[PR] Dublin Bus revamps its service information for Commuters

Victor

http://www.dublinbus.ie/news_centre/press_releases.asp?action=view&news_id=711

Dublin Bus revamps its service information for Commuters

Over the next 12 months, customers can expect to see major changes in how Dublin Bus presents its service information. In conjunction with changes already in place including the introduction of the new Dublin Bus logo and branding, there has been significant investment in developing and improving access to information for the 500,000 customers carried across the city each day.

The substantial overhaul of our system is based on a combination of extensive customer research and analysis of other international transport administrations including Transport for London, and is intended to personify the principles of clarity, simplicity and consistency when it comes to customer information.

The first phase of this project includes a complete revamp of the structure of the information at bus stops and the bus stop structures. This includes a move towards more frequency based timetables allowing customers to calculate the minimum length of time they are likely to wait, and because we have removed the need to display every single departure time, there is room to increase font sizes for vision impaired passengers. The new stops also exhibit the new corporate colours of black and yellow which further increases visibility. Furthermore, they display additional information at the stop, such as a linear route map and a “you are here” indication to help customers ensure they are at the correct stop for the service they are looking for.

The first of the new look bus stops have been installed on O’Connell Street. These new style bus-stops have a modern chrome finish, and are designed to fit in with new bus shelter design and with the updated streetscape within the city centre. This is a proven design which complies with the highest accessibility standards. In addition to this the stops have display units which are much more vandal resistant than the current format and can carry additional customer information.

This investment will allow both mapping and timetables to be displayed in a more customer friendly manner. A new mapping structure is being developed which will present the entire public transport network as a linear or ‘spider map’, together with key interchange points (with bus, rail and Luas) which will make it easier for commuters to find their desired route. These maps take their lead from the London Underground mapping system which is one of the most iconic transport maps in the world. It is also a concept which is totally expandable to a multimodal network which is evolving in Dublin.

Speaking about the changes, Clíodhna Ní Fhátharta, Media and Communications, Manager for Dublin Bus, outlined the reasons behind their introduction. “Our new information system will mean that current and potential customers will be aware of all local routes and thus be able to use the bus with complete confidence,” she said.

Apart from ensuring that travelling on the bus is as straightforward as possible for existing customers, Dublin Bus believes that the upcoming changes will encourage traditional car users to view the bus as a hassle free mode of transport and a part of the solution to the city’s traffic problems. The improvements are an addition to the range of services that Dublin Bus offers throughout the Greater Dublin Area and will be central in providing a the best service possible is provided for all our customers travelling in the city.

cast_iron

Has the electronic information system trialed on the Lucan/Maynooth service a while back been totally shelved?

munchkin_utd

talking about service information. (hopefully not off topic but i might be probing an example of bad customer info. if my question cant't be answered)

Is there anywhere in the dublin bus site which shows a map of the city centre showing the bus routes and the location of bus stops? I couldnt find anything at all.

I am flying into dublin airport late on Wednesday evening and I need to change busses in the city centre to get to castleknock, and i wouldnt mind a nice clear map to see what my options are, and where EXACTLY the bus stop is.

Currently I am thinking of just getting a taxi as the bus option will take long enough as it is without me wandering about town looking for a busstop.

(p.s. I only want a link to info on dublin bus website. If the information isnt there then I'm happy enough to travel by taxi and dublin bus can shove their 8 euro busfare.)

John R

munchkin_utd wrote: »

talking about service information. (hopefully not off topic but i might be probing an example of bad customer info. if my question cant't be answered)

Is there anywhere in the dublin bus site which shows a map of the city centre showing the bus routes and the location of bus stops? I couldnt find anything at all.

I am flying into dublin airport late on Wednesday evening and I need to change busses in the city centre to get to castleknock, and i wouldnt mind a nice clear map to see what my options are, and where EXACTLY the bus stop is.

Currently I am thinking of just getting a taxi as the bus option will take long enough as it is without me wandering about town looking for a busstop.

(p.s. I only want a link to info on dublin bus website. If the information isnt there then I'm happy enough to travel by taxi and dublin bus can shove their 8 euro busfare.)

http://www.dublinbus.ie/your_journey/city_centre.asp

Taxi would be much quicker though.

There is a direct bus from the Airport to Castleknock but the last one is at 9.20pm Mon-Fri, 7.00pm Sat and no service on Sundays. http://www.urbus.ie/

Prof_V

munchkin_utd wrote: »

Is there anywhere in the dublin bus site which shows a map of the city centre showing the bus routes and the location of bus stops? I couldnt find anything at all.

http://www.dublinbus.ie/your_journey/city_centre.asp. Admittedly, it's severely limited: it only covers the core of the city centre, it's stylised to the point of being misleading and it has a few other quirks (such as showing a Red Line stop at Connolly but not the one at Abbey Street, which is much more convenient for most people interchanging with DB). It's also pretty well hidden (under "Timetables" and then "Search by map"). That said, it's a lot better than DB's online mapping of routes outside the city centre.

John R

Prof_V wrote: »

http://www.dublinbus.ie/your_journey/city_centre.asp. Admittedly, it's severely limited: it only covers the core of the city centre, it's stylised to the point of being misleading and it has a few other quirks (such as showing a Red Line stop at Connolly but not the one at Abbey Street, which is much more convenient for most people interchanging with DB). It's also pretty well hidden (under "Timetables" and then "Search by map"). That said, it's a lot better than DB's online mapping of routes outside the city centre.

Which is the point of the sceme announced in the link Victor quoted.

The geographical network map and local area guides produced at present are not bad for areas outside the canal ring, it is the distribution of them that has always been poor with the full map a rarity. Along with the scematic spider maps announced they should provide an excellent reference that has been badly needed for a long time.

lostexpectation

wow, remove the specified time and buses can never be late...

_Kaiser_

lostexpectation wrote: »

wow, removed the specified time and buses can never be late...

Indeed. I'm not sure what the point of this exercise is aside from squandering more money that would be best spent elsewhere.

- Didn't they "rebrand" not that long ago?
- What's wrong with the existing stops?
- How is this move supposed to actually improve the SERVICES themselves?

seamus

http://maps.google.co.uk shows the exact location of the bus stops...

munchkin_utd

Thanks for the help folks. Still 50/ 50 on whether I will get the bus or not, but at least by knowing where that (well hidden) map is I can make my way from the city centre dropoff point to the 38 bus without having to feck about o connell street aimlessly at 10 at night, with luggage.

Back on topic....
I hope that this new communication strategy makes taking a bus in dublin a little bit more straight forward.
It can hardly be more confusing than at present!

EDIT:
google maps is far from complete. Its missing any busses down the castelknock road for example.
Anyhow, its the job of Dublin Bus to convey and provide up to date information on their services, not google maps!
p.s. Google maps even also managed to omit the underground station in Munich where the OCTOBERFEST takes place, so dont depend on google maps to get you anywhere, not even to a beerfest with 6 million visitors over 16 days!!!

murphaph

munchkin_utd wrote: »

talking about service information. (hopefully not off topic but i might be probing an example of bad customer info. if my question cant't be answered)

Is there anywhere in the dublin bus site which shows a map of the city centre showing the bus routes and the location of bus stops? I couldnt find anything at all.

I am flying into dublin airport late on Wednesday evening and I need to change busses in the city centre to get to castleknock, and i wouldnt mind a nice clear map to see what my options are, and where EXACTLY the bus stop is.

Currently I am thinking of just getting a taxi as the bus option will take long enough as it is without me wandering about town looking for a busstop.

(p.s. I only want a link to info on dublin bus website. If the information isnt there then I'm happy enough to travel by taxi and dublin bus can shove their 8 euro busfare.)

Depends where in Castleknock you're after but bus to Drumcondra and train to Ashtown or Castleknock might work for you.

KC61

Kaiser2000 wrote: »

Indeed. I'm not sure what the point of this exercise is aside from squandering more money that would be best spent elsewhere.

- Didn't they "rebrand" not that long ago?
- What's wrong with the existing stops?
- How is this move supposed to actually improve the SERVICES themselves?

Where do we start?

The standard of information currently at stops is atrocious. These new style stops are identical to those used by TfL in London and give a schematic map for EVERY route at the stop.

Each bus shelter will have a spider map showing where all the buses go from that stop and each other stop within a short distance.

This has been seriously missing from Dublin - try figuring out where the buses go using the current stops.

The current stops do not have every bus timetable for each stop - these will.

It is an enormous leap forward - it's just incumbent on DB to get the detail right - something they have not got a great track record in the past for.

Slice

This is great news. It's not a waste of time to make the information on the Dublin Bus network clearer and more accessible; with a greater overview of the network more people will be encouraged to make better use of the service. Regretfully TfL are still way ahead of us with real-time information on bus services at stops while there's no sign of this with DB. Perhaps it has something to do with the fact that such real-time information will only show how woefully poor services on some of the DB routes really are relative to timetable.

KC61

Slice wrote: »

This is great news. It's not a waste of time to make the information on the Dublin Bus network clearer and more accessible; with a greater overview of the network more people will be encouraged to make better use of the service. Regretfully TfL are still way ahead of us with real-time information on bus services at stops while there's no sign of this with DB. Perhaps it has something to do with the fact that such real-time information will only show how woefully poor services on some of the DB routes really are relative to timetable.

Funding for real time information was withheld by government but is now in the current NDP:

From www.dublinbus.ie

A project is underway to develop a system for deployment across the entire fleet that will be used to track all vehicles in the Dublin Bus fleet and provide information to customers in real time.

Over the years, vehicle tracking systems have evolved to incorporate a significant level of control and fleet management functionality. The availability of increased computing power has enabled systems to be developed that assist supervisors in making informed decisions based on real time data and predictions of the consequences of such decisions. Such systems are often referred to as automatic vehicle location and control (AVLC) systems.

Dublin Bus proposes an incremental approach to the development of AVLC/RTPI systems. The key component of any real time system is the vehicle tracking function. This will be a basic requirement for any RTPI system.

Deployment of an AVLC system on the entire Dublin Bus fleet will provide a modern fleet management and control tool. This AVLC system will generate the necessary data that can be used for the provision of information to the public. Real time information may be presented to the customer through a number of channels, such as internet browser, mobile phone via SMS, bus stop information display panels and in-vehicle displays.

It is proposed that each bus in the Dublin Bus fleet will be equipped with an on-board system to support the vehicle location requirements and to provide the necessary data that will be required for the presentation of travel information to the public.

The on-bus system will generate location data in real time using satellite tracking technology. This data will be transmitted from the bus by means of private radio or GPRS.

The on-bus system will be introduced on a depot by depot basis. As the system is implemented in each depot, the monitoring and control functions will be introduced. Supervisors will have a real time view of the services being operated. They will be able to compare actual services with the schedules, identify gaps in services and take corrective actions. The tools available on the central system will be able to compute the consequences of the controllers' interventions and regulations, and assist in good decision-making.

A recording facility will store logs of all vehicle movements. This will be used to assist in planning and scheduling. It will also be a valuable tool in post-event investigation of specific events.

Once the AVLC system is operational it will be possible for Dublin Bus to make real time information available to the public. This information may be displayed through a number of channels.


On-bus display units
Roadside display units at key stops on all QBCs.
Internet or personal mobile devices, such as mobile phones, which require less investment in infrastructure and can be achieved in a relatively short timeframe.
A tender for the AVLC system was issued at the end of 2006.

The likely timescales for this project are as follows:


Late 2007 Award contract
Late 2008 Commence deployment of Automatic Vehicle Location & Control (AVLC)
Mid 2009 Commence testing of Real Time Passenger Info (RTPI) services
Late 2009 Complete deployment of AVLC
Early 2011 Complete rollout of RTPI services

Victor

munchkin_utd wrote: »

Thanks for the help folks. Still 50/ 50 on whether I will get the bus or not, but at least by knowing where that (well hidden) map is I can make my way from the city centre dropoff point to the 38 bus without having to feck about o connell street aimlessly at 10 at night, with luggage.

Get off 747/748 at O'Connell Street, cross street to 38 bus stop.

L1011

seamus wrote: »

http://maps.google.co.uk shows the exact location of the bus stops...

Including the 39B now becoming an underground Metro line Other than that its quite accurate, needs serious zooming though to get all the stops shown. They're not always totally on-spot though (look at the Wellington Quay 66 stop for instance).

lostexpectation

seamus wrote: »

http://maps.google.co.uk shows the exact location of the bus stops...

wow finally,when did that come in? pity you can't see the routes zoomed out.

Victor

lostexpectation wrote: »

wow finally,when did that come in? pity you can't see the routes zoomed out.

Unoffical Dublin Bus maps

http://www.lexferenda.com/map/webpage/dublinbus.html

http://mkmap.com/dublin

Victor

Whatever about abbreviated timetables on the side of the road where on so much will fit, I'm not impressed with the 128 timetables.

The vast bulk of the timetable is essentially 'there should be a bus in 10 minutes' while much of the rest is 'there might be a bus in 15 minutes or maybe 20'.

http://www.dublinbus.ie/your_journey/viewer.asp?route=128

_Kaiser_

Victor wrote: »

Whatever about abbreviated timetables on the side of the road where on so much will fit, I'm not impressed with the 128 timetables.

The vast bulk of the timetable is essentially 'there should be a bus in 10 minutes' while much of the rest is 'there might be a bus in 15 minutes or maybe 20'.

http://www.dublinbus.ie/your_journey/viewer.asp?route=128

"approx every xx minutes????" :rolleyes:

I hope this isn't an example of the new and improved revamped passenger information some people were banging on about earlier. I can guess when there should be a bus myself - and it doesn't cost a cent of monies that (as I said above) would be far better spent improving the actual SERVICES themselves.

Get the buses running reliably and efficently, then they can "brag" about it as much as they like!

wayne2107

And how excatly do you expect Dublin Bus to do this? Most of the time its not there fault a bus is late, its the traffic in Dublin that causes most delays. In my opinion Dublin Bus are doing a fine job at what there doing. Did you know that Dublin Bus has one of the most modern fleets in Euroupe, and one of the most wheelchair friendly. I feel for DB, if they where to operate the new swords express route they would have to by law put low floor buses on it instead of high floor coaches.

Victor

Some pics of the timetables shown on the new stops in O'Connell Street. Apologies for the photo quality.

armada104

I find it strange that this development is being condemned by certain members. It's clearly a very positive development that Dublin Bus are moving in this direction, considering how lacking their information is at present. At least once a month, I find myself using a bus route I'm not familiar with, and the lack of useful information is shocking. Timetables are often destroyed by vandals and left in this state for months or years. Even when they are intact, the list of locations they serve is in Irish only (I love the Irish language, but I'm just not familiar with Irish Dublin place names), and it's not stated that the times given are for departure from the terminus, not arrival at the stop (something not at all obvious to anyone not familiar with DB)

I find it easier to use the bus service in other European cities than that in my own city, and I'm only generally sure of where a bus is going after travelling on it a few times.

Of course, drivers are generally very helpful, but their time and that of all the passengers on a bus shouldn't be wasted dwelling at a bus stop answering tourists' questions. Then there are the minority who roll their eyes to heaven as if you're supposed to have a psychic ability to know where their bus is going.

Route maps and clear, colour-coded timetables are both money extremely well spent. Frequency-based timetabling is clear and easy to understand, and reflects the reality of running a bus service in a city like Dublin. Of course DB will continue to use its own internal timetables, but will not make any promises that it can't keep.

Metrobest

Victor wrote: »

Some pics of the timetables shown on the new stops in O'Connell Street. Apologies for the photo quality.

Without any geographical reference points the "maps" on the new bus stops are of little value to service users.

I can only sit back and laugh that this is what Dublin Bus calls a "revamp" of its service. Basically the revamp consists of a new font on the timetable and one of two random lines portraying the trajectory of the route which are of little practical use in terms of finding destinations like streets, parks, universities, schools, businesses, etc.

And now customers won´t even be able to challenge the lateness/abscence of buses leaving termini because customers won´t know the times those buses were supposed to leave, they´ll only have an "every 12 minutes" or so idea of a bus´s frequency. Even though we´re all aware that Dublin Buses which do use a "frequency based" timetable such as the 121 series tend to amongst the least reliable in the Dublin Bus stable. Now the rest of the fleet can become like the 121s. Revamp indeed!

.Last time I was in Dublin I witnessed sixty people shivering on a wet and windy O´Connell Bridge waiting with weather-beaten faces at a pole for a bus to arrive. That is more of same, awful Dublin bus service, and hardly a revamp, is it?

You can change the leapord´s timetables but you can´t change his spots.

_Kaiser_

Metrobest wrote: »

And now customers won´t even be able to challenge the lateness/abscence of buses leaving termini because customers won´t know the times those buses were supposed to leave, they´ll only have an "every 12 minutes" or so idea of a bus´s frequency. Even though we´re all aware that Dublin Buses which do use a "frequency based" timetable such as the 121 series tend to amongst the least reliable in the Dublin Bus stable. Now the rest of the fleet can become like the 121s. Revamp indeed!

My point exactly. At least there's one other person here who can be objective about the service (or lack thereof) offered by Dublin Bus, and who can see that this is just another expensive PR exercise that will in reality do little for the person waiting on it to arrive. It just means the driver/depot can more easily shrug off the responsibility as they're all "approximate" times - and their brethern in IE consider anything up to 5/10? mins "on time" don't they? I suppose that's progress too. :rolleyes:

Wayne2107: Ok they have new buses and the majority of them are now wheelchair accessible. That's great (genuinely), but it does nothing to improve the quality of service provided by the company. It's very easy to blame a late bus on "traffic" but what about when buses don't run at all, or leave early? (both regular occurances). Can't really blame that on congestion?

MiniD

I'm not crazy about this new setup. Telling passengers there will be a bus every "10-20 Minutes" is really no help at all. Many people would not wait 20 minutes for a bus, and would choose to either walk or get a taxi. Give people the information and provide the service. Dublin Bus moved away from this system a few years back when they removed the "bus every xxx" from Imp and CitySwift routes. It's strange they decided to return to this.

Looking at the pictures above, I'm baffled at how the 19 can get to Phibsboro Road in 10 Min, but the no.4 takes 15 minutes, when both routes travel the same way. There is no mention of route 4A on this map, and the fact that the 4/4A travel to Harristown.

The new spider maps are a bit confusing. The maps suggest Kilternan is to the east of Bray. Dun Laoghaire is the same distance south, and west, of Bray. The map for buses heading "towards Ballymun & Finglas" suggests Ballymun is south of O'Connell Street. I know these are small points, but for anybody not familiar with Dublin and the bus service, this would be very confusing.

This is the new Nitelink map.
http://www.dublinbus.ie/images/homepage/Nitelink%20pick%20up%20map.pdf

While it's bright and colourful, some of the places are really inaccurate. According to this map, Prussia Street is right next to Dodsboro, Lucan. Artane is quite close to Portmarnock, and Saggart is right next to Crumlin Road Garda Station.

Some routes are lacking basic information. Route 49N just lists Rathmines and Kilnamanagh on it's route, leaving out key places like Terenure, Rathgar, Templeogue, Firehouse and Tallaght Village.

cast_iron

MiniD wrote: »

Looking at the pictures above, I'm baffled at how the 19 can get to Phibsboro Road in 10 Min, but the no.4 takes 15 minutes, when both routes travel the same way.

That does seem strange alright. Perhaps the loading times are longer on the 4.

MiniD wrote: »

The new spider maps are a bit confusing. The maps suggest Kilternan is to the east of Bray. Dun Laoghaire is the same distance south, and west, of Bray. The map for buses heading "towards Ballymun & Finglas" suggests Ballymun is south of O'Connell Street. I know these are small points, but for anybody not familiar with Dublin and the bus service, this would be very confusing.

People unfamiliar with Dublin won't give a damn if Ballymun us south of O'Connell St. Those who are will know better.

Theses maps aren't supposed to be a geographical representation of Dublin. They are to clearly show which line your destination is on.

MiniD wrote: »

While it's bright and colourful, some of the places are really inaccurate. According to this map, Prussia Street is right next to Dodsboro, Lucan. Artane is quite close to Portmarnock, and Saggart is right next to Crumlin Road Garda Station.

Again, all these are irrelevant. If you wanted to go to Saggart, it would be quite clear that the Crumlin line is not the one you want. And that's the real point of this style of presentation.

MiniD wrote: »

Some routes are lacking basic information. Route 49N just lists Rathmines and Kilnamanagh on it's route, leaving out key places like Terenure, Rathgar, Templeogue, Firehouse and Tallaght Village.

Agreed.

John R

MiniD wrote: »

The new spider maps are a bit confusing. The maps suggest Kilternan is to the east of Bray. Dun Laoghaire is the same distance south, and west, of Bray. The map for buses heading "towards Ballymun & Finglas" suggests Ballymun is south of O'Connell Street. I know these are small points, but for anybody not familiar with Dublin and the bus service, this would be very confusing.

The point of the spider map is to accurately locate the correct bus stop for all routes in a certain locality and give an overview of where each route goes in a diagram.

The diagram is not supposed to be geographically accurate, just clear to read.

Such geographical inaccuracies haven't stopped the iconic London Underground map from being the most copied transport publication ever.

MiniD wrote: »

This is the new Nitelink map.
http://www.dublinbus.ie/images/homepage/Nitelink%20pick%20up%20map.pdf

While it's bright and colourful, some of the places are really inaccurate. According to this map, Prussia Street is right next to Dodsboro, Lucan. Artane is quite close to Portmarnock, and Saggart is right next to Crumlin Road Garda Station.

Some routes are lacking basic information. Route 49N just lists Rathmines and Kilnamanagh on it's route, leaving out key places like Terenure, Rathgar, Templeogue, Firehouse and Tallaght Village.

The map only lists the pick-up stops, the 49N only picks-up in the city and at Rathmines.

MiniD

cast_iron wrote: »

People unfamiliar with Dublin won't give a damn if Ballymun us south of O'Connell St. Those who are will know better.

Theses maps aren't supposed to be a geographical representation of Dublin. They are to clearly show which line your destination is on.

I understand they are not supposed to to be geographically accurate, I was just making the point the Nitelink map doesn't strike me as a map of Dublin, despite the Liffey being featured.

I think the other point of tourists using bus maps is quite important. I have been approached many times for queries on different bus routes. I think having a map on a bus stop which doesn't reflect the direction of travel, could be misleading. It's fine you and I knowing Ballymun is north of O'Connell Street, but for any tourist in Dublin, this is important.

In the pic below, a simple solution would be to have the route lines on the map running up the page, instead of south.

https://us.v-cdn.net/6034073/uploads/attachments/2160/47899.jpg

MiniD

John R wrote: »

The map only lists the pick-up stops, the 49N only picks-up in the city and at Rathmines.

But surely a passenger boarding in the city centre looking to go to Terenure will look at the map for details?

cast_iron

MiniD wrote: »

I think the other point of tourists using bus maps is quite important. I have been approached many times for queries on different bus routes. I think having a map on a bus stop which doesn't reflect the direction of travel, could be misleading. It's fine you and I knowing Ballymun is north of O'Connell Street, but for any tourist in Dublin, this is important.

I don't see how a tourist in Dublin would care where Ballymun actually is when what all they are after is a simple map that clearly shows which route to take. They will have a map giving it's geographical location anyway.

MiniD wrote: »

In the pic below, a simple solution would be to have the route lines on the map running up the page, instead of south.

https://us.v-cdn.net/6034073/uploads/attachments/2160/47899.jpg

[/quote]I see your point, perhaps it's a poster layout issue.

MiniD wrote: »

But surely a passenger boarding in the city centre looking to go to Terenure will look at the map for details?

Exactly. A Nitelink of this nature would clearly show which route to take - rather than having to find the ticket bus and queue just to ask which one to take.

lostexpectation

bus leaving terminal at...? what use is that to anyone but the person and terminus?

and yes boo to only having the street names in irish

markf909

One thing I love about using buses in London is that there are 4 mini signs below the final destination of the bus advising the passenger of the rough route it is taking.

The lack of something as immediate as that will always leave DB passengers at a disadvantage.

seamus

MiniD wrote: »

I understand they are not supposed to to be geographically accurate, I was just making the point the Nitelink map doesn't strike me as a map of Dublin, despite the Liffey being featured.

Indeed, it may only serve to confuse - the maps don't have to be spot on, but a shred of accuracy would be nice. The 25N goes west after Palmerstown, it doesn't even go remotely northbound. Not to mention that it devalues a few thousand homes in Lucan by putting them north of the liffey

jjohnson1984

Had to laugh this morning, I was walking down O'Connell Street and looked at one of these that were put up last week. They all had a sign up saying that the timetables would be added at a later date and to phone Dublin Bus or go online to find out the time of your next bus.

Now I know this may sound stupid, but why replace the old ones with new ones if they do not put the timetables up. if they do not have the timetables ready why did they not wait until they do?

astrofool

Cos the guy that puts up the signs would have nothing to do otherwise. Of course he could replace the old worn signs with brand new non worn signs, but that would be ridiculous.

Victor

markf909 wrote: »

One thing I love about using buses in London is that there are 4 mini signs below the final destination of the bus advising the passenger of the rough route it is taking.

I'm not sure what you mean here.

Victor

armada104 wrote: »

Even when they are intact, the list of locations they serve is in Irish only (I love the Irish language, but I'm just not familiar with Irish Dublin place names), and it's not stated that the times given are for departure from the terminus, not arrival at the stop (something not at all obvious to anyone not familiar with DB)

Irish is across the top, English is down the side (and on the bottom, but that section isn't normally shown on the street version to allow a larger font be used).

http://www.dublinbus.ie/your_journey/viewer.asp?route=128

markpb

Victor wrote: »

I'm not sure what you mean here.

I think he means on the front display on the bus. Instead of just Harristown 13, they'd have Harristown in large letters and in the four boxes underneath it would say: Drumcondra, Phibsboro, Glasnevin & Ballymun.

markf909

markpb wrote: »

I think he means on the front display on the bus. Instead of just Harristown 13, they'd have Harristown in large letters and in the four boxes underneath it would say: Drumcondra, Phibsboro, Glasnevin & Ballymun.

Yup thats it in a nutshell, all London buses seem to have this small but excellent feature.

I know some Dublin buses sometimes have a "via" but more often than not its just the end destination visible, the customer should be clairvoyent enough to know the routing.

markpb

markf909 wrote: »

I know some Dublin buses sometimes have a "via" but more often than not its just the end destination visible, the customer should be clairvoyent enough to know the routing.

You mean that second line can be set to something other than via City Centre?! The mind boggles

John R

markf909 wrote: »

Yup thats it in a nutshell, all London buses seem to have this small but excellent feature.

Except for new ones and buses that have changed routes as only the end destination is now required, which is a bad decision.

They had the right idea in forcing the companies to keep the manual scrolls too, they are much more legible (and can show more text) than the dot matrix displays now standard everywhere else.

markf909 wrote: »

I know some Dublin buses sometimes have a "via" but more often than not its just the end destination visible, the customer should be clairvoyent enough to know the routing.

Until the late 1970s we had multi-point scrolls in Dublin too until the as Gaeilge nazis took hold.

armada104

Victor wrote: »

Irish is across the top, English is down the side (and on the bottom, but that section isn't normally shown on the street version to allow a larger font be used).

http://www.dublinbus.ie/your_journey/viewer.asp?route=128

The 128 timetable is one of the few where the Irish and English placenames match, on the majority of timetables the Irish list is more complete than the English. The listing of stages is useless unless you're fairly familiar with Dublin geography. Those who aren't familiar with a route are unlikely to be so familiar.

MiniD

armada104 wrote: »

The 128 timetable is one of the few where the Irish and English placenames match, on the majority of timetables the Irish list is more complete than the English. The listing of stages is useless unless you're fairly familiar with Dublin geography. Those who aren't familiar with a route are unlikely to be so familiar.

You're right, it can be complete guesswork at times.

This is the bus timetable for route 15B. This busy route travels from Whitechurch to the City Centre, serving Ballyboden, Ballyroan, Templeogue, Terenure, Rathgar, Rathmines and Stephens Green.

Now, when you arrive at the bus stop, rather than list these important points, the timetable reads...

Whitechurch

Terenure Cross

Swan Centre

Bleeding Horse Pub

Eden Quay

For anybody unfamiliar with the southside of the city will do well to know where the Bleeding Horse Pub is, never mind "Swan Centre".

Surely, it would be far better to actually put in place names like Rathmines, Rathgar etc.

The point on the destination scrolls is also important, and the new DMD units are capable of showing much more than "Harristown - Baile Anri". A few years back, when the new RV buses launched onto the Airlink, these buses were programmed with the destination scrolling across the screen in 4 different languages. This is something which could, and should, be applied to each route.

There are some routes which badly need better destination displays. Having a bus travel across the city from Blackrock and Kimmage on routes 4 & 83 just displaying "Harristown"(when up until last weeks strike, hardly any Dubliner who where this place was) is jusy lazy.

Some other gems include route 122 which travels cross-city just displaying "Ashington" in big letters. Route 45, which for many journeys simply displays "Esplanade", and the various routes to Tallaght which just display "The Square". There are also the large amount of Clontarf services, which operate from the city centre reading "Howth via Connolly Station". Even though Connolly Station is the second stop on the route.

It would be much better to have the main destination displayed, with the via points scrolling below.

markf909

John R wrote: »

Except for new ones and buses that have changed routes as only the end destination is now required, which is a bad decision.

They had the right idea in forcing the companies to keep the manual scrolls too, they are much more legible (and can show more text) than the dot matrix displays now standard everywhere else.

Didn't notice that, will have a look this weekend, if so thats an awful decision, I have used London buses a lot when just out exploring an area purely on the basis that it is so easy to know the basic route of the bus.

Until the late 1970s we had multi-point scrolls in Dublin too until the as Gaeilge nazis took hold.

My DB experiences only go back to the early 80's with the cream buses, blue leather seats and the bus conductors!

Carawaystick

The fact Dublin Bus list CLonmel st as a stage says it all about "Changing with the city" No bus ever served Clonmel st and a Dublin bus carrying passengers hasn't passed Clonmel st for several years since the luas started on Harcourt st. yet this brand new route proudly lists clonmel st as a stage.

munchkin_utd

When visiting the Dublin Bus office last week, I discovered that Dublin Bus have very nifty Local Service Guides for various areas published with maps and service info.

Is there some known reason that these cannot be provided online as downloadable pdf documents?

For someone like myself that is living abroad, I don't have the luxory of popping down to the O Connell st office in the evening to pick up an info leaflet.
Even for people living in Dublin, having the ability to download these info sheets would save a trip to the city.

KC61

munchkin_utd wrote: »

When visiting the Dublin Bus office last week, I discovered that Dublin Bus have very nifty Local Service Guides for various areas published with maps and service info.

Is there some known reason that these cannot be provided online as downloadable pdf documents?

For someone like myself that is living abroad, I don't have the luxory of popping down to the O Connell st office in the evening to pick up an info leaflet.
Even for people living in Dublin, having the ability to download these info sheets would save a trip to the city.

These guides have been published on an annual basis since the late 1980s.

Be aware that timetables may change since they are published - best to check with www.dublinbus.ie just in case.

I'm specifically thinking of the Rathmines guide which has the old 15 and 74 and timetables and those of their variants.

ga2re2t

munchkin_utd wrote: »

Is there some known reason that these cannot be provided online as downloadable pdf documents?

Why not ask them?
E-mail: info@dublinbus.ie

Let us know if you get a reply

Carawaystick

munchkin_utd wrote: »

When visiting the Dublin Bus office last week, I discovered that Dublin Bus have very nifty Local Service Guides for various areas published with maps and service info.

Is there some known reason that these cannot be provided online as downloadable pdf documents?

For someone like myself that is living abroad, I don't have the luxory of popping down to the O Connell st office in the evening to pick up an info leaflet.
Even for people living in Dublin, having the ability to download these info sheets would save a trip to the city.

Even if you could pop in in the evening, the Dublin bus office would be closed.....

cast_iron

munchkin_utd wrote: »

Is there some known reason that these cannot be provided online as downloadable pdf documents?

I don't see why not. But I don't see a huge advantage either (especially to those living abroad:)).

The whole idea of these is the handiness - it's hardly something that easily printable (to the same size/format) and compact.