Luas Fine for having no ticket

hansgruber

Hi,

I was jumped on the Luas today without a ticket and got off but when I got of an inspector came up and asked me for a ticket, because I didn't have one he gave me a fine of €45. I am seriously considering not paying this, althoguh the could take me to court. Just wondering have any other people been in this situation and what happened? Any advice

seamus

Em...what makes you think you don't have to pay it?

blah

Troll right? Making fun of regular similar threads?

Ok..I'll go with it

You idiot! What makes you think that you should be able to travel on the luas for free? :mad: People like you are the reason public transport in this country is so crap and expensive!!!! Rant rant rant! If I was in government I'd have you hanged :mad: :mad: :mad: My advice is don't pay the fine, let them throw you in jail!!! :mad: :mad:

6th

You were off the Luas when he issued the ticket ... and you took it?

6th

blah wrote:

Troll right? Making fun of regular similar threads?

Ok..I'll go with it

You idiot! What makes you think that you should be able to travel on the luas for free? :mad: People like you are the reason public transport in this country is so crap and expensive!!!! Rant rant rant! If I was in government I'd have you hanged :mad: :mad: :mad: My advice is don't pay the fine, let them throw you in jail!!! :mad: :mad:

Personal abuse and sig2big? ..... post reported, sig reported soon

hansgruber

Well, what can they do if I don't?

They have my name, but they dont have my current address, just an old address

markpb

6th wrote:

You were off the Luas when he issued the ticket ... and you took it?

Luas stops are private ground with public access, they're owned by the RPA so he was within his rights to issue a ticket there.

hansgruber

The reason the transport system is bad is down to a lack of proper planning, mismanagement and over spending. The Luas makes loads of money and has far exceeded profits so far so I wouldn't worry about that.

And yea I was off the Luas when they stopped me, does that make any difference?

6th

markpb wrote:

Luas stops are private ground with public access, they're owned by the RPA so he was within his rights to issue a ticket there.

Interesting, cheers for clearing that up.

popebenny16

What purpose does this thread serve?

We had a big thread on this before.

Calina

blah banned for a week for personal abuse.

6th

The OP is new and search is down, old threads currently mean nothing if you weren't around for them.

Calina

hansgruber wrote:

The reason the transport system is bad is down to a lack of proper planning, mismanagement and over spending. The Luas makes loads of money and has far exceeded profits so far so I wouldn't worry about that.

And yea I was off the Luas when they stopped me, does that make any difference?

No it doesn't. You're in the wrong regardless of whether you're caught or not. Trying to get off on a technicality is just immoral, that's all.

Trampas

Why did you not have a ticket in the 1st place?

6th

I once jumped on with no ticket because I was in a rush and it was pulling off. When I got off I bought a ticket and binned it. Felt that made up for it.

Ham'nd'egger

seamus wrote:

Em...what makes you think you don't have to pay it?

Let me see what excuses yer man could have...

I was late for work, wasn;t able to wait 5 minutes for the next tram?
I wasn't able to buy a Latte and a Luas ticket at Starbucks?
There was a queue and there wasn't enough ticket machines?
I didn't have change of a €2 coin?
I ought to travel from free, €4 a day is a rip off?
I didn't know I needed a ticket?
I paid on the way here?
I lost my ticket, sorry?
I will pay later on, you know me, I'm on it all the time?
What about them scumbags who didn't pay?
I am wearing a suit, do I look like I'm ripping you off a fare?

There is but one reasons why you got a fine.... Because you didn't make it your business to purchase a ticket.

No matter how hard by you try make it sound, there isn't really any middle ground on this. And giving the incorrect address will fall back on you if you are tracked down; pay the fine and move on as you are in the wrong here.

FX Meister

blah wrote:

People like you are the reason public transport in this country is so crap and expensive!!!!

So it has nothing to do with sending Darts that don't need refurbishing off to eastern europe to be refurbished at a cost of €80,000 per married couple when they could use the money to provide a better service as they do in other countries?

dermo88

The problem is that you did'nt buy a ticket. Now, irrespective of individual circumstances, and while I do sympathise with your plight, you've got to look at the reality of the situation.

There are a lot of hard chaws, chancers, and bluffers. Not just in Ireland, almost everywhere has that kind of breed. But if you work in the service sector, such as a pub, shop, restaurant, bank or a bookies, you hear almost every poxy excuse under the sun. Your trust and faith in humanity gets eroded. Play by the rules, you get treated fairly. These guys have heard every excuse going and if I was in their shoes, my eyes would just glaze over, "I've heard it all before, now lets do this the easy way"

I do not agree with anyone calling you an idiot. You were just in a rush, impatient, you were just being human. Noone is perfect, but frankly, its like breaking a red light, fiddling taxes, smuggling cigarettes, taking drugs, bunking off work, or speeding. We've all done it a little, but sometimes we get caught, and its human nature to complain when life goes against us.

Now, chancers come in all shapes and sizes. I don't care if they are in suits, or tracksuits, granted though, I have more pleasure in booking the tracksuits than the suits, but its all the same underneath. I had an incident years ago when I refused to pay a Nigerian fraudster pulling a slow count in a betting office, and I told him exactly what I thought of him after he accused me of being racist. That was after getting threatened with a shotgun, but an accident with some boiling water sent him on his merry way, and he was on the ferry to Holyhead within two hours after another accident with some 'friends'.

Theres no point in moaning about whether Luas fined you. You were unlucky. The chances of getting caught on Dublin Bus are 100-1 against. The chances of getting caught on Luas are easily 4-1. The extra 6-7 minutes waiting on the next tram are easily worth 43 Euro, which is the difference between paying the correct fare, and the penalty fare.

And it is clear as daylight, and clear public knowledge that the Luas ticket checkers, or revenue protection officers are doing their job.

seamus

hansgruber wrote:

The Luas makes loads of money and has far exceeded profits so far so I wouldn't worry about that.

The Luas has made lots of money becuase people pay their fares.

By your logic, it's perfectly fine for me to walk into your house and eat all your food. You make enough to replace it, right?

Red Alert

I have often been in a rush and had to wait for the next tram. I'm sure your rush wasn't more important than the other honest people who actually bought a ticket. The rules say that you must have a valid ticket with you before boarding a tram - for people who don't care to read them they even put them on the PIS boards from time to time. The rules say nothing about whether you're in a rush or not.

(I'd say even if RPA/Veolia dealt with those very slow piece-of-crap ticket machines they've got the dodgers would still say they are in a rush).

paulm17781

6th wrote:

Personal abuse and sig2big? ..... post reported, sig reported soon

Why is his sig too big yet your larger one isn't?

antoinolachtnai

The Luas doesn't make money in the sense that a private company might make money. It covers its operational costs and makes a surplus. The surplus isn't even enough to cover the interest on the cost of the infrastructure.

Anyway, the practical problem with not paying the penalty under the honour system is that if you are a regular commuter, you will be apprehended by the inspectors pretty quickly. Remember, they have a picture of you on video as well.

Just pay it and get on with life.

6th

paulm17781 wrote:

Why is his sig too big yet your larger one isn't?

Because mine isn't bigger.



Anyway like i said I can understand jumping on if its pulling off and you are in a rush but if you get caught then pay up.

popebenny16

paulm17781 wrote:

Why is his sig too big yet your larger one isn't?

It's centered.

6th

And its physically bigger.

monkeyfudge

6th wrote:

Because mine isn't bigger.

The rule-breaking two lines of text underneath make yours bigger though.

But anyway... they don't catch people on fare dodging all that often so they really should prosecute to the full extent of the law when the do.

€45 really is all that much... How much have you saved by dodging fares in the past? Or was this your first time?

dowlingm

hansgruber wrote:

Any advice

Pay up you cheap langer.

Victor

OK chill out folks and stay on topic.

Civilian_Target

seamus wrote:

By your logic, it's perfectly fine for me to walk into your house and eat all your food. You make enough to replace it, right?

lol! Doooo it!

Cabaal

You were wrong for not buying a ticket, you were caught, now your bitching, pay up or I hope they bring you to court over the matter if you don't

Have a nice day...

corktina

we get one bus a day....would love to have a Luas here to not use either....:) (should be free really but thats another topic....)

Ste.phen

Didn't someone here do the math and decide it was economically productive to not pay the fares and just pay the fine when caught?

i.e (X * fare was < fine * percentage of times they encountered inpsectors over those X journeys)

antoinolachtnai

No, this won't work for you if the inspectors are doing their job properly. The system doesn't depend on honour alone - a smart inspection crew will be able to crack down on repeat offenders -.

If you are a regular user of the Luas, and you get caught once, they will be looking out for you the next time. They have CCTV, the control room will know more about your travel habits than you do by the end of the first month. Paying the fine won't necessarily be the end of the matter either. They could bring you to court if you are recalcitrant (although I don't know if they actually do this). You could easily get yourself barred from the luas, and that would leave you high and dry if it's your only way to get to work.

There is one category of people who can probably get away with fare-dodging - people who rarely use the Luas. But from the point of view of fare protection, these people aren't that important, because they use the system so little and the loss of fares over a year is quite small.

breadmonkey

OP: why didn't you just walk/run/give fake details? Actually, you gave your old address right? That was a bit silly.

Red Alert

Would they actually be actively looking out for trouble makers on the CCTV? (Fair dues to a camera-watcher who can pick out a load of trouble makers spot on!)

hansgruber

I was going to run initially but there was 3 of them, they stopped me and when I refused to show them anything they "called the control to send round a Garda." I obviously didn't want that so I had to show them ID (GARDA AGE CARD)

I reckon that on an occasion I might have got away with it but one things for sure I won't be trying that again. Not worth the hassle.

One thing that does really piss me of is how I have often seen people without tickets being caught while on the Luas and the inspectors letting them away with a warning and just making them buy a ticket when they get off the Luas. I have never been given a warning.

Surely it is very unfair how they don't excercise equal treatment with offenders.

egan007

hansgruber wrote:

Hi,

I was jumped on the Luas today without a ticket and got off but when I got of an inspector came up and asked me for a ticket, because I didn't have one he gave me a fine of €45. I am seriously considering not paying this, althoguh the could take me to court. Just wondering have any other people been in this situation and what happened? Any advice

Does sound like a troll

Perhaps you are 10 and did not realise that you have to PAY for services like everyone else.

IF it's true I hope you don't pay it and they take you to court and fine you even more

hansgruber

Thats an original view to take

egan007

hansgruber wrote:

Thats an original view to take

Wow that's that's the equivalent of an online pout.

I don't see your problem. You knew the score and you took the risk -now take the heat and quit being a biatch about it

6th

hansgruber wrote:

One thing that does really piss me of is how I have often seen people without tickets being caught while on the Luas and the inspectors letting them away with a warning and just making them buy a ticket when they get off the Luas. I have never been given a warning.

The bit in bold makes it sound like this isnt your first time?

hansgruber

Sorry about that I understand what you mean.

I'd like to clarify the situation and say that what I mean't to say was that I HAD never been given a warning. I know that they did not have to give me one as was clearly in breach of the rules but what I would like to stress is how it is very unfair how they often let people like me go with just a warning.

I would be much more in favour of a no excuses tolerated situation where if you are in breach of the rules you're fined.

The current situation is very unfair in that regard.

paulm17781

hansgruber wrote:

Sorry about that I understand what you mean.

I'd like to clarify the situation and say that what I mean't to say was that I HAD never been given a warning. I know that they did not have to give me one as was clearly in breach of the rules but what I would like to stress is how it is very unfair how they often let people like me go with just a warning.

I would be much more in favour of a no excuses tolerated situation where if you are in breach of the rules you're fined.

The current situation is very unfair in that regard.

You can avoid being treated in this second class citizen way if you purchase a ticket. Amazing, it really is that simple.

Victor

hansgruber wrote:

Surely it is very unfair how they don't excercise equal treatment with offenders.

They should, but you refused to cooperate with them.

antoinolachtnai

Did you refuse to identify yourself? As in, to tell them your name and address?

hansgruber

No, I did not refuse to identify myself.

What difference does this make?

antoinolachtnai

They insisted on ID though, you say?

Ham'nd'egger

hansgruber wrote:

No, I did not refuse to identify myself.

What difference does this make?

Errrr, actually you said yesterday...

I was going to run initially but there was 3 of them, they stopped me and when I refused to show them anything they "called the control to send round a Garda." I obviously didn't want that so I had to show them ID (GARDA AGE CARD)

That looks really like you were refusing to identify yourself; if anything you as good as begged for the fine with your actions.

First off, you travelled without a ticket, secondly you decided to do a legger when you were caught, thirdly you didn't answer their request (This was your joker card, which you didn't use) and then you gave them an incorrect address by your own admission. And even then, you are thinking you were somehow hard done by or picked on.

hansgruber

Hamndegger wrote:

Errrr, actually you said yesterday...

I was going to run initially but there was 3 of them, they stopped me and when I refused to show them anything they "called the control to send round a Garda." I obviously didn't want that so I had to show them ID (GARDA AGE CARD)

That looks really like you were refusing to identify yourself; if anything you as good as begged for the fine with your actions.

First off, you travelled without a ticket, secondly you decided to do a legger when you were caught, thirdly you didn't answer their request (This was your joker card, which you didn't use) and then you gave them an incorrect address by your own admission. And even then, you are thinking you were somehow hard done by or picked on.

They asked for a ticket and I refused to show one. They never asked for ID until later, they called the Gardai and then I just gave in to them because I was in a hurry and needed to get there asap.

Also I though about doing a legger but didn't beleive me if I decided to there'd have been no catching me if I got away However there was 3 of them surrounding me and no escape. As for giving them an incorrect address, well how were they do know it was incorrect.

Ham'nd'egger

hansgruber wrote:

They asked for a ticket and I refused to show one. They never asked for ID until later, they called the Gardai and then I just gave in to them because I was in a hurry and needed to get there asap.

Also I though about doing a legger but didn't beleive me if I decided to there'd have been no catching me if I got away However there was 3 of them surrounding me and no escape. As for giving them an incorrect address, well how were they do know it was incorrect.

Hang on... you didn't show them a ticket when asked. Are you now saying that you had a ticket to show them but couldn't be arsed?

May I suggest you complete this next sentence please, try put this issue to bed

"I should not pay my Luas fine because..."

Hotblack Desiato

Perhaps, given the small chances of getting caught, this thread could be renamed "Luas - fine for having no ticket" ?