Children Home Alone without a Creche

Ian38HR

If you have 3 kids (all boys), eldest is 13, then 11 and 5 - would you able to make your 13 year old the childminder of the 2 other boys? I have and my wife have day jobs - and just for the summer that we can make do without a child minder/creche. Any Irish laws that govern this situation?

eve

I started minding kids at about 15 and I looked after a family of boys (4 of them) where the eldest was about 12 at the time. Unless they are very unusual, I've found that 13 just isn't old to leave them on their own. Maybe a 2 hours or but not for a day where they have to cook/get food for themselves.

angeldelight

I really strongly think that's a very bad idea. I'm not a parent, but remembering what I was like at 13, I would strongly recommend against it. Firstly, 13 is still young to be left alone for a full day every day of the week, to amuse themselves. Ok so they might know the rules of "don't answer the front door" etc. but what happens if he or one of the others falls or hurts themselves? It can be stressful enough for an adult to try and keep a calm head in a situation like that whatever about a child. What are they going to eat/drink during the day? What if they burn/cut themselves?

A 13 year old is by no stretch of the imagination mature enough to look after other children, both for the safety of the others and himself... Are you suggesting they sit inside for the summer or are they going to be out on the street playing or in the park? Can a 13 year old erally be expected to not go and play with his friends because he has to run after the other 2 and watch them?

Shelli

Possibly the 13 and 11yr old could be left, if there was food left ready for them, but not minding a 5yr old, they just wouldn't be mature enough, not to mention that it's not really fair to ask a child who should be enjoying his youth to step into the role of parent.

Nevyn

Tell you what why don't you ring your local health clinc and ask for the sitting socail worker and get thier professional opinion.

They might be a bit busy so make sure you leave a contact name and address for them to get back to you.

G&T

Pay for the child care,if anything happened to one of them you would never forgive yourself.
The older 2 could do summer camp's and the youngest go to a creche/minders.
Honestly it is not fair on the 13 yr old he is still a kid.

Your self/wife could alway's take parental leave for the summer.

dame

Neighbours of ours seem to doing the same thing. I'm not sure what age the boy in charge is but he's about 13 too and there's a girl of 7 and a boy of 10. The parents both work down the town and pop back at lunchtime most days. I honestly wouldn't do it myself though. The kids are wandering the estate all day every day, causing bother and annoying people. They've also been given pellet guns to amuse themselves with but that's a whole other story. I feel sorry for the kids really. They should have somebody keeping a proper eye on them, organising activities and keeping them out of trouble. Boredom leads kids into all sorts.

daiixi

It really depends on your children. Some 13 yr olds are suprisingly mature and able. If your younger kids will listen to their older sibling then why not?

G&T

daiixi wrote:

It really depends on your children. Some 13 yr olds are suprisingly mature and able. If your younger kids will listen to their older sibling then why not?[/QUOTE


For the reason's dame stated,boredom leads to trouble.

No 13yr old is as mature as an adult,imo

Nevyn

If anything happens to the children the parents can be charged with neglect.

Trinity

Only you know your children but i wouldnt take the risk.

SOme adults can barely handle an emergency/crisis situation never mind children. ANd there is no way of knowing what can arise. I'm the most protective mother i know, my son is known as the cotton wool kid and yet I still managed to sever his thumb in a door, he required surgery. I fell to pieces, couldnt even direct the ambulance i was so hysterical. Still makes me cry tbh.

In answer to your question is it legal, i honestly dont know.

oh well

have 3 similiar ages (14, 11 8) and wouldn't even be happy letting the 14 on own for the whole day - again the boredom can lead to who knows, and once kids on the street know theres a free house every day, the pressure on the child might be great.

It isn't really fair either if the friends are out and about and he/she is stuck minding younger kids. this is all apart from any accidents happening of course - slipping on the stairs, dropping a glass, etc.

Think that its actually illegal under the age of 14 too but wouldn't be 100% sure of that, but there is definitely an age. there was a thread about this some months ago.

so, organise yourselves some good childcare, parental leave or something. think of them as young children, cos that's all they are.

siochain

no chance, kids minding kids will never work.

In this day and age there is no need for putting that responsibility onto a 13 year old, 13 year old needs a summer holiday too.

cmurph

very bad idea in my opinion.....

its not so long since madeleine mc cann was abducted and everyone was saying how the parents were so responsible ,not saying this is likely in this situation but you will still be leaving three children home alone..


what if anything happened...???

shrapnel222

as a one off, i can't see it being a problem. Day in day out would be asking for trouble as the likelihood of the children coming up against a situation they can't handle would not bear thinking about

I'm really shocked at how babied some 13-14 year olds are. When I had just turned 13 I was at home all summer with my 11 and 9 year old siblings and I didnt feel like an immature child. I was already ironing my clothes, doing the dishwasher, cleaning a bit etc. If anything had happened I could have got a neighbour, dialled 999 etc. I wasn't much less mature than I am now at 22. Its nothing like leaving young kids (8 and under) alone.

Trinity

I think boys can be different, i was cooking cleanign etc at a young age too. I also loved babysitting.

But these are all boys and not many 13 year old boys would want to be stuck home all summer responsible for a 5 year old when all their friends are probably out playing footie

G&T

Miguel Deafening Deodorant wrote:

. If anything had happened I could have got a neighbour, dialled 999 etc.

The neighbour is looking after their own family,unless they are asked to keep an eye on the kid's it is unfair to assume someone else will be there to help out.

oh well

wouldn't agree that 14 yr olds are babied. my one does the ironing, can make a fairly decent dinner, can bake, uses the washing machine and dish washer - but asking her to look after 2 younger brothers/sisters day in day out for the whole summer is a bit much. expecting a neighbour to be avail in an emergency too isn't really good an idea either - most of neighbours out themselves at work/on holidays/or just in town or whereever.

all day long everyday is just plain irresponsible i think. kids do need their summer hols too and while a certain amount of boredom can lead to some great games, too much is not a good thing.

maryjane1

apparently there are no laws ro say at what age you can leave your children home alone BUT if anything happens to them you can be done for neglect

Nevyn

There is no law about sticking a fork in your eye either....

Piste

I agree with not leaving the 13 year old to look after the 11 and 5 year old so a child minder is probably the best option, but only hire the cildminder to look after the 1 and 5 year old, let the 13 year old come and go as he pleases. I would have flatly refused to have a minder in when I was 13.

the_syco

BAD IDEA.

A girl may be able to sit tight, and mind the others, but a boy will go out the minute he can, with or wihtout the others.

Look into summer camps, etc.

Lazarus2.0

Ian38HR wrote:

If you have 3 kids (all boys), eldest is 13, then 11 and 5 - would you able to make your 13 year old the childminder of the 2 other boys? I have and my wife have day jobs - and just for the summer that we can make do without a child minder/creche. Any Irish laws that govern this situation?

The mind boggles :eek: Unbelievable !

krankykitty

Childhood is short enough - let the 13 year old enjoy it while he can before shoving parental responsibility onto him.

maryjane1

krankykitty wrote:

Childhood is short enough - let the 13 year old enjoy it while he can before shoving parental responsibility onto him.

exactly!!

Nevyn

The thing is tht such children would be deemed to be at risk and all it takes it 1 phone call from 1 neighbour to the local health clinc to the social worker and there has to be an investigation and home visits, interviews and a file which stays active for the next two years and even if there is no action take against the parents and the file is closed as there was no merit it remains in the system with both parents and childrens names listed.

Ian38HR

eve wrote:

I started minding kids at about 15 and I looked after a family of boys (4 of them) where the eldest was about 12 at the time. Unless they are very unusual, I've found that 13 just isn't old to leave them on their own. Maybe a 2 hours or but not for a day where they have to cook/get food for themselves.

We actually fix the food the night before - its in the table and some are above the kitchen counter and just needs to heat up when meal time arrives - we make sure we call every 2-3 hours to check on them as well.

Trinity

Ian38HR wrote:

We actually fix the food the night before - its in the table and some are above the kitchen counter and just needs to heat up when meal time arrives - we make sure we call every 2-3 hours to check on them as well.

How does the eldest feel about it?

Ian38HR

angeldelight wrote:

I really strongly think that's a very bad idea. I'm not a parent, but remembering what I was like at 13, I would strongly recommend against it. Firstly, 13 is still young to be left alone for a full day every day of the week, to amuse themselves. Ok so they might know the rules of "don't answer the front door" etc. but what happens if he or one of the others falls or hurts themselves? It can be stressful enough for an adult to try and keep a calm head in a situation like that whatever about a child. What are they going to eat/drink during the day? What if they burn/cut themselves?

A 13 year old is by no stretch of the imagination mature enough to look after other children, both for the safety of the others and himself... Are you suggesting they sit inside for the summer or are they going to be out on the street playing or in the park? Can a 13 year old erally be expected to not go and play with his friends because he has to run after the other 2 and watch them?

I definitely told them to stay in doors - my eldest has his own wireless laptop, PSP, PS2 and tons of DVD titles to watch - so far its ok.

Ian38HR

Trinity1 wrote:

How does the eldest feel about it?

Well we knows he's stressed about it but he does cooperate in a way we didnt expect - he hoovers the mess when we dont tell him too - took outthr trashed with the best intentions even when we told them not too when we're not there yet

Ian38HR

the_syco wrote:

BAD IDEA.

A girl may be able to sit tight, and mind the others, but a boy will go out the minute he can, with or wihtout the others.

Look into summer camps, etc.

you mean summer schools? One of them are going to football camp. I would have to check on the 2 others.

Ian38HR

G&T wrote:

Pay for the child care,if anything happened to one of them you would never forgive yourself.
The older 2 could do summer camp's and the youngest go to a creche/minders.
Honestly it is not fair on the 13 yr old he is still a kid.

Your self/wife could alway's take parental leave for the summer.

Good point there. Thanks and to others who replied.

walshb

Ian38HR wrote:

If you have 3 kids (all boys), eldest is 13, then 11 and 5 - would you able to make your 13 year old the childminder of the 2 other boys? I have and my wife have day jobs - and just for the summer that we can make do without a child minder/creche. Any Irish laws that govern this situation?

No offence, but why have kids at all if this is the way you treat them.
13 is hardly the most responsible age is it? I know childminders cost money, but deal with it. That's life and in life everything costs money. Don't be so flippant and stingy regarding this. Get the cash whatever way you can and pay it. Otherwise one of you should give up work and look after your kids properly. It's their right!!!!

Ian38HR

daiixi wrote:

It really depends on your children. Some 13 yr olds are suprisingly mature and able. If your younger kids will listen to their older sibling then why not?

It seems that way as well. Overall they are well disciplined kids to begin with.

Ian38HR

walshb wrote:

No offence, but why have kids at all if this is the way you treat them.
13 is hardly the most responsible age is it? I know childminders cost money, but deal with it. That's life and in life everything costs money. Don't be so flippant and stingy regarding this. Get the cash whatever way you can and pay it. Otherwise one of you should give up work and look after your kids properly. It's their right!!!!

They just came inside the Irish system 3 months ago - they went to school for 2 months - so its the first time scenario. before that its all different of course.

angeldelight

Ian38HR wrote:

I definitely told them to stay in doors - my eldest has his own wireless laptop, PSP, PS2 and tons of DVD titles to watch - so far its ok.

Do you not see anything wrong with this? A 13 year old child has unlimited unsupervised internet access for hours every day. That is not a good idea to start with.

Secondly, so your 13 year old has all this at his disposal, he has lots to do great. What about the other 2? Yes it's a crappy summer but they shouldn't be cooped up inside for hours at a time. How much attention is he really paying to them?

You said yourself he's stressed, vacuuming, heating food, bringing out rubbish... wow what a great summer he's having, lots of fun.

If you lived near me and I knew that was going on every day for the whole summer, I'd have to act on it.

oh well

Ian38HR wrote:

Well we knows he's stressed about it but he does cooperate in a way we didnt expect - he hoovers the mess when we dont tell him too - took outthr trashed with the best intentions even when we told them not too when we're not there yet

if he does these jobs when you've told him not to do them, well what else is he liable to to when you not there. even a boiled kettle can do a lot of damage if spilt, a hot plate from the warmed up meal can easily drop, can't you just see the whole host of things that can go wrong.

i have to agree with the poster who said if they knew a neighbour was leaving kids alone all day they would have to act on it. recently in our primary school, the principal became aware of an 8yr old who had key to let himself into the house cos mum/dad were out all day - guess who was reported.

don't do it.

G&T

Ian38HR wrote:

I definitely told them to stay in doors - my eldest has his own wireless laptop, PSP, PS2 and tons of DVD titles to watch - so far its ok.

So they are watching telly all day,
Who is supervising what they watch.
There is alot on day time tv that is unsuitable for kid's.

Dosen't sound like the making's of happy childhood memories.

luckat

How well I remember the day my friend's 12-year-old, minding her little brother, ran to stop him doing something, stumbled and put her arm through a glass door, slashing open an artery.

Why bother to have children if you're not willing to take proper care of them? Children minding children is *not* taking proper care.

If the children come to harm while unminded, you'll find yourself up in court double quick, OP, and you'll need a damn good lawyer to argue you out of bad trouble.

vallo

Is this thread a wind-up? Are you seriously saying that you are leaving three boys unsupervised, not allowed to go outdoors, for the whole summer? And that it's okay because they have PS2 etc, they are well disciplined and you leave meals for them to heat? You have to be kidding.

dame

Ian38HR wrote:

I definitely told them to stay in doors - my eldest has his own wireless laptop, PSP, PS2 and tons of DVD titles to watch - so far its ok.

Ever heard of fresh air and exercise?? They're good for all of us, especially growing children.

How do you know what they look at on the internet and telly?

Ian38HR

Thanks guys/gals for the advices. I really appreciate them I'll work on a schedule to have them attended to as you said. I'm planning to bring in a relative or even a permanent minder for them - Its just a temporary thing -it might be happening around 6-8 days a month max else they are attended too. As for the TV and internet - I just need to give my eldest more disciplining on that definitely.

Stark

Hopefully he brings a few of his friends around and they end up thrashing the place. Might give you an idea of why leaving 13 year olds home alone to babysit is a bad idea.

Wook

Thaedydal wrote:

If anything happens to the children the parents can be charged with neglect.

sorry i allready think its neglect thinking about leaving a kid of that age the sole resposibility over your kids for longer periods of time.
How warped is that for the kid himself to grow up ? Sorry to be harsh but you clearly didn't think that one through getting three kids and not being able to find the time to take care of them.

How Strange

The kids are back at school now so I suppose the parents don't have to worry about the cost of childcare from 9-3 as the state is doing that but are they left on their own after that at home?

Anyway, this is a ridiculous situation and the father seems completely blind to how wrong the whole situation is. At 13, most kids (and I know there are a few mature ones out there) are too childish and selfish to put their siblings before themselves. And why should they, they are children and should not be expected to think and act like adults.

I personally think that either this a wind up or it is a case of absolutely appaling parenting bording on child neglect. The OP has rationlised it to the point that he sees nothing wrong. I agree that people like this OP shouldn't have children if they can't and won't take the appropriate measures/make the appropriate sacrifices to ensure their children are always looked after in a secure environment.

Incredible.

kelle

As it happens, I was left to mind my 4 younger brothers on a regular basis from when I was 9. I was a very sensible girl and my brothers were looked after and never went hungry.
I have 3 small children now, but would never leave any of them with the same responsibility until they're much, much older. Why? Because I built up resentment as I got older that I'd spent my childhood being a parent. The day I left home was the first day in my life I felt dissolved of resposibility. I made a vow never to have children. However, in my 30's I changed my mind and don't regret it. But I'll never put my children through that.

Ehh maybe I was really hard done by and neglected but I stayed home with my younger siblings from 13 onwards, for about 4 hours a day, and all day once I was 14-15. I felt way too old for a babysitter at that age and I was more than able to stay home alone. I could cook, iron, clean and was responsible. I would never have trashed the place, maybe I was less of a brat than some people on here's kids. I understood that my parents had to work and I didn't particularly want an 17 year old girl from my school 'looking after' me. I think a lot of 13 year olds today are babied and spoiled, TBH. Not saying its really old enough to look after siblings - mine were just a little younger than me, not 5 as yours is, but its old enough to look after themselves. What 13 year old can't entertain themselves for a few hours, cook a simple meal and clean up after themselves? Is 14 not the minimum age for babysitters? I remember having teenage babysitters as a child and they were well able to handle us.

I wouldn't leave a primary age child alone but a 13 year old isn't a young child, IMO. Loads of people my age were working real jobs in shops etc, I'd rather have just been at home doing a bit of housework. When I think of 'childhood' I think age 11 and under, not my teenage years. None of the 13 year olds I see hanging round the local shopping centre seem like children to me either, maybe I'm very jaded. I did have real boring summers at that age but I'm quite glad I wasn't free to wander round the estate, smoking and looking for trouble. TBH there was really nothing better to do where I live than sit at home - maybe if we'd been in Dublin things would have been different.

I wonder how the OPs kid feels about this though? My parents were happy to pay someone to look after us, but I really didn't want it. We only ever ended up sitting home with the babysitter anyway. I guess it depends on loads of things. If I'd stayed in England where I grew up, there would have been things to do with friends and I would have told my parents that, it would have been fine. Just depends on loads of things, IMO. And I do agree 13 year old boys aren't nearly as mature as girls of that age.

BostonB

I would say in general its a very bad idea. Not because a 13yr can't do it. But there is a huge potential for an accident, or mischief.

Theboinkmaster

Just come across this thread now - I'm sitting here reading through the OP's posts with my jaw on the ground :eek:

Ian38HR if I knew who you were I'd report you immediately to social services, you're obviously not fit to have children.

Why oh why did you have 3 kids?! Were they all planned?! My god you sound like the clichéd working-class couple who just keep popping out kids with no idea how to raise them.

Some of your comments are just unbelievable, I'm just in shock.....

I won't go into each point as other posters have addressed them all but please, for starters, do not have any more kids and please start trying to educate yourself

John Mason

Theboinkmaster wrote:

Just come across this thread now - I'm sitting here reading through the OP's posts with my jaw on the ground :eek:

Ian38HR if I knew who you were I'd report you immediately to social services, you're obviously not fit to have children.

Why oh why did you have 3 kids?! Were they all planned?! My god you sound like the clichéd working-class couple who just keep popping out kids with no idea how to raise them.

Some of your comments are just unbelievable, I'm just in shock.....

I won't go into each point as other posters have addressed them all but please, for starters, do not have any more kids and please start trying to educate yourself

OMG :eek: i agree totally with the boinkmaster, this is horrendous. those poor children especially the 13 year old