Whats a good reliable car

Slimbo

Hi All,

Looking for some good advice as to what the most durable cars are.

I drive all over Ireland and would ideally like a big car(2ltr), with comfort but that can handle being on the road 8/10 hours a day.

I hsve a VW Passat but they are very soft.

Any suggestions.

Slimbo

Biro

Honda Accord. I've seen people try hard and fail to break them.

Barr

With that kind of milage , Japanese is the way to go ..an Avensis or Primera would be the way to go

muletide

Mazda 6 ftw

bren2002

Focus is a cracker

Guy:Incognito

Biro wrote: »

Honda Accord. I've seen people try hard and fail to break them.

I broke 2. Well when I say "I" , I mean they broke themselves while I had them. Engine dieing type problems. Although one was a Rover 620 so maybe it sensed the badges and self destructed.

The Real B-man

muletide wrote: »

Mazda 6 ftw

Yeah its a cracking car

bazz26

If you can afford to pay the extra tax and fuel then something like a Toyota Camry 2.4 litre would be a good choice. They are very comfortable cars, ultra reliable and great for long hauls. They can be had for silly money these days, so the savings you make on the purchase price can be put towards the extra tax and fuel costs.

Depending on your budget:
http://www.carzone.ie/used-cars/Toyota/Camry/2.4-WT/757842/
http://www.carzone.ie/used-cars/Toyota/Camry/2.4-VVTi/757750/

These cars cost over €35k when new.

Others:
Nissan Maxima QX:- http://www.carzone.ie/used-cars/Nissan/Maxima-QX/SE-FULL/812532/

unkel

New / second hand? Budget? Without these any advice is pointless imho

The one thing that one could say is that if you're in the car 8-10 hours a day, chances are you do a high mileage. You'll need a diesel so!

GERMAN ROCKS

for big milage id go something french for the comfort
1st peugeot 407
2nd citroen c5 (the new one is a stunner)
there disel engines are bullet proof:)

Biro

Stekelly wrote: »

I broke 2. Well when I say "I" , I mean they broke themselves while I had them. Engine dieing type problems. Although one was a Rover 620 so maybe it sensed the badges and self destructed.

That was probably it!
To be fair, I don't know of any car that someone never had a problem with somewhere! I've just heard of less Honda problems than any other car make. Mazda and Toyota probably joint second. Take your pick really!
The main problems these days is electrical rather than anything serious in the mechanical front, so I suppose in a way, all cars are good to a point!

coolbeans

Mazda6 is a great option if you consider the Passat too soft. The real driver's car in the class. Turbodiesel is a cracker and like all Japanese built Mazdas ultra reliable. Must say the 2.2CTDI Accord is a beautiful car but they cost a good deal more than the 6 and are about to be replaced....Mondeo???...I think they look dull as ditchwater.
Avensis; ditto, primera; ditto.

staker

i know the japs are very good reliably but if youre looking for a bit of comfort with bulletproof build would you consider an e220 merc, 98/99/00.. theyre a tank of a machine and go forever just to find a non ex taxi! that's my penny's worth

maidhc

bazz26 wrote: »

If you can afford to pay the extra tax and fuel then something like a Toyota Camry 2.4 litre would be a good choice. They are very comfortable cars, ultra reliable and great for long hauls. They can be had for silly money these days, so the savings you make on the purchase price can be put towards the extra tax and fuel costs.

Great idea. So long as you don't mind being mistaken for the special branch all the time though!

colm_mcm

GERMAN ROCKS wrote: »

for big milage id go something french for the comfort
1st peugeot 407
2nd citroen c5 (the new one is a stunner)
there disel engines are bullet proof:)

Did you read the original post at all :eek:

I'd be looking at Honda Accord, Nissan Maxima, Toyota Camry, Mitsubishi Galant if you're looking for cars a few years old.

coolbeans

Hope you don't mind me pm'ing you but u seem to know your stuff. The father is gonna bring in a new euro spec hilux from the UK. He wants all the goodies even though it's for farm use so that'll mean leather etc. Reckon we can pick one up for E40k or thereabouts all taxes paid. Is the rear diff lock necessary as he'll do a lot of pulling heavy trailers in muddy fields. They're optopnal on the 3L models.

coolbeans

Bugger. thought i pm'ed colm. colm mcm that last question was for u. Apologies for asking a separate question on this thread.

coolbeans

Legacy is a beauty of a car too. Old model like this http://www.carzone.ie/used-cars/Subaru/Legacy/2.0-AWD/674239/ or this http://www.carzone.ie/used-cars/Subaru/Legacy/2.0-GL/916525/ or http://www.carzone.ie/used-cars/Subaru/Legacy/car/884767/. Colm mcm's options are good too.

JHMEG

What about a BMW?

groupb

I tried and failed to break two mondeos. Really durable machine.
Add in the fact that its been the best car in its class since 93' and its got to be considered.
There seem to be more old ones around than just about any other car which says a lot.

JHMEG

groupb wrote: »

Add in the fact that its been the best car in its class since 93' and its got to be considered.

According to who?

groupb

Most motoring journals. I've had a saab 900, an audiA4 , a passat, a primera and two mondeos and I can honestly say that the mondeos were leagues ahead of the others , especially where dynamics and relability were concerned.

maidhc

groupb wrote: »

Most motoring journals. I've had a saab 900, an audiA4 , a passat, a primera and two mondeos and I can honestly say that the mondeos were leagues ahead of the others , especially where dynamics and relability were concerned.

Have to agree. My 1995 mondeo is still a better car to drive than an 2007 passat.

JHMEG

groupb wrote: »

Most motoring journals.

You'll need to provide a source.

E92

The Mondeo has won the lions share of awards since it came out, it doesn't matter what car mag you look at, they all love it, Autocar even thinks the current one is better than a 3 series BMW!

The original also won the European car of the year in 1994 too.

I've gone in several Mondeos(not the Mk4 yet sadly), a treat for the passenger, and I'm led to believe, even more of a treat for the driver!

groupb

I've had both. The mondeo made its first unscheudled visit to a garage in my hands at 112,000miles to have a sensor replaced. The passat (a 07tdi) could'nt pass a garage without needing attention. As for handling , the passat did'nt.

groupb

JHMEG wrote: »

You'll need to provide a source.

Find me a journal that says the mondeo does'nt lead its class.

coolbeans

groupb wrote: »

Find me a journal that says the mondeo does'nt lead its class.

how does this help the OP?

Green Hornet

I'd go for the Accord. Bit on the pricey side and the model is changing in September but a real sturdy, comfortable car over long journeys.

JHMEG

groupb wrote: »

Find me a journal that says the mondeo does'nt lead its class.

4car prefers the Vectra.
Autozine prefers the Mazda 6.
Now back up your statement that the Mondeo is best car in it's class since '93.

maidhc

JHMEG wrote: »

4car prefers the Vectra.
Autozine prefers the Mazda 6.
Now back up your statement that the Mondeo is best car in it's class since '93.

Well the Mk1 mondeo was so far ahead of everything in 1993 it wasn't even funny (bar perhaps the Primera and 405) . It was competing with the Mk1 Vectra/Cavalier ffs and the Passat back then was hideous.

The Mk2 was a revised mk1, and was at least as good as the 406 and Mk1 Passat, it drove a lot better than the latter and was far less troublesome that both. The diesel mondeo was seriously dated by 2000 though.

The Mk3 came out in 2000, and again was lauded as being a fantastic car. Definately was a bit dull looking, but any group tests i ever read put it ahead. In fairness the Accord of the time was a good car, but then honda got notions and priced themselves out of the market.

The Mk4 is a superior car to anything else in the class, and in the class above it. This seems the consensus.

JHMEG

maidhc, I'm not saying that the Mondeo was never any good.

I'm saying that it wasn't the best in class for 15 years running, and also that groupb shouldn't be making such sweeping claims without providing any evidence.

IMHO, the Mondeo only got good in 2000, and obviously a whole lot better with the current model. Bear in mind the current model, like the 2000 model, is ahead of the competition in terms of lifecycle, and therefore comparing an 08MY Mondeo to a much older design Vectra isn't a proper comparison.

maidhc

JHMEG wrote: »

IMHO, the Mondeo only got good in 2000, and obviously a whole lot better with the current model. Bear in mind the current model, like the 2000 model, is ahead of the competition in terms of lifecycle, and therefore comparing an 08MY Mondeo to a much older design Vectra isn't a proper comparison.

No, the mondeo was always a fantastic car. In time it will probably be regarded as the turning point for ford in europe, you can pretty much neatly divide a timeline, whereby every car produced from the 80s to 1993 by ford was pretty questionable, and everything produced after has been able to rival the germans for quality and the japs for reliability.

You are of course correct about life cycles, but the 2000 Mondeo is still superior to the 2008 vectra! Of course which car is "the best" will always been subjective, but I think the point groupb has been making is the mondeo has generally been the benchmark in the C/D segment for many years now, and it is ultimately the model VW/Honda etc put in their powerpoint presentation when briefing their engineers!

Victor_M

JHMEG wrote: »

What about a BMW?

My Vote goes to Honda;)

groupb

I'm not saying that every single mondeo has beaten every other contender in every single test. Its just that generally speaking it has been top of its class ( according to Autocar & Car magazine ) since 93' . As I said in my own experience thats also been the case.I went from a 97' mondeo to a 02' A4 (not my choice) and the mondeo was a far superior car dynamically. Don't tell me that you honestly believe that a 97' vectra for instance was a superior car to a 97' mondeo. If you do have you ever driven a mondeo?
Back to the OP , if the mondeo does'nt do anything for you , the mazda 6 & the accord have good reputations also although i'm not sure what running costs are.
BTW I'd read that autozine article again if I was you.

JHMEG

groupb wrote:

Find me a journal that says the mondeo does'nt lead its class.

groupb wrote:

I'm not saying that every single mondeo has beaten every other contender in every single test.

I've driven auld Primeras and auld Mondeo (and auld Carinas, Cavaliers and Accords), and going on experience rather than magazines I'd put the auld Primera above the auld Mondeo, tho the memory has well faded by now. Not by a lot tho, as all those auld cars mentioned are very similar.

Victor_M wrote: »

My Vote goes to Honda;)

Not got a BMW to suggest?

unkel

maidhc wrote: »

No, the mondeo was always a fantastic car. In time it will probably be regarded as the turning point for ford in europe, you can pretty much neatly divide a timeline, whereby every car produced from the 80s to 1993 by ford was pretty questionable, and everything produced after has been able to rival the germans for quality and the japs for reliability

Interesting point. I've heard about the turning point theory starting with the arrival of the Focus in '97 but your theory makes more sense. The Mk 1 Mondeo was much better built and more reliable than anything Ford had come up with in a generation. Also Jaguar build quality was turned completely around by '95 or so wasn't it?

JHMEG wrote: »

I'd put the auld Primera above the auld Mondeo

In terms of being a decent drivers car, I agree. The Mondeo is better than average but the Primera is among the best of the segment. I owned a Primera for a few years. Unfortunately it was very unreliable

E92

The autozine article is if you read between the lines, is very much a qualified +1 for the Mazda. If your "priorities" are different to those that they judge cars on, then they say the Ford is the best.

If you read the car mags you'll find that the Mk3 Mondeo was easily outclassed by it's rivals towards the end of it's time(I actually thought Toyota bettered it back in 03 with the then new Avensis, for the passenger anyway, I imagine the Ford drives better but I don't know really).

JHMEG

E92 wrote: »

If you read the car mags you'll find that the Mk3 Mondeo was easily outclassed by it's rivals towards the end of it's time(I actually thought Toyota bettered it back in 03 with the then new Avensis, for the passenger anyway, the Toyota is the better car).

I haven't actually driven that model Mondeo, so I can't comment. I have the Avensis however, but I wouldn't see it as anything spectacular.

maidhc

unkel wrote: »

Interesting point. I've heard about the turning point theory starting with the arrival of the Focus in '97 but your theory makes more sense. The Mk 1 Mondeo was much better built and more reliable than anything Ford had come up with in a generation. Also Jaguar build quality was turned completely around by '95 or so wasn't it?

The Ka, 1.25 Fiesta, Puma, and (to a certain extent the 1996 facelift Escort) were all good cars by objective standards and predate the focus.

Before the mondeo we had such gems as the 1991 Escort and Scorpio! I think 1994 is the golden year as regards jaguar.

E92

maidhc wrote: »

Before the mondeo we had such gems as the 1991 Escort and Scorpio! I think 1994 is the golden year as regards jaguar.

We had the misfortune to have a MkV Escort for a few years. About the only good thing about it was it never went wrong(it was rubbish in any other measure, at least with didn't have the constant vibration and harshness engines though, instead we had the one with the Anglia derived engine, which featured a steering wheel, speedo, odometer, trip meter, gearbox, seats, doors, door locks, headlights, and windows as standard).

JHMEG

maidhc wrote: »

The Ka, 1.25 Fiesta, Puma, and (to a certain extent the 1996 facelift Escort)

OMG, I can't believe I've actually driven all these Fords you mention! But...

1.25 Feshty. I really don't get what people saw in these cars. Even tho the Corsa of the time handled like soap, it was a much nicer car imho. The Feshty was trying to be something it wasn't, with fake wood on the dash etc, and a driving position waayy too close to the windscreen. The Corsa knew its place in life.

I reckon the Ka was a crafty way for Ford to flog all the 1.3 Enduro engines they had left over after they fitted the more powerful, refined and economical 1.25 16v to the Fiesta. Still tho, body coloured metal work should not be inside the cabin, and the Ka is actually smaller than it looks (unlike the competition).

The Puma was a blast to drive, within reason. Apart from hitting my head off the A-pillar the car was pretty good. Lovely gearachange. It was the 1.6, and while quick wasn't fast. Could have done with a few more hp. But that would be my only complaint.

Escort experience is from a 1992, owned by my sister. If I had a quid for every time I saw that yoke on the back of a tow truck. And it failed its first NCT due to rust. And my sister had arms like Popeye from driving it. And.. it had that awful 1.3 Enduro engine..

unkel

JHMEG wrote: »

OMG, I can't believe I've actually driven all these Fords you mention! But...

1.25 Feshty. I really don't get what people saw in these cars

So you've driven it and you can not see the appeal? :eek:

It's nippy. It's fun to drive. Much more so than any supermini of it's generation. I drove a rental ghia back in '98 in the UK and I liked it. I had a very dim opinion of anything Ford based on my experience and this little car completely changed my view. A Ford that drove well?

JHMEG

unkel wrote: »

So you've driven it and you can not see the appeal? :eek:

It's nippy. It's fun to drive.

I owned a '95 1.3 Civic DX (complete with Keihin twin venturi down draught carb) at the time, and it blew the Feshty away. Ok it was platicky and felt like there was nothing to it, but its limits were sooo much higher...

Altho, a mate owned a '95 Golf CL at the same time. I can see the difference there. The Golf's handling reminded me of Emerald Star's finest.

moe_sizlak

unkel wrote: »

Interesting point. I've heard about the turning point theory starting with the arrival of the Focus in '97 but your theory makes more sense. The Mk 1 Mondeo was much better built and more reliable than anything Ford had come up with in a generation. Also Jaguar build quality was turned completely around by '95 or so wasn't it?



In terms of being a decent drivers car, I agree. The Mondeo is better than average but the Primera is among the best of the segment. I owned a Primera for a few years. Unfortunately it was very unreliable

the focus was not available to buy untill early 1999 , think it was launched in late 1998

Henry Ford III

Later Escorts were awful to be fair. Apart from Cosworth models.

If I had to spend 8 hours a day in a car, I'd want a big car, auto., diesel, with leather etc.

Merc. E270CDI?

groupb

E92 wrote: »

The autozine article is if you read between the lines, is very much a qualified +1 for the Mazda. If your "priorities" are different to those that they judge cars on, then they say the Ford is the best.

If you read the car mags you'll find that the Mk3 Mondeo was easily outclassed by it's rivals towards the end of it's time(I actually thought Toyota bettered it back in 03 with the then new Avensis, for the passenger anyway, I imagine the Ford drives better but I don't know really).

what car mags?

JHMEG

groupb wrote: »

what car mags?

Why does E92 have to provide sources and you don't?

groupb, I think it's fair to say the Mondeo hasn't been the best car in its class since 1993. There have been other cars in the last 15 years that have been better.

Biro

maidhc wrote: »

The Ka, 1.25 Fiesta, Puma, and (to a certain extent the 1996 facelift Escort) were all good cars by objective standards and predate the focus.

Before the mondeo we had such gems as the 1991 Escort and Scorpio! I think 1994 is the golden year as regards jaguar.

Ah come on! The Escort? That was a piece of muck. It was so bad, Ford had to work overtime and introduce independant rear suspension in the Focus to banish memories of the Escort! And they still were trying to get rid of Escort stock for 4 years after the Focus was introduced!

The Mk2 Mondeo wasn't much of a class leader really. Good chassis dynamics that followed from the first, but apart from that fairly harmless. The Mk 3, which used the Passat as it's bench mark, was an excellent car. That was until Mazda brought out the 6, which I can't think of one single way in which the Ford is better. My biggest problem with Fords is that I can't get comfortable in the drivers seat. I feel like I'm sitting on them rather than in them. No matter how good the chassis is, that hinders the driving experience a little. Therefore, the 6 is a nicer car to drive than the Mondeo.
Plus the last landmark Ford engine was probably in the Mk 2 Escort RS1800.

Biro

groupb wrote: »

what car mags?

Autocar and What Car both rated the B6 Passat ahead of the Mk 3 Mondeo, and actually the 407 was rated a better drivers car.

groupb

Jog my memory. I don't remember autocar ever putting a passat above a mondeo and for the life of me having driven both over long distances , I could'nt see any reason why they would. The OP did say that he wanted a new car because his passat was too soft.
I had a mk2 mondeo and can't think of a car at the time (bar possibly the 406) which bettered it.
Can't disagree with you about the escort though. An absolute heap. Those were the days when ford europe was run by beancounters.