Primary school teaching...soft option?

raindrops21

I'm just wondering what the big attraction is with primary school teaching as a career. A lot of my friends are in their final year of their arts degrees and all suddenly want to be primary school teachers because they dont know what else to do.

I just don't see what the attraction of the job is - the pay is barely livable and teachers are driven mad by their 30 or more screaming children for 6 hours a day. I can see how the holidays are a bonus (this is why they cant complain about the pay not being very good), and this is also probably why so many middle aged women opt for a career change into the profession.

I honestly think primary school teaching is nothing more than a soft option....Views?

Hanley

raindrops21 wrote: »

I'm just wondering what the big attraction is with primary school teaching as a career. A lot of my friends are in their final year of their arts degrees and all suddenly want to be primary school teachers because they dont know what else to do.

I just don't see what the attraction of the job is - the pay is barely livable and teachers are driven mad by their 30 or more screaming children for 6 hours a day. I can see how the holidays are a bonus (this is why they cant complain about the pay not being very good), and this is also probably why so many middle aged women opt for a career change into the profession.

I honestly think primary school teaching is nothing more than a soft option....Views?

Notice the pattern?? Uh oh... oh yes I did

I guess the large holidays and early enough finishes during the day are a big factor, as you said. Personally I'd have zero interest in it.

cee_jay

mmm the pay is pretty good to start with - think you can end up starting at close to 40k - thats nothing to sneeze at!

kippy

There are many many reasons why one would want this career however "not knowing what else to do" is not one of them.
The holidays are fantastic. The hours are fantastic. The pay is fantastic (per hour worked).
That said it can be very stressful but the majority of national school teachers I know (and I know a few) love what they do, the wouldnt swap it for anything else.
It obviously has its pitfalls and its not the type of job you can go into every day and "hide".
Kippy

stardust_dublin

carol - yeah the pay starts off good. but the yearly increments are minimum and it takes 25 years to even reach circa 56k. But anyway, its not just about the money. i dont understand how its so popluar either- i'd say about 1 in 4 people i know (all girls believe it or not) want to be primary school teachers.

the_syco

A lad down the road to me is a teacher. Christ knows why, but seemingly it's something he had wanted to do. He'll last. The OP's friends will soon see that school ain't the same as those memories seen through their rose-tinted glasses...

newestUser

Dunno if I'd call it a soft option.

It's family-friendly, secure employment. It seems to suit people who aren't into the whole Celtic Tiger dog-eat-dog thing. Our parent's generation regard it as a 'good job'.

And yeah, to a certain extent, it's the beaten track. It's like going to Oz for a year after you finish college, hordes of people have done it before. Follow the leader. etc.

Trotter

All I ask before someone calls this or any job a soft option, is to do the job for a day, or watch it being done. There's a massive difference in the job since the new curriculum came in after 1999. The classes are overcrowded, and its very difficult to teach this curriculum to 30+ young people. Its a difficult job, and there is a misconception that teachers finish when the bell goes. I bring hours of work home, almost every day. I do 40+ hours a week, and so do most of the primary teachers I know.

whatsgoinon

i am currently doing a postgrad in primary teaching and it is nothing like i expected it to be. The course work is really really hard work, the teaching is even harder work, no way does the day end at 3pm, there is so much to be done to prepare for the next days lessons, planning resources, marking etc etc. I had 2 years in a classroom prior to deciding on the course. I find it really rewarding when a child 'gets' something, or tells you whats troubling them. There are a lot of difficult children in society, it sure as hell isn't like when I was in school (from what I can remember). Trying to get some kids to take out their pencil is a job in itself.

Yeah I thought it was a soft option, nice holidays, early finishes, pensionable job, but the holidays are well earned and there is a reason the day finishes early. 8 people have dropped out of my course since christmas, they realised it just wasn't for them. My friends dad was forced into early retirement at the age of 48 with heart troubles brought on by the stress of the job, it's not something to be taken lightly.

Moonbeam

Teachers salary scales -
http://www.into.ie/ROI/WorkingConditions/Salaries/CommonBasicScale/

um7y1h83ge06nx

Not a bad job really.

Your friend would want to plan ahead if they're thinking of doing the post-grad. Mary I do it, so I presume St. Pat's does it too but the numbers are limited, not everyone gets accepted. Helps to be interested in things like sport, music, singing etc. for the interview that has to be done.

Best thing I heard about the post-grad that if you enter with an honours degree, you only need scrape through the course and you'll still get your honours degree bonus when you're out working.

I know literally loads of teachers, as I went to college and work in Limerick, and spent too much time on the lash on Tuesday nights! Anyway, they seem to like it, although it can be stressful when they're dealing with little brats.

Sounding like a real oldie here but it can be a great job if people have a young family. Enroll the children in your school when they're 3 and get free childminding from the state! Just keep them back a year or two in Junior Infants.

That's my rambling.

Mrs. D'arcy

I have lots of friends going down this route as well....lots of them go to England, Strawberry Fields I think. I think that for some people it is a great option but for others its undoubtedly a soft option. One friend with an honours science degree is going over this september...she only graduated last year so hasn't even really investigated what she could do with the science degree. Whatever about secondary teaching, i think primary is a total waste of her abilities. I think people do go for the easy option, job for life without having to really think too much about it. I don't think the job itself is easy just that getting into it is.
Another pet hate of mine is that most of these people can't stand Irish. They'll have to do a conversion course when they come home, don't have particularly good Irish and have no interest in teaching it or getting children interested in it.
Anyway rant over, I'm still jealous of friends who did teaching and now have properly paid jobs while I'm slaving away trying to work and do a masters...better pay off in the long run!

run_Forrest_run

primary school teaching is a soft number relatively speaking and the money is pretty decent if you ask me, what other industry gives you guaranteed pay scales and massive holidays...c'mon, soft out.

yes, a lot of women are entering primary teaching and it has been raised that there is a serious lack of male teachers in primary schools which isn't a good thing either..of course we will pay the price for that in about 10 years time.

Trotter

run_Forrest_run wrote: »

primary school teaching is a soft number relatively speaking and the money is pretty decent if you ask me, what other industry gives you guaranteed pay scales and massive holidays...c'mon, soft out.

So you've taught a class, done the prep every evening, dealt with difficult children, spent some of your holidays on training courses that you have to pay to do, and you came to the conclusion that its a soft number?

That or you really havent a clue what the job is like at all.

The salary scale isnt a good thing.. It starts high enough, and then you're stuck at that level for years.

I really wish people would do some sort of research on jobs before commenting on them.. and I don't mean the "I know a teacher" research. I know an engineer. That doesnt make me an expert in his job, or give me the entitlement to make comments on how difficult his job is.

kippy

I'd have to agree with Trotter.
It is definitly not a soft option. A lot of us who can post/surf boards during "work time" are on far softer options.
If it really is a soft option (relative to what you are doing now) then I suggest you join them.


The holidays/pay are well deserved and as I said not everyone is cut out for it.

RealJohn

I'm a secondary teacher and I used to think that secondary teachers and primary teachers had similar workloads but the more I think about it, I think primary teachers have it much harder in general.

I certainly wouldn't consider it a soft option (and I'm not saying secondary teaching is a picnic either. Trust me, I love it but it's hard work).

run_Forrest_run

yah yah yah, listen, teachers are going to say it is not a soft option, they are used to moaning more than an infant with a belly ache. the fact of the matter is there is a surge of applicants to enter the profession, why is that if it is so hard and difficult??

Also Trotter, big deal if teachers have to do some prep work or do stuff during the holidays, ye aint alone there. Many people in various professions (mine included) had to often work on weekends without receiving a penny extra (no unions protecting us you see), you just do it and be thankful for having the job because as often is the case, the next downturn could mean you are out of a job...something that teachers will never understand given a job for life and all.

And for your info I did no some research into this area...and I still believe it is a soft number compared to other jobs out there today.

kippy

run_Forrest_run wrote: »

yah yah yah, listen, teachers are going to say it is not a soft option, they are used to moaning more than an infant with a belly ache. the fact of the matter is there is a surge of applicants to enter the profession, why is that if it is so hard and difficult??

Also Trotter, big deal if teachers have to do some prep work or do stuff during the holidays, ye aint alone there. Many people in various professions (mine included) had to often work on weekends without receiving a penny extra (no unions protecting us you see), you just do it and be thankful for having the job because as often is the case, the next downturn could mean you are out of a job...something that teachers will never understand given a job for life and all.

And for your info I did no some research into this area...and I still believe it is a soft number compared to other jobs out there today.

No offence, but the surge of applicants is due, in my opinion to a large amount of people who do arts degrees realising that they cant get a job doing much else, coupled with a general downturn in secure decent jobs.

I'm not saying its an ultra easy job. I am saying its not a soft number either. I personally believe I have a softer number mainly because I couldnt imagine myself having the patience to deal with 25+ kids on a daily basis.
We all have the choice of going for the job if we think we'd enjoy it more than what we currently do.
Kippy

Trotter

run_Forrest_run wrote: »

And for your info I did no some research into this area...and I still believe it is a soft number compared to other jobs out there today.

So you've taught a class then? Thats the question I'm asking.


I'm tired of hearing the old "job for life" yarn too. Its not like you're banned from applying for the course to be a teacher. If it appeals to you so much and its so much easier than your own job, than..... go be a teacher.

Here's the info you need! Good luck with your application!
http://www.spd.dcu.ie/main/courses/postgraduate/documents/grad_dip_handbook-07-08_000.pdf

stardust_dublin

Slightly off topic, but i dont think its fair to say the surge of applicants is partly due to a number of people with arts degrees applying because they cant get a job anywhere else. That is simply untrue. Im sick of this whole arts degrees are crap $hite.
My friend was skitting me for having one the other day, just because she did her degree in dcu which is a Bachelor of ARTS in Communications. thats an arts degree aswell. for some reason if you do arts in ucd it's $hit.. :mad:

Also i have a friend with a law degree that is applying to do the post grad in primary teaching so obviously it just appeals to some people. she could go on to do much more but she's choosing not to.

BubbleWrap85

Hello!Just to let you know that I'm a primary teacher and it's not a "soft option". Granted, we do get good holidays, that cannot be scoffed at. However, the amount of stuff we're expected to do, and the different "jobs" we're expected to do as teachers is unreal - psychologist, nurse, mum, babysitter, discipliner along with actually teaching them something!! I'm only new to the profession, but it's goin good for the time being. It is tough though, especially if you have a difficult class. Don't know if I see myself still in school in 40 years time though. Plus, someone said the pay is good. It's fine, considering I'm on a fairly good wage and I'm just out of college. The pay increases are slim though, and it takes many a long year to get to the top of the salary scale. Plus, for most of your day, you've 5 - 12 year olds as company and conversation! Plus, when you're at work, you're at work, no time for dossing on the internet or posting messages on boards !! (At least until after 3 o clock!) Which is more than can be said from many people on here who seem to be on this thing all day, office jobs and what not! But anyhow, I think I've proven my point. No doubt there'll be many quoting me and debating but hey, sure that's part of the fun!

parsi

I've two kids in primary.

I used think teaching was a doddle. Now I realise that it aint the doddle that it appears by any means. Try bringing home one or two of your kids friends and see how that 5% wrecks your head...

run_Forrest_run

Trotter wrote: »

So you've taught a class then? Thats the question I'm asking.


I'm tired of hearing the old "job for life" yarn too. Its not like you're banned from applying for the course to be a teacher. If it appeals to you so much and its so much easier than your own job, than..... go be a teacher.

Here's the info you need! Good luck with your application!
http://www.spd.dcu.ie/main/courses/postgraduate/documents/grad_dip_handbook-07-08_000.pdf

a typical hot headed response from 'a teacher':rolleyes:
no i have not taught a class as I am not a teacher (duh)

who said it appeals to me so much? and no, of course I'm not banned from applying but sure I'm not banned from running for president either but that doesn't mean I would get the role!

quick, I hear the bell ringing, bottoms up with that coffee..a long day ahead

Trotter

run_Forrest_run wrote: »

a typical hot headed response from 'a teacher':rolleyes:
no i have not taught a class as I am not a teacher (duh)

who said it appeals to me so much? and no, of course I'm not banned from applying but sure I'm not banned from running for president either but that doesn't mean I would get the role!

quick, I hear the bell ringing, bottoms up with that coffee..a long day ahead

Im out of this discussion.. all the best.

run_Forrest_run

BubbleWrap85 wrote: »

.. Plus, for most of your day, you've 5 - 12 year olds as company and conversation! Plus, when you're at work, you're at work, no time for dossing on the internet or posting messages on boards !! (At least until after 3 o clock!) Which is more than can be said from many people on here who seem to be on this thing all day, office jobs and what not!

Have you ever stopped to think for a minute that people on boards who are non teachers may actually work different hours instead of the 9-3 that you work?

You also say that it takes a while to get up the salary scale, why not do another job for the 3 months you are off in the summer? Then would be earning two wages for a while anyway...not many people can boast of having that option.
Also in the industry I work in it can take a long time to go up the salary scale also but if one works hard and achieves their goals and objectives and if the forecast is good then an increase might be on the books..perhaps if there was a performance rating system in schools ye might go up the scale faster (cue strike talk from teacher unions!).

whatsgoinon

there is a guy on my course who is a fully trained GP. He decided it wasn't for him and is giving teaching a go. My friend is 26 and is on 42k as a primary teacher.

I don't think anybody can say primary teaching is a soft option unless they have actually spent time in a classroom, know what they day involves.

As for bringing in the performance tables, everytime i pick up a paper over here, there is some inquest or other over headteachers / teachers that have committed suicide over impending inspections. Of course there should be a standard but the pressure teachers are under to reach these standards is unreal.

People seem to think that it is a soft option due to 'early' finish and long holidays, it's not early, I've said before there is a reason for it and that the holidays are well earned.

corcaighcailin9

Oh man I've gotten so mad reading some of the ignorant comments posted here about teaching. I'm not even gonna start quoting some of the BS in this thread that has had my blood boiling. Look it's easy to say we have a cushy number just because of the hours but as has been pointed out, we work far more hours than 9-3. The money is fine but there is little opportunity to supplement our income, it's not like we can sign up for overtime. It's so true about being stagnant on the pay scale and we were ignored in the latest Benchmarking recommendation. Not only do we get abuse from the kids and parents but the amount of bullying and bitching and cliques in every school is incredible. Does this still sound like a soft option?

nesf

corcaighcailin9 wrote: »

Does this still sound like a soft option?

Honestly there are much harder, physically demanding, stressful etc ways of making a living. I don't think teaching is an easy job by any means but I don't think that teachers can claim to have it very hard or to be particularly underpaid. People complaining about it taking years to reach 56K need a reality check to be honest, you don't need to be a good teacher to climb up the salary scale and this will always mean that the good teachers aren't getting a good return for their abilities.

corcaighcailin9

nesf wrote: »

Honestly there are much harder, physically demanding, stressful etc ways of making a living. I don't think teaching is an easy job by any means but I don't think that teachers can claim to have it very hard or to be particularly underpaid. People complaining about it taking years to reach 56K need a reality check to be honest, you don't need to be a good teacher to climb up the salary scale and this will always mean that the good teachers aren't getting a good return for their abilities.

Hey, everyone's entitled to their opinion. Like any other jobs, there are facets of the profession that are frustrating namely the very fact that bad teachers are not weeded out and you are dead right when you say that you don't need to be good at the job to get an increase. It's the same when a school undergoes a Whole School Evaluation (WSE) by the DES. Schools all over the country get into a flap when they get notification of this inspection yet teachers aren't named in the final report whether they are good or bad. Anyway, enough ranting for a Saturday night I reckon

gogsy

raindrops21 wrote: »

I'm just wondering what the big attraction is with primary school teaching as a career. A lot of my friends are in their final year of their arts degrees and all suddenly want to be primary school teachers because they dont know what else to do.

I just don't see what the attraction of the job is - the pay is barely livable and teachers are driven mad by their 30 or more screaming children for 6 hours a day. I can see how the holidays are a bonus (this is why they cant complain about the pay not being very good), and this is also probably why so many middle aged women opt for a career change into the profession.

I honestly think primary school teaching is nothing more than a soft option....Views?

professton please????.....this also applies to run f run

corcaighcailin9

What?????

whatsgoinon

gogsy would like to know what professions raindrops21 and run forest run are in. I'm taking a guess at this.

gogsy

correct!!

corcaighcailin9

Oh thanks I was puzzled there for a while

nesf

gogsy wrote: »

professton please????.....this also applies to run f run

Use proper English. You're setting a bad example for any impressionable youngster reading this thread..

Kinetic^

run_Forrest_run wrote: »

a typical hot headed response from 'a teacher':rolleyes:
no i have not taught a class as I am not a teacher (duh)

Such a stupid response, clearly you know nothing about what they've to deal with.

Trotter wrote: »

So you've taught a class, done the prep every evening, dealt with difficult children, spent some of your holidays on training courses that you have to pay to do, and you came to the conclusion that its a soft number?

Unless you've actually covered what Trotter here has mention rFr, then be quiet. Ever had to deal with kids with ADD/ADHD or other learning disabilites? I give my gf a slagging for having a 5 day week that consists of "half days" but I know that when she's in the classroom and yard she's got her work cut out for her.

corcaighcailin9

Good for you Kenny. As I always tell my other half, it's not about quantity but quality when it comes to our lively discussions about who gets to be more tired at the end of the day

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

run_Forrest_run

gogsy wrote: »

professton please????.....this also applies to run f run

I work in the private IT sector so no point in trying to draw me into an argument of comparisons

corcaighcailin9

Ah sure we can try anyway, rfr

run_Forrest_run

corcaighcailin9 wrote: »

Ah sure we can try anyway, rfr

true, no fun otherwise

jdivision

corcaighcailin9 wrote: »

Look it's easy to say we have a cushy number just because of the hours but as has been pointed out, we work far more hours than 9-3.

Most people work more than their rostered hours in their jobs. they techically work 9-5 and work more than that

corcaighcailin9 wrote: »

The money is fine but there is little opportunity to supplement our income, it's not like we can sign up for overtime. It's so true about being stagnant on the pay scale and we were ignored in the latest Benchmarking recommendation. Not only do we get abuse from the kids and parents but the amount of bullying and bitching and cliques in every school is incredible. Does this still sound like a soft option?

You can't say there's little opportunity to supplement your income when you have three months off. You could do something during that time couldn't you. there's a guy called Gerry Barrett who started doing stuff during the summer in construction. He's worth hundreds of millions now.

you were ignored in benchmarking because you didn't deserve any more money. An independent body that undervalued your pension decided this. What is the problem with that.

there are cliques in every workplace. Did you really enter teaching expecting not to get abuse from kids and parents?

kaji

jdivision wrote: »

Most people work more than their rostered hours in their jobs. they techically work 9-5 and work more than that

You can't say there's little opportunity to supplement your income when you have three months off. You could do something during that time couldn't you. there's a guy called Gerry Barrett who started doing stuff during the summer in construction. He's worth hundreds of millions now.

Wow, he's earned ''hundreds of millions'' during his 3 months off!
Look, what people are trying to say is that teachers work more hours than the 9-3, (but nobody mentioned that other people don't). The work is hard (but nobody said it's harder than any other job). You sound kind of bitter

corcaighcailin9

Look jdivision i'm not gonna get drawn into an argument with you about working hours, benchmarking and/or opportunities to supplement our income. I never said I thought I wouldn't get abuse from parents or colleagues - where did you pull that from?? Anyway, as the previous poster suggested, you do sound like you have your own issues here. I'm not trying to convince anyone that teaching is the hardest job, only that it's not the easiest.
And FYI primary teachers have TWO months off in the summer, not three!

steo123

wot do most teachers do for the 2 months off?head away?work?

nesf

steo123 wrote: »

wot do most teachers do for the 2 months off?head away?work?

Use proper English on this forum please.

whatsgoinon

My sister might go away for a week, the rest of the time she just floats around the place. I'm qualifying in june all going well, have this summer of being as poor as poor can be, then summer 09, south america here I come, I have spent this last 09 months planning where I am going to travel to on my holidays for the next 5 years, can't wait!!

Fruiti

I've just read through some of these posts and I'm smiling to myself imagining what my mum and sister would think (they are both teachers!). I'm not and previously subscribed to the whole "teachers have an easy life" notion - well I worked as a substitute teacher for 3 weeks when my mum was sick (and I was off college) and I would NEVER ever call it an easy job again! It was unbelievably tiring and difficult. Coming home at 3pm I felt like I'd done a 12 hour shift! Children are incredibly demanding and some are extremely nasty. I had no lesson plans to prepare as I just used my mum's - anyone who thinks its a soft option needs their head examined - or better yet, a week in an inner city school with 36 kids in the classroom 7 or 8 of whom have ADHD! Anyway, that's my opinion, and I suppose the other side of it is, some teachers actually love their jobs, so whether it's a soft option or not is irrelevant, it's a vocation for them, not just a job!:)

run_Forrest_run

nesf wrote: »

Use proper English on this forum please.

yes, one is a very bold pupil for not using proper English :rolleyes:

moomoo2007

Ive just finished an arts degree myself and am considering doing the post grad in primary school teaching, anyone doing it at mo, how ye's finding it, or even doing it in uk?