[US/IRL] 4X13/4X14- "There's No Place Like Home (2)/(3)" [** SPOILERS WITHIN **]

Basq

- WARNING: THIS THREAD WILL CONTAIN SPOILERS FOR THOSE WHO HAVE NOT YET SEEN "THERE'S NO PLACE LIKE HOME (2)/(3)" -

Episode Title: "There's No Place Like Home (2)/(3)"
Airdate: May 29th 2008

Synopsis (from TV.Com):

As the face-off between the survivors and the freighter people continues, and the Oceanic Six find themselves closer to rescue.

Next New Episode: 5X01 - TBA - 2009

---

SPOILER WARNING:

From now on, this thread shall reveal details of the episode mentioned above. If you have not yet seen this episode, please do not move any further down the thread.

This episode shall air on:

ABC (US) - May 29th 2008
RTÉ (IRL) - June 2nd 2008

If you are sure you have seen the episode as mentioned above (on the channels on those original airdates), you can move down further in order to discuss the episode.

Otherwise, YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED - there shall be major plot details of the episode revealed and discussed below with no spoiler tags used!

Faith

9

So is tonight the last night for this season of Lost? I don't want it to be over!

Basq

Yep.. last one til end of January / start of February next year.

doonothing

7

Oh it's not that long away is it?

Will it not startin september?

Sinfonia

9

Too marvellous for words.

11/10

Creamy Goodness

H
O
L
Y

F
E
C
K

best 1 hour and 23 minutes a 2 seconds of lost ever.

so glad that desmond didn't die, it was looking that way for a while.

few cool bits, nice to see how ben got the cut on his arm when he totally kicked the **** into them two arab guys.

the ending was a major mind phuck, why jeremy bentham and why is he locke?

that's going to be playing in my head for the rest of the summer, thanks lost you just ruined my summer.

*EDIT* ben looked very vampire-ish in the end, couldn't stop laughing at that.

Sad Professor

9

*sigh*

8 months...

*weeps quietly in the corner*

Can't stop thinking about that last scene. Some really twisted humour in there. Jack sobbing about how everyone hates him. Then Ben's line: "We'll have to bring him too." And Jack's casual reaction. rofl.

Anyway great stuff as usual. I'll write a proper review later.

SP

phantom_lord

idk, i liked the earlier seasons of lost, but this season has turned me off the show completely, i didn't find this episode (nor most of the earlier ones) interesting at all.

randomchild

Oh dear god, how am i going to wait for next season after that ending? Desmond and penny finally being reunited was awesome too.

Oh and Check mate, Mr. Eko

eddiehead

8

It was a great ep alright, but am I the only one who thinks the wheel idea was a little silly? Apart from that it was excellent, my 2 favourite parts were -
- "Check mate, Mr Eko", that really came out of nowhere.I'd love to see more of Eko, i know hes dead but stranger things have happened.

- Christian to Michael "You can go now", that little scene was about as cold as it gets, kinda makes me think Christian may be a bit of a baddie, hmm.

Have to say it never crossed my mind that it could be Locke in the coffin, obviously he now needs to be ressurected of something. The earth shattering kiss didnt really live up to the hype, fair play to Sawyer though. Glad to see Des is still alive, hes brilliant, but I wonder is he one of the group Ben referred to in the end, I hope so anyway.

Im a little lost as to what this means for on-island goings on next season, apart from finding out what happened to Locke, I cant think of much else. The Mercs are all dead, the freighter is gone, a lot of people on the Island actually want to stay there, the Others arent kicking up much of a fuss and hardy will when Lockes in charge. Maybe the writers are finally gona take us through some of the mysteries on the Island(Smokey, Jacob, Four toed Statue, history of the Others, Dharma, Black Rock), having said that,I remember Darlton saying at some point that Jacob and the Statue were issues for season 5, so hopefully they'l live up to that.

Also Starring LeVar Burton

9

Wow. Awesome. WTF?

I know everyone said Jin and Michael were toast, but I didn't actually believe it would happen. And Locke, for the last 10 minutes or so I was certain it was gonna be Desmond, Ben or Frank in the coffin, but when Ben came in for some reason I knew it'd be Locke, but I don't know why Desmond and Frank were suddenly safe at that point, in my mind.

Loved the reference to Eko. It'd be great if he started returning next season, playing chess with Hurley and we actually got to see him.

WTF happened to Farraday and the Red Shirts when the Island disappeared? Did they get moved with the island? Are they stranded at sea? Did they all drown? I wanna see Farraday get back to the beach. Could be a new love triangle between him, Charlotte and Juliette. Did anyone else notice all the chemistry there?

Speaking of Charlotte, what was up with the little revelation from Miles? Charlotte said something to Daniel about still looking for where she was born. Is she old enough to be Annie, perhaps? Could she be related to someone on the island?

It was very strange seeing older Walt, but a clever way by the writers to bring him back into the show. Could he be one of the ones who'll urley didn't tell him about Michael. Not knowing what the hell is going on with his dad is probably worse in the long run than finding out he's dead.

Was Claire appearing to Kate, a dream, or was she a ghost? I hope Claire isn't dead, but it ain't looking good for her at the moment.

It was obvious that Sawyer was gonna jump, but a great scene none the less and such a noble act. That was one of the best moments in the finale.

Anyone else under the impression that if Jack, Sun, Kate, Aaron, Sayid, Hurley, Locke's Body, Desmond, Frank and Ben get back to the island, that will be how the show ends?

RIP Jin Kwon
RIP Michael Dawson
RIP John Locke

Xyo

If Locke is truly dead i.e done with the show then I am done with lost.

Dont be at yourself

7

Rubbish, rubbish special effects.

eddiehead

8

Xyo wrote: »

If Locke is truly dead i.e done with the show then I am done with lost.

He is absolutely not done, he has to be brought back to the Island. Anyway, the coffin scene in 3 years in the future, it could be a looong time before he dies anyway.

Gingervitis

9

A bit random, but I felt so happy that I called the coffin!

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=53318112&postcount=12

The best hour and a half of tv this year, period.

Favourite line was Ben's response to Locke's giving out to him after killing Keamy: "So?"

I wonder how Sun'll be persuaded to come back? She seems to be in cahoots with Widmore now.

Can't say any more, mind is blown.

Anima

9

That was really great. None stop action from start to finish. Had a nice balance between on island politics and the mysteries of the island as well as the future stuff. Very well done. Although the special effects were awful in some places :P

10/10 from me anyway.

Sad Professor

9

Check out the two alternate endings:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DWWMYFAycmQ

SP

Goodshape

5

MEH.

I've enjoyed this season so far but really.. that was pretty awful.

Basq

Averted my eyes navigating down this thread as I've just started watching it and paused at the 'Lost' credits...


.. but I had to comment on the fact that the bundles of explosive has been labelled 'C4 EXPLOSIVES!". At if it needed an exclamation mark at the end to elaborate how explosive and deadly it is..

... that is all!

Back to the episode!

Creature

9

Great episode. Loved the fight between Keamy and Sayid and the dramatic exit of Jin. Glad to see Des survived too, though the way it left him and Penny sailing off into the sunset, I get the feeling we wont be seeing any more of him. Hopefully I'll be wrong. Ben at his most cold-blooded, was the star of the once again.

anotherlostie

7

To paraphrase Eamo Dunphy, I thought it was a good episode, not a great episode. I really felt there was serious amounts of padding going on at times (OK, some of it was to reflect the scenes when they arrived on the island, but first we had them getting to the boat, then to shore...), and that as a 41 minute episode, it might have been so much more. And this to the detriment of not knowing what happened to Faraday and raftees - are they doomed or did they move with the island (considering that both islands moved together), and those left on the island like Sawyer and Juliet.

I was surprised that Keamy and crew were dispatched so easily. Maybe now John is living with the mystical non-Other Others, we will find out what makes this bunch such sh!t hot ninjas.

I was intrigued by Charlotte's comments, she has to be Annie, IMHO. And I have no idea why Sun was talking business with Widmore.

Overall I felt satisfied by the episode, but it is not killing me that there is no more Lost for 9 months, whereas last year,the flash forward idea opened the show up so much at the same time.

8/10 and I'll deffo be watching a second time.

Royale with Cheese

6

anotherlostie wrote: »

I have no idea why Sun was talking business with Widmore.

Maybe she knows it was Ben that was ultimately responsible for Jin's death and he's the second person she holds responsible for his death along with her father.

She thinks Ben is still on the island and that Widmore wants him dead, and wants to help him.

jor el

anotherlostie wrote: »

I was intrigued by Charlotte's comments, she has to be Annie, IMHO.

I thought that as soon as Miles said about her trying to get back to the island. I wonder who told him, one of the dead people?

And I have no idea why Sun was talking business with Widmore.

Presumably the other person she blames for Jin's death is the driving factor here. I'm guessing Ben, as he did blow up the boat without even caring, but it could be someone else. I don't understand why she doesn't hold Widmore partly responsible, since it was probably his plan to have that much explosives on the boat in the first place. Unless she does blame him, and this is her way of getting to him. Part of a larger plan maybe?

I must say, I quite enjoyed it all in all. Leaving Faraday and the extras in the middle of the ocean, that would be quite cruel. I wonder were they close enough to the island to move with it?

How the hell does Locke make it off, and why suicide? I thought when Sayid mentioned that, that maybe he killed the mysterious "Jeremy Bentham". Long wait till next year. Oh well.

Niall0

9

"The body of John Bentham of New York was found shortly after 4 am in the 4300 block of Grand Avenue.

Ted Worden, a doorman at the Tower Lofts complex, heard loud noises coming from the victim’s loft.

Concerned for tenants’ safety, he entered the loft and found the body hanging from a beam in the living room.

According to Jaime Ortiz, a police spokesman, the incident was deemed a suicide after medical tests. Latham (sic) is survived by one teenaged son.

Memorial services will be held at the Hoffs-Drawlar Funeral Home tomorrow evening."
That was the newspaper clipping from season 3 If this was Locke. Whos his son? Maybe Walt went to live with him .

tvnutz

8

Mind frak of an episode once again. Good stuff though.

So I guess we can assume Michael is done for good,Christian saying he could go now. Is Jin dead for sure? he was at the edge of the boat,could have gotten blown out to sea.

Locke in the coffin,Locke is one of the best characters so fairly annoyed about that. Can he actually be brought back to life?

Des and Penny scenes were good,but does that mean they wont be in it anymore? Is he and Frank included in the group that need to go back?

too many questions...gah!

Sad Professor

9

Niall0, the parts of the obituary visible in the episode didn't mention anything about a teenage son. The supposed full text that you quoted was actually posted by someone on The Fuselage claiming it was leak from the prop department. However one of the words ("found" vs "discovered") didn't match the episode so it was always suspected to be foiler.

This was the best anyone could decipher from screenshots at the time:

The body of Jo~~~ ~~ntham of
New York was found shortly after 4
a.m. in the ~~~~ block of Grand
Avenue.
Ted ~~~~ a doorman at The
Tower ~~~~ complex heard loud
noises coming from the victim's loft.
Concerned for the ~~~~ safety, he
entered the loft and discovered the
body hanging from a beam in the
living room.
According to ~~~~ ~~~~ Ortiz,
a police spokesman, the incident
was deemed a ~~~~ ~~~~ ~~~~
~~~~.

mewso

9

I really don't think it's likely that Sun doesn't blame widmore. Why do people take some things literally and not others. Seems to me she probably is out to get him and the approach was a ruse. I mean she can't walk up and shoot him in broad daylight and get away with it.

mewso

9

Another thought. If Jin or Michael are alive then they'll need a good explanation for how they might get back to the island or whatever happens to them because there is no way they were nearer to the island than the chopper.

Mr E

9

Absolutely loved it... thrilling from start to finish.

My ban reflex is twitchy for the asshole here who RUINED the ending for me 2 weeks ago though. :mad:

abelard

Royale with Cheese wrote: »

Maybe she knows it was Ben that was ultimately responsible for Jin's death and he's the second person she holds responsible for his death along with her father.

I figured Jack's comment in the last scene meant that he's the second person she blames. Probably for not going back for Jin.

Anyway good episode, loads going on, pity about the long wait now!

bazzachazza

8

Heres what the voice said to Kate on the phone. It was originally backwards when she heard it.

Sorry for the thread creep. Thought this was a fantastic episode.

Sqaull20

Exotic Matter, spin the wheel!!!

Huge let down for me..

DVD-Lots

9

wow, just wow. TV at its best. Yes I had a lump in my throat at the Searcher (sp) part, classic Lost ftw. More answers than questions I thought, which is a new direction for lost. Was kept guessing for the coffin though and for me that makes for great TV. Roll on Season 5!!!

steviec

6

I was a bit disappointed overall actually.

I mean, plenty happened in the episode. The Oceanic 6 got off the island. Jin died. The island moved. Ben ended up in Tunisia. The thing is, I knew all these things before the episode started because other episodes told us it was all going to happen. I was expecting a twist but never really got one.

The only real good surprise was Desmond, which was a fantastic scene, I really enjoyed that bit after waiting so long, and when I was really worried at various points in the episode that he wasn't going to make it.

On the whole though, it was solid, but just not as spectacular as the finale of each other season of Lost. I was expecting a big shock to happen at any time but it never did. Obviously there was the coffin reveal which is a big deal, but again we knew we were going to find out and it was only ever going to be one of a few people, once Ben walked into the room it was obvious who it was going to be, so it wasn't that big a surprise. Huge disappointment though, Locke is too great a character to die!

What I'm left wondering for next year though is, how do they justify the characters' motivation in going back to the island. As far as I can tell the only people left alive on the island that they would care about are Sawyer, Rose and Bernard, and it just doesn't seem right that the future of the show will be based around rescuing those three people.

I know the others are still on the island, along with Faraday and pals, but there's no reason for any of the Oceanic Six to care about them so it just doesn't add up to me, unless Jack comes round to Locke's way off thinking that the island is more than just an island and it needs protecting...

Niall0

9

The thing im wondering is how and why did locke leave the island? everything was wrapping up nicely and then they throw dead locke at us WTF?

Hugh_C

8

CaptainNegative wrote: »

RIP John Locke

Locke will mysteriously reanimate for season 5, no doubt about it.

I have to agree with comments about the dodgy effects, with Lost's shedloads of money they could have been better, especially around the ship blowing up, and when Sayid leans out of the helicopter to check the leak. The Disappearing was pretty good though.

So when Ben says "whoever moves the island can't go back", I guess that precludes him from returning in season 5. I'm wondering who moved the island before - maybe Matthew Abaddon?

Anyhoo, liked the finale a lot.

Favourite moments: Jack playing Pixies Gouge Away on the way to the funeral parlor. Ben stepping out of the shadows in the funeral parlor - really wasn't expecting that but then knew immediately it was Locke in the coffin. And good ol' Sawyer calling Frank "Kenny Rogers". Class. Roll on se05.

rizzla

I think Sun approaching Widmore is set after the funeral scene. Widmore found a way to the island before so can do again, Ben and Jack managed to convince Sun to get in with Widmore, so he does the hard work. With Ben effectivly banished from the island I'm guessing this means he could be out of the entire loop of whats happening on the island. WIdmore is there only real link then.

Mr.Nice Guy

8

I thought it was less satisfying than previous season finales but it was nonetheless gripping stuff. I was shocked to see Locke in the coffin but the fact they look set to bring him to the island leads me to think he might be resurrected via another miracle. If not, I'm sure he'll make appearances a la Christian.

I too liked the Des/Penny scene which was very well done. I was happy Des survived and was worried they might kill him off during the 'copter crash. I wonder will Des have to go back to the island too along with Lapidus? Or will it not matter for them since they're not Oceanic members? One to ponder...

I've a feeling that's the end of Michael alright but I'm not so sure about Jin. I think it's possible he could have made it.

One thing that Jack said has me wondering about Sun. He said Sun blamed him for what happened to Jin, and in last week's episode Sun told her father that he was one of two men responsible for Jin's death. Does that mean the other one is Jack in her eyes? Is that why she's helping Widmore? I'm not sure but I would be surprised if that's the case. I bet she's working with Ben or something.

Anyways a good, action-packed episode. Shame the next season is so far away and that most of the stuff in this episode will be forgotten about!

doonothing

7

Alright finale... I was expecting so much more! The effects were pretty meh... And I thought the actor's reaction to the island moving was a disaster, such pantomime panic! It seemed so silly.

Ok, I'm confused. Widmore puts fake plane in water to make world believe flight 815 crashed. He sends Freighter folk off to make sure that everyone who survived is dead. The O6 make it off the island. Would that not make a fair few people wonder what happened with fake plane? And, they're off the island, what difference does it make if the other people on the island survive? And the whole moving the island, presumably that's gonna put a bit of a spanner in the works of Widmore and co's attempt to find them and kill them... So confused!

Another thing, what has happened that caused everyone to call Locke Benthem? Part of the lie presumably?

The next series is totally gonna end with the O6's return to the island.

Pretty good episode, just, as has been said, we already knew everything that happened was gonna happen, I was PRAYING for a nice tantalising twist, with no previous hints. Sigh!

8. For effort.

doonothing

7

bazzachazza wrote: »

Heres what the voice said to Kate on the phone. It was originally backwards when she heard it.

Sorry for the thread creep. Thought this was a fantastic episode.

Creeeeepy...

I also hated the wheel spinning (WHAT, like, what sense does that make, at all, spinning a wheel to move the island. What?)

Exotic matter? some explanation alright! I don't mind lotsa mysteries and questions, just not ****e answers!

cooker3

I really enjoyed this. It was pretty action packed throughout. I think it continues really well the lost theme of having wtf type endings that season 2 and 3 had.

I loved the Desmond and Penny reunion. It was completely unexpected for me (in this episode anyway) Just so satisfying after waiting 2 years to actually see it happen.Although consequently it meant I was utterly convinced it was Desmond in the coffin until the camera panned over it for the reveal. I am not really sure whats left for Desmond now. Is he 1 of the people who have to go back to the island? Maybe he will protect Penny from Ben I suppose.

As I said didn't see the Locke reveal at all and it really shocked me. But hopefully it doesn't mean the end of locke's character. There is still a lot of questions on how he ended up there and what will become of his body/spirit whatever on the island.

I am open to Jin status. I wouldn't be shocked if he was still alive, anyone hear any word from Daniel Dae Kim on what's happening with him?
Also what happened with Faraday and the raft people?
Also I think anotherlostie made a good call with Charlotte being Annie, that never occurred to me at all. Hopefully we see much more of the freighter folk in season 5, I think the 2 hours lost from the strike really impacted their story the most.

I thought Michael Emerson just stole the show once again, it's almost easy to overlook but he is so incredible most notable when he was turning the frozen donkey wheel. He also had line of episode with the time travelling bunnies line.

Overall I don't think it quite leaves the same amount of questions that season 3 finale and namely the flashforward left but there are still a ton of them.

Where is the island in time and in space?
How did Locke go from leading the others to dead in a funeral home?
What were the bad things that happened in the gap, who or what caused them?
What became of everyone else left on island.
Structurally how will season 5 be put together. Will the off island become real time as such, will the island take the place of the flashes.

8 months is too long

DonkeyStyle \o/

8

Frank: "I'd feel a hell of a lot better if we were a few hundred pounds lighter."
(Cut to Hurley's hangdog expression.)
Brilliant

Nice to see Ben whooping ass with that extendable batton thing again.
I was expecting them to capture Kimi and keep him alive for interrogation (and to delay the explosion)... but oh well, at least they've wrapped up another loose end.
Which I think this episode did nicely in general.

Pretty good I thought.

cooker3

doonothing wrote: »

Ok, I'm confused. Widmore puts fake plane in water to make world believe flight 815 crashed. He sends Freighter folk off to make sure that everyone who survived is dead. The O6 make it off the island. Would that not make a fair few people wonder what happened with fake plane? And, they're off the island, what difference does it make if the other people on the island survive? And the whole moving the island, presumably that's gonna put a bit of a spanner in the works of Widmore and co's attempt to find them and kill them... So confused!

The story still stands at least to the general public. The fake plane was Oceanic 815. The O6 are the ones who escaped alive from there. This is why the plan was concoted which led Penny to bring them 3000 miles away to just off the indonesian island. As for why a flight from Sydney to LA would crash in that region is still up in the air.
The island moving means Windmore can't find it again so he is left in the position before the hatch imploded I assume

Yeah I agree that the special effects were pretty poor it has to be said

Sherifu

7

All in all typical Lost finale fare. Getting a bit old for me. The coffin ending and Penny&Des reunion sort of made up for crappy effects and the exotic matter bs. I'm not giving Jin up for dead. I thought it was obvious Sun is helping Widmore to get revenge on Ben who killed Keamy/caused the explosion. My guess is Faraday and his band shouldn't have moved with the island but I wouldn't be surprised if they did. Michael went out with a heroic bang. That scene with Christian was another wtf moment as was checkmate Mr. Eko and Miles conversaion with Charlotte.

I'll give it an 8.

Kenny Rogers, rofl.

Basq

I'd have to agree with the people who thought it was my good but not fantastic... possibly simply let down due to the expectation of it being amazing.

The first hour was excellent but the second was less so - and the wheel idea was all a bit daft.

And as for Locke in the coffin, it was ruined to me by some fúckwit on here (who is now banned for life) - good riddance! It was interesting to see they filmed 2 endings with Desmond and Sawyer.. but Locke was the only one that really made sense (with regards to the points Gingivitis brought up in his post a few weeks back).

I called the exact reason they were lying about the crash 2 weeks ago anyways.. but in my mind, it was fairly obvious they wanted to protect who was left on the Island.

Don't think Jin is dead either at all.

Nice ending with Desmond and Penny finally re-uniting but will Desmond be required to come back to the Island? Probably not.. might be the last we've seen of the excellent Henry Ian Cusick as he wasn't one of the passengers of 815. But we did get a "see you in another life" comment so who knows!?

Still be very much anticipating season 5 but season 3's finale was hands-down much much better. I mean they introduced the flashbacks which is, without doubt, what saved this show from becoming very mediocre.

gazzer

9

Just finished watching the last 2 eps. Brilliant though I am puzzled about why the Oceanic Six are lying.

They all know that somebody went to great lengths to put an aircraft at the bottom of the ocean to make the world think that everybody on board died and now to the outside world 6 survivors turn up to collaborate the story. Surely that follows that Widmore knows that the Oceanix 6 are lying (and vice versa) and are a huge threat as at a point in the future they could all decide to tell the truth about crashing on the island and that there were more survivors. Presumably in the week that they were on Pennys boat the subject of her father hiring a freighter to search for the island would have come up? I mean Desmond knew about that.

Should it not mean that the oceanic six should be worried about what might happen to them moreso than what might happen to those who are still on the island.?I dont get why they didnt just admit to the media that they crashed on the island and that there are other survivors. Surely the resultant media attention would mean that there would be loads of other aircraft, ships, search crews etc out looking for the island and the survivors. Its not as if Jack believes that the island is special (not at that point in time anyway) and that it needs protecting so why did he instigate the cover up?

Or am I missing something totally obvious ??

Hyzepher

I thought it was obvious that Widmore was the last to move the island and has been searching for it ever since - just like the O6 will be doing. Obviously if he found it before he can find it again.

I am sure the Black Rock being found inland is a result of the island moving and appearing under the ship. It was obviously positioned off Madagascar at one point - Eko's plane.

jor el

What's with all the "oh no, we'll never see Locke again" type comments? People seem to be forgetting that the funeral scene takes place about 3 years after they get off the island. There'll be plenty of Locke on the island to cover the next 3 years that Lost has left to air. Also, we had never seen Locke in any flash forward before now, so having him not in further flash forwards will be of no difference. The fact that he's now a corpse also means very little in Lost.

I'd say we'll see Desmond again too. Ben is looking for Penny, Penny will be with Desmond, hence we're likely to see them both again. I wouldn't be surprised if Jack reunites the group with Penny to get back to the island, given the resources she seems to have at her disposal. Would be good to see what happens if he puts Ben and Penny together.

sebastianlieken

9

OMG....OMFG....WTF.....UNREAL!!

also, we will see loads more of locke, he (I get this from a reliable source) the only member of the lost cast to have a full 6 series contract.

radiospan

8

topnutz wrote: »

- Christian to Michael "You can go now", that little scene was about as cold as it gets, kinda makes me think Christian may be a bit of a baddie, hmm.

I took that as being a good thing for Michael. He's tryed to kill himself before, and he was frustrated not being able to. Also, he said that he was on the boat "to die", so I wouldn't think Christian is a baddie because of that line.

Hugh_C wrote: »

Favourite moments: Jack playing Pixies Gouge Away on the way to the funeral parlor.

Loved this bit too. He was playing Nirvana in his car last season. If I remember right, that was three years in the future as well.

sebastianlieken

9

Mr.S wrote: »

lol. Reliable source?

One of my sisters friends uncle is terry o'quinn (locke)....therefore, relable source