Civil Service - EO exams

K_P

I've applied for the current round of civil service Executive Officer recruitment. The exams are apparently coming up at the end of April. I've had a look through the test familiarisation booklet and the verbal and numerical sections seem fine. But does anyone know anywhere I could get some advice on the job simulation section? I know they just say to answer in terms of the course of action you would take, but I'd still like a bit of guidance.

Thanks.

Electric

I've taken the EO tests before and IMO the job simulation section isn't something you can practice really. I just read the paragraph and selected the answer based on the course of action I myself would most realistically take. There is no right or wrong answer.

The questions were kind of like....It's Friday evening your boss has a very important meeting first thing Monday morning, but he's forgotten that he has to make a presentation. To help him out do you:

a: stay late and work on the presentation
b: go home as usual
c: go home as usual and work on the presentation over the weekend
d: come in early on Monday morning and work on it
e: none of the above

Ok well that example isn't great but the questions are long that line so pick the one that you would likely do (or the one you think sounds the best)

cronos

Electric wrote: »

I've taken the EO tests before and IMO the job simulation section isn't something you can practice really. I just read the paragraph and selected the answer based on the course of action I myself would most realistically take. There is no right or wrong answer.

The questions were kind of like....It's Friday evening your boss has a very important meeting first thing Monday morning, but he's forgotten that he has to make a presentation. To help him out do you:

a: stay late and work on the presentation
b: go home as usual
c: go home as usual and work on the presentation over the weekend
d: come in early on Monday morning and work on it
e: none of the above

Ok well that example isn't great but the questions are long that line so pick the one that you would likely do (or the one you think sounds the best)

I love when people say their is no wrong answer. Its an interview and they are judging you answers by associating a score with each answer, not all options get the same score. I understand that all options get a score but their is a highest score and a lowest score. I would argue that the one that gives the lowest score is the wrong answer. (In the eyes of the people giving the interview)

For example I am sure they would give the b: go home as usual answer the least marks in your above example.

nesf

Electric wrote: »

The questions were kind of like....It's Friday evening your boss has a very important meeting first thing Monday morning, but he's forgotten that he has to make a presentation. To help him out do you:

a: stay late and work on the presentation
b: go home as usual
c: go home as usual and work on the presentation over the weekend
d: come in early on Monday morning and work on it
e: none of the above

Ok well that example isn't great but the questions are long that line so pick the one that you would likely do (or the one you think sounds the best)

"a) because I'll be ****ed if I'm coming in early on Monday Morning"

K_P

I find the problem is there are usually one or two options that are obviously ridiculous, along the lines of nesf's one above. The remaining three are all very similar. One of the sample questions is:

Scenario 1

You are working in a Government department on a busy project for which there are tight time deadlines. It is now Friday afternoon and you have an important task to complete by Monday afternoon. This involves preparing a report for the Minister about an important issue that the Minister needs to respond to.

A senior manager newly appointed to a different but related area in your department, asks you to photocopy a very large amount of material, to be ready first thing Monday morning.

You have no staff of your own and the staff who work with this senior manager have expressed their dissatisfaction with having to do additional work for you in the past.

Do you,


A. Approach the senior manager’s staff directly and ask them to carry out the photocopying work, indicating that it relates to their area of work.

B. Ask your own manager to return the photocopying work to the senior manager on your behalf, having explained the pressures that you are under.

C. Explain the pressures that you are under to the senior manager indicating that you cannot manage an extra task in the time frame.

D. Accept the work from the senior manager but do not do it, and explain to the senior manager later on that you were under too much pressure to do so.

E. Come in over the weekend and do the photocopying work yourself for the senior manager.

I would consider options D and E to be the if-you-pick-these-I'm-amazed-you-even-found-the-test-centre answers. But then A, B and C are very similar. Having said that I'd probably go for C.

I'm a bit nervous of this section as I did an EO competition a few years ago. To be honest I didn't put too much effort in as I had just been told a few days previously that I had got another job. I still did well in the verbal and numerical sections but fell down on the job simulation. I was straight out of college at the time though. Now that I've a few years working I reckon I might be a bit more prepared.

Electric

K_P wrote: »

I find the problem is there are usually one or two options that are obviously ridiculous, along the lines of nesf's one above. The remaining three are all very similar. One of the sample questions is:



I would consider options D and E to be the if-you-pick-these-I'm-amazed-you-even-found-the-test-centre answers. But then A, B and C are very similar. Having said that I'd probably go for C.

I'm a bit nervous of this section as I did an EO competition a few years ago. To be honest I didn't put too much effort in as I had just been told a few days previously that I had got another job. I still did well in the verbal and numerical sections but fell down on the job simulation. I was straight out of college at the time though. Now that I've a few years working I reckon I might be a bit more prepared.

In that case I'd go with the answer that you are happiest with. I'm not really sure why they include these kinds of tests cos as previous posters have said some of the answers are completely unrealistic. That said it's probably used as another stage at which to weed out unsuitable candidates - not that you're unsuitable

Zulu

K_P wrote: »

I would consider options D and E to be the if-you-pick-these-I'm-amazed-you-even-found-the-test-centre answers.

Ah, the not-so-subtle difference between public & private sectors!

turtleshead

Has anyone been called for these exams yet? the exams are on the 18th/19th of April and I have not heard anything yet wondering has anyone else heard.

folan

i thought i heard 26th/27th?

Ive heard nothing either

Precociousg

I agree that the job simulation aspect of these tests can be quite frustrating. I sat the AO exams some time ago and got really good results on the verbal and numerical parts but totally fell down on the job simulation exercise. Unlike the other 2 parts, It seems to be the kinda thing you cant really prepare for!

K_P

turtleshead wrote: »

Has anyone been called for these exams yet? the exams are on the 18th/19th of April and I have not heard anything yet wondering has anyone else heard.

I got an email today. 26th April. That's for the Dublin ones. The other ones around the country are being held earlier AFAIK. In the original application it said every applicant would be informed of their test date by April 11th so there's still a week for them to contact you if they haven't already.

It's no harm to give them a call if you're worried about it though.

Saibh

25 april - 1.30pm in rds

but unless i do something about the maths part of the exam between now and then, there is no point in going because I'm useless at maths.

flycruise

Ya the fcking maths.... can anyone suggest someone who can help? In Cork if poss...

RoseBlossom

flycruise wrote: »

Ya the fcking maths.... can anyone suggest someone who can help? In Cork if poss...

Remember that in the maths section it is better to be accurate than quick - you only need to pass the section. This could mean getting 12 to 15 correct, out of a total of 28 (I don't know the exact figure so don't rely on this!). You will not be ranked on the basis of your maths result, rather they will call candidates to the next stage based on their Verbal and Job Simulation results. A lot of people think the idea is to get all the maths done when really you should concentrate on getting the ones you do correct.

Any maths teacher could talk you through the sample questions; since the Junior and Leaving Cert exams are coming up I'd say if you ask around someone will know of a good maths teacher giving grinds.

RoseBlossom

Saibh wrote: »

25 april - 1.30pm in rds

but unless i do something about the maths part of the exam between now and then, there is no point in going because I'm useless at maths.

The best thing you can do is practise the sample questions and make sure you understand them. I'm not being smart here, but there's a possibility you could end up in a finance-type position (or even a position where you have to occasionally help organise something within budget) or a role where you have to prepare or read graphs etc. so taking the time to brush up on your maths now might make life a little easier for you further down the line.

Also - don't not go! The worst that can happen is that you only come away from it with great experience for the next time!

flycruise

Thanks Rose Blossom, you're pretty cool. You're dead right about not not going, I'll see if I can rope someone in to help and give it my best shot!

jockey#1

Hi Lads,

I got my date for the exam, its 18th April in Cork, unfortunately i can't make it that day as i have a family wedding :mad:. I've emailed to explain this to them. What are the chances of them giving me a different date?

Thanks

Jockey #1

TheBigLebowski

jockey#1 wrote: »

Hi Lads,

I got my date for the exam, its 18th April in Cork, unfortunately i can't make it that day as i have a family wedding :mad:. I've emailed to explain this to them. What are the chances of them giving me a different date?

Thanks

Jockey #1

I too would like to know the answer to this as I can't make my date. Anyone ever changed their date?

hawker

They would usually try in accommodate you. However it more than likely will not be in the same test centre. You might have to go elsewhere. If you are willing to go to Waterford, Limerick or Dublin, I'm sure they would look after you.

I think there are exams in Cork on Sat. 20th as well. But would you want to go after a family wedding?

cee_jay

My friend can't make her date either. She contacted them by email and the response she got contained the dates of all exams being held around the country. They said she can turn up to any of the others and they would try to accomodate her on the day but there is no guarantee.
I have the list of all the exams at work - if I get a chance will post it here on Monday

yabadabado

give public jobs a call and they will tell u the date and times of areas that mite suit u.they will do there best to accomadate u.there is usually loads of empty seats at the exam centres

death1234567

I got my exam next weekend in Galway. Doese anyone know the procedure after the exam? Like Exam --> Pass --> Interview a month later --> Start Job two months later --> €€€

Has anyone a link to the sample Test document?

run_Forrest_run

death1234567 wrote: »

I got my exam next weekend in Galway. Doese anyone know the procedure after the exam? Like Exam --> Pass --> Interview a month later --> Start Job two months later --> €€€

Has anyone a link to the sample Test document?

perhaps I am not talking about the correct tests but I have seen sample test stuff up on publicjobs.ie if they are any help to you.

death1234567

run_Forrest_run wrote: »

perhaps I am not talking about the correct tests but I have seen sample test stuff up on publicjobs.ie if they are any help to you.

Yeah I saw one for a programming job on the site but I am not sure if its the the same as the one I will have. Probably close enough though.

K_P

The test familiarisation booklet is here:

http://www.publicjobs.ie/downloads/EO%20&%20EO%20(ICT)%20%20Familiarisation%20Material.doc

In terms of timescale, it could be quite a while. There will probably be thousands of people attending the tests, so an optimistic guess would be getting results of your tests maybe about 6 weeks after the tests finish. It's a nationwide competition so they would need to complete all tests before compiling results and telling you what order you came in. Of course it could be a lot longer than 6 weeks.

As for interviews, they could be another few months after that again. The speed of civil service bureaucracy is one of the slowest forces in the known universe.

When I did the Dublin City Council Clerical Officer tests a few years ago, I applied in September, had the test in November, had my interview in February I think and started in April. So it was quite a slow and frustrating process.

funky_monkey

To everyone who sucks at the numerical reasoning, try practising calculating percentages and ratios. I've been doing that this week and finding it quite helpful.

Did the aptitude test for the Garda's before and did awful in it cos i never practised simple math calculations.

GOOD LUCK! although i hope some people fail so I get in...... harhahrhahhahahahah

fletch

How many positions are available does anybody know?

kippy

Right, I am giving a friend some help in doing the maths questions.
We've got the sample questions and in my opinion one or two of the answers and indeed the way in coming to those answers are dubious to say the least.
Question 5 on the software part.
I reckon the answer is D.
They say the answer is defo B and say that:
• Compare the money raised if the Spreadsheet software is priced at 1 Euro and the Business Statistics are priced at 2 Euros

In all fairness one has no idea of the cost of the sofware and surely making assumptions here is not what is required.

Question 14, while the answer given is correct would basicilly say to me that you should not assume anything.

Has anyone found any dubious answers in the "sample maths paper"?
The rest appear to be relatively okay.
Kippy

fletch

kippy wrote: »

Right, I am giving a friend some help in doing the maths questions.
We've got the sample questions and in my opinion one or two of the answers and indeed the way in coming to those answers are dubious to say the least.
Question 5 on the software part.
I reckon the answer is D.
They say the answer is defo B and say that:
• Compare the money raised if the Spreadsheet software is priced at 1 Euro and the Business Statistics are priced at 2 Euros

I am presuming that you are talking about Question 4???

In which case it is stated that "Spreadsheet software costs half the price of Business statistics software and current sales targets are met" The Spreadsheet software target for this year is 23.2 and it was met, however this software costs half the price of Business Statistics Software, the value of the target for the current year for Spreadsheet software is 0.5 multiplied by 23.2 or 11.6 which is greater than 11.5 (Business statistics target for the year) so B is the correct answer.

kippy wrote: »

Question 14, while the answer given is correct would basicilly say to me that you should not assume anything.

I don't see what you are getting at? From 1997 to 2002, the increase was €40billion, from 2002 to 2007, the increase was €70billion. There is no trend there??? So why would we assume anything?

kippy

Sorry Fletch, just seeing the error of my ways now.
I've approached this with the wrong attitude and you are indeed correct.
Thanks for the follow up.
I must remember to read the questions better.
Kippy

EDIT- Am glad I aint doing the maths part of the exam myself.

RoseBlossom

fletch wrote: »

How many positions are available does anybody know?

I was talking to someone recently who said they had a friend placed in the high hundreds (i.e. 800s) on the current panel who was recently called for interview and started work. They said that because it took so long to get to people further down the list, many of them turned down the interviews because they had already found new/better jobs, hence the high number taken from the panel. I'm not sure if that's true but it's what I was told!

I'd say if you rang Publicjobs and asked what place they were at on the current EO panel you would get an idea of what range you need to aim for.

The_Dave

Just sat my EO, I'd really like to thank the girl who coughed every 2 minutes without fail, congratulations for irritating everyone

BurnsCarpenter

Anybody know if there's negative marking?
Wondering if I should fire down a load of random answers when there's one minute to go.

BurnsCarpenter

BurnsCarpenter wrote: »

Anybody know if there's negative marking?
Wondering if I should fire down a load of random answers when there's one minute to go.

To answer myself (:o) Apparently there's no negative marking.
Managed to get everything done in time anyway.

K_P

I'm sitting mine next Saturday. Just out of interest, did they say when to expect results and when interviews are scheduled for? I'm getting a bit ahead of myself here, I know.

kim_eire

I sat mine at the weekend, they said to expect results in the middle of May.

AlexBM

Middle of May? That's not too bad. I'm sitting mine this Saturday. Anyone want to offer any last-minute style advice/tips, please do.

death1234567

AlexBM wrote: »

Middle of May? That's not too bad. I'm sitting mine this Saturday. Anyone want to offer any last-minute style advice/tips, please do.

Its not hard so dont stress out about it. Just relax and answer as many questions as you can. I think lots of people go on for interview so Its not like you have to get the highest score out of everyone in the room.

K_P

Last minute style advice? Emmm... patterns will be big this summer with vintage floral, tribal and animal prints making a return to the high street. Sorry, I'm being stupid.

Well from my past experience of these types of exams, the sample questions given seemed to be at the easier end of the scale. There'll probably be a few simple ones at the start with the standard getting gradually harder. And as there's no negative marking, if you find yourself out of time with questions left to answer, there's no harm in putting down any answer. A few of them are bound to be right. Best of luck!

AlexBM

Thanks gang. I think I was asking for trouble with putting the word style in there! I'm doing some practice tests at the moment, and they seem to be pretty doable. Fingers crossed, anyway.

Oh, while I think of it, there isn't any dress code or anything is there?

fletch

How strict are they on the calculators? I have a calculator with memory (can only store numbers, not formulas) but it says no programmable calculator. Do they check them? Or just reset them before going in?

indiewindy

fletch wrote: »

How strict are they on the calculators? I have a calculator with memory (can only store numbers, not formulas) but it says no programmable calculator. Do they check them? Or just reset them before going in?

Their not too strict on them, i always bring a spare to these things just in case. The main thing with the maths part is not to spend too much time on the hard qs, just move on if your stumped.

Supercell

These tests are all pen and paper right?, so no need to wair a suit on the day, smart casual should be OK?

indiewindy

Supercell wrote: »

These tests are all pen and paper right?, so no need to wair a suit on the day, smart casual should be OK?

Yes, just wear comfortable clothes

nesf

fletch wrote: »

How strict are they on the calculators? I have a calculator with memory (can only store numbers, not formulas) but it says no programmable calculator. Do they check them? Or just reset them before going in?

If it's just got standard memory functions like M+ and M- then it's not a programmable calculator.

Strawberry 04

Hi,

Does anyone know if its possible to get any other sample papers, apart from the ones already mentioned on publicjobs.ie? I have gone through the questions several times but could do with seeing some more sample numerical reasoning tests. Thought they were quite hard and could do with some more practice! Thank you.

death1234567

The numerical reasoning tests in the sample paper are much harder than the actual ones in the test so if you have done the sample paper you'll be fine.

Strawberry 04

Good to hear! Thanks

Nightwish

Did the exam last saturday. A lot easier than anticipated. We did a sample numerical reasoning test before the actual one which was a lot harder. It went ok for me, the job familiarisation bit was the easiest and I had that done in 10 mins which was a pain, because they dont allow you to leave.

BurnsCarpenter

Nightwish wrote: »

Did the exam last saturday. A lot easier than anticipated. We did a sample numerical reasoning test before the actual one which was a lot harder. It went ok for me, the job familiarisation bit was the easiest and I had that done in 10 mins which was a pain, because they dont allow you to leave.

How in blazes did you manage that? I found it to be the opposite - flew through the first 2 but spent a bit of time agonising over every response in the job simulation.
I'd say there were only around 2 or 3 questions where I was fully satisfied that my answer was correct - for the rest there were at least two responses I could have given.

Nightwish

Maybe its because I can relate to a lot of the situations as I work for the government anyway but not as a civil servant.