Calcium questions

Red Hand

Hello,

I don't post in this forum but it seems the best place to ask the questions I have.

I'm sort of paronoid about osteoperosis, and have been taking a calcium supplement for the last two years or so. I used to drink milk as my main source of calcium before that but wasn't sure if adults metabolised the calcium present in milk, or whether it was fully absorbed to where it was needed. So I started taking a supplement.

1) Is the calcium in milk in a form that is easily absorbed by the body? Is it true that alot passes out the body in urine?

2) What calcium supplement, that I could buy, is best absorbed by the body?

EileenG

A subject very close to my own heart! I'm paranoid about my bones.

Calcium in milk is absorbed well, but you need a source of fat present for maximum absorbtion, so full fat is better than skim, and cheese is also a good source. The calcium they add to breakfast cereal is not well absorbed, and studies show it does not affect bone density or fracture risk. Only calcium from food that naturally contains it does that.

Egg yolks, tinned fish, cheese, yogurt, tofu, almonds and other nuts, green vegetables like turnip greens, spinach, kale, seaweed, blackstrap molasses, and stock made from bones are good food sources.

As well as calcium, you need vitamin D, magnesium, vitamin K and boran and a few other minerals for strong bones. Vitamin K is one that is often left out of multi-vitamins, so it's worth buying a bottle. Solgar do it, a bottle of 100 is around a fiver. It's in green veg, but not many people eat enough to get their RDA.

You also need a diet with plenty of protein (contrary to what Gillian McKeith thinks, protein does not rot your bones, study after study has shown that a diet with enough calcium and protein can actually remineralise bones). A diet with lots of sugar, refined carbs and cola can leech calcium from your bones. Tea drinking and lots of green veg is protective.

Weight training and high impact exercise can strengthen bones, even after menopause. Breastfeeding is an amazing window of opportunity to strengthen bones as an adult. Women who breastfed for 6 months or longer have a quarter of the hip fractures of those who didn't.

Calcium carbonate and magnesium oxide are very cheap form of cal/mag. Look for better if you can. The best form of calcium is supposed to be microcrystalline hydroxyapatite. I haven't seen it in Dublin, so I order it on-line.

A good home test for bone density is your vertical jump. The denser your bones, the higher you can jump. Reach up and make a mark on the wall as high as you can. Then jump straight up and see how much higher you can touch. Do best out of three. 12 inches for a woman or 18 inches for a man is considered average, but you know your own fitness best, so if your jump is less than you were expecting, it might be an idea to get a formal test.

By the way, they got all the athletes at the Atlanta Olympics to do a vertical jump test. The highest one was recorded, not by a basketball player, but by a 24 stone power lifter.

Red Hand

Thank you very much.:) I never knew about any relationship between jumping and bone density. Must try that!

You mentioned tea drinking as good protection against leeching? I thought that caffeine was one of things to avoid? Or is present in such small amounts in tea (compared to coffee) that it's effect is negligable?

smellslikeshoes

EileenG wrote: »

A good home test for bone density is your vertical jump. The denser your bones, the higher you can jump. Reach up and make a mark on the wall as high as you can. Then jump straight up and see how much higher you can touch. Do best out of three. 12 inches for a woman or 18 inches for a man is considered average, but you know your own fitness best, so if your jump is less than you were expecting, it might be an idea to get a formal test.

By the way, they got all the athletes at the Atlanta Olympics to do a vertical jump test. The highest one was recorded, not by a basketball player, but by a 24 stone power lifter.

Surely a vertical jump is not a remotely accurate test of bone density? Your point about the power lifter jumping higher just illustrates that its more about a test of explosive muscle power.

EileenG

They reckon it's not caffeine as much as the other stuff that goes into cola drinks. Any sugary drink is bad for your bones. Coffee is not good, but not nearly as bad as Coke. And tea seems to be protective, even discounting the added milk. They did that study in Oxford, because they couldn't find enough tea drinkers in America!

Actually, jumping helps to improve bone density. Apparently jumping in bursts of 20 seems to have the best effect.

EileenG

smellslikeshoes wrote: »

Surely a vertical jump is not a remotely accurate test of bone density? Your point about the power lifter jumping higher just illustrates that its more about a test of explosive muscle power.

Just about any athlete at Atlanta should have lots of explosive muscle power. No, it seems that your bone density is directly related to your ability to do a vertical leap.

bwardrop

EileenG wrote: »

it seems that your bone density is directly related to your ability to do a vertical leap.

Hi Eileen - I have been reading and posting on this forum for a little while now and I have noticed you consistently give good advice (particularly in relation to diet / nutrition) which is well written and accessible to all. There is loads of information on this site - good and bad, correct and incorrect and everything in between. While high impact exercises are great for developing & maintaining bone density, to the best of my knowledge there is no direct correlation between vertical jump height and bone density - jump height is certainly not a determinant of bone density. The most accessible method for estimating bone density is a DXA scan. Usually, a person would be referred by their GP if they are considered at risk of osteoporosis. Other methods include ultrasound, MRI, CT etc - predominantly hospital based methods.

Peak bone mass is usually reached after puberty and will decrease as we age. Good bone health involves:

a) being as physically active as possible while your bones are growing
b) having a good diet when your bones are growing

This will help you achieve a greater peak bone density. Evidently, there is not much most of us reading this can do about these now .

A few years after puberty, you bone density will inevitably start to decrease. You can slow this by remaining physically active (this promotes osteocyte turnover) and consuming a good diet. A simple calcium carbonate supplement may be of benefit here.

It is quite an interesting area - recent research indicates that bone is likely to influence fat metabolism... but that is a whole other conversation!!

EileenG

Thanks. Can you point me in the direction of the research about fat and bones?

In general, it's true that once you are adult, you can't do much except slow bone loss, but with the right combination of diet and weight-bearing/high impact exercise, you can increase bone density. Small increases, but enough to make a big difference to your chances of osteoporosis. Also breastfeeding really does make a big difference. During nursing, your bones become metabolically active again: the calcium for the milk is taken from your bones and the calcium from your diet goes back into your bones. If you eat a good diet, you can end up with much stronger bones than before you got pregnant.

As an example, the first time I did a dexa scan, I was told I had ostepenia, and could expect to have osteoporosis by the time I was 50. After several years of breastfeeding and a low carb diet, I had another scan and was told I was unlikely to get ostoeporosis in a normal life time. Score!

Red Hand

I presume the breast feeding as an aid to having sturdy bones only applies to females!?:D

EileenG

Difficult for men.

Hanley

EileenG wrote: »

Difficult for men.

But not impossible :D:D

EileenG

Hanley wrote: »

But not impossible :D:D

Actually not. There is an indigestion remedy which is used off-label for increasing milk production in breastfeeding women. This possibility first came to light when elderly men came to their doctors with milk coming from their nipples.

amazingemmet

EileenG wrote: »

By the way, they got all the athletes at the Atlanta Olympics to do a vertical jump test. The highest one was recorded, not by a basketball player, but by a 24 stone power lifter.

Any linkage for that and how it relates to bone density and not explosive speed?

Hanley

amazingemmet wrote: »

Any linkage for that and how it relates to bone density and not explosive speed?

....and what was a powerlifter doing at the Atlanta olympics?

And 24 stone = 152kg... I only found 4 or 5 guys who competed at that weight at the Atlanta games. Don't suppose you know the name of the person? Or a link to the test?

EileenG

I read about the jumping as an estimate of bone density on a medical site a long time ago, can't remember which, but it was one of the reputable ones. The power lifter jump was mentioned as part of a different topic in something like Men's Fitness. They did name him, Shaun something? but I don't remember exactly.

bwardrop

Hi Eileen - the research on the proposed link between bone & energy metabolism is relatively new and has a genetic focus. Some of it is pretty hardcore - I recommend you have a good medical dictionary to hand when reading!!!

Here is a link to one of the abstracts - the full text link is not working for me at the moment. You can use the 'related articles' link to the left to explore more similar research.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18366536?ordinalpos=1&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_DiscoveryPanel.Pubmed_Discovery_RA&linkpos=4&log$=relatedarticles&logdbfrom=pubmed