Why don't Irish buses announce their stops?

astrofool

Well, the first thing they need to do, is actually create route MAPS on dublinbus.ie akin to this: http://mkmap.com/dublin then the likes of the Luas, passengers and bus stops can figure out where they should get off, and include them on other maps.

Secondly, naming bus stops ain't hard, upper/midde/lower if it's the same street, but also putting the name ON THE BUS STOP, would probably help, along with a list of ALL the buses that serve that stop (not just what timetables + advert fit on the round spinning thing).

AlekSmart

Oddly enough...Bus Atha Cliath made a VERY thorough job of removing EVERY Stage numer from it`s stops throughout the network.
This of itself made it far more difficult for both Drivers and Customers to know where they actually are.

Mind you every single Bus Stop is now tagged,numbered and logged into a database in preparation for the Real Time Information Programme which has now recieved full board approval.....Still does`nt let the Punter know TODAY where the hell they are... :cool:

Zoney

Calina wrote: »

As to what could be done? Well Dublin Bus could do a slightly better job on naming major stops and the drivers can call them out. By that I mean not calling them after businesses which may or may not shut down. There are one or two in Drumcondra and Dorset Street AFAIR which are symptomatic.

At one particular time, about 1998/99, the three main Bus Éireann city bus departure points in Limerick were named after closed/renamed businesses; Spaights, Boyds and Todds.

The journey planner online now at least refers to the first two as Henry St. and William St. rather than Dunnes and Centra, but the third is listed as "Limerick Brown Thomas".

seanabc

meanmachine3 wrote: »

seanabc just in case you hadn't noticed bus drivers are not taxi drivers
most passengers think we know dublin like the back our hands, i'm sorry to disappoint most of you but this aint the case.i've had my own route for a long time and i still dont know were most places are in between. all i know is how to get from one termini to another.if i can help someone i wil and mostly that means asking locals on the bus for such a place, and to be perfectly honest i dont know any other routes (where they go) in the depot i work out of and i dont want to either.

Touchy! Like I said it was pretty unusual because this fella didn't know anything. It was a number 10, which goes to Phoenix Park via Phibsboro and someone getting on asked if he went to Drumcondra and another asked to be let off at the nearest stop to Grangegorman. You don't need a back of hand knowledge for stuff like that. If it wasn't for the passenger standing beside him he'd have been really stuck.

seanabc

armada104 wrote: »

There is one bus driver on the 10 route who seems to have taken it upon himself to announce all the stops. And I mean all of them. He's not Irish, I think he may be Indian or Pakistani, but he knows the names of the stops off by heart, and calls them out every time. It's great for pasengers not familiar with the route, if a little irritating for those who are. Irritating because it draws your attention to just how many unnecessary stops there are on the route. Three on Waterloo Road alone!

The point is, however, you get used to it and block it out after a while, and it is useful for new passengers. You'd have to wonder about the safety implications though.

That fella is good all right. The first time I heard him I didn't know what was going on but he has a nice idea.

Polar101

Calina wrote: »

As to what could be done? Well Dublin Bus could do a slightly better job on naming major stops and the drivers can call them out.

They could also do simple stuff like have the route map on their website, list street names in English in timetables (I'd be happy to learn Irish, but not when I'm trying to get somewhere).

Still, Dublin Bus could be a lot worse too - I do get to work and home every day, it just takes a while..

shltter

Calina wrote: »

Technologically, the solutions exist. The reason it might be irritating in Dublin is - as I've already said - that there are far too many bus stops on the network in Dublin and they are generally too close to each other. But that's what iPods are for and anyway, frankly it's nowhere near as annoying as mobile phones are.



.

I never said it was not possible just that it is not as simple as recording a list of stops

Personally I think given the number of stops and the proximity of the stops it would be very annoying to have them announced the sign with a chime for the blind or partially sighted seems like a much more unobtrusive measure.

parsi

Zoney wrote: »

At one particular time, about 1998/99, the three main Bus Éireann city bus departure points in Limerick were named after closed/renamed businesses; Spaights, Boyds and Todds.

The journey planner online now at least refers to the first two as Henry St. and William St. rather than Dunnes and Centra, but the third is listed as "Limerick Brown Thomas".

Aye but that is still not clear enough - Henry Street is a long street and so is William St so the stops need to be more specific eg Henry St/Shannon St or William St/Whatever-the-name-of-that-lane that used have The Sultan on it.

We need a bit of a mind change really - Irish directions are given by landmarks (the New Bridge in Limerick springs to mind) or the Old Mallow Road in Cork which is really the Old-Old Mallow Road because the Mallow Road was replaced by the new road...

What would help are good quality route maps which would allow you to better follow where you are going.

Wishbone Ash

shltter wrote: »

given the number of stops and the proximity of the stops it would be very annoying to have them announced

I shudder at the thoughts of getting the no. 33 all the way. Hundreds of potential stops during it's 2 hour journey. :eek:

Carawaystick

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

I shudder at the thoughts of getting the no. 33 all the way. Hundreds of potential stops during it's 2 hour journey. :eek:

It'd be hard to even name the stops between Rush and Lusk, never mind anywhere else....

KC61

As Calina points out, the sheer volume of stops in Dublin would make announcing each stop rather cumbersome. It would also get very irritating for regular passengers and drivers alike.

However, Dublin Bus are currently upgrading all passenger information at bus stops. This takes the form of:

1) New style bus stops showing the location, list of routes serving the stop, and spider maps at each stop showing where each route from that stop goes. The first examples of these stops are now on O'Connell Street. Where bus shelters are provided, more extensive maps will be shown.

By watching the stops en route a passenger can tell where he or she is.

2) Tenders are about to be issued for the provision of realtime information and vehicle tracking systems that will finally provide accurate information to both route controllers and passengers alike.

It should also be noted that the latter has been delayed due to government funding being withheld and not due to any lack of desire from Dublin Bus to provide this level of information.

whosedaddy?

Anyome care to explain why Dulbin has this massive amounts on stops on each route... get rid of some and solve the obesity problem at the same time.

Seriously though, other cities have routes with long routes and many stops and they still announce them.. If you are a regular on the bus you will get used to that in no time.. All a matter of volume and the right voice on the recording.

IMHO there is NO excuse not to introduce either display or taped announcements.

If I was a driver I'd be annoyed in every tourist asking me where to get off the bus...

Wishbone Ash

Carawaystick wrote: »

It'd be hard to even name the stops between Rush and Lusk, never mind anywhere else....

For a start you'd have about six "Whitestowns", a few Beau Hills, then a few Eifflestowns etc! :eek:

Why not just put numbers&letters on each of the bus stops (A1,U2,B52..etc) and have routemaps (either paper or website) with the numbers on them.

corktina

that would be a cheaper option and you could have a list of stops posted up in the bus maybe a map even....

MiniD

Deleted User wrote: »

Why not just put numbers&letters on each of the bus stops (A1,U2,B52..etc) and have routemaps (either paper or website) with the numbers on them.

That is exactly what is currently being rolled out. The first few examples can be seen on O'Connell Street.

MiniD

MiniD wrote: »

That is exactly what is currently being rolled out. The first few examples can be seen on O'Connell Street.

As you might have guessed, I don't use the bus! Impossible on any journey I make now.

Red Alert

Why did they remove the stage numbers in the first place? (It surely doesn't mean they're doing something intelligent like a zonal fare system)

The buses in Berlin definitely announce their stop, as do the buses in chicago from my experience. This type of equipment isn't rocket science but again we have stalling tactics, multiple tenders for no good reason and a general apathy on the part of dublin bus management against doing anything quickly and in a practical manner.

In fact had they kept the AVM system instead of chucking it out and making guys stand around with handheld radios they could have started on an announcement system and then upgraded to GPS when it suited them. Now there's an RTPI system that can't seemingly feed back to the users.

I know I sound like a stuck record on the topic, but this is just another example of the fact that Dublin Bus are nailing their own coffin. This type of behaviour just feeds into the hands of those who are pro-privatisation for their own reasons. It alienates the regular customers and frustrates tourists. If ex- sovbloc countries have their transport in order why can't we do the same considering we're always boasting to europe how good we are.

AlekSmart

I feel your Pain,Red Alert,however like much else the actuality tends to be somewhat cloudier than what is seen on-screen.

The AVM system was only decommissioned on the understanding that it`s digital replacement was going to be approved ........It was`nt !!

The original and highly innovative AVM system as developed by CIE`s Dublin City Services could have been a world beater had it been exposed to the normal methodology of recognizing and nurturing such technological items.

Sadly,in CIE`s case the AVM fell foul of a principle which will once again be appearing on our screens quite soon............The CUTBACKS !! :eek:

As with virtually everything which Bus Atha Cliath does,the guiding principle behind its operation is the seeking of "Shareholder Approval" for any and all spending on its infrastructure.

Back in the late 1980`s CIE recognised that the original analogue AVM system,although simple and functional,was approaching the limits of its application.
Plans were laid for the development and introduction of the next phase of AVM,which would have entailed a move to the then more complex and expensive Digital methodology.

This would have been coupled with the Electronic Ticketing (Smart Card) iniative then being trialled on a very limited basis in Dublin (Route 39 I think).

However,Ireland in that era was not really ready to spend money on this type of thing as there was little profit in it for the movers and shakers,who preferred to invest their time and energy in Land Deals and Toll Bridges in order to facilitate their family trust funds.

Thus when faced with a choice of using it`s scarce funding to actually attempt to run a Bus Service OR to develop new and innovative technological solutions to the next round of problems,CIE management had to bite the bullet and pay for the diesel...:(

Posters on so many boards can rail and rant about Bus Atha Cliath until the (Headage Paid) cows come home,but the reality is that for ANY capital expenditure on ANY thing to improve it`s own services the CIE companies MUST seek firstly,subsidiary Board Approval...then Main CIE Board approval before finally kneeling before the Grand Panjandrum of the Dept of Transport.

The Dept Of Transport of course will ruminate and eventually reach a decision which will be then subject to final Cabinet Approval,which will come about only after the proposal has satisfied the rigorous criteria of the Dept of Finance.

Meanwhile,as todays Irish Independent story reveals,the same Dept will have commissioned EXPERTS of the calibre of Booz-Hamilton to tell a salivating public that back in 2005 Bus Atha Cliath lost passengers to the Luas....quite so...thank you Mr Boozy-Hamilton for that revealing insight...:rolleyes:

In addition we know know that the revised Departmental strategy is to approach Bus Atha Cliath with a 9-Point list of "stuff" which the "Experts" consider to be necessary for the company to implement.....It`s a great pity no "Experts" were on hand to advise the Department and the Rail Procurement Agency on how to devise and implement an Integrated Ticketing system...:o

Meanwhile the Department still sits on the Route 141 licence application like a very old clucking hen......16 Months and counting......???

bk

A Dub in Glasgo wrote: »

I remember my 60 minute 4 mile commute on the 13 bus 15 years ago. It would have driven me nuts if I had some driver or autobot announce every stop all the time.

I was just thinking about this and there is an easy technical solution.

Only display the next stop on an LED, don't announce it. However have the system announce it via very short range FM radio transmission, this way blind or illiterate people could tune into the announcements via cheap FM radios or the radio in their mobile phone.

Best of both worlds.

Hotblack Desiato

astrofool wrote: »

Secondly, naming bus stops ain't hard, upper/midde/lower if it's the same street

So we could have stuff like Upper Lower Mount St. and Middle Middle Abbey St.

spacetweek

shltter wrote: »

Apart from the fact that it would be irritating as hell if you had to listen to it 5 days a week on your way to work on then on the way home again

This is nonsense. I use the Luas every day and you don't notice the announcements after a short time.

The problem with announcing this on buses is that there are a great many more stops on buses than on trains/trams, so there'd be a voice announcing stops basically the whole journey.

Ham'nd'egger

bk wrote: »

I was just thinking about this and there is an easy technical solution.

Only display the next stop on an LED, don't announce it. However have the system announce it via very short range FM radio transmission, this way blind or illiterate people could tune into the announcements via cheap FM radios or the radio in their mobile phone.

Best of both worlds.

This would be illegal under broadcasting laws in Ireland. In any case, for it to work, people would be carrying FM radios when using public transport to hear such announcements. PA is the way to do it, if anyway is.

spacetweek

spacetweek wrote: »

This is nonsense. I use the Luas every day and you don't notice the announcements after a short time.

The problem with announcing this on buses is that there are a great many more stops on buses than on trains/trams, so there'd be a voice announcing stops basically the whole journey.

I absolutely hate the announcements on the IÉ Mk4s so I can see how some would find them irritating. I now travel on Mk4s with an iPod. The Luas and DART ones don't really bother me though, short and simple is the key, not bi-lingual announcements that go on for yonks.

giddyup

In my neck of the woods the bus drivers annouce every stop - just a quick mention generally of the cross-street name. If there are major places of interest nearby they throw that in also. Very handy.

Asking Dublin Bus drivers to do this would possibly involve re-training / a pay-rise / strike action / the emergence of a Brendan Ingle like figure to rage against the audacity of management in expecting the downtrodden workers to upskill while distracting them from the critical tasks of assuring the health and safety of their passengers - it would be undoable in the context of agreed partnerships and frameworks and in the absence of a few shillings etc. etc. etc.

Nothing against bus drivers - they are generally salt - just the nonsense that would invariably follow if you tried to do this. Sorry, I'm on a rant after reading about the wildcat rail strike in Cork.

bk

Hamndegger wrote: »

This would be illegal under broadcasting laws in Ireland. In any case, for it to work, people would be carrying FM radios when using public transport to hear such announcements. PA is the way to do it, if anyway is.

Nope, Comreg recently changed the laws on very low power FM transmission for such applications.

Yes you would need an FM radio, but that isn't such a big deal, it costs about €5 to buy a cheap one and most mobiles have one built in nowadays.

My idea is to make the service available to blind, hard of site and illiterate people without disturbing other regular passengers who can just glance at the LED readout.

It is a good compromise. By doing this you could potentially give far more detailed information at each stop, you could even potentially have different languages at different FM frequencies.

Ham'nd'egger

bk wrote: »

Nope, Comreg recently changed the laws on very low power FM transmission for such applications.

Apologies, I wasn't aware that this was brought in. And they made it bloody hard to find on their website at that!

OTK

There's about 25 stops every 10km on Dublin Bus routes. How can this make sense?

bk

Hamndegger wrote: »

Apologies, I wasn't aware that this was brought in. And they made it bloody hard to find on their website at that!

Yes, typical of ComReg, it was always an ineffective law that was going to get changed as the country is swamped by those iPod FM transmitters and similar devices.

shltter

giddyup wrote: »

In my neck of the woods the bus drivers annouce every stop - just a quick mention generally of the cross-street name. If there are major places of interest nearby they throw that in also. Very handy.

Asking Dublin Bus drivers to do this would possibly involve re-training / a pay-rise / strike action / the emergence of a Brendan Ingle like figure to rage against the audacity of management in expecting the downtrodden workers to upskill while distracting them from the critical tasks of assuring the health and safety of their passengers - it would be undoable in the context of agreed partnerships and frameworks and in the absence of a few shillings etc. etc. etc.

Nothing against bus drivers - they are generally salt - just the nonsense that would invariably follow if you tried to do this. Sorry, I'm on a rant after reading about the wildcat rail strike in Cork.

Hilarious :rolleyes:

quick question though why would they want a boxing trainer to rage against anything