Hypocritical Ban from Wishbone Ash.

givyjoe81

So the story is I'v been banned from learning to drive forum, rather unfairly I feel. The moderator Wishbone Ash banned me for what he calls "trolling and general muppetry" Not too sure what this trolling thing is but is it starting arguements??Anyway If the definition of trolling is disagreeing with someone's opinion, then i guess I'm guilty, and that really is all I did, at first anyway. As for the muppetry, i thought that was uncalled for especially from a someone who seems to have no sense of humour to take a bit of stick his way.

Anyway when i disagreed with this moderator's opinion, he replied with a comment reffering back to some some other thread's in november. ( when he didnt like what I had to say, which is fair enough, didnt much like his opinions either, but that's the nature of the beast isnt it?!) He stated that I had made of a fool of myself then and did i intend to do so again! Well Im no fool but i really thought this had absolutely nothing to do with what i had posted, now surely his comment would be considered trolling? I mean what do you expect someone to say to a comment like that?! "Yes sir, no sir, wont let it happen again sir"?!

A snide remark like that from a moderator is totally uncalled for and a ban for defending myself, i feel is totally unwaranted, particularly in how it was comunicated. "Banned for trolling and general muppetry... come back when you have something constructive to add". All that i said in response to his silly remark was, oh i must have hit a nerve, and get down off your high horse, while mentioning just how smug some full licence holders in the learning to drive forum can be, im a full licence holder myself incidentally.

Now while i think he does give allot of help he can be quite condescending at times and i feel he has totally abused his position in this case as he was just as, if not more guilty than me of the offences for which I have been banned for.

Do let us know what you think, but please keep it reasonable, i am only asking whether you think the ban was reasonable. No trolling!!

Ciaran500

The thread: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055276126&page=4

Rb

Wishbone Ash wrote:

You made an idiot of yourself on this thread last November. Do you intend to do the same again?

This was unneccessary as far as I'm concerned.

It looks like a silly/harsh ban alright.

RuailleBuaille

I'm getting sick of these 'unfair banning' threads. Let's just ban banning. And being banned. And elastic bands.

leninbenjamin

Rb wrote: »

This was unneccessary as far as I'm concerned.

indeed. he was effectively calling the OP out.

and secondly, i don't actually see a bannable offense in those posts. perhaps worthy of an infraction or warning, but a ban was harsh considering the circumstances.

givyjoe81

RuailleBuaille wrote: »

I'm getting sick of these 'unfair banning' threads. Let's just ban banning. And being banned. And elastic bands.

Sorry! :eek:, i just had to get it off my chest, i think i literally would have exploded if i hadnt been able to vent. The bloke is great for givin amount of knowledge he shares on the forum but the best teachers dont make the best principals and er stuff.

Cheers to the other dude for sticking the thread up, im useless.

givyjoe81

leninbenjamin wrote: »

indeed. he was effectively calling the OP out.

and secondly, i don't actually see a bannable offense in those posts. perhaps worthy of an infraction or warning, but a ban was harsh considering the circumstances.

Whats "the OP"?!

Thats what I was so annoyed. It felt like i was being banned just because he didnt like my opinions, past and present, but thats what this place is all about.

humanji

There definitely doesn't seem a reason to ban the OP here. A warning to stay on topic and cool down maybe but definitely not a ban.

leninbenjamin

givyjoe81 wrote: »

Whats "the OP"?!

the Original Poster of the thread, i.e. in this case you.

Thrill

givyjoe81 wrote: »

Whats "the OP"?!

In this thread you are the OP, Original Poster.

Thrill

humanji wrote: »

A warning to stay on topic and cool down maybe but definitely not a ban.

If anything, the mod went off topic first when mentioning the other thread.

It looks like a harsh banning to me.

Genghiz Cohen

Let this be the first time that feedback has actually worked, let the OP back in regardless of the mods opinions!
Hurrah!

RoundyMooney

Heavy handed IMO.

Asking noobs to refrain from posting in lower case is also a little overbearing, and likely to drive them away (no pun intended).

It's not as if it's txtspk.

Thrill

Genghiz Cohen wrote: »

Let this be the first time that feedback has actually worked, let the OP back in regardless of the mods opinions!
Hurrah!

Dream on.

givyjoe81

Thrill wrote: »

Dream on.

I know its early days and I'm sure some will think i deserved it but early doors it seems that it was indeed harsh. Should i send the mod a link to this thread? Or is it pointless? Two week ban too, which is itself harsh, and even then i think i have to prove that I have something "constructive" to say. Believe it or not i think he may have been serious with that comment.

Mr Magnolia

You should discuss it with the mod alright. It's normally best to discuss it before a feedback thread, you weren't to know that I suppose

The ban seems a little odd to me on the thread linked.

givyjoe81

Mr Magnolia wrote: »

You should discuss it with the mod alright. It's normally best to discuss it before a feedback thread, you weren't to know that I suppose

The ban seems a little odd to me on the thread linked.

I did reply to his message regarding the ban, and told him just how unfair i thought it was, but as of yet havent heard back. I just felt it was a total abuse of power, like "this guy is annoying me, so il just ban him and hope he goes away".

And it seemed odd to me, i felt it was more to do with posts back in november, but i wasnt banned back then, nor did i get any warnings as far as i can recall. Back then it was a heated discussion which dragged out and all turned a bit childish. So in a nutshell i believe thats why i was banned, for what happened then and not now.

Sherifu

Way too harsh from reading the thread.

Thrill

I haven't seen too many bans overturned on feedback tbh. Normally posters are told, after lots of arguing and cat pictures, to grin and bear it.

You do have a better chance than most though. We'll have to wait and see.

challengemaster

Unfair ban, and the mod pretty much did call him out..

Heinrich

So you got banned for some nonsense in a worthless thread. Why bother getting steamed up? If the mod bans you he is exercising his right and you can exercise yours by ignoring his mickey mouse forum!

I got banned from the quasi worthless laptop forum for pointing out something that the mod did not like. I am still alive and my problem has been resolved without any assistance from that quarter.

How useless can it get. Now drive on...:D

mikemac

challengemaster wrote: »

Unfair ban, and the mod pretty much did call him out..

+1

Very harsh ban

Faith

Definitely only worthy of an infraction, imo.

givyjoe81

Mr Magnolia wrote: »

You should discuss it with the mod alright. It's normally best to discuss it before a feedback thread, you weren't to know that I suppose

The ban seems a little odd to me on the thread linked.

Just a little further to that, the mod actually told me to bring it to feeback if i had a problem, pretty much saying he didnt want to know!

Sent a pm yesterday saying how unfair i thought it was, no reply, sent a link to this thread with the responses to date, and you guessed it, no reply.

Guess il just have to start building that bridge..:D

Ron DMC

givyjoe81 wrote: »

Sent a pm yesterday saying how unfair i thought it was, no reply, sent a link to this thread with the responses to date, and you guessed it, no reply.

Give him a chance, he hasn't been online since 11 last night.

Rb

Ronny Mitchell wrote: »

Give him a chance, he hasn't been online since 11 last night.

In fairness, I noticed he was active on feedback last night whilst I was busy with all that fuss in the other threads, so he has definitely had a chance to reply/explain himself and has chosen not to do so.

Marcus.Aurelius

Utterly unncessary. Even an infraction would be harsh. Very poor standard of moderating in this case.

Ban should be revoked

Still, would be interesting to hear Wishbone Ash's interpretation of all this

Ron DMC

Rb wrote: »

In fairness, I noticed he was active on feedback last night whilst I was busy with all that fuss in the other threads, so he has definitely had a chance to reply/explain himself and has chosen not to do so.

Hmmm. In that case he can't have missed the thread as his name is in the title. That kind of thing would tend to grab someone's attention.

I'd like to hear his side of the story to be honest.

givyjoe81

Ronny Mitchell wrote: »

Hmmm. In that case he can't have missed the thread as his name is in the title. That kind of thing would tend to grab someone's attention.

I'd like to hear his side of the story to be honest.

I also put a read receipt on my reply to his pm about the banning, so he opened it at least.

I would also like to hear his take on things and how how he justified the ban. As I mentioned, his comment's regarding posts in november seemed to be the real reason behind the ban, especially seen as how the pm regarding the ban was worded, speculation perhaps but not far fetched.

jhegarty

I don't see anything wrong with the op's posts

stevenmu

Just to play devils advocate. It does appear that the OP has previously had rants about licensed drivers (in particular those who got it through amnestys), and could be said to be trying to hijack the linked thread to rant about it again.

RoundyMooney

Like it or not, the mod is under no obligation to reply to a Feedback thread, and it's not something we can enforce upon ourselves collectively.

At this point, I'd suggest discussing the matter with a Cmod.

givyjoe81

stevenmu wrote: »

Just to play devils advocate. It does appear that the OP has previously had rants about licensed drivers (in particular those who got it through amnestys), and could be said to be trying to hijack the linked thread to rant about it again.

I had no such rants, it started with someone's opinion that I agreed with, and then several others including the mod didnt like it and heated debates took place for a while after. But as i stated, no warnings were issued( to my knowledge anyway, as everybody played their part).

I got over it and moved on, and have posted there since, not a problem. In fairness if i was hijacking it then he was doing the same thing, i.e. bringing up the same old arguements, i just stated my opnion disagreeing (strongly) with what he had to say. No hijacking intended and really what am i supposed to say to his response regarding posts in november.

I know your only saying what if.. but i just wanted to clarify that this wasnt the case at all, not my intention i mean.


I know you guys aren't obligated but in the interests of fairness i think where so many people are of the opinion it was unfair the ban should be lifted and or explained. Prior to this post i did indeed bring it to the helpdesk.

RoundyMooney

givyjoe81 wrote: »

I know you guys aren't obligated but in the interests of fairness i think where so many people are of the opinion it was unfair the ban should be lifted and or explained. Prior to this post i did indeed bring it to the helpdesk.

I don't disagree with you on this point.

Helpdesk/Cmod is the best approach at this point, I feel.

Nailz

Very unlucky pal, it's a shame mods can ruin some aspects of this website, but what can you do. Very harsh, stupid and inconsiderite modding.

Rb

RoundyMooney wrote: »

I don't disagree with you on this point.

Helpdesk/Cmod is the best approach at this point, I feel.

Particularly if the moderator in question has been online, read the pm about it, has been on feedback and has seen the thread, yet hasn't even replied.

OP: Give WhiteWashMan a pm and let him know what's going on. He's the Cmod of Rec/Motors and Wishbone Ashs higher up.

Nailz

Rb's right, this thread is the proof that you are right, link it to him.

Malteaser!

Rb wrote: »

Particularly if the moderator in question has been online, read the pm about it, has been on feedback and has seen the thread, yet hasn't even replied.
.

Maybe he's been on, read the pm and had a quick check through the thread but didn't have time to give his side of the story then. I know there's been loads of times I've been on, read things and then come back to them later to reply when I'm not as busy.

tbh

Rb wrote: »

Particularly if the moderator in question has been online, read the pm about it, has been on feedback and has seen the thread, yet hasn't even replied.

OP: Give WhiteWashMan a pm and let him know what's going on. He's the Cmod of Rec/Motors and Wishbone Ashs higher up.

I don't think either of them would like that tbh. How many times has a manager let you in a pub after a bouncer refused?

RoundyMooney

Once or twice, but then again, I know quite a few publicans

Malteaser!

Nailz wrote: »

Rb's right, this thread is the proof that you are right, link it to him.

I don't really think it is.

For all anyone of us know, there's another side to the story that we won't find out until Wishbone Ash comes on.

givyjoe81

Malteaser! wrote: »

I don't really think it is.

For all anyone of us know, there's another side to the story that we won't find out until Wishbone Ash comes on.

What other side?! Everyone can see the posts which led to me being banned!! Im sorry but at this stage he's had plenty of time to at least acknowledge my pm and say il get back to you on it, the guy spends allot of time and boards making many many posts, so at this stage i think he should have gotten back.

DeVore

If posts of yours have been deleted or edited then people wouldnt see them.
As for "so many people" etc... well, its not a vote. I'd like to hear the Mod's side of things and rather then running to plead your case to the mob (thats the rest of you by the way), it might have been better if you discussed it with the mod directly. i'm not saying you have to accept his pov or apologise or anything but dialogue is always better then confrontation. I will review this in depth when I get a chance and I'd like to hear from the mod either here or in private message.

DeV.

Faith

DeVore wrote: »

t might have been better if you discussed it with the mod directly.

The OP did PM Wishbone Ash and was directed here, and then PM'ed him alerting him to the existence of the thread but got no reply.

Wishbone Ash

It was totally out of order for me to call givyjoe81 an idiot and on that basis I have apologised to him and have lifted the ban.

I would like to give a more comprehensive answer in relation to the issuing of the ban in the first place but, it is difficult to demonstrate this when givyjoe81 has deleted many of his posts in the thread of last November.

Wishbone Ash

Faith wrote: »

The OP did PM Wishbone Ash and was directed here, and then PM'ed him alerting him to the existence of the thread but got no reply.

I've just got in from work. I do not have access to the net there.

Steve

Respect x1000, WA.

Nailz

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

It was totally out of order for me to call givyjoe81 an idiot and on that basis I have apologised to him and have lifted the ban.

I would like to give a more comprehensive answer in relation to the issuing of the ban in the first place but, it is difficult to demonstrate this when givyjoe81 has deleted many of his posts in the thread of last November.

Fair play, that takes balls!
Respec', respec'.... :cool:

Stark

Faith wrote: »

Definitely only worthy of an infraction, imo.

That would be assuming that the OP hadn't been warned previously and that they had given some indication that they wouldn't continue the same behaviour. If you read most of the OP's posts, you'll see that you won't get much out of him other than what he was banned for. Of course, there's also the issue that the OP went and deleted his posts so most people here can't see them...

leninbenjamin

another happy ending in feedback. fairplay, fairplay to all i say!

Sherifu

leninbenjamin wrote: »

another happy ending in feedback. fairplay, fairplay to all i say!

Oh stop, i'll cry. :pac: