What is it like? (App. Comp / Comp. Forensics)

stick-dan

so you've made you mind up then?

coadyj

jakedixon2004 wrote: »

sounds like fun
I will defo do that course in cisco anyway it will be a huge benefit i the future

CCNA is a load of ****, unless your going to do deskside support which you can do without a degree nobody is going to care.

"Wow you know what a rooter is, omg your so smart"

As for java and the industry you guys could not be more wrong, java is completely platform independent which means is has api's to run on phones, webservers, pc's and even on xbox's. digital convergence was the biggest thing to hit IT in the last few years and would not have happened without java.

as far as job in java when your finished well http://www.jobs.ie/Jobs.aspx?Categories=&Regions=&Keywords=java&Submit=Search

also if you cant learn java, then you will never be able to program at all. its fundamentally the simplest OO language. And kev i wasnt always good a programming, my first year in trinity i was ****, I just sat down and went threw all all the assignments and it came to me, but be warned, most people dont get it.

coadyj

jakedixon2004 wrote: »

do u have to secure networks and stuff in the course or is it more complicated than that

not at first, but yeah obviously its harded the WEP and WPA.

for example you may know about router security, but do you know the theory? you may have an idea about what a network is but do you know about topologies, ieee standards? and that just basic 1st year stuff.

You would want to be good at maths too.

Sully

Didn't you do ****e in your interview with Google when it came to networks James?

I still stand by my statement that Java in the course IS intense, and its a matter of you either like it or hate it. I don't mind Java to much, but I warm more to PHP.

stick-dan

James you're terrible bitter about the course aint ya. :P

CCNA is a good starter point if you would rather not wait until third semester to do networking.

Sully

Bare in mind, that CCNA is pretty much everything you do in Networking in 1st and 2nd year. The notes are practically the same.

jakedixon2004

I never knew that there would be Maths involved in networking (that shows u how much i know about it)
As for that cisco course, I thought it would be vital for a career in networking

I am definentily going to WiT providing I get the B1 in Maths and the 360 points requirded for the course

Sully

Im not to sure what Maths James is on about, but there is very little Maths involved in the course right up until 3rd year at least.

Cisco is a recognised course, and I would suggest you do it if you want a career in networking. Doing it via WIT is time consuming but cheaper.

coadyj

i didnt mean maths in CCNA, i mean in the degree you need to be good at maths. sorry for the confusion.

now although i do know kev to be the guru of all things WIT i will say that i know a lot of people who work in IT, and i working in IT myself for a few years and I or any of my friends have ever been asked weather we had the ccna.

AHH but james, your a programmer i hear you say. true but most of the people i went to college with ended up in networking. My mate did the Microsoft networking administrator exam, but it was a lot more intense then the ccna.

I would like to see the college offering the sun cert and the msad ect so sully get on that.

A friend of mine works in ibm without a degree as a desk side support person and he is thinking about doing the ccna. but only because he has nothing else to show. and i still think its a waste of time.

and btw, if i did so bad in the google interviews then how come
:):)

(I turned them down too.)

Hi James,

I hope that you are well, I have just received great news overnight that everything has been approved for your internship.

What happens next?
You will receive two copies of your contract, one via email (to allow you to read through and ask any questions) and one by post. Please contact me the moment that you have received and read through your contract (email) so that if you have any questions I can address them. If you are happy with everything then we need to start your work permit application as soon as possible.

Questions/not heard?
If you have any questions at all or haven't heard from us regarding your placement please do contact me as soon as possible (contact details below)

Its great news, we just need to make sure that all of the final elements are organised now!

Well done!

Alex
xxxxxxxxx@google.com
+44 207 03x xxxx

jakedixon2004

So what type of Maths/Physics is there in the degree

Sully

coadyj wrote: »

i didnt mean maths in CCNA, i mean in the degree you need to be good at maths. sorry for the confusion.

In Applied Computing / Forensics? I'm not that good at Maths or Physics and its what held me back, but I got thought most of it now thank god - only one more and all is back to normal. Id imagine the OP is good at Maths?

now although i do know kev to be the guru of all things WIT i will say that i know a lot of people who work in IT, and i working in IT myself for a few years and I or any of my friends have ever been asked weather we had the ccna.

AHH but james, your a programmer i hear you say. true but most of the people i went to college with ended up in networking. My mate did the Microsoft networking administrator exam, but it was a lot more intense then the ccna.

Fair enough, its what we were told about the CCNA. I think its a very useful course either way.

I would like to see the college offering the sun cert and the msad ect so sully get on that.

I would like to see the college offer more Web Dev. courses, and move around languages more - rather then sticking with Java. I agree, these courses on offer would be great. I think they have a nice handy deal with Cisco & Microsoft, which is probably why we don't see more being offered - open source technologies, different certs etc.

and btw, if i did so bad in the google interviews then how come
:):)

(I turned them down too.)

I meant in regards to your networking questions they asked you - if I recall, you had difficulty with basics? Anyway James, you know full well you have the experience and intelligence to pick up a job like that - with or without networking knowledge!

Sully

jakedixon2004 wrote: »

So what type of Maths/Physics is there in the degree

2 years of both - maybe more depending on the stream you pick.

The Maths & Physics in Forensics is the same as those covered in the Applied Computing course - you will be mixed with them for those (and other) subjects.

stick-dan

jakedixon2004 wrote: »

So what type of Maths/Physics is there in the degree

Physics in the course is simple to be honest because i just about passed my junior cert physics. It was my weakest subject in secondary school but i found it simple enough in college. The physics is split down the middle. You have a double practical every week that is manditory to attend, miss two of them and you fail but generally people enjoy the practicals. The practicals have to be logged each week and handed up for assessment at the end of the year. The physics consists of gravity theory,electromagnetism and kinetics and lasers:D in first year first semester.

You don't have physics in second semester.

In third semester you have digital electronics. It is a tedious module but if you apply the effort is easily passed.Digital Electronics consists of looking into diodes,transistors, conductivity theory,looking at binary counters, multiplexers,demultiplexers, decoders, karnaugh maps, playing with a multi-processor thats mainly it. The practicals in digital electronics are not as good as failing components are annoying but after we complained this year we were assured it wouldn't happen again. Again a log book has to be completed and assessed for the practicals.

Maths in first year is ok. It is about differentiation, integration, complex numbers,sets,functions,enumeration,simpsons rule,logic,etc. Basically first year maths is like leaving certificate applied maths.Not too bad.It all depends on your lecturer. Some people have different view on the lecturers.

Second year maths is easier in my opinion. Differential Equations, Integrals,vectors,scalars,transformations,rotations,eigen vectors and eigen values etc.Then i fourth semester in second year you have statistics which i ma in at the moment and trust me i dont need to tell you what that is about you did that in first year.;)

You'll be fine. Are the points 360 this year??

stick-dan

Sully i know you are the moderator but i am pretty sure jakedixon2004 would like to hear more about the course and less about you two debating.:):D;):rolleyes:

might i suggest you two being more direct.

Sully

stick-dan banned. Nah your right, we went of topic there. Iv posted whats on the courses a few times, and given a good bit of info - give a search and you should be able to find. I wont repeat myself, so I just gave you a summary

jakedixon2004

Thanks for all the help
I took physics in Leaving Cert thinking that I would need it but by the sounds of it I dont
I think it is 360 points but i am not sure

stick-dan

If you do physics in the leaving cert you will be fine. I took no science subject in the leaving cert. Have you decided which one you will choose. Forensics or Applied Computing.

jakedixon2004

I am going to do Forensics
What type of jobs can u get after the course

stick-dan

here's a hint, go to any of the major jobs sites and look up anything to do with computer security,.You could join the fraud squad,any anti-virus/malware prohibiting company,e.g norton.

There is also "exciting new developments in the forensics scenes and the guards apparently are expanding into this section as cyber crime becomes and increasing problem.

In special cases the CSI and FBI do hire for internet security and computer probing personnel.But this is a long shot unless you are very determined:)

England is expanding big at the moment in the area of cyber crime prevention and internet security and fraud so you will not be left for a job.

I have only named a fraction of the jobs here. No doubt James and sully will inform you more:)

Unfortunately as is misinterpretated there is no herratio kaine in the course, no speed boats, analyzing blood samples etc.:)

coadyj

You can get into two side of forensics

Security or Investigation, not too much of the latter in ireland, but security is pretty big, they say over 25% of irish companys lost over €100,000 from hackers, so obviouly its something they want to crack down on.

You could also go the other way and see it as a IT degree, which it basicaly is and you could get into networking, programming or even support(but that is like the worst job you can get)

My advice to you is to spend first year completly focused on programming, It may seem like a lot of work but belive me it will be worth it in the end. Dont mind these guys when they say java isnt good, its the best and easyist language to learn by far. I can garantee that you will never be able to learn c/c++ if you cant get java.

Anyway, good luck with the course.

jakedixon2004

I was expecting a job as something to do with computer/network security alright
Does anyone know if there is a work placement during the course
I would really love to learn how to programme in c or java but when i look at either of them it looks very hard .... I was able to learn python by myself but it is a very easy language to learn anyway

coadyj

dont worrie about c, nobody uses that anymore

If you can pick up python then java should be a breeze, But when you say you know it do you mean you have an understanding or could you tell me what a stack it?

I would think anyone who understood python should pick up java very quick.
p is a Object-Oriented language so is java. has all the same properties of java as in for, if, else, while

dlofnep

Programming looks tough at first glance because it's something new and the logic appears different to anything you've seen before.

But you'll be gradually edged in, so don't worry about it. You start with the complete basics and work your way up. Java is an easy language to learn and very intuitive. You just need to spend a little time with it. C is a little tougher.. the learning curve isn't that tougher, but you self manage memory and don't have OOB benefits. If you really want tough, wrap your head around ASM - but I'm sure assembly programmers will say the same thing to me

There are various areas of security that anyone can look at.

Network/System security. - As advertised.
Application security - requires strong programming ability.
Web security - Have an intricate understanding of various scripting languages and database flaws.

And so forth. IT sec is a broad field, but the best can cater to all fields. Freelance security experts can make a bomb. Network admins have secure jobs, with varying ranges of workloads. Web or Application testing is for the wicked! It's a tough field and you really have to be up to date with all common flaws and vulnerabilities and understand the intricacies of them.

Personally, I think Comp Forensics looks to be an amazing course and if I could turn back the clock, I'd probably do that instead of Multimedia. I think you'll enjoy it and the demand for those doing it is high. Go for it

stick-dan

appartently i asked some of them but they seem to be unaware largely of it at the moment probably because they are the first year class at the moment and the first to do the course since it was run independently.The comman concensus is that there is indeed work placement in computer forensics in third year but a quick look through the waterford it website will tell you exact what is entailed in the course.

jakedixon2004

What kind of stuff would u do in first year?
Also.. would there be people goin into this course not knowing how to turn on a computer:p and slowing up the show

Sully

jakedixon2004 wrote: »

What kind of stuff would u do in first year?

Which course? There both similar but have differences!

Also.. would there be people goin into this course not knowing how to turn on a computer:p and slowing up the show

I really would not recommend anybody with no experience of computers to go to this course - mainly the Applied Computing one. You will find it extremely difficult. The two courses are very similar as I said, and if you didn't know anything about PC (like turn it on) you would be holding yourself back and putting yourself under a lot of stress.

In such a case, I would do some sort of PC training course first to get you up to speed, and ask yourself is an IT Course really for you? Most people going to these courses have an interest in IT!

jakedixon2004

I was talkin about the Forensics course

stick-dan

Semester 1 of forensics as i know it but don't quote me consists of the following.

Physics - This module is ok if you like physics and consists of electromagnetism, energy,playing with lasers , sound physics.Vectors,scalars, distances and gravity.Was fun enough i enjoyed it and i don't like physics.

Programming - This is the introduction to the rest of your course,i.e java. Your enjoyment of this particular section depends on your lecturer. This years current crop of first years had a great lecturer whom i envy them because they had. This module requires alot of work so it does. Not to be put on the back burner till the last minute. If you find yourself struggling there are two helpful years of students above you so don't hesitate to ask us. You are required to complete at least one program construction project.

Maths - Again depends on the lecturer. Some people have their different opinions about the lecturers and it all depends on how well you want to do at maths. Mathematics is by no means hard and just completing the exercises on examples by the end of the week will go a great deal towards passing your exams.

Thinking and learning - Loved by most, hated by few. This is the subject that really has no significance in the course in my opinion but hey you gotta pass it! Basically is all about changing your way of thinking and all.Nothing at all to worry about by any means.Attendance would merit a pass.:)

Computer Essentials.- Brace yourself for this you learn all about how to use ms word, ms power point. You learn the difference between a mouse and a keyboard, etc. Is basically the basics of computers. Not hard.This is where you will get your "first" look into binary and how to add,subtract,divide it. Touts complement and all that. Not hard with basic study. This course this year coming will see the introduction of a new lecturer as the woman that was teaching it is gone to Canada on work experience. Structure may change.

Introduction to forensics.- If it is anything like i am doing now you will be looking at encryption in small detail, maintaining a site of current breakthroughs in forensics,yup make your own site for this, looking at CSI surveys, etc. But this may be second semester for you as the current first years only started most of that this semester. looking into the history of the forensics will be the most likely curriculum.

_______________________________________________________________

As for will there be basic people in the class holding you back you'll always find that there is and that about two weeks of every semester at the start is dedicated to a common grounding in the subject so as to speak.You may have to watch out for people who think they know it all but no nothing at all except for a few nifty keyboard short-cuts that temporarily WOW you.

_______________________________________________________________

Hope that helps, Don't take it as gospel though.

jakedixon2004

Thanks a million man ..this is loads of help
I cant wait to get the leaving over and done with so i can get crackin on this course.
Is there a computer club or Society in the college

stick-dan

jakedixon2004 wrote: »

Thanks a million man ..this is loads of help
I cant wait to get the leaving over and done with so i can get crackin on this course.
Is there a computer club or Society in the college

Not really any society there this year lad.There was a gaming society in the college up to last year but it for some reason was not continued this year although two lads in our class were going to restart it but one of them quit the course . There is definitely interest from some of this years first years and some second years so odds are it will be up and running again next year.It was the Wit gamers society or something like that and i think they organised lans and the like or so i believe. Trust me there are plenty of people in the course who like to do that stuff in their spare time unlike us normal students who have work to do. pm me if you have any questions.