At what point do you give up on your father..

Storm_rages

My dad is not a bad guy but he just does not seem to have any interest in his kids. I don’t think he has ever rung/text me just to talk. If there is a family dinner he will eat the food and then go upstairs or start watching tv. We just don't seem to talk at all. I’m getting married in a few months and I have been asking him to meet for lunch today (something we have never done) and this morning after I text him to see if he was still free, he text back saying he can’t make it, how about tomorrow..


I feel very upset about this, my mate is always saying you can’t build a relationship with someone if they don’t want to ..and I’m starting to think he may be right.

RedXIV

i'd like to compare your story with my dad. He's without a doubt the quietest man i've ever encountered (dunno how he met my mum, let alone got married) and he's always been this distant giant throughout my childhood.

It wasn't until my lil sister fell into a pit of netals and generel crap that was about 25 feet deep and my dad dived straight in afterwards that i realised he actually did care about us. sure when she was ok and all, he went back to being quiet but i have to accept that unless we need him, as a father/hero, he's just that way.

Still wouldn't trade him for the world though

JDLK

My da has never called me to talk and if he did Id proably tell him to pi55 off and stop being a woman. Dont get me wrong theres no bad blood and he can be a bit of a laugh sometimes but he's my da not my mate.

Im not being smart here but are you a daughter or a son?

lolli

Op,

My dad is the same, I always thought he didnt really care about us. A few years ago I got meningitis and almost died... the first thing i seen when i woke up was my dad standing over me crying, i had never seen him cry in my life. I realised then that he does actually care, hes just not good at expressing emotions. A couple of years later I had a row with him and I said to him that he didnt even care about me because he would never hug me or tell me he loved me apart from that time I was sick. He said to me that he loves me and my siblings very much but hes not the type of person who says that he loves us. He just seems very unemotional really, although he doesnt seem to have a problem with the emotion of anger!! I know it can be hard because I have found it hard to understand how my own father can be so emotionless but as I get older I realise the some people just cant express their emotions in the ways that others can. I also think men my dads age held back from their emotions as it was too "girly" to express yourself. Thankfully times are changing and men in my own generation seem to be more intouch with their emotions.

I'm sure your dad loves you just as mine does but everyone is different and everyone expresses emotions in different way.

Storm_rages

i'm a daughter !!

thanks for the responses !

he is not a quiet man... he is just does not seem interested

Anti

OP take your friends advice.

RedXIV

Storm_rages wrote: »

he is not a quiet man... he is just does not seem interested

Things have probably changed alot in his generation. my dad NEVER talks about his dad. has a pic of him in his office but never hear stories, antics or things they did together. Thats just what he's used to. Things are different these days, people are more inclined to open up as lolli said. Its a hard transition for some

Storm_rages

thanks lolli you post made me cry! he was very sick last year and i get upset thinking about it cause i don't feel i know him at all.. and if i have kids i don't really have many happy memories to share with them (fingers crossed that he would still be around so i won't have)

Thank Anti, in some ways my friend is right cause he can certainly show is anger and i do tend to get upset about this kinda stuff...

MIN2511

I was brought up differently; my dad and i were very close when i was young(daddy's girl) my dad was jealous of my mum and i getting close so he sent me to boarding school(believe me when he admitted it i was shocked). Right now i am closer to my mum because i feel i was robbed of time with her.
Your dad sounds like he can't show his emotions, you wonder if he has ever loved before e.t.c.
Why don't you send him a text telling him that you have tried your best to have a relationship but he keeps pushing you away and you won't be bothering anymore.

lolli

Op,

I dont think you should give up on your dad! At the end of the day hes your father. I will never give up on mine. Is he giving you away at your wedding? I bet if you needed anything in the morning he would try his best to give it to you.

Storm_rages

yea he is giving me away which is a bit of a worry in itself.. at my debs rather then telling me i looked lovely he told me to stand up straight!!

Beruthiel

At what point do you give up on your father..

You don't in this case. He is what he is. His up bringing probably had a lot to do with it. Back in the day showing any kind of emotion was a big no no. If he's not a bad guy then why would you give up on him?
Have you ever talked to your mother about this?

RedXIV

Storm_rages wrote: »

yea he is giving me away which is a bit of a worry in itself.. at my debs rather then telling me i looked lovely he told me to stand up straight!!

I remember coming home one day from school to my dad with a test saying 98% on it. showed it to him, he gravely examined it and said "what happened to the other 2%?" charmer my old man

Storm_rages

i guess because he is a total stranger to me.. he does not seem to want a relationship!

I have a great relationship with my mum but she does not feel or want to get involved!

he is not a bad guy and i have a brother who is 10 years younger and i am envious of their relationship but the rest of us who are all older have no relationship with him at all...

Dudess

Storm_rages wrote: »

yea he is giving me away which is a bit of a worry in itself.. at my debs rather then telling me i looked lovely he told me to stand up straight!!

And he probably thought you were absolutely beautiful but could not bring himself to say so because that's how men of his generation are. He probably thought standing up straight and proudly would make you look even more beautiful and would be you making the absolute most of yourself.

How Strange

MIN2511 wrote: »

Why don't you send him a text telling him that you have tried your best to have a relationship but he keeps pushing you away and you won't be bothering anymore.

Why would you send a text like that to anyone? If you've something to say that's important to you then at least say it to his face so you can discuss it.

Storm_rages.. is not a bad guy and i have a brother who is 10 years younger and i am envious of their relationship but the rest of us who are all older have no relationship with him at all...

OP, I've got a teenage brother and it amazes me to see how different my parents are with him especially my Dad. They are always hugging each other and having quality time (something my bro insists on) and family days out.

When we were growing up he was too busy out trying to earn a living for his family to have time for us. He never showed emotions or told us he loved us.
Admittedly he has softened alot in recent years probably because of my lil bro but I really think that your Dad is a product of how he was raised by his parents.

They showed they cared by going out to work and putting food on the table. They put clothes on your backs and made sure you went to school. That's how they were taught to show love.

I'd seriously consider having a chat with him - in person and not by text, mail or smoke signals. Tell him what you've said here. People can change no matter what age they are but they aren't mind readers. Your dad needs to be told what the problem is before he can work on it.

JDLK

I think alot of lads are like this regardless of generation, its just not something we talk about- half the time we arent even paying attention- no offence intended, just we dont really get as emotional about these things. Like we think, "Ok, got to bring her to the debs, got to get that shelf fixed, got to be home in time to watch that match..etc...etc"

You should probably say it to him, I wouldnt say he means any harm- its just the way we are

Also I would say he probably doesnt have a clue anything is even wrong in the first place- so to blurt out any stored up thoughts/feelings all at once will defintely knock him off balance so avoid it- nothing switches our minds off quicker then realising we are about to witness a well rehearsed tirade

seamus

Beruthiel wrote: »

You don't in this case. He is what he is.

Indeed.

The other thing to remember that a relationship isn't necessarily a relationship on your terms. It is what it is, as Ber says. From his point of view, he may very well have a perfect father-daughter relationship - he has the exact type of relationship that he saw as the norm when he was growing up.

We are definitely still undergoing something of a shift in family relations in this country. While we're big on family ties and celebrating events and occasions as family, there can be something of a male-female divide within families. There are people who are as young as their fourties in this country, whose entire idea of being a father is providing money for the family, having their dinner cooked and laying the smack down when their kids are bold. Outside of this, their main relationships consist of drinking buddies and golf buddies.

We (people between 20 and 40) are but one generation away from the type of father who literally was barely aware of some short people living in his house. His job was to provide for his family. His wife's job was to care for it. Having very personal relationships with your kids was not the norm. As with a lot of other areas, it's the following generation (people born in the 40's, 50's and 60's) who've had to carve out their own trail somewhat and try to adapt to a very different social mindset.

he is not a bad guy and i have a brother who is 10 years younger and i am envious of their relationship but the rest of us who are all older have no relationship with him at all...

This is quite telling. I've seen this occur in other families, particular with parents who would have started working in the 60's and 70's. Basically, they spent so much of their time working and breaking their balls, that they had little time for their kids. Now that times are easier and it's "OK" to be more open with your kids, they have the time to devote to their younger kids, but unfortunately the older kids are somewhat strangers to them, as they never got a chance to know them growing up.

Tzetze

RedXIV wrote: »

I remember coming home one day from school to my dad with a test saying 98% on it. showed it to him, he gravely examined it and said "what happened to the other 2%?" charmer my old man

Hey, we share the same old man? That's exactly what mine would ask me when hearing results. Never heard a 'well done'.

Spud83

Did he provide for you through your childhood/teenage? Keep you in clothes, a roof over your head, feed you, put you through school, and give you every opportunity to be whatever you wanted to be in life. You seemed to have grown into a fairly decent adult so he must have done something right.

When was the last time you thanked him? I'm not trying to have a go here, because I know that most children dont thank there parents enough, I know I haven't for the amount of overtime he worked so we could have a holiday or nice christmas presents, or the opportunity of a good education.

Beruthiel

alanmurphy83 wrote: »

Did he provide for you through your childhood/teenage? Keep you in clothes, a roof over your head, feed you, put you through school, and give you every opportunity to be whatever you wanted to be in life. You seemed to have grown into a fairly decent adult so he must have done something right.

Very good point Alan.
Speaking as a parent, that's exactly what you do when you care for your child. Give them the best you can.

Dudess

Tzetze wrote: »

Hey, we share the same old man? That's exactly what mine would ask me when hearing results. Never heard a 'well done'.

Ah but do you really think he means it? That one's a gem among middle-aged men. They think it's absolutely hilarious. He probably meant it as a joke but failed to include a twinkle in his eye.
My dad never grew sick of it during all the years we were in school/college.

thalia_13

My dad is the opposite, he is a very close friend to me, I call him everyday and I can honestly say I would not be able to go a day without talking to him. He lost his dad at any early age, so did his utmost to be a father as he imagine his dad would have been, had he lived longer. My dad is amazingly generous and self sacrificing. He has done so much for his younger siblings, and is the most powerful influence in my life. I am who I am because of him. Even down to tiny little traits....

However his brother is like your dad OP, aloof and not really seeming to bother. We reckon its because he did not know how to be a dad, and was very straitlaced and strict with his kids as thats how he thought dads should behave. Losing their father at a very young age seems to have affected my dad and uncle in completely different ways. My dad is affectionate and open regarding his feelings, my uncle isnt. But underneath it all I know my uncle loves his children more than life itself. He just cant express it.
Your dad could be the very same. It can be all related to their upbringing. Dont think its you, it most likely is your dad feeling insecure.

LegacyUser

Sounds like a typical Irish father to me. You ring home, he answers, and immediately says "I'll put you on to your mother". It's often only with grandchildren that they can let up a bit... it's sad for them too. I think many of them are quite envious of the relationships kids (by which I mean adult offsring) have with their mothers, but they do'n't know how to open up. Our family tried going out to restaurants a couple of times. I'm sure restauranteurs love us, cos it's strictly eat and go. We gave up then, it was just too embarrassing.

Storm_rages

thank you so much every one ...
feeling a lot better now! i will go to lunch tomorrow and hopefully it will a fresh starting point.
there is no question that the man put himself under serious stress at a very young age to look after all the kids (5 and then the last one ten years later) and i'm sure it can't have been easy for him (and i did indeed thank him a while ago for that, not that you can ever really thank someone for that)
I think it is just the way he is and i have tried talking to him before about it but he gets very angry and i end up crying and then he just walks away!

i think i am just feeling a bit sorry for myself.

MIN2511

How Strange wrote: »

Why would you send a text like that to anyone? If you've something to say that's important to you then at least say it to his face so you can discuss it.


OP, I've got a teenage brother and it amazes me to see how different my parents are with him especially my Dad. They are always hugging each other and having quality time (something my bro insists on) and family days out.

When we were growing up he was too busy out trying to earn a living for his family to have time for us. He never showed emotions or told us he loved us.
Admittedly he has softened alot in recent years probably because of my lil bro but I really think that your Dad is a product of how he was raised by his parents.

They showed they cared by going out to work and putting food on the table. They put clothes on your backs and made sure you went to school. That's how they were taught to show love.

I'd seriously consider having a chat with him - in person and not by text, mail or smoke signals. Tell him what you've said here. People can change no matter what age they are but they aren't mind readers. Your dad needs to be told what the problem is before he can work on it.

I do get what you mean but sometimes us humans would rather text than ring especially if it's to an elderly person. No matter what my dad did i wouldn't have the balls to confront him and if i tried to i would text him to let him know how i felt.

Dudess

Storm_rages wrote: »

i have tried talking to him before about it but he gets very angry

I think that's a good indicator of how it must be quite frustrating for him too.

Storm_rages

i guess he is the way he is and i am the way i am..

Beruthiel

Storm_rages wrote: »

i guess he is the way he is and i am the way i am..

That's it exactly. You've got to take him as he is. If he worked his ass off to keep his family together then he did his level best for you. The best that he can be.

littlebug

Storm_rages wrote: »

i guess he is the way he is and i am the way i am..

I was just about to write that!

My parents have never (in my memory) told me they loved me. The only time I ever remember giving either of them a kiss or hug was on my wedding day when we had to because everyone was looking and it felt quite awkward tbh! Compliments or praise are rare... very rare. The only comment when my daughter was born was "she's very small". Despite all this I love my parents and know they love me. They are who they are and I can see the love and pride in their eyes but to make them say it would be like torturing them:D

once when my dad was drunk he went a bit mushy and said "you know no matter what you do it will always be right in my eyes"... that's the best I've got and I've held onto it! My mam rings me for chit chat and gossip. My dad rings a lot but it's usually to tell me there's somehting good on the telly and to switch over quick.
He may have said nothing before or when he walked me up the aisle on my wedding day but I know he was the proudest man in the world and I was proud to be his daughter:)

JDLK

Beruthiel wrote: »

That's it exactly. You've got to take him as he is. If he worked his ass off to keep his family together then he did his level best for you. The best that he can be.

Once we hit 18 our parents are no longer our parents (even though we still feel like it). We have no right to "expect" anything more from them. Its the transition then from viewing them as a caregivers to just ordinary people that is the hardest. Once you start seeing him as an equal rather than a parent you might have a more adult relationship with him

RedXIV

littlebug wrote: »

I was just about to write that!

My parents have never (in my memory) told me they loved me. The only time I ever remember giving either of them a kiss or hug was on my wedding day when we had to because everyone was looking and it felt quite awkward tbh! Compliments or praise are rare... very rare. The only comment when my daughter was born was "she's very small". Despite all this I love my parents and know they love me. They are who they are and I can see the love and pride in their eyes but to make them say it would be like torturing them:D

once when my dad was drunk he went a bit mushy and said "you know no matter what you do it will always be right in my eyes"... that's the best I've got and I've held onto it! My mam rings me for chit chat and gossip. My dad rings a lot but it's usually to tell me there's somehting good on the telly and to switch over quick.
He may have said nothing before or when he walked me up the aisle on my wedding day but I know he was the proudest man in the world and I was proud to be his daughter:)

Thats a ridiculously nice post and if i wasn't built like one of these old school guys, i'd probably be going for tissues

Storm_rages

see its not the fact that he does not praise me.. which he does not.. its more the fact that there is no contact or communication at all... We don't talk, the other night i was in the house and the tv was broken and he ended up just leaving the room.. he did not asking about the wedding or my partner, my business, my life..
if i accept that is him then i have to accept that this will never change, that this man will never have any interest in me as a person.. and he did feed and house me but he does not seem to have any interest in me ! (to be honest he did not have any interest when i was living at home)

How Strange

I also think that our generation's frame of reference for most things is hollywood and cinema. We think that unless our Dads are like the ones on tv and tell us all the time how much the love us and how proud they are and they can come up with off the cuff poignant speeches about how they feel then there is something wrong with our relationship.

As others have said, our parents might not be perfect but if they have tried their best to bring you up. One person's Dad may not be as articulate or affectionate as another's but that doesn't mean he loves you less.

littlebug

Storm_rages wrote: »

see its not the fact that he does not praise me.. which he does not.. its more the fact that there is no contact or communication at all... We don't talk, the other night i was in the house and the tv was broken and he ended up just leaving the room.. he did not asking about the wedding or my partner, my business, my life..
if i accept that is him then i have to accept that this will never change, that this man will never have any interest in me as a person.. and he did feed and house me but he does not seem to have any interest in me ! (to be honest he did not have any interest when i was living at home)

Some men of that generation are just not good communicators but I don't think that necessarily means he's not interested. He probably gets the run down on everything from your mother.
Do you ask him about everyday stuff in his life? Does he converse if you're talking about everyday stuff that he is comfortable with? I know men that could talk at length about cattle, crops and land but turn the conversation to my job and there's stony silence. I could be speaking clingon as far as they're concerned.

Storm_rages

not really, he tends to be on his phone a lot.. He won't talk about his work with the family (he is in no way working with the FBI) and the funny thing is i am in a similar line of work so in theory we should have a lot to talk about...
i honestly think that if something happened to my mum (touching all sorts of wood) that my dad and i would lose all contact..

littlebug

Storm_rages wrote: »

not really, he tends to be on his phone a lot.. He won't talk about his work with the family (he is in no way working with the FBI) and the funny thing is i am in a similar line of work so in theory we should have a lot to talk about...
i honestly think that if something happened to my mum (touching all sorts of wood) that my dad and i would lose all contact..

How sad OP. The only thing I can add now is that maybe you should just try to accept it and just let the relationship be what it is without the pressure of trying to make it something else. He is who he is and he's not likely to change

LouOB

bet you 10eur if you offer to buy him a pint he will go
go for a drink with your auld man - its helped me.
we play poker some times now - what are his interest (horses, cars, darts, boats)
offer to go out with him - least you can say you made the effort consience clear

JDLK

Storm_rages wrote: »

not really, he tends to be on his phone a lot.. He won't talk about his work with the family (he is in no way working with the FBI) and the funny thing is i am in a similar line of work so in theory we should have a lot to talk about...
i honestly think that if something happened to my mum (touching all sorts of wood) that my dad and i would lose all contact..

Thats is very sad actually. The only thing I can say regarding the original question "At what point do you give up on your father?" is that you never give up. You might stop pressing the issue but never give up hope that things might change in the future, thats just the way it is with family.

Storm_rages

he does not drink. he does go to church (eh, the fact that my partner and i are living together have been a serious issue, even with us getting married in less then 5 months.. he did even ask me "why would he want the cow if he can get the milk for free" i mean honestly does he not think someone might actually be in love with me!!! ) i don't know....

Storm_rages

by the way LouOB can i get that €10 now or should i get it later??

MIN2511

Your dad is old fashioned, maybe you should go to mass with him one day...

Apart from church what are his interests?

Storm_rages

eh well i will be in a church on my wedding day!!! (not a church going at all)

interests.. he likes horse racing, and hill walking.. (i have gone hill walking a couple of times but its not really a chatting sort of a pass time, by the time you get up the bloody mountain you are too bollex to talk).. he does do charity work (a lot) but honestly i think this is more to escape the family...

The Bollox

I don't really talk to my dad much either. we never were that close. I love him and I know he loves me but like me he isn't good at expressing how we feel. we would almost never say anything to each other and all conversations would seem dry and forced. to bridge a communication gap I decided to take an interest in the Premier League, just so we would have something to talk about and it does work, but on any other topic we are still rather distant.

my mam on the other hand I get on with like a house on fire, more because we have more or less got the same personality so I can talk to her about anything.

I know it's tough, but try and find a common interest between you and him, OP, or do what I did, take up an interest in something he likes. it could make you feel better. I hope it does

MagicMarker

Storm_rages wrote: »

he does not drink. he does go to church (eh, the fact that my partner and i are living together have been a serious issue, even with us getting married in less then 5 months.. he did even ask me "why would he want the cow if he can get the milk for free" i mean honestly does he not think someone might actually be in love with me!!! ) i don't know....

He's protective of you then, that says something doesn't it?

Just be glad you're dad is even in your life, some people aren't so lucky. I've seen my father on average once a year since i was about 12 years old.

Nevyn

Storm_rages
Unhelpful and off-topic posting will get you banned from this forum.
Do take time to read the charter which contains the rules and abide by them.
Have a nice day.
Thaedydal

mags16

OP, as others have said, you cannot make your father into someone he is not. In an ideal world, a la desperate housewives, you will have a heart to heart, he will break down and tell you how proud he is of you and how much he loves you. You all cry and hug and live happily ever after. It aint gonna happen.

I'd say I am older than you and in my day, fathers were out at work all day and in the evening they were the grumpy man in the corner. If I got 90% in an exam, he would ask what happened to the other 10%. He never acknowledges my profession cos he doesn't think it's very respectable (no, I'm not a sex worker!!). He never says it but I know he loves me. I would never force him into a conversation about how he feels about me. It would be torture. I just accept him for what he is. Stubborn, conservative, narrow minded, self obsessed, funny, generous, loyal.

OP, do you ever think that your father has his own issues going on? Does he suffer from depression? Is he shy? Does he realize how dissatisfied you are with him? If he does, that is bound to cause him some stress, especially if he can't express his feelings.

Please don't give up on him but try to see the world from his eyes and then maybe you can forge some sort of relationship. But if he is anything like my da and the vast majority of irish men, he will never be the touchy feely kind of da. That is why we ladies have girlfriends.

mags16

OP, just another quick point. From reading other posts, can't you see that your da is very similar to everyone else's?

Not appearing to be interested in our lives.........check
Never praising us for our achievements.................check
Handing the phone to our mothers when we ring..................check
Giving the silent treatment.........................check
Emotionally stunted.................................check
A little bit chauvinistic....................check
A little bit racist......................check

He's just a product of his own upbringing

littlefriend

I thought this thread was going to be about some alcoholic violent man or something like that....

Look, maybe you are just stressed because of the wedding? Of course he is mad about you - you're his little girl. Don't take it personally - some ppl just can't say how they feel or don't see the need to or whatever.

Have you ever thought of your dad as anything other than your dad - I mean that he is an actual person with a past and feelings other than parent stuff? I kind of forget that alot. Maybe he is shy or can't express himself - he is only a person too.

Do you ever hear friends talk about their babies and their plans for them and the way they worry if they seem upset etc etc your parents must have been like that about you too. Its hard to remember that.

My dad is a bit similar in that he isn't one for saying I love you or I'm proud of you or anything like that. I'm actually kind of laughing at the thought of that happening as I type it I think the best thing is to let people be. Just enjoy what you have of him, don't force things as it will feel strained and he will almost certainly retire to his room rather than feeling uneasy. I know I would.

You'll see the love in him when he is giving you away at your wedding - even if he doesn't say anything you can be sure he'll have a big lump in his throat.

chuci

op you should be grateful that your dad is in your life. you said yourself he was very sick last year and you get upset talking about it, why didnt you try and change anything?you say he like horse racing why not go for a day to the races?ask him for tips etc you dont need a big heart to heart just a chat and you might be surprised at how well you get on. my dad worked 6 days a week and we barely saw him even though im a total daddys girl when i was old enough to appreciate GAA thats when we started to bond every sunday the two of us used head off. we fight like cat and dog because we are so similar but at the same time id never ring or text him or him me unless we wanted something.:p
maybe tell him you appreciate how hard he has worked to make sure you were fed clothed and got a good education and that you really appreciate it and that you love him.

sam34

Tzetze wrote: »

Hey, we share the same old man? That's exactly what mine would ask me when hearing results. Never heard a 'well done'.

exact same here!