Advice for marathon novices - what I wish I knew then!

--amadeus--

A lot of teh people who come on a board like this are probably looking for advice as they prepare for thier first race. I know that the help I recieved online was invaluable. But a lot of people are shy about asking, so here are a few things I have learned (or wished I knew then). Feel free to add your own!

First - you are unique, just because someone else is doing 22 mile runs wearing a pair of underpants on thier head and tehy have a mara PB of 2:20 doesn't mean that that is right for you. Lots of people will give you advice about distance training, refueling, clothes, etc. 99% of this is based on personal experience. Listen to it all, try if it sounds resonible but if it doesn't work then move on. EG I hate gels so I never use them and no number of people raving about them will ever make me try them again.

First Part Two- Buy lots of salt. You'll need this because every piece of advice you get should be taken with a grain of salt! Running is deceptivly simple so everyone and his aunt have an opinion. I was once given a pile of suicidally stupid and incorrect advice at a gym by an instructor who wrapped up by asking "how long is the marathon anyway?". Judge the value of teh advice by teh experience of teh person giving it.

Three - Don't take teh training program too seriously. It's vital that you train properly for the marathon but don't get obsessive. If you wake up and you have a pain in your knee then resting may be better than running just because the schedule says so. Listen to your body - if it says rest then rest. This doesn't mean slob out, just that you should adopt some flexability. Likewise if you plan to run 6 and end up running 5 then don't try and add the extra mile on to your next run.

Three Part Two - Consistancy is the key. I personally don't think that the volume of training makes that much difference to a first marathon. Train regularly, do a long run per week and get in teh habit of running. A missed run here or there won't hurt but a phantom pain every long run day leading to lots of missed runs will effect you on the day. Expect some discomfort during training, twinges, stiffness and fatigue are par for teh course.

Five - Enjoy it! Running is a hobby, not a job. If you dread the training sessions then you need to look at your schedule, vary things a bit. Instead of teh same runs on teh same routes every day vary distance, routes and speeds. Find a running partner (I use my dog )And most of all enjoy the marathon. Thousands of people will be lining the route (especially on big races) cheering for you and wishing that they had the strength, fitness and willpower to do what you will be. So lap it up!

hunnymonster

Great post Amadeus.

Some of my own.

Set a goal
Not everyone agrees with me but I don't like to hear "I just want to finish". Set a time, even if this time is 8 hours. After all noone sets out to not finish.

buy good shoes
My partner ran too many marathons, on too little training in bad shoes. Now he barely walk and is only 32. Good gear is also a worthy investment, particularly sports bra's for women.

remember everyone else
If you're new to running, suddenly 5-20 hours of your week have just disappeared. Your partner, children, dog, laundry, chores,...... have not disappeared. Try to remember they need time too.

(as amadeus said) Enjoy your first marathon.
You only ever get a first marathon once, enjoy it, smile to the crowds, take your time crossing the finish line, take a perverse pleasure in legally dropping empty water bottles at the road side, make sure you are running when you pass the official photographers, limp proudly into work the day afterwards. When people enquire if you've hurt yourself, enjoy telling them no, you just ran a marathon. There are some very special races out there but nothing compares with finishing your first marathon.

Racing Flat

Amadeus,
Can you tell us anymore about the underpants on the head regime? I've been struggling to knock the minutes off, so willing to try anything...


Great post btw, +1

--amadeus--

Racing Flat wrote: »

Amadeus,
Can you tell us anymore about the underpants on the head regime? I've been struggling to knock the minutes off, so willing to try anything...

I stumbled across the fabled "underpants on head" method when living with teh Massai tribe in deepest africa. I was having a great deal of difficulty with my running at the time. More specifically when cornering where I just couldn't get traction when going around corners. In fact my feet were slipping all over the place.

So I approached a tribal elder and asked him for advice. He told me.....





..."keep an eye on your skid marks!"

ditpoker

this thread is a great read so far!

sticky!?

Racing Flat

I would recommend the book 'The Competetive Runners Handbook' by Bob Glover as a great read for someone as they are planning/preparing for the first marathon. Not too technical but gives all the right information and very comprehensive.

hunnymonster

you've recommended that book a couple of times and I certainly want to get hold of it but I would be concerned by the title. Most of us will never be competitive at marathons let alpong our first time out at the distance.

eclectichoney

I am nearly finished The Runner's Handbook by Bob Glover and it is great for beginners (like me!) so might be a better place to start for first-timers??

Racing Flat

hunnymonster
Glover categorises runners into categories such as beginners, intermediate, advanced, local champion, semi-elite, elite based on race or predicted race times and then goes through requirements and training plans for all. Being relatively new to the sport myself and having read a lot of running books, I think Glover is the best, as I said, comprehensive, but not too technical. Whereas other good books e.g. Jack Daniels, Seb Coes dad's book, Tim Noakes are very technical, so Glover is the best for a beginner. I suppose everyone's competetive - if you are doing your first marathon, you are competing just to finish / break 5 hours or whatever, just like Haile is competing to break 2.04 in Dubai;) so don't let the title put you off. Most people I run with have read it a few times - I've not got to that stage yet...

Racing Flat

Hunnymonster,
True, most of us will never be competetive in marathons - but you are! 3rd in Connemara, that's fairly competetive if you ask me! See the local champion section of Glover;)

Dinkie

Having taken up running this year, my big advise would be:

If your injured, don't push your self to keep to your training schedule. Its o.k. to do less. Managed to injure myself badly this year by trying to keep to my running schedule when I was injured.

HardyEustace

Always have at least two pairs of shoes on the go.

If you have only one pair of shoes and something happened to them the night before/morning of the marathon you'd be in big trouble.

hunnymonster

HardyEustace wrote: »

Always have at least two pairs of shoes on the go.

If you have only one pair of shoes and something happened to them the night before/morning of the marathon you'd be in big trouble.

This is good advice on several fronts. If (like me) you went for a lunchtime run today, your trainers are likely to be out of action for up to 48 hours while they dry out. It was miserable out there! I always have at least 2 pairs of trainers for running in. When they retire from running, they become gym shoes for a while and finally get used to walk to work in before giving them to charity. I keep meaning to start logging how many miles are on each pair but I've been far too lazy so far.

tunney

I used to be a great man for multiple pairs of shoes and rotating them etc etc.

Now I just have one pair of lightweight racers that i use for all my running year road. Stuff newspaper in them after a runner and off you go. I replace them when there they fall apart

How Strange

Speaking of running shoes - I saw lifestyle had women's kayano's for €105 last weekend. I'm broke at the moment it makes no difference to me.

I'm new to running myself - I've done up to 11k. I went out on Saturday and could only do 9k, went out Monday and was wiped at 4k. Going out again tonight and hopefully will do better.

Planning on doing the 5mile in Raheny, then a half marathon in Holland on Easter weekend and then the 10k in Phoenix Park at beginning of April. My longterm goal is the Dublin marathon but I'm not going to start training for that now. At present I just want to build up my miles slowly. I try to go out 4 times a week but this bloody weather (rain and wind) isn't exactly enticing.

Do you reckon running on a threadmill is as good as running outdoors?
I get so bored on them but I suppose it may be necessary over the next couple of months considering the weather.

macinalli

How Strange wrote: »

Do you reckon running on a threadmill is as good as running outdoors?
I get so bored on them but I suppose it may be necessary over the next couple of months considering the weather.

I don't know about others but I just can't run on treadmills. About 20 minutes and I need to stop; nothing in particular, I just think they're incredibly uncomfortable to run on. As for wind and rain - the best cure is a decent jacket and some company. Also good for increasing distance - you don't really notice the miles if you're too busy chatting!

hunnymonster

How Strange wrote: »

Do you reckon running on a threadmill is as good as running outdoors?
I get so bored on them but I suppose it may be necessary over the next couple of months considering the weather.

I'm one of a rare bunch of runners who doesn't discourage people from running on the "dreadmill". In fact I trained exclusively on one for my first couple of marathons.

I still use them occasionally, for example last week I did 8x800m at marathon race pace off 200m recovery. I knew if I went outside to do this I would slack. You can't cheat the machine (though the machine can cheat you, never believe how many calories it tells you, you are using)

Having said that, I now try to do most of my running outdoors as I find it much more enjoyable. As has already been said, There is no such thing as bad weather, just the wrong clothes. Part of running is mental, getting out there when the weather is awful prepares you for anything.

How Strange

hunnymonster Quote:..There is no such thing as bad weather, just the wrong clothes. Part of running is mental, getting out there when the weather is awful prepares you for anything

Yeh hunnymonster, I think I need to get over the 'oh its raining out so I can't go for a run' mentality. It's just so hard on a night like tonight when its absolutely lashing and freezing cold.

brutes

Yes its all mental or 80% is in marathon running anyway - in bad weather like this and as forecast, its very difficult to get started - even if you have a few under your belt like me!. But once you are out and have the first two miles done , you will genuinely find the weather becomes background noise and you really dont notice it - honestly!. It is a great feeling and excellent motivator to get the training done and you will feel much stronger physically and mentally for having done training in poor conditions - a good rainjacket and quick shower after and youll be right ...

Clum

hunnymonster wrote: »

Part of running is mental.

The wife reckons it's all mental! Seeing me coming home night after night freezing and soaking she thinks I'm completely mad...

How Strange

hey brutes, you are totally right. I'm a wuss But I'll get myself out there no matter what the weather from next week.

--amadeus--

I'm doing a frankenstein and bringing an old thread back to life...

The original point of this thread was to let people who had done a few races pass on thier experiences to first timers. Well we are now fast approaching the point where training builds to a peak and races start to get run. The Seville marathon has already been and gone and while there aren't many marathons in March we have Rotterdam, London, Paris, Stockholm and, of course, Connemara closing in fast. Lot's of people planning marathons may also be running thoer first ever 10K or half's over teh next few weeks.

So I thought I'd bring this back up and see if anyone has any race day advice to pass on? I have some but I don't want to put up a mega long post so I'll wait and see if there is any interest in the thread before writing my essay!

geld

It took me five marathons to realise that you have to go slow at the start. This is a serious distance and you need to conserve your energy. That for me is the best advise that I wish I knew then that I know now.

Other things such as enjoy your first marathon - you'll never run one again and have a training plan and as best you can stick to it.

JustMe1982

I was talking to someone and said i dont know if i can imagine myself running for over 3 hours. She said as a first timer i will be going close to 6 hours. :eek:

I dont know if i can do this!!!

HardyEustace

JustMe1982 wrote: »

I was talking to someone and said i dont know if i can imagine myself running for over 3 hours. She said as a first timer i will be going close to 6 hours. :eek:

I dont know if i can do this!!!

That's utter rubbish.

Now this could be a wild guess but I'll bet this "someone" hasn't run a marathon.

JustMe1982

Well she was in traing last year and did all the adidas race series but got injured for the marathon last year so couldnt do it but what she was saying was as a first timer you dont usually run the whole thing, you have a lot of walking.

I know i wont be running the whole thing!

HardyEustace

JustMe1982 wrote: »

Well she was in traing last year and did all the adidas race series but got injured for the marathon last year so couldnt do it but what she was saying was as a first timer you dont usually run the whole thing, you have a lot of walking.

I know i wont be running the whole thing!

Utter rubbish... I hadn't run a step before April and ran the whole thing and finished just under four and a half hours. All this while I was still a dedicated smoker.

However, if you think you won't be running the whole thing then you won't be running the whole thing.

To be honest, it's not beyond the realms of possibility that "someone" is a bit jealous and doesn't want to think that you'll do better than them. I'd find someone a bit more positive as a mentor.

Not that I've masses of experience but if someone was genuinely interested - I'd be far more positive and affirming about their ability to run a marathon and would stress how pleasant the whole experience is.

And I'm slow.... lots of people run their first marathon in 3:30 to 4:00 hours sometimes even faster.

I'm quite cross with this "someone" giving out such negative advice.

Highway_To_Hell

Why not run the whole marathon, that was one of my goals for my so far only marathon (DCM 08). between now and October there is plenty of time to build up the distance and if you follow a structured program it will have you running 20+ miles before the event by slowly increasing the mileage each week and this gives you the confidence to know you can do it.

In Jan 08 I could not run more then 500 meters without stopping, in Oct I ran every step of the marathon.

I would think that 6hrs for a marathon would have you walking 75-80% of the distance.

TFBubendorfer

How Strange wrote: »

Do you reckon running on a threadmill is as good as running outdoors?
I get so bored on them but I suppose it may be necessary over the next couple of months considering the weather.

You do not need to run on a treadmill in Ireland, ever. Rain should not stop you from running (what do you do if it's raining on marathon day? Cancel the whole thing?), and the wind isn't that bad 363 days of the year.

If you prefer running on a treadmill in bad weather then go right ahead, but it definitely is not a necessity.

dermCu

I'll tell you what I wish I knew then.........

Your nipples are small (mine are anyway!!) but my god they can cause you a lot of pain if they get chafed.
Even if they haven’t been a problem on long runs protect them somehow for the marathon.
The same goes for vaseline around sensitive areas. I won’t forget that lesson.

The moral of the story: your long run isn’t just a long run; it’s also a dress rehearsal for the race.

Running Bing

Are treadmills easier to run on than outdoors?


I only ever ran on one once but it felt very easy compared to outdoors.

When I think about it outdoors you are actively pushing yourself forward where as on a treadmill its more just going with it, moving your legs. Surely there is a difference?

Magnet

eat lots and lots and lots of fruit in the week before the marathon then none whatsoever in the 3 days lead up to marathon day!

Took me 4 marathons to figure that one out

JustMe1982

Magnet wrote: »

eat lots and lots and lots of fruit in the week before the marathon then none whatsoever in the 3 days lead up to marathon day!

Took me 4 marathons to figure that one out

why none before?
And it may be a stupid question but whey lot and lots the week before?

JustMe1982

HardyEustace wrote: »

And I'm slow.... lots of people run their first marathon in 3:30 to 4:00 hours sometimes even faster.

I'm quite cross with this "someone" giving out such negative advice.

Maybe she is REALLY slow and does a lot of walking during her training.

If i can run 10 mins id be happy at the moment. ive honestly only just been talked into this. All i can do is try, its not even in my head yet that i can do this

RJC

Magnet wrote: »

eat lots and lots and lots of fruit in the week before the marathon then none whatsoever in the 3 days lead up to marathon day!

Took me 4 marathons to figure that one out

I'm guessing that this is due to the need to keep the 'roughage' down in the last few days.

I think the key to a good marathon (and exam and job interview) is to have the world's biggest dump on the morning of the race (if not a world record then at least a PB). This will set you up for a decent run and you know your level of nervous 'arousal' is at the right level.

My advice (that I wish I knew before) is to practice running with a full gel belt - otherwise you will chaff the hips off yourself. - I now run with it tucked into my shorts so it doesn't bounce all over the place.

I remember a guy at last years cork city marathon who had his breakfast, lunch and dinner on his fuel belt - gels held on with safety pins, mcvities digestives, drinks and so on. He had never tested it in training and he had stuff falling off all over the shop (and that was just at mile 2).

Also -

tape your nipples (men)

write significant times on your arm in biro - for example - 10 miles in 1 hr 20 min or whatever your goal is. This can set your mind at ease if you are unsure of your pace later.

shels4ever

RJC wrote: »

I'm guessing that this is due to the need to keep the 'roughage' down in the last few days.

I think the key to a good marathon (and exam and job interview) is to have the world's biggest dump on the morning of the race (if not a world record then at least a PB). This will set you up for a decent run and you know your level of nervous 'arousal' is at the right level.

My advice (that I wish I knew before) is to practice running with a full gel belt - otherwise you will chaff the hips off yourself. - I now run with it tucked into my shorts so it doesn't bounce all over the place.

I remember a guy at last years cork city marathon who had his breakfast, lunch and dinner on his fuel belt - gels held on with safety pins, mcvities digestives, drinks and so on. He had never tested it in training and he had stuff falling off all over the shop (and that was just at mile 2).

Also -

tape your nipples (men)

write significant times on your arm in biro - for example - 10 miles in 1 hr 20 min or whatever your goal is. This can set your mind at ease if you are unsure of your pace later.

Learn your 26.2 times tables, Did you not do these in primary school..

Nipples great point i forgot that before and its the worst pain..

HardyEustace

JustMe1982 wrote: »

Maybe she is REALLY slow and does a lot of walking during her training.

Look maybe she is, I feel that you're getting a little defensive at my comments. I was merely offering advice. I just don't think that someone who starts off with such a negative slant such as "oh, you'll be HOURS on the course" and "oh, don't expect to run the whole thing" is such a good person to turn to for mentoring or advice.

I had a friend who helped me enormously in the run up to my first marathon. He constantly told me that I was strong, that I could do it, that every step made me stronger, that I was going to do a fantastic job. Never once did he say "oh it'll take you ages", "oh you might have to walk", instead he concentrated on all the positives. Remember the marathon is the easy part, it's the training up to it that's the challenge. Once you're lining up at that start line you've achieved more than a lot of people.

JustMe1982 wrote: »

If i can run 10 mins id be happy at the moment. ive honestly only just been talked into this. All i can do is try, its not even in my head yet that i can do this

You've got to believe that you can. I knew once I'd started that if I had to crawl home I'd be finishing that marathon.

I'd recommend this book - non-runner's marathon trainer.

If you buy this book, follow the training plan (I never missed a single run - though I did run so hungover I almost threw up a few times ), do all the "mental" exercises and fill out the training log then you will finish the marathon.

Get yourself some decent shoes and some decent gear and a good sports bra. Join a fit4life or running club. Enjoy the journey.

You can't run a marathon and not change your life for the better. The difference it's made to my life and my happiness is incredible.

That feeling when you cross the finish line is amazing. You feel like you can do anything. I'm smiling as I type this and remember it.

JustMe1982

HardyEustace wrote: »

Look maybe she is, I feel that you're getting a little defensive at my comments. I was merely offering advice. I just don't think that someone who starts off with such a negative slant such as "oh, you'll be HOURS on the course" and "oh, don't expect to run the whole thing" is such a good person to turn to for mentoring or advice.

Hardy -calm down there, i wasnt defensive at all. I was only saying MAYBE she is really slow. I can see that you are really into running but i was only saying maybe and not getting caught up on it and im greatful for your advise, I dont want to upset you...

She wasnt really advising me, She was saying in general thats what she thought, her opinion. we were only talking at the desk while waiting for the kettle to boil

Thanks for the book idea, im not a great reader but i must look into it.

I have a trainer once a week for a while (or will do when i start)
It will be the kick up the bum i will need to get me going

The good shoes and gear wont be a problem. I just need to figure out if im a tights / shorts / (or what other options are out there, can you run in trackies?) person for running

JustMe1982

HardyEustace wrote: »

Get yourself some decent shoes and some decent gear and a good sports bra.
.

Must try and find a new sports bra though. I was riding last night and doing sitting trot and it didnt really support me, must have it too long at this stage. Im a real odd size (small waist)

Any women out there know of good ones. I have a shock absorber but i have to sew the straps up shorter, i must have short shoulders

HardyEustace

whoops, sorry if I seemed a little touchy, that's the problem with the written word, it's easy to take out of context without hearing a person's tone or seeing their face as they express themselves.

To be honest, I'd start now on the mini-marathon training program. Start off small and steady. You need to be able to run 5miles by about July so I'd start now.

Would definitely, definitely recommend the book. You don't have to be a massive reader. There's literally a chapter per week on a 16 week training program so it's very achievable to complete. I literally took it week by week and filled in my training log in the book accordingly.

You can run in trackies but to be honest you'll be bet with the heat and you run the risk of chaffing. Personally I like the "proper" running shorts with the built in knickers as they're really comfortable to run in. Other friends run in tight leggings that finish at the knee as they chaff if they wear something shorter.

A lot of people feel a little self-conscious about getting to lycra running gear at the start but it really makes such a difference to your comfort and performance. You should feel slightly cold at the start of your run, you won't be long warming up.

But you really have to believe that you can do it. To be honest, I can understand why you're nervous it's a real challenge.

I'd definitely recommend doing the pre-marathon race series. It gave me so much confidence to know that I'd run up to a half marathon distance when I was on the start line.

And despite all my guff about positive thinking, I've yet to start a marathon where I'm not crying my eyes out on the start line as I don't know how I'm going to get round <<blush>> (it's always the bit where you're jogging up to the start line, everyone else is cheering and I'm crying like baby). However about ten steps after the start line, I know in my heart I'll be finishing no matter what.

HardyEustace

JustMe1982 wrote: »

Must try and find a new sports bra though. I was riding last night and doing sitting trot and it didnt really support me, must have it too long at this stage. Im a real odd size (small waist)

Any women out there know of good ones. I have a shock absorber but i have to sew the straps up shorter, i must have short shoulders

I find shock absorbers terrible. I use the Fiona sports bra from lessbounce. They're brilliant, super comfortable and wash well. I've one I've had for three years and it's still in great shape. Over all I think I've about six. I swear by them!

JustMe1982

HardyEustace wrote: »

I find shock absorbers terrible. I use the Fiona sports bra from lessbounce. They're brilliant, super comfortable and wash well. I've one I've had for three years and it's still in great shape. Over all I think I've about six. I swear by them!

Thanks for the link - Shock absorber seems to be my only option. Im a 28E/F . I currently have a 30DD but i have a bra under that also to keep them steady

RJC

JustMe1982 wrote: »

Thanks for the link - Shock absorber seems to be my only option. Im a 28E/F . I currently have a 30DD but i have a bra under that also to keep them steady

I'm lost but I assume it's to do with ladies bits....or very wide shoes

rainbow kirby

RJC wrote: »

I'm lost but I assume it's to do with ladies bits....or very wide shoes

Move along, nothing to see here.
it's about bras

misty floyd

I find this article useful to understand 'hitting the wall'. Knowing how it happens (I think) is good to prevent it from happening or maybe delaying it. I know this is for experienced runners to give advice, I'm a first time marathoner myself (counting the days down to Belfast) so I can't say I've experience of hitting the wall when running.

http://www.marathonandbeyond.com/choices/latta.htm

Its probably a given but there is not much mention of hydration on this thread. Very important to me and probably everyone really. I'd never do more than 10 miles without bringing a bottle of water or having one stashed along the route.

This thread is a great idea. Gonna send it onto any new newbies if they ask me for my rather inexperienced advice. Everyone knows how to run, its the nice tips that make a hell of a difference.

Another thing I would never do without is to run with (can't think of the name off hand) those lycra type undies/shorts. Nothing worse than your ass chewing up your sweaty boxers and causing discomfort.

Slogger Jogger

I did marathons for 3 years before I discovered running in the hills and got the benefit from a) the freedom and beauty of it all and b) the extra stamina it gave me. I've never looked back.

My first marathon training was a lonely experience. In subsequent marathon training I've benefitted hugely from either having a pal training with me or having people in a support network (usually injured runners :rolleyes:) who gave me great reinforcement for the training I was doing and vice versa. Running a long run with a pal, chatting away etc, takes the edge off what can sometimes be a drudge. If you can't train together on a given day its great reinforcement of your training to find out that they've run X distance so you feel the need to get out and run at least the same.

Oh.. and start a training log on Boards.

rigal

misty floyd wrote: »

I find this article useful to understand 'hitting the wall'.
http://www.marathonandbeyond.com/choices/latta.htm

Cheers misty floyd. Great article..

aburke

Join. A. Club.

mrak

Dinkie wrote: »

Having taken up running this year, my big advise would be:

If your injured, don't push your self to keep to your training schedule. Its o.k. to do less. Managed to injure myself badly this year by trying to keep to my running schedule when I was injured.

+1. Don't run through pain. If running hurts you're not ready for your first marathon - relax and do the next one. In the first mar you are most likely to bollix yourself by ignoring pain as you are so desperate to do it - you can do damage that will be with you forever. Also race loads of 5k, 8k, 10k, 10-miles, 1/2 marathons - especially if you can get them on Saturday so you can still do an easy long run the next day.

Searlait

JustMe1982 wrote: »

Must try and find a new sports bra though. I was riding last night and doing sitting trot and it didnt really support me, must have it too long at this stage. Im a real odd size (small waist)

Any women out there know of good ones. I have a shock absorber but i have to sew the straps up shorter, i must have short shoulders

I have two from Marks and Spencers, one that I have to pull on over my head, its the highest absorbency they have. I think its great!! I'm 36DD, so need some decent support and I find this does the trick!! It was about €20 I think!!

shels4ever

If your coming from a inactive background or you have let yourself go set a propper time line for your training . Marathon programs can be 14-16 weeks long but in most cases they take it that your at an ok level of fittness.

If your out of shape there is no point pushing yourslef and putting pressure to run a marathon with 5-6 months trainng if it takes 18 months you will be better served in the long term by taking your time.

A gradual change in lifestyle and a long term approach will stand with your for the long term , a quick training plan will push you too hard , make it less fun and may put you off.

Remember you run because you enjoy it