Improving the Car Sales Experience

-Chris-

OK, I know that by asking these questions I'm opening a potential can of worms, but I think it's worth it...

I'm trying to be as good a salesperson I can and give my customers good service. There are philosophies and processes ingrained in the motor trade that I'm getting trained in, but I want to get a conversation going to gauge how worthwile they are.

Please don't turn this into a "dealers are w*nkers, salespeople are thieves, once when I was in this dealer you'll never believe what he said" thread. I want to know how to improve my service, to make your experience better.


Here's some starting points of what I'm wondering about:

If I ask you "Have you got any idea what your car's worth, have you got a price from anyone else, what have you got?" what do you think? I legitimately need that kind of information, but are you comfortable giving it?

When I ask you "are you looking to place an order today?", how many of you really are? Does it take 2 or 3 interactions before you make up your mind, or do you walk in with chequebook in hand?

How important is a test-drive (depending on the car, obviously)? How important is it that you get a test-drive immediately, or do you mind being re-appointed?

If I don't have the car to test-drive, what do you do? Do you head to my competitor's garage and test-drive there or do you give me a chance to organise the drive?

How long will you wait in a showroom before you'll get pissed off?

How many dealers do you normally go to before you make your decision?
Are they all the same make or do you go to several competing makes?

How much shopping have you done before you get to the dealership?

If you come in looking for a brochure or price list, should I just give you them or should I presume that you're here to buy and I should actually start SELLING?

How much research do you do on the internet? What are your gripes/praise for the amount and type of information available on the internet? What would you like to see on dealer/manufacturer websites that isnt' there currently?

How many of you go to a dealer to get a trade-in price with no intention of buying a car from that dealer?

Do you want the bottom line price immediately or is it important to haggle?

Are things like children's play areas, cappuchino machines and couches important to you? If you were designing your perfect showroom, what would you put in it?

At the moment, how well do you think your dealer/salesperson knows you - hobbies, family etc.?
How well do you want them to know you? Do you want a "relationship" or do you just want the car?

niceirishfella

I think LESS offers of hot beverages and MORE offers of substancial discounts would be advantageous to all buyers.

I used to work in the trade, in service, in sales and in rental. I dont think that car sales people are Thieves - but I do think the whole ETHOS of how some operate their sales business's is questionable in my experience on both side of the counter.

Turbodreams

return phone calls straight away! take phone calls when you are there! and dont leave a customer waiting for 2.5 hours in a showroom waiting to collect their new car. all of which i experienced at a certain Volkswagen dealer in south Dubllin. hence, when i get a new car next year, il shop elsewhere.

rebel.ranter

The most important thing to remember is to call people back when you say you will call them. Approx. 2 years ago I was in the Market for a brand new mini. The cost of the one I was interested in was coming to €27k, a cash deal, no trade in involved. The salesman went through the spec with me in the showroom but had to wait till a bit later for a price. No call for 2 days...
The sales man only called me back when I called the competition (who were not trading in BMW yet). It really peeved me that he didn't call me. I made a point of buying elsewhere despite it being more inconvenient.

cantdecide

It sounds lame but a little appreciation when giving the final go ahead would be nice. It wouldn't kill them to acknowledge the fact that a serious purchase is about to be put their way- not their competitors and the ol' 'ok, I'll start the paperwork' routine is pretty arrogant compared to 'great- thanks for the business'.

Spit62500

I think that its better to ask for an expected price instead of doing the usual of giving a low initial price and then moving up to a more realistic offer. It implies that had the customer not been better informed then you would have taken advantage.

Some people buy on the spur of the moment and some agonise over their decision. No harm to prod gently but no psycho salesman stuff.

Test drive importance depends on the customer. I think that its reasonable to expect availability of mainstream models (eg standard Golf) and unreasonable to expect immediate availability of less common models. Customer should really book a test drive but if the salesperson is free then it shouldn't be an issue (assuming that its not really busy in the showroom).

Personally I'd wait for you to organise a car for me if you offer - at least you showed interest which isn't guaranteed when visiting another showrooms.

I'll wait as long as I feel like waiting - if the salespersons are having a chat and laughing among themselves I'll wait for 5 minutes max. I've waited an hour and a half when all salespeople were busy - the receptionist did periodically reassure me that I hadn't been forgotten about though - helped a lot.

I can make a deal with the first garage I visit or visit all franchised dealers for that marque in the region. I usually have a price in mind and will be happy once I've got it. I'm not really interested in driving around to save 100 euro.

I usually choose a particular marque and then focus on that. If I can't get my target price then I'll reconsider brand.

You should give the information requested and show interest in moving things along - just show interest and enthusiasm, not a burning need... Always presume a prospective and imminent sale.

Most initial research done on internet - no substitute for driving the car though.

Usually never get a price unless I'm in the market - if I wouldn't buy off a dealer then I wouldn't visit them either.

I prefer a bottom line price. I do my research and I know what's a good deal before I start. I hate being offered 2k or 4k less than my car is worth followed by a better offer. I also hate the salesperson's consultation with the sales manager or the theatrical phonecall to another dealer. I particularly dislike 'dissing' of my brand of trade-in - 'those Nissans are only junk - they're made with Renault parts now' type of stuff. I am interested in honest reasons as to why they won't take my car or offer a good price.

Children's play areas and coffee machines are of no interest to me. I'm there to buy a car. If I want coffee I'll go to a coffee store. A car is something of a lifestyle choice but I don't see why it has to be associated with other lifestyle choices. On the subject of coffee, I was in in Mongey Plunkett recently. The staff were all drinking coffee from a store up the road - none of them seemed inclined to drink the stuff from the customer coffee machine :eek:

My last salesperson doesn't know me - I've never succeeded in buying a car twice off the same person. For some strange reason, they'll give me a good price on the first purchase and an unrealistic price on the second one. A complete stranger selling the same brand will give me a much better price without much of a struggle - I've no idea why (and I'm no trouble - honest!).

I hate when the salesperson doesn't call back, although I know that its because they can't/won't deal.

I also hate when the salesperson clearly has no interest in cars and has less knowledge of the options available than I have. I shouldn't have to tell a salesperson that it is possible to order air con when its on the Irish website. I don't expect them to be an expert but its depressing when they are lacking both product and customer service skills.

Spit62500

cantdecide wrote: »

It sounds lame but a little appreciation when giving the final go ahead would be nice. It wouldn't kill them to acknowledge the fact that a serious purchase is about to be put their way- not their competitors and the ol' 'ok, I'll start the paperwork' routine is pretty arrogant compared to 'great- thanks for the business'.

+1

Guy:Incognito

Key ring and a demisting cloth ftw!:D

Calling customers bacdk would rank very highly on my list.

JoeA3

Do car salesmen go on courses to learn the ins and outs of what they are selling? I've had countless experiences with car salesmen where they didn't know their backsides from their elbows when it came to the specs/options on the cars they were supposedly selling... Its very offputting when I know more about the product than the person trying to sell it to me. A read over the brochure might help!

I've also found it hard to forge relations with any one particular dealer, as sales staff seem to turnover a lot.

Another question, why do so many dealers not bother with weekends, when people have time to shop? Several dealerships in my area either close completely by lunchtime on saturday or operate with skeleton staff...

PauloMN

First of all, fair play in asking those questions of the general punters. Pity more sales people (not just car sales) wouldn't take the same time!

I'll give my tuppence worth on what I think the most important points are:

- I want a garage to give me a price on my car, not ask me for one. If a sales person starts asking me how much I think it's worth, I'm immediately put off by that. I don't think I'd ever trade-in again anyway, too expensive. However, I think it's fair game to ask someone "how does that compare with any other offers you've got?" after you give them an approx. figure.
- Agree with Spit26500 on the waiting - a few mins if I see people obviously free and I'm being ignored, much longer if I'm acknowledged and I clearly see that people are busy and I'm kept informed off where I am "in the queue".
- If I asked for a pricelist, I wouldn't mind being engaged in a chat about my requirements, as long as it's not pushy at that point.
- Availability of test drive depends on the car. I wouldn't expect a row of 10 RS4s to be waiting outside for a nice spin, however I expect the main sellers to be available or available within 20 mins if someone is already out in one. "Call back next Wednesday at 11am" won't do for a test drive in a TDi A4 in my opinion.
- Personally, I don't think a sales person should ever say "are you looking to place an order today?". It's not a packet of Tayto, it's a lot of dough and I would just think that the sales person is thinking purely of his/her targets when asking that. I think it's a big no-no. I'd probably say "no, thanks" and walk out if I got that line. The timescale can be figured out after a brief chat with the prospect.
- Play areas, coffee etc.... meh, to me that kinda just means I could be waiting there for a long time. A small play area for the kids is handy I suppose if you do engage for a while with a sales person.
- Haggling within reason is ok, but personally I just like to cut to the chase. No bull****, let's not all stand around cars in the cold doing the "fffsssshhhhhhhhh" inward breath through the lips. Cold, hard figures please. Bottom line, cash in the phoca, how much for that car?
- Also agree with Spit26500 on the product knowledge. I've gone into dealers knowing more about the cars than the sales people. Drives me mad as they should know everything about what they are selling, especially if they are selling a specific marque.

In general, listening to the customer is the most important thing. I went to Park Motors last year looking for an A4 of around '02/'03 vintage. Sales chap there said he'd none, and started saying they'd be around €27k anyway. :eek: It was obvious that he wanted to sell me a new motor, he'd a few of the 115bhp 1.9TDis left to shift, and he obviously thought I'd bite. He had me sitting down working out finance etc. before I knew it, it was very pressurised. After a while I just went along with it, wanted to blag a test drive and thought "this prick didn't listen to a word I've said so fcuk him, I'll waste some of his time". I'd no intention of buying a new car as he would have known if he had listened to me, so he wasted probably 40 mins including the test drive.

JHMEG

niceirishfella wrote: »

I think LESS offers of hot beverages and MORE offers of substancial discounts would be advantageous to all buyers.

+1

..and Guarantees in writing, and answer the phone/return phonecalls.

groupb

When I worked as a salesman in a big Dublin garage I was the only one that had an interest in cars and knew how an engine worked. It was my first sales job and was told that if I sold a car in my first few weeks I would be doing well. I sold 15 in three weeks which considering the brand and the time of year (march) was'nt bad. I believe if you show the customer that you have genuine faith in your product and you show some passion , this will easily outshadow the "lets gloss over the fact that I know nothing about the car but I'll get you a good deal" attitude that a lot of salesmen/women show.Remember that every customer is an indivudal. I think its like everthing else in life you take people as you find them. I think setting hard and fast rules can lead to the arrogance that has been referred to by other posters many times on motors.
I was headhunted after 7 weeks into a non car releated sales role but this turned out to be a disaterous move. I've since tried to get back into car sales but with a CV showing 18 years as a plant fitter and 7 weeks as a car salesman this is proving difficult.
Anyway to the OP - Good luck.

-Chris-

Thank you everyone so far. I'm reading rather than replying - I don't want to get defensive. I'm trying to get better, not justify my existing problems.

Please, keep going!!

Esel

AudiChris wrote: »

If I ask you "Have you got any idea what your car's worth, have you got a price from anyone else, what have you got?" what do you think? I legitimately need that kind of information, but are you comfortable giving it?

How do you 'legitimately need that kind of information'? How is it in my interest to answer that question? Or if I decide to answer, should I be truthful? I want you to make the first offer on trade-in value. Being asked this question would set one of the negative switches in my head, tbh.

E92

Salesmen(not salesperson none of this political correctness bullsh*t please) should know what they're selling.

If I tell a salesman that car x has a chassis from car y and they say it has nothing to do with it that drives me mad e.g. a Nissan salesman saying that the Note has nothing to do with the Renault Modus.

I also shouldn't have to tell the salesman what is standard in a particular car as I had to once in a large Opel dealer in Dublin.

I hate most of all arrogance. They should be as pleasant as possible, and of course I expect them to take me seriously.

I've helped people I know to buy cars before and it is extraordinary how so many make no real effort to try and sell you a car at all. It's like they hate their job and are finishing their jobs in the morning for something else. Some are so morbid. Salesmen are supposed to be enthusiastic about what they do and what they sell. I know that you have to deal with complete spastics but most people are not like that at all I'm sure.

They should be trying to promote the car, but not in an 'in your face' arrogant type approach.

rebel.ranter

As E92 said:
know your product, doa bit of research into it ohter than just reading the brochure. Have an understanding of what is going on in the workshop behind you. At least then you'll sound lie you give a ddamn.
If you don't know then just say so & find out the answer to the customer's question. Most people appreciate honsesty.

The personality traits of good sales people go against them in a lot of areas. They are just interested in the sell & only get their buzz fromthe point of sale. I can see it where I work, there are two different personality types in new sales & existing account management. The "new sales" guys are greta at bringing in the business but are absolutely rubbish at following up on a lead if it requires more than one attempt. The accoutn managers on the otherhand are excellent at maintinaing cusomters.

I do think that a test drive of the prospective purcahse is important, one possible way on how to improve the experience is to let the customer feel at ease, maybe even let them have a good look around the car on their own, offering your assistance from afar.

pburns

I just want a saleman who KNOWS HIS STUFF!

I did a bit of shopping around in December - 2 salesmen spring to mind:
One guy was a young business gradute:rolleyes: (he told me so during the test drive). Genuinely nice guy, but he didn't have a clue about the car he was selling, specs, engines etc. His excuse was that it was a new model and he's only started a few weeks before but I knew more than he did! He didn't even examine my trade-in. In fact I don't think he was at all clued up about cars in general. Any car-head who surfs the net or reads car mags would have known more. Pissed me right off.

The other guy was more typical salesman, a bit slippery, trying to talk me into an old-spec model, making transparant excuses about why the showroom was empty (an Alfa-Fiat affair!) Turned out he was an ex-mechanic who knew a friend-of-a-friend. When I brought him out to examine my car he immediately spotted where I had just had a small ding repaired. Even to me it is invisable! Despite being a bit of a cute hoor though I was impressed with him.

Spit62500

E92 wrote: »

Salesmen(not salesperson none of this political correctness bullsh*t please) should know what they're selling.

Whatever about PC, I can't bring myself to refer to a female saleswhatever as a salesman.... Doesn't seem right.

T J Hooker

esel wrote: »

I want you to make the first offer on trade-in value.

Which deal would you prefer if the two cars were identical:
Dealer A: car(€18000) - px(€7000) = €11000(cost to change)


Dealer B: car(€15250) - px(€5000) = €10250(cost to change)


Would you prefer a high trade-in value or a low cost to change?
I would think the answer is fairly obvious, but I am in car sales myself and one thing that irates me is when someone walks in and says how much for my trade-in? They have no idea what they are looking for but they will only consider looking at the dealer who offers the most for their trade-in without considering the retail prices of the cars that dealer is selling.
People focus way to much on trade-in price and not enough on how much they have to spend to buy their new car.

OP:
1)As already stated a few times, product knowledge is absolutely vital!

2)It is proven in car sales around the world that for every two test drives you will sell one unit. So insist on customers driving the car(without being forceful), provided you have the car on site. So simply put, the more you test drive the more units you will sell.

3)Show genuine interest in your customer. If they don't buy on the day ring them later the same day and say a simple "thank you for stopping by today". You will be amazed at how much a simple thank you can impress people and could sway a deal your way.

The day my customer collects their car and leaves I send out a hand written letter to them in the post to say thank you for the business. It takes two minutes to do and makes an impression.

I'm not saying everything I'm doing is right nor wrong however its simple touches that can make a world of difference to your customers buying experience which will make them come back and they will refer people into you. Repeat business requires less work.

Stephen

Interesting thread!

AudiChris wrote:

If I ask you "Have you got any idea what your car's worth, have you got a price from anyone else, what have you got?" what do you think? I legitimately need that kind of information, but are you comfortable giving it?

That would set alarm bells off in my head too. Just make me an offer of what you think its worth! "Have you got any idea what your car's worth" makes me think "cos if you don't, i'm going to take you to the cleaners"! Not accusing you of this btw Chris!

T J Hooker

Stephen wrote: »

That would set alarm bells off in my head too. Just make me an offer of what you think its worth! "Have you got any idea what your car's worth" makes me think "cos if you don't, i'm going to take you to the cleaners"! Not accusing you of this btw Chris!

Because some people look at carzone and become disillusioned as to what they think their car is worth. It is very hard to convince that type of person that their car is infact not worth (in the trade) near what they think it is.

maidhc

Be honest, straightforward, and give the best deal you can.

Nothing else really matters.

Sandwich

If I ask you "Have you got any idea what your car's worth, have you got a price from anyone else, what have you got?" what do you think? I legitimately need that kind of information, but are you comfortable giving it?
You dont legitimately need that kind of information - its your job to have it already no get it from your customer. Salesmen ask this question to guage if the owner knows the real worth of their car. if they dont he can try to offer them less than the market price. But i usually play the game and lie - just up the price by a few thousand.


When I ask you "are you looking to place an order today?", how many of you really are? Does it take 2 or 3 interactions before you make up your mind, or do you walk in with chequebook in hand? You are asking the question to judge how keen he is to buy, and so you will factor that into getting the most out of him that you can. Any sensible customer will say no, that he has a few other dealers to check out. Some will say yes though - these are the people you want - and can probably get a better margin from.


How important is a test-drive (depending on the car, obviously)? How important is it that you get a test-drive immediately, or do you mind being re-appointed?
Depends on how rare the car/version/engine is. I wouldnt hold it against you if you didnt have one there and then - dont really expect you to have all variants available at the same time.

If I don't have the car to test-drive, what do you do? Do you head to my competitor's garage and test-drive there or do you give me a chance to organise the drive? If another garage has it in reasonable distance, then propbably go see it there. will make no difference to which I would buy from though - price alone would determine that.

]How long will you wait in a showroom before you'll get pissed off? Up to half an hour no problem if there are other people there that are being dealt with. Beyond that not so happy, and if the place is not busy and no one is available I would not be happy at all.

How many dealers do you normally go to before you make your decision?
Are they all the same make or do you go to several competing makes?Will allways try to or 3 dealers when have decided on the particular car. Would usually have two or 3 makes/cars in mind and so could could have visited 6 or 7 dealers in all.

How much shopping have you done before you get to the dealership?Will generally have the cars pretty well researched from magazines/web and will know specs, variants and prices.

If you come in looking for a brochure or price list, should I just give you them or should I presume that you're here to buy and I should actually start SELLING? No just give me the brochure price list. If I really wanted to talk sales then I would initiate it. Otherwise just introduce yourself, give me you card, and let me know if there were any GENUINE special offers that you had - but only inform me dont try to sell it.

How much research do you do on the internet? What are your gripes/praise for the amount and type of information available on the internet? What would you like to see on dealer/manufacturer websites that isnt' there currently?Quite a bit. Generally it is very good these days from most manufacturers. Will look at the onle magazines and forums also though for the less biased view.

How many of you go to a dealer to get a trade-in price with no intention of buying a car from that dealer?
Never done it. You may as well get the price from someone who has a car you're interested in.

Do you want the bottom line price immediately or is it important to haggle?
Want the bottom line price - but know it will never be given. Car salesmen make money on the ignorance of the buyer who on average is only buying a car once every few years. Salesmen are selling them everyday and its their job to know the prices and margins in detail. Buyers only know this to varying degrees and so salesmen gain from their knowledge - trying to guage how ignorant/knowledgeable the buyer is and so trying to maximise the margin to each customer individually. If you give the bottom line price straight away then you will lose out on those sales wher the buyer was willing to pay more.

Are things like children's play areas, cappuchino machines and couches important to you? If you were designing your perfect showroom, what would you put in it?Yes but no need for too much. A few magazines, confortable couches, water machine would be fine.

At the moment, how well do you think your dealer/salesperson knows you - hobbies, family etc.?He doesnt. NOt really relevant.

How well do you want them to know you? Do you want a "relationship" or do you just want the car?Not at all. We are meeting to deal in a car not become pals - but polite, friendly, chatty, bit of banter about the new of the day i would expect.

pburns

Sandwich wrote: »

AudiChris wrote: »

OK, I know that by asking these questions I'm opening a potential can of worms, but I think it's worth it...

If I ask you "Have you got any idea what your car's worth, have you got a price from anyone else, what have you got?" what do you think? I legitimately need that kind of information, but are you comfortable giving it?

AudiChris wrote: »

You dont legitimately need that kind of information - its your job to have it already no get it from your customer. Salesmen ask this question to guage if the owner knows the real worth of their car. if they dont he can try to offer them less than the market price. But i usually play the game and lie - just up the price by a few thousand.

AudiChris wrote: »

When I ask you "are you looking to place an order today?", how many of you really are? Does it take 2 or 3 interactions before you make up your mind, or do you walk in with chequebook in hand?

AudiChris wrote: »

You are asking the question to judge how keen he is to buy, and so you will factor that into getting the most out of him that you can. Any sensible customer will say no, that he has a few other dealers to check out. Some will say yes though - these are the people you want - and can probably get a better margin from.

AudiChris wrote: »

How important is a test-drive (depending on the car, obviously)? How important is it that you get a test-drive immediately, or do you mind being re-appointed?

AudiChris wrote: »

Depends on how rare the car/version/engine is. I wouldnt hold it against you if you didnt have one there and then - dont really expect you to have all variants available at the same time.

AudiChris wrote: »

If I don't have the car to test-drive, what do you do? Do you head to my competitor's garage and test-drive there or do you give me a chance to organise the drive?

AudiChris wrote: »

If another garage has it in reasonable distance, then propbably go see it there. will make no difference to which I would buy from though - price alone would determine that.

AudiChris wrote: »

How long will you wait in a showroom before you'll get pissed off?

AudiChris wrote: »

Up to half an hour no problem if there are other people there that are being dealt with. Beyond that not so happy, and if the place is not busy and no one is available I would not be happy at all.

AudiChris wrote: »

How many dealers do you normally go to before you make your decision?
Are they all the same make or do you go to several competing makes?

AudiChris wrote: »

Will allways try to or 3 dealers when have decided on the particular car. Would usually have two or 3 makes/cars in mind and so could could have visited 6 or 7 dealers in all.

AudiChris wrote: »

How much shopping have you done before you get to the dealership?

AudiChris wrote: »

Will generally have the cars pretty well researched from magazines/web and will know specs, variants and prices.

AudiChris wrote: »

If you come in looking for a brochure or price list, should I just give you them or should I presume that you're here to buy and I should actually start SELLING?

AudiChris wrote: »

No just give me the brochure price list. If I really wanted to talk sales then I would initiate it. Otherwise just introduce yourself, give me you card, and let me know if there were any GENUINE special offers that you had - but only inform me dont try to sell it.

AudiChris wrote: »

How much research do you do on the internet? What are your gripes/praise for the amount and type of information available on the internet? What would you like to see on dealer/manufacturer websites that isnt' there currently?

AudiChris wrote: »

Quite a bit. Generally it is very good these days from most manufacturers. Will look at the onle magazines and forums also though for the less biased view.

AudiChris wrote: »

How many of you go to a dealer to get a trade-in price with no intention of buying a car from that dealer?

AudiChris wrote: »

Never done it. You may as well get the price from someone who has a car you're interested in.

AudiChris wrote: »

Do you want the bottom line price immediately or is it important to haggle?

AudiChris wrote: »

Want the bottom line price - but know it will never be given. Car salesmen make money on the ignorance of the buyer who on average is only buying a car once every few years. Salesmen are selling them everyday and its their job to know the prices and margins in detail. Buyers only know this to varying degrees and so salesmen gain from their knowledge - trying to guage how ignorant/knowledgeable the buyer is and so trying to maximise the margin to each customer individually. If you give the bottom line price straight away then you will lose out on those sales wher the buyer was willing to pay more.

AudiChris wrote: »

Are things like children's play areas, cappuchino machines and couches important to you? If you were designing your perfect showroom, what would you put in it?

AudiChris wrote: »

Yes but no need for too much. A few magazines, confortable couches, water machine would be fine.

AudiChris wrote: »

At the moment, how well do you think your dealer/salesperson knows you - hobbies, family etc.?

AudiChris wrote: »

He doesnt. NOt really relevant.

AudiChris wrote: »

How well do you want them to know you? Do you want a "relationship" or do you just want the car?

AudiChris wrote: »

Not at all. We are meeting to deal in a car not become pals - but polite, friendly, chatty, bit of banter about the new of the day i would expect.

You need to close your tags before this becomes readable...

Biro

AudiChris wrote: »

Here's some starting points of what I'm wondering about:

If I ask you "Have you got any idea what your car's worth, have you got a price from anyone else, what have you got?" what do you think? I legitimately need that kind of information, but are you comfortable giving it?
Yes

When I ask you "are you looking to place an order today?", how many of you really are? Does it take 2 or 3 interactions before you make up your mind, or do you walk in with chequebook in hand?
I like 2 or 3 interactions, and pondering time. I hate being rushed, and I hate the immediate lack of interest when they find out I'm only doing preliminary homework.

How important is a test-drive (depending on the car, obviously)? How important is it that you get a test-drive immediately, or do you mind being re-appointed?
Vital, and I hate being rushed with it. I like being shown a route that they recommend because it's got some good and bad roads, basically showcasing the car's ability. Hate being re-appointed for a test drive, but if it has to be done, so be it.

If I don't have the car to test-drive, what do you do? Do you head to my competitor's garage and test-drive there or do you give me a chance to organise the drive?
Usually another same brand dealer will be miles away, so can't go to competitor.

How long will you wait in a showroom before you'll get pissed off?
3 minutes before someone asks if I'm OK, or even just says "I'll be with you in a couple of minutes". Once I'm acknowledged, I'm happy enough to browse for another while.

How many dealers do you normally go to before you make your decision?
Are they all the same make or do you go to several competing makes?
Several competing makes.

How much shopping have you done before you get to the dealership?
Lots
If you come in looking for a brochure or price list, should I just give you them or should I presume that you're here to buy and I should actually start SELLING?
Just give them, but maybe casually chat about the car first, like "Oh, did you know about the new engine coming next month" or something like that to sus out if the customer is willing to talk more and maybe give info on when they'll be ready to deal.
How much research do you do on the internet? What are your gripes/praise for the amount and type of information available on the internet? What would you like to see on dealer/manufacturer websites that isnt' there currently?
Fully researched before I buy. It's hard to get to just picking the model you like, the list price, and the extras price. That's the first thing that matters. After that have an easy to access Tech specs page, with EVERYTHING there.
How many of you go to a dealer to get a trade-in price with no intention of buying a car from that dealer?
Seldom enough.
Do you want the bottom line price immediately or is it important to haggle?
Tough one, maybe a close to bottom line price with a little room.
Are things like children's play areas, cappuchino machines and couches important to you? If you were designing your perfect showroom, what would you put in it?
Zero importance.
At the moment, how well do you think your dealer/salesperson knows you - hobbies, family etc.?
How well do you want them to know you? Do you want a "relationship" or do you just want the car?
It'd be nice to be acknowledged for being someone who knows what they're talking about, and not another pleb with an open wallet.

I hate when a sales guy knows less than me. They're supposed to know more than me, otherwise they're just an obsticle that causes the price of the car to increase. It happens a lot in Ireland, in everything, like car dealers, electrical places, computer places etc.

Also, ring me back when you say you will, otherwise you've lied to me. I was in a BMW dealer looking for a price on an M6 for my old man's friend, I thought I could get a better price in this place. If it was the difference of a grand or two, the person would have made the deal there. I was told they'd get back to me on Monday, but they never did. Why was the potential for a sale of a €165,000 car not important enough for one 2 minute phone call? Even if they thought I wasn't serious, even though I was?

Padraig Mor

Spit62500 wrote: »

I also hate when the salesperson clearly has no interest in cars and has less knowledge of the options available than I have. I shouldn't have to tell a salesperson that it is possible to order air con when its on the Irish website. .

JoeA3 wrote: »

Do car salesmen go on courses to learn the ins and outs of what they are selling? I've had countless experiences with car salesmen where they didn't know their backsides from their elbows when it came to the specs/options on the cars they were supposedly selling... Its very offputting when I know more about the product than the person trying to sell it to me. .

groupb wrote: »

When I worked as a salesman in a big Dublin garage I was the only one that had an interest in cars and knew how an engine worked...... I believe if you show the customer that you have genuine faith in your product and you show some passion , this will easily outshadow the "lets gloss over the fact that I know nothing about the car but I'll get you a good deal" attitude

E92 wrote: »

Salesmen(not salesperson none of this political correctness bullsh*t please) should know what they're selling.......I also shouldn't have to tell the salesman what is standard in a particular car as I had to once in a large Opel dealer in Dublin..

Completely agree with all of these. The buyer should not have to tell the salesman about the car. He should know it already! And don't try and quote prices thousands above those on your group website (like J+P Honda in Cork)!

Also, if you say you're going to ring back - do it.

-Chris-

OK, some really interesting stuff there!

AudiChris wrote: »

If I ask you "Have you got any idea what your car's worth, have you got a price from anyone else, what have you got?" what do you think? I legitimately need that kind of information, but are you comfortable giving it?

This seems to be 50/50, and I think I'm probably going about it wrong.
The logic I've been told is to check what the expectation is before getting too deep into the process because often (more often than I'd like, anyway...) I'll spend 45 minutes with someone, spec up a car, assess their car, go on a test-drive etc. and then when it comes to giving a price I get "is that all it's worth? I thought it'd be worth €x! Well if it's only worth that then we'll have to go and think about it".
This normally means "we can't afford it after all" and I never see those customers again. That's 45 minutes I could be using for more productive things.
I can understand that giving that information away shows your hand to a certain extent, though. You've lost a little of your negotiating power.

AudiChris wrote: »

When I ask you "are you looking to place an order today?", how many of you really are? Does it take 2 or 3 interactions before you make up your mind, or do you walk in with chequebook in hand?

Interesting replies on this too. Again, it's a "don't waste 45 mins with someone who's buying in '09 when there are other people in the showroom" question, but I've always hated asking it - it feels kinda aggressive.
Sometimes there's also a bit of "don't let them leave until they've bought a car" attitude. I don't know if it's possible to spend €x0,000 in one sitting.
From my point-of-view, letting you leave takes away all my control - now you're out-and-about with my quote in hand using it to beat other dealers up with.

AudiChris wrote: »

How important is a test-drive (depending on the car, obviously)? How important is it that you get a test-drive immediately, or do you mind being re-appointed?

This is pretty much as I thought.

AudiChris wrote: »

If I don't have the car to test-drive, what do you do? Do you head to my competitor's garage and test-drive there or do you give me a chance to organise the drive?

Again, 50/50 - and not something that's in my control.

AudiChris wrote: »

How long will you wait in a showroom before you'll get pissed off?

I'm surprised at the answers to this. My experience is that very few people will wait more than 3 or 4 minutes, no matter what the circumstances.
We would never sit around chatting and ignore a customer, or let the customer go un-approached for more than a few seconds - the boss would kill us!
Sometimes though, when we're all busy with people, you'll see people walk in, wait 2 minutes, and then walk out again. You don't even get the chance to make eye-contact with them.

Follow-up question: If you walk into a showroom and all the salespeople are busy with someone, would you take it upon yourself to take a seat/grab a magazine and wait to be looked after, or would some form of "greeter" be of any comfort to you - someone to say you'll be looked after next and who can get you brochures etc.?

AudiChris wrote: »

How many dealers do you normally go to before you make your decision?
Are they all the same make or do you go to several competing makes?

No surprises here.

Follow-up question: you bought your car from x garage. Do you go to x first before shopping around, or do you shop the other dealers first so you have ammo/information when you get to x? Is there any inclination there to deal with the same person as last time?

AudiChris wrote: »

How much shopping have you done before you get to the dealership?

No surprises here.

AudiChris wrote: »

If you come in looking for a brochure or price list, should I just give you them or should I presume that you're here to buy and I should actually start SELLING?

Everyone seems pretty agreed on this one too.
I ask because my boss insists that we get everyone's contact details, even if they're only looking for a price list. We should try and sit them all down with us - if they've gone to the trouble of walking in to a dealership, then they're pretty serious about buying a car.
I always thought you should feel it out with a pleasant chat to suss the customer's current stage of thought. This can lead to disaster though (from a personal efficiency point-of-view) as it's a short leap from chatting idly to them asking to look at that car (and probably one or two others) and possibly even asking for a drive, when they're really only sussing out the brand and the model range at the moment and they're far from a decision.
I could spend 30 mins with that person easily and all they were looking for was a brochure...

AudiChris wrote: »

How much research do you do on the internet? What are your gripes/praise for the amount and type of information available on the internet? What would you like to see on dealer/manufacturer websites that isnt' there currently?

We're probably a skewed sample - asking on a forum "how internet savvy are you?":p
Any more suggestions for specific things you'd like on a dealer website - if I were designing the perfect website today, what would you want to see on it.

AudiChris wrote: »

How many of you go to a dealer to get a trade-in price with no intention of buying a car from that dealer?

I'm amazed at the answers of this. You wouldn't believe how many people walk into the dealership asking "I'm looking for an A4, how much is my car worth", you get them a price, they leave, they never return your phone calls after that.
I always presumed they were existing customer of other dealers, just trying to keep them honest by checking out the competition.
No evidence of that here though...

AudiChris wrote: »

Do you want the bottom line price immediately or is it important to haggle?

Me personally, I'd rather give the bottom line price. If someone said "that'll cost you €10,000" and then I managed to get it for €8,000, I'd feel like they tried to nick €2,000 off me.
But if I don't build in some sort of leeway, then I've got nowhere to go if you go to a different dealer who beats me by a few quid, and I've got no wiggle-room if you start asking for mats and flaps and a free first service...
People always say "give me your best price" and then immediately follow that up with "ah come on, you can do better than that". Then we're into the pantomime of me running back and forward to the Sales Manager's office...

Follow up question: If I have a bottom line price in my head (and I mean ROCK BOTTOM), how much leeway should I build in? Would beating me down by €500 make you feel like you made a good deal, or do you want €1,000.
Bear in mind the product that I sell and the cost of it when you're answering...

AudiChris wrote: »

Are things like children's play areas, cappuchino machines and couches important to you? If you were designing your perfect showroom, what would you put in it?

Really surprised at this. Could be a brand thing though.
I have this image in my head of my customers - they're successful middle-management or company directors, they're spending €35,000+ on a new car. They take nice holidays and stay in good hotels. They have nice clothes and are well respected in the companies they work for.
If they get a certain level of service from the Hilton/Radisson, would they not expect to get the same service and comfort from their motor-dealer?
Am I wrong? Is it just about the deal?

AudiChris wrote: »

At the moment, how well do you think your dealer/salesperson knows you - hobbies, family etc.?
How well do you want them to know you? Do you want a "relationship" or do you just want the car?

That was just out of curiosity...



My product knowledge is very strong, as is my technical knowledge, although with a product like Audi there are so many bloody options that differ from car to car that sometimes I get confused. Makes me feel very unprofessional.

As for not returning phone calls, I'm guilty of this too. I don't know why.
I've moved from an office job where everything was within my control and I could prioritise easily to a customer facing job where it's much harder to control your time - I started typing an email with some leasing quotes to a customer around 10am yesterday, with interruptions (i.e. customers) etc. it was 3pm before I hit send.
There is no excuse for not returning calls or keeping promises though.

-Chris-

cantdecide wrote: »

It sounds lame but a little appreciation when giving the final go ahead would be nice. It wouldn't kill them to acknowledge the fact that a serious purchase is about to be put their way- not their competitors and the ol' 'ok, I'll start the paperwork' routine is pretty arrogant compared to 'great- thanks for the business'.

Yeah, we can't let ourselves become blase. Sealing the deal and taking delivery should be fulfilling experiences.

-Chris-

JoeA3 wrote: »

Do car salesmen go on courses to learn the ins and outs of what they are selling?

Yep, all Audi salespeople are supposed to do a 3 week training course as well as online product training. I'm sure it's true to a greater or lesser extent for all marques.

JoeA3 wrote: »

I've also found it hard to forge relations with any one particular dealer, as sales staff seem to turnover a lot.

This is definitely a problem out there.

JoeA3 wrote: »

Another question, why do so many dealers not bother with weekends, when people have time to shop? Several dealerships in my area either close completely by lunchtime on saturday or operate with skeleton staff...

I both agree and disagree. From a consumer point-of-view, I recognise the fact that retailers need to be open when purchasers are free.
From a seller's point-of-view, I tend to find we get serious buyers during the week (who have taken the time off work to get the job done) and a mix of browsers and buyers on Saturday. Apparently, when we used to open on Sunday you'd have a lot of people in, but never actually sell any cars.

That's a tough call...

There should be no skeleton staffs though - if you're open, be properly open!

-Chris-

PauloMN wrote: »

First of all, fair play in asking those questions of the general punters. Pity more sales people (not just car sales) wouldn't take the same time!

Thanks, I'm finding it to be a VERY worthwhile exercise.
Thank you all for your help!

PauloMN wrote: »

In general, listening to the customer is the most important thing. I went to Park Motors last year looking for an A4 of around '02/'03 vintage. Sales chap there said he'd none, and started saying they'd be around €27k anyway. :eek: It was obvious that he wanted to sell me a new motor, he'd a few of the 115bhp 1.9TDis left to shift, and he obviously thought I'd bite. He had me sitting down working out finance etc. before I knew it, it was very pressurised. After a while I just went along with it, wanted to blag a test drive and thought "this prick didn't listen to a word I've said so fcuk him, I'll waste some of his time". I'd no intention of buying a new car as he would have known if he had listened to me, so he wasted probably 40 mins including the test drive.

I don't think this is dealer (or even industry) specific. There's nothing I hate more than being sold something I don't want.
If you don't have what I want, feel free to offer alternatives, but demonstrate that you understood the requirements in the first place.

I don't think I'm guilty of this, I hope not...

Follow up question: The "proper way to sell a car" says to start off by sitting the customer down and getting their requirements (qualification) before showing them a car. That would stop this kind of thing from happening.
If you walk into a showroom and say "Can you show me the A4 you have parked outside?" and I reply "yes, of course. Come have a seat with me first while I get some information", does it feel natural/pressured/unnecessary? How would you prefer me to handle this situation - bear in mind that if I just bring you out straight away that I've taken no time to assess your requirements and if I sit you down straight away I've basically said "no, you can't see that car 'till you've jumped through these hoops"...

-Chris-

rebel.ranter wrote: »

The personality traits of good sales people go against them in a lot of areas. They are just interested in the sell & only get their buzz fromthe point of sale. I can see it where I work, there are two different personality types in new sales & existing account management. The "new sales" guys are greta at bringing in the business but are absolutely rubbish at following up on a lead if it requires more than one attempt. The accoutn managers on the otherhand are excellent at maintinaing cusomters.

You may be right with this, but I'm not sure. I'm a great Account Manager (it's my background), not a cold-blooded sales machine. I give people time and space and try to be an adviser rather than a salesperson.
It's led my trainer and my boss to both comment "Chris, don't be the nicest guy they never bought a car from".

Sometimes you need to be able to either close the deal or just move on, if you spend your time chasing luke-warm prospects, you won't be available for the hot ones!

_Kaiser_

If I ask you "Have you got any idea what your car's worth, have you got a price from anyone else, what have you got?" what do you think? I legitimately need that kind of information, but are you comfortable giving it?
Like others I'd think it's your job to tell me based on the condition/mileage/age etc of my individual car. I may have an approximate value already, or a figure that I want for it but to me a question like that reads like "how much can I take you for?"

When I ask you "are you looking to place an order today?", how many of you really are? Does it take 2 or 3 interactions before you make up your mind, or do you walk in with chequebook in hand?
For most people buying a new(er) car is a big (expensive) decision. Per your post above you may not see this as much as you're selling Audis, but for me I'll probably need more than the one or two visits - those other visits may be to other dealers though.

How important is a test-drive (depending on the car, obviously)? How important is it that you get a test-drive immediately, or do you mind being re-appointed?
Given that my last 3 cars have been automatic, and Ireland's historic dislike of these, I wouldn't be too put out if you didn't have the exact version I wanted to hand, but in a bigger dealer I'd expect something similar to be available.

If I don't have the car to test-drive, what do you do? Do you head to my competitor's garage and test-drive there or do you give me a chance to organise the drive?
Depends on the timeframe and how much time I have as well. I may go test it elsewhere but it won't impact where I buy it from.

]How long will you wait in a showroom before you'll get pissed off?
If I walk in and things are busy I'm happy to browse/have a read of the brochures. After a few minutes I'd expect to be at least acknowledged and given an idea of how long I'll be waiting.
If on the other hand the place is quiet and the salesmen are chatting amongst themselves I'd expect to be approached fairly quickly.

How many dealers do you normally go to before you make your decision?
Are they all the same make or do you go to several competing makes?
As above I'll probably go to several dealers but I'll already have a particular brand/model in mind before I come in.

How much shopping have you done before you get to the dealership?
I'll have checked prices and spec online, looked for the "known issues" on forums, guaged owner feedback etc

If you come in looking for a brochure or price list, should I just give you them or should I presume that you're here to buy and I should actually start SELLING?
As others, just give me the details. Feel free of course to introduce yourself, give me your card, inform me of any genuine deals you may have on what I'm interested in but leave the sales pitch until I start asking pointed questions.

How much research do you do on the internet? What are your gripes/praise for the amount and type of information available on the internet? What would you like to see on dealer/manufacturer websites that isnt' there currently?
As above, I do a lot of preliminary research online. Most of it is pretty good.

How many of you go to a dealer to get a trade-in price with no intention of buying a car from that dealer?
Done it once or twice. Per my original point, it's a big decision for most people. I did however bring my 02 Passat in for a quick assessment to a main VW dealer a while back only to be told "oh we don't deal with something that old ourselves but I'll ring a garage we deal with and get back to you" - which never happened.

Do you want the bottom line price immediately or is it important to haggle?
Bottom line. Of course I'll never get it, but I'll have a figure I want to pay in mind and a margin to play with around that. I'd rather cut out the wasted haggling time.

Are things like children's play areas, cappuchino machines and couches important to you? If you were designing your perfect showroom, what would you put in it?
No real interest to me. Somewhere comfortable to sit down if I'll be waiting is good but that's about it.

At the moment, how well do you think your dealer/salesperson knows you - hobbies, family etc.?
Well the guy I bought my current Passat from knows me pretty well, but that's because I've been back to him too many times with problems

How well do you want them to know you? Do you want a "relationship" or do you just want the car?
A bit of banter and honesty goes a long way. If I feel like I got a good deal from you and the experience generally was good I'll come back to you next time or refer others. But at the end of the day, I'm there to buy a car, not make a new best friend.
EDIT: After-sales experience is also key. If I do run into any issues, how you deal with those will be a BIG factor in whether I come back to you next time or recommend you to others.

Follow-up question: If you walk into a showroom and all the salespeople are busy with someone, would you take it upon yourself to take a seat/grab a magazine and wait to be looked after, or would some form of "greeter" be of any comfort to you - someone to say you'll be looked after next and who can get you brochures etc.?
As above, I don't mind waiting, but to be acknowledged and given an idea of my place in the queue is a must.

Follow-up question: you bought your car from x garage. Do you go to x first before shopping around, or do you shop the other dealers first so you have ammo/information when you get to x? Is there any inclination there to deal with the same person as last time?
See my point above

Follow up question: If I have a bottom line price in my head (and I mean ROCK BOTTOM), how much leeway should I build in? Would beating me down by €500 make you feel like you made a good deal, or do you want €1,000.
Bear in mind the product that I sell and the cost of it when you're answering...
As above I'll have an idea of how much I'm prepared to pay with some leeway built in. Of course I realise you have to make some money too, but if I've come back to you twice/three times then I'm obviously interested in buying the car from you. Theatrics like "ok let me talk to the manager and see what I can do" etc don't impress me.

Really surprised at this. Could be a brand thing though.
I have this image in my head of my customers - they're successful middle-management or company directors, they're spending €35,000+ on a new car. They take nice holidays and stay in good hotels. They have nice clothes and are well respected in the companies they work for.
If they get a certain level of service from the Hilton/Radisson, would they not expect to get the same service and comfort from their motor-dealer?
Am I wrong? Is it just about the deal?
As I mentioned above, because of the car you're selling you may well be getting a lot of customers like this but I'd imagine that to most people (even the more well off ones), buying a new car is a fairly big thing. To that end they're going to be more interested in the deal than where the coffee machine is.

As for not returning phone calls, I'm guilty of this too. I don't know why.
I've moved from an office job where everything was within my control and I could prioritise easily to a customer facing job where it's much harder to control your time - I started typing an email with some leasing quotes to a customer around 10am yesterday, with interruptions (i.e. customers) etc. it was 3pm before I hit send.
There is no excuse for not returning calls or keeping promises though.
Absolutely. I work in IT myself and like you, it often takes several attempts to send a simple e-mail sometimes, but if you promise to do so or call someone back then do. Otherwise a customer will go elsewhere.

masterwriter

Suggest all used cars be priced if not already. Lots of dealers do not put prices on used cars and this is illegal.

Why do they not price them? Is it so they can make up the price depending on how flush the customer looks?

T J Hooker

masterwriter wrote: »

Suggest all used cars be priced if not already. Lots of dealers do not put prices on used cars and this is illegal.

Why do they not price them? Is it so they can make up the price depending on how flush the customer looks?

Its not illegal, and they do it so that the customer has to approach a member of staff to enquire about the car.

masterwriter

T J Hooker wrote: »

Its not illegal

Are you sure? Consumer people told me it is illegal, that everything should be priced.

T J Hooker

I'm in car sales, its up to the garage to price or not price their cars.

masterwriter

T J Hooker wrote: »

I'm in car sales, its up to the garage to price or not price their cars.

Does this not apply to cars?

T J Hooker

masterwriter wrote: »

Does this not apply to cars?

You would think so but you will find that the dealers that dont have the prices displayed in the window of the car will have a price list for customers to read through. So technically the price is available for the customer to see. Its a loop hole thats all.

kluivert

1. Know your product. I am amazed by the number of sales people who do not know anything about the products they are selling and I mean technical information.

For Example:

GF bought a 1.7 CDTI Astra two weeks ago, she wanted the 100bhp version, the salesman wasnt able to tell the difference between the 80 and 100 bhp, I had to go and find out the engine codes for myself.

Information like mpg, 0-60, serivce internals etc is important.

Also know the ins and outs of every model and trim you sell. I catch so many sales people with this and I just want to say hey give me the price list and Ill look around myself, your useless in providing information.

I hate sales people who tell me its a nice colour which I get alot. Its a nice colour to the person who is buying it not the person who is selling it.

2. When someone is spending that amount of money with you, which will probably the second largest purchase a person makes in their life time, at least say thank you for you custom.

3. After a sale, make sure to give the customer a rign about a week or two after the sale to make sure they are happy with the car and everything is to their satisfaction. It only takes five mins at most.

4. I dont like to be pouched on by sales people. When I go to a show room I know what I want. Introduce yourself to me, enquire if I am looking for new or second, if new inform me that you have models available for a test drive, if second hand, give me a copy of the stock list and a pen, let me pick out the cars I am interested in and tell me where I can find you when I need to get more information.

5. As an accountant I am very much aware of the Mark Up on new cars and even on second hand cars. Dont do the following which happened last month which really pissed me off;

Skoda Octavia 07 1.9 TDI 21k CASH Price.

Skoda Octavia 07 1.9 TDI 23k TRADE In price
Trade in value Opel Astra 6.5k

What you are doing here is giving a trade in value of 4.5k, I dont like this practice and only for the GF was with me I would have given the Sales man a bollocking.

6. Fill the car with fuel, every dealer I went to in the last two months looking for GF's car, there was barely any fuel in the tank which annoys me for two reasons.
1 - You cant bring the car on a proper test drive that should last at least ten mins.
2 - Its not good on a car to run the tank so low, this is highlighted in every manufacturers manual, and if a diesel runs dry the system has to be bleed.
I understand why you guys run tanks low but for geniune buyers its annoying.

7. Repair scratches and dents before selling a used car on the forecourt, because as a dealer I will expect you to repair if before I take possession. I mean very bad scratches and dents greater than the size of a 2 euro coin.

8. Dont talk crap which alot of sales people do. Firstly find out what the customer if after, secondly give the facts, thirdly, then pursaude.

Good luck, this is only my two cents on the sales process.

masterwriter

T J Hooker wrote: »

You would think so but you will find that the dealers that dont have the prices displayed in the window of the car will have a price list for customers to read through.

So do the supermarkets at some level habe a price list

So technically the price is available for the customer to see. Its a loop hole thats all.

That is also true in the supermarket. The customer can scan the goods. the point is that the price must be visible for the customer top make comparisions. My money says this practice of not having car price in window of car is illegal. I am checking again with consumewr folk asking the answer be in writing

peasant

When I come looking for a second hand car, willing to spend only 5 or 6 k ...it's still money. My money, that I had to work for.

The money doesn't stink and I'm not a leper ...please don't treat me as such.

quattro777

Returning phonecalls. Called in person to 2 Audi dealers in January about an A6, neither got back to me.

port

IMHO...best price up front earns sales,repeat business,referrals and respect.

masterwriter

T J Hooker wrote: »

Its not illegal, and they do it so that the customer has to approach a member of staff to enquire about the car.

It is illegal. Just checked with consumer people. All cars whether new or second hand on the forecourt or in the showroom should have individual price. They can be fined on the spot or subject to prosecution

PauloMN

AudiChris wrote: »

Thanks, I'm finding it to be a VERY worthwhile exercise.
Thank you all for your help!




I don't think this is dealer (or even industry) specific. There's nothing I hate more than being sold something I don't want.
If you don't have what I want, feel free to offer alternatives, but demonstrate that you understood the requirements in the first place.

I don't think I'm guilty of this, I hope not...

Follow up question: The "proper way to sell a car" says to start off by sitting the customer down and getting their requirements (qualification) before showing them a car. That would stop this kind of thing from happening.
If you walk into a showroom and say "Can you show me the A4 you have parked outside?" and I reply "yes, of course. Come have a seat with me first while I get some information", does it feel natural/pressured/unnecessary? How would you prefer me to handle this situation - bear in mind that if I just bring you out straight away that I've taken no time to assess your requirements and if I sit you down straight away I've basically said "no, you can't see that car 'till you've jumped through these hoops"...

If I walk into the showroom and ask you to show me the A4 parked outside though, you would know my general requirements as it's a specific car (year/model/spec etc.). I don't like sitting down at desks in showrooms when I'm just looking TBH. I do like sitting down when I'm actually buying something big (except in PC World where they want to sell you even more stuff when you sit down i.e. insurance!!!).

Instead of asking to see a specific car (I didn't see any suitable cars on the forecourt), I asked the sales guy if he had any '02/'03 vintage A4s. Pretty specific. That's all he needs to know at that point. If the roles were reversed, I'd immediately have guessed "this guy wants a 4/5 year old A4, he's got approx €18k to €22k to spend give or take. He's specific about the year (means he's done some homework) so I doubt he'll want a new car for €42k". Further information can be got by having a chat while looking at the car (but not driving **). No need for sitting down at desks like an interview, and definitely no need to finance people to be around.

** Leads me to a real pet hate - car sales people talking continuously while you are driving a car, especially a 2nd hand one where you are trying to listen out for every sound and also getting used to a different clutch, steering, brake etc.. :mad:

-Chris-

PauloMN wrote: »

** Leads me to a real pet hate - car sales people talking continuously while you are driving a car, especially a 2nd hand one where you are trying to listen out for every sound and also getting used to a different clutch, steering, brake etc.. :mad:

The perfect test-drive involves two stages
1) Salesperson drives the car for a short distance (this is to show that the car can be driven smoothly. It's also to give them a chance to explain or point out anything they feel relevant).
2) Salesperson and customer change seats to let the customer drive (during this section, salesperson - STFU! Only reply to direct questions, otherwise say nothing).

Anyone who's talking while you're driving should know better.

peasant

AudiChris wrote: »

The perfect test-drive involves two stages
1) Salesperson drives the car for a short distance (this is to show that the car can be driven smoothly. It's also to give them a chance to explain or point out anything they feel relevant).
....

ahh, stop the condescending ...

I don't want demonstrations or explanations. One point of the testdrive is to hop into the car "cold" and immediatedly notice what's missing, hard to find, in the wrong place, awkward, (or brilliant, clever, comfy) etc ...

It BeeMee

AudiChris wrote: »

Follow-up question: If you walk into a showroom and all the salespeople are busy with someone, would you take it upon yourself to take a seat/grab a magazine and wait to be looked after, or would some form of "greeter" be of any comfort to you - someone to say you'll be looked after next and who can get you brochures etc.?

I think a little acknowledgement that you've seen the person, and someone will be along shortly to help is important. Personally I think it's a great opportunity to poke around the showroom models (even the ones I'm not interested in) without someone prattling sales-talk in my ear the whole time.
So I think there must be a happy medium between being completely ignored, and exploration time....

AudiChris wrote: »

Follow-up question: you bought your car from x garage. Do you go to x first before shopping around, or do you shop the other dealers first so you have ammo/information when you get to x? Is there any inclination there to deal with the same person as last time?

I go to other dealers first, so at least I know in my own head what the deal I'm being offered is like - provided of course, any queries, issues etc in-between have been satisfactorily dealt with
(and that I haven't discovered in the meantime that that dealer screwed me the last time )

Question back to you, AudiChris :
I pull into your dealership with a car of the same marque BUT with livery (numberplate surrounds, sticker in back window, insurance disk holder or whatever) from another dealer for the same marque.
Does this effect how you will treat negotiate with me?
Will you push harder to do a deal to "steal" me away from your rival?
Or will you just assume that I'll go back to my own guy anyway?
(bearing in mind I may have had bad experiences since buying the car)

AudiChris wrote: »

I have this image in my head of my customers - they're successful middle-management or company directors, they're spending €35,000+ on a new car. They take nice holidays and stay in good hotels. They have nice clothes and are well respected in the companies they work for.
If they get a certain level of service from the Hilton/Radisson, would they not expect to get the same service and comfort from their motor-dealer?
Am I wrong? Is it just about the deal?

It's all about the deal!!!!
If I'm comparing two dealers that are €500 apart, will I give business to the more expensive one cos they had nice coffee?

ninty9er

You're at an upper end of the market, so don't be afraid to say (as was said to me at a BMW dealers) when looking at a trade-in : "we wouldn't retail anything that old/that make, so I won't be able to give you as much as an abc dealer". You're being honest and they'll know by looking at the forecourt that you're not bluffing

In the particular case I'd seen a 00 5 Series on their website, which was there to his bemusement when the salesman checked. He told me when I first enquired that "We don't retail anything more than 3 years old" which was bordering on riduculous, but there is a tolerable level of such cherrypicking.

AS regards haggling space. On something like an A5, I'd leave €6-€7k once all the extras like leather and such are added (including trade in margin). The same BMW dealer mentioned abover climbed down this much on a 325 Coupe with a hammered old Picnic as a trade in last year...on your standard A4, move less on price, but throw a few more goodies at them and be willing to move about €1500 on price.

If I was spending €7-€8k on a car I'd expect to get €500 off.

Will you be buying today??
No. No. No. No. No. No. No. Do NOT ask this question. Are you in a hurry to buy? is much less confrontational

First of all ask what kind of car they're after,
-if it's secondhand say (if it's the case) that you have a number in stock, but if they don't suit, you'll call if you get another one in if they can wait.
-If they're after a new one, ask if they're interested in the demos or would they like to order from the factory, that way you get an idea of when your time will pay off.

Someone who's not buying til' 09 is still valuable as there may be very little market for new Audi's in 09 and if you can get the order now, it's a step towards next years target.

Have baby booster seats for people with kids coming along, ask for the kids opinion (apparently kids now control 45% of large household financial decisions via pesterpower), because if the parents see you paying attention to the kids, you're probably the type of guy they can identify with and want to do business with...and especially with people who have kids...be the 1% of the industry who can explain what ISOFIX is in plain English.

Be able to explain the difference between the engine power of the 2.0 TDI 120, 143, 170....again product knowledge, but know how to sell the 170 for the sake of us who'll be buying secondhand in a few years

I know of a particular VAG dealer where the sales treatment is that the kids are to be ignored and the wife is only here to pick the colour, so we don't need to talk to them....I passed a couple who experienced that when looking at a Polo on to a salesman in the garage I was working in who sold a Fiat Punto after I'd taken them for a test drive and had a good chat. They bought there and then and collected it 3 days later.

Bottom line. Money's important, but what makes the deal is the human touch.

Edit:
And no, the salesman never needs to drive the car in the course of an ordinary test drive

Biro

ninty9er wrote: »

Will you be buying today??
No. No. No. No. No. No. No. Do NOT ask this question. Are you in a hurry to buy? is much less confrontational

Be able to explain the difference between the engine power of the 2.0 TDI 120, 143, 170....again product knowledge, but know how to sell the 170 for the sake of us who'll be buying secondhand in a few years

I'd agree with those points, they're important.

ninty9er wrote: »

Edit:
And no, the salesman never needs to drive the car in the course of an ordinary test drive

I agree with this too, I'm baffled at that statement. If I asked for a test drive (which I hate having to do, I should be offered one - makes me feel like a beggar if I have to ask), and the salesman started heading for the drivers seat, I'd nearly ask him what he was at.

-Chris-

peasant wrote: »

ahh, stop the condescending ...

I don't want demonstrations or explanations.

When I say "perfect test-drive", I'm referring to the way all the sales training literature tells you how to do it. They identify the two stages above. Not my idea, I'm just passing the info.

peasant wrote: »

One point of the testdrive is to hop into the car "cold" and immediatedly notice what's missing, hard to find, in the wrong place, awkward, (or brilliant, clever, comfy) etc ...

As a salesperson, you don't want the customer to ever jump into the car "cold". You should have identified all the features the customer feels are important and demonstrated them during the static presentation. The test-drive is to move the car from showing "shown" to something "experienced".