Videogames Club

Retr0gamer

First post of hopefully many.

The first game that I'm going to recommend will be Robotron 2084 which I've recently fallen in love with. I pioneered the dual joystick system, one to move the other to choose the direction of fire, that we see in every xboxlive arcade game these days.

The game is notoriously tough but also very addictive. Some tips for people starting out:

It might be counter intuitive but staying close to enforcers (the annyoing flying guys that look like buggenheim (sp?) from FFVII fire slower the closer you are to them.

The game is very tough and you will die often. However the design takes this into account. It's very easy to obtain extra lives in the game so make sure you rescue as many civilians as possible since they are your ticket to more lives.

The game is emulated in mame and available on xbox live arcade. You will be better off using a pad with dual analogue due to the unique control scheme.

We need to make up a rota for who chooses the games, so post here if you are interested.

deadl0ck

So - how long have we to play/test the game ?

Retr0gamer

Say what you think of it whenever you want. A new game will be choosen by someone else next Tuesday so anytime before then. Play it as much or as little as you want.

CiDeRmAn

Hate those feckin' tanks, always got stuck on the tanks, this is the game I'd give a kidney to have at home in it's original arcade format, otherwise I have versions on nearly every format I've got, it's a beauty of a game,
For affordability therefore I'd recommend the Xbox Live edition, as the pad has a handy two sticks already!

Retr0gamer

I keep getting stuck on wave 9 as well. Bloody tanks, although I probably get killed more by enforcers. Some of the top scores on xbox live are just crazy, can't believe some people can obtain them, it's superhuman.

It's amazing that a game thats going on 25 years old is so damn good and addictive. It gives modern shoot'em ups a good run for their money and is hard to beat in carnage stakes. The graphics are also excellent, love the dissolution effects when you kill an enemy or the weird effects when you start stage 10. Goes to show that with very little power and a good art style you can still make a great looking game. For me it's a tiemless classic and I can't believe I only just discovered it now despite having read so much about it. God bless Xbox Live arcade. (I did think I wasted my money on it at first but after 30 minutes I realised I loved it and wasn't going to stop playing anytime soon )

CiDeRmAn

I have it on the PS as well, a Tempest 2000 style update, Tempest X, not quite the same but not bad.
I've got a decent version on the Megadrive and a nifty one on the GBA.
I used to hate the brain thingys until realised that if you kill them all bar one quickly you can then rack up some serious points picking up Moms, nice, grab an extra life on the way.
Mention should go out to the spiritual sequels Smash TV and and Total Carnage, Super Smash TV on the Snes was awesome.

Trode

Somehow, I'd never actually played Robotron before. I loved Smash TV and played a few different versions, and had this sitting there for a while, but I just never got around to it. Now I have, and it is excellent. Perhaps not as excellent as I had been led to believe, but I'm still laughably bad at it, and it's one of the rare games that makes me really want to be good at it, so my feelings could change. It's definitely a 'one more go' kind of thing, all the more so when my goes tend to average at about 40 seconds. I probably would have ignored it in an arcade, had one go, swore at it's ludicrous difficulty and never spent money on it again, but MAME is great for giving games like this a chance to shine for the differently skilled* gamer like myself.

*crap

Roar

bright colours!

never even heard this before, gave it a go on midways site

http://www.midway.com/classicGames/robotron/robotron.html

but you'd need about 40 fingers to play it on keyboard

anyone know how i can get my ps2 pad to work with mame?

Dr Bob

ps2 to usb adaptor, I think Game does them , and you should be able to map it under mames config screen (tab calls it up , I think)

Roar

yeah i have one of those, but mame don't seem to recognise it..

ah well

deadl0ck

You'll need to use MAME32 to use that, not standard MAME
It should be fine then, once you configure it in Control Panel

hamster

Just tried Robotron tonight and back to work tomorrow and busy solid for next 3 days. Bah! Retr0Gamer and folks - that game is a *gem* !!! I only played it for 2 games and wow - it has that classic playability and captures the best point of games back then! By the way, I love the rating comments it gives you on your score. Keep playing this game!
The Mame version is beautiful! Zipping this game with me on my travels tomorrow.

deadl0ck

Weird that you picked Robotron actually....
I've just moved my MAME cab and set it up 2 weeks ago (after it had being lying dormant for almost a year), and discovered Robotron, just before you suggested it.

It's an absolutely fantastic game!! It's gotta be one of the best arcade games I've played.

If this videogames club allows me to discover games on par with Robotron, that I didn't know, about it's gonna be a games filled Christmas for me

Dr Bob

gave this a quick blast yesterday ,(mame32 and an aldi usb dual analog controller) good fun but a lot harder than I remember.
..and to think I used to think smash tv/total carnage were hard
I have the midways greatest hits pack on the ps2 (all of them actually) must give it a dig out and play it on the big screen.

Retr0gamer

I find smash TV to be a much tougher beast, I'm horrendous at it but in robotron at least I can hold my own until after wave 5 when the sh*t hits the fan.

trout

Robotron, Smash TV and similar games always make me feel terribly inadequate

I'm just hopeless at them.

Can we have a nice old fashioned side-scrolling shooter next ?

Retr0gamer

trout wrote: »

Can we have a nice old fashioned side-scrolling shooter next ?

I hope someone picks an evil bullet hell shooter like Mars Matrix just for you

Are there any 'nice' side scrolling shooters? Defender is the most evil for me. It's up there with Robotron in the difficulty stakes.

brianon

I love Robotron. But Smash TV wins it for me although its an exceptionally tough game. As is Robotron.

Retr0gamer

Your turn to pick a game deadl0ck

deadl0ck

Cool.

So how the hell do I come up one one as good as Robotron !!!

Right - I'm gonna go for another arcade game, it's one I used to play in the chipper beside school WAYYYY back....

It's.... Choplifter (The bootleg version works)

It's pretty tough, but I used to enjoy it.

deadl0ck

Jebus.....

Is it so bad that it doesn't even warrant a comment ???

trout

deadl0ck wrote: »

Jebus.....

Is it so bad that it doesn't even warrant a comment ???

Here's a comment. I remember the first version of this game on the Apple II. One of the lads in school got a copy from his uncle in America.
The disk was labelled "Pascal source code" and we could only play it at lunch time on the school's one and only computer.
The teachers thought we are working on programs for a pilot Comp. Science scheme the Department of Education was running. Ah, the innocence.

I remember seeing the arcade game some years later, I think in the Airport, and being blown away by the difference in graphics and especially sound ... bet it looks cheesy now.

Man, I am feeling so old right now.

Still ... it was a good game in it's day, and I will give it a blast tomorrow

djsim

Choplifter - Now there is game that takes me back in time. I remember seeing this game way back in the "so called" arcade section out in Shannon Airport. This game was there along with UN Squadron. I found choplifter very hard at the time (was only a wee young lad)

I will play the game tonight and comment more tomorrow.

Dr Bob

I'll have a crac at it via mame tonight .
I remember the Atari 8bit version myself

Jerichoholic

I'll give it a go later on too.

Trode

I've been playing this, and it's great, although killing the hostages is much too easy and fun to make progress easy. There are a couple of irritations, the point at which the screen decides to scroll is frustratingly inconsistent, and the Defender-esque 'press button to turn around' thing I've never liked, but all in all a good and unfairly overlooked game. Good pick, deadl0ck.

I'd also recommend the SNES update, although it's a good but easier than this.

trout

So I gave Choplifter a rattle today, for old times sake. I have mixed feelings about it - It hasn't aged well, and the scrolling is irksome, but it is quite satisfying and fun to play

I seem to remember it being much harder when I was a kid, I suppose we have all evolved a little since then.

What I do like about it is it's the first game I remember playing that was obviously the work of a team, and it was so well polished & "produced", with references to the original coder and the original publisher ... I don't remember seeing that before in an arcade game. It also had an attract mode that featured a backstory ... about the evil Bungeling Empire, and how the POW's were held captive.

I like the way you can fly in different directions to the one you are facing, like a real chopper. The animation, for 1985 is pretty smooth, and the graphics are cute enough.

Maybe the nostalgia factor is high today, but I remember being pleased at playing a game of "rescue the good guys", and feeling bad if I shot or squashed a hostage.

Also, I think this is one of the first games to appear on a home PC or console first, and then becoming an arcade game, as opposed to an arcade port. The upscale really worked well, if you consider the Apple II version.

All in all, it's a cool game and well worth the time spent.

Good choice, deadl0ck

Retr0gamer

Had a go of it there myself. I'm rather impressed, thought it would have aged badly. The gameplay is addictive and still holds up today. I'm also rather impressed by the graphics. It looks rather gorgeous for a game from 1985 since it was one of the first games on the 16-bit Z80 hardware that would be the basis for the Megadrive. The animation on the helicopter is really impressive, you would swear it was sprite rotation if you didn't look hard enough. The parallax scrolling is great and it was on of the first games to use it. Nice one deadl0ck.

CiDeRmAn

I too played it on an Apple IIe back in the computer lab in school, it was not all that good then, too many games on the Spectrum and C64 were better and I think time has left it behind.
Not really good enough to polish Robotrons shoes!

deadl0ck

Over to you CiDeRmAn

trout

I think I'm up next ... according to the rota in the sticky

Sticking with the same era - mid 80's, I would like to nominate Salamander.

In college, I spent a waaay too much time & money on this game when I should have been studying ... I had to repeat two subjects in first year, but I don't regret a single minute :rolleyes:

If you've played Nemesis / Gradius on any of the home consoles, this game will be familiar to you. If you like R-Type, you'll probably like this.

It's short game, but tough and engaging ... just one more go.
I still get a kick out of the digitised speech ... "pick it up ... for Ripple Laser"


http://www.klov.com/game_detail.php?game_id=9410
http://www.arcade-history.com/index.php?page=detail&id=2297

Supported by MAME from v 0.35b12 up ... salamand.zip

Retr0gamer

Salamander is an absolute classic, great choice. I think it has been bettered by it's spiritual sequel Axelay and Gradius Gaiden and V but it still is a wonderful game to this day. Salamander 2 is worth checking out as well but it's only available on the Sega Saturn.

deadl0ck

Whoops - Sorry trout (I was going by the order of replies to this thread).

Slamander it is !!! (Excellent choice)

Trode

Man, I loved Salamander on the C64, one of the best shoot-em-ups on the system, and although I never saw the arcade version ( I didn't even know it was originally an arcade until I saw it listed in MAME), I've been playing it recently (before this thread got started, coincidentally), and it's lost absolutely nothing over the years. The level one boss is more iconic to me than a dozen of the red b*stard from R-Type.

Retr0gamer

The C64 conversion is brilliant but it's missing an awful lot from the original including some levels and some layouts have been changed.

The game was released in America as lifeforce which was basically the same as salamander but with the gradius power-up system and the colour pallets of the levels changed to resemble the inside of a body. The effect is very poor and unconvincing and speech was added to the start of levels to tell you which part of the body you are in. Lifeforce is a pretty poor game since the addition of the gradius power-up system makes the game far tougher than it was designed to be since it's a lot harder to power-up.

However the conversion of lifeforce for the NES is superb. Konami made a lot of changes and the result is a much better game with new levels. Still I much prefer the arcade salamander.

Trode

I've never liked the Gradius power-up system, though it hasn't stopped me enjoying the games. It seems like, after the second level or so, you pretty much have to finish it on one life or you're screwed (unless, paradoxically, you're extremely good). Wizball is about the best implementation of it I've come across.

In short, I much prefer the system in Salamander to it's more traditional cousins(or American bastardisation, apparently).

Retr0gamer

I always loved the Gradius power up system. It fails in Gradius 2 and 4 in a few places due to some parts being too tough to get past without enough power-ups. It works great in Gradius Gaiden, V and the parodius games. The game I have major beef with for using the gradius system is Gradius 3. The game is just ridiculously tough and it's next to impossible to recover from a lost life. You need 3 speed ups until your ship can move faster than a snail and you will more than likely be dead before getting 3 power-ups. To rub salt into the wounds you can't continue in that game. At least the SNES conversion fixed that.

The continuing from were you die in Salamander was always nice thankfully they kept that in for Gradius V.

hamster

Hot Damn Guys! Salamander it is! Will try this during the weekend. I remember reading this in Zzap when I had the commie but never actually played it - so when I briefly tried it on Mame a few years ago it was a real bring-me-back. Definitely one to try! Good choice trout!

Which reminds me Retr0gamer - I never did *finish* off that big spaceship level in R-Type last August. Another thing to finish! I'd been Ubunting lately...

CiDeRmAn

Salamander, think I had an 8bit version back in the day, very nice, must pop it on xmame and have another go.

hamster

CiDeRmAn wrote: »

Salamander, think I had an 8bit version back in the day, very nice, must pop it on xmame and have another go.

xmame.... hmmm? Is xmame sluggish under your distro? Just guessing, but please say no!

CiDeRmAn

Always seemed ok to me, now its a while since I fired it up, my retro gaming time has been sorely hampered by the use of my games room as a generalised crap storage space by my better half.

Dr Bob

luas_dublin wrote: »

I'll have a crac at it via mame tonight .
I remember the Atari 8bit version myself

Finally managed to have a go at this this morning (I'm slow eh?)
Its good fun alright , but I found it massively hard(this may be due to me being hungover/ old/ or plain sh!te at shumps! ...oddly enough the only way I could get to the hostages was to fly backwards shooting all the way!.

Dr Bob

Gave Salamander a few plays yesterday.
Shoot em ups really aren't my thing , but I did remember playing this on the C64 years ago.Its actually a bit easier than I remember , but again like practically every shooter I've played , it does that horrible thing of returning you from the dead with all the firepower of a pea-shooter,which , when you're crap like me makes things tricky.
The bits were you shoot though the wall of pink matter (and it grows back around )you are interesting allright , but a pain in the arse.

Oh and I tried the US version (i.e.) Lifeforce ,which oddly enough had the same powerup system rather than the Gradius/nemesis one.(I thought it looked better though)


A quick squint at wikipedia found this
"The Japanese re-release of Life Force, released later in 1987, is further differentiated from Salamander in that all the mechanical art of enemies and levels has been replaced by organic material with additional graphical tweaks, and a revert to the original Gradius power-up system. The power-up system in Life Force is identical to the one in Gradius, with the exception that it replaces the Double power-up with the Ripple Laser and is presented in a three row by two-column matrix in order to make room for a second HUD. In addition, the bar of the second player is ordered differently from the first player. Salamander was released in Europe, however, in its original form."

Must have a quick go of the Japanese one tonight so.

Retr0gamer

Thanks for the info there. I didn't know that the japanese re-release of Lifeforce was the one with the gradius power-up system and the american one was just like salamander. I always wondered why the american Nes game played like salamander rather than lifeforce. When I play salamander I use the Salamander collection on the Sega Saturn which must have Salamander 1 and 2 and the japanese lifeforce rather than the american one.

Anyway gave this a few more goes at the weekend. The fire level always seems to lose me loads of lives and cripples me in the next level. The pink wall in the first is easy once you figure it out. Did anyone notice the strobe ship in the second level. Really annoying. I'd say that he is solely responsible for the videogame epilepsy scare of the early nineties

For a shmup it's actually quite an easy game but it unfortunately came out during what I call Konami's stingey phase were all their coin-ops wouldn't allow continues.

Dr Bob

Right. My turn I think.
I figured I'd go for something a bit different ,Power Down on the Atari 800/400.It was a budget release from Mastertronic.
I reckon its a game few of you have even heard of mainly as it only ever got a release on the Atari 8 bit series.At first glance it looks like a maze shooter game , but its actually a fairly tricky puzzler.
It's also massively unforgiving and quite hard , you have both a time limit and a limited amount of lives.And of course , like most 8bit games you have to finish it in one sitting (no saves!).Playing this with save states is a must.
Its not a hugely long game (theres only one puzzle maze) but bear in mind this was designed to be played without saves etc.

Your task in Power Down is to infiltrate a fortress built on an asteroid by the evil Argon, within a one-hour time limit. I'm not going to tell you much else , and let you work it for yourself , one hint to start you off ,there's a series of annoying drones in the game who can kill you on touch, you can only stun them (fire and left right up or down to shoot) , but they can be very useful, in fact you'll need their help to finish the game

I never finished this as a kid(I actually had 2 copies of it at one point )But replayed it about a year ago and battled my way though
it.The nice thing , in a way , about it being fairly obscure, is that to the best of my knowledge , theres no walkthoughs or FAQs for it .So if you finish it you do it on your own merits!.
Anyway have a go and see what you think

Emulating the 800:Atari800win isnt a bad emu
http://www.a800win.atari-area.prv.pl/
but theres a few others out there , the disk image to look for is : powerdown.atr


[Admins delete this bit if need be ,] If it helps the coverscan and instructions are up on Atarimania [Admins delete this bit if need be ,]



Anyway

Trode

Had a go of this, after a bit of hassle getting the emulator and game up and running, and it's oddly compelling. More thoughtful than I'd have expected. I'm only about five minutes in so far, and stuck on the second real puzzle, which I think I know how to do, but can't seem to actually accomplish. Save states are a real asset though, even if only to avoid going back to the start of the maze every time you die. It's an interesting pick, if nothing else, and if you (like me, admittedly) thought all pre-speccy 8-bit stuff was poor conversions of monochrome arcade games, give it a shot.

Just as a caution, I had problems finding the necessary ROM files(not the game itself) for the emulator, but YMMV.

Dr Bob

If anyones having problems with the emulator , I may be able to zip up a working one and mail it , so PM me:)

Roar

cant seem to get the emulator working, anyone care to point me in the right direction?

Dr Bob

Whats it doing (or not??)
One thing I've found about atari emus is that you need to download the bios for the original atari computers , theres a link here

http://sourceforge.net/project/downloading.php?group_id=40606&use_mirror=mesh&filename=atari800-2.0.3-windx.zip&86586895
from that site :
"Darek Mihocka got the permission from Atari corp. to distribute the images of Atari 800XL's OS and BASIC ROMs. The XFormer 2.5 package that contains these ROM images is free now so download and unpack it to get the ROM files needed for Atari800 run."

when you get that , unzip it straight into the emulators folder.Usually the emulators smart enough to work it out from there:



Alternative emus
"atari800"
http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=40606

"A8E"
http://www.zerstoerung.de/download.html

"Xformer2000"
http://www.zophar.net/Files/xf2000.zip

Retr0gamer

Bah, couldn't ge the emulators to work during the weekend

Roar

apparently i'm up next

going to go with one of my favourite games from my first ever (and probably still favourite) games system.

Seymour goes to Hollywood on the Amstrad 464 (no doubt it was released on speccy and c64)



A game similar to dizzy, but I always found Seymour a more accessible and dare I say more fun game to play than Dizzy.

It's a game I played repeatedly, is full of off-beat humour and it's quite difficult to finish.

keep your eyes peeled for all the movie references!