pac:

but seriously I did see it up

What premises was it up in? My friend lives there and he wants to go and check it out to see if it's still there. He'd never heard of it.

gixerfixer

gixerfixer wrote: »

Dont really get that? Was that an attempt at comedy.It's a free country,i can send my kids where i want.Like i said id rather they went to a school with mostly Irish kids.Dont know why you have to go and insult Irish people in general....Whats wrong with how we raise our kids.

gixerfixer wrote: »

Cant blame the parents really.I doubt if id send my girls to a school with that many Non-nationals.

Seriously, you're either a very bad troll or a complete f*ckwit. How can you honestly not see the hypocritical absurdity of your two posts?

My gast is well and truly flabbered.

And you still haven't expanded (expounded?) on your reasoning behind your first post.

darkman2

Mena wrote: »

Well I live in a very comfortable 5 bed detached somewhere in Kildare currently, but I'll happily take one of the council flats next to his place if it serves the purpose!

You probrably could not afford a cardboard box where I live:D I have to say there is not many immigrants in my area. I have two polish guys putting in a wooden floor for me atm. They work really hard. I asked them to at least take a break but they wont. Put Irish workers to shame. Been working non stop since 9 this morning.

gixerfixer

Deleted User wrote: »

Seriously, you're either a very bad troll or a complete f*ckwit. How can you honestly not see the hypocritical absurdity of your two posts?

My gast is well and truly flabbered.

And you still haven't expanded (expounded?) on your reasoning behind your first post.

Ah the internet eh. Where you can insult people from the security of your keyboard safe in the knowledge that you dont have to call them names to their face:rolleyes: You sir should be ashamed of yourself. As for my first post..why should i expand on what i said.

gixerfixer

Dudess wrote: »

What's wrong with your kids mixing with foreign kids?

Who said there was anything wrong with my kids mixing with foreign kids.When my kids get to a school going age i'll send them to a school that has a mix of foriegn childern and Irish childern,not a school with all Irish kids or all foreign kids.

UsedtobePC

chopperbyrne wrote: »

One of the main problems with foreign children in this country is that their parents don't speak to them predominantly in English, which doesn't help their first few years in primary school.

Was delighted to see a Chinese woman talking to both her young children in English last week.

Plenty of time to teach them another language a year or two after they've started school and have a good grasp of English.

Let's assume for the sake of argument you go to live in a country like Mongolia, and you bring your kids with you. Let's assume as well they are old enough to attend school.

Mongolian language being completely different to any language you could've/might've learnt at shool yourself will not be the easiest thing for you as a parent to learn. Do you:

a) Continue to speak to your children in your mother tongue?

b) Take a crash course in the lingo, try to get a job, sort out housing and schooling aaand... communicate effectively and efficiently to your kids in Mogolian?

Mena

darkman2 wrote: »

You probrably could not afford a cardboard box where I live:D

Yeah, well I guess I can smile as apparently it's your government that coughed up for my 5 bed detached and the 2 BMW's parked in the drive way :cool:

The Bollox

Jeff_Lebowski wrote: »

What premises was it up in? My friend lives there and he wants to go and check it out to see if it's still there. He'd never heard of it.

it's almost directly across the road from the hotel. I can't remember the name of the place

AnonoBoy

Mena wrote: »

Yeah, well I guess I can smile as apparently it's your government that coughed up for my 5 bed detached and the 2 BMW's parked in the drive way :cool:

And you stole our wimmins too! Admit it. :eek: