cattle marts

charliecon

Just wondering what other peoples thoughts are on those big thick pig ignorant men who work in cattle marts and the way they beat the animals with sticks, I mean they're not just driving them on but absolutely flailing the poor cattle across the back, head ,eyes , anywhere they can reach them so of course the terrified cattle go wild so they wallop them even more.Saw one jackass this evening with the sweat running of him from hammering a weanling who wouldn't go into a pen for him. I know these people should be reported but who to and more to the point does anyone (apart from the farmer who reared and cared for these animals ) give a damn. Sorry for long rant but it's something that really annoys me:mad:

gordon_gekko

charliecon wrote: »

Just wondering what other peoples thoughts are on those big thick pig ignorant men who work in cattle marts and the way they beat the animals with sticks, I mean they're not just driving them on but absolutely flailing the poor cattle across the back, head ,eyes , anywhere they can reach them so of course the terrified cattle go wild so they wallop them even more.Saw one jackass this evening with the sweat running of him from hammering a weanling who wouldn't go into a pen for him. I know these people should be reported but who to and more to the point does anyone (apart from the farmer who reared and cared for these animals ) give a damn. Sorry for long rant but it's something that really annoys me:mad:

my uncle is a farmer and i have been on occasion visited a mart , the mart staff have no choice but to beat the cattle , those cattle are not people friendly , there reared by there mother ( suckled ) and not used to much human interaction apart from when there being brought to the mart ,
also , cattle are pretty stupid animals so the only thing they understand is force , compared to most animals , cattle have a pretty good life , there well fed for the most part and most of them die in a painless manner when there eventually shot at the meat factory

muggyog

does anyone ......give a damn.

Unfortunately no!

kfk

Usually the mart workers will not use too much force unless it is necessary. Why would they. It would only create extra work and hassle for themselves. Generally, wild cattle have to be kept moving and not have time to think otherwise it can become dangerous for the handler.

charliecon

I go to the mart every week plus I work with "wild cattle" every day and I can tell you the way the cattle are beaten is way over the top. I have to say not all the workers are like this just some in particular and any of you who think I am exaggerating really should spend a day in your local mart.

fastrac

I use Macroom and have to say the staff are A1.Right they use sticks but not like you describe.there are 100s of cattle to get through in a few hours and I take my hat off to them for a job most people would look down their noses at.

charliecon

That's good fastrac and I do know its not the norm everywhere but it happens all the time in this Co. Meath mart especially the bullock ring .By the way I have no objection to them using sticks to drive or stop the cattle ,hell I use one myself- they're essential, it's when you see a 6'6" 25 stone jackass (amongst others) use his whole strength to hammer a calf, that's what I'm on about.

hattie-f

im frequently in marts and i am usually infuriated by some of the handlers
they beat the animals to hard

it is clear that cattle are under enouf stress as it is after being moved from surroundings that are normal to them to then be moved into a enviroment that is busseling with people and normally quite noisy.
the way that calves are handled annoys me the most.
last week there was a calf that was no older than a week lying in a wet pen and she looked half dead. if people were half humane they would let these animals have at least a clean dry pen. needles to say she was unsold.

a previous comment said about the 'stupid' cattle but i would like to inform them that they still get ill feel pain and althought an animals death mite be humane the conditions that alot of farmers put them through before they get there arnt humane!!!!
:mad:

but i must admit that a stick is part of a farmers every day kit especially with the wilder selection of cattle and that although you do have the brutes in the mart most of them arnt like that and fair play to them for keeping the string of cattle moving my motto is kindness is key!

meathstevie

I remember years ago an abbotoir owner in Aalst ( central Belgium, near Brussels ) barring a particular independent transport lad from his yard. He used to wallop the bejeezes out of the cattle he brought in for farmers until the owner of the place told him to f-off and not to come back untill he understood that the cattle needed to be as stress and painfree as possible before they came to slaughter line.

I was there when it happened and my old man said he should have done that years ago because the muppet had cost farmers and butchers thousands upon thousands due to his stupid way of handling cattle.

snowman707

a lot of the blame lies with the idiots that designed the penning & the passage ways in the marts, i reckon they never got a splash of cow sh*t in their lives only a shiny arse on their trousers from sitting behind a desk

i seen one mart built about 15 years ago that to cut out the race going to the scales cos no way would the animals go up the race & in the same mart the gates in the in the loading bay were opening the wrong way.

massey woman

What do you all think of the Tanglers spinning their fingers claiming the next animal into the ring.
Mohill and Drumshanbo is serious for this .Young bucks with the arse out a their trousers trying to blaguard decent people who reared the animals and bring them to the sales in expectation of getting their value. All these tanglers are big men using other mens cheque books

Sam Kade

I took a calf to a mart a few years ago. When I was unloading the calf I saw a buyer watching he used to try to buy my calves before I put them through the mart I told him if he wanted them to bid on them while they were in the ring. Anyway when the calf came into ring there was one 1 or 2 bids then the bidding stopped dead my friend the calf buyer tipped off all the other buyers not to bid on the calf.

charliecon

I hope you took the calf home with you Sam ,its the only way you can get the better of them fcukers. Round these parts they try that regular cos its only a small mart so when they try it on with us we just tell the auctioneer to let all our cattle out, load them up and head to a bigger mart a few miles away the following week. I know its a lot of hassle and really maddening but I would not give them shower of bastards the satisfaction of getting one over on me:mad:

As for the gob****es "claiming" cattle ,there's feck all you can do about it other than ate the arse of the auctioneer - he can stop them by telling them their bids will not be accepted ,mind you in the bigger marts they can claim all they like but nobody gives them one bit of heed.

Sam Kade

Yes I brought the calf home again, I knew your man that tipped the buyers off but I had no way of proving that it was him.

JohnBoy

how does this claiming thing work?

Sam Kade

JohnBoy wrote: »

how does this claiming thing work?

Buyers argue with one another over certain animals they don't want to pay too much so they won't start a bidding war thats why they try to claim animals.

charliecon

JohnBoy wrote: »

how does this claiming thing work?

Round here the tanglers put their arm into to the ring and make circles with their hand to let everyone know that they want to buy the next animal and for the others not to bid on it.

massey woman

Did you ever notice how when the tangler is at home he is so friendly -mostly cos his cattle are thieving or starving as they never have time to maintain the fencing etc - but when you meet him in the mart he ignores you. Your neighbour the tangler will have his arm around some big farmer or fellow dealer who he is trying to keep sweet or maybe buy a cheap animal and switch to his buddy who doesnt want to appear to be getting all the handy ones.
Some even starve the cattle and sheep around here. There have been a number of jail sentences applied for same.Tanglers are similar to drug pushers think they can muscle in and upset the trade in their favour.
Oh yeah and if you aspire to being a tangling man get a pair a YELLAW Boots and britches no other qualifications necessary
Dont worry about the price you pay cos its another mans cheque book your being a big fella with and there is the €30 commission from the buyer and sometimes afew € from the mart and may be another few € luck money from the seller.
PHEW

fred432

Is it time for an ebay type mart? Prices can vary by time of day an when bidders go to lunch. Maybe cattle could be left in pens for a set period of time with all their details posted and bids could be submitted up to a set closing time. This would guarantee best price for seller and better opportunity to evaluate cattle for the buyer.

pjbrady1

Was at a mart today. Won't name it as people might get named. But I couldn't believe the aggressive in your face behaviour of some of the bidders.
I hadn't been in a mart in about fourteen years. One guy got up from ringside and was shouting directly into a mans face. His crime, he bid on some cattle at a mart .....

I had never heard of this business of twisting your hand in the ring, seen loads of guys at it, but it's pointless as they're all at it.

Also noticed that bidding was conducted by so few bidders. 4 -5 bidders were mopping up 70% o the stock.

Noticed that farmers are still overpaying for good quality muscled continental stock. 400 euros with the kilo!!!! Angus only made 100 with the kilo. Maybe that's the export guys.

Finally noticed a lad about 22, in a tracksuit, soft hands, obviously not a full time farmer. Bidding for awhile he was. Then not another single bid. He did a lot of staring over at other bidders, and shouting over abuse like "f you you boll*x'

Overall the last time I'll ever set foot in a mart for quite awhile. It's like a down at heel bookies, hard to feel comfortable with a small minority of the people who are around.

Finally how do Marts manage to suck the heat out of the air. Twas freexin, but one hard chaw was in a t-shirt. (Would a been a good photo, everyone else was in jackets and hats)

massey woman

Was in a mart today myself
The tanglers were all getting their turns
Some farmers knew the value of their stock and didnt sell
Others just gave them away as the land in the west is in shiite after such a wet summer and cattle are failing
Looking at the age profile of the farmers a few under 30's mostly 50 plus and a few sprightly 80+
Have any of you noticed the number of people who smoke in the mart and a lot of them would blow the smoke in your face too
Is it legal to smoke up on the seats
There are still a lot of ignorant f***ers in the marts
What do you think of the mart food
Tasty at the time but the thoughts of it now has me belly spinning !!

irish_bob

pjbrady1 wrote: »

Was at a mart today. Won't name it as people might get named. But I couldn't believe the aggressive in your face behaviour of some of the bidders.
I hadn't been in a mart in about fourteen years. One guy got up from ringside and was shouting directly into a mans face. His crime, he bid on some cattle at a mart .....

I had never heard of this business of twisting your hand in the ring, seen loads of guys at it, but it's pointless as they're all at it.

Also noticed that bidding was conducted by so few bidders. 4 -5 bidders were mopping up 70% o the stock.

Noticed that farmers are still overpaying for good quality muscled continental stock. 400 euros with the kilo!!!! Angus only made 100 with the kilo. Maybe that's the export guys.

Finally noticed a lad about 22, in a tracksuit, soft hands, obviously not a full time farmer. Bidding for awhile he was. Then not another single bid. He did a lot of staring over at other bidders, and shouting over abuse like "f you you boll*x'

Overall the last time I'll ever set foot in a mart for quite awhile. It's like a down at heel bookies, hard to feel comfortable with a small minority of the people who are around.

Finally how do Marts manage to suck the heat out of the air. Twas freexin, but one hard chaw was in a t-shirt. (Would a been a good photo, everyone else was in jackets and hats)

thats cattle dealers for you, possibly the lowest form of life in rural ireland

thetangler

If the cattle dealers were taken out of the marts 60% of cattle would go home unsold. The dealer is a necessary part of the picture.:D

reilig

thetangler wrote: »

If the cattle dealers were taken out of the marts 60% of cattle would go home unsold. The dealer is a necessary part of the picture.:D

+1

And if a farmer spots an animal that he wants to buy, he has to be prepared to bid above the dealer. Dealers are looking for cheap cattle - Farmers, if buying in, should be looking for good cattle.

irish_bob

thier are two things ive always found with cattle dealers , most of them come from a particular county and secondly , thier is no such thing as an honest cattle dealer

massey woman

What about the auctioneers
How do you know a good one
When hes selling for ya hes great
Tell ya Im on me own now I have no one will I put him on
Hate to hear that
when your buying then you know he could take you for a spin
PJ Reynolds the best auctioneer in the West
Knows everyone tanglers,farmers,dealers,novices the lot and the value of the beast
He would sing a song for ya too

thetangler

Yip P.J. does know the value of stock, and how the whole thing works, but so do most experienced auctioneers.

marzic

i'm from a farming background, but have never heard this term 'tangler'. it appears that it is accepted as normal, but does it distort the market? is it against competition rules? dealers of any description are prone to sharp practice, but 'cattle dealers' in 'ireland' must be the perfect combination!

To address the op, i would suggest that there have always been the headers who will flake all day and generally dont give a sh*t about what damage they do. Also i would suggest that cattle nowadays are being handled less at home, due to some farmers having to work another job as well as the farm, so it conspires to create wild cattle. the layout in old marts is not always up to the mark. It would be interesting to see if mart owners have addressed the issue in their H&S document or corporate plan

pakalasa

I stopped going to one particular mart because this one auctioneer was selling cattle to himself, ie taking false bids. You could be bidding, he'd then take a false bid at the other side of the mart, come back to you, if you were any way slow he'd bring the hammer down quickly.
My father used to say it and it happened to me more than once. I'd follow the cattle out and hear the lads outside saying to "put them in for ***, the auctioneer". He would sell his own cattle too, looking in at the sellers box and winking at the dealers (tanglers to some)...even though his name was coming up as the seller.............only in Ireland.
You really do need to keep your wits about you at a mart. Some of the newer Marts have signs up now saying that hands in the rings are taking as bids. I've going for years now and farmers take no notice of this. When they "claim them", they, the dealers agree not to bid again one another.

As for handling cattle in marts, have a look at this. Dr Temple Grandin is an autistic woman in the USA who designs handling facilities to minimise stress in cattle....curved chutes etc
http://www.grandin.com/

fig mclough

yea i tink its madness and very unnessary in most cases!!! wat anoys me da most is da dope in the ring!!!!! everybody can tell if a bullock is mad but yet they still persist in beatin him around d ring!!!!!

lanod2407

Yeah - I've seen programmes on cattle slaughtering and how important it is to keep the animals as placid and calm as possible 'cos the meat from stressed cattle isn't as good.

Apparently curved chutes are a key component as the animals really do not like corners ....... strange, but quite true apparently!

Sam Kade

I bought cattle at a mart last week. One bullock had a bad cut on his knee when he arrived on my farm. The following morning his leg was completely swollen up to his shoulder. I called the vet and he gave him an intravenous injection and I gave him antibiotics for a few days luckily enough the swelling went down after a few days. He must have got injured at the mart. The mart covers themselves by having signs up saying they are not responsible for any injuries to cattle.

fullup

Hi all I’d like to make a note;

Am from a farming background and also I have a father who was a cattle dealer in the earlier days of us kids growing up.
There is a number of things that I have inadvertently been thought from following my father from mart to mart, fair days and house calling.

It’s a difficult life that the dealer of yesteryear had but my parents made sure we all received an education and wanted us to keep away from that life.

I have insight that I taught might help.
There is no Margin and a dealer be very lucky to have a weeks wage (Very lucky)
The fancy dressed dealers and the chatter boxes don’t have money there fronting for someone else.

A dealer can ruin another dealer very easy and sometimes they will burn each other.
You have too in order to show that your not being walked over today.

Days can be long and nights even longer just to make a few quid.

Dealer friendship is far and between I’ve seen fights over a 100 punt calf’s and lorries damaged. If you are purchasing animals you are there early to inspect you write your numbers down and you chat and let some of the others know what you’re after your only trying to pay what you think the animal is worth and hope to make a profit later but this is hard because there are so many probabilities and you can't cover all bases.
Work it out what a dealer can make, it’s not a lot after you take everything into account.

If a farmer starts to bid the dealer will stop simply because Farmers are dangerous people in an auction/mart they don’t have a handbrake and get over excited. i have purchased animals for my self in marts a lot easier than the farmer standing beside me because he/she has been waiting all day for that one animal. (Obviously more can be expanded on)

Yes there are auctioneers who are good, bad and ****!! But you watch them and follow how they work, you can figure it out how to work with them.
We as farmer sell some of our own breed animals at the mart and knowing knowledge like that helps a lot. Don't be shy with the auctioneer.

There are dealers out there who I wouldn’t touch but there are some just trying to make ends meet at the end of their doc sheet.

Mart Employees i think there are some lads that could do with some training and some facilities upgraded. I don't personal think you see as much badness out there as years ago but training for the new lads could be a good option as I've seen a few bad techniques.

bob charles

fullup wrote: »

Hi all I’d like to make a note;

Am from a farming background and also I have a father who was a cattle dealer in the earlier days of us kids growing up.
There is a number of things that I have inadvertently been thought from following my father from mart to mart, fair days and house calling.

It’s a difficult life that the dealer of yesteryear had but my parents made sure we all received an education and wanted us to keep away from that life.

I have insight that I taught might help.
There is no Margin and a dealer be very lucky to have a weeks wage (Very lucky)
The fancy dressed dealers and the chatter boxes don’t have money there fronting for someone else.

A dealer can ruin another dealer very easy and sometimes they will burn each other.
You have too in order to show that your not being walked over today.

Days can be long and nights even longer just to make a few quid.

Dealer friendship is far and between I’ve seen fights over a 100 punt calf’s and lorries damaged. If you are purchasing animals you are there early to inspect you write your numbers down and you chat and let some of the others know what you’re after your only trying to pay what you think the animal is worth and hope to make a profit later but this is hard because there are so many probabilities and you can't cover all bases.
Work it out what a dealer can make, it’s not a lot after you take everything into account.

If a farmer starts to bid the dealer will stop simply because Farmers are dangerous people in an auction/mart they don’t have a handbrake and get over excited. i have purchased animals for my self in marts a lot easier than the farmer standing beside me because he/she has been waiting all day for that one animal. (Obviously more can be expanded on)

Yes there are auctioneers who are good, bad and ****!! But you watch them and follow how they work, you can figure it out how to work with them.
We as farmer sell some of our own breed animals at the mart and knowing knowledge like that helps a lot. Don't be shy with the auctioneer.

There are dealers out there who I wouldn’t touch but there are some just trying to make ends meet at the end of their doc sheet.

Mart Employees i think there are some lads that could do with some training and some facilities upgraded. I don't personal think you see as much badness out there as years ago but training for the new lads could be a good option as I've seen a few bad techniques.

Thats a very accurate post. Always think its funny the way most on here think the regular guys buying the cattle are best of buddies