Joint Support Forumlas

Hanley

So who's used em, did they work and what's the best one going??

I'm currently looking at Animal Flex as being my number one choice.

EileenG

Can't recommend anything specific, but a couple of weeks ago, I ran out of fish oil and didn't bother getting more, and now I'm finding that my knees are gone to hell. Just walking downstairs hurts, and the thought of squats is making me wince.

I bought a bucketload of fish oil today, should be interesting to see if there's an improvement.

crotalus667

Hanley wrote: »

I'm currently looking at Animal Flex as being my number one choice.

I have to say flex works very well , I started taking it when I noticed some thing was up with my knees , after a few days they where fine , I stoped taking it for a while (I just forgot to take it for a few weeks) and noticed the truble again as soon as I started taking it agan I was sorted , the only thing I will say to you is that you schould take it just befor you eat otherwise you will be tasting them untill your next meal :rolleyes:

EileenG

Could I take Animal Flex as well as fish oil? I'm going skiing in 10 days, and would really like functioning knees.

Hanley

crotalus667 wrote: »

I have to say flex works very well , I started taking it when I noticed some thing was up with my knees , after a few days they where fine , I stoped taking it for a while (I just forgot to take it for a few weeks) and noticed the truble again as soon as I started taking it agan I was sorted , the only thing I will say to you is that you schould take it just befor you eat otherwise you will be tasting them untill your next meal :rolleyes:

Very good, thanks man.

spiral

James

Fish oil/cod liver oil is the way to go and Glucosamine/chronodritin/msm . Fish oil you can get anywhere , seven seas is good , Holland and barrett is good . I take 6-9 a day 2-3 with each meal. Glucosamine/chronoditin there are a lot of different products out there. I 've read you should aim for 1500 mg each a day but in my experience it takes 2-3 weeks to kick in. Just to let you know animal flex has good doses of gluc/chron but consists of 6 tablets and tastes manky.

Hanley

spiral wrote: »

James

Fish oil/cod liver oil is the way to go and Glucosamine/chronodritin/msm . Fish oil you can get anywhere , seven seas is good , Holland and barrett is good . I take 6-9 a day 2-3 with each meal. Glucosamine/chronoditin there are a lot of different products out there. I 've read you should aim for 1500 mg each a day but in my experience it takes 2-3 weeks to kick in. Just to let you know animal flex has good doses of gluc/chron but consists of 6 tablets and tastes manky.

You've used it and didn't like it so?? It seems quite expensive for what it is like.

So ya think something like 9 fish oil caps and some glucosamine/chronodritin/msm as well? How much??

spiral

yeah I thought it worked ok just tasted bad and 6 big tablets was to much. You should be able to get something in a chemist or holland and barrett / natures way that has 1500 mg of glucosamine/chrondritin in 2/3 tablets . It was pricey as well.AS for price fish oil is cheap as cheaps and €20 max for the glucosamine etc cheaper maybe if you order online

crotalus667

spiral wrote: »

and 6 big tablets was to much.

some people say that but I find them easy to neck in one (it's 8 not 6)

spiral wrote: »

You should be able to get something in a chemist or holland and barrett / natures way that has 1500 mg of glucosamine/chrondritin in 2/3 tablets

Animal Flex Supplement Facts
Serving Size 1 Pack
Serving Per Container 44
Amount Per Serving
Calories 9
Calories From Fat 9
Total Fat 1g <2%
Vitamin C (as ascorbic acid) 100mg
Vitamin E (as d-alpha tocopherol) 100mg
Zinc (as zinc picolinate) 15mg
Selenium (as sodium selenite) 70mcg
Manganese (as manganese sulfate) 1mg
Joint Construction Complex 3000mg
Glucosamine (as HCl, sulfate KCl), Methylsulfonylmethane (MSM),
Chondroitin Sulfate A (CSA), Chondroitin Sulfate B (CSB)
Joint Lubrication Complex 1000mg
Flaxseed Oil (50% alpha linolenic acid)
Cetyl Myristoleate Proprietary Blend
(Cetyl Myristoleate, Cetyl Myristate, Cetyl Palmitate, Cetyl Laurate,
Cetyl Palmitoleate, Cetyl Oleate), Hyaluronic Acid
Joint Support Complex 1000mg
Ginger Root Extract (gingerols, shogaols), Turmeric Extract (curcumin),
Boswellia (boswellic acid), Quercetin, Bromelain

Animal Flex Other Ingredients:
Shark cartilage, carob, gelatin, glycerine, soybean oil, purified water, magnesium stearate, stearic acid.
Contains shellfish.

spiral wrote: »

. It was pricey as well.AS for price fish oil is cheap as cheaps and €20 max for the glucosamine etc cheaper maybe if you order online

It's about 40 euros for 44 days , I dont think it's that pricey , but I do think bloody handy just open the tub and pull out a baggie

Jimmy Bottlehead

Boots stock 1000mg cod liver oil tabs, the auld fella took them (at my behest!) and said they did a good job on loosening up a shoulder joint that was giving him some bother. I think Seven Seas would do a (somewhat more expensive, but no more than €12 or so) similar product. I found regular amounts of cod liver oil did me good anyways!

Hanley

Just gonna bump this because natures way have a sale on. How much fish oil per day is a good starting point does anyone know? I was thinking of just getting the 1000mg ones and throwing back 3 of them 3x a day.

Latchy

I use to take and recomend cod liver oil for lubritcating the joints but i noticed on taking a course it was making my hair go grey (seriously ) .

Have never being able figure out why .

siochain

I have been using Cissus for about 3 weeks and after 2 weeks the difference its made to my knee is unreal. While I got it for my knee the other niggly injuries have cleared up.

I ordered mine off bulkpowders.co.uk (USPlabs Cissus Quadrangularis 11%). Highly recommend it.

Disclaimer with regard to new posting rules. Please ensure you have the right medical treatment first, this is not a cure all.

siochain

latchyco wrote: »

I use to take and recomend cod liver oil for lubritcating the joints but i noticed on taking a course it was making my hair go grey (seriously ) .

Have never being able figure out why .

Thats a good one, does the same happen on other fish oils? I generally stay away from cod liver oil due to the high vit D content.

Latchy

siochain wrote: »

Thats a good one, does the same happen on other fish oils? I generally stay away from cod liver oil due to the high vit D content.

Yeah , i was thinking the vit D or E content might have somthing to do with it and the funny thing is i am going greyish naturally now ,so i suppose it dont really matter now .Not sure about other fish oil products although have tried some only of late .

HammerHeadGym

I like to go for Udo's choice for the oil and some glucosamine and chondroitin tabs or caps. While we all have our supplement boxes out, what does anyone take for strengthening tendons?

Latchy

Cod liver oil cuts arthritis pain without the side-effects of painkillers

By FIONA MACRAE - More by this author »from todays daily mail

Last updated at 01:11am on 25th March 2008

Cod liver oil: Reduces pain from arthritis
Two teaspoons of cod liver oil a day can cut the number of powerful painkillers needed to ease the pain of arthritis.

Researchers said many patients given the supplements were able to reduce their daily dose of anti-inflammatory drugs - some by more than 30 per cent.

The findings are a further indication that the fish oil is a cheap and natural way of helping sufferers of rheumatoid arthritis, one of the most common forms of the condition.

The ibuprofen and other non-steroidal anti-inflammatory drugs (NSAIDs) prescribed to millions of patients each year have been linked to a range of side-effects.

Long-term use of high doses to quell the pain and swelling of inflamed joints can double the threat of heart attack and raise the risk of strokes and heart disease.

Aisla Bosworth, of the National Rheumatoid Arthritis Society, said: "Sufferers still rely heavily on anti-inflammatories, even though their safety is under scrutiny.

"It's in this context that this new research provides some promising new evidence that cod liver oil may reduce the need for anti-inflammatories."

The researchers from Dundee University and the city's Ninewells Hospital tracked the health of almost 100 rheumatoid arthritis patients taking NSAIDs.

Half were given 10g of cod liver oil - the equivalent of two teaspoons - to take alongside their daily dose of painkillers while half were given dummy capsules.

After three months, the volunteers were asked to try to gradually reduce their reliance on NSAIDs.

Nine months into the study, 39 per cent of those in the cod liver oil group had cut their daily dose of the painkillers by more than 30 per cent.

Just 10 per cent of those in the other group achieved the same result.

Crucially, those who cut their intake of painkillers did not find their symptoms worsened as a result, reported the journal Rheumatology.

Researcher Professor Jill Belch said: "This study offers hope to many patients for whom cod liver oil can offer a natural pain treatment without the harmful side-effects associated with anti-inflammatory drugs.

"It reinforces previous research that has shown cod liver oil, and its high contact of omega-3 essential fatty acids, to have significant anti-inflammatory properties in patients with rheumatoid arthritis."

The researchers added their finding was important at a time "when there are increasing concerns about adverse events associated with NSAID use".

They said: "One study reported regular NSAID use in over 70 per cent of the rheumatoid arthritis patients studied."

Previous research has shown the benefits of fish oils in staving off heart disease, cancer, depression and Alzheimer's disease in the elderly.

Dragan

Hanley wrote: »

I'm currently looking at Animal Flex as being my number one choice.

I had **** results with this.

Nutriplex Joint Support gave me great results. You should be able to get it in Health Matters.

timetogetfit

I have used maximuscles achefree and it did nothing for me but then I used a product called proflex 750 by AST and it was amazing, this product works big time.The best joint support product by far it got me back doing squats

Frank Bullitt

Fish oil is the way to go i think man, that or this other stuff called cissius RX I believe,friend of mine swears by it.

Beelzebub

timetogetfit wrote: »

I have used maximuscles achefree and it did nothing for me but then I used a product called proflex 750 by AST and it was amazing, this product works big time.The best joint support product by far it got me back doing squats

Unfortunately that product has been discontinued.

It contained Grape Seed Extract(50mg) in addition to the Glucosamine Sulfate(450mg) and the Chondroitin Sulfate(250mg).

More information on Grape Seed Extract:

From Wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grape_seed_extract

NOTE WELL: The Precautions and the Side effects. Especially women who are pregnant or breast-feeding.
Disclaimer: I do not recommend the use of any supplement.
Check with your physician before embarking on any course of supplementation.

siochain

Gintonious wrote: »

this other stuff called cissius RX I believe,friend of mine swears by it.

Thats what I'm talking about above, can't be bet, been on the fish oil, Glucosamine & Chondroitin for years but when I started with cissus the joints have never been better and belive me my joints have taken a lot of physical stress over the years.

siochain

some info on ..


CISSUS RX: Promotes Speed Healing

THE SCIENCE
Cissus quadrangularis is an ancient medicinal plant native to the hotter parts of Ceylon and India. It was prescribed in the ancient Ayurvedic texts as a general tonic and analgesic, with specific bone fracture healing properties. Modern research has shed light on Cissus' ability to speed bone healing by showing it acts as a glucocorticoid antagonist (1,2). Since anabolic/androgenic compounds are well known to act as antagonists to the glucocorticoid receptor as well as promote bone growth and fracture healing, it has been postulated that Cissus possesses anabolic and/or androgenic properties (1,3). In addition to speeding the remodeling process of the healing bone, Cissus also leads to a much faster increase in bone tensile strength. In clinical trials Cissus has led to a fracture healing time on the order of 55 to 33 percent of that of controls. That cissus exerts antiglucocorticoid properties is suggested by a number of studies where bones were weakened by treatment with cortisol, and upon administration of Cissus extract the cortisol induced weakening was halted, and the healing process begun.

While the increased rate of bone healing may be of great significance to persons suffering from chronic diseases like osteoporosis (4), the antiglucocorticoid properties of Cissus are likely of much more interest to the average bodybuilder or athlete, since endogenous glucocorticoids, particularly cortisol, are not only catabolic to bone, but catabolize muscle tissue as well. Numerous studies over the years have suggested that glucorticoids, including the body's endogenous hormone cortisol activate pathways that degrade not only bone, but skeletal muscle tissue as well. A recently published report documented exactly how glucocorticoids (including cortisol) induce muscle breakdown: They activate the so-called ubiquitin-proteasome pathway of proteolysis (5). This pathway of tissue breakdown is important for removing damaged and non-functional proteins. However, when it is overactive during periods of elevated cortisol (e.g disease states, stress, and over-training) excess amounts of normal tissue are broken down as well. By exerting an anabolic, antiglucorticoid effect cissus helps preserve muscle tissue during times of physical and emotional stress.

Although the bulk of the research on Cissus centers around bone healing, the possibility exists that Cissus may act to improve bone healing it may improve the healing rate of connective tissue in general, including tendons. If this is the case it would be of great benefit to bodybuilders and athletes.

Besides the above-mentioned properties of Cissus, the plant is also rich in the vitamins/antioxidants vitamin C and beta-carotene. As analyzed, Cissus quadrangularis contained ascorbic acid 479 mg, and carotene 267 units per 100g of freshly prepared paste in addition to calcium oxalate (6).

The typical recommended daily dosage of Cissus is 3 to 6 grams to accelerate fracture healing. Safety studies in rats showed no toxic effects at dosages as high as 2000 mg/kg of body weight. So not only is Cissus efficacious, it is also quite safe, in either the dried powder form or the commercially available extract.

Cissus also possess analgesic properties on a mg per mg basis comparable to aspirin or anti-inflammatory drugs like ibuprofen. Cissus quadrangularis, which has been proved to be highly effective in relieving pain, reduction of swelling and promoting the process of healing of the simple fractures as well as in curing the allied disorders associated with fractures (7). The mechanism through which Cissus exerts its analgesic and anti-inflammatory properties has not been well characterized. It may act centrally, but the anti-inflammatory features suggest that it acts by preventing the conversion of arachidonic acid to inflammatory prostaglandins. Real World Application for injuries.

Simply if you're suffering from joint pain, ligament pain, cartilage pain, had surgery on bone, ligament or cartilage, Cissus is the supplement to use. It has been my experience that many grapplers take anti-inflammatory medications to fight through the pain. Ultimately, these medications only kill the sensation of pain not the symptom. Cissus has the ability to kill the pain specific to the injury while promoting healing.

Some users will get instant relief and other will need to use Cissus for much longer period of time for complete healing of an injury. Leverage performance science is not claiming that Cissus will work 100% percent of the time that would be a foolish claim. We have estimated that 85% of user experience relief from our product. This number may lower or rise as more consumers send in reports. In the PHARMACEUTICAL industry a 50% success rate is good. Since we talking about the Pharmaceutical industry, they have yet to produce a product that helps the healing process. They just develop pain medications that are often addicting.

THE OTHER SIDE EFFECT IS ANABOLIC!
Cissus is anabolic and anti-catabolic!!! Cissus users report a "PUMP" that we call the Cissus pump. The PUMP effect becomes prevalent at approximately 10-15 days of continuos Cissus use. The "PUMP" is due to the increase of blood flow to the muscle. The Cissus pump will have you flexing your muscle for no apparent reason. This is when you know the product has exerted its effect.

Cissus is a powerful natural anabolic; if not the one of most powerful natural anabolic on the market. Do you need it? An Anabolic and anti-catabolic substance allows for faster recovery from exercise, from injury, increase in muscle strength, and stamina. In short, you will be able to train longer and recover faster without the negative effects of anabolic steroids.

Cissus is also an ideal product to use in conjunction with cAMPED for dropping weight. Imagine decreasing bodyfat while simultaneously retaining your strength and preserving muscle mass while on a calorie restricted diet! The combined effects of Cissus and camped become a powerful tool for any competitive grappler!


WARNING
If using Cissus to heal injury related pain, you may experience instant relief due to its analgesic (pain killing) effect . This does not mean the injury has completely healed! Please continue your training regimen with extra caution until full recovery has been achieved. On the contrary, if using Cissus primarily for its Anabolic properties your training program should be continued with maximum intensity to reap the full benefits of this product.

References
1) Chopra SS, Patel MR, Awadhiya RP. Studies of Cissus quadrangularis in experimental fracture repair : a histopathological study Indian J Med Res. 1976 Sep;64(9):1365-8

2) Chopra SS, Patel MR, Gupta LP, Datta IC. Studies on Cissus quadrangularis in experimental fracture repair: effect on chemical parameters in blood Indian J Med Res. 1975 Jun;63(6):824-8.

3) PRASAD GC, UDUPA KN. EFFECT OF CISSUS QUADRANGULARIS ON THE HEALING OF CORTISONE TREATED FRACTURES. Indian J Med Res. 1963 Jul;51:667-76.

4) Shirwaikar A, Khan S, Malini S. Antiosteoporotic effect of ethanol extract of Cissus quadrangularis Linn. on ovariectomized rat. J Ethnopharmacol. 2003 Dec;89(2-3):245-50.

5) Combaret L, Taillandier D, Dardevet D, Bechet D, Ralliere C, Claustre A, Grizard J, Attaix D Glucocorticoids regulate mRNA levels for subunits of the 19 S regulatory complex of the 26 S proteasome in fast-twitch skeletal muscles. Biochem J. 2004 Feb 15;378(Pt 1):239-46.

6) Chidambara Murthy KN, Vanitha A, Mahadeva Swamy M, Ravishankar GA. Antioxidant and antimicrobial activity of Cissus quadrangularis L. J Med Food. 2003 Summer;6(2):99-105.

7) Panda, J Res Ayurv Siddha, 1990, 11, 7rences

token56

Reading about cissus it looks fairly good,

Would anyone here who has used it recommend it as a supplement? How hard is it to get? Cant imagine many pharmacies etc would have it.

siochain

its no silver bullet,

but I can say it helped me recover from a knee cartilage op and cleared you several wear and tear issues I'd had from years of rugby, kickboxing and general gym abuse.

COH

Started taking Animal Flex there about 6 weeks ago, personally I've found it to be pretty damn good

EileenG

token56 wrote: »

Reading about cissus it looks fairly good,

Would anyone here who has used it recommend it as a supplement? How hard is it to get? Cant imagine many pharmacies etc would have it.

I have chronic knee problems, and I find it good. I get mine in Fighting Fit in Aungier Street, but you can get it mail order in MyProtein.co.uk.

siochain

Hey EileenG, if you still have the bottle from Fighting Fit would ya mind letting me how the brand, % ketosterone and price.
Cheers

EileenG

www.myprotein.co.uk/products/mega_cissus

This one. I paid €24.99 for it in Fighting Fit.

siochain

aaagh right so its the exact same product,

do the stock other myprotein product rage?

EileenG

I think they have a few, but that was the one I was interested in. Give them a ring and ask?

BigBraveBear

siochain wrote: »

I have been using Cissus for about 3 weeks and after 2 weeks the difference its made to my knee is unreal. While I got it for my knee the other niggly injuries have cleared up.

I ordered mine off bulkpowders.co.uk (USPlabs Cissus Quadrangularis 11%). Highly recommend it.

Disclaimer with regard to new posting rules. Please ensure you have the right medical treatment first, this is not a cure all.

Do myprotien.co.uk deliver to addresses anywhere in Ireland, like the middle of nowhere, if you just make a small order. also do you have to sign for the package when delivered as it says on their website?

siochain

BigBraveBear wrote: »

Do myprotien.co.uk deliver to addresses anywhere in Ireland, like the middle of nowhere, if you just make a small order. also do you have to sign for the package when delivered as it says on their website?

no worries, have been using them for a feew years now, would be interested to see if the range can be bought cheaper in the shop in town.

Guya

Lyprinol Green Lipped Mussel Extract, Veridian Joint Complex (Glucosamine & bozwelia being the important ingredients) + a decent MSM supplement mean that I have no issues at all with my joints anymore.

Quite pricey but you get what you pay for.

I also take fish oil but for the omega oils effect on the brain rather than body. It makes a difference to joints but not a huge one.

I also recommend barefoot running. Strengthens the lig/tend/musc groups in a more comprehensive way. Less impact on joints because the heel strike is eliminated. It even improved my back! It can take a week or two to get used to. You're calf muscles will feel it the most.

aca101

just wondering where you guys get your cissus? do ye know if any of the irish supp sites sell it online?

TommyKnocker

aca101 wrote: »

just wondering where you guys get your cissus? do ye know if any of the irish supp sites sell it online?

As EileenG posted, you can buy it over the counter in Fighting Fit in Camden St.


Best Regards,

M