Fury at tribute plan for IRA girl Farrell

LordSutch

Headline News - Saturday, February 23, 2008
The Sinn Fein MLA who organised a memorial service for a convicted IRA bomber at Stormont has defended the plan. Jennifer McCann of Sinn Fein has sparked fury among other parties after she booked the Long Gallery inside Parliament Buildings for an event dedicated to the memory of the notorious IRA bomber Mairead Farrell.
She said that the event was scheduled to coincide with International Women's Day, which is on March 8. Mrs McCann then said that she did not intend to offend unionists, but nor did she expect them to back her plans.
"It's not about agreeing," she said. "I'm not asking anyone to agree with what I am doing, but I am saying they should respect it.
Stormont is a shared space and that's the way it has to be seen. "We have a right to hold the celebration there She added: "It's International Women's Day and we're celebrating the life of Mairead Farrell. I don't think that should offend anyone."

"Mairead Farrell was a Provisional IRA bomber who was thankfully intercepted by the SAS on her way to kill innocent people in Gibraltar” Nelson McCausland of the DUP said. "For Sinn Fein member Jennifer McCann to claim that an event celebrating the life of such a criminal has anything to do with International Women's Day is quite frankly ludicrous.
"People like Farrell and her fellow terrorists in the IRA killed hundreds of innocent women throughout the course of their campaign of terror. "To hold such a person up as a role model demonstrates some kind of warped thinking. "The DUP & Others will oppose this event taking place. "As the home of our local assembly, Stormont is a shared public space."

Just what the hell is Sinn Fein (Mrs Mc Cann) thinking of

Zombrex

While I don't in any way support the unlawful execution of Ms Farrell by the SAS, I'm not quite sure why anyone would want to hold a memorial for her. She was trying to blow up a military band (a band FFS, in Gibraltar FFS) in a public street while they paraded, a bomb that would probably have killed many many people. While her death was a crime (according to the EU Court of Human Rights), she was conspiring to murder people herself, so it is hard to find sympathy for her.

Fratton Fred

This is daft, this just gives the unionists the excuse to have their own memorial to one of their own murderers.

OK, there are no murders any more, but has anything really changed up north?

GuanYin

Its tit for tat propaganda at this stage. The UK made a mess of the Gibraltar three, unlawfully killing them and then engaging in a coverup of the circumstances of their deaths, SF are using this so called memorial as a finger pointing exercise and really, at the stage we should be at, this is going to do nothing but glorify a state of mind that we should all be trying to get over.

twasantis

ArthurF wrote: »

Headline News - Saturday, February 23, 2008
The Sinn Fein MLA who organised a memorial service for a convicted IRA bomber at Stormont has defended the plan. Jennifer McCann of Sinn Fein has sparked fury among other parties after she booked the Long Gallery inside Parliament Buildings for an event dedicated to the memory of the notorious IRA bomber Mairead Farrell.
She said that the event was scheduled to coincide with International Women's Day, which is on March 8. Mrs McCann then said that she did not intend to offend unionists, but nor did she expect them to back her plans.
"It's not about agreeing," she said. "I'm not asking anyone to agree with what I am doing, but I am saying they should respect it.
Stormont is a shared space and that's the way it has to be seen. "We have a right to hold the celebration there She added: "It's International Women's Day and we're celebrating the life of Mairead Farrell. I don't think that should offend anyone."

"Mairead Farrell was a Provisional IRA bomber who was thankfully intercepted by the SAS on her way to kill innocent people in Gibraltar” Nelson McCausland of the DUP said. "For Sinn Fein member Jennifer McCann to claim that an event celebrating the life of such a criminal has anything to do with International Women's Day is quite frankly ludicrous.
"People like Farrell and her fellow terrorists in the IRA killed hundreds of innocent women throughout the course of their campaign of terror. "To hold such a person up as a role model demonstrates some kind of warped thinking. "The DUP & Others will oppose this event taking place. "As the home of our local assembly, Stormont is a shared public space."

Just what the hell is Sinn Fein (Mrs Mc Cann) thinking of

firstly..use of the word intercepted is not fair!!!lets be real,she was murdered....u say about her going to bomb and kill innocent people,how do u know this???it is the common theory,but unproven!!!! secondly if some people want to celebrate her life that is there choice,also as it is peoples to disagree!! lastly....but most importantly, i can only imagine that if mairead farrell had a choice,stormont is one place she would not want to be honoured in!!!!

Fratton Fred

twasantis wrote: »

firstly..use of the word intercepted is not fair!!!lets be real,she was murdered....u say about her going to bomb and kill innocent people,how do u know this???it is the common theory,but unproven!!!! secondly if some people want to celebrate her life that is there choice,also as it is peoples to disagree!! lastly....but most importantly, i can only imagine that if mairead farrell had a choice,stormont is one place she would not want to be honoured in!!!!

the IRA came out and said they were in Gibralter on active service. What were they doing, looking for a payphone that worked?

walrusgumble

Wicknight wrote: »

While I don't in any way support the unlawful execution of Ms Farrell by the SAS, I'm not quite sure why anyone would want to hold a memorial for her. She was trying to blow up a military band (a band FFS, in Gibraltar FFS) in a public street while they paraded, a bomb that would probably have killed many many people. While her death was a crime (according to the EU Court of Human Rights), she was conspiring to murder people herself, so it is hard to find sympathy for her.

the three people were unarmed and they did not find a bomb in the suspected car. oh course it was convenient that another popped up in another; cough conspiracy cough (sic). not to mention the inconsistencies from witness statements about the actions of army members telling them to stop. (didn't the british try to 'plant' arms on bodies during the bloody sunday murders?, not to mention the mimai (dickie rock's group) killings)

you saying "according" to the ECJ is disengenious. the court found that the sas had intelligence on the group weeks prior to alleged bombing and went to Gibraltar early not to mention informing the Gibralter police, why didn't they intercept before the killings by arresting them when they entered the area, and killing in front of public, that not reckless? their actions were disproportionate and excessive.

i dont sympathise her but wish to point out what was found in an important court that makes states accountable for their actions, see the case transcript for yourself.

Fratton Fred

walrusgumble wrote: »

the three people were unarmed and they did not find a bomb in the suspected car. oh course it was convenient that another popped up in another; cough conspiracy cough. not to mention the inconsistencies from witness statements. (didn't the british try to 'plant' arms on bodies during the bloody sunday murders, not to mention the mimai (dickie rock's group) killings)

you saying "according" to the ECJ is disengenious. the court found that the sas had intelligence on the group weeks prior to alleged bombing and went to Gibraltar early not to mention informing the Gibralter police, why didn't they intercept before the killings by arresting them when they entered the area, and killing in front of public, that not reckless? their actions were disproportionate and excessive.

yes they were, but if every person killed during the troubles is going to have a memorial at Stormont, then someone better tell the caterers to get a new kettle.

twasantis

Fratton Fred wrote: »

the IRA came out and said they were in Gibralter on active service. What were they doing, looking for a payphone that worked?

is the sarco really needed here?????that was not my point!!!!what she was doing is hearsay,active service ok,thats a valid remark....but her intentions as part of that active service??u cant claim as fact,like op did.i not saying she was not going to that,but speaking of things like they are fact when they are only suspected only clouds judgement..but anyway my main point is that she was not out there so that sinn fein could sit in stormont....that i will stick my neck out and say is fact!!!!
so i was agreeing that she should not be celebrated in stormont,but on different grounds...

LordSutch

I doubt very much that she was on a shopping trip or on a 'bird watching expedition' (ala the columbian Bird watching expedition) so what was she & her two buddies up to on the Rock? I only ask this because of her tainted IRA history . . .

A Dub in Glasgo

Met Mairead Farrell in Belfast in '87, very nice woman

murphaph

A Dub in Glasgo wrote: »

Met Mairead Farrell in Belfast in '87, very nice woman

On 5 April 1976 she and two others bombed the Conway Hotel, Dunmurry

She sounds lovely alright.

Zombrex

walrusgumble wrote: »

the three people were unarmed and they did not find a bomb in the suspected car. oh course it was convenient that another popped up in another; cough conspiracy cough (sic). not to mention the inconsistencies from witness statements about the actions of army members telling them to stop. (didn't the british try to 'plant' arms on bodies during the bloody sunday murders?, not to mention the mimai (dickie rock's group) killings)

Oh please. 3 active IRA members just happen to end up in Gibraltar (what? on holiday) so the British go "Wow, what luck, lets plant plastic explosives in a car, shoot them and place the keys to the car with them. The perfect crime"

Cause its not like the IRA ever tried to blow up British Army personnel abroad before ...

walrusgumble wrote: »

you saying "according" to the ECJ is disengenious. the court found that the sas had intelligence on the group weeks prior to alleged bombing and went to Gibraltar early not to mention informing the Gibralter police, why didn't they intercept before the killings by arresting them when they entered the area, and killing in front of public, that not reckless? their actions were disproportionate and excessive.

And?

walrusgumble wrote: »

i dont sympathise her but wish to point out what was found in an important court that makes states accountable for their actions, see the case transcript for yourself.

I have seen the case transcript and I agree 100% with it. I'm failing to see your point here.

Pen1987

SF should honour whom ever they wish to honour in a place appropriote. Stormont is a symbol of governmental unity. Attempting to honour a person whose actions in the past could be called into question in the terms of the peace process, not matter republican or unionist - in stormont - is sparking an argument that could be easily avoided

If the ceromony was done in SFs' main office it would avoid argument, and be better supported. Its a childish move by SF by trying to do this in Stormont.

murphaph

Pen1987 wrote: »

SF should honour whom ever they wish to honour in a place appropriote. Stormont is a symbol of governmental unity. Attempting to honour a person whose actions in the past could be called into question in the terms of the peace process, not matter republican or unionist - in stormont - is sparking an argument that could be easily avoided

If the ceromony was done in SFs' main office it would avoid argument, and be better supported. Its a childish move by SF by trying to do this in Stormont.

Agree entirely. SFIRA are bound to honour their dead, but at least be discreet about it! They know the DUP are already under fire for being in govt with them, talk about making it awkward.

djpbarry

A terrorist's life should not be celebrated in a public building. End of. How she died is irrelevant in that context. To quote Nelson McCausland, "To hold such a person up as a role model demonstrates some kind of warped thinking".

purple'n'gold

I am just wondering has Sinn Fein got another agenda up their sleeve. They usually have everything planned out and are not prone to making off the wall decisions. And on the face of it this is stupid in the extreme. Is there an unpleasant surprise ahead? Is this just a smoke screen to divert from something more sinister?

duggie-89

djpbarry wrote: »

A terrorist's life should not be celebrated in a public building. End of. How she died is irrelevant in that context. To quote Nelson McCausland, "To hold such a person up as a role model demonstrates some kind of warped thinking".

you dont seem to understand the concept of terrorist do you??? she was a freedom fighter who was gunned down in the street. they were not armed and there is no proof they were there to kill anyone.

quoting a DUP mla who has supported the idea of bringing her "murders" the SAS to another cermony in stormont.

if you ask me its a shared future and part of that future is remebering our dead and the event was booked long ago.

also she stood out in the republican movement. she was a high profile republican women who should be remembered.

well unless remembering our dead is another agenda then i dont think so but time will tell.

Fratton Fred

duggie-89 wrote: »

you dont seem to understand the concept of terrorist do you??? she was a freedom fighter who was gunned down in the street. they were not armed and there is no proof they were there to kill anyone.

quoting a DUP mla who has supported the idea of bringing her "murders" the SAS to another cermony in stormont.

if you ask me its a shared future and part of that future is remebering our dead and the event was booked long ago.

also she stood out in the republican movement. she was a high profile republican women who should be remembered.

well unless remembering our dead is another agenda then i dont think so but time will tell.

Maybe they were "observing the elections" :rolleyes:

is it "make excuses for murderers season" or something, there's a lot of it about lately.

Zombrex

duggie-89 wrote: »

you dont seem to understand the concept of terrorist do you??? she was a freedom fighter who was gunned down in the street.

She was a freedom fighter who used terrorism to obtain that freedom. She is a terrorist. The two aren't mutually exclusive terms.

duggie-89 wrote: »

they were not armed and there is no proof they were there to kill anyone.

The European Court of Human Rights, which demeaned the killing unlawful, disagrees. Which is why they did not award damages. They also determined that the SAS men honestly believed at the time that the IRA terrorists were attempting to detonate a bomb. This was grossly incorrect information, which they should have not acted upon, but you make it sound like the SAS shot them while they were eating ice cream. This case is very similar to the case of the Brazilian shot on the London Tube, itself and illegal, unlawful and immoral killing, but the police didn't just pick a random Brazilian and shoot him for the heck of it. This wasn't even a case of mistaken identity, she was the IRA terrorist in town to kill people.

So where the ECHR wrong?

duggie-89 wrote: »

also she stood out in the republican movement. she was a high profile republican women who should be remembered.

Remembered for what exactly? Being prepared to kill innocent people?

Lemming

duggie-89 wrote: »

you dont seem to understand the concept of terrorist do you??? she was a freedom fighter who was gunned down in the street. they were not armed and there is no proof they were there to kill anyone.

Ah ... a "freedom fighter". I see. Well, exactly what "freedom" had she murdered people for in the past and was conspiring to murder more people for in Gibraltar?

if you ask me its a shared future and part of that future is remebering our dead and the event was booked long ago.

And who is th is "our" you are referring to? The self-serving thug b*stards who crave power who murdered in the name of people who never asked nor wanted them to carry out such heinous attrocities?

Just well nobody asked you then.

also she stood out in the republican movement. she was a high profile republican women who should be remembered.

"High profile" for all the wrong reasons. So she should perhaps rather be remembered as an example of how not to be a piece of scum.

All in all, this is a childish prank by SF. They have an agenda up their sleeves here - the party masters are far too astute to have not had this orchestrated to stir sh*te to cover something else.

duggie-89

Lemming wrote: »

Ah ... a "freedom fighter". I see. Well, exactly what "freedom" had she murdered people for in the past and was conspiring to murder more people for in Gibraltar?

And who is th is "our" you are referring to? The self-serving thug b*stards who crave power who murdered in the name of people who never asked nor wanted them to carry out such heinous attrocities?

Just well nobody asked you then.

"High profile" for all the wrong reasons. So she should perhaps rather be remembered as an example of how not to be a piece of scum.

All in all, this is a childish prank by SF. They have an agenda up their sleeves here - the party masters are far too astute to have not had this orchestrated to stir sh*te to cover something else.

ok firstly for irish freedom...... maybe if you dont no what she was fighting for you should not comment. otherwise it may make you look bad.

no "our" is the two communities in the north. again you seem to be full of anger and bitterness that is not good for your health. maybe you should relax and you will see the light lol

maybe nobody asked me but i still gave my point and the last time i checked i had a right to do that.

again thats in your opinion and subject to many different views.

LordSutch

The 'our' obviously refers to the IRA/ Sinn Fein fraternity, seeing as most normal minded people (Unionist or Nationalist) would not have claimed the dead bomber to be one of ours ..............

Rossibaby

i claim her...im no sinn fein supporter or pira supporter but,mairead farrell RIP,her sacrifice is not forgotten in the RM

Zombrex

duggie-89 wrote: »

ok firstly for irish freedom...... maybe if you dont no what she was fighting for you should not comment. otherwise it may make you look bad.

And blowing up a marching band on a public street while they parade through Gibraltar (which is beside Spain BTW) achieves Irish freedom how exactly .... ?

duggie-89 wrote: »

no "our" is the two communities in the north.

LOL .. which "two communities" wish to remember this terrorist? Would that be the IRA communities and the Sinn Fein communities?:rolleyes:

djpbarry

duggie-89 wrote: »

she was a freedom fighter who was gunned down in the street.

What "freedom" was obtained by bombing a hotel?

duggie-89 wrote: »

they were not armed and there is no proof they were there to kill anyone.

So what was the 84kg of semtex for? Fireworks?

duggie-89 wrote: »

if you ask me its a shared future and part of that future is remebering our dead and the event was booked long ago.

Who does "our" refer to? Terrorist groups and their supporters? If the IRA want to remember her death, then they can do it in private.

duggie-89 wrote: »

she was a high profile republican women who should be remembered.

High profile, yes. But the only reason she should be remembered is as an example of what hatred can drive a person to do.

Erin Go Brath

Of course Mairead should be remembered and her life commemorated. Its just the usual crowd of WBrits and Empire apologists who have to make a deal about it and complain as per usual. :rolleyes:

Zombrex

Erin Go Brath wrote: »

Of course Mairead should be remembered and her life commemorated. Its just the usual crowd of WBrits and Empire apologists who have to make a deal about it and complain as per usual. :rolleyes:

har har, you so funny

Mr.Micro

Who offically was Mairead Farrell acting for that she should deserve recognition
or commemoration? It was certainly not for the Irish state. Sinn Fein will never be done stirring it. So ordinary people who obey the law in this life will never be commemorated?

djpbarry

Erin Go Brath wrote: »

Of course Mairead should be remembered and her life commemorated. Its just the usual crowd of WBrits and Empire apologists who have to make a deal about it and complain as per usual. :rolleyes:

While we're at it, why don't we commemorate these guys?

FIGHT DA POWA!

Erin Go Brath

djpbarry wrote: »

While we're at it, why don't we commemorate these guys?

FIGHT DA POWA!

Commemorate who you want to. Why don't you commemorate those brave soldiers who gunned down innocent civilians in Derry on Bloody sunday aswell. I'm sure they're your real heroes anway.

Mr.Micro

Yes too right DJPBarry, its the bad F..ks that seem to get all the notoriety and often celebration. Anyway what would Sinn Fein know about propriety and decency. They appear to laud people who have been involved in terrorism and all that goes with it .

djpbarry

Erin Go Brath wrote: »

Why don't you commemorate those brave soldiers who gunned down innocent civilians in Derry on Bloody sunday aswell.

Of course, the IRA never killed any innocent civilians. Oh no, wait...

Erin Go Brath wrote: »

I'm sure they're your real heroes anway.

Yes, of course, anyone who is opposed to the IRA must be a supporter of British imperialism. You're either with us or against us, eh? :rolleyes:

Lemming

Erin Go Brath wrote: »

Commemorate who you want to. Why don't you commemorate those brave soldiers who gunned down innocent civilians in Derry on Bloody sunday aswell. I'm sure they're your real heroes anway.

And who are yours? The guys who gutted Robert McCartney? Or maybe the thugs who executed an innocent mother in Jean McConville? Shall you be "commemorating" them after they're gunned down by some equally hate-filled thug?

stovelid

Although I'm not an IRA supporter, (and that's putting it extremely lightly) I deplored the execution of MF; however, I'm not sure about the wisdom of hosting this in government buildings. I appreciate that it may be a tactical gesture to the grassroots after recent revelations, but it's just playing into the hands of the cracker wing of unionism.

I'm not sure how tolerant SF would be of, say, an SAS or Billy Wright memorial in state buildings either.

LordSutch

There must be plenty of decent living women Mrs McCann could have chosen to celibrate on International Womens Day apart from convicted bomber Farrell ~ From Mary Peters to Sonia O'Sullivan, from Mary McAleese to Mary Robinson, from Dana to Enya, from Andrea Corr to Sharon Shannon, to so many other talented good honest Irish women who were'nt in the 'mass murder' business.

Typical Sinn Fein stunt if you ask me ~ I just wonder whats the real reason for it? apart from getting everybody else steamed up.

stovelid

ArthurF wrote: »

Andrea Corr

Jaysus, steady on Arthur. There are limits.

Zombrex

Erin Go Brath wrote: »

Commemorate who you want to. Why don't you commemorate those brave soldiers who gunned down innocent civilians in Derry on Bloody sunday aswell. I'm sure they're your real heroes anway.

Nah, we tend not to commemorate murderers round these parts.

Isn't that more Sinn Fein's thing? Will they be holding a commemoration for them when they are finished with Farrell.

Or is murdering people only ok if you murder them for your side?

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

pretty sure michael collins murdered people too.

Erin Go Brath

Lemming wrote: »

And who are yours? The guys who gutted Robert McCartney? Or maybe the thugs who executed an innocent mother in Jean McConville? Shall you be "commemorating" them after they're gunned down by some equally hate-filled thug?

Nelson Mandela, if you want me to name my hero.

I respect the sacrificies people made in the name of Irish freedom, and indeed for parity of esteem in the occupied counties. Many died, or spent years in jail fighting for their beliefs. Labelling them thugs is disingenuous in the extreme.

LordSutch

Sorry about throwing Andrea Corr into the list, but I ran out of names

Erin Go Brath

djpbarry wrote: »

Of course, the IRA never killed any innocent civilians. Oh no, wait...
Yes, of course, anyone who is opposed to the IRA must be a supporter of British imperialism. You're either with us or against us, eh? :rolleyes:

It doesnt bother me if people detest the IRA, they've commited some terrible crimes theres no getting away from that. What does annoy me is people just blantanly ignore the terror the British Army has inflicted on this country for centuries. Its like the IRA just went about slaughering people for the craic or something according to some of the posters here, completely ignoring the root cause of conflict, and indeed that there were two sides to the conflict, both guilty of atrocities.

Sand

DUP should hold a simulataneous commemoration of Jean McConville, and invite Sinn Fein to come along and join with them in remembering all the women, mothers, sisters and daughters murdered by terrorism in the northern irish conflict. Possibly Adams can give a speech on the murder of this innocent mother, condemn her brutal torture and murder, and the destruction of the family she left behind. Surely she would make a fitting individual to commemorate on International Womens Day?

Ah, but then theyd be told to "move on" - SF is only interested in revising the past, not commemorating it.

Its just the usual crowd of WBrits and Empire apologists who have to make a deal about it and complain as per usual.

Funny thing is, its actually the people living in Northern Ireland/UK who are the West Brits. SF voter isnt a nationality after all.

End of the day, SF and their ilk are scum. None of them are that far removed from punishment beatings, murders, organised crime and plenty of the leadership are old hands at it. Hardly surprising in that sort of moral climate that SF consider celebrating a murderer something thats okay. Wasnt too long ago a SF conference was on its feet cheering wildly a group of men who were notable only for throwing nail bombs into resteraunts and begging to be allowed to surrender when faced with actual armed opposition.

Oh and another thing, the European courts never said the three were murdered. The Gibraltar courts said the killings were lawful, the European Commission of Human Rights said the killings were lawful and referred it to the European Court. The higher court, by a narrow margin, merely stated that it was not convinced the killings were a result of force employed that was proportionate and necessary. Thats all, never said the UK murdered them, just that they went in too heavy.

Personally, Mairead and her buddies were quite willing to murder musicians, so they should roll with the punches and accept the other side shoots back. After all, isnt it SFIRA theology that they were fighting a war? In war enemies can shoot you when you are not under their control, so either SFIRAs view that it was murder gets a little wobbly when you try to reconcile it to their dogma of being a guerilla army.

Zombrex

Erin Go Brath wrote: »

I respect the sacrificies people made in the name of Irish freedom, and indeed for parity of esteem in the occupied counties. Many died, or spent years in jail fighting for their beliefs. Labelling them thugs is disingenuous in the extreme.

Yes, it does take great sacrifice to blow up children. For this we should applaud those brave men and women :rolleyes:

Oh that's right, the British made them do it. That's ok then. When the British kill children that is horrific. When the IRA kill children, well that is the British again making them do it. Wonderful, surely then we should be commemorating the British for the sacrafice they made in the cause of Irish freedom

djpbarry

Clammy Todgers wrote: »

pretty sure michael collins murdered people too.

Indeed he did - what's your point?

Erin Go Brath wrote: »

I respect the sacrificies people made in the name of Irish freedom

:rolleyes:

I respect the sacrifices people made in containing the threat posed by the IRA, hence protecting the right to life of innocent civilians.

Erin Go Brath wrote: »

Labelling them thugs is disingenuous in the extreme.

Thugs, murderers, terrorists, criminals, killers, slaughterers, fanatics, extremists, Neanderthals...

Take your pick - they're all apt.

Zombrex

Clammy Todgers wrote: »

pretty sure michael collins murdered people too.

Pretty sure a lot of people around here think that was equally bad.

Seriously where did this idea that it is ok to do what ever crime you like so long as you have a "good cause" behind you.

Michael Collins was a terrorist who used tactics that were highly immoral and illegal. The fact that he was a member of "our side", the fact that he was fighting for a cause I strongly believe in, is totally irrelevant to that. The fact that it worked to gain the ultimate goal of the cause is equally irrelevant.

The justification of your cause is not justification of your actions. Having a just cause does not make any action carried out for that cause just. Something immoral doesn't become moral just because you win.

GuanYin

Wicknight wrote: »

Pretty sure a lot of people around here think that was equally bad.

Seriously where did this idea that it is ok to do what ever crime you like so long as you have a "good cause" behind you.

Michael Collins was a terrorist who used tactics that were highly immoral and illegal. The fact that he was a member of "our side", the fact that he was fighting for a cause I strongly believe in, is totally irrelevant to that. The fact that it worked to gain the ultimate goal of the cause is equally irrelevant.

The justification of your cause is not justification of your actions. Having a just cause does not make any action carried out for that cause just. Something immoral doesn't become moral just because you win.

I'd disagree. There was a long history and saga that pushed people to the point of 1916. Not least a history or oppression, genocide and brutality by the occupational forces. While MC et als tactic are, by definition, terrorism, and the ends may not have justified the means, they were very different times and a very different English rule than what we see up North now.

That said, non-violent resistance has historically been the proportionally most effective.

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

djpbarry wrote: »

Indeed he did - what's your point?
:rolleyes:

.

that we don't mind glorifying murderers 'down here'.

Fratton Fred

How many innocent people did Michael Collins kill would be a better question.

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

alot probably, but signifigantly less than churchill, cromwell, blair, thatcher.

Rossibaby

Clammy Todgers wrote: »

alot probably, but signifigantly less than churchill, cromwell, blair, thatcher.

well said