I am not buying the Sindo this week?

Brendan552004

I have decided not to buy any editions of the Sindo this week, I started last Sunday. The money I am saving I am donating to Goal. If we all did it, the Sindo might reflect on all their coverage over 2007, they might get rid of some of the alcoholic hacks who masquerade as journalists. I might just get used to the idea, the starving kids will benefit.

I edited a grocery trade magazine years ago, the independent grocers organised a boycott of certain suppliers, they were supporting undercost selling, the boycott worked. It was all a little bit too late. we now have our grocery market controlled by multiples. Tesco's Irish profits are the highest of any country in the world they operate in. we are all getting screwed.

daveirl

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Brendan552004

National newspapers have a very important part to play in shaping our society, people read newspapers, they believe what they read, conjecture becomes fact. How often do you hear "I know it is true, I read it in the paper".

Over the last few years, the Sindo has put itself over as a campaigning, righteous, moral seeking, publication. I remember when Cian O'Connor, Sir A's godson won the olympic gold on Sir A's horse Waterford Wedgewood. Sir A featured in a half page spread complimenting himself. When the horse doping scandal broke, not a word. Cian fell out with Jessica Kurten, they went on a witchunt after her. I not even going to talk about the Shinners, there were pages every week about them.
Only recently they decided to get Kathy French's boyfriend Marcus, he objected to her appearing in a lingerie shoot. They got him, his restaurant went into examinership last week. I do not know him from adam, just shows you the power of the press. I am sure that the rest of you have many more examples. It is get Bertie time now, they used to praise him, they have turned turk.

flogen

Brendan552004 wrote: »

National newspapers have a very important part to play in shaping our society, people read newspapers, they believe what they read, conjecture becomes fact. How often do you hear "I know it is true, I read it in the paper".

Over the last few years, the Sindo has put itself over as a campaigning, righteous, moral seeking, publication. I remember when Cian O'Connor, Sir A's godson won the olympic gold on Sir A's horse Waterford Wedgewood. Sir A featured in a half page spread complimenting himself. When the horse doping scandal broke, not a word. Cian fell out with Jessica Kurten, they went on a witchunt after her. I not even going to talk about the Shinners, there were pages every week about them.

I think they're giving campaigning journalism a bad name. There's nothing wrong with campaigning as long as it's done for the right reasons, ie a better or fairer society.

Harold Evans'/The Sunday Times' Thalidomide campaign is an example of a newspaper fighting big companies on behalf of people who couldn't. The Sunday Independent's campaign to abolish stamp duty is an example of a newspaper fighting the Government on behalf of its own senior staff's bank balances.

Only recently they decided to get Kathy French's boyfriend Marcus, he objected to her appearing in a lingerie shoot. They got him, his restaurant went into examinership last week. I do not know him from adam, just shows you the power of the press. I am sure that the rest of you have many more examples. It is get Bertie time now, they used to praise him, they have turned turk.

Anything I've seen would suggest that they're still defending Bertie all the way - they have been going for Cowen, though, and even when he did reorganise stamp duty in a way that would please them they said it was only because Bertie told him to, not because he wanted to.

Brendan552004

Who does Sir A really want as Taoiseach?, you are right about Cowan, who dubbed him "Lips". Lets see how the reporting goes when Bertie appears before the tribunal next week. They need a new campaign, I think it will be "lets get rid of Bertie".
I notice a thread on the legal boards.ie about NZ refusing a visa to someone because they were obese, not within the proper BMI range, someone else posted that they should deport all the "All Blacks" as they were all obese. Maybe Sir A should campaign for the "All Blacks" not to be deported. His own BMI is looking a bit suspect at the moment, he dwarfs that lovely Greek lady he married, Gavin might also have a problem getting a visa to visit NZ.

Mind you I think they may stay away from obesity, especially after the article they published on special needs people, the article that resulted in them nearly losing all their HSE advertising account.

You will also notice that the Sindo do not campaign too much about food prices, bread, milk, butter, the basics. I wonder is it anything to do with the full colour adds, every second page in every issue, every week.

Gekko

flogen wrote: »

I think they're giving campaigning journalism a bad name. There's nothing wrong with campaigning as long as it's done for the right reasons, ie a better or fairer society.

Harold Evans'/The Sunday Times' Thalidomide campaign is an example of a newspaper fighting big companies on behalf of people who couldn't. The Sunday Independent's campaign to abolish stamp duty is an example of a newspaper fighting the Government on behalf of its own senior staff's bank balances.

Have to agree. But I'd add that the campaign to abolish stamp duty is also partly due to the following.

Arguably there is broad elite of property developers, investors, a large section of Fianna Fail and senior Sunday Independent executives who move in the same circles. Some of their interests overlap and have led to the campaign on stamp duty.

constitutionus

Gekko wrote: »

Have to agree. But I'd add that the campaign to abolish stamp duty is also partly due to the following.

Arguably there is broad elite of property developers, investors, a large section of Fianna Fail and senior Sunday Independent executives who move in the same circles. Some of their interests overlap and have led to the campaign on stamp duty.

yeah. not exactly a co incidence they'll make out like bandits over these tax changes and the sindo , along with the other broadsheets, has a fairly hefty property supplement bringing in alot of lovely money for them.

i have to confess to buying it last sunday. but its getting very close to me dropping it. i was reading myers column during the week (didnt buy, read in shop) where he basically laid into the indos culture of creating "celebrities" to fill column inches and raised the idea that its down to a desperate scramble for readers.
makes sense if you think about it. readers are falling off and the sindo, with 1 million readers, only captures half the work force or a quater of the population. when you consider where readership figures used to be 20yrs ago thats a big change.

TBH in regards to the OP. fair play. putting your money where your mouth is does pay off. i doubt the sindo will go under but it might highlight the issue to editorial staff or at the very least encourage competitors to take a different tack.

brianthebard

If only I had bought it in the first place I could boycott it. Seriously though fair play, if there was some way of organising this on a mass scale it could potentially be picked up by the other sunday papers, who I'm sure would love to get one over on the sindo.

moe_sizlak

daveirl wrote: »

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i thought brendan o connors article was very touching

i like the sindo , its terribly trendy to bash it but its by far the biggest selling sunday paper

daveirl

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Gekko

have to agree it's pretty trashy. It's heavily targeted at female readers, the biggest market that all the newspapers including all the sundays are chasing.

cousin_borat

daveirl wrote: »

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Same here, I used to enjoy the SINDO despite prats like Terry Keane and Barry Egan through the years. It really has become very thrashy now altogether. Why an editor lets Brendan O'Connor write articles like the Katy French piece last week is unbelievable. Big song and dance about somebody who is one of their own essentially and expect the nation to be upset

mike65

I have to confess to pretty much giving up on newspapers full stop, back in the day ( when we were all still at home) we would buy the IT twice a week, with a Saturday paper, two Sundays and the local rag on Thursday. Now I buy the SundayTimes and thats it, mainly for the Culture and Sport.

Mike.

Kevster

What other Sunday newspaper is there then... ...? - None, apparently. The Irish Indo has become trashy too, and I've noticed the Irish Times slipping a bit in quality too.

The best newspaper is FT but it's still next to impossible to find straight honest journalism. When opinion is introduced it ceases to be news.

simu

The Indo is trashy but it doesn't bother me tbh because I don't expect anything more from it. The Sunday Times is only marginally less trashy anyways - in fact, newspapers in general have become more frivolous down through the years. I guess people want everything to be entertaining now!

Dodge

simu wrote: »

I guess people want everything to be entertaining now!

Obviously not given the drop in readership (despite less and less competition each year). And I don't know one person who actually enjoys reading the Indo or considers it worthy of commendation.

The SIndo is a disgrace to journalism IMO Even their sports coverage is ridiculously biased. I haven't bought it in months.

jmcc

The attraction of the Sindo is that it is a village newspaper. People buy it to see who is mentioned in it each week. As for journalism - that's way down the list. Where else would a gang of village idiots get a job?

Regards...jmcc

Gekko

I agree with it being a kind of a village newspaper. Not all the journos are village idiots though!

I thought the paper wasn't too bad yesterday.

themont85

I think nearly all the papers have fallen in recent years with the Sindo a particularly bad offender. NewsCorp and INM are both owners of a lot of the papers are pushing their owners agendas at times. I used to think the Tribune was all right with the ST but the Trib I think has gone down hill. Wouldn't it be great if the IT had a Sunday version, the best paper by a country mile in the country.

simu

Dodge wrote: »

Obviously not given the drop in readership (despite less and less competition each year). And I don't know one person who actually enjoys reading the Indo or considers it worthy of commendation.

The SIndo is a disgrace to journalism IMO Even their sports coverage is ridiculously biased. I haven't bought it in months.

All papers are featuring more entertainment and "features" sections these days, though. They seem to have decided that's how to attract/hold on to readers.

I know many people who enjoy the Sindo as the trash it is tbh.

brianthebard

Kevster wrote: »

What other Sunday newspaper is there then... ...? - None, apparently. The Irish Indo has become trashy too, and I've noticed the Irish Times slipping a bit in quality too.

The best newspaper is FT but it's still next to impossible to find straight honest journalism. When opinion is introduced it ceases to be news.

I've only read the Sunday business post once or twice but it seemed at least better than the Sindo. On the other hand it did an article about cocaine and drugs where it went through profit margins, how much it costs to import, how much can be made if its cut 20%, 50% etc. :rolleyes: Its just a bit too business orientated!

constitutionus

brianthebard wrote: »

I've only read the Sunday business post once or twice but it seemed at least better than the Sindo. On the other hand it did an article about cocaine and drugs where it went through profit margins, how much it costs to import, how much can be made if its cut 20%, 50% etc. :rolleyes: Its just a bit too business orientated!

thats actually my main complaint. if i do give up the SINDO i'll probably end up getting the SBP as its the only credible alternative. i dont want
to give up a Sunday read but its getting unjustifiable now as im getting far more actual news on the net now. if the katy french thing opened my eyes to anything its that the future of Sunday newspapers seems to be salacious chic lit crap to pander to women

santosubito

I made the decision to stop getting the Sindo yesterday. As a consequence, I feel great today! All the bitterness and anger that these muppets share the same profession as me (emotions that rose to the surface every Sunday upomn reading it) were absent all day yesterday and today. Life's great! I should have done it years ago, but I always had a nagging doubt that I'd be missing something, somewhere, in the paper that was remotely newsworthy. But, in recent months, it has just gotten worse and worse and I'm happy bot to have bought it yesterday. I had a peek in my in laws' and saw some ****e about Gerald Kean: that was enough to make me realise I'd made the right decision.
All the people, largely reporters, I know who give out about the paper still buy it every week, I'm convinced it's only when large numbers of punters stop buying the rag that things will change.
I did buy the Sunday Times, however, and, as usual, was unimpressed with its Irish content in the news section. Very poor.

Gekko

disturbing stuff about eoghan harris marrying some young one by the name of gwen halley who he mentored when she was a reporter starting out on the paper. There's like a 40 year age gap...

TheDemiurge

santosubito wrote: »

I made the decision to stop getting the Sindo yesterday. As a consequence, I feel great today! All the bitterness and anger that these muppets share the same profession as me (emotions that rose to the surface every Sunday upomn reading it) were absent all day yesterday and today. Life's great! I should have done it years ago, but I always had a nagging doubt that I'd be missing something, somewhere, in the paper that was remotely newsworthy. But, in recent months, it has just gotten worse and worse and I'm happy bot to have bought it yesterday. I had a peek in my in laws' and saw some ****e about Gerald Kean: that was enough to make me realise I'd made the right decision.
All the people, largely reporters, I know who give out about the paper still buy it every week, I'm convinced it's only when large numbers of punters stop buying the rag that things will change.
I did buy the Sunday Times, however, and, as usual, was unimpressed with its Irish content in the news section. Very poor.

It's great coming on here and finding that many people think the same way that I do - I thought I was the only one. I'm a solicitor and the whole Gerald Kean thing (the mother had a copy of yesterday's paper - I see he and the waxwork have been named "People of the Year") is just an embarrassment to our profession, as if things could get any worse for us.

I really find the whole Sindo culture to be quite terrifying at this stage - there's no voice out there for those of us clinging desperately onto the last vestiges of sanity and reason.

TheDemiurge

TheDemiurge wrote: »

It's great coming on here and finding that many people think the same way that I do - I thought I was the only one. I'm a solicitor and the whole Gerald Kean thing (the mother had a copy of yesterday's paper - I see he and the waxwork have been named "People of the Year") is just an embarrassment to our profession, as if things could get any worse for us.

I really find the whole Sindo culture to be quite terrifying at this stage - there's no voice out there for those of us clinging desperately onto the last vestiges of sanity and reason.

By the way I'm female and I can't stomach articles aimed at wimmin

TheD

moe_sizlak

Gekko wrote: »

disturbing stuff about eoghan harris marrying some young one by the name of gwen halley who he mentored when she was a reporter starting out on the paper. There's like a 40 year age gap...

i didnt know it was gwen halley he married but it makes perfect sense

she is a neo conservative and hes a newly found neo conservative

moe_sizlak

TheDemiurge wrote: »

It's great coming on here and finding that many people think the same way that I do - I thought I was the only one. I'm a solicitor and the whole Gerald Kean thing (the mother had a copy of yesterday's paper - I see he and the waxwork have been named "People of the Year") is just an embarrassment to our profession, as if things could get any worse for us.

I really find the whole Sindo culture to be quite terrifying at this stage - there's no voice out there for those of us clinging desperately onto the last vestiges of sanity and reason.

you thought you were the only one , are you serious , sunday indo bashing is a serious sport among BOARDS .ie members and the young who see themselves as trendy in general

i think eoghan harris is a bufoon but i still like the paper , especially how they grill our despicable public service

DublinWriter

TheDemiurge wrote: »

I'm a solicitor and the whole Gerald Kean thing (the mother had a copy of yesterday's paper - I see he and the waxwork have been named "People of the Year") is just an embarrassment to our profession, as if things could get any worse for us.

That's unbelievable.

I think they should rename the Sindo "Circle Jerk Weekly".

I have proudly never bought a copy, ever. Even if they offered a free Fabergè Egg with every edition, I'd still think twice.

johnnyskeleton

Not that I condone anyone ever reading the Indo, but if you don't want to give them any of your money, you can always read it online. They'll still make money from advertising, but your point will be made.

Or, you could read the Times instead, and get more facts less opinion-stuffed-down-your-throat.

DublinWriter

johnnyskeleton wrote: »

Or, you could read the Times instead, and get more facts less opinion-stuffed-down-your-throat.

Says you. Have people already forgotten Captain Myers and his "Irishman's" Diary?

flogen

DublinWriter wrote: »

Says you. Have people already forgotten Captain Myers and his "Irishman's" Diary?

If you venture into the op-ed section expecting anything but opinion, you're kind of missing the point.

It's when the news and feature aspects of the 'paper become opinionated that I have a problem.

Nightwish

When I stopped buying the Tribune 2 years ago, I started buying the Sindo. However after 2 weeks I couldnt take anymore SoCo Dublins social scene gossip masquerading as news. My da however buys it so its around the house on a Sunday. I'd inevitably end up flicking through it, but it would annoy me so much to the point of anger I've now stopped. I havent gone near it since the end of November. If people have dropped the Tribune like a hot sh!t since it turned into an entertainment/features paper rather than a newspaper, why arent readers turning their backs on the Sindo, seeing as so many can see it for what it is - a gossip rag.

Tha Gopher

I havent bothered reading the whole thread (mainly because Im drunk) but tbh you ought to be ashamed of yourself for having ever bought the Sindo, giving up buying it isnt something to be proud of (Im 23 and its been an ads paper mixed with out of touch with real life columnists ever since I can remember. Unfortunately my granny, and presently my housemate, buy it, so I read it most weeks for the comedy). Really is a country thing for some bizarre reason (housemate being from Roscommon)

And oh yeah, the shock horror 4 per edition "your boss in work and beautiful D4 girls off their heads" cocaine reports by columnists who have never seen someone smoke a joint, let alone a line of cocaine. The normal indo can be bad enough (well, primarily the Saturday edition) but the Sindo is an adverts mag mixed with gutter filth journalism which shouldnt be taken even remotely seriously under any circumstances. Makes me angry these people were actually given journalism/communications degrees.

I nearly wish we had China-like media censorship here, surely someone would shut this rag down.

vibrant

Is it true that Independent "Views"papers have a 25% share in the Tribune, and also a share in the Sunday World? The Tribune used to be good, but I really went off it all of a sudden.

We used to get the Sindo in the house when I was growing up it was just the done thing, the habit. I suspect that most of their readership buy it out of habit now too.

I bought it once about 6 years ago and not only was there a completely cut+paste job from that weeks Popbitch mailout, ("written" by Brendan O'Connor!) but there were articles written by a married woman, a single man, a single woman (I think), and all they were writing about was the fact that they were married/single. This was in the main newspaper, not the magazine supplement section. Then they made stuff up about Liam Lawlor before the man's body had even turned cold.

Lazy "journalism" personified, I wouldn't throw tuppence at them.

gazzer

I was down in my parents house last Sunday. They had bought the Indo. I looked at the front page and read a story about how a journalist had found a wrap of cocaine amongst some mail in the apartment block where they live. Apparantly it is common for dealers to post wraps of cocaine in letterboxes to get people hooked... WTF..

Needless to say I didnt read anymore of the paper. Its just getting worse and worse.

r3nu4l

moe_sizlak wrote: »

you thought you were the only one , are you serious , sunday indo bashing is a serious sport among BOARDS .ie members and the young who see themselves as trendy in general

Funny, I was bashing the Sindo long before I ever heard of boards.ie I'm also neither young, nor trendy. The simple fact is that the Sindo is agenda driven opinion that portrays itself as News. When you look at the headlines and read the stories you have to work really hard to weed out the simple facts from the opinion and bias. It's been like this for a few years now but has been getting worse year on year.

To anyone advocating a boycott: instead of simply boycotting the Sindo people should be buying a competitor product. There aren't many decent competitors out there but buy the Tribune, the Sunday Business Post or the Sunday Times instead. Newspapers hate falling circulation but they hate it even more if that circulation is going towards competitors.

brianthebard wrote:

Its just a bit too business orientated!

You do know that the word "Business" in the title "Sunday Business Post" kind of implies that, right?

parsi

I stopped buying it when I started work and didn't need the appointments sections (the days before websites..).

Even still I get browned-off when I read the odd copy of the Independent..

constitutionus

bought the mail this week instead.

wouldnt ordinarily touch it with a ten foot barge pole but the bertie / revenue comisioners was just too juicy a story to pass up

jdivision

vibrant wrote: »

Is it true that Independent "Views"papers have a 25% share in the Tribune, and also a share in the Sunday World? The Tribune used to be good, but I really went off it all of a sudden.
.

Indo group controls around 70 per cent of print media in Ireland, they are also involved in the Star as well as newspapers above (they effectively own The Trib because of the loads they gave them) so the only domestic national competitors are The Irish Times, The Irish Examiner and The Sunday Business Post. After that there's the British papers - The Sunday Times, News of The World, The Sun, The Mirro, Mail, Mail on Sunday etc

The Trib went downhill suddenly because most of its best writers left, many of them for The Sunday Times business section but others to The Irish Times and so on. Not many good journalists left there after what seems to have been a fairly ruthless shift to inexperienced (and therefore cheaper) journalists. Effective because circulation held up but poor for the readers because the quality of the business section plunged faster than I have ever seen a newspaper quality slump, sports coverage not great anymore and news is also poor.

Gekko

O'Reilly's aim for Independent News and Media is to "be the Ryanair of the newspaper industry."

That means costs are being slashed to the bone...alot of the workforce is freelancers paid per article with a skeleton editorial staff and some key staffers...I'll leave you to be the judge of what the consequences are for the quality of journalism.

With Independent Colleges, the company will also be able to teach its own journalists and groom its own pool of hacks, while making money from them at the same time.

moe_sizlak

lets not make out tony o reilly to be the devil himself or worse still , rupert murdoch , he has a long way to fall yet

jdivision

Hmmm he meets political leaders and then miraculously his newspapers support them and tone of coverage becomes glowing - FF reelected after rebounding.
It's not the first time either. The worst was when the Rainbow coalition election came up and he sided with FF. Why? Well it wouldn't have anything to do with the illegal deflectors that FG-Lab-PL had turned a blind eye to while O'Reilly was involved in cable TV. Of course not. It's just a conincidence that there was a clampdown after FF got back into power.

constitutionus

interesting to note todays sindo does not have the fact berties not tax compliant on its front page as opposed to both the mail and the times.

wonder if its anything to do with the "exclusive" interview with him wherein he pretty much spreads as much ****e about the tribunals as he can conscerning things they havent even asked (unless i missed the question refering to who shares his bed)

can you say "propaganda"

still you have to give it to bert when it comes to sophistry. he was on radio 1 news refuting the claims he got money off o callahan

BERTIE :" i never got a penny off him"

quite correct, the amount suggested was 80k, not a penny

BERTIE: " in fact , i never got a glass of water off him"

this is also true, no one suggested ya got a glass of water off him. but considering he raised it knowing bert it might imply he got a pint of bass. interviewers should ask this next time

by the way in case your wondering . no , i didnt buy it this week either as it blatantly ignored the main story of the day and felt too much like spin for my liking. just read it in easons instead.

still one good thing about this bertie thing is its really polarising the jounalists. it becoming very obvious who supports who in terms of politics and where their interests lie. the sunday supplement on today FM was pretty much calling all its texters FG supporters this morning (check the pod cast ) due to their annoying insistance that bertie not paying tax WAS a big deal as opposed to what his panal was maintaing

i like the suday supplement, and in fairness to sam he reads out the texts the challenge him, but the bias really shows sometimes.

EamonnKeane

A new low this week re the wimmins' articles: a third of a page on how one can catch one's high heels in the cracks in Grafton Street. (meanwhile there were elections in Taiwan, but no-one cares about that)

constitutionus

EamonnKeane wrote: »

A new low this week re the wimmins' articles: a third of a page on how one can catch one's high heels in the cracks in Grafton Street. (meanwhile there were elections in Taiwan, but no-one cares about that)

jesus. surprisingly i didnt even miss it this week. maybe its just a slow week and temptation will come when something big hits the fan.

i cant belive they did a story about high heels though. i thougth they went as low as they could when one of their female journalists did a story on why men cant commit and proceeded to do a half page of moaning from her girlfriends who've ALL been dumped. she didnt even ask ONE guy why he wants to remain single in the whole article

i couldnt help thinking "can blokes not commit? or is the problem really just you luv, and your psycho mates."

Gekko

EamonnKeane wrote: »

A new low this week re the wimmins' articles: a third of a page on how one can catch one's high heels in the cracks in Grafton Street. (meanwhile there were elections in Taiwan, but no-one cares about that)

Ah come on, the writer did have nice legs though

vibrant

I wonder if the Sindo's high circulation number stems in part from the high number of hotels/gyms/bars etc who seem to supply the paper for free for their guests? Just something I've noticed recently.

Roanmore

vibrant wrote: »

I wonder if the Sindo's high circulation number stems in part from the high number of hotels/gyms/bars etc who seem to supply the paper for free for their guests? Just something I've noticed recently.

The Sunday Independent quote readership figures and not circulation on it's front page and it's based on an extimate so all those free papers is probably inflating their readership.

jdivision

The free papers are called bulk sales and yes the Sindo has a large percentage of them. At one stage at least 10 per cent of its circulation was made of this:
http://archives.tcm.ie/businesspost/2003/03/02/story395035525.asp
http://archives.tcm.ie/businesspost/2003/03/09/story260949531.asp
I'm not aware of current figure offhand. It's an artificial way of keeping up their circulation essentially.

constitutionus

interesting point.

i know when i went to the aran islands last year the airline were giving away free indos so maybe stuff like that is bulking it up too.

month 2 and no indo. ha, starting to sound like an AA meeting

"my name's constitutionus. and i read the sindo"

"there there man, well done. get it off your chest"