For people surviving from poker (or thinking about it)

The_Chopper

This is more a wonderment/rant rather then a question as people might not want to reply with the truth.

I think very few people who live off poker have to contend with things like:
Paying domestic bills (ESB, Oil etc)
Paying rent or a morgage (ie paying an establishment that isn't your family)
So obviously when you say you live off or make a living from the game it's not an entirely true statement.

I know quite a few people however that sub their earnings/student livings with poker money and in my view this is the best way to go about it. Your mind doesn't get bored with only one thing - in fact you're more likely to stay sharper when you have an array of different things going on in your life.

I tried playing poker full time - i completely lost the love (maybe too strong a word) of the game and when variance took a bite out of my arse I had no other incomes (student or otherwise) to ride the storm.

No matter how good a player you are, until you can break through a certain barrier and stop scrapping at low limits you'll always struggle to make a living 100% based on poker.

IMO poker is a very tough living and I would strongly recommend that nobody drop out of college to play the game or think about quitting a good career for it.

Requiem4adream

The_Chopper wrote: »

I tried playing poker full time - i completely lost the love (maybe too strong a word) of the game and when variance took a bite out of my arse I had no other incomes (student or otherwise) to ride the storm.

No matter how good a player you are until you can break through a certain barrier and stop scrapping at low limits you'll always struggle to make a living 100% based on poker.

IMO poker is a very tough living and I would strongly recommend that nobody drop out of college to play the game or think about quitting a good career for it.

Good advice. I dropped out of Business & Legal in UCD after 3 years of a 4 year course, not exactly the best move ive ever made gonna go back n start in 1st year next year probably lol. poker is a really hard way of making an easy living.

Again i think you're dead right to differentiate between making a living off poker and having poker as a sole means of income. The 2 things might sound the 1 and the same but affording a house, car, bills etc and sustaining that through poker is a lot different from living at home (even making 40 - 100k per year from poker) with none of the above.

RoundTower

The_Chopper wrote: »

This is more a wonderment/rant rather then a question as people might not want to reply with the truth.

I think very few people who live off poker have to contend with things like:
Paying domestic bills (ESB, Oil etc)
Paying rent or a morgage (ie paying an establishment that isn't your family)
So obviously when you say you live off or make a living from the game it's not an entirely true statement.

In my opinion everyone who "lives off poker" has to do these things. If someone else pays your bills or you live rent-free with your parents, you don't "live off poker", you live off your parents and win or lose a little spending money playing poker.

ianmc38

id certainly agree with not dropping out of college to pursue poker as a career. fortunately i was finished in uni before I even played poker for more than €20 a go.

However, i disagree with a large amount of the rest of your post.

I have monthly bills which I pay which are the same if not higher than I'd be paying in Ireland.

I'm happier now than I've ever been. I've a diverse range of interests ouside of poker which i regularly engage in here. Poker gives me the free time to visit new places, meet new people and basically do whatever I want when I want. I can choose my own working hours and don't have to take orders from people. I don't get up having underslept and go and do something mundane from 9-5 5 days a week every week of the year with 21 days holiday along the way.

BTW they're just my viewpoints based on previous office job experience. I was never cut out to work in a job like that!

This month I've played a load of 1/2 games, both omaha and holdem, about 1/3rd as much 2/4 and a few 5/10 games. I've made far more than the average industrial wage at 1/2 alone and have played very little compared to how often I usually play.

All that said, I think most people dont have the temperament to become full time players and are probably better off avoiding it.

Ste05

RoundTower wrote: »

In my opinion everyone who "lives off poker" has to do these things. If someone else pays your bills or you live rent-free with your parents, you don't "live off poker", you live off your parents and win or lose a little spending money playing poker.

I certainly always assumed this was the case when people say they "Live off" Poker. Do students that get extra spending money by playing Poker instead of getting a part-time job consider they are "living off" Poker?? Whatever pays for the roof over your head, food on the table and clothes on your back is what you Live off, not where you get your money you spend on drinking/socialising, etc.

I assumed students "Living off" Poker were paying for their rent, books, clothes, food, etc. out of Poker instead of working in some other Part Time job to pay these same Bills. In my mind there is a world of a difference.

zuutroy

I think its definitely person dependent. Its very easy to think you could hack it when you have a real job but it might be a different story when you cut the tether. I think I read a bit by Chris Ferguson that said if you make as much in a year from poker as you did in your real job, then you can begin to consider thinking about going full-time.
Really, dropping out of University to play poker is madness. Fortunately I had a PhD before I knew the rules of poker! [dreamland]If I ever got good enough I'd like to take a year or two off and play full time to see what its like, but only because I have something to fall back on.[/dreamland]

Ace2007

zuutroy wrote: »

Really, dropping out of University to play poker is madness. Fortunately I had a PhD before I knew the rules of poker! [dreamland]If I ever got good enough I'd like to take a year or two off and play full time to see what its like, but only because I have something to fall back on.[/dreamland]

This is spot on imo, and why i believe casino's/online sites should make it manatory that you have to be over 21 to play.

When it comes to playin professionally - how many people do you know that are really playin? as in, not in college or have any or job and just poker.This is not directed toward you zuutory but in general...

Requiem4adream

Ace2007 wrote: »

This is spot on imo, and why i believe casino's/online sites should make it manatory that you have to be over 21 to play.

When it comes to playin professionally - how many people do you know that are really playin? as in, not in college or have any or job and just poker.This is not directed toward you zuutory but in general...

Making a casino 21-mandatory might sound good in principle but not everyone goes on to 3rd-level-education, in fact a sizeable % of people do not, and you would be procluding a large % of people from indulging in the game for no good reason. If they can drink, vote, have sex, smoke etc i see no reason why poker should be a special exception. In fact i dont see many good reasons why students would be an exception in any case, in my experience they are much more likely to view it as a social recreation than burgeoning career-option.

I didnt drop out of college to play poker, i dropped out after some major surgery, plenty of missed time and in general major apathy towards the course at the time. I should have "grinded" it out for another year and a bit though and got the degree, i underplayed my hand for sure.

dvdfan

I eased into playing poker first in my spare time, then i cut it down to part time to have a right good go and lately ive stopped working alltogether to concentrate fully on poker. I dont think im good enough to be playing full time if im honest but because the business i work in is a family business i can go back to it anytime i want for as much or as little hours as i want so if things go wrong i guess i can just swallow my pride and do that but i have no big bills other than an old loan im paying off, dont have a car, family to support, rent is cheap etc so im cheap to keep and i can survive having a few bad weeks, which incidentially im having since i went full time but im sure ill get through and get back on track soon and the good run ive had previous is easily seeing me through.

An internet type bussiness has always appealled to me and ive had one before that wasnt really successful but the reason it appeals to me is because i can live in countries like Poland, Thailand etc where IMO i can live so much better than in Ireland and thats with working alot less because i dont think its possible to play poker for full time hours as i like to take breaks between each session. I know Ian lives very well as he posted a pic of his apartment/mansion in Thailand and im sure hell tell you how far your money can go better than i can but from what i remember last time i was in Thailand i rented out a fine compact apartment with a Gym, Bar, Restaurant, Security, Laundromat all for 250 euro a month.

From what i remember the meals in the restaurant in the hotel start for as little as €1.50 and it was a fine meal, drink was only €1 or so for pint bottles from recolection so you can see if your only making a half decent living from poker you could live like a king over there. That might not suit people with familys in Ireland or that had high earning jobs and there standard of living is already very high but for someone simple and easygoing like me its great. The Gym and Laundromat were all included in the price.

Another important thing would be how you manage your money because you need to keep a nest egg for times when you hit a purple patch, thats the big difference between poker and a full time job and if your just spending everything in front of you when your doing well your going to be in trouble when things go south.

Mr.Plough

i enjoy it and it allows me to not have to work during college, which keeps me happy. Just paid for a trip to amsterdam solely by poker which feels pretty good aswell


im still a student bum obviously though


edit - i intend to play alot more when i finish 4th year but i would never contemplate dropping out of college to play full time. I'm not good enough and it would lose its appeal pretty quickly.

Macspower

unfortunately I have all the above to contend with and a family to support from a sole income of poker.....

littlebitfishy

You should not leave college for the sole reason to play full time poker,some people do it as a stop gap but the ups and downs of pro poker is usually too much to grasp especially for a young person who has no experience with bankroll management and paying bills(rent,electric,gas,clothes,holidays)It can be a very good living but not many players get through life without going broke and i believe you can learn alot from going broke,a lesson of life so to speak...

I have been playing poker for 9 years,on a part time/full time basis.I worked in a job where work is always available so there is little pressure of going broke and i am very realistic that with a bad downswing i can be back at work after 3-4 months but after many years i am prepared for that although not expecting it any time soon.

As Ian says it is very person dependant the life of a pro poker,if it suits you an you enjoy it and your head stays above water doing something you like goodluck and make sure you enjoy what your doing...

Macspower

Just re read the thread again and I have to agree with Chopper when it comes to not giving up a job/college to play....

I am very disiplined when it comes to my "wages" and withdraw the same ammount every month... win or loose ..... whatever level I'm playing at....

Only thing that is hurting lately is the USD exchange... I now have to withdraw more each month to make the same.... and I havn't moved up levels to compensate...

I'm living off it and learning as I go along.... I've been way down on hours lately as I'm building a new house and doing a lot of work on it myself but poker has afforded me the chance to do this and what I will save by being there and doing a it myself will be more than some earn in a year....

It's not just the money from the job but the freedom it allows you ....

I think your mindset for the game of poker has to be different to "normal" people and I find myself becoming more detached from my emotions by the day..... good or bad thing I dont know.... but the beats don't bother me anymore as I now understand "the long term"! (doesn't mean I have to like them though)

I meet a lot of people who play "professionally" but I often ask myself the questions that Chopper raised.... I think there is a difference....
The way I look at it ... right now I'm playing full time and managing to make a living but won't ever be rich from it at my levels... so taking a job at some stage or restarting a business is not ruled out for me at any stage and I wouldn't consider it failure if/when I do go back "working"

littlebitfishy

Your right macspower!!!You can't look at going back to work a failure.If you choose to go back to work or forced.It's a learning curve and it is a good lesson.At the time when you go back to work it does and will feel like failure but pro poker is person dependant and if it's for you you will jump back on the horse.
I felt the same with emotions in poker anyway,after awhile bad beats are just a part of the game and the most impotant thing is the long run and tilt control when on a downswing and keep practising good bankroll management.

nicnicnic

I gave up a job two years ago and poker has supported me since however I'm thinking of only playing poker part-time next year and becoming a professional sports better.

zuutroy

nicnicnic wrote: »

I'm thinking of only playing poker part-time next year and becoming a professional sports better.

Did a bit of sports betting & betfair trading in my spare time last year...Sports betting is so, so laborious, boring and lonely if you want to make a shot of it. I happily gave it up even though I'd found quite a few regular profitable trades. Good luck though!

DeadMoney

I used to think that people who made their living off playing poker lived an absolute dream, but i can now imagine some of the very tough obstacles which full time players face. For one thing, sitting in front of you're computer for tons of hours grinding it out can obviously become very repetitive. Most jobs are quite repetitive anyway so i wouldn't mind this as such. The thing I imagine to be the hardest part is personally dealing with the swings involved. Atleast when you have a bad day at work, you still walk out in the evening having made some money. But every player from time to time goes through bad patches and this can leave you very stressed and often take a nice chunk off you're BR.
I think it's still a job like anything else and has a lot in common with most grinds. However, if somebody can balance their personal life well with poker as a sole means of income, and cope well with the swings, I think it's a really cool way of making a living. Of course anybody doing this successfully at any proper levels is obviously a very solid player which is the most important requirement, respectfully.
I really envy the way that pro players are their own boss. Being able to take time off when ever they need to and travel, not take orders from people, and of course sleeping in late are a few of the most attractive sounding elements, imo. Not to be forgotten (for some players), being nicely minted sounds quite good too!!

mewso

Thank god for Ian's post tbh. I'm getting a little tired of all these cautionary threads popping up.

Lazare

musician wrote: »

Thank god for Ian's post tbh. I'm getting a little tired of all these cautionary threads popping up.

Me too Muso, I was just about to call these guys

mewso

Lazare wrote: »

Me too Muso, I was just about to call these guys

To teach them poker?

Lafortezza

I don't know how people play for 4+ hours every day. The grind of putting in 2 or 3 days of solid poker really turns me off the idea of ever doing it full time.

dvdfan

lafortezza wrote: »

I don't know how people play for 4+ hours every day. The grind of putting in 2 or 3 days of solid poker really turns me off the idea of ever doing it full time.

I play about 4-5 hours a day maybe 4-6 days a week but i usually play for maybe 1.5hr in the morning, then might go for a game of pitch and putt/Gym or go to town do some bits and bobs, then put in another 1.5-2hrs then usually go for my afternoon/evening nap and then ill put in another session later in the night and off to bed....rinse and repeat go for a few beers at the weekend and a small break from poker and back fresh as a daisy Monday morning. Putting in more than 2 hours at a time really feels like grinding though and i dont do it anymore.

Lafortezza

Yeah but even if you're running reasonably well do you actually enjoy 6 tabling day after day? How do you deal with a lengthy bad run? Do you still put your head down and grind?

cooker3

I rarely do 3 sessions, mainly 2 and if I am feeling particulary lazy like today 1. I am so lazy, I am bearly going to hit 20k hands this month.

DeVore

I dont think anyone should leave college to play poker, it just seems like a really bad idea strategically no matter how much you are "killing" the game.

I like the term "semi pro". Waterford paid for my rent and ESB this month (after the ex's are taken into account) but I dont want to be reliant on that income each and every month... its great for some serious spending money though and can allow you some freedoms you might not otherwise get but very few can really make a living from it, I mean a good living.

DeV.

Requiem4adream

musician wrote: »

Thank god for Ian's post tbh. I'm getting a little tired of all these cautionary threads popping up.

With all due respect living the life of Reilly in Thailand where the cost of living is a fraction of our own is all well n good, it's not very representative though. You could work in McDonalds for 5 years here and save enough to achieve the same standard of living over there.

As for cautionary tales, i'd prefer to err on the side of caution than to lean towards tall tales of success and grandeur. This is a total guess but i imagine only a small % of Boardsies earn 100k+ consistently year-upon-year through poker as a sole means of income. I would go so far as to assume that a microscopic % of Boardsies have bought their own house outright (no mortgage) in Ireland as a pure result of poker earnings.

The Chopper is just offering his own opinion and is entitled to do so. Put it this way, i dont envisage many Career Guidance Counsellors advocating a career in poker in seconday schools in the future. Anyone looking to pursue a career in poker will be smart enough to realise there is success and failure achievable, words of caution should be heeded just as much as words of encouragement.

NickyOD

ianmc38 wrote: »

id certainly agree with not dropping out of college to pursue poker as a career. fortunately i was finished in uni before I even played poker for more than €20 a go.

However, i disagree with a large amount of the rest of your post.

I have monthly bills which I pay which are the same if not higher than I'd be paying in Ireland.

I'm happier now than I've ever been. I've a diverse range of interests ouside of poker which i regularly engage in here. Poker gives me the free time to visit new places, meet new people and basically do whatever I want when I want. I can choose my own working hours and don't have to take orders from people. I don't get up having underslept and go and do something mundane from 9-5 5 days a week every week of the year with 21 days holiday along the way.

BTW they're just my viewpoints based on previous office job experience. I was never cut out to work in a job like that!

+1

Jeez Chopper there's no need to paint such a dark picture.

Anyone who quits college for poker didn't want to do what what they were studying anyway, and probably would have left it to do something else. No one goes into playing full time thinking "This is me set for life now". Everyone (at least I think everyone) goes into it with an open mnd, and I don't tihnk anyone who fails at is terribly shocked when they do.

I pay bills (lots of them) and rent. I have savings. I have a girlfriend and responsibilities. I have lots of hobbies and I get out of the house as much as I can.

My life is exactly the same as anyone who runs his own small business.

mewso

Requiem4adream wrote: »

As for cautionary tales, i'd prefer to err on the side of caution than to lean towards tall tales of success and grandeur. This is a total guess but i imagine only a small % of Boardsies earn 100k+ consistently year-upon-year through poker as a sole means of income. I would go so far as to assume that a microscopic % of Boardsies have bought their own house outright (no mortgage) in Ireland as a pure result of poker earnings.

The Chopper is just offering his own opinion and is entitled to do so. Put it this way, i dont envisage many Career Guidance Counsellors advocating a career in poker in seconday schools in the future. Anyone looking to pursue a career in poker will be smart enough to realise there is success and failure achievable, words of caution should be heeded just as much as words of encouragement.

My point is I don't need 10 threads about disaster, being careful playing poker etc. etc. I know that some folks do well from the game and others don't. I don't dispute whats being said here I just don't need to hear it over and over it again.

The_Chopper

NickyOD wrote: »

+1

Jeez Chopper there's no need to paint such a dark picture.

Anyone who quits college for poker didn't want to do what what they were studying anyway, and probably would have left it to do something else. No one goes into playing full time thinking "This is me set for life now". Everyone (at least I think everyone) goes into it with an open mnd, and I don't tihnk anyone who fails at is terribly shocked when they do.

It can be a bleek picture and something I think you can understand after seeing the dark side. I know quite a few people who have dropped out of college and now play poker as their sole means of income. None of them are "living the dream" - in fact it's a painful grind.

musician wrote: »

My point is I don't need 10 threads about disaster, being careful playing poker etc. etc. I know that some folks do well from the game and others don't. I don't dispute whats being said here I just don't need to hear it over and over it again.

If I had seen another thread on this I wouldn't have posted this. But how are 10 cautionery threads a bad thing. There are new people coming to this forum all the time reading how player X just won 10K, player Y got to final table of waterford etc - it's painted as very glamerous and very tempting.

Requiem4adream wrote: »

With all due respect living the life of Reilly in Thailand where the cost of living is a fraction of our own is all well n good, it's not very representative though. You could work in McDonalds for 5 years here and save enough to achieve the same standard of living over there.

As for cautionary tales, i'd prefer to err on the side of caution than to lean towards tall tales of success and grandeur. This is a total guess but i imagine only a small % of Boardsies earn 100k+ consistently year-upon-year through poker as a sole means of income. I would go so far as to assume that a microscopic % of Boardsies have bought their own house outright (no mortgage) in Ireland as a pure result of poker earnings.

The Chopper is just offering his own opinion and is entitled to do so. Put it this way, i dont envisage many Career Guidance Counsellors advocating a career in poker in seconday schools in the future. Anyone looking to pursue a career in poker will be smart enough to realise there is success and failure achievable, words of caution should be heeded just as much as words of encouragement.

The Thailand thing that came up in this thread I think is about Ian and I say "well done", nice one. You're obviously very good and very successful and one of the few that can actually make a living 100% from poker.

DeVore wrote: »

I dont think anyone should leave college to play poker, it just seems like a really bad idea strategically no matter how much you are "killing" the game.

I like the term "semi pro". Waterford paid for my rent and ESB this month (after the ex's are taken into account) but I dont want to be reliant on that income each and every month... its great for some serious spending money though and can allow you some freedoms you might not otherwise get but very few can really make a living from it, I mean a good living.

DeV.

Great point - this is exactly how I see poker in my life at the moment. Hopefully they can pay off my loans!!!

AdMMM

I play poker to help ease my way through college. I still maintain a part time job that I'll keep no matter what (job = reality). If I have a good week, I spend it - it's extra income for me. If I have a bad week, I don't go out as much or buy as much crap but I still have the income from my job which in itself is enough to get me through the week.

I can't imagine me doing it any other way!

RoundTower

lafortezza wrote: »

I don't know how people play for 4+ hours every day. The grind of putting in 2 or 3 days of solid poker really turns me off the idea of ever doing it full time.

Most people spend more time than that at work, 4 hours a day is a half day for a lot of people.

GrangeUtd

ianmc38 wrote: »

I don't get up having underslept and go and do something mundane from 9-5 5 days a week every week of the year with 21 days holiday along the way.

thx for summing up current existence!!

my jobs not so bad I work in fraud for a big internet company.

But the underslept part is so on the money.

I have over 10000$ in tournamnet wins online in the last year and I rarely play them cause of donkaments and all that!!
I also made about 5000 dollars playing cash since i solely concentrated on it since the July. Which has paid for a lot of a 03d car and also a months hoildays in Austarilia in January

The problem is i am on a pc for 40 hours a week and probably another 30+ at home which is too much and it takes its toll physically. I play a lot of football also which is my only saving grace but my diet is atrocious and i am always in front of the pc eating takeaways.

I would love to play fulltime but the pressures would be differnet went it means you are putting bread on the table.

So i plan to move up levels etc. in the coming year and take it from there.

So to everyone that plays fulltime succesfully a sincere well done and it gives me hope. Though having a job is generally a good thing and it can never be looked upon as step backwards for those who have tried to play fulltime and not suceeded.

p.s Ianmc38 coach me!!!:D

BigCityBanker

NickyOD wrote: »

I pay bills (lots of them) and rent. I have savings. I have a girlfriend and responsibilities. I have lots of hobbies and I get out of the house as much as I can.

why do you feel the need to tell lies?

ianmc38

Requiem4adream wrote: »

With all due respect living the life of Reilly in Thailand where the cost of living is a fraction of our own is all well n good, it's not very representative though. You could work in McDonalds for 5 years here and save enough to achieve the same standard of living over there.

Well in fairness, this is true for some people who live in Thailand. However, my monthly expenses are far higher than I would pay in Ireland. I pay €1800 per month for a one bed serviced apartment. I eat out in good restaraunts at least once a day where a meal costs about €20 or more. My mobile phone bill is equivalent to what i'd pay in ireland because I regularly make international calls. The clothes i buy are the same price as they would cost in any clothes shop back home.

So, I dont think anyone who works in McDonalds could afford a comparable lifestyle.

It's certainly possible to live a nice life here with a budget of about $1000 per month, but it doesn't really appeal to me too much, certainly not in Bangkok anyways.

Ste05

ianmc38 wrote: »

I pay €1800 per month for a one bed serviced apartment.

:eek: :eek: Where the fcuk are you living that costs that much for a 1 bet apartment!! What does "serviced" include?? :rolleyes:

The_Chopper

I think McDonalds in Thailand is more expensive then McDonalds here (at least the fancy ones).

One thing that has come to mind is when you get up to go to work you have a sense of achievement and been. When you go to bed at night you feel you've acomplished something. When I played poker for a living I could do anything from one day to the next with no structure or discipline (much like been a student actually). It destroyed my health, I gained weight, am completly unfit (HJ, Cardshark and all the boys can confirm this) - I wonder why we never see supermodels regularly sitting at poker tables???

If you have amazing self dicipline and amazing skill at poker then you have a chance - but don't kid yourself and always leave yourself something to fall back on

ianmc38

The fact that you gained weight and became completely unfit is your own lifestyle choice. I do weights 3 days a week and do a light cardio routine every other day (20 minutes jogging, 10 minutes cross training). I have an excellent diet and eat 3 good well balanced meals every day. I sleep for about 7 or 8 hours a night and get up most mornings between 7 and 9 am.

For a while, I was in the same boat, never exercised, lacked motivation to do anything, but then I realised, thats a really sh*t lifestyle and not one I'm happy with. What you do with your own body is down to yourself. If you want to become a lazy fcuk and sit on your ass playing poker all day, eating garbage and never exercising, sleeping through the day, well that's your decision. You can't blame that on poker.

As for a sense of achievement, I did get some sense of this when I worked in my old job. But now, I have an even greater sense of this. Being able to sustain a lifestyle that enables me to have the free time to do anything I want to do at any time is a great accomplishment in my eyes and it's one shared by lots of other people I know who play poker full time.

And as for models, what about Patrick Antonius? He's dreamy!

Oh and Ste, not that kind of service unfortunately. Basically means I have a cleaner on call, newspaper delivered every morning, free gym , swimming pool, loads of other amenities etc.

The_Chopper

ianmc38 wrote: »

The fact that you gained weight and became completely unfit is your own lifestyle choice. I do weights 3 days a week and do a light cardio routine every other day (20 minutes jogging, 10 minutes cross training). I have an excellent diet and eat 3 good well balanced meals every day. I sleep for about 7 or 8 hours a night and get up most mornings between 7 and 9 am.

For a while, I was in the same boat, never exercised, lacked motivation to do anything, but then I realised, thats a really sh*t lifestyle and not one I'm happy with. What you do with your own body is down to yourself. If you want to become a lazy fcuk and sit on your ass playing poker all day, eating garbage and never exercising, sleeping through the day, well that's your decision. You can't blame that on poker.

Wasn't there a whole thread on how poker is bad for your health? So it's not just me and a lazy lifestyle.

I hardly call eating rat meat in bangkok healthy What restaurants are you going to when they are charging €20 - are they cutting the meat of the person in front of you?

Again I'll say you need extreme discipline more so then studying/working/family. You seem to be one of the few exceptions to my whole arguement. So would you recommend playing poker as a sole means of earnings?

ianmc38

The_Chopper wrote: »

Wasn't there a whole thread on how poker is bad for your health? So it's not just me and a lazy lifestyle.

I hardly call eating rat meat in bangkok healthy What restaurants are you going to when they are charging €20 - are they cutting the meat of the person in front of you?

Again I'll say you need extreme discipline more so then studying/working/family. You seem to be one of the few exceptions to my whole arguement. So would you recommend playing poker as a sole means of earnings?

The whole thing about poker being bad for your health is based on how you let it affect you personally. If you have the right frame of mind then I don't see it as being an unhealthy pasttime/occupation. It's stupid to say oh i started playing poker fulltime and I became an unhealthy degenerate. Dont blame it on poker. Blame it on yourself for having the wrong attitude and not ensuring you keep your body and mind healthy, as well as pursuing other interests outside of poker on a regular basis.

If a person has the right mentality, the skill, the bankroll and the right emotional state of mind to play poker full time, then I would recommend it. It's the best lifestyle change that has ever happened in my life.

However, most people dont have all of the above so will be destined for failure and thus it's not a good choice for most people imho.

dvdfan

Now that i play poker for 4-5 hours a day and get up whenever i want i find ive alot more time to go to the Gym now then i did when i was working full time (Which is why im a fat bastard) so i agree with Ian that its your own choice and i cant see how playing poker professionally which is basically a part time job can effect your health any more than a full time job when youve an extra 3-4 hours a day free, although if you had a full time job and played poker in your spare time i could see it leading to very little time to do anything else.

I like playing poker, i look forward to each session i play even when im running bad im looking to turn things around (i was down $500 dollars for the whole month last month which is terrible for someone supposed to be making a living out of this). I still managed to get a nice trip away for 4 days completely paid for by my poker winnings the previous month though simply because i was clever with the money i won the previous month and as i said before i can live cheap, dont know if i could live for $1000 a month in Thailand either, in not that cheap:D but i guess im under pressure this month to make a few k as christmas is approaching but for me this is absolutely brillaint to be able to be my own boss and do something i love doing. Saying that im a newbie to this poker thing so maybe the novelty will wear off in the future but i doubt it. If i felt that poker was a grind everyday i dont think i would choose this path but if you like doing something it just comes natural and part of your day.

Also i think that thread was more about how bad sleeping patterns effect your health i.e nightshift, i rarely play past 1am so this wouldnt effect me although i did work nights before and i loved it more than any other shift especially morning shift so maybe im a bit nocturnal

The_Chopper

ianmc38 wrote: »

The whole thing about poker being bad for your health is based on how you let it affect you personally. If you have the right frame of mind then I don't see it as being an unhealthy pasttime/occupation. It's stupid to say oh i started playing poker fulltime and I became an unhealthy degenerate. Dont blame it on poker. Blame it on yourself for having the wrong attitude and not ensuring you keep your body and mind healthy, as well as pursuing other interests outside of poker on a regular basis.

So to clarify:
You want to play poker for a living and prefer live. 90% of live tournies happen between say 8pm and 3am (if you do well). All the better cash games happen say between 8pm and 8am. Lets assume you go down that route when playing live. It's unhealthy generally for a number of reasons:
- It's hard to get proper fresh food, leaving you the option of chips/pizza and chinese
- You're sleeping pattern goes completely out of whack and leads to constantly feeling like a zombie
- you play surrounding by people who don't wash there hands and smell (ie waterford) and get sick.
- Due to the above your immune system weakens and could lead to you get sick more frequently.
- When playing long sessions you do little to no exercise at all and when the session is finished you go to bed,

In saying all that - I like your approach to things and see how it could work from a health perspectous

dvdfan

The_Chopper wrote: »

I hardly call eating rat meat in bangkok healthy What restaurants are you going to when they are charging €20 - are they cutting the meat of the person in front of you?

The Rat Meat is actually prepared quite hygienically and looks quite tasty, dont tell me you wouldnt eat one of those on the way home from a feed of beer:p

http://www.mediafire.com/?8kxbjt03qm3

€20 would easily feed me for the week over there but each to their own as im not much into eating out anyway and i just want to find somewhere nice to fill me tummy and if your into eating out in a fancy restaurant €20 is still a bargain compared to what youd pay here.

pok3rplaya

If you want to play live poker for a living in Ireland you need your head examined full stop.

ianmc38

Lol completely agree with pokerplaya. Whatever about playing live occasionally for a laugh or for a change of pace from online. I like playing in the casino now and then , but I'd hate to do it day in day out. I used to play live all the time and its a horrible existence. Furthermore, you're playing one table at small stakes so you're winrate is going to be much less than what can be sustained online. Maybe if you played in vegas it would be different, but even there I'd hate to spend 5 days a week in casinos as a full time job.

Hitman Actual

ianmc38 wrote: »

The whole thing about poker being bad for your health is based on how you let it affect you personally. If you have the right frame of mind then I don't see it as being an unhealthy pasttime/occupation. It's stupid to say oh i started playing poker fulltime and I became an unhealthy degenerate. Dont blame it on poker. Blame it on yourself for having the wrong attitude and not ensuring you keep your body and mind healthy, as well as pursuing other interests outside of poker on a regular basis.

Some good points there. I think that people stuck in dead-end, mind-numbing jobs are more likely to turn into lazy unhealthy slobs. I'm sure we all know plenty of them.

One problem I'd have with having to play poker full-time is that I don't think I could ever get any sort of intellectual challenge/satisfaction out of it. I'd really worry that it would become one of those mind-numbing jobs that I swore I'd never end up in (and thankfully didn't).

The_Chopper

Surely the biggest thing about playing online poker in the social aspect. Let me elaborate:
If I work - I work with people. Even if you hate everyone you work with you will occasionally play soccer, go on a team building exercise or even to the pub. All this burns up energy and fat (granted if you drink loads you will gain weight, ignore for now). Even talking sh*te to people consumes energy.

Playing online has next to no physical interaction with anyone really. You go out less and do less activities meaning you really need to motivate yourself to go to the gym, for walks etc as there is nobody to interact with.

When you play live poker you have the interaction aspect - but you're generally to tired to do anything and the hours that you keep would be that to make doing normal activities almost impossible,.

ianmc38

The_Chopper wrote: »

Playing online has next to no physical interaction with anyone really. You go out less and do less activities meaning you really need to motivate yourself to go to the gym, for walks etc as there is nobody to interact with.

But all of this is subjective. You make these decisions. You have the choice whether or not you want to do these things. If you can't motivate yourself, well that's a personal issue and shouldn't be used as a generalisation.

In terms of social interaction, I would agree that's the only downside to no longer working in an office. I worked with a deadly group of people, all slightly older than me but with similar interests and general outlooks on life.

I don't see why poker should inhibit any other forms of social interaction though outside of the time your friends spend in college/place of work. I hung out with all my friends pretty much everyday of the week back home...

Ste05

The_Chopper wrote: »

So to clarify:
You want to play poker for a living and prefer live. 90% of live tournies happen between say 8pm and 3am (if you do well). All the better cash games happen say between 8pm and 8am.

If you prefer Live, move to Vegas, but being a professional Live tournament player in Ireland is just laughable. Even Live cash would seem like a complete waste of a life, and it'd be a pretty sh1tty life IMO, no money, such small games to try and Live off, you'd need a huge win-rate and would have to put in some savage hours, leading to even less freetime then a working 9-5 stiff. All IMO.

Being a Live Pro is not even an option for anyone in Ireland, if you can't play on-line then Poker isn't an option for you as a career.

CelticPhantom

ianmc38 wrote: »

In terms of social interaction, I would agree that's the only downside to no longer working in an office. I worked with a deadly group of people, all slightly older than me but with similar interests and general outlooks on life.

I know lots of people who work from home - none of them at poker. All of them have said that it is great for the first while, but soon they miss the interaction. Even the possibility of turning to the person beside you and asking a question which they could answer in 30 seconds is gone. Working from home is not all it is cracked up to be. This applies whether your playing poker or sitting in front of your PC doing "office work".

Also I am one of those people who is underslept. This leads me to want to eat high sugar or high fat foods, not want to exercise (I am knackered - what do I want to tire myself even further for?) and not be as motivated to find ways to live healthily. This is before I even knew about poker!!!

These things happen whether you are playing poker or not. I am living (albeit unhealthily) proof of this;)

ianmc38

Yes celticphantom but again thats nobodies fault but your own. if you're undersleeping go to bed earlier. Eat healthier foods. Saying you're underslept as an excuse for eating high fat foods is a joke. If you want sugar, eat some fruit which contains fructose.

It's very easy to say oh I have to work so hard I never get the time to fit in any exercise and so on. The bottom line is we're all responsible for our own bodies and how we maintain them. This includes personal fitness, diet, sleeping patterns etc. if you want to abuse it and come up with some lame excuses for why you cant do this then that's fair enough, but you're only fooling yourself.

The reality is anyone with sufficient motivation can easily keep themselves healthy. Get up an hour earlier and go for a run. Read the wealth of information on the internet about balanced diets and nutrition. Just stop blaming other factors on things which are your own responsibility to look after.

By the way I smoke about 10 cigarettes a day, so I'm not exactly at peak fitness, but I'm pretty healthy as far as smokers go...

pok3rplaya

Since when do all your friends need to hail from your workplace?