Alfa 166... is this a good deal?

ZV Yoda

Hi folks... I'm a frequent reader, but not so frequent poster on these pages.... I'm looking for some advice on whether this 166 is a good buy...

My current daily driver is a 00 Almera 1.5. I do very low mileage (c. 5k miles/PA) so not overly concerned with fuel efficiency.

http://www.carzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=876877

I spoke with the owner... he's had it since new - as a company car for 4 yrs, then he bought it outright (hence the "one driver, 2 owners" on the ad). Mileage is genuine & backed up with all bills. Full Alfa service history @ Victor Motors & Alasta (who did the belts about 7k miles ago).

Would like to avoid the "Alfas are rubbish/everybody should own an Alfa" debate... I'm looking for genuine advice on this one. I wouldn't dream of it without the service history, but it's a great spec, great colour & very low mileage.

I am an Alfa fan (though have never owned one). Family (i.e. 3 kids) won't allow the GT I'd really like (hence the reason I'm having to sell my MG BGT - if anybody's interested!) & depreciation dictates the 159 will have to wait for another couple of years. I do like the 156's, but I can't get away from the fact that 166 is a lot more car.

So, all things considered, is this a good buy? I'm planning to view this week-end, so looking for advice before I do.
Thanks

bazz26

Seems a bit expensive to me. They can be bought even cheaper than the 156.

Seen a 1999 full spec 166 2.5 V6 tiptronic for sale on www.adverts.ie, asking €800 but it needs a new head gasket but it is driving.

redman

Yes the 166 is a great car, I had a 3ltr V6 one but knew a few with the 2ltr. As it has full service history and the belts are done - great news. Otherwise I'd recommend bringing up to TI Autos to have a once over look.

Of course for the price, like any purchase you should negotiate-7.5k would be better. You do have the option of bring in from the UK the facelifted model from 2003 onwards for the less money. But thats up to you.


I loved the 166, great handling, spacious and looks different from every other car on the road. The depreciation has happened now.

My one caveat is like ALL cars you can have unforseen problems. In the 166 the timing belts and suspension are key things. Small items, the internal air vent covers can break, do check the handling of the wheels(balance/tracking) at speed.

Yours is low mileage. I had one problem with mine where the diff broke and it cost a few quid to replace along with the clutch...but I also had unforseen problems with other cars include BMW 5 series etc...

Seems a beauty , good luck

ZV Yoda

Thanks folks...

I've seen the 2.5 V6s, but didn't want to go there (tax/insurance wise). Also, I don't do enough driving to really justify it. Mind you, a friend of mine had the 2.5 V6 156 with some additional Alfa tweaking and it was some car to drive. A bit noisy... but what a noise. Too fast for me though

I'm looking for a balance between something sporty/different but practical at the same time. I'm not into the hassle of UK imports (not for a car in this price range anyway).

I know there are other '02 cars around for less money, but they've much higher mileage & don't have FSH. Obvioulsy I'd haggle on this one & would be hoping for €7.5-8k. Can't imagine this would be too easy to sell anyway, so probably a buyer's market.

Any other thoughts

alias no.9

Looks like a cracking motor but haggle on the price.

unkel

Nice and all the signs seem set to green. As the others said, try and haggle on the price. But if it was me, I'd be prepared to go the full asking price if it came to that. Alfas in great condition for a reasonable price are scarce and there are people "in the know" out there who'd know good Alfas are bargains

Personally I'd get the 3.0 V6. As you say, your fuel consumption is irrelevant. If you have a full NCB, the difference in insurance is probably only another couple of hundred too. Tax is dear on a 3l car, but they can be had for similar money as the 2l and you get so much more Alfa

FWIW, I had a few drives with the MD of a company in Cyprus (where the roads are way worse than in Ireland) who had a 9 year old 166 3.0 V6 from new. It had 115k miles on it, mainly Nicosia city area driving . Not a rattle on it!

ZV Yoda

Nail on the head Unkel... good Alfas like this are hard to come by.

On the larger engines, I dunno, I just can't justify the extra running costs when my mileage is so low... I only do 6 miles/day, so I'd never really get the car on the open road that often.

Hmm... :rolleyes: am I actually complaining about a short commute? That's a first!

Keep the comments coming - test drive is looking more likely....:cool:

cjt156

That looks an absolute gem. Not the cheapest one around but then you can see exactly where your money is going; FSH, belts done, immaculate inside & out by the looks of it.
I'd buy it myself but my next Alfa is going to be a V6.

mvpr

Gorgeous car. You obviously like it, so why not view and have a chat with the current owner. I'm sure you can come to some arrangement regarding the price.

Best of luck with it anyway - if I could insure it, you might have had a bit of competition on your hands!

redman

one other thing go to http://www.alfaowner.com/
a great UK site with lots of info...

Sandwich

A 166 is a work of art and well worth owning at least once in your life. The badge following sheep, unable to judge a car for themselves might turn up their noses at it, but to the more sophisticated it really is a gem.

Looks like a good one, and while you might get the price down a bit, compared with other cars you might choose its really is very good value even at that.

skyhighflyer

That looks like a lovely example. Not the cheapest, but a cheap Alfa is a false economy. Obviously cherished and the all important belts have been changed. I think it's worth the asking price and I actually prefer the last of the 02 models to the facelifted 03 onwards model.

I'm confused as to why you say you can't justify a 3.0 V6 because of your short commute. I would have thought a short commute would be the best justification for a bigger engine. Still, you can't go wrong with a good example no matter what's under the bonnet.

My current car is a SAAB 9-3 but it will be replaced by an Alfa GT sometime this year, what beautiful cars. There's also a wealth of knowledge on www.alfaowner.com as one poster pointed out. Good luck with the sale if you go through with it.

mickdw

I owned a 1999 166 2.0. Bought with 40000 miles. sold with 97000. Firstly dont buy 5 speed- poorly geared. Mine had various problems. maf sensor 150. Rear wheel bearing 179. Clutch collapse 700- Not due to poor driving. I would suggest changing front suspension as the sump/sump gaurd hits the road on high speed bumps or some speed ramps taken too fast. this lead to cracked sump on mine - 350 + labour. other problems -Rear suspension arm 200. ICS control system stopped working and was quoted 2000 from dealer, however new car battery made it work again. must be sensitive to voltage. Main problem with these cars is that dealers are poor and parts are crazy prices. this is why the cars devalue so much.
Lovely car to drive though and still glad I bought it.
Would recommend yours at about 7000 and keep a repair budget of about 2000. and be prepared to sell it for nothing after 3 years. ICS- radio, aircon phone display sat nav is class when working. beware only original cd changer can be connected 500.

ZV Yoda

Thanks for all the advice folks - I'm taking it for a spin tomorrow, so will let you know how I get on.

galwaytt

+ 2 from here - me and the SO.

Nice colour - much better than silver and red on the 166.

But the absolute best you can get your hands on, and, for low mileage p.a. more toys and less engine is a good combo. Paying monster tax for low mileage will just eat you away and you'll blame the car. The 2.0 is a good compromise.

If at all poss - have you a garage? It'd be nice to keep it........nice !

unkel

galwaytt wrote: »

Paying monster tax for low mileage will just eat you away

You're right, it is very painful the one day of the year you tax your car. But tax is only a minor cost in the grand scheme of things, especially with performance cars

BIG-SLICK-POKER

ALFA = ****e had one b4 al i had was hassle non stop .. cost me a fortune on parts , Just fillin u in . I bought a Bmw after that and i will never look back , Better to spend more as u will save more in long run

Moorsie

for a number of years. Timing belt due to be changed at 45K and plugs at 60K. Big enough jobs. Had little trouble with mine. Air con acted up twice and the power steering went the once. Had for 4 years ( 25K - 75K miles ). Would recommend but personally I think 8.5K is too high a price.

ZV Yoda

Thanks for all the comments folks...

I took it out for a drive last w/e and really liked it. No discernable noises/smoke etc coming from the engine. The car is spotless (even though it hadn't been valeted). FSH paperwork all checked out - a wad of receipts (all Alfa main dealers).

When I arrived, the car had a puncture - he had run over a nail on the way back from the shops that morning. It's in the wall of the tyre, so he's agreed to supply a new one (would have to do this for NCT anyway?)

No underside damage (thanks for the comments about speed bumps!), panel fit as good as you'd expect from an Alfa. Few (if any) bodywork blemishes.

It's the 155BHP 6-speed box & also has the integrated phone.

It's due to be NCT'd this w/e. The were supposedly 3 other prospective buyers out looking the same day (I got there first), so assuming it passes, I've offered the asking price (didn't see the point in risking it for the sake of €500 or so... I doubt there are many of these left in this condition).

Only niggles were the front & rear passenger side electric windows were temperamental. Also, the remote boot release button on the key fob doesn't work.

So, am I mad or what?

skyhighflyer

buy it buy it buy it buy it

galwaytt

oooooh, you jammy git!

I was going to buy it this Sat - bringing the cash'n'all..............

bugger! Start the search again.......:(

It's just that it's so hard to get excited about an.........E-Class......!

ZV Yoda

Sorry 'bout that GalwayTT...

When I get my Alfa 8C :cool: in a couple of years, you can have 1st dibs on the 166

redman

Thats great news, but..

whatever you do, don't let the pressure of the close force you to make a rash decision or stop you negotiating! You can get plenty of nice ones in excellent condition with FSH from the UK for good money.

Be prepared as said earlier to have money/a fund to fix potential problems like any second hand high end executive car.

Take a while, think it through and then stick with your decision.

Best of Luck!

prospect

Well done OP, cracking car, looks great and is a fantastic place to be. Only real bad point is depreciation, but for a clever buck like you, buy a used one and let someone else suffer the hit.

IMO, it is a much nicer car in almost every way to ALL its executive car rivals.

techie

OP go for it, I have an Alfa 147 and the only advice really is check the oil regularly, the Twinspark engine likes oil in normal conditions.

Great car, enjoy driving when you get it, you will find yourself taking the long way home !!!

galwaytt

prospect wrote: »

Well done OP, cracking car, looks great and is a fantastic place to be. Only real bad point is depreciation, but for a clever buck like you, buy a used one and let someone else suffer the hit.

IMO, it is a much nicer car in almost every way to ALL its executive car rivals.

depreciation ? compared to the competition - he's already way ahead. On a € per km basis, it'll probably be the cheapest car he'll ever buy !

galwaytt

ZV Yoda wrote: »

Sorry 'bout that GalwayTT...

When I get my Alfa 8C :cool: in a couple of years, you can have 1st dibs on the 166

....in a couple of years the 8C will be only worth what the 166 is now, anyway - thanks to John Gormley...........

Anan1

galwaytt wrote: »

On a € per km basis, it'll probably be the cheapest car he'll ever buy !

I dunno about that now! Lovely car though, i've always had a soft spot for them and that one looks to be about as good as it gets.

ZV Yoda

When you think about the depreciation all the same...

I just sold my 00 Almera... It cost (as far as I can remember) about €20k new, so it's lost about €16k over 8 yrs.
...approx €2k depreciation/yr

The Alfa cost €45.5k new. So it's lost €37k in 6 years.
...approx €6.5k depreciation/yr:eek:

Scary, isn't it?

I've owned a couple of new cars in the past. This is the oldest one I've ever bought (aside from my '73 MG). I can't imagine ever going back to a new car again.

Horses for courses I suppose... maybe I'll have lots of "I told you so"s when I start posting about problems with the Alfa

prospect

ZV Yoda wrote: »

When you think about the depreciation all the same...

I just sold my 00 Almera... It cost (as far as I can remember) about €20k new, so it's lost about €16k over 8 yrs.
...approx €2k depreciation/yr

The Alfa cost €45.5k new. So it's lost €37k in 6 years.
...approx €6.5k depreciation/yr:eek:

Scary, isn't it?

I've owned a couple of new cars in the past. This is the oldest one I've ever bought (aside from my '73 MG). I can't imagine ever going back to a new car again.

Horses for courses I suppose... maybe I'll have lots of "I told you so"s when I start posting about problems with the Alfa

Too be fair, all executive cars depreciate alot faster than smaller cars.

I know a guy who traded in his 1y/o Merc E-Class and had to put €20K with it for the same car again. that is effectively €20K p/a..... (I know it will slow down each year afterwards, but you get the point).

mickdw

I would advise changing the front suspension to prevent damage if you drive on any back roads anyway fast. My driver side window was also dodgy.... used to get stuck in its running and I would need to help it return to closed position. Triple check that the engine returns to idle quickly and smootly at all times.

ZV Yoda

Thx Mick - I was advised (on here I think) about the low ride hide at the front, so I checked the front underside & no bumps or scrapes on the subframe or sump. I don't drive on any back roads - my daily 6 mile commute is all good roads, but I'll bear that in mind.

Car did return to idle normally, but will check again - what's the potential if this is not the case? There's less than 40k on the clock & it's fully backed up by main dealer invoices/stamps.

Also, did you manage to sort your window? I rarely have passengers in the back, so I'm not too concerned if it's not easiy fixed.

Thanks

RobAMerc

Well done Yoda - that looks a cracking car - my mate bought one with 140k on the clock and has never looked back - its a cracking drive I must say

as galwaytt said - its very hard to get inspired by an e class when you can buy this sort!

mickdw

Didnt get it fixed as it was one of the more minor niggles. On the idle, mine developed a problem were it would stick at 2000 revs at times. got new maf sensor and cleaned out throttle body but was never quite right. I like the cars but lets just say the parts guy in Tractamotors became a little too familiar to me. The clutch im told is borderline in its design and will not take much hardship. The high idle caused problems with my clutch.
At the money you wont buy more car thats for sure but as I said before keep a parts budget and expect to use it. Also 3 years ago dealers were quoting 1400 for timing belt at 70000 mile service. spark plugs are 200+ even at motor factors (8 plugs)

cjt156

Steer well clear of dealers for servicing (with the exception of Alasta Autos - long time service specialist, recently awarded a dealership). In Dublin TI Autos is the way to go, or a trusted independent.
I've changed belts (3 times) and plugs on mine & paid nothing like that money.

Edit to say; congrats on the 166; it looks a gem - enjoy!

galwaytt

ZV Yoda wrote: »

When you think about the depreciation all the same...

I just sold my 00 Almera... It cost (as far as I can remember) about €20k new, so it's lost about €16k over 8 yrs.
...approx €2k depreciation/yr

The Alfa cost €45.5k new. So it's lost €37k in 6 years.
...approx €6.5k depreciation/yr:eek:

Scary, isn't it?

I've owned a couple of new cars in the past. This is the oldest one I've ever bought (aside from my '73 MG). I can't imagine ever going back to a new car again.

Horses for courses I suppose... maybe I'll have lots of "I told you so"s when I start posting about problems with the Alfa

you're missing the point - he's only paying 8.5k. Depreciation up to now is irrelevant.

The absolute worst that can happen is that he writes the car down to, say, 1k, and sells it for parts then. :eek: . Let's say, 3 years? That's 2.5k/yr. If he does high or reasonable, mileage, that'll be cheap. With low mileage, it'll be reasonable, but there again it'll be worth more than 1.5k at the end......still no worse (really) than your Almera. Plus, the sum total of his loss is 7.5k You've lost 16k on your Nissan.

Win-Win, it seems to me for the Alfa.

Hey, why aren't we all doing this?

Oh, sorry.........I am !!

ZV Yoda

Hey TT, I am the OP - I sold my Almera to buy the Alfa...

I was illustrating your point exactly... Alfa depreciation has already happened, so even assuming servicing etc is more expensive than the Almera, I'm (hopefully) still quids in.

Anybody any recommendations on Alfa mechanics in the Leixlip/Celbridge/Nth Kildare area?

I've heard Alfa dealers aren't great in general. The 166 was serviced in Alasta, so sounds like that's good news. A few people have mentioned that TI are great - where are they located?

FWIW, the Almera has a FNSH... the last service cost me €745 at a main dealer. Timing chain in the Almera cost €700 too.... so not exactly cheap either..

cjt156

TI are in Smithfield (north inner city) Alasta are in South Lotts (south, near the canal) both are easy enough for you to access, even if not nearby.

RobAMerc

ZV Yoda wrote: »

Timing chain in the Almera cost €700 too.... so not exactly cheap either..

Can I ask why this needed to be done ?

Lex Luthor

you should consider going to England if you are after a 166. I would if I was looking for one....

this one is a beaut

http://www.veloces.co.uk/reg/51JXHEH

Harrybelafonte

You're making a great choice with the 166. I've had mine for over 2 years now, but if I could just warn you about a couple of things

1. Be prepared for a slagging for owning an Alfa
2. Always have a little bit of spare cash for the emergencies, they may not happen but presume they will and it makes ownership a bit more pleasurable to be prepared. If she breaks down, there's nearly always a simple explanation.
3. Don't throw her around any twisties yet after coming from the Almera, get used to her first. They're a little bit arse heavy and can slip from under you when pushed.
4. Check the oil, check the oil, check the oil. Everytime you fill her up check the oil, seriously. Carry the stuff in the boot with you. Some burn the stuff, others don't, pay attention until you get to know her better.

Most of all enjoy ownership. That's a good price for a Sportivo with such low milage.

Keep an eye on alfaowner.com to learn about sorting out some of the niggles that may appear.

galwaytt

only reason the 166 caught my eye was the interior colour, and the price.

Mind you, Veloces also have this ....mmmmm........

unkel

RobAMerc wrote: »

Can I ask why this needed to be done ?

You rightly ask why, because most timing chains never need being replaced. The answer is that Almeras of that kind of age seem to have a problem with the timing chains. I've heard of many people reporting they had to replace them

Back O/T, some quality posts from owners. To make a wee bit of a generalisation - Alfas can be had for very little money, especially in this country. You get an incredible level of style, beauty and performance for your money, but TLC needs to be applied

Wanna buy an Alfa? Prepare to be an Alfa owner. Do it properly - take the maintenance on the chin but most of all, enjoy! Life's too short, etc.

richardsheil

Well done to original poster.

166 is a great car.

I have had mine a year and a half now and when I got it changed the MAF and handbrake cables. Changed the belts just before Christmas which cost about 250 (did it myself)

Now 16000 miles later all I have had to do is change the oil and keep on running.

Quality is great.

Good luck

eamon234

Have you sold the MGB yet OP? Any details on it? That 166 is a beauty by the way happy motoring.

ZV Yoda

Thanks for all the comments about the Alfa folks... I'll keep them all in mind.

I've joined Alfa Owners.com already - they know their stuff!

MGB not sold yet.. see my ad - has warts and all details. No minter, but priced accordingly & will put a smile on your face when you're behind the wheel



http://www.adverts.ie/showproduct.php?product=35346&cat=2

Lex Luthor

galwaytt wrote: »

only reason the 166 caught my eye was the interior colour, and the price.

Mind you, Veloces also have this ....mmmmm........

Veloces do have some v nice cars every now and again

ZV Yoda

Well, I took the plunge & bought the 166 this week. Been driving it for a few days now & haven't stopped smiling.

It's absolutely mint inside & out, has new tyres, only 37.6k miles (with all receipts) & is NCT'd till Feb 2010.

Happy days!!

redman

ZV Yoda, I am delighted for you ! Many happy miles driving!!

ZV Yoda

Cheers - great avatar BTW

cjt156

That is an absolute gem; hope it gives you many happy miles of motoring.