Kittens we don't want

lukin

What's the most humane way to "put down" kittens. One of our cats is about to have kittens and we already have too many cats.
There's no way I'll be able to give them away as pets because they are not tame. I'm not going to drown them as that is unspeakably cruel.
Can I get something from the vet or do I have to bring them there to have it done?

golden

Think about getting all your cats spayed, is a start.

Glowing

What a horrible thread to come across on a friday morning!

Sorry Lukin, no idea. Please don't take it into your own hands though! And what golden said, if you've too many cats, get them spayed!!!

I don't know much about cats, but when they're weaned, can you not domesticate them by handling them etc?

bridget.laitly

Glowing wrote:

What a horrible thread to come across on a friday morning!

Absolutely agreed, especially because we've been looking for kittens for our home!

Lukin, it's heart breaking to hear they won't have a fair shot- is the mother feral? You can acclimate the kittens by handling them regularly (but gently) and re-homing them at around 4 weeks.

I can assure you that you will absolutely be able to find homes for them- and if you have any doubts about it talk to the Dublin SPCA and ask how many calls they get for kittens!

If your mind is made up please call the SPCA to discuss humane options and they will do their utmost to help you.

...and SPAY your cat!

franksm

If the mother can be given a place to have the kittens in (food and water nearby will make her more amenable), then you should be able to handle the kittens and tame them. Been there, done that, and it's not hard.

There are plenty of people out there looking for kittens.

And the mother... she really should be speyed.

These guys might be able to advise: http://kittenadoption.proboards80.com/index.cgi

neacy69

get you cat spayed if you do not want her to have kittens.
Its your fault she has had kittens because you did not get her spayed before this.
Please don't KILL these kittens just because you think you have to many cats already contact DSPCA or your vet or a local pet shop or animal shelter who will try to find suitable homes for them

Hellrazer

Op banned--Im not in the mood for threads like this.

No discussing animal cruelty of any kind whether it be of the "humane" kind or not.

dame

Our cat has recently had kittens too. We thought she was spayed cos the shelter told us she had been, but obviously not. It shouldn't be too hard to find homes for them when they're about two months old. We've a good home found for one of ours already. Spread the word that you have them and you'll be surprised how many people will come forward saying they've been keeping an eye out for one. Failing that, bring them to the nearest shelter and see if they can help re-home them.

Like everyone else has told you; get her spayed. If you have Tom cats get them neutered too.

Hellrazer

Here is the apology from Lukin as per a PM I just received.As you can see Ive offered to take the kittens and try find homes for them-if anyone else wants to help please do.

lukin wrote:

Sorry I posted that thread about the kittens I wanted to get rid of, I didn't know it would cause offence.
However it's a fact of life that cats breed too much and if you don't get the mother of the kittens neutered in time this is the only way to control it.
Because I'm banned I can't reply to the people who've posted to explain so they probably think I am some kind of barbaric animal-killer. I am not happy about that because nothing could be further from the truth.
I spend a lot of my hard-earned cash on food for my dog, my sister's dog and the cats that live on my parents farm.
I am going to get the mother of the kittens in question neutered;I would have it done before now but they are not my responsibilty, I only knew she was having kittens when it was too late as I am only home every weekend.
It actually breaks my heart to have them put down but I am going to a good vet who I know will do it painlessly.
Apologies again for any offence called.

My reply:

Look even in your apology youre still wanting to kill these INNOCENT animals.If you dont want to sound like what Ive highlighted above then do the right thing and hand the kittens over to an animal shelter.
Even Id gladly take them off you to try and find homes.

Does this sound like a "heartfelt" apology to any of you lot??
My bloods boiling over this thread.
Richie

franksm

Fair play

KittenAdoption (http://kittenadoption.proboards80.com/index.cgi) have a subsidised neutering scheme which can see the job done for EUR20, so I'd recommend Lukin talks with them.

Hillcrest Vetinery Practice in Coolmine, Blanchardstown (Tel. 01-821-3868) have a number of clients looking for kittens, so you could ask there for help re-homing them.

If we can sort out some details & photos, I can put some notices up in Microsoft - there tend to be people now and then looking for kittens here.

Lou.m

If they are young then they can be tamed give them to the Ispca just hand them over you dont have to don anything else dont kill them it is not necessary really it is not. They will look after even wild cats.
PLEASE GIVE THEM TO THE ISPCA.

Bring them to the animal welfare center they will decide on the basis of their health what they will do. They may even collect them. And when they take them you dont have to do anything.

PLEASE JUST BRING THEM TO THE ISPCA THEY WILL DO THE RIGHT THING!

doctor evil

I`m sorry but why was the OP banned?. If the kittens tested positive for feline aids they would have to be put down.

granted the op could have phrased their post better.

For god sake when an animal is put down by a vet (which the op was going to do) they don`t feel a thing. I thought this was animal/pet issues not over sentimental fluffy wuffy issues. Ban me if you may but it will just confirm my post, that this forum can be far too quick to judge.

Our man in Havana

I know the OP has been banned - but I would like to say that the kitten can be tamed easily enough - allow the mother access to a shed with a box & plenty of food & water she will hopefully have the kittens here - handle them as often as possible from a week old & then at 8 weeks take mum to the vet to be spayed & take the kittens & rehome them I am sure a shelter or rescue can & will help you find new homes for the kittens.

If you really do not want the cat to have kittens some vets will spay the mother & put the kittens down now. Not a nice option but sometimes it has to be done.

Hellrazer

Ive given the OP access to the forum again so that they can see that there really is no point in killing these animals.

So far I reckon that I have homes for the whole litter if it comes to it.
Richie

Hellrazer

doctor evil wrote:

I`m sorry but why was the OP banned?. If the kittens tested positive for feline aids they would have to be put down.

granted the op could have phrased their post better.

For god sake when an animal is put down by a vet (which the op was going to do) they don`t feel a thing. I thought this was animal/pet issues not over sentimental fluffy wuffy issues. Ban me if you may but it will just confirm my post, that this forum can be far too quick to judge.

Feline aids is a different matter than the OP posted about--he wants to kill kittens that may or may not have any problems.
If they had posted that the kittens did have feline aids I would be the first to recommend euthanasia.

Im sorry you dont like the fluffy wuffy nature of the way we mod this forum but I will not tolerate issues of animal cruelty here regardless of how "humane" its supposed to be--theres enough of that in other fora on boards.

RE*AC*TOR

Hellrazer wrote:

Feline aids is a different matter than the OP posted about--he wants to kill kittens that may or may not have any problems.
If they had posted that the kittens did have feline aids I would be the first to recommend euthanasia.

Im sorry you dont like the fluffy wuffy nature of the way we mod this forum but I will not tolerate issues of animal cruelty here regardless of how "humane" its supposed to be--theres enough of that in other fora on boards.

I don't see any evidence of cruelty, the only evidence I see is a mod with no sense of reality or perspective.

The thread is relevant to the forum, is not crossing any legal boundaries and is morally ambiguous. This type of modding to your own personal whims rather than to the benefit of the forum is rather juvenile and egocentric.

Zambia

My cat was wild as a kitten, its a perfect house cat now in fact it never leaves the house.

Hellrazer

RE*AC*TOR wrote:

I don't see any evidence of cruelty, the only evidence I see is a mod with no sense of reality or perspective.

The thread is relevant to the forum, is not crossing any legal boundaries and is morally ambiguous. This type of modding to your own personal whims rather than to the benefit of the forum is rather juvenile and egocentric.

So you dont find it cruel that the ops first post starts with

What's the most humane way to "put down" kittens. One of our cats is about to have kittens and we already have too many cats.

I find the above quite cruel.Id say the op wanting to put down his cats because he has too many is more of a "personal whim" and more "juvenile" than what Im trying to do.

Ok so the thread is relevant to the forum--Agreed.
I may have been quick to judge the ops first post harshly.
And yes maybe if it was "phrased" differently I would have let it go.

If you`ve a problem with the way I mod put it in feedback.Ive stated from the very first day I started modding this forum that I wont tolerate any animal cruelty and I stick by that.

Richie

Our man in Havana

RE*AC*TOR wrote:

I don't see any evidence of cruelty, the only evidence I see is a mod with no sense of reality or perspective.

The thread is relevant to the forum, is not crossing any legal boundaries and is morally ambiguous. This type of modding to your own personal whims rather than to the benefit of the forum is rather juvenile and egocentric.

Your reaction to the way a mod has judged this thread is a tad hard in my opinion! Richie & I have both seen our fair share of animal cruelty & the OPs post did sound a touch harsh. As Richie has stated he has un-banned the OP so she can comment. This should be the end of the matter as regards to what US mods do to create a happy environment on here.

Nala

After reading the OP's PM they sound a bit better. But nobody has mentioned yet, even if the kittens got the most humane death possible, what about the poor mother? It's horribly cruel to take her kittens away from her when she's only just had them. Fair enough they may need to be rehomed at 8 weeks, but that is a different matter, mammy knows they don't need her as much then and is probably worn out by then anyway. But to take her kittens from her when they're only just born- Cats aren't stupid and they do have feelings.

OP- How would you feel if you had a baby and it was just taken from you? I know some people will think I'm being over-sensitive here or whatever but I am only putting another side to things.

lukin

OK everyone you put me on a guilt trip, I had second thoughts and decided to ask around if anyone wants them, I'm sure I'll get someone to take them,
I'll put up ads in supermarkets and other other places.
Thanks to Hellrazer who offered to take them off my hands (and for un-banning me) and also thanks to those who stuck up for me and wondered why I was banned.
I still think it's a bit ridiculous to get upset by something that we know happens all the time; animals being put down by their owners.
As far as I know even animal shelters do it when they run out of space.
Soemtimes it's a sensible course of action when there isn't someone to look after the animal in question.
Some people's definition of "animal cruelty" is different to others.

Our man in Havana

I know people are killed everyday - that still upsets me!
I know kids are abused everyday - that always upsets me!
I know people abuse animals everyday - that really upsets me!

So I am not surprised that people (including myself) are upset at the thought of kittens being put to sleep! As Nala stated this is cruel for the mother as well as the kittens! The cruelest thing I can think of at the moment are people who do not spay & neuture their pets! Tis easy to "get rid of the babies" Tis not the answer tho!

Hellraiser said he would take any kittens that needed a home! I have taken in feral kittens before & they tame down lovely!

So I am sorry you feel we have been a tad hard on you! Please make sure the poor mother is spayed once the kittens are 8 weeks old.

Rigsby

lukin wrote:

As far as I know even animal shelters do it when they run out of space.
QUOTE]

This gets to the whole crux of the problem. Have you ever thought WHY the shelters are full to bursting point ?
Because people wont take responsibility for their pets by getting them spayed or neutered. The problem could be solved in a short time if they did.

tallus

lukin wrote:

I still think it's a bit ridiculous to get upset by something that we know happens all the time; animals being put down by their owners.
Some people's definition of "animal cruelty" is different to others.

That makes it alright then does it ?
Tbh if I was a moderator here I'd have banned you again just for that ridiculous statement.

Hellrazer

lukin wrote:

OK everyone you put me on a guilt trip, I had second thoughts and decided to ask around if anyone wants them, I'm sure I'll get someone to take them,
I'll put up ads in supermarkets and other other places.
Thanks to Hellrazer who offered to take them off my hands (and for un-banning me) and also thanks to those who stuck up for me and wondered why I was banned.
I still think it's a bit ridiculous to get upset by something that we know happens all the time; animals being put down by their owners.
As far as I know even animal shelters do it when they run out of space.
Soemtimes it's a sensible course of action when there isn't someone to look after the animal in question.
Some people's definition of "animal cruelty" is different to others.

Lukin--Thanks for making the right decision.And I apologise for being so harsh at the beginning of this thread.
My offer still stands if you have any problems at all finding homes for them.
Richie

morgana

At least this forum has helped to change one person's mind about killing kittens. And regardless of whether it happens all the time, it doesn't make it right. In light of the prevalent attitude towards cats, the OP actually shows some regard for the kittens, albeit misguided from most people in this forum's point of view.
Anyway, I am glad that you decided to give the kittens a chance, and please see that the mum is spayed after the kittens are weaned. Then you won't have to deal with this problem in future - and mummy cat will be much happier too.

doctor evil

Welcome back Lukin,

So why is putting kittens down by euthanesia considered cruel?, what would you deem a "humane" way of putting an animal down.

Hellrazer

doctor evil wrote:

Welcome back Lukin,

So why is putting kittens down by euthanesia considered cruel?, what would you deem a "humane" way of putting an animal down.

Im dont consider euthanasia cruel,what I consider cruel is killing kittens because they have too many.Thats what got me annoyed.


How about you make a new thread about euthanasia and I promise I wont lock it or ban anyone if it stays on topic--It could make for a good debate.

Richie

kyra

lukin wrote:

What's the most humane way to "put down" kittens. One of our cats is about to have kittens and we already have too many cats.
There's no way I'll be able to give them away as pets because they are not tame. I'm not going to drown them as that is unspeakably cruel.
Can I get something from the vet or do I have to bring them there to have it done?

why dont you get your cat spayed ???
what kind of insensitive owner you are ??
my cat got pregnant at the age of six months (we hadnt got her spayed yet as we wrongly thougth she was way too young for that). we let her have the kittens and when they reached the age of 8 weeks, we handed them to people who were looking for one. Oh and i want to clarify that in my house there were already 4 cats and three dogs at that time....so no you have no excuses whatsoever! If the cat is yours, it is your responsibility to get her spayed. I honestly think all your pets should be taken into care !
why dont you contact Jan at kitten adoption ? she should be able to help.
good luck

doctor evil

Kyra, pot calling kettle black?.

The issue has been resolved, no point in posting to give your self a higher moral grounding.

lukin

Yes, the issue has been resolved, I'd say I'll have no problems getting homes for them. In response to those who question why the cat wasn't spayed, this may come as a surprise to you but some people happen to live busy lives and it's not easy to find the time to do these things.
One question though; according to the mod of this board, "doing away" with animals is not acceptable under any circumstances.
At the same time said mod encourages people to take stray animals they find to shelters. As I have previously stated, shelters put down animals all the time so is there not a slight double-standard here?
I get banned for saying I am going to put down kittens but it's OK for those in charge of shelters to do it?

Our man in Havana

There is a vast difference between rescues & the local pounds - most rescues have a no kill policy - only sick animals are put to sleep not healthy ones that can be given a chance.

Thank you for giving the kittens a chance If you need advice at all - just ask.

Themadhouse

If the kittens tested positive for feline aids they would have to be put down.

I'm sorry but i find this statement just as upsetting as the opening post to the thread.
You can test kittens for FIV but they can test positive due to maternal anitbodies present, but they usually test negative later. they should be re tested at 6 months old to be sure, but it could be too late by then if they have been PTS!
FIV is not an automatic death sentence, there is no need to PTS in a lot of cases...... Plenty survive and live with cats that have tested NEG for FIV. They can have a long and happy life if someone is will to give them the chance.
I know one big boy who is probably about 17 years old, still going strong, tested pos 9 years ago, prob got it a long time before that!
Nothing is cut and dry and yes there are an awful lot of times when it is nicer to PTS but not all the time....

Lukin, i'm glad you have decide to give the kitttens a chance to live....
As bond-007 said, rescues have a low kill rate, they will only put to sleep if absolutly neccessary, not because they have too many.
The rescue that i foster for last summer had 63 kittens at the one time, thats not including the family cats. Tough going in a house with no cattery....

Tabitharose

Themadhouse wrote:

I'm sorry but i find this statement just as upsetting as the opening post to the thread.
You can test kittens for FIV but they can test positive due to maternal anitbodies present, but they usually test negative later. they should be re tested at 6 months old to be sure, but it could be too late by then if they have been PTS!
FIV is not an automatic death sentence, ...They can have a long and happy life if someone is will to give them the chance.

saved me writing something similar

kyra

doctor evil wrote:

Kyra, pot calling kettle black?.

The issue has been resolved, no point in posting to give your self a higher moral grounding.

sorry, been away for a while and have just seen the thread.
no need to jump at me throat though :eek:
happy the issue is resolved

good luck

emma27

Hellrazer wrote:

Feline aids is a different matter than the OP posted about--he wants to kill kittens that may or may not have any problems.
If they had posted that the kittens did have feline aids I would be the first to recommend euthanasia.

Im sorry you dont like the fluffy wuffy nature of the way we mod this forum but I will not tolerate issues of animal cruelty here regardless of how "humane" its supposed to be--theres enough of that in other fora on boards.

Doctor Evil-maybe someone should stick a needle in you and put you to sleep. Would you like that? for someone else to make the decision to end your life. Their is nothing humane about putting animals down unless of course if they were sick or had been in an accident. If you have ever owned any kittens you should know that they have feelings too.

doctor evil

An animal cannot comprehend when it is about to be put down, you would have more credibility if you did not label animals with human emotions.

Hellrazer

doctor evil wrote:

An animal cannot comprehend when it is about to be put down, you would have more credibility if you did not label animals with human emotions.

So now animals have no emotions???
:rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Hellrazer

emma27 wrote:

doctor evil-maybe someone should stick a needle in you and put you to sleep. Would you like that? for someone else to make the decision to end your life. Their is nothing humane about putting animals down unless of course if they were sick or had been in an accident. If you have ever owned any kittens you should know that they have feelings too.

Emma27-Just to let you know personal attacks on other posters are not welcome here.Because youre new Im only going to warn you this time.
Richie

uberwolf

Hellrazer wrote:

Op banned--Im not in the mood for threads like this.

No discussing animal cruelty of any kind whether it be of the "humane" kind or not.

Why the ban when this doesn't appear to be against the charter? Cruelty is willfully or knowingly causing pain or distress to others, humane treatment is the antithesis of this. This forum is for the discussion of pet related issues, and you're preventing said discussion because you're not in the mood?

Is there an alternative place on boards for this discussion? The OP living on a farm may have a far less sanitised attitude to animals, but a better understanding for it.

The_Minister

I was thinking the same thing Uberwolf, the ban was totally undeserved. Putting down unwanted animals is a acceptable way of dealing with the problem.

JB1

The_Minister wrote:

I was thinking the same thing Uberwolf, the ban was totally undeserved. Putting down unwanted animals is a acceptable way of dealing with the problem.

No.It's not.

The right way is making sure it does not happen in the first place.Get your cats and tom cats spayd.
If you haven' take responsibility and find them homes.They live, they breathe they have every right to live.They have every right to LIFE.Who do we think we are that we have the right to end it?

doctor evil

Hellrazer wrote:

So now animals have no emotions???
:rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Animals don`t have emotions in the same way you and I have emotions. They live minute to minute and do not have the same comprehension as humans.

JB1

doctor evil wrote:

Animals don`t have emotions in the same way you and I have emotions. They live minute to minute and do not have the same comprehension as humans.

Oh yeah?than explain to me why it is that so many dogs and cats cease eating when their owners are not around or have deceased?How it comes that cats that have been together all their lives keep searching their mates for month?
There are tellings about dogs that wouldn't move from their owners grave..
Animals don't have an understanding of time.They certainly have an understanding of emotion-they FEEL them!

Hellrazer

Hellrazer wrote:

Lukin--Thanks for making the right decision.And I apologise for being so harsh at the beginning of this thread.
My offer still stands if you have any problems at all finding homes for them.
Richie

Uberwolf and The Minister.Ive already apologised for my harshness and reinstated the OPs access.

And The Minister--I disagree that killing unwanted animals is an acceptable way of dealing with the problem.I found homes for all those unwanted kittens within a couple of hours of this thread going up.

doctor evil

They have simplifed emotions, they may feel things but to the same complexity, as I have already reiterated.

doctor evil

Hellrazer wrote:

I found homes for all those unwanted kittens within a couple of hours of this thread going up.

What about the animals that otherwise would have gone to those homes, can`t play Superman to them all which is the point myself and others are trying to make.

Hellrazer

doctor evil wrote:

can`t play Superman to them all which is the point myself and others are trying to make.

I think the point youre trying to make is that its the "easier" route to kill these animals than even people even bother their a*ses to try find homes for them.

Thats what sickens me.

Myself and a few regulars here keep in touch with rescue centres and anyone who needs help rehoming can just put a post up here and we`ll all do a "superman" to help out.

doctor evil

I`m not saying its the easier route but I`m not naive enough to think its only the sick and wounded who should be pts.

JB1

doctor evil wrote:

I`m not saying its the easier route but I`m not naive enough to think its only the sick and wounded who should be pts.

Than I pitty you.Because in my view your understanding of 'human' is completly different to mine...and thank god many others out there.
I can only hope you will never be in a position to make that call-for the anmials sake and your own.Because it will be the harshest thing you ever have to do-taking away the right to live from something innocent.Remember, you can NEVER give it back.
Poor you.

JB1

doctor evil wrote:

They have simplifed emotions, they may feel things but to the same complexity, as I have already reiterated.

I wonder how you'd know?Ever been a dog?
Did you ever see an anmial mourn over something?Did you see a mum cat look for her kittens?Did you see the behaviour of a swan when his or her mate got shot?

You don't know.No-one does because no-one has ever been an animal(or at least remembers it)But the facts are on the table.They do mourn and they do feel emotions.They might just not complicate them in a way humans tend to do.Lucky them.