The €10k

milkerman

I rang my solicitor yesterday to see if he had any response to my request for repayment of monies owed by my sister in law. He said he had received nothing as yet. He did tell me my wife had called to his office and he had a 20 minute chat with her. She told him we did not want to go after her sister hammer & thongs and that I had acted in anger. He told her that he was acting on my instructions. He also pointed out that he had known me since Primary School and that in his opinion we were being badly used. She got quite huffy with him.
His question to me was 'Do you want to me to chase this one?' I told him to go ahead and institute proceedings if there is no satisfactory response before 10th December. He issued a further letter yesterday afternoon by registered mail. Before hanging up he advised me to clarify matters with my wife.
My wife never said anything to me about having gone to see him. We haven't even talked about this thing in nearly 2 weeks. Dont know whether to raise the issue or not. Perhaps keeping my head down is the best option.
I am sick of both sisters tbh. This whole thing has exposed serious cracks in our marriage and I found it difficult to sit with her last night.

pepper

milkerman wrote: »

My wife never said anything to me about having gone to see him. We haven't even talked about this thing in nearly 2 weeks.

This whole thing has exposed serious cracks in our marriage and I found it difficult to sit with her last night.

I think you have been more than fair on this issue-She had some nerve to go to the solicitor behind your back-You helped out her sister and shes made you feel like the bad guy for wanting your hard earned cash back

If i was you id tell her how pissed you are and that if she is going to act like this then you dont see the marriage lasting

I personally think she has some neck

Cathmandooo

Fair play getting the solicitors letter.

You dont seem to be getting anywhere with your wife sadly She's seems adament to stick by her sister. I'd press on with whatever advice your solicitor gives you and stick with it. Your sis in law has been unbelievable and you should stand your ground

GhostInTheRuins

Don't mention it to her, act like you don't know she was talking to him, probably the best thing to do right now.

jgally

I think that you should proceed also.

Your sis-in-law is taking advantage of your generosity im afraid. If ye tried all other ways and means then your fully entitled to take the solc route ... its your money that I'm sure you worked hard for.

You have learnt a lesson the hard way I'm afraid so others reading this should learn from it. When it comes to lending money to a friend or relative ... give them directions to the bank !

Zippitydoo

If your wife is sensible she'll come around sooner or later and see how unfairly you've been treated. You've done the right thing.
Good luck.

MagicMarker

My god... I'm sorry but it may seem over the top, but what your wife is doing could may be a deal breaker for me. The lack of any kind of support is disgraceful!!

Beruthiel

milkerman wrote: »

I am sick of both sisters tbh. This whole thing has exposed serious cracks in our marriage and I found it difficult to sit with her last night.

That is an awful shame.
I feel for you both. Your wife is stuck between a rock and a hard place. She loves you both and doesn't want this to become a disaster for either side.
Her sister is a brat to have caused this and if she cared for her sister, your wife, she would not have done anything that would come between you. Your wife needs to understand that and at least put the responsibility where it should be, squarely on the person who done you out of 10k.
Not talking to your wife will only make matters worse imo and never a good idea in any relationship. She should never have gone to the solicitor behind your back and not told you.
Try and discuss this calmly with her before it gets out of hand.

Fysh

"Keeping the head down"? Not a good idea, I don't think. Certainly not when the course you're on looks like it's going to lead to legal proceedings against your wife's sister.

It's a horrible situation and I have a lot of sympathy for you, but you're going to have to ask serious questions of yourself and your wife in the near future, so I'd start sooner rather than later. It's pretty obvious that your wife will not back you if you institute proceedings against her sister - the rights and wrongs of this are essentially irrelevant; while your reasons are understandable, this is her family and her feelings on what she'll do for and tolerate from her family are clear.

Which means that if you let the solicitor institute proceedings on the 10th of December (precluding response from the sister, which let's face it doesn't look likely because she thinks your wife will talk you out of it) you're going to have your wife stuck between you and her family. Not a situation anyone ever wants to be in.

Now, if you bring it up with your wife before things get that far, you may get nowhere. You may just get the rows and fights and shouting a couple of weeks early. But on the other hand, if you can have a discussion about it with the wife without the situation descending to the level of a row (which depends as much on her as it does you, so you may not be able to avoid it), you might get a better outcome - which would be that your wife, whether or not she likes the situation, realises how serious you are about this and manages to talk her sister into at least responding to the solicitor's letter and start some sort of negotiation process.

I admire your stance on this and would firmly fall on your side in terms of perceived right and wrong. At the same time I think it's either brave or foolhardy of you (can't quite decide which) to undertake these actions just before christmas and all the family stuff that's supposed to go with it. Good luck with Christmas Dinner, I think you're gonna need it!

milkerman

We all love our families, (I do at least). But equally in every family their is always one that causes problems.
In my case, this is my mother - a very difficult interfering person. I have had to draw the line with her and limit her input into my household. At every opportunity she would always be quick with the sly digs and genuine nastiness towards my wife. I stopped all that, she was my family - my job to deal with it .
My wife is refusing to deal effectively with her sister and I could say she is assisting her sister in robbing me and my kids. That is just not on.
This has been bugging me for months, my wife knows how annoyed I am. She knows I need a holiday, she knows I worry about money (even though I earn enough), she knows this is taking a toll on me physically - yet does nothing. As someone said above, this could be a dealbreaker for me.
I will get off early and go home and talk to my wife. I will tell her what I am thinking. So what if her sister never talks to her again, she's not married to her. My mother has not spoken to me directly in over 3 years, I don't like it but just have to live with the fact.

Beruthiel

milkerman wrote: »

I will get off early and go home and talk to my wife. I will tell her what I am thinking.

That is the best thing you can do imo. I hope she sees it from your side and understands the seriousness of it and how it's effecting your relationship.
Best of luck.

dudara

You have to talk to your wife. I really find it hard to believe that she went to the solicitor and didn't tell you. These issues need to aired and brought out into the open.

LegacyUser

milkerman wrote: »

So what if her sister never talks to her again, she's not married to her. My mother has not spoken to me directly in over 3 years, I don't like it but just have to live with the fact.

I think you should leave this attitude on the doormat tonight before you walk in and talk to your wife.

You said in your first post that this whole thing has "exposed" cracks in your marraige.
She may feel this too.

Her sister will always be her sister, but you may not always be her husband and if you two were to break up, she'd need her family more than ever.

She was dead wrong to go behind your back but I think ye really really really need to talk about it.
Tell her how your feeling, but don't forget to let her tell you how she's feeling. She is probably very very stressed out about it all too and obviously feels she can't talk to you about it if she has to go behind your back.

Hope it works out for you.

Sizzler

Slightly off topic OP, but not knowing the full extent of whats going on here, but the long and short of it is you loaned €10k to the sister in law and theres no sign of it coming back, correct?

If so, I'm not sure what way the law stands now but when I was studying it a few years back the line was that in such cases since there was no "intention" to create a legal or binding agreement as you were friends then the law will find it hard to intervene and would not be able to compel that person to repay the debt.

Again obviously I dont know the full facts but I hope for you that you succeed in getting things sorted

py2006

I seem to recall your thread on this before.

It is extremely unlikely that you will see this money this side of Christmas!

Have you been keeping some sort of record of her expenditure over the months? It would be interesting!

Also, could the payment be made in installments of say €100 a month for 10 months? Or are you not even able to get to a negotiating stage?

Regardless, your sister in law's behaviour is disgraceful and while it is a difficult situation for your wife to be in she should be backing you up on this somewhat. Not as far as the legal action goes but she should be screaming at her sister to pay the money back.

dame

py2006 wrote: »

Also, could the payment be made in installments of say €100 a month for 10 months?

No because she owes 10,000 not 1,000.

OP, you really do need to speak to your wife. I agree that you should seek to get all the money back from that wagon by legal means if necessary (which it appears to be at this stage), but I would worry about your marriage if your wife does not support you. I hope you manage to communicate this afternoon and get through to her just how important this issue is to you and your family. Remind your wife that you and her children should be more inportant to her than her leech of a sister.

Shooter McGaven

milkerman wrote: »

My wife is refusing to deal effectively with her sister and I could say she is assisting her sister in robbing me and my kids.

Thats exactly what i was thinking when i read your first post about this ages ago, how can she carry on like this behind your back?

py2006

dame wrote: »

No because she owes 10,000 not 1,000.

Ooops, ! But you know what I mean.

am i bovvered

milkerman,
I have been following this post from the beginning, and i can understand why the vast majority of the posts are supporting your action, but, these people don't have to live with the consequences of the desicions of you and your wife.
Please consider these 2 questions...

Are you using this whole incident as an excuse to justify getting out of your marriage ? The more I have read the more evident this has become.

If not.... is your marriage worth 10k, I would say if you still want to be a family put things in place that this cannot happen again and then let it go.
10k is little money compared to the road of divorce you are going down.

I realise this post will be slated for being soft and naive but I am just saying ...take a breath, its starting to get out of hand.

good luck

supermouse

Bit off the point but what is your solicitor doing talking to your wife when,from the last post i gathered, that you went to see him alone. If this is the case surely he is breaking confidentiality laws by disclosing information got to do with the case with your wife....??

Maybe im totally off...

ali.c

milkerman wrote: »

We all love our families, (I do at least). But equally in every family their is always one that causes problems.
In my case, this is my mother - a very difficult interfering person. I have had to draw the line with her and limit her input into my household. At every opportunity she would always be quick with the sly digs and genuine nastiness towards my wife. I stopped all that, she was my family - my job to deal with it .
My wife is refusing to deal effectively with her sister and I could say she is assisting her sister in robbing me and my kids. That is just not on.
This has been bugging me for months, my wife knows how annoyed I am. She knows I need a holiday, she knows I worry about money (even though I earn enough), she knows this is taking a toll on me physically - yet does nothing. As someone said above, this could be a dealbreaker for me.
I will get off early and go home and talk to my wife. I will tell her what I am thinking. So what if her sister never talks to her again, she's not married to her. My mother has not spoken to me directly in over 3 years, I don't like it but just have to live with the fact.

Okay so if i am reading this correctly, you began legal proceedings against your wife's sister without her being on board and then she proceeded to go behind your back and try and stall the solicitor. Now i understand that family situations are tough to deal and i know you draw an analogy to your own relationship with your mother but you are not your wife and prehaps she feels that 10k is not worth as much as her relationship with her sister.

One way or the other tbh i think the big thing here is communication between you are your wife leaving the sister aside from one moment. Now i know her sister behave appallingly and to be fair i think that is pretty obvious I am also well aware that 10k is a significant amount of cash but is it worth losing your wife over if it comes to that?

Clearly your wife is not supporting you but i think you need to work on understanding why and then concentrate on explaining your position. Again to be fair i think she is being incredibly unsupportive of your position but maybe she has other reasons for doing so. Sibling relationships can be quite complicated and she could be acting out of a desire to protect her sister or indeed out a sense of obligation to her. Now i realise that its not rational but then sometimes its hard to cut the bonds that have been there since childhood.

Personally, i think your energy might be better focused on your relationship with your wife for the minute. I think you said before the 10k you can earn again, but i think (though i could be wrong) that if you allow this situation to descend into a negative tit for tat with your wife there may be no coming back from it.

NextSteps

ali.c wrote: »

is it worth losing your wife over if it comes to that?

Personally, i think your energy might be better focused on your relationship with your wife for the minute. I think you said before the 10k you can earn again, but i think (though i could be wrong) that if you allow this situation to descend into a negative tit for tat with your wife there may be no coming back from it.

I agree completely. Money is just money; if you go home and tell your wife that you are a better person because of how you deal with your family, and try to force her to take sides, you risk losing much more.

Most people are far too close to their siblings to want something like this to happen. Think of it from your wife's point of view: imagine your family being in the papers over a court appearance? Imagine how she must feel, and how torn she must be. It sounds like she's trying to smooth things over; I'd do the same if I were her.

Are you being bullish or hotheaded? Are you being fair? Are you taking this squabble out of proportion?

-Leelo-

milkerman wrote: »

I rang my solicitor yesterday to see if he had any response to my request for repayment of monies owed by my sister in law. He said he had received nothing as yet. He did tell me my wife had called to his office and he had a 20 minute chat with her. She told him we did not want to go after her sister hammer & thongs and that I had acted in anger. He told her that he was acting on my instructions. He also pointed out that he had known me since Primary School and that in his opinion we were being badly used. She got quite huffy with him.
His question to me was 'Do you want to me to chase this one?' I told him to go ahead and institute proceedings if there is no satisfactory response before 10th December. He issued a further letter yesterday afternoon by registered mail. Before hanging up he advised me to clarify matters with my wife.
My wife never said anything to me about having gone to see him. We haven't even talked about this thing in nearly 2 weeks. Dont know whether to raise the issue or not. Perhaps keeping my head down is the best option.
I am sick of both sisters tbh. This whole thing has exposed serious cracks in our marriage and I found it difficult to sit with her last night.

What a nasty selfish cow your sister-in-law is to put you and your wife in this situation.
You should also tell your wife that unless she's willing to pay the legal fees she's not to be giving conflicting instructions to your solicitor.

LegacyUser

It appears some people here are of the opinion to let it slide for the sake of your marriage and sure what is 10 grand.

I don't believe you should let it slide, but I think you do need to calmly explain to your wife that you feel you have been more than fair to her sister, that you think she is putting her sister before you and her own children and that it hurts when she is undermining her real family.
By the sounds of it, she has already decided who is most important and beware she may walk out when push comes to shove.

If you do let it slide then it will always grate on your mind and it has already affected your relationship with your wife and her family.
Also you might find some day another payment has been made to either the same sibling or another family member. If they can get away with it once then they will believe they can do it again.

Either way I believe you should promptly setup a personal account and have your salary going into this account.
Then setup a transfer for X amount into the family household account to cover household expenses.

If she has a problem with it then tell her she can make a "gift" of her own salary but not yours.

PS maybe your mother was a better judge of character and maybe she had the measure of your wife long ago.

Drummerboy2

I feel for you Milkerman. I also feel for your wife. You are obviously worried about the effect of not having that €10k is having on your family but if you and your wife split it will cost you a hell of a lot more than €10K, not to mention the affect a break-up will have on your children. Sit down with your wife, let her deal with recovering the money from the sister-in-law. If she can't/won't, drop it, its not worth it. At least you can hold your head up high and be able to keep control of the purse strings in the future.

Turbulent Bill

milkerman wrote: »

I rang my solicitor yesterday to see if he had any response to my request for repayment of monies owed by my sister in law. He said he had received nothing as yet. He did tell me my wife had called to his office and he had a 20 minute chat with her. She told him we did not want to go after her sister hammer & thongs and that I had acted in anger. He told her that he was acting on my instructions. He also pointed out that he had known me since Primary School and that in his opinion we were being badly used. She got quite huffy with him.
His question to me was 'Do you want to me to chase this one?' I told him to go ahead and institute proceedings if there is no satisfactory response before 10th December. He issued a further letter yesterday afternoon by registered mail. Before hanging up he advised me to clarify matters with my wife.
My wife never said anything to me about having gone to see him. We haven't even talked about this thing in nearly 2 weeks. Dont know whether to raise the issue or not. Perhaps keeping my head down is the best option.
I am sick of both sisters tbh. This whole thing has exposed serious cracks in our marriage and I found it difficult to sit with her last night.

Honestly, while I have a lot of sympathy over the 10k, I think you should stop digging. From the earlier thread, the chances of getting anything substantial back are slim, so you're effectively playing Russian roulette with your marriage (and maybe kids) over 10k. Reading between the lines above, your wife doesn't want the 'hammer and tongs' approach, but might be willing to persuade the sister to come up with something (anything) as a peace offering. Would this help matters?

As mentioned above, you really, really need to talk to your wife honestly about this tonight. Keep it as calm as you can, and emphasise the hurt it's causing you. Try to come to a compromise you both can live with, even a temporary one: it'll give both of you some breathing space. I wouldn't mention the solicitor stuff if you can, as your wife probably feels pinned between you and the sister.

I assume that your marriage was ok before all of this, it would be a shame to let it all go over this. Your whole family (wife and kids included) have been shafted by the sister, but it needn't be terminal. Good luck.

ali.c

Unreg22 wrote: »

It appears some people here are of the opinion to let it slide for the sake of your marriage and sure what is 10 grand.

I don't believe you should let it slide, but I think you do need to calmly explain to your wife that you feel you have been more than fair to her sister, that you think she is putting her sister before you and her own children and that it hurts when she is undermining her real family.
By the sounds of it, she has already decided who is most important and beware she may walk out when push comes to shove.

clearly its alot of money, rather that labour his position the OP (apparantely he has already done so) should try to work out what his wife's motives for her position is. We dont know that and apparantely neither does the OP. While he is dealing with it on a rational level, there may be some underlying issues which in all fairness its a marraige partnership and he should make his decisions in light of the full information.

Unreg22 wrote: »

If you do let it slide then it will always grate on your mind and it has already affected your relationship with your wife and her family.

Only if the issue is not dealt with between himself and his wife

Unreg22 wrote: »

Also you might find some day another payment has been made to either the same sibling or another family member. If they can get away with it once then they will believe they can do it again.

I seriously doubt the OP is going to let that happen

Unreg22 wrote: »

Either way I believe you should promptly setup a personal account and have your salary going into this account.
Then setup a transfer for X amount into the family household account to cover household expenses.

If she has a problem with it then tell her she can make a "gift" of her own salary but not yours.

Eh its a marraige or a partnership if you will, if the OP withdraws from his wifes earnings eh it kinda affects the whole family. The OP has already said that the 10k loan has affected his familys quality of life, i dont see who pays for it (between him and his wife) is really going to change that.

milkerman

Hi Folks,
Maybe I'm an optimist but I don't see this as a choice between 10k or my marriage.
If I cant trust my wife to act in our best interest regardless of who the third party is I cant really trust her at all. I am not looking for excuses to walk out, If I wanted to I could just walk out as so many others do on a daily basis. I just want the ground rules clearly laid out.
The solicitor spoke to my wife because he is a good friend and we mix socially and WE lent this woman the money from OUR shared assets.
Maybe the generation after me earn their money too easily but as a young married man I worked in some proper sh*tholes of places (and still carry the injuries) abroad. Security & stability are important to me, I have witnessed what happens in families where these are absent and WILL NOT let my kids suffer the same fate.
If it comes to a choice between 10k and my wife, my wife wins hands down every time. It just shouldn't come to that choice. If it does there is something fundamentally wrong to start with and I think it would revolve around my wife's priorities.
Oh well, time to talk now, please God I can get her to understand.

Jack B. Badd

milkerman wrote: »

If it comes to a choice between 10k and my wife, my wife wins hands down every time. It just shouldn't come to that choice. If it does there is something fundamentally wrong to start with and I think it would revolve around my wife's priorities.

So, your wife should choose you before the 10k and the 10k before her sister? Hrmmm...I'm not convinced that's going to work the way you want it to because of the 3 options (i.e. you, her sister, the money), she probably wouldn't choose the money over either of ye and probably wouldn't want to choose between you or her sister. But whether you acknowledge it or not, I think you're putting your wife in a situation where she will have to choose between you and her sister (and probably her family) and I don't think anyone has the right to ask that. I'd think long and hard about what this 10k is ultimately going to cost you, OP.
I hope your talk with her goes well tonight. Good luck.

vorbis

my family must be really different to some on here. I know if my uncle, aunt heck even sister blatantly defauded someone, they'd be getting no sympathy from our family. Maybe we're a bit weird.

As I said the last time you posted, leaving the money slide means you are humiliated. It will poison your marriage. Your self respect will be in the gutter. The onus is really on your wife to rectify this situation. I remember when I was younger, my mother took the side of an old friend over my father. The argument was that the friend was severely underpaying my mother for land rent.

My father was eventually proved correct but to this day he's still a bit bitter over my mother siding against him.

Milkerman, I'd say continue with the legal action and hope your wife comes around.

TPD

People ask if the 10k is worth more than his marriage, thats a ridiculous question. The fact that the wife is refusing to help on this - still being friendly with the sister, trying to get milkerman to forget about it - shows a real lack of tact and priorities. The least I would expect in this situation is for the wife to acknowledge that the sister has to pay the money back, and put gentle pressure on the sister to pay it back, if only in installments.

Milkerman - while your wife may be in a bad situation at the minute, she has put herself there. She should have the cop on to realise that her sister is holidaying a few times a year with the money that her husband earned by not taking a badly needed holiday for years. I dont think I could be as calm as you in a situation like that, I'd probably demand the money back after the first holiday, let alone the third.

Best of luck with whichever path you do take, though I couldnt imagine you looking at your wife the same way again if you just drop this.

ali.c

milkerman wrote: »

Oh well, time to talk now, please God I can get her to understand.

My point earlier was that perhaps you should try to understand your wifes position rather than convincing her of yours if your with me? first seek to understand and then to be understood and all that.

You talk alot about our interests but again apparantely your wife sees it differently so that is something to sort out.

Tiesto

milkerman wrote: »

Hi Folks,
Maybe I'm an optimist but I don't see this as a choice between 10k or my marriage.
If I cant trust my wife to act in our best interest regardless of who the third party is I cant really trust her at all. I am not looking for excuses to walk out, If I wanted to I could just walk out as so many others do on a daily basis. I just want the ground rules clearly laid out.
The solicitor spoke to my wife because he is a good friend and we mix socially and WE lent this woman the money from OUR shared assets.
Maybe the generation after me earn their money too easily but as a young married man I worked in some proper sh*tholes of places (and still carry the injuries) abroad. Security & stability are important to me, I have witnessed what happens in families where these are absent and WILL NOT let my kids suffer the same fate.
If it comes to a choice between 10k and my wife, my wife wins hands down every time. It just shouldn't come to that choice. If it does there is something fundamentally wrong to start with and I think it would revolve around my wife's priorities.
Oh well, time to talk now, please God I can get her to understand.

I don't believe the choice is between 10k and the wife..
I think we all know its not the 10 k specifically thats the problem.
Its the principal that you were nice enough to LEND her sister out with a very decent sum of money when she needed it and for some reason she doesn't want to pay it back...
The fact that your wife went behind your back to talk to the solicitor about this says so much... I mean what does she think of you... you are the father of her kids.... and she goes behind your back to protect the interests of her sister who screwed ye over..
that is sooooooooooo wrong!

themadchef

Im trying to put myself in your wife's shoes..what would i do?

If its my baby sister who i felt had a tough time..yadda yadda, loaned her the money to help her out of tough spot, not my money...our money and now she refuses to pay back.

I would beg and plead with her to see reason, get her to offer what ever she could afford, jesus, even 50 a week to make the peace. At least attempt some form of effort to pay the loan.

If she loved your wife the way your wife loves her there wouldint be an issue as she would not want to put her marriage under strain..which it so obviously is. Family first, and you are her family now like it or not her sister should come second.

My god with christmas round the bend she should sort this out. I imagine how tough it's going to be for you and truly hope you two can come to some sort of arragment with her.

The Sweeper

I followed this through the last thread and I was one of the people suggesting calm, and seeing it from the wife's point of view and so on. I was also one of the people doing the whole "10k versus marriage versus kids" thing and "don't make your wife choose".

I still stand over what I said last time, because I think that if you have to look your kids in the eye in five years while you have them for a weekend because your ex-wife has them during the week, and tell them "We broke up because your Auntie Whoever wouldn't give me ten grand back and your mum thought I should stop asking for it", well. It speaks for itself really.

However, the fact that your wife went to the solicitor behind your back worries me VASTLY. It smacks of a number of things:

1) Your wife thinks you overreacted, but won't talk to you.

Why can't she talk to you? Why does she feel like she can't approach you instead of the solicitor? What the hell is going on?

2) Your wife has no respect for you.

Some people are odd about money. They assume that people who have more than they do should be more generous with it, without understanding that they wouldn't be generous themselves. People also look at other people's money, and make vast assumptions about how much there is, whether that person can 'afford' things, how much it costs to live and so on. They then use those assumptions to get on their high horse.

Your wife seems to think the 10k isn't a problem, but as a result she's done a lot worse - she's dismissed the importance of your feelings over it and tried to undermine your way of coping with it by going to the solicitor behind your back.

I have to say that would be a dealbreaker for me. Every so often in a marraige, you may encounter something that you just will not ever, ever agree upon. All you can do is agree to disagree, hold fast and hope it passes. If it's a minor or transitory issue, then you may survive it. If not.... well.

I hope your conversation tonight went okay, if only for your kids' sake.

jimmycrackcorm

If I were the op I'd proceed exactly as he is doing. After all the money is also for their kids benefit and his wife knows without admitting that her sister is in the wrong even as much as she tries to defend it. No matter how much acrimony is caused, it will always be the sister-in-laws fault.

Carrigart Exile

I suppose my concern is your wife is telling your sister not too worry, we don't really mean it, if she is then its a waste of time and money engaging the solicitor in the first place. Don't turn this in to a battle over a unretractable principle, that way lies divorce and your kids broken hearts

MIN2511

milkerman

I have followed this topic since your first posted and i am surprised you haven't discussed things with your wife? With all the anger in your threads; not being rude but should you not discuss it with your wife first (at length i mean) Time is precious, and the more you carry this chip on your shoulder the more likely you are to snap soon. It can’t be that difficult to talk to the wife after all you are married to her, share the same room-house and have kids. There is no way you could sleep or eat with her knowing all of this is bothering you?
No matter what anyone says you married this woman, you chose her to be your partner in sickness, wealth, health and all that blah now why can’t you share this problem and let her know the extent of how you feel?
· Talk to the wife
· Talk to the wife
· TALK TO THE WIFE

CrazyNoob

OP I've just read the whole thread,
and 10K isnt alot of money in the long term

If it was me I'd be looking for the money back,
But I'd be talking to my wife

I know you feel like the sister in law is taking the p*ss
but the communication with the wife is more important.

The fact that your wife is not supporting your position is the bigger issue in my opinion.
I'd stress the point of her supporting you and the kids in this matter and that you're happy to move position/negiotiate with the sister in law as long as she is willing to show good faith and pay up, even if in installments.

This 10K could be putting strain on the sister in laws marriagwe also as they may not be in a position to pay.

K_P

Milkerman, it seriously makes my blood boil even thinking of your situation. Your sister-in-law is playing on you and your wife's good nature and she deserves everything that's coming to her. I'm delighted you're pursuing it and I think you're doing it in the best way possible.

However, I can sympathise somewhat with your wife. She's torn between trying to please her sister and her husband. I agree that she should be behind you a bit more on this and it's likely that her indifferent attitude to the money is being interpreted by her sister as permission to not pay it back.

Bottom line, you need to keep talking to your wife about this. The stress of this is probably taking its toll on her too. Tell her you spoke to your solicitor, you know she spoke to him, all that. You'll probably never fully agree on this but it's better than you both doing things behind the other's back.

Thanks for the updates by the way. Really hope this ends well for you.

LegacyUser

I've been following this from the start also. Milkerman, just to let you know it happened to me also. Got stuck with a 12K bill because of being a Guarantor on a loan that the brother in law had. Unlike you, we needed to get a loan out to repay the bill. Ended up paying 16K on it.

As bad as the situation was, I would never have dreamed of going to a solicitor to sort the whole thing out. Myself and my wife just took it as a lesson learned after a while. We did try asking them for it back, get it paid in installments etc but with no luck. What really pissed me off the most about it was people giving their 2cents about the whole fiasco. I just wanted to tell them to f*ck off, mind your own business or help pay it back, not that they ever offered to help!

Finally after nearly 5 years we did get the money back! The whole time we were repaying the loan we still talked with them and still got on. At the end of the day, it is not a nice thing for them to have to go through, they still are family and most importantly to me, I would never put anything like this between myself and my wife!

milkerman

Well we had a long talk last night.
I suggested that my wife talk first for as long as she wished and that I would not interrupt, then it would be my turn & she would not interrupt.
So she started, she made several points - 1. She loves her sister, 2. Her sister has had a difficult marriage, 3. Her sister is still a bag of nerves, 4. My turning legal has caused her terrible upset, 5. Her sister is afraid to visit because of what I might say, 6. 10k is not that much money nowadays, 7. I wont listen and am very unreasonable, 8. I am oblivious to other peoples feelings and their problems. It went on and on and the general gist being that I am an awful bastard.
I made the following points 1. I love my wife, not her sister, 2. I love my kids and want the best future possible for them, 3. I always put the wellbeing of my immediate family first, 4. In the course of my wife's statement she never once mentioned mine or the children's wellbeing, 5. I am really annoyed at my wife's lack of support and underhanded behaviour, 6. I want my wife to recognise the long term damage to our relationship in that my trust has been eroded. 7, The nervous sister is living a jet setter lifestyle with holidays, long weekends, pub thrice weekly, new bf etc
She started crying as I spoke. I asked her to dry her eyes and bear up because this was not going away. I asked her what she wanted me to do. She said she would prefer if I would just forget about the money and let family life get back to normal. I said family life will never be normal because of her sisters behaviour even if the money was paid back. I pointed out that she hadn't once mentioned my wellbeing, weightloss - no holiday- stress - worry.
In the end I agreed not to bite her sisters head off if she visits this weekend. I agreed not to proceed the legal route if her sister starts coughing up straight away. She agreed to sit beside me when we talk to the sister and that she will explain that we need our cash back. She has agreed to not undermine me again.
I showed her this and the previous threads, the various reactions shocked her. Paricularly the ones saying this was a dealbreaker.
Then we went to bed. I hope this is the end of it.

r3nu4l

When I entered into my marriage I didn't just 'take on' my wife. Yes I formed a new family unit consisting of my wife and me but I also took on an extended family and recognised that that could bring it's own problems in the future.

Some families are very close knit, I know mine is! A lot of things have gone wrong for both you and your wife in this...all thanks to her sisters behaviour. I guarantee you that your wife feels terrible about what her sister has done but also terrible and maybe even conflicted about her own responses.

When you talk to the sister this weekend why not agree a repayment timetable, sweep everything else under the table and start as if this weekend was the day you loaned her the money.

If it looks like you are never going to get the 10k back maybe as a last resort you would accept 5k? I know you shouldn't have to but maybe your wife would recognise that you are compromising and she wouldn't think of you as being so hard-hearted and might be more likely to help you pursue her sister for payments? That would be a last resort for me but something you should consider.

Best of luck to you both and your children. I hope it works out and you two can rebuild something good from this

supermouse

milkerman i truly hope this works out for you.

Good luck !!!

Keano

I too hope it works out but the sister in law needs to start coughing up. As some posters have mentioned perhaps getting maybe 50% of the cash back might be a good agreement. As I dont hold out much hope for you of getting 10K back

Amazotheamazing

You've made your point, now you have a very limited oppurtunity to be the "bigger man" and write off part of the debt, ie, show your wife you can compromise etc. It mightn't seem very fair, but you have to accept your wife feels caught in the middle of all this.

Think you should send your kids to the sister for a week next summer and take a proper holiday with your wife.

LouOB

I too have been following this thread since the previous one and my heart goes out to you.

Sounds like you had a really good chat with your wife and that you still love each other very much. I hope your sister-in-law gets the full story on how her actions have cost you both emotionally and financially. She seems to be a very inconsiderate person only thinking about herself.

Please keeep us all informed and I hope you are still taking that break away at christmas with the family.

GhostInTheRuins

Fair play to both of you for being able to have a rational conversation about this touchy subject without it turning into an argument. I hope it all works out for you and your family.

Marksie

I have to admit that it was the best and only way you could have approached it without a serious argument.

I hope from here o in it will improve on all fronts

skywalker

LouOB wrote: »

I hope your sister-in-law gets the full story on how her actions have cost you both emotionally and financially. She seems to be a very inconsiderate person only thinking about herself.

I was going to make this exact point. When you sit down with your wife & her sister for the chat, you really should let her know the situation in its entirety, and the consequences of her poor behavoiur on your family.

Also you should be getting a proper document drawn up which acknowledges that she owes you this money & will be making repairations at a set rate each week/month. Id be looking for a direct debit to cut out the future sob stories too.

To the people saying he should be writing off half the debt at this stage, Why should he do that? She hasnt actually paid ANYTHING back as yet, is my understanding of the situation. She should be rewarded for this with a 50% off voucher?

Pyjamarama

D.T. Jesus wrote: »

Fair play to both of you for being able to have a rational conversation about this touchy subject without it turning into an argument. I hope it all works out for you and your family.

Totally agree, really glad your wife has started to see things from your perspective.

Also I wouldn't accept any less than 10k back, she hasn't paid you a penney since and if this was a bank loan how much interest would she owe? You did her a favour which she has showed no gratitude for, you don't need to do her another one.

Good luck.