O2 XDA Orbit 2 Release Date

Le Burp

Since the current Orbit has now being discontinued, does anyone know the release date for the Orbit 2 ? (aka..HTC Polaris)

aikon

In store they told me April

fisab

The manager of one store told me today that he had no knowlege of it and he would know at least 1 month in advance.
Hope its not too expensive when it comes out.

mkennedy

I'd be interested in knowing this too.

The Polaris IS only 550 unlocked though. Hmm..
But with O2's new data plans the Orbit 2 might be worth looking at for me.
How soon can you unlock these O2 devices after getting them?

If anyone hears anything, keep us updated please.

lfc1892

you can unlock any O2 phone on contract at any time. However, HTC may take up to 4 weeks to supply this code.

Wheels

aikon wrote: »

In store they told me April

Every store will tell you something different. I was given the runaround for the release of the original Orbit. Baggot Street told me a few weeks, Henry Street Experience told me months, Grafton Street had never heard of it.

Eventually one day I checked Henry Street Experience, they told me another two months. I went up the road to the regular Henry Street store and got on then and there. They'd had them in stock for a few days.

On various different occasions I was told it would come with WM6 hence the delay. And no one, not even the store I bought it in or subsequent stores I visited was entirely sure what the package consisted of. It was a joke.

That said, April sounds realistic given the release of last years. I do hope the deal is slightly more attractive though and at least some way represents good value for money. I won't hold my breath though.

chka

I called O2 few days ago and she (the person on the phone) told me that Orbit 2 is currently on testing and the release date is early April. She also said that because they didn't announce it publicly they can miss that day and if they miss it they will try to release the phone next month (she said that they always release new phones on the begining of the month).

Wheels

chka wrote: »

I called O2 few days ago and she (the person on the phone) told me that Orbit 2 is currently on testing and the release date is early April. She also said that because they didn't announce it publicly they can miss that day and if they miss it they will try to release the phone next month (she said that they always release new phones on the begining of the month).

I wish they'd get their act together and do things properly. The phone has been out nearly 6 months at this stage, exactly what testing are they doing??

mkennedy

I rang them and they said early April as well.
Certainly before the end of April though.

I might get it instead of its HTC counterpart, the Touch-Cruise.

Anyone able to give a pro/con comparison of the Orbit 2 and the HTC Touch-Cruise.
I know the Orbit 2 is rounder and has a start button unlike the Touch-Cruise, but any other major differences?

I'm guessing o2 don't cripple their devices that much do they:
e.g the GPS on the Orbit 2 can work unassisted by a data connection i assume?
e.g HTC TouchFLO (cube etc) works exactly as on the Touch-Cruise?
e.g the WM6 on the Orbit 2 pretty much works with all WM6 apps including Skype (incidentally do O2 allow Skype over their 3G network)

Also do o2 bundle full satnav maps (copilot) in with it?
They did with the Orbit, didn't they?

Lastly anyone know how much it's likely to be?

Wheels

mkennedy wrote: »

I rang them and they said early April as well.
Certainly before the end of April though.

Who did you ring? I wouldn't mind hounding them myself.

I'm guessing o2 don't cripple their devices that much do they:
e.g the GPS on the Orbit 2 can work unassisted by a data connection i assume?
e.g HTC TouchFLO (cube etc) works exactly as on the Touch-Cruise?
e.g the WM6 on the Orbit 2 pretty much works with all WM6 apps including Skype (incidentally do O2 allow Skype over their 3G network)

The GPS will work without a data connection assuming you don't have it set to get traffic updates etc. The only big changes are cosmetic really, it looks o2, it has o2 branded software but it does everything else perfectly well and if all else fails is still able to live as a PDA without a phone connection.

Also do o2 bundle full satnav maps (copilot) in with it?
They did with the Orbit, didn't they?

They did but it was more expensive and only open to business customers. They also didn't do it straight off the bat and for the first month and a half no shop knew what deal they were offering. I heard some people got their sat nav free because the staff were confused.

I got mine without and after months of searching bought DestinAtor online for roughly 60euro. Has worked an absolute treat and I've never had a problem with it.

Lastly anyone know how much it's likely to be?

I would assume around the 350/400 mark. o2 Ireland like to make as much as they can on these things...

mkennedy

Wheels wrote: »

Who did you ring? I wouldn't mind hounding them myself. The GPS will work without a data connection assuming you don't have it set to get traffic updates etc. The only big changes are cosmetic really, it looks o2, it has o2 branded software but it does everything else perfectly well and if all else fails is still able to live as a PDA without a phone connection. They did but it was more expensive and only open to business customers. They also didn't do it straight off the bat and for the first month and a half no shop knew what deal they were offering. I heard some people got their sat nav free because the staff were confused. I got mine without and after months of searching bought DestinAtor online for roughly 60euro. Has worked an absolute treat and I've never had a problem with it. I would assume around the 350/400 mark. o2 Ireland like to make as much as they can on these things...

Just someone in customer care, no-one special.
She assured me nobody had any more info apart from the April date.
Incidentally, it's confirmed on the other thread now by the O2 person.

If the changes are just cosmetic that's great.
TBH I don't think i'd mind the O2 branding that much compared to the other operators.

Confused staff you say?
Sigh, should be fun.
On the other hand might be able to blag a free satnav app off them..

I read that Tomtom works ok as well on it, despite it coming with copilot.

slegs

Copilot 7 is very nice software with Navtech mapping. Have it on XDA Exec and it works great.

wheresmybeaver

I use iGo MyWay 2006 and it works great, the map is bang up to date and it has all the Irish localities and area-names. Certainly worked better than Tomtom, which had a lot of roads and area-names missing. It's hard enough to find now though, and these days they only sell it with a full Euro map, whereas I was able to get just the Irish map on its own.

chka

I just called O2 customer care (1909 number) again to double check the due date. They told me that 1st of April is the release date but... the phone is still in testing mode. He explained that there is a possibility that it may take few extra weeks after the 1st of April but since the XDA is an O2 phone they'll try to their best to release it on the 1st (april's fool day...). BTW, Destinator rulz

Le Burp

Lads they are now issuing HP Ipaq 614c (Sim Free and unbranded), I can confirm this as our procurement manager ordered several XDA Orbits (The Original) and O2 told him that the Orbit was discountinued and a new model would be available, we got ours yesterday, so now I have two 614c's:eek:

The Orbit 2 would have an O2 Based rom but the early ones most likely will be unlocked.

Wheels

According to Henry Sreet its April 7th it's out!

mkennedy

Was in an O2 store yesterday and they didn't hear anything about it coming in.
They thought it'd be May atleast

Can copilot be taken off the original media card it's sold with and installed on a larger media card (i assume it can but would like to confirm).

fisab

Le Burp wrote: »

Lads they are now issuing HP Ipaq 614c (Sim Free and unbranded), I can confirm this as our procurement manager ordered several XDA Orbits (The Original) and O2 told him that the Orbit was discountinued and a new model would be available, we got ours yesterday, so now I have two 614c's:eek:

The Orbit 2 would have an O2 Based rom but the early ones most likely will be unlocked.

Dont mean to hijack this thread, but are you saying that O2 now sell Ipaq 614c's? If so, do you mind me asking what the upgrade cost was?

I was planning on upgrading to the Orbit 2 but the SAR rating of 1.75 has put me off a bit.

chka

Actually I'm worried about the SAR rating as well and I'm not sure I'll get it. It seems that the new XDA is not even allowed to be sold in the states as the maximum allowed SAR rating is 1.6 but it's ok here in Europe with maximum rating of 2.0 (http://www.sarvalues.com/what-is-sar.html).

fisab

chka wrote: »

Actually I'm worried about the SAR rating as well and I'm not sure I'll get it. It seems that the new XDA is not even allowed to be sold in the states as the maximum allowed SAR rating is 1.6 but it's ok here in Europe with maximum rating of 2.0 (http://www.sarvalues.com/what-is-sar.html).

I'm very frustrated about this 'cos I was about to buy it as soon as it comes out. The HTC Touch Cruise (on which it is based) only has a SAR of 0.88 but the housing/casing is different so there must be some extra "leakage".
The alternative options with O2 for a WM6 or S60 phone with a 2.8" screen size or more are non existent.

3frog

chka wrote: »

Actually I'm worried about the SAR rating as well and I'm not sure I'll get it. It seems that the new XDA is not even allowed to be sold in the states as the maximum allowed SAR rating is 1.6 but it's ok here in Europe with maximum rating of 2.0 (http://www.sarvalues.com/what-is-sar.html).

Either there is a typo on that site or I'm incapable of reading the data right.. either possibility is very possable and it might be both.

If that link is right then the rating for Europe is
2.0 W/Kg in 10g of tissue
Now the table shows the US as having
1.6 W/Kg in 1g of tissue.
So to put that in context it would suggest that in Europe it is
0.2 W/Kg in 1g of tissue.

Somethings not right... The ratings on the phone tables would make most of them unavailable in Europe if the limit is 0.2 lol
O2 say they have them in stock if you phone cust service.

fisab

From the O2 Germany manual (http://www.o2online.de):

SAR-Informationen
1,72 w/kg@10g (CE)

Thats at the official 10g absorption measurement.

chka

3frog, well done for spotting it but after researching the issue more, I noticed that the difference between 1g and 10g doesn't make that much of a difference. Have a quick look on http://www.ce-mag.com/archive/03/01/miller.html at the paragraph: "The origin of current SAR limits". The 1g or 10g is just the tissue sample that is tested and the results are averaged for that tissue. The previous article states: "The lower U.S. limit is more stringent because it is volume-averaged over a smaller amount of tissue". A more sientific explataion of SAR and the way it’s measured is here: http://www.emctech.com.au/sar/sar_article_2003.htm Anyway, it's really bad especially because the SAR rating of the original phone without the O2 case (the HTC Touch Cruise) that has a SAR rating of 0.888 W/kg @10g!!!

mkennedy

That's a pity about that SAR rating thing alright.
Really wanted to get the Orbit 2- probably have to shell out now for the Touch-Cruise.

Not mad about the TC's angular design compared to the sleek Orbit 2 though.

Easydevices.co.uk look like the cheapest at the moment for the Touch-Cruise, <500 euro with p and p so it's an option I suppose.
Should be able to use my own satnav app on it.

The Orbit 2 WITH copilot will probably come in around the 500 mark all in on the 35 euro tarriff so maybe not a huge difference price-wise afterall.

It's out in Dublin tomorrow apparently is it?

chka

No idea if tomorrow is the release day for the Orbit2 but I just checked the business section in O2.ie and they still celebrate the “new” Orbit (the old one). I'll give a call to O2 & carphone warehouse to see if it's released and in stock. My current phone is the XDA Orbit and I'm very happy with it. The only reason for upgrading is that the old Orbit it lacks 3G which is important for me (is it?). The question for me now is: Orbit 2 + mandatory use of bluetooth headset on every call or stay with my old Orbit? (or forget the bluetooth headset and fry my brain?). I just checked and the old Orbit has only 0.496W/kg@10g SAR rating!!! How the O2 guys managed to mess up the orbit2 so much?

The Easydevices.co.uk seems like a good offer with 508 euro (todays exchange rate) but I have at least one platinum upgrade on the account and I can get the phone half price.

3frog

chka wrote: »

Orbit 2 + mandatory use of bluetooth headset on every call

You forget that one day you may wish to use the family juiles. Fry them if you just leave the thing in the pocket.
Is there any other reference for the cooking power of the orbit2. Any other lab have data on it.??
Can I use it to make tea for example?


Oh and I figured out that the young lady from O2 on the phone over the weekend was rather confused.. she thought I was talking about the Orbit not the Orbit2!!
(that's about as polite as I can make that comment.. but teeth are grinding)

Wheels

The stores on Grafton Street today felt it would be next month and as usual knew nothing. *sigh*

Seriously considering not getting it now though.

mkennedy

You forget that one day you may wish to use the family juiles. Fry them if you just leave the thing in the pocket.

Now there's a man with his priorities straight.

Can I use it to make tea for example?

Hmmm i can just see the blurb...HSDPA/Wifi/GPS/FM tuner/WM6 and world-first built-in tea-making capacity (TMC).

Oh and I figured out that the young lady from O2 on the phone over the weekend was rather confused.. she thought I was talking about the Orbit not the Orbit2!!
(that's about as polite as I can make that comment.. but teeth are grinding)

Know that teeth-grinding feeling only too well.
The Orbit's been out for the past year FFS- how could they mistake the old one for a new device.
I take it you shouted Orbit TWOOOO in big bold letters at them to offset this eventuality btw.:)

Extraordinary though how there can be so little expectation/knowledge about an "upcoming" device.
Wonder if is coming at all tbh.

chka

Well... I just called O2 to find out when it'll be available but instead of the usual "oh well... we don't know" the person on the phone said:

"Ehmm... it was due to be released last week but ... it didn't got approval" !!!!!

Do you think they're working on fixing the radiation leak? I heard that a lead flavored chewing gum on the top right corner, fixes the problem :-) But I don't think that as it is can replace your microwave. The Orbit2 is too strong and can burn your food.

Wheels

chka wrote: »

"Ehmm... it was due to be released last week but ... it didn't got approval" !!!!!

QUOTE]

So basically, first week in April, middle of April, May... We can expect it in any of them.

3frog

chka wrote: »

as it is can replace your microwave. The Orbit2 is too strong and can burn your food.

I love a good miss quote. Nothing like it to get a good rumour going.

I can see it in News of the World.
"The new Orbit2 come with a strap on system allowing it to be attached to any regular mug ("cup" intended but mug means so much more). Add water and a teabag and wait 3 min. "

Of course a "strap on being and attached to a regular mug" has its own considerations.

chka

I'm getting the Orbit 2 tomorrow...

Wheels

chka wrote: »

I'm getting the Orbit 2 tomorrow...

Get your tinfoil helmet ready.

mkennedy

This SAR rating has put me right off. Can anyone say definitively what its implications are likely to be.

@chka:
How much is it?

fisab

mkennedy wrote: »

This SAR rating has put me right off. Can anyone say definitively what its implications are likely to be.

@chka:
How much is it?

The SAR rating is the maximum a phone will generate e.g in a moving car while the handset is changing to another basestation, being very far away from the base station etc.

A better gauge is a phone's TCP rating - a measure of how good a phone is at contacting a base station. A phone with a good TCP rating doesnt need to ramp up as much power when communicating, thus uses a lower average SAR.

Unfortunately manufacturers dont publish TCP ratings

Still, since the SAR is the only value we have, I also wont be buying an Orbit for safety - real pity.


PS. Same question, how much was your Orbit?

chka

15 euro ... :-) Really!!!.

I lost my orbit on Saturday and today I got a call from the insurance company saying: "If you want, with 15 euro I can get you the XDA Orbit 2. We just received them today." When I took the call initially I was thinking ... "No way" but I usually make calls using my hands free (well... it's the 15 euro factor as well) and I agreed to get the new one for testing.

Therefore, as the official guinea pig, I'll keep you updated on my findings and if you don’t receive any new postings from me over the next few weeks, you’ll know what’s the reason:my brain is fryed.

chka

mkennedy wrote: »

This SAR rating has put me right off. Can anyone say definitively what its implications are likely to be.

Nothing sort term. And I'm not sure that a SAR rating of 1.72 can cause any significant damage to you because the maximum SAR in Europe is 2.0 and I assume that the EU legislators know what they're doing. Don't forget that we all survived the era of "Nokia 5110" or even older phones with undefined SAR rating (I just checked and my first phone, the 5110, has a SAR rating of 0.69!!!).

chka

[SIZE=-1]Look what these (http://www.mobile-phones-uk.org.uk/sar.htm) guys say:[/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1]Avoid touching the aerial while the phone is turned on, and keep the phone away from areas of the body such as eyes, testicles, breasts and internal organs[/SIZE]

and that applies to any phone.

Also I noticed that: "For example research shows that nematode worms exposed to mobile phone radiation produce more eggs, release stress hormones and grow larger."

3frog

chka wrote: »

research shows that nematode worms exposed to mobile phone radiation produce more eggs, release stress hormones and grow larger."

So who needs Viagra!! Just get a good old well regulated dose by having a phone in your pocket.
Brings new light to the expression "Is that a mobile phone in you pocket or are you just pleased to see me."
answer .. "Actually its both, its part of an enlargement program"

I still have not found any more information on the SAR for the Orbit 2.

If I could read German I guess I could figure out why its release has been delayed. That is assuming its because of technical problems and not just as a way to get more money out the iPhone.
Are there any German readers here who can find anything out about any problems they have reported so far.!! ?

chka

I'm not an expert on SAR but I'm not sure that carrying the XDA Orbit 2 in your pocket will not do any more damage than carrying any other phone. My understanding of SAR is the amount of microwaves escaping from the front of the phone while you're talking thus frying your head. I'm sure that the total amount of energy (microwaves) is more or less the same for all phones (they all need to talk to the main cell). Lower SAR means that most of the energy leaves the phone from the top or back (frying your hand or the guy sitting next to you on a bus) and less from the front (frying your ear). Anyway... all phones are bad, so we should stay with the old black, heavy, ugly, dial phone.

mkennedy

I was told yesterday that you can only get the 250mb data addon for the Orbit 2 (no 1gb or 1gb data addons are available for it).

They said this only applies to certain highend handsets like the Orbit 2 and not generally.
Makes absolutely no sense whatsoever but they seemed adamant.
Very peculiar.

Can anyone confirm or deny this.

chka

Yes, I have the 250mb addon but its more than enough. If I need to access the internet outside of the office, I have a data modem. Don't forget that the orbit is just a phone and you don't want to download movies on it. For viewing web pages and reading your e-mails 250mb are more than enough.

Now, the orbit2 is really cool device. The internet access is ultra fast (3G) and the most important of all, the orbit2 comes not only with GPS (like the plain orbit), but with copilot pre-installed. From the other side now, it contains the SAR: 1.72 label and restrictions as to what countries can be used (for example US is not there)!

mkennedy

So this device can't be used as a modem with the 1gb or 10gb broadband addons then?

chka

I'm sure you can get an additional sim card (for example an O2 broadband card, or any other company's broadband card but you have to change sims all the time) that has the 1/10GB allowance and use it with the orbit. I can't see why not.

mkennedy

Well someone in CC who consulted with data support and a supervisor now just told me 250mb, 1gb and 10gb addons will be applicable to the Orbit 2.
And can be used as a modem with these addons.

3frog

chka.. I have to ask you, whats it like using the touch screen.. is it smooth and easy like the iPhone?
Can you type an SMS as easy as with a standard mobile phone keypad or a qwerty one?
Oh and any news on when it will actually get released here, or do we have to wait till O2 dissects you to find out if your brain has melted first. ?

mkennedy

3frog wrote: »

chka.. I have to ask you, whats it like using the touch screen.. is it smooth and easy like the iPhone?
Can you type an SMS as easy as with a standard mobile phone keypad or a qwerty one?
Oh and any news on when it will actually get released here, or do we have to wait till O2 dissects you to find out if your brain has melted first. ?

It's available (atleast where i am).
But i'll almost certainly go with the Touch-Cruise because of the SAR thing.
Shame because i really like the design and it's bundled with copilot apparently.

Incidentally i'm fairly sure there's a way of tweaking the registry to increase the touchscreen sensitivity if you need to.

Patrickof

mkennedy wrote: »

It's available (atleast where i am).

Where is it available?

3frog

Anyone interested in me buying them a pint sometime while I try out their Touch Cruse or Orbit 2 touch screen for simple writing, like an SMS.
I'm in Dublin city centre these days.
I'm just not sure about the virtual screen thing till I try it.

3frog

Patrickof wrote: »

Where is it available?

They have it in the O2 experence store in Grafton Street but no demo or display unit. So no touchy feely moment.
I guess there is a better price through the on-line or phone store.
I must call and find the price there next.

chka

3frog wrote: »

chka.. I have to ask you, whats it like using the touch screen.. is it smooth and easy like the iPhone?
Can you type an SMS as easy as with a standard mobile phone keypad or a qwerty one?
Oh and any news on when it will actually get released here, or do we have to wait till O2 dissects you to find out if your brain has melted first. ?

1000 sorry for not replying earlier but my brain was fried (just kidding). My experience so far with the orbit 2:

The good things (and a mini comparison with iPhone):

1. It looks great
2. It's similar in dimension as the old Orbit (very close to the dimensions of iPhone)
3. 3G RULZ!!!!!!! I can't believe how useful is the 3G connection on the phone. Most of the times it's faster than the office connection. There is an application and you can share the 3G connection with your laptop over Bluetooth… so simple!
4. Has a real GPS (compared to the fake stupidity that iPhone has)
5. Costs €375 with gold upgrade (I had to buy another 2 for the company and that’s why I know the real price)
6. The Co-pilot (IE, UK) is now part of the operating system. I do prefer the Destinator but the Co-pilot is not bad.
7. The usual windows applications (i.e. word, excel, PowerPoint, etc) are much faster due to the new OS and the faster CPU
8. Compared to iPhone, the orbit2 is on a much cheaper tariff
9. There is a pen!!! The iPhone assumes that all its users are girls with small fingers.
10. There are two cameras (one in the back and one in the front for video-calling). But… O2 doesn’t support video-calling.
11. Comes with everything on the box. You don't need to buy anything else: hands free + radio, car holder, car charger, you name it.

Some bad things:
1. You can’t compare its user interface with the iPhone. The apple guys spend tons of money implementing the iPhone’s user interface and the Orbit2 has only an add-on. It mimics let’s say 60-70% of the UI of iPhone but only in specific applications (for example the photo viewer and the new “3D menu” but it doesn’t work let’s say on IE) but this functionality is not embedded with the operating system (WM6) from Microsoft. I hope that WM7 will have most of the iPhone’s functionality in the next version of windows mobile edition.
2. There is no way to write an SMS with your fingers (i.e. not using the pen) using the default keyboard something that a girl can with the iPhone. But there are 6 different keyboard-views you can use. One of them emulates a phone-keyboard, so if you are used to the keystrokes on a normal phone you can write an SMS easily with using only your fingers.
3. I think that the touch screen is not as responsive as the previous versions. I am the owner of almost every XDA… the first XDA, XDA2, XDA2s, XDA2i, orbit and now orbit 2 and I know from experience. You have to apply a bit of pressure for the screen to register the “click”. I just did an experiment and I opened a new note (an application you can draw) and it needs few extra grams of pressure to operate. I did this test because I read somewhere that the orbit2 is clever enough to understand if you use the pen or a finger. And it does very well!!! I could move this point to the positive notes, but since I’m not using my fingers for drawing, I’ll keep it as a negative point.
4. When you send a text (SMS) there is no way to define to get a delivery report. But after 10sec in Google you can download a register hack that enables the delivery reports on texts.

Compared to the iPhone, I think the orbit2 is much higher spec with a lot more functions. At the end of the day, the orbit2 runs on windows (yes mobile, I know) and not some cryptic operating system that you have no idea what it does on the background. Microsoft gives for free the SDK for the orbit2, so if someone wants, he/she can write his own applications for the XDA. I wouldn’t even think of buying an iPhone just for the name or its better user interface because it doesn’t worth it.

Please let me know if you need any additional information. About the SAR rating now: It does have the scary 1.72 on the box but (http://www.mobile-phones-uk.org.uk/sar.htm):
You should also be aware that the SAR values shown are maximum values and in practice emissions from mobile phones will normally be lower than these figures. The emissions depend on factors such as distance from a transmission mast, whether the phone is used indoors or outdoors, how close the phone is held to the ear and other operating factors. It is important to realise that a phone with a high SAR rating may actually operate with much lower emissions in practice, and conversely a phone with a lower SAR rating may operate with emissions higher than a high SAR phone in practice. You should not rely on a low SAR rating to guarantee your health.