Pistol Case

kdouglas

Was thinking of picking up one of these to use as a pistol case, put some foam padding in it and cut it to shape, could probably fit two pistols and mags in it

thecivvie

Cannot find online but Lifestyle do a putting set in an aluminium case, cose e15. Throw away the putting stuff unless you know someone who wants it, excellent

ED E

I'm gonna get a rifle one and then just sick pistols in with my aug.

Right now using a battered old case that i have to field strip my augs barrel(about seconds work:D ) to fit it in.

CrazyRabbit

My glock fits nicely into the pocket of my jacket (when I'm going to airsoft skirmishes of course). And there is a pocket on the front of my rifle bag that it fits into nicely. A separate pistol case = more unnecessary stuff to carry IMHO.

kdouglas

yea, i guess it is a bit much to have a case for them, would be grand if we get some practical shooting up and running, just for carrying the pistols

padmundo

CrazyRabbit wrote:

My glock fits nicely into the pocket of my jacket (when I'm going to airsoft skirmishes of course).

I know you're not actually up to anything but if the Garda were to stop you for any reason and you had it in your pocket they really wouldn't take very kindly to it at all. You'd be better off transporting it in a case or purposeful bag of some kind for your own sake.

o1s1n

padmundo wrote:

I know you're not actually up to anything but if the Garda were to stop you for any reason and you had it in your pocket they really wouldn't take very kindly to it at all. You'd be better off transporting it in a case or purposeful bag of some kind for your own sake.

Totally right. You're really asking for trouble if you don't transport it correctly in some kind of bag/case. Putting it in your jacket pocket might actually be considered an offense if you were to be stopped and searched.

CrazyRabbit

I'll take my chances though I don't believe it is illegal unless I display it in public. I'm not aware of any legislation on transporting of airsoft AEP's/AEG's.

99% of the time I carry it in the rifle case anyway. Just yesterday it was a bit full, so I had to use my pocket. Pocket was kept closed at all times, and the glock completely out of sight.

o1s1n

CrazyRabbit wrote:

I'll take my chances though I don't believe it is illegal unless I display it in public. I'm not aware of any legislation on transporting of airsoft AEP's/AEG's.

99% of the time I carry it in the rifle case anyway. Just yesterday it was a bit full, so I had to use my pocket. Pocket was kept closed at all times, and the glock completely out of sight.

There doesn't have to be a specific legislation of transporting AEP'S/AEG's. Theres the whole "offensive weapon in public" thing. Which A Gard can make a decision on the spot about. A knife is perfectly legal to own. Perfectly legal to transport in a bag. Becomes something totally different when you carry one in your pocket. Same goes for a lot of things. I'd be pretty sure an airsoft pistol would fit into that category.

Could possibly land you in a lot of trouble. I know its not likely, but we cant have our Crazyrabbit ending up in court

CrazyRabbit

o1s1n wrote:

There doesn't have to be a specific legislation of transporting AEP'S/AEG's. Theres the whole "offensive weapon in public" thing. Which A Gard can make a decision on the spot about. A knife is perfectly legal to own. Perfectly legal to transport in a bag. Becomes something totally different when you carry one in your pocket. Same goes for a lot of things. I'd be pretty sure an airsoft pistol would fit into that category.

Could possibly land you in a lot of trouble. I know its not likely, but we cant have our Crazyrabbit ending up in court

I'm on a first name basis with the judges already

Got to know a lot of the judges when my brother was prosecuted (I won't say what for as it's not related to airsoft)

Oh, and I'd guess the Glock would have to be loaded and have it's battery in ti for it to be considered a weapon/concealed weapon.

kdouglas

it's one of those better safe than sorry things, better off keeping it in a bag just in case

EyesOnly

i wonder if bfsl has the hard plastic cases instock , i've been thinking of getting one for awhile now.

o1s1n

CrazyRabbit wrote:

Oh, and I'd guess the Glock would have to be loaded and have it's battery in ti for it to be considered a weapon/concealed weapon.

Not a technicality I'd want to try out with a Gard first hand!

o1s1n

EyesOnly wrote:

i wonder if bfsl has the hard plastic cases instock , i've been thinking of getting one for awhile now.

I wouldn't mind one myself too. Not for transport though. Just for keeping it safe while it's around the house.

padmundo

CrazyRabbit wrote:

I'd guess the Glock would have to be loaded and have it's battery in ti for it to be considered a weapon/concealed weapon.

Not really, anything that can be mistaken as a real weapon can be classed as a weapon, loaded or not.

I'd stick it in a case though lad, just for your own look out.

I had enough trouble having a camping axe in the boot of my car with other camping stuff. I talked my way out of it but I had perfectly good reasons for it to have been there at the time.

Another friend of mine was nearly done for having beat me up and stabbing my friend after he was stopped walking home from work with various tools including a stanley knife in his pocket. Only that I was able to say I'd reckon I'd remember if it was my own friend who had attacked us they let him go.

[--SC(+)PE--]

Did ya not get a case with your m190 Douglas?

kdouglas

yup, but it's tight enough fitting the pistol and 4 mags into it, was thinking the aluminium case would be good for a couple of pistols + mags

Wossack

o1s1n wrote:

Not a technicality I'd want to try out with a Gard first hand!

aye, if the difference between a 'carry on' and a few hours down the clink explaining yourself is putting your glock in your backpack - I know what I'd do

CrazyRabbit

padmundo wrote:

Not really, anything that can be mistaken as a real weapon can be classed as a weapon, loaded or not.

I'd stick it in a case though lad, just for your own look out.

I had enough trouble having a camping axe in the boot of my car with other camping stuff. I talked my way out of it but I had perfectly good reasons for it to have been there at the time.

Another friend of mine was nearly done for having beat me up and stabbing my friend after he was stopped walking home from work with various tools including a stanley knife in his pocket. Only that I was able to say I'd reckon I'd remember if it was my own friend who had attacked us they let him go.

Been a while since anyone called me a 'lad'

I'll drop into the Blanch Gardai station later and ask for their advice on the matter. Just curious as to what the 'official' line would be on it so that we are all fully aware. Grumpy bunch in the Blanch station, so they'll probably arrest me for even talking about 'guns'.

I hope that carrying it in the rifle case is sufficient. I don't see why it would not.

kdouglas

as long as it's in a rifle case your fine, i wouldnt go talking about carrying it in your pocket in a garda station, could bring unwanted attention to yourself

sidneyreilly

CrazyRabbit wrote:

I'll drop into the Blanch Gardai station later and ask for their advice on the matter. .

Are you right in the head?

Sparks

CrazyRabbit wrote:

Just curious as to what the 'official' line would be on it so that we are all fully aware.

The Gardai can't tell you that.
The official line on the matter is laid out by Dail Eireann in the Firearms and Offensive Weapons Act 1990.
Enjoy the read.

CrazyRabbit

sidneyreilly wrote:

Are you right in the head?

Jeez, you must have a pretty negative opinion of the Gardai. They are actualy pretty reasonable.

What do you think is gonna happen?

"Hi Guard. Just looking for your advice on something. I have a legal airsoft pistol, but don't have a proper pistol case for it. Is it ok to carry it securely, and unloaded in a jacket pocket, & out of sight of the public, or would it be a criminal offense?"

Pause for a few secs....

10 armed Gardai burst through the door, pointing guns at me and yelling at me to get down on the ground. Arrest & conviction follows with 10 year prison sentence....

Come on. All they would say is "yes that's fine", or "don't even think about it". If they asked to see the pistol, I would show it to them along with the relevant quoted section from the CJB.

Didn't get a chance to drop into them yet. Probably drop in to them on friday. Oh, my next door neighbour is the Garda Superintendent for the station, so he knows me.

sidneyreilly

1. Carrying a pistol, even something pistol shaped is,in your pocket is nuts man. Think about it.

2. Asking a gard if you carry such a thing in your pocket and they will look at you as if you had three heads!

Put it in a bag or a case, it's this kind of maggot acting that will get your stuff banned.

Sparks

CrazyRabbit wrote:

Jeez, you must have a pretty negative opinion of the Gardai.

I think his opinion isn't of the Gardai.
Look, what you're proposing is that you'd walk into a Garda station and ask if you can break the firearms and offensive weapons act and if they'd say that's okay.
Seriously, are you right in the head?

You cannot carry in public any item which may be used as an offensive weapon, without a good reason.

In other words, if you're carrying a javelin from your car to the athletics pitch, you're okay. If you're carrying a flick-knife, you're not. If you pointed your airsoft at someone, they wouldn't know it was an airsoft and you'd be committing an act of assault. Therefore it's an offensive weapon, therefore it's covered by the act, therefore you can't do it.

Feck's sake man, just go buy a case already.
I mean, it's going to cost you less than the airsoft did and it'll protect it in case it gets dropped and it'll let you keep all the bits and bobs handy with it - where's the problem?

CrazyRabbit

sidneyreilly wrote:

1. Carrying a pistol, even something pistol shaped is,in your pocket is nuts man. Think about it.

2. Asking a gard if you carry such a thing in your pocket and they will look at you as if you had three heads!

Put it in a bag or a case, it's this kind of maggot acting that will get your stuff banned.

1. It's not illegal or dangerous as far as I can tell. I'm trying to confirm though. Carrying an airsoft pistol in your jacket pocket is not something I would recommend doing on a regular basis, but I want to confirm the legal ramifications of doing so, or using a rifle case, backpack etc.

2. Gardai might be concerned initially, but would probably be glad that I checked with them instead of just guessing. Only a responsible law-abiding person would bother asking them. You won't see any criminals asking them.

As I mentioned before, it was just the once I had to carry it in my pocket. 99% of the time it's in the Rifle case. Not much of a difference to be honest if you think about it. Same goes for a dedicated pistol case or backpack. Just as easy to access (actually, it was bloody awkard trying to remove the pistol from my pocket when I got home)

Don't know why you are getting (mildly) upset over this. I only want to check on the guards advice so that all airsofters will know one way or the other. I haven't been able to find anything that says it is illegal. For all we know, it might be a requirement to carry them in locked pistol cases, and rifle bags may not be suitable!

CrazyRabbit

Sparks wrote:

I think his opinion isn't of the Gardai.
Look, what you're proposing is that you'd walk into a Garda station and ask if you can break the firearms and offensive weapons act and if they'd say that's okay.
Seriously, are you right in the head?

You cannot carry in public any item which may be used as an offensive weapon, without a good reason.

In other words, if you're carrying a javelin from your car to the athletics pitch, you're okay. If you're carrying a flick-knife, you're not. If you pointed your airsoft at someone, they wouldn't know it was an airsoft and you'd be committing an act of assault. Therefore it's an offensive weapon, therefore it's covered by the act, therefore you can't do it.

Feck's sake man, just go buy a case already.
I mean, it's going to cost you less than the airsoft did and it'll protect it in case it gets dropped and it'll let you keep all the bits and bobs handy with it - where's the problem?

Is it really necessary to keep implying that I'm somehow not fully mentally capable ('Not right in the head' comments). It's borderline flaming TBH.

This question about carrying a pistol is not about me. As I said, I normally carry the pistol in the rifle bag. This has nothing to do with me not wanting to buy a pistol case or anything like that.

Also, at no time did I suggest it would be ok to carry an offensive weapon in public (which is illegal). I was talking about carrying the pistol inside a closed jacket pocket, but it would equally apply to backpacks, plastic bags (which some airsofters have used on occasion) or even shoulder holsters.

Basically what I want to confirm is..."What are the legal requirements for transporting a legal airsoft pistol (or AEG) from your house to an airsoft skirmish event?"

Is it wrong for me to want to try and find the answer to this so as to protect everyone here from possible legal issues?

Another mountain out of a molehill...

Shiva

CrazyRabbit wrote:

Basically what I want to confirm is..."What are the legal requirements for transporting a legal airsoft pistol (or AEG) from your house to an airsoft skirmish event?"

If I were you, and the Supt. is your next door neighbour, I'd ask him off the record, as it were, and that way you'd probably get a better informed answer, and not have to involve a strange Garda who doesn't know you from Adam.

Or you could ask Spitfire - he'd probably be able to provide an answer ?

Sparks

CrazyRabbit wrote:

1. It's not illegal or dangerous as far as I can tell.

It is illegal, it's a violation of the Firearms and Offensive Weapons Act 1990.

2. Gardai might be concerned initially, but would probably be glad that I checked with them instead of just guessing. Only a responsible law-abiding person would bother asking them. You won't see any criminals asking them.

The Gardai are not the people to ask. You're looking for an opinion on the law. Call a solicitor.

As I mentioned before, it was just the once I had to carry it in my pocket.

And it's just the once you have to be caught to be convicted.

Don't know why you are getting (mildly) upset over this.

Because of the press coverage you'll bring down on everyone else if you got caught doing something so daft.

I only want to check on the guards advice so that all airsofters will know one way or the other. I haven't been able to find anything that says it is illegal.

Again, read the act I've cited several times already, and provided a copy of above.

Sparks

CrazyRabbit wrote:

Also, at no time did I suggest it would be ok to carry an offensive weapon in public (which is illegal).

Yes you did! An airsoft is an offensive weapon for the purposes of the 1990 act!

Basically what I want to confirm is..."What are the legal requirements for transporting a legal airsoft pistol (or AEG) from your house to an airsoft skirmish event?"

Don't carry it in public is the basic thing. Put it in a case or a bag so it's not immediately obvious what it is that you're carrying. Then stick it in the boot of the car if you have one.

Is it wrong for me to want to try and find the answer to this so as to protect everyone here from possible legal issues?

Of course not. It's just that you're ignoring the answer and insisting on asking the wrong people for an answer which won't be objective. The job of the Gardai is to keep the peace - not to adjudicate on legal matters or offer legal opinion. If you ask, you'll be told no, regardless of that being the right answer in this case, because that means less work for the Gardai and thus less risk to the peace from their point of view. You won't get a legal opinion and you'll be passing on incorrect information to everyone else.

And next time someone has a legal question, they'll do the same, and the next thing you know, that molehill's gotten awfully large...

CrazyRabbit

Taken from the FIREARMS AND OFFENSIVE WEAPONS ACT quoted above:

(2) It shall be a defence for a person charged with an offence under subsection (1) to prove that he had good reason or lawful authority for having the article with him in a public place.

(3) Without prejudice to the generality of subsection (2), it shall be a defence for a person charged with an offence under subsection (1) to prove that he had the article with him for use at work or for a recreational purpose.

I think it's pretty clear cut IMHO, but I'm not a gardai or a solicitor.

From the above I would ascertain that carrying an airsoft pistol to/from an airsoft game would be legal, so long as it is concealed. Carrying it down to the local shops would be illegal. That's how I see it, but I would like to confirm with those nice people who have the handcuffs. Solicitors are one thing, but they ain't the ones slapping the cuffs on you if you break the law.

Sparks, if it's illegal and 'daft' to carry it in your pocket, what's the difference between that and a pistol case, or any other method of carrying it?

Really, I'm just looking out for everyone here by spending my free time checking what is/isn't legal in regards to transporting airsoft guns.

O1s1n, do you want to split this thread so that it remains on-topic? I kinda accidentely has branched out into a whole new topic.

EDIT: Gonna check with both the gardai and Terrence Lyons solicitors (I have a friend there). That way we get a 100% accurate, legal statement on what is and isn't acceptable when transporting airsoft guns.

Sparks

From the above I would ascertain that carrying an airsoft pistol to/from an airsoft game would be legal, so long as it is concealed.

And once you've been arrested, it'll be down to the court to decide if your opinion is worth anything...

Tell you what, ask the lads who were caught taking airsofts on the bus to Donegal from Dublin there a year or so back. As I recall, they got arrested for it.

Sparks, if it's illegal and 'daft' to carry it in your pocket, what's the difference between that and a pistol case, or any other method of carrying it?

A pistol case can be argued in court to be a purpose-built container and thus the logical thing to carry an airsoft pistol in. Carrying it in your pocket just isn't seen the same way because as far as the Gardai and judicary are concerned, that's an offensive weapon being carried in a concealed fashion but ready to be taken out and used.

BTW, this is an old problem for target shooters and hunters, so it's not like you're the first to ask this question. The rule is, stick it in a case, stick the case in the boot if you're driving, don't get on a bus or train with one. The last bit doesn't apply to airsoft though.

I would like to confirm with those nice people who have the handcuffs. Solicitors are one thing, but they ain't the ones slapping the cuffs on you if you break the law.

Again, the Gardai can not give you a definitive answer on this. Your solicitor's opinion would carry far more weight, and a judge's answer even more. In this specific case, the answer you get from a Garda would carry very little weight.

edit: And the fact that the Gardai have the cuffs makes no difference. If you're arrested mistakenly for doing something perfectly legal, it's the court's opinion that counts, not the Gardai's. Therefore you want to be asking there, not asking the Gardai. See what I'm saying?

sidneyreilly

At times I dispair:(

It's against the law and it looks terrible. Consider this scenario: you get caught up in a public order situation on your way to a skirmish and get pulled. You are searched and pistol found in pocket. You had nothing to do with the situation but how does it look, "concealed weapon" they will shout! Or if they ask you to empty your pockets and you start drawing your pistol? Or do you say "erm.. before you over react the first thing thats coming out of my pocket is an airsoft, it looks real but isnt, honest", yeah that'll wash.

Now same situation with a case: you get caught up in a public order situation on your way to a skirmish and get pulled. You habd them your case, bag and say here you go there is an airsoft in theri I'm on my way to a skirmish. They get to open it inspect it, small delay and you should be on your way, same thing with pockets.

ED E

You van get a case for £20! Just buy one and stop flaming each other!

CrazyRabbit

I don't need a pistol case Lethal. I have the rifle bag which can hold the pistol. But again, this is not about me. It's about anyone of us carrying any sort of airsoft gun, and what the legal requirements are for their transport.

Sparks, I'm aware that the gardai's opinion and even a solicitors opinion is not concrete 100% definitive. Only a judge can provide that. But since I don't have access to a judge, they'll have to do. They should be knowledgable of the law since they are the ones that enforce it. The rest of your comments are just your opinion as are most of my comments. I'm looking for reasonably concrete information on the legality of carrying airsoft guns, be it in a jacket pocket or anywhere else.

Sidneyreilly, if this hypothetically public order situation occured and one of us was stopped & arrested then yes it would probably end up with a day in court. But according to the FIREARMS AND OFFENSIVE WEAPONS ACT quoted above, you only need to provide a good reason or lawful authority for having the airsoft gun with you in a public place. I think it would be reasonably easy to show that you were attending an airsoft skirmish (the clothing, the AEG, the confirmation from the skirmish site owner of a skirmish taking place and that you play airsoft etc). But still, you are talking about a very unlikely occurance. And your statement that it is 'against the law' is what we are discussing. I don't think it is, but I could be wrong so that's why I want to check.

Sparks

They should be knowledgable of the law since they are the ones that enforce it.

Oh, we're agreed there.
Thing is, they're not, in general. There are more than sufficient court cases currently being taken against them for that reason.

Further, you're talking about asking a biased source and treating their answer as being objective.

I think it would be reasonably easy to show that you were attending an airsoft skirmish (the clothing, the AEG, the confirmation from the skirmish site owner of a skirmish taking place and that you play airsoft etc).

None of that is proof you were attending an airsoft skirmish.
The only thing that's close is the site owner saying there was a skirmish on that day.
Proof would be if you were booked in to play at a scheduled time and the site owner testified to that.

See, what you're saying is that it's okay to take an approach that leads to a judge making a decision as to whose word he should accept - a serving Garda officer or a bloke caught wearing combat fatigues or camo gear and carrying a replica of a combat pistol in a concealed fashion down O'Connell street.

I mean, I appreciate that we all need hobbies, but I think most of us wouldn't list "arguing with District Court judges" as likely candidates...

CrazyRabbit

Just got off the phone with my solicitor friend from Terrence Lyons. I'm heading to the gardai station now to get their view. When I get home I'll post what was said by both (assuming I have an internet connection tonight)

EyesOnly

(anyways Back on topic ) anyone tried checking BFSL to see if the have the hard case's?
SpitFire you seen any up their? i might give him a call later on this week, If i get my M15 that is (only reason i want one so i dont damage it, dont mind about the clones to much).

o1s1n

CrazyRabbit wrote:

.

if it's illegal and 'daft' to carry it in your pocket, what's the difference between that and a pistol case, or any other method of carrying it?

The difference being that in one situation the airsoft is readily "at hand" so to speak and could possibly be used as an offensive weapon. The other it's packed away in a case. It's the same with a knife. If you have one in your pocket you could quite quickly produce it and use it in some illegal manner. If it were packed away that's not going to be possible.

CrazyRabbit wrote:

.
Really, I'm just looking out for everyone here by spending my free time checking what is/isn't legal in regards to transporting airsoft guns.

I'd be interested in hearing if any of them mention anything regarding having bags locked down etc.
The pistol in your pocket is a no brainer though. There's really no need to have to resort to that. Bags are a pretty inexpensive way of transporting things

CrazyRabbit wrote:

.
O1s1n, do you want to split this thread so that it remains on-topic? I kinda accidentely has branched out into a whole new topic.

How about you start a new thread about the safe transportation of airsoft equipment once you receive this information from those two sources? Could always come up with a list of Donny do's and Don'ts.

MaxForce

Here is a pic of a case I bought in Lifestyle Sports for €15. It used to hold a putting set but I found a very good home for that:D It will hold 2 pistols and with the right work should be able to grip the mags in the upper part of the case. I put the phone in just to show ye the size. I dont know which Lifestyles around the country would have them but the bigger ones should.

o1s1n

MaxForce wrote:

Here is a pic of a case I bought in Lifestyle Sports for €15. It used to hold a putting set but I found a very good home for that:D It will hold 2 pistols and with the right work should be able to grip the mags in the upper part of the case. I put the phone in just to show ye the size. I dont know which Lifestyles around the country would have them but the bigger ones should.

That's a nice find. Reasonable price. Might try and get one of these.

Oh wait, I dont have a pistol :mad:

kdouglas

time to buy a pistol then!

MaxForce

The catch might need a bit of work. If only going by car it would be pretty OK but if on a bus would worry it might spring open. Could do with a staple and hasp rivited on to it to make it secure.

kdouglas

actually, does anyone know where you might get some foam to make a custom pistol case?

there used to be an upholstery place just opposite st.patrick's cathedral if i remember rightly, dont know if they're still open though

o1s1n

Ah I remember a place stocked big cube of that blue foam. Can't remember though. Some department in my college was using them I think.

MaxForce

kdouglas wrote:

actually, does anyone know where you might get some foam to make a custom pistol case?

there used to be an upholstery place just opposite st.patrick's cathedral if i remember rightly, dont know if they're still open though

Try Currys or one of those places. I would imagine they throw away a pile of it.

Bananaman

I guess the crazy rabbit has not been let out of the clink yet..

Must have forgotten to draw his airsioft with the opposing hand when he wanted to show them what pcoket he had it in.

Bananaman

Oops - only just saw other thread.

My Bad.

o1s1n

Bananaman wrote:

I guess the crazy rabbit has not been let out of the clink yet..

Must have forgotten to draw his airsioft with the opposing hand when he wanted to show them what pcoket he had it in.

He survived with a tale to tell...

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055087395

CrazyRabbit

Bananaman wrote:

Oops - only just saw other thread.

My Bad.

You actually thought I would bring an aisoft pistol down to the station and pull it out all Rambo style?

Shiva

CrazyRabbit wrote:

You actually thought I would bring an aisoft pistol down to the station and pull it out all Rambo style?

I have to admit....I kinda presumed the "Crazy" in your nickname was there for a reason